Thank you for those links, Chris.
I didn't know about startup disk creator in Ubuntu - it must be so long ago I
last looked at the USB option - and that made it so easy to get the 22.04 ISO
onto a USB and it showed up in the boot list and the installation went
smoothly. The wireless Internet worked from the start too.
Thanks!
Dave
On Sat, Jul 2, 2022, at 5:59 PM, Chris Guiver wrote:
>> Can you recommend any sites or webpages that explain simply how to install
>> by putting the ISO file onto a USB stick, or how to create a partition and
>> get the ISO file into it and then run the installation?
>
> I'll provide the following links
>
> -
> https://ubuntu.com/tutorials/tutorial-create-a-usb-stick-on-ubuntu#1-overview
> - https://ubuntu.com/tutorials/tutorial-create-a-usb-stick-on-macos#1-overview
> -
> https://ubuntu.com/tutorials/tutorial-create-a-usb-stick-on-windows#1-overview
>
> Myself, and for a number of year(s) now (after wiping a drive array,
> and backup drive using `dd`) I nearly always just use mkusb -
> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/mkusb
>
> in fact a ISO written yesterday on this box (jammy daily of Lubuntu
> 22.04.5) was written with this command (after zsync to update the
> daily ISO)
>
> guiverc@d960-ubu2:/de2900/lubuntu_64$ dus jammy-desktop-amd64.iso
>
> and just following/answering various prompts...
>
> My comment was based on various support queries on users who've had
> issues with DVD media; such as
> https://discourse.lubuntu.me/t/bug-failed-snap-daemon-in-lubuntu-22-04-lts-no-firefox-help-please/3246
> and others like it.
>
> I just remember it taking a lot longer than USB media did, having many
> occasional problems, that didn't happen when when USB media was used;
> thus I assumed you didn't have working USB ports which why I mentioned
> the writing of ISOs to hard drive on old IBM thinkpad t43p etc. I
> would recommend using good branded USB media instead & save yourself
> the hassle.
>
> If the ISO is written/burnt to USB thumb-drive media, yes I'd expect
> it to be offered as a boot option using whatever key your device uses
> (the key varies on device significantly; and I have a couple of
> devices I don't use much in QA-testing as they're a pain to get
> thumb-drive media to boot with; where as others are dead easy).
>
> Do note - when you download an ISO, it sits as a 'data file' on your
> disk. If written to thumb-drive media as just a file on the
> thumb-drive (ie. data), it won't be bootable (unless you've made the
> thumb-drive bootable already with software that looks for what's on it
> & offers it as a menu etc). The ISO file is written to the thumb-drive
> so it's bootable with specific software; see links I provided earlier.
> Also note the USB ports don't show up, but your device's firmware will
> detect bootable USB media inserted & the media itself should appear if
> correctly written.
>
> I don't know about your wireless issue, but I suspect it's related to
> the kernel; which is why I talked about what kernel stack choice you
> used with other releases; ie. 20.04 using HWE has possibly only very
> recently upgraded itself to the 5.15 kernel for you meaning it's now
> on the same kernel as 22.04 has; thus I'd wonder if you received the
> same issue on 20.04? though if you were using the GA kernel stack with
> 20.04 you won't have had any issue as that remains on 5.4
>
> My guess is your wifi issue (note: guess & I have no idea!) relates to
> the 5.15 kernel; and I've seen a few support queries relating to wifi
> in recent day(s), but wifi isn't an area that interests me so I tend
> to ignore them. My 'guess' is the issue would be the same if you clean
> installed, dirty installed, or release-upgraded to 22.04 - but that's
> just my (~guess) opinion.
>
> Chris (guiverc)
>
> On 7/2/22, David <ag...@justemail.net> wrote:
>> Hi Chris
>>
>> thanks for your time.
>>
>> The laptop on which I have been using Ubuntu, since around 2013 (and the
>> laptop is older than that) is a Lenovo T400. It has working USB ports.
>>
>> The version of Ubuntu that I am trying to install is the version for desktop
>> PCs and laptops.
>>
>> You reckon it could well be to do with using optical media.
>> It sounds like you're suggesting installation from USB or from putting the
>> ISO file into a partition.
>> Can you recommend any sites or webpages that explain simply how to install
>> by putting the ISO file onto a USB stick, or how to create a partition and
>> get the ISO file into it and then run the installation?
>>
>> Should the USB ports show up as an option when I hit F12 at startup, the way
>> the optical drive does?
>>
>> D'you reckon there's a good chance that the wireless problem will be gone if
>> I were to do the online upgrade from 20.04 to 22.04? And is that as good as
>> doing a clean install of 22.04?
>>
>> Thank you
>>
>> Dave
>>
>> On Sat, Jul 2, 2022, at 12:03 PM, Chris Guiver wrote:
>>> G'day
>>>
>>> I'm involved with QA & in particular a flavor, if my background is
>>> helpful.
>>>
>>> You mention old hardware; I've used devices from 2003 and upwards in
>>> the QA; though i386 devices were not used beyond 19.04 except for
>>> respins of 18.04 (eg. 18.04.4 & 18.04.5)
>>>
>>>> Last week I decided to move up from 18.04 and tried the online Upgrade
>>>> option for the first time (instead of a clean install from a live disk).
>>>> The upgrade to 20.04 LTS completed, but I had no internet connection. I
>>>> googled this and saw info about something called Netplan
>>>
>>> You didn't say if you're talking about a desktop system
>>> (NetworkManager) or server system (Netplan). The mention of netplan
>>> implies you're asking about a server system? but it could also be your
>>> misunderstanding. Desktop systems use NetworkManager still; but it's
>>> best if you're specific & readers aren't having to guess.
>>>
>>>> So yesterday I burnt the 22.04 LTS ISO onto a brand-new rewritable DVD
>>>> and tried to do a clean install, held down F12 at start up, chose the
>>>> optical drive, selected “Try or Install Ubuntu”
>>>
>>> Here we get to potential problems... Changes were made starting with
>>> 20.10 that can have negative consequences for those using optical
>>> media (eg. DVD). The optical media is designed for sequential
>>> reading, but the media verification reads files on a file-by-file type
>>> basis, and timeouts can occur with optical drives which can can
>>> problems (failed to start issues; particularly with snap..) etc.
>>> Reboot & re-try, and it may work the next time, as beyond being very
>>> slow, it's somewhat problematic as it's hardware timeouts that cause
>>> the issue/failures.
>>>
>>> In my QA testing, I used some really old IBM Thinkpads that didn't
>>> have working (bootable) USB ports; thus I'd download/write the ISO to
>>> a drive partition, and use that instead of USB media (installing to
>>> another part of the disk for example). Yes the laptops actually had
>>> DVD drives; but it was far easier/faster/reliable to use hard-drive
>>> over optical media. You might want to consider that instead of optical
>>> media (I would and did!)
>>>
>>> There is a bug report that will mitigate some of the issues with
>>> optical/slow media but it's not yet available for 22.04 (it maybe
>>> available using 22.04.1 media but unclear yet; that's still a month
>>> away). But I'm warning you'll have complications with optical media as
>>> it's not the intended installation media for Ubuntu releases beyond
>>> 20.04.
>>>
>>> Some effort is made to ensure it works (why the bug I mentioned exists
>>> & is being tracked or 22.04.1), but it's not high priority as almost
>>> no users use optical media & development resources are limited.
>>>
>>> You gave no details as to what hardware stack you were using for each
>>> release; as Ubuntu 20.04 LTS if using a GA kernel stack uses 5.4 which
>>> differs greatly to 22.04 (5.15), but if using 20.04 with HWE you'll be
>>> using either 5.13 (20.04.4) or 5.15 (20.04.5 that's rolling out ~now
>>> so if fully upgraded you maybe using 22.04's kernel stack already on
>>> 20.04). You may find using alternate kernel stack (easy) helps, though
>>> as 22.04 is still ~young, both GA & HWE are on the same stack so no
>>> choices there exist yet.
>>>
>>> On older devices in QA; I found the kernel stacks made a big
>>> difference; and as both stacks can co-exist on the same device (unless
>>> certain closed-source kernel modules are being used; aka video
>>> drivers) they were an easy fix for some users who had issues & sought
>>> support (eg. 18.04 with HWE uses the same kernel stack as found with
>>> 20.04 using the GA stack.. thus if it works with 18.04+HWE, I'd expect
>>> no issues with 20.04+GA)
>>>
>>> Installations using optical media are for sure possible; they just
>>> aren't easy & multiple attempts maybe required before it works; at
>>> least that's what was found in QA; also they're very slow (esp. beyond
>>> 20.10 as already stated). I suggest avoiding using optical media for
>>> installs if you can.
>>>
>>> Chris g.
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