Example: 3 member mirroring array
A)
One disk fails during uptime, raid keeps running with 2 disks and on a reboot
the array will get started through the --no-degraded or --incremental command
with 2 disks.
B)
One disk fails during downtime, the array won't be started with --no-degraded
or
Two external drives containig a raid1 (storage for digicam) do not get
detected and mounted when connected to another machine.
** Summary changed:
- mdadm.conf is crated with explicit ARRAY statements prevents hotplug
autodetection
+ mdadm.conf with explicit ARRAY statements, and HOMEHOST !=any
yeah, right a umask setting the exec bit ;-)
** Changed in: coreutils (Ubuntu)
Status: Incomplete = Confirmed
--
cp preserves mode with --no-preserve=mode
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/379233
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Hi,
In 9.10 someone changed the mdadm udev rules to use --incremental without
considering all the consequences that were already reported.
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReliableRaid
--
udev not using mdadm incremental
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/157981
You received this bug notification because
Current state of ubuntu systems with md raid:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReliableRaid
--
installed system fails to boot with degraded raid holding cryptdisk
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/488317
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Current state of ubuntu systems with md raid:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReliableRaid
--
--incremental not creating device nodes
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/251663
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Current state of ubuntu systems with md raid:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReliableRaid
--
encrypted root initialisation races/fails on hotplug devices (does not wait)
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/247153
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu
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Current state of ubuntu systems with md raid:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReliableRaid
--
mdadm.conf with explicit ARRAY statements, and HOMEHOST !=any prevents hotplug
autodetection
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/252345
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu
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Current state of ubuntu systems with md raid:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReliableRaid
--
option to start selected arrays in auto-read mode (like --incremental)
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/251646
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Current state of ubuntu systems with md raid:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReliableRaid
--
boot impossible due to missing initramfs failure hook integration
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/251164
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Current state of ubuntu systems with md raid:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReliableRaid
--
inconsistency with the --no-degraded option
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/244810
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Current state of ubuntu systems with md raid:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReliableRaid
--
--incremental --scan --run does not start anything
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/244808
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Current state of ubuntu systems with md raid:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReliableRaid
--
[gutsy] mdadm, initramfs missing ARRAY lines
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/136252
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Uh, oh, I got that feeling you know ;-)
Seriously, exactly as you write I was seeing the user being added to his
primary private group.
adduser tester produces this group entry: tester:x:1006:
where users-admin produced: test:x:1005:test
I had experienced much trouble before because of another
Public bug reported:
The part about the UMASK setting is not correct and misleading.
As a contribution here is the corresponding section containing corrected
information (for inclusion in the next update).
--8- cut here --
#
# Login configuration initializations:
#
# ERASECHAR
The informational text suggested is and can be updated on
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiUserManagement
--
provide some info about users and file permissions
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/252351
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Try checking if the /tmp/libgksu-*/.Xauthority file is created with the
right ownership of the target user?
--
gksu breaks X apps when /etc/sudoers has NOPASSWORD:
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/66328
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This may help tracking down this bug:
The ownership is set correctly when using the the su method (by
calling the gksu binary directly instead of of through the gksudo
symlink AND with the -w option).
This fails:
$ gksudo -u firefoxuser firefox
No protocol specifiedNo protocol specified
Error:
Does creating the symlink mentioned in Bug #281679 help you?
--
Error: Could not find service 'kfmclient' using Gnome
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/112414
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Hi there, it's now a vfat fs plugged into a 9.10 system:
ii coreutils 7.4-2ubuntu1 The GNU core utilities
$ ls -l /media/USB/
-rwxr-xr-x 1 test.txt1
-rwxr-xr-x 1 test.txt2
$ cp /media/USB/test.txt1 .
$ ls -l
-rwxr-xr-x 1 test.txt1
$ cp --no-preserve=mode /media/USB/test.file2 .
$
*** This bug is a duplicate of bug 379397 ***
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/379397
Ah, thank you for clearing this.
I must have missed the copy skeleton option when I first noticed that
users created with kuser where set up so differently from other methods
(independenly from the debian
Reasoning: Not using the debian mechanims results in not executing
useradd hooks, different filepermissions, possibly not copying /etc/skel
etc. (duplicates of this bug.)
--
kuser is violating debian policy
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/379397
You received this bug notification because you are
Public bug reported:
Binary package hint: gpsd
Other apps seem to avoid the garmin_gsm kernel module for usb devices
and access those devices using the hotplug USB subsystem, instead of the
device created by garmin_gsm.
** Affects: gpsd (Ubuntu)
Importance: Undecided
Status: New
Why is the hotplug mechanism disabled by default in ubuntu?
As everything is hotplug enabled it seem gps devices are expected to be
hotplugable too.
--
gpsd depends on nonexistent /lib/udev/hotplug.functions
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/367197
You received this bug notification because you
I am sorry I don't understand what you are talking about.
On my ubuntu 9.04 system there is certenly no garmin_gsm module loaded
when connecting the device.
Plus I need to manually mount an usbfs and put add some udev line.
I don't know how is anyone suppost to know about this marble when you
can't it be tagged 9.04?
** Changed in: gpsd (Ubuntu)
Status: Invalid = New
--
gpsd depends on blacklisted garmin_gps module
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/388917
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Full workaround to use garmin USB device in 9.04:
in /etc/modprobe/blacklist.conf:
#blacklist garmin_gps
The udev rule to add:
#cat /etc/udev/rules.d/51-garmin.rules
SYSFS{idVendor}==091e, SYSFS{idProduct}==0003, MODE=666
The Filesystem to mount:
/etc/fstab:
none /proc/bus/usb usbfs 0
You might want to set it to fix commited, if this is the case?
But then if garmin_gps is loaded by udev rules, wont't it again break
other packages that use usb: to fetch trackdata from the device?
--
gpsd depends on blacklisted garmin_gps module
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/388917
You
For the workaround, it is better to leave garmin_gps blacklisted
(stadard) so that it wont be loaded during boot, and just sudo modprobe
garmin_gps and gpsd /dev/gps when you need gpsd. (For gpsdrive,
tangoGPS etc.).
--
gpsd depends on blacklisted garmin_gps module
Blacklisting garmin_gps is not a bug. It allows apps to use libusb
instead.
Bug #236682 garmin_gps.ko assumes you're using usbfs exists.
--
gpsd depends on blacklisted garmin_gps module
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/388917
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu
Public bug reported:
Binary package hint: gpsd
When a USB device, that is created by the garmin_gps module is specified,
the may not be needed/or should rather look in /dev/bus/usb for garmin_gps
devices.
An older report is: garmin.c: /proc/bus/usb is deprecated
The mentioned report on berlios is wrongly set to won't fix, possible
due to misunderstanding it to request a switch to libusb.
--
gpsd checks on obsolete /proc/bus/usb/devices
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/388995
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu
Bugs,
Here is the output:
#ls -ld /sys/module/garmin_gps/drivers/*
/sys/module/garmin_gps/drivers/*/* /sys/module/garmin_gps/drivers/*/*/*
lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root0 2009-06-18 16:18
/sys/module/garmin_gps/drivers/usb:garmin_gps -
../../../bus/usb/drivers/garmin_gps
lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root0
Best thing is probably to switch the gpsr to NMEA and just use that...
Even if my device supported it, I would think it would not help with
setting up the USB conectivity.
With
1) the udev rule to apply correct permissions to usb device (that shoud come
installed with some default init
Ah, here is a thread to refer to
http://www.nabble.com/gpsd---garmin-driver-broken-due-to-use-of--proc-bus-usb-td16342438.html
--
gpsd checks on obsolete /proc/bus/usb/devices
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/388995
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu
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Best thing is probably to switch the gpsr to NMEA and just use that...
Even if my device supported it, I would think it would not help with setting
up the USB conectivity.
Got it, garmin usb binary format is diffrent from garmin serial binary.
Cornfiming: large piece of crap and forerunners do
Public bug reported:
Binary package hint: gpsd
/usr/share/doc/gpsd/README.Debian.gz is missing in unbuntu.
No documentation is provided that and how /etc/default/gpsd has to be
configured (with dpkg-reconfigure).
Taken from Bug #367197:
Note that in order for gpsd.hotplug.wrapper to work at
But at the end I'd expect that the garmin stuff is just removed from
gpsd.
Yes, when the garmin_gps module or a garmin-userspace-driver layer that
can use libusb provides a serial tty device for gpsd, the garmin stuff
should probably be removed from gpsd.
(For devices that don't provide NMEA,
When this bug is a regression from changes made to udev, is full on in
9.04 and needs syncing from the well and completely maintainded debian
package, how can it be marked incomplete?
** Changed in: gpsd (Ubuntu)
Status: Incomplete = Confirmed
--
gpsd depends on nonexistent
Public bug reported:
pam_umask is the new and only facility to set the umask consistently for
different login shells, X, ssh, cron, ... .
But, pam_umask is not called in common-session. Instead the old
workaround since the introduction of pam once broke the login.defs UMASK
setting is still used
Public bug reported:
Binary package hint: base-files
Setting the umask in /etc/profile only works for some shells. It was
introduced into debian as a workaround, when the switch from login to
PAM broke the UMASK setting in /etc/login.defs.
Since recently pam_umask is included in pam, and
The comments in /etc/login.defs really need to be updated.
Here is an updated version of the section on login configuration
initialisation:
--8- cut here --
#
# Login configuration initializations:
#
# ERASECHAR Terminal ERASE character ('\010' = backspace).
#
jaunty no longer has this
** Changed in: shadow (Ubuntu)
Status: New = Fix Released
--
login.defs references libpam-umask which is a obsolete package
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/245210
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The cleanup may actually be more than a wishlist item, because
login.defs wrongly points out not to set UMASK and has leaves it
commented out. (As was correct when pam_umask did not parse it.)
--
/etc/login.defs umask cleanup
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/71295
You received this bug
Still no gksu functionality to run apps as a differnt user (other then root) in
ubuntu 9.04.
(i.e. no way to quickly check your own email on the computer running all
day at the reception with the account used by all the receptionists for
example.)
--
gksu to regular users broken
Public bug reported:
Binary package hint: kdeadmin
All user/group managment tools have to rely on the adduser/useradd
mechanism.
But kuser is not even following the same rules when creating
users/groups.
** Affects: kdeadmin (Ubuntu)
Importance: Undecided
Status: New
--
kuser
Public bug reported:
Binary package hint: kdeadmin
New homedirs get drwx-- permissions.
(Instead of honoring the default drwxr-xr-x adduser setting. It is not
using the adduser mechanism as stated by debian policy.)
** Affects: kdeadmin (Ubuntu)
Importance: Undecided
Status:
Debian policy states: Packages other than base-passwd must not modify
/etc/passwd, /etc/shadow, /etc/group or /etc/gshadow.
(http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-opersys.html#s9.2)
--
kuser ignores umask when creating homedirs
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/379399
You received this bug
Public bug reported:
Binary package hint: kdeadmin
kuser creates subdirecories in the homes, mimiking other OSes behaviour,
but /etc/skel is not used for this.
Instead /etc/skel might provide pub/, priv/ and incoming/ directories with
correct permissions.
And /home/groups/users/writable and
Public bug reported:
Let groupadd have the option to create /home/group/groupname sgid directories.
Sgid group directories are the means for users to easily collaborate on
local files with the user private group scheme used in debian/ubuntu.
Graphical tools can then adopt to this addgroup
Public bug reported:
Binary package hint: user-setup
Set up a sgid /home/group/users directory for the users group if it
doesn't exist, so that users are provided with a way to collaborate on
local files.
This will also seed the answer of how smaller groups can collaborate.
For full control:
The following example might be further enhanced:
root:group (rwxrwsr-t) /home/share/group
root:group (rwsrwsrwt) /home/share/group/incoming
root:group (rwxrwx---) /home/share/group/private
--
set up a /home/group/users directory
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/379431
You received this bug
The following example might be further enhanced:
root:group (rwxrwsr-t) /home/share/group
root:group (rwsrwsrwt) /home/share/group/incoming
root:group (rwxrwx---) /home/share/group/private
--
Let groupadd create /home/group/groupname sgid directories
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/379421
You
Public bug reported:
Binary package hint: base-files
Please provide the directories /etc/skel/private (rwx--) and
/etc/skel/incoming with appropriate permissions.
In the user private group scheme used in debian/ubuntu the homedirs are
created with permissions allowing the users to share and
The following wiki page now contains more information and ties together related
bugs.
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiUserManagement
--
pam_umask.so missing in common-session
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/253096
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The following wiki page now contains more information and ties together related
bugs.
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiUserManagement
--
set up a /home/group/users directory
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/379431
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The following wiki page now contains more information and ties together related
bugs.
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiUserManagement
--
remove/comment /etc/profile umask setting
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/379341
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu
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The following wiki page now contains more information and ties together related
bugs.
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiUserManagement
--
provide some info about users and file permissions
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/252351
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu
The following wiki page now contains more information and ties together related
bugs.
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiUserManagement
--
users not belonging to users group
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/253103
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu
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The following wiki page now contains more information and ties together related
bugs.
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiUserManagement
--
Let groupadd create /home/group/groupname sgid directories
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/379421
You received this bug notification because you are a member of
The following wiki page now contains more information and ties together related
bugs.
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiUserManagement
--
pam_umask is missing a pam-auth-profile
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/379335
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The following wiki page now contains more information and ties together related
bugs.
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiUserManagement
--
gksu to regular users broken
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/246192
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The following wiki page now contains more information and ties together related
bugs.
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MultiUserManagement
--
/etc/login.defs umask cleanup
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/71295
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Please include a pam-auth-profile to support the user private group
theme.
So that a debconf setting will put the line
session optional pam_umask.so usergroups
into the common-session config.
--
pam_umask.so missing in common-session
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/253096
You received this bug
PAM may be more appropriate then shell rc files (etc/pam.d)
--
LD_LIBRARY_PATH settings in /etc/profile lost
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/367814
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See man pam_env, /etc/security/pam_env.conf and /etc/environment for
a solution to your problem.
If gdm used to source /etc/profile, and now stopped this misbehaviour,
that is good.
--
LD_LIBRARY_PATH settings in /etc/profile lost
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/367814
You received this bug
Hope the solution above helps to understand this bug as invalid?
Shell config files are supposed to work only for (even specific) shells, pam is
more a global method.
** Changed in: ubuntu
Status: New = Invalid
--
LD_LIBRARY_PATH settings in /etc/profile lost
Hope the solution above helps to understand this bug as invalid?
Shell config files are supposed to work only for (even specific) shells, pam is
more a global method.
--
LD_LIBRARY_PATH settings in /etc/profile lost
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/367814
You received this bug notification
Public bug reported:
Binary package hint: coreutils
Example: copying files from CD/vfat/etc. into the filesystem.
The files (all) will keep their executable bit and stay read only.
Even with the --no-preserver=mode option the current umask is ignored
(or only used in a substracting way when
Oh, hi,
To browse dns service discovery entries click the button on the right from the
K in the Controlbar (Kicker), then choose Network and then Network Services.
Or in Dophin it is: system:/remote/zeroconf/
** Changed in: kdebase (Ubuntu)
Status: Invalid = New
--
Links retrieved over
Hi, thanks for the reply.
There seems to be at least two ways to mount partitions automatically.
One is the hotplug system mounts partitions, the other is it the
partition is mentioned in fstab and gets mounted during boot.
1. the specific steps or actions you took that caused you to encounter
Thank you for checking the command line.
Well, this may then be a UI bug, now.
** Summary changed:
- rename files instead of deleting and copying again.
+ UI not showing xferbycopying feature (renaming instead of deleting and
retransfering)
** Description changed:
- Binary package hint:
(Tested with two local replicas.)
--
rename files instead of deleting and copying again.
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/253319
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Manual says:
xferbycopying: The default value istrue.
But the GUI does not seem to indicate that a renamed file will be copied:
(a: file /b: absent)
(a: deleted / b: u nchanged file)
--
rename files instead of deleting and copying again.
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/253319
You received this
Oh very good, the changelog sounds just like what I was thinking about.
Is this enabled by default?
--
rename files instead of deleting and copying again.
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/253319
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When a disk fails in a running system a raid will run degraded. The
System doesn't stop, and probably should't. The mdadm notification
functionality brings this to the admins attention.
So changing the default to bootdegraded=yes seems reasonable, once the
patches are tested to work with enough
Just to state that I am indifferent wether this is fixed with pam_group
or by adding to the default groups in adduser.
pam_group wouldn't intruduce much redundant info and fix existing
systems/users, too.
real group memberships would work for cron/at jobs? (But maybe they use
pam session I don't
Yes, /etc/default/laptop_mode seems more sane as a second config file
for laptop-mode-tools.
As you mentioned in Bug #250935 we have to keep in mind that enabling
the laptop-mode-tools by default is in fact a necessary change to fix
the load cycling issue for example.
IMHO laptop-mode-tools
Alexey, you did good in making the patch acceptable. (And since you had
success, even better!)
So second step would be to flip the settings the right way.
hdparm -B254 needs to be reintroduced because bug #172282 has changed
that setting in the meantime.
(Yann who reported 254 did not work for
Reopening.
hdparm -B value 254 needs to be reintroduced because the fix to bug
#250935 ([intrepid] laptop-mode-tools needs to change its default
settings to match acpi-support and add hooks for pm-utils) has migrated
the old 255 setting from acpi-support into laptop-mode-tools.
** Changed in:
Dustin, you could have open a separate bug with your debconf patch to
track your work and at the same time keep the comunity updated and able
to give you feedback in a more organized manner.
the default being BOOT_DEGRADED=false, which is the
conservative/traditional behavior.
Only some may
Wow, Dustin we again wrote or comments almost simultaneously. Thank you for
separating the issue.
--
cannot boot raid1 with only one disk
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/120375
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu
Server Team, which is a subscriber of a
I have separated out the issue of booting with degraded non-root arrays
into Bug# 259145.
As a user merely helping to gather info I can't say if updates to hardy
(ubuntu 8.04) will be made available. Dustin?
--
cannot boot raid1 with only one disk
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/120375
You
Yes, I think you are right. Since the laptop-mode messing has fortunately been
removed from acpi-support the setting is obsoleted there and serves only for
confusion.
Alexey wrote:
It's interesting to know that current acpi-support in Debian unstable
(1.109-5) has this comment in
Thank you for your comments.
Then the current state I see in intrepid is this:
- You still need to ENABLE_LAPTOP_MODE=1 in /etc/default/acpi-support
(Bug 244838)
- The /etc/laptop-mode/laptop-mode.conf default hdparm -B value has been
changed from 254 to 255.
This may be OK for consistency of
When resposibility is reestablished for /etc/laptop-mode/laptop-mode.conf the
ENABLE_LAPTOP_MODE_ON_BATTERY=yes default from debian's laptop-mode package
will and can enable laptop_mode when on batteries, no problem.
Package pm-utils has had a hacked laptop-tools script in hardy all the time
Hi,
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PowerManagement has been updated to respect the fixes
for intrepid (ubuntu 8.10).
You currently still need to follow the steps mentioned there for hardy
(ubuntu 8.04) installs.
(I guess Vincenzo Ciancia who reported his issues where fixed with
recent hardy updates
Dustin, you could have open a separate bug with your debconf patch to
track your work and at the same time keep the comunity updated and able
to give you feedback in a more organized manner.
the default being BOOT_DEGRADED=false, which is the
conservative/traditional behavior.
Only some may
Wow, Dustin we again wrote or comments almost simultaneously. Thank you for
separating the issue.
--
cannot boot raid1 with only one disk
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/120375
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu
Bugs, which is subscribed to Ubuntu.
--
the default being BOOT_DEGRADED=false, which is the
conservative/traditional behavior.
Only some may consider this conservative behaviour a broken behavior,
when a system on a redundant array of independent disks will degrade
just fine when running, but won't even come up when booting.
The
Public bug reported:
Binary package hint: mdadm
It is said that the intrepid fix to Bug #120375 added support to mdadm and
initramfs-tools for configurable booting degraded RAIDs, but a systems with
/home on a degraded array doesn't come up.
The particular array needs to be mdadm --run
This issue has been separated out from Bug #120375 in order to track it
separately.
(Don't mark this as a duplicate, like 4 others before.)
--
home array not run when degraded on boot
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/259145
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Ubuntu
I have separated out the issue of booting with degraded non-root arrays
into Bug# 259145.
As a user merely helping to gather info I can't say if updates to hardy
(ubuntu 8.04) will be made available. Dustin?
--
cannot boot raid1 with only one disk
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/120375
You
Public bug reported:
Binary package hint: laptop-mode-tools
When the filesystem is on a raid device lm-profiler only reports only disk
access by a process called md0_raid1 (the md module).
Unfortunately this information does not help in identifying the
processes that actually causes the disk
Thank you for the screenshots. The button order also seems reversed in
the subsequent windows to create new profiles. I noticed this because I
kept hitting cancel after entering the info.
--
OK buttons in profile wizard reversed
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/253283
You received this bug
Alexey!
I'd like to say thank you.
For providing patches to the laptop-mode related things in ubuntu.
It was good to see your work apear.
--
acpi-support should let laptop-mode-tools run properly
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/250938
You received this bug notification because you are a member
Hi Tormod,
you asked:
3. Are some fixes needed in the pm-utils package as well?
Can you reference other bug reports (with patches)?
I do remeber two things, first Bug #239419 (pm-utils)
pm-utils has laptop-tools script which conflicts with laptop-mode-tools
has been wrongly set as a duplicate
Thank you for reassigning the bug.
Yes, the info should really be in the documentation, too.
I have filed this from practice. Many support requests deal with (new,
aka ex windows) users that have installed ubuntu not able to easily
collaborate with other users on their ubuntu installation.
The
The wording of man pam_umask seems pretty much the same as what used to be in
login.defs before.
http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?msg=10;filename=login.defs.diff;att=1;bug=282822
I have also made the experience that some graphical user managment tools
do not keep gids eqal to uids
I agree, there are of course much more fine grained methods than the group of
all users. And to be honest when adminstering larger systems the users group is
probably not good for much more then giving all users write access to some
device, or to files that are served on the net. Now, it's not
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