** Project changed: libgnome = gnome-control-center
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Title:
(design decision) Icons missing from context menu , dialogue buttons ,
firefox
** Bug watch removed: Mozilla Bugzilla #504275
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504275
** Bug watch removed: GNOME Bug Tracker #557469
https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=557469
** Bug watch removed: GNOME Bug Tracker #588668
** Changed in: baltix
Status: New = Opinion
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Title:
(design decision) Icons missing from context menu , dialogue buttons ,
firefox
Kolargol00 and Pevzi, if you have any specific examples of inconsistent
use of icons, please report them as separate bugs. Thanks.
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Icon presence in default GNOME menus is still inconsistent in 10.04 RC.
Please fix this flaw even if it comes from upstream.
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** Changed in: libgnome
Status: New = Invalid
** Changed in: libgnome (Ubuntu)
Status: Confirmed = Invalid
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Icon presence in default GNOME menus is still inconsistent in 10.04
RC. Please fix this flaw even if it comes from upstream.
+1
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Applications and Places menus have icons, while System menu has no
icons (and its sub-menus do have icons). Moreover, the option to enable
icons in menus has been removed from the Appearance control panel.
That's right. Menu looks very ugly now.
--
(design decision) Icons missing from context
And icons can be returned to their native places only using gconf-
editor. Not very user-friendly -_-
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** Description changed:
The default setting for icons has now changed , the icons will not be shown
unless forced upon by the app.
- Icons that are essential must be displayed and need to be set accordingly in
the app.
+ Icons that are essential must be displayed and need to be set
So, Gnome is now shifting to a model where dynamic objects --
applications, bookmarks, documents, folders, user accounts, wireless
networks, and so on -- have icons by default, while all other items do
not.
What? This is completely backwards. Dynamic objects should not have
items, while actions
Dave Gilbert: (and otheres)
My brother is dyslexic and I have also for a long time had a deficient time
writing and reading. We both prefer navigating using visual ques rather then
text. The fact that the option to enable all icons has been removed in 10.04 is
doing us a grate disservice. If
Is people aware this was an upstream decision and not an Ubuntu one?
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Default menus in 10.04 Beta2 are also inconsistent: Applications and
Places menus have icons, while System menu has no icons (and its sub-
menus do have icons). Moreover, the option to enable icons in menus has
been removed from the Appearance control panel.
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(design decision) Icons missing
** Changed in: libgnome (Ubuntu)
Status: Confirmed = New
** Changed in: libgnome
Status: Invalid = New
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@mercedes
Please don't change bug status without a comment.
** Changed in: libgnome (Ubuntu)
Status: New = Confirmed
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As much as I do agree that going back on the old way of including icons
on every menu item possible is a good (both productively and
aesthetically) change, I do feel that the lack of icons on actions on
the main panel menu items is a step backwards in aesthetics (see
screenshot-1), and feels to a
** Tags removed: metabug
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** Tags added: metabug
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** Tags added: iso-testing
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Reading comments here is clear enough that a lot of users (including me) saw
the missing icons as a bug. Guidelines are good tools to give consistency, but
we should also concentrate on *what* we perceive as consistent.
A main menu with tree items, where the indentation clearly shows that
I also thought there was a bug when I noticed missing icons in the main
menu, that's why I came across this page.
I appreciate the idea of UI consistence and balance, but it's
getting too inefficient. Let me explain: my OS is in Russian while lots
of programs still miss the Russian documentation
Style or Usability ?
The eternal debate between graphic designers and people from ergonomics.
Each group evaluates usability its own way. Basically:
One says nicer is better (because aesthetic design ...),
the other focus on methods and numbers (measuring user efficiency ...).
I've seen them
Guidelines or not... think practical, in the end the missing icons in
System and Places menus look like a bug to the common user. It doesn't
look clean or professional, but rather opposite; buggy, incomplete,
inconsistent. Is this Linux for Human Beings or Linux for Guideline
Obsessives?
--
Only by violating the guidelines for which items should have icons. None
of the top-level items in the System menu obviously represent
applications, files, documents, people etc, so they shouldn't and don't
have icons.
It is true that the Show icons in menus option is badly worded, but it
has had
Let's organize things my friend... Ok canonical desired to have this
option off by default OK, no problem for that... But there is a bug in
here.. What thing is context menu icons and other completely different
is menu Icons, like system menu one... those options should be
separated, Don't they?
The same guidelines apply to menu items no matter what type of menu
they're in. For example, the use of icons in Nautilus's Open With
submenu should be exactly the same regardless of whether you are opening
that submenu via the context menu or the File menu. And icons in
buttons and icons in menu
So why do we have no icons in the System menu, if they are already
separated options?
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On Sun, 2009-10-25 at 15:09 +, Andreas Nilsson wrote:
I agree with this change, but this is not a election, so I don't think
those kind of comments adds any additional value to the bug report.
#80 ...and makes other menus cute again
A cute looking Operating System is not something I
I do not really care about context menu with no icons BUT I'll never
agree about having NO icons Under system menu, those are different this,
and it is really horrible to have some main menu menu with icons and
some other with no one like is the case of System menu and some icons
under Places menu
i'm not against the decision to remove icons but i agree with manzur :
having icons in Applications and Palces and not in System looks like a
bug to the user
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I have no issue with icons being turned off, but turning them back on
should be a easy consistent, which it is not.
The location for this preference:
System Preferences Appearance Interface (Tab)
The option that turns it on/off:
Show Icons In menu
1) The issue with this is why would someone
a developer could tell me if I am wrong?
can we have system menu back even with context menus disabled by default?
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I support decisions taken by gnome developers and I also thank them for
keeping enable/disable option open for me to choose how my menus look.
#90 I didnt want to target your comment with the word Cute
I took it as:
clean and slick and cute are two options available
I also believe clean and
I agree with this change, but this is not a election, so I don't think
those kind of comments adds any additional value to the bug report.
#80 ...and makes other menus cute again
A cute looking Operating System is not something I think we should strive for.
Cute stuff could make you forgive the
Gergely, I tried with French, Latin, Polish, and Portuguese, and none of
the items in the System menu changed order. If you have a specific
example of menu items without icons that change order in a particular
language, please report that as a *separate* bug, including exactly
which language you
Sorry, it was a misunderstanding, the items in the System menu itself do
not change order (I wanted to say Settings instead of System). Order is
changed in Settings and Administration menus, but there *are* icons, so
Fabián should tell which menus are those that have no icons and change
order in
@manzur
Canonical had nothing to do with this, it was all Gnome's.
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Taylor Ripps L-Wren:
Pls read the initial comments , it was not all Gnome.
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That is no bug, they are sorted alphabetically afaik, which makes sense,
but it takes some time to find the correct one in another language.
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The software entries have icons and the system category order is fixed
though there
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I would just like to know why canonical took this decision
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I prefer enabling icons in: /desktop/gnome/interface/menus_have_icons
System Preference Appearance Interface Tab Select Show icons in menus
I keep it default (disabled) for
/desktop/gnome/interface/buttons_have_icons
This brings system menu back to normal and makes other menus cute
again
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Fabián, which items without icons change order when you change language?
That's probably a bug in itself.
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Eg. elements in System and Administration menus change order as language
changes (I have seen those menus in several lanugages), the order
depends always on the alphabetic order of the current translations.
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Look... I do not care about context icons BUT about system menu icons,
it looks horrible that we got any other main menu icons and System
Menu icons are gone, please pay attention to this
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I just came across this bug a few weeks ago when i started using alpha.
When using another language in Ubuntu options change positions *and*
names, and icons are the only way some options can be found quickly.
Without such icons it's not impossible but certainly not so easy to find
such options.
@mpt while on the whole i agree removing icons was a good idea as it
makes for a cleaner interface
but this as said in a previous comment really needs to be made a special
case and allow icons for this.
Me too. For example Close button is probably the most widely used
button in all windows, but
Disagree with removal of icons.
This looks and feels like there are missing icons. -.-
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Reported bug 451160.
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Thanks very much Matthew!! :D
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** Also affects: baltix
Importance: Undecided
Status: New
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Marcos, it's cool that we have made gufw a little more attractive
without you having to do anything (no more ugly orange and white
cross!), but the change has made it more obvious that you were not
following the Gnome guideline about size and padding of buttons.
Hi Matthew! Could you be more specific about Gufw, please? Gufw is an
open proyect to any tester and improvement :) Can you create (or another
designer) a bug with more specific details (https://bugs.launchpad.net
/gui-ufw) about the interface, please? Thanks! ;)
In other way, I think that remove
komputes, the gconf key does not apply to entire menus, it applies to
individual items. For example, when on, Places Connect to Server
and Bookmarks Organize Bookmarks have icons; when off, they don't.
Jean-François, testing this would be difficult but not impossible. Take
a representative
Hello!
As a developer (Gufw) I think this is a very bad decision.
In my case, the interface lost usability and beauty without icons.
You can compare here: http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/7526/screenshot1i.png
Please consider including the icons in Ubuntu!
Thanks and best regards.
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(design
2 point:
Canonical took a great decision coz they were trying to make buttons the same
size BUT..
after they have generated or designed small icons (16px) or minor ubuntu is
prepared to reconsider their inclusion
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(design decision) Icons missing from context menu , dialogue buttons , firefox
manzur,
You're talking about bug #84931, right? I don't think that was the
motivation for disabling icons... do you have an official source to
confirm this? Reading the comments on this bug from Matthew and others,
it seems to be a design decision.
If bug #84931 was the real reason for the
This just re-enable the icons in menu, not on dialog buttons. See
https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=595341
** Bug watch added: GNOME Bug Tracker #595341
http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=595341
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This gnome bug is really interesting... :)
Just a quote: if you want to restore icons with gconf-editor
(/desktop/gnome/interface/buttons_have_icon, menus_have_icon), remember to not
to run it with sudo, because that changes settings for root (and that's why you
won't see the effect).
--
Delan is right, you can activate them in the appearance settings
I think we should activate them by default not only it looks better but it lets
you find things faster as you can see on the gimp screenshot that I attached,
I don't know if it's my brain but I find the printer icon faster than the
I see that Ubuntu does not feel like returning icons. Let it be. But
people (as I see) don't like that change. So please highlight in visible
places (Release notes on Ubuntu webpage, etc.) that it can be changed in
System-Preferences-Appearance-Interface. I had spent really much time
on finding
I disagree with removal of icons too.
When I use Windows, I hated that there are no menu icons.
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Ok, this is going nowhere. We have a bunch of me too's but that's never going
to change their mind or give them a realistic sample of the gnome users'
opinions. Quoting André Klapper's (condescending) comment upstream:
'Feel free to ask them, e.g. run a poll somewhere where probably 0.01% of
if your really want to run a poll, we sould wait a few months to see the
whole picture (=wait to see if people get accustomed to it, otherwise
you will have a lot of negative answers based on the fact that a lot of
people don't like changes)
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(design decision) Icons missing from context menu ,
I thought you could restore them (at least in the beta) by going to
System.Preferences.Apperance on the Interface tab and checking Show
Icons in Menus... I did that...
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I strongly disagree with removal of icons too, especially since the
others menus in the Panel have some.
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I can confirm this bug as well for the system menu in karmic. ( see
http://launchpadlibrarian.net/33171684/system_menu_noicons.png )
Even with the gconf values on
/desktop/gnome/interface/buttons_have_icons and
/desktop/gnome/interface/menus_have_icons set to false, you will see
that editing
** Summary changed:
- (design decision) Icons missing from context menu , dialogue buttons ,
firefox bookmark favicons
+ (design decision) Icons missing from context menu , dialogue buttons ,
firefox bookmark favicons, system menu
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(design decision) Icons missing from context menu ,
I disagree with removal of icons too.
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Me too. For example Close button is probably the most widely used button
in all windows, but now it have no icon. Previously I could click it
without thinking, but now... well, this is disaster, I'm completly
inefficient.
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I disagree with removal of icons. I don't like this choice.
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Christoph: As I just explained on IRC, raw customizability of the menu
is not the standard we're using here -- otherwise every menu item in
OpenOffice.org would need an icon merely because its menus are
customizable. The Ubuntu Software Store has moved to the Applications
menu (bug 431882). And I
mpt : i've filled Bug #432876 concerning the icons missing problem with
search engines drop down list in Firefox
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As I see the Software Store is now in the System menu as well.
Does the software store not have an icon ?
And is this the main reason why the system menu does not get icons (in the
first level) at all ?
Oh, and the Places menu also has icons missing.
** Attachment added: Places menu with
I also vote for icons in menu. I have a feeling that Gnome people are
copying Mac OS X. Mac OS X doesn't have icons in menu, but nobody said
that this looks sexy. Please do not follow dumb OS X way. Please return
icons. My current Ubuntu menu looks unprofessional. Why Add/Remove
Applications has
Two things to keep in mind:
Ubuntu is Linux for Human Beings
and
Pretty is a Feature
Icons help people navigate and look pretty - buttons_have_icons
menus_have_icons = true
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The buttons_have_icons one is already starting to show up lots of apps
that have dialogs that look wrong with it on where some buttons get them
and some others don't and are smaller.
Given that people are saying that this is an upstream thing that's
already been decided can someone tell me what
I think that there is a bug in Firefox seacrch box related to that decision.
In the search box, the icon of the current search engine is displayed but if
you look at the drop down list there is no icon !
The search engine drop down list should use the always-show-icons property of
I agree with Christoph Korn.
Without icons and due to the indentation the system menu looks as if the
icons are missing.
That was exactly my first thought after upgrading.
After working without icons for a few hours I realized how important
they are to me. Without icons I actually have to read
me too, i do vote for keeping the icons where they should be
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I would like to have icons in the System menu of gnome also at the first level
for the following two reasons:
- All other menus in the gnome-panel (Applications and Places) have icons and
with the indentation in the System menu it looks as if there are icons missing.
- Because the System
Dave Gilbert: usability being more important than aesthetics suggests
an opposition that isn't really there. Aesthetics is part of usability;
for some research and examples of this, see
http://www.alistapart.com/articles/indefenseofeyecandy.
antistress: I don't see how adding an icon could ever
Indeed, forget about what i've written
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And yes I know I can set a setting in appearance to get 'em back
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I strongly disagree with removal of icons.
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Matthew: Yes, you're right it's a difference in balance - I'm a strong
believer in usability being more important than aesthetics; having said
that I'd much rather find a solution that satisfies both. I also don't
believe I'm on my own, and I don't think everyone agrees that losing the
icons
maybe i'm wrong but i believe that i would be more easier for the user if icons
already display in the toolbar would be in also in menus
It would help users to find stuff
i.e i don't know in what menu is X. But X isquite similar to Y which is in the
toolbar. Let's find Y in menus and i'll surely
Dave Gilbert: So basically we disagree on the weight given to usefulness
of an individual icon vs. the weight given to aesthetics of the menu as
a whole, and there's no way to argue that convincingly one way or
another. If it's any consolation, many of the actions that have highly-
recognizable
On Thu, 2009-08-27 at 12:45 +, Matthew Paul Thomas wrote:
For example, Mac OS
8 and 9 used icon-only forward and back buttons in their assistants
http://mactech.com/articles/develop/issue_27/arcellana.html. But that
had a substantial disadvantage: it gave the thing you were most likely
It is in gconf-editor (ready through the previous comments and you will
find the key), alternatively also under
system-preferences-appearance-interface
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You
at least nautilus should have an option that reads: Enable Menu
icons.
Why? To make nautilus NOT look like the rest of the desktop?
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at least nautilus should have an option that reads: Enable Menu icons.
Maybe this is not the perfect solution but it is just an idea that came into my
mind BUT maybe this is somewhere i do not know so, please make me know
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maybe it is in gconf-editor and i do not know
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i said it because i think nautilus is everything in gnome: desktop and
file manager
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Matthew,
I think where there are (fairly) universally recognised icons for things
then they also make sense for actions on menus (e.g. 'play' and back and
forward or print). While I understand that the gaps may look unsightly I
believe that the benefit in ease of navigation is significant
** Description changed:
- The icons are missing from the context menus and dialogue buttons , since i
updated :
+ The default setting for icons has now changed , the icons will not be shown
unless forced upon by the app.
+ Icons that are essential must be displayed and need to be set
@mpt ,
The arrow icons [back , forward , up , down] are very clear by themselves and
do not need labels.
But the labels are often different in different apps , for instance
either forward / next is used by different apps throughout the system.
Why not remove the labels for these buttons and
fishor, Mozilla has restored the icons in Firefox's Bookmarks menu (bug
408361).
Taylor L-Wren, it is true that icons are more recognizable than text,
but only for a few menu items. Unfortunately, those items are almost
always interspersed with other menu items that have no possible obvious
Another issue: bug #387796 concerned actually _adding_ icons to the menu
(for the open-with application list), it is sort of counter-productive
to fix the bug there and then remove the icons again with this
setting...
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