Re: U+0140

Elaine Keown Tucson Dear Asmus Freytag and Ken Whistler: I would be pleased if you at Unicode would choose to further describe your existing middle dot collection. I have *no* interest in _more_ middle dots, enough is enough. Eventually I hope there *will* be helpful notes on

Re: U+0140

Elaine Keown Tucson Hi, I kept the amazing list of middle dots listed this week on the main Unicode list for future reference. Hebrew (Hebrew from 1200 B.C.E. - present) needs at least 1 middle dot. Elaine __ Do

very OT Windows XP and Unicode alphabet of Magi

Elaine Keown Tucson Hi, Off-topic random questions: 1) Is Windows XP Unicode-compatible? If so, which version of Unicode? An Israeli scholar wrote me today about a scholarly Hebrew database, giving the disclaimer that it was not yet running under Windows XP. 2

Re: [hebrew] Re: Ancient Northwest Semitic Script

Elaine Keown still in Texas Hi, The core issue in all this is how to apply the Unicode character/glyph model to an old 22-letter alphabet with (most likely) a 3,700 year history. Personalities and sniping aside, that is the central issue. And I suspect that this 22-letter

Re: [hebrew] Re: Ancient Northwest Semitic Script (was Re: why Aramaic now)

Elaine Keown still in Texas Dear Michael Everson and Lists: Michael Everson wrote: > And the mother of those scripts is Phoenician. She is > *not* Hebrew. The mother script is probably the southern Sinai or Wadi el-Hol script, written in about 1,700 B.C.E. by Aramaea

Re: Ancient Northwest Semitic Script (was Re: why Aramaic now)

Elaine Keown Dear Christopher John Fynn: > > they had different opinions at Harvard and at > > UChicago. I > How about in European and Middle Eastern > Universities? I didn't have the motivation to pursue the earlier material because there were only tiny

Re: [hebrew] Re: Ancient Northwest Semitic Script (was Re: why Aramaic now)

Elaine Keown still in Texas Dear Michael Everson, Dean Snyder, and Lists: I am grateful that Michael Everson chose to share his thinking (and, I guess, that of Rick McGowan and Ken Whistler) on Semitic alphabet(s) with us. I had been wondering for a long time where the Roadmap ideas

Re: why Aramaic now

Elaine Keown Dear Mark and List: > >Some of the sets of symbols I found--- snip > > --are innately controversial because of the > Roadmap. Examples of innately controversial for Mark: I think Hebrew's been written since 1,150 B.C. But at every stage it had diffe

Re: why Aramaic now lumpers and splitters Samaritan

Elaine Keown Dear Michael: I can send Samaritan references after I finish the Hebrew proposal font corrections--I finally sent John Hudson two sets of minor changes yesterday, and I have several days' work on the others. John Hudson has been waiting on me almost two months, so I wa

Re: why Aramaic now lumpers and splitters

Elaine Keown in Texas Hi, > There is zero chance that Phoenician will be > considered to be a glyph variant of Hebrew. Many, many Semitists would be truly astonished to read this sentence. > >The font for the Samaritan marks is still in rough > > draft du

Re: why Aramaic now lumpers and splitters

Elaine Keown still in Texas Dear Michael Everson: > Or not. It depends what kinds of criteria we select, > or don't, and it's good to know that you aren't > prioritizing that either. It appears to me that script experts may resemble experts in dialec

RE: [hebrew] Re: Aramaic unification and information retrieval

Elaine Keown Hi, I hesitate to ask this, but what is the current opinion on how many Han characters there are? There's some Canadian Taoist scholar who has a really high number. All I know is that that 1740s dictionary had ~40,000. Elaine __ D

Re: why Aramaic now

Elaine Keown Dear Christopher John Fynn: Your arguments are very calm and rational, but it's not that simple. I wish it were. Some of the sets of symbols I found---which I simply assumed could be added to "Hebrew"--are innately controversial because of the Roa

Re: why Aramaic now

Elaine Keown still in Texas Dear Michael Everson: Michael, I have NO "master plan" for 2004 where this work on Aramaic unification (or near-unification) will be completed in a particular month, quarter, or even season. I will be working on it along with font correct

Re: Aramaic unification and information retrieval

Elaine Keown in Austin Dear John and main list: Since this was on the main list, I guess it's ok to reply there. > Now, that said, I am very keen to have the Samaritan > shin encoded, because > this is used as a mark in the apparatus critici of > the BHS and possi

why Aramaic now

Elaine Keown still in Texas Hi, The reason the Aramaic is being discussed now is that right now there are people who are interested in it inside your Unicode community. Right now Jewish studies and Biblical studies people are finally trying to convert to Unicode, fonts are

scripts for today's Aramaic

Elaine Keown still in Texas Hi, I'm forwarding this to answer someone's question from the main Unicode list, which, wonder of wonders, is discussing Aramaic. Peter Kirk discovered that there are probably a couple other scripts used by today's Aramaic spe

June Ashton 1999 thesis U Sydney

Elaine Keown in Austin Hi, I wanted to bring the following dissertation--listed at the bottom--to the attention of the e-discussion groups. I'm going to try to have some American research library or University Microfilms make it available here in the U.S. Apparently Dr. A

Re: Qumran Greek

Elaine Keown Hi, --- Michael Everson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The X looks like a CHI of course. It is a chi!!!--E. G. Turner Greek Manuscripts of the Ancient World 1987 says that chi is an editorial mark. His book has a plate of a Greek ms showing the chi and paragra

Re: Stability of WG2

Elaine Keown in Austin Hi, > Not with Ireland and Japan standing with the US on > such an issue. ;-) > We really must get the UK back into SC2 ;-) Is this another joke?--Elaine __ Do you Yahoo!? New Yahoo! Photos - easier uplo

Re: Swastika to be banned by Microsoft?

Elaine Keown Hi, > I'm embarrassed to admit it, but I find myself > thinking that the swastika, THE Nazi swastika, right-facing, tilted .the whole deal, should be encoded This looks to me like the ideal place for an extended note in Unicode, not a code point. The

Qumran scribal, again: http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/rs/dss/marks/review.html

Elaine Keown central Texas Hi, I'm sending along the URL of a fascinating article that Ken Penner brought to my attention. http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/rs/dss/marks/review.html Again, I'm still concerned about the overlap between Qumran and Greek, Qumran and Coptic, and

Re: Qumran Greek

Elaine in central Texas Hi, > I would guess that the first of your symbols, if > Greek, is a PARAGRAPHOS or a FORKED PARAGRAPHOS. > It's also used in Coptic. Yes, both of those seem to be at Qumran. In Coptic, do you know what period of time they are in? > The X looks like a CHI of cour

RE: unification (CJKV history) ; Alphabetic Aramaic+ ...

Elaine Keown still in Texas Dear Tom Emerson: > > This history of unification is laid out pretty > > clearly in Appendix A of TUS. I hope this is online--And they go all the way back to the 200 previous suggestions, some from the Chinese Language Computer Soci

unification (CJKV history) ; Alphabetic Aramaic+ ...

Elaine in Texas Hi, I'm working on unification and would like to more about the earliest CJKV work--was it from the RLG? Was their work the 201st solution to Chinese, or linked to the 200 earlier proposals? I read a book on computerizing languages by a Sproat from Bell Labs--not as s

Re: New symbols (was Qumran Greek)

Elaine in Tejas central Hi, > is > a complete listing of new symbols to go into Unicode Thanks!--how many Web sites do you all have? and why aren't they linked together for us fringies? When I looked last month, I couldn't find any link

Qumran Greek

Elaine Keown Hi, I include 2 Qumran symbols that are probably Greek. I'm looking for help with the large 'X'. Also, where will the new numbers for the accepted TLG items be posted? Debbie said everything got in, but I don't know where to find their assigned

Sample Hebrew character descript: http://www.cox-internet.com/keownlaw/

Elaine Keown still in Texas RE: http://www.cox-internet.com/keownlaw/ Hi, I'm sending this URL to ask for FEEDBACK on FORMATTING. I don't want to write more character descriptions without getting some other opinions. This list is NOT definitive--I had s

Unicode Hebrew proposal: nomenclature..

Elaine in Central Texas Hi, Ok, font underway, what a relief. Now NOMENCLATURE 1) BLOCK NAME: does the Hebrew block need to permanently be called Hebrew? If a better name would be HEBREW-ARAMAIC SQUARE SCRIPT, should that be added as a note? 2) SUB-BLOCK: can the sub-blocks have

Re: font creation software for Unicode Hebrew proposal ?

Elaine Keown central Texas Hello again, Please reply off-list--I'm mostly trying to become a 3-day weekend Fri-Sun Unicoder. For the Hebrew proposal, I'm mostly doing new vowels/diacritics since my beloved ligatures were outlawed. Is there somewhere a freely avail

Re: font creation software for Unicode Hebrew proposal ?

Elaine Keown Bryan, Texas Hello, > At 15:48 -0700 2003-09-26, Elaine Keown wrote > >What is the absolute minimal font requirement for a > Unicode proposal? > > Glyphs. Is there a difficulty? > Michael Everson * * Everson Typography * * If one is almos

re: History of Unicoding Hebrew

Elaine Keown central Texas Hello, Elaine Keown wrote: > >I was told third-hand that in the late 1980s some > >prominent. I was also told that they were > >ignored by whomever they contacted. Michael Everson wrote: > I do NOT think that reporting t

Re: font creation software for Unicode Hebrew proposal ?

Elaine Keown central Texas Hi, What is the absolute minimal font requirement for a Unicode proposal? Just glyphs or more? If the PUA is supposed to be left-to-right, what codes do I give the proposed glyphs? Do they have to have a real Unicode code point? Thanks, Elaine

re: History of Unicoding Hebrew

Elaine Keown Bryan, Texas Hello: After *today*, please reply off-list. I am now reading Unicode archives on the web and joining the list for 24 hours. >From: Dean Snyder ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) >Date: Tue Sep 16 2003 - 16:03:36 EDT >Can anyone point me to documen

font creation software for Unicode Hebrew proposal ?

Elaine Keown Bryan, Texas Hello: After *today*, please reply off-list. I am now reading the archives and sometimes joining the list for 24 hours. I am looking for inexpensive glyph creation software to produce a Unicode Hebrew proposal. The Hebrew Unicode list recommended

re: History of Unicoding Hebrew

Elaine Keown Bryan, Texas Hello: After *today*, please reply off-list. I am now reading Unicode archives on the web and joining the list for 24 hours. >From: Dean Snyder ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) >Date: Tue Sep 16 2003 - 16:03:36 EDT >Can anyone point me to documen

[OT] terminology: BMP, UCS 3 questions

here? 3. 971, what does " * Numbered subset 300 (BMP) " mean? See y'all in Kowloon, Elaine Keown Find the best deals on the web at AltaVista Shopping! http://www.shopping.altavista.com

[very OT] Documentation: beyond 65,536 ; misc Semitic ?s

Hello, Within the book, Unicode 3.0, is there somewhere a long section I missed about all the stuff that happens beyond the "first 65,536," in addition to surrogate stuff? Is there other documentation somewhere? Today are there still 7,827 unused code values? Will they be unassigned unti

[ OT ] ISO 10646-x and Unicode 3.0 and Hebrew ?

aic-Hebrew work for the Web, and we currently own 2 copies of Unicode 3.0 and no copies of the ISO parallel text(s). -------Elaine Keown Find the best deals on the web at AltaVista Shopping! http://www.shopping.altavista.com

ConScript registry?

Hello, What's the ConScript registry? Does it have a formal relationship with Unicode? Sounds like something designed to be used with the Private Use Area? Elaine Keown Find the best deals on the web at AltaVista Shopping! http://www.shopping.altavista.com

[OT] Unicode-compatible SQL?

de 3.0 the best choice. Elaine Keown Find the best deals on the web at AltaVista Shopping! http://www.shopping.altavista.com

Re: What about musical notation ?

chanting liturgically. These symbols are at least 1100 years old. Elaine Keown "Erik Garrés" wrote: > I would like to know, why the symbols used for music are not listed on > UNICODE ? Find the best deals on the web at AltaVista Shopping! http://www.shopping.altavista.com

Japanese in Arabic , Javanese

its Roman period. Elaine Keown Find the best deals on the web at AltaVista Shopping! http://www.shopping.altavista.com

[ very OT ] why abjad ..? ; list--Arabic script languages

Hello, Below, latest list of Arabic-script languages. Additions appreciated. Eighteen of these languages are mentioned in Unicode 3.0 documentation. Question for the list: Unicode 3.0 Arabic and most literature in English lists variant Arabic script alphabets in "abjad" order. Why was "ab

Re: [langue-fr] L'anglais est-il une langue universelle ?

ects of Europeanization in much of the world (Africa and Asia get less attention), language death, and language rebirth (Hawaiian, Fijian, Hebrew, Gaelic, Welsh). Worth reading, although very sad--Elaine Keown Find the best deals on the web at AltaVista Shopping! http://www.shopping.altavista.com

expansion of bidi planned?

cause they thought it was the worst possible combination of languages. Elaine Keown Find the best deals on the web at AltaVista Shopping! http://www.shopping.altavista.com

boustrophedon more current, not ancient?

a field. So I'm not sure if the quote below is completely accurate. > "Boustrophedon writing is of interest almost exclusively to scholars > intent on reproducing the exact visual content of ancient texts. The Elaine Keown Find the best deals on the web at AltaVista Shopping! http://www.shopping.altavista.com

bidi or multi algorithm?

Hello, Is Unicode's so-called "bidi algorithm" really bidirectional, that is, does it govern horizontal text layout in right-to-left and left-to-right languages? Or is "bidi" a metaphor here, for more possible text orientations, including vertical boustrophedons and other historically availa

Aramaic by any other name.........

Hello, Aramaic is spoken in many countries today:Israel, Armenia, Georgia, Turkey, Iran, Iraq, U.S., probably Azerbaijan, maybe further into Central Asia in some pockets...but it's never called Aramaic, as far as I knowit's called Surit, Kurdit, Turoyo, Assyrian, Mandaean, Ma'

[OT] Arabic script langs in 3.0 ; list?

Hello, Unicode 3.0 mentions 11 contemporary languages written in Arabic, most from Central Asia, none from Africa except Arabic---Berber is not mentioned. Is Arabic script no longer used south of the Sahara? Or does standard Arabic script easily cover relevant African languages? My usually

sort of OT: politics and scripts

Cyrillic has started, and there is a return to Arabic script. But not "plain vanilla" Arabic script, but the extended Arabic scripts with extra symbols.. This gives Unicode an odd "legacy code" problem, in

Re: Stacking Thai marks, stacking Hebrew marks?

ngrad Codex, is actually considerably simpler than other Hebrew manuscripts. I'm getting ready to look at the complexity problem this week. Elaine Keown Philadelphia ___ Free Unlimited Internet Access! Try it now! http://www

Unicode 3.0 OS implementation URLs?

Hello, I'm still trying to get information on which operating systems have implemented Unicode 3.0it's important for Hebrew and Aramaic. I'm speaking about all this at a professional meeting next month Could list folks refer me to suitable URLs for Microsoft, Apple, Sun, Linux

please expand re bidi algorithm

Dear Michka and List: Please elaborate on what you said belowyou mean there are multiple technical approaches to bidi, something like that?Do bidi algorithms have a long history in the world of algorithms? > my example about the Unicode Bidi algorithm is hardly contrived, since man

lag time in Unicode implementations in OS, etc?

Hello, I'm writing to inquire about the "lag time" between when Unicode 3.0 hit the street and when implementations in Windows NT, software tools, fonts, etc. came out? Does stuff usually come out within 3 months, 6 months, ? Is there a central URL that keeps track of implementations, so

Re: Major site in unicode?

s is not what you asked, but there is some movement in Biblical Studies toward Unicode now, they are planning some important sites using Biblical Hebrew and Aramaic, a very exciting development. Unicode 3.0 added some versions of Hebrew characters widely used in diaspora Hebrew teaching and researc

[off-topic] database collation with standard Unicode 3.0 Hebrew block

Hello, Thanks for all the help with UTF-8 and Hebrew vowels. I hope to help write electronic dictionaries for Hebrew script languages. The dictionaries will be used by Chinese Hebrew students and will have vowel points. We Diaspora Hebraists invariably use pointed Hebrew except when orderi

Re: Unicode on a website

Hello, I'm interested in using the more recent Unicode Hebrew versions on Web sites. These versions have about 30 more symbols for Hebrew Bible text than the original Unicode from the early 90s. But the UTF-8 versions I found on the Web only seem to have the early 90s version of Hebrew, and