Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode
Your testers can be remote, assuming you get "live wires" who will dedicate time to testing/ communications I always invite them to SLACK asap so they feel they can contact me any time and then we jump into appear.in video rooms. I just exited 2 hours of meetings with one young mom, her

Division by Zero Error

2017-07-07 Thread Roger Guay via use-livecode
I often find that I have to deal with a division by zero error message in plotting functions, solving equation etc. Are there methods or techniques used to programmatically handle or work-around a possible division by zero? e.g. If I want to evaluate y= 1/(x-3), what can I do to deal with a

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread J. Landman Gay via use-livecode
On July 7, 2017 8:26:53 PM Mark Wieder via use-livecode wrote: There's a truism that you can't test your own software - you're way to close to the way it *should* work to ever figure out how users are going to try to use it. Oh man is that ever true. I'm lucky

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Mark Wieder via use-livecode
On 07/07/2017 05:07 PM, Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode wrote: That's it. Everything else I'm about to tell you is just commentary." Great background story. -- Mark Wieder ahsoftw...@gmail.com ___ use-livecode mailing list

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Mark Wieder via use-livecode
On 07/07/2017 05:50 PM, Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode wrote: The way my brain works, I am decent at figuring out clever solutions, but terrible at realizing what others will find intuitive. Heh. You're not alone there. There's a truism that you can't test your own software - you're way to

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
I am impressed by your circle of beta testers! I have plenty of friends and family that would help, but they are spread around the country. Point taken about folks not communicating so well. It seems like direct observation of them using it could help. The way my brain works, I am decent at

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode
I would echo Jacqueline's advice here: " There's no secret to creating a great application that people will use and enjoy. Test the application and everything in it, again and again. Run everything through its paces several times and in different orders. Click every button, read and scroll

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
Thanks Bill I am thinking of reaching out to Trip Advisor after version 1.5, but focusing on high schools initially. Trolls are a big concern. I have a lot ideas on dealing with that, including taking advantage of the self-correcting nature of social media. I am going to add in a rating

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread William Prothero via use-livecode
Jonathon: There are two learning processes going on. One is for the person testing the software, the second is for you, learning what kinds of interface approaches hang up new users. As you learn, by observing users, you will gain approaches that minimize future user problems, and you will find

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
It does help, Scott - sounds like I should segment the testing process with a cycle, running through the test, observe, discuss, note cycle for each group of functionalities. Not unlike PM methodology. Because I am looking to perfect and grow a single app over many years, I should be able to

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
It sounds like a little bit of direct, intensive observation is worth a lot of testing a a distance. Thanks Jeff Sent from my iPhone > On Jul 7, 2017, at 5:31 PM, Jeff Reynolds via use-livecode > wrote: > > Jonathan, > > I second bill's approach of watching

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Scott Rossi via use-livecode
You don’t have to keep your mouth shut. In fact, you should be vocal, but you want your tester to be more vocal. Generalized suggestions from past experience… - First, explain to the tester in general terms what your app does. Avoid getting into operating specifics. - Tell the tester you

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Jeff Reynolds via use-livecode
Jonathan, I second bill's approach of watching folks use the app. Years of educational software creation taught me this. I would always make friends with a local teacher that was into tech and they usually were happy to get a period to try something on the kids if it only took one period to do

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
Well, 3 out of 3 people who tested my app from this list got stuck signing up, but no one got stuck when I was there to prompt them to use the Universal Options button. So, I have to discipline myself to keep my mouth shut. Everything depends on it. This is my second time reading your article,

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread J. Landman Gay via use-livecode
That's a good summary. It's tedious sometimes but essential. The hardest part by far is keeping your mouth shut. If I had a one-way mirror in a sound-proofed room I'd use that. Another method might be to have the user share their screen and turn off your microphone, but screen sharing is not

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
>From reading these, it looks like my basic steps are these: 1. Make changes to the app 2. Test for usability myself a dozen times, trying things in different orders and in different ways to make it fail 3. Have my testers, which is really about 3 family members, test it to make it fail No

Group does not exist after "copy to this card"

2017-07-07 Thread Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami via use-livecode
I doing this thing of saving a custom control in the loader stack on card 4..but it's behavior is text only stack on external to the stack group "shareUI"" then I have a new init handler that adds the long id's of these controls global sConfigA to then it is super easy to do this anywhere

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
Thank you, Jacqueline Sent from my iPhone > On Jul 7, 2017, at 1:39 PM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode > wrote: > > http://hyperactivesw.com/resources_testing.html > > >> On July 7, 2017 6:59:52 AM Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode >>

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread J. Landman Gay via use-livecode
http://hyperactivesw.com/resources_testing.html On July 7, 2017 6:59:52 AM Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode wrote: What steps do you guys follow for accurate testing when you don't have a budget for proper official testing procedures? -- Jacqueline Landman

Re: iOS Browser Widget and PDFs? SOLVED

2017-07-07 Thread Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
I think you are safe using special folder path "documents" on all platforms. Sent from my iPhone > On Jul 7, 2017, at 1:00 PM, JOHN PATTEN via use-livecode > wrote: > > FWIW… > > The issue was related to the specialFolderPath. When I was testing this > aspect

Re: iOS Browser Widget and PDFs? SOLVED

2017-07-07 Thread JOHN PATTEN via use-livecode
FWIW… The issue was related to the specialFolderPath. When I was testing this aspect of the app I had it point to specialFolderPath(“Desktop"). Naturally, on the iPad I changed it to specialFolderPath(“engine”) thinking that would cover the iOS app. Nope. Apparently you can’t save files

Re: Problem showing card script in IDE in LC9.0.0(dp7)

2017-07-07 Thread hh via use-livecode
http://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=19887 ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences:

Re: Google Static Maps Demo Available

2017-07-07 Thread William Prothero via use-livecode
I just uploaded a new version, with a few minor tweaks to my Google static maps demo stack, at Hermann’s suggestions (same link address I sent previously). You don’t need to get a Google APIKey anymore, but will need it for a real app. If anybody would like to modify it to work with Bing maps

Problem showing card script in IDE in LC9.0.0(dp7)

2017-07-07 Thread William Prothero via use-livecode
Folks: LC 9.0.0(dp7) doesn’t show the script of the first card on my application, when I open it in the project browser. If I don’t try to edit the script, then save the app, everything is ok. Going further, it appears that the card script of the last card is not displayed. To work around this,

Re: Text style is hit or miss for me

2017-07-07 Thread Devin Asay via use-livecode
Roger, The advantage of the array notation for textStyle is that you can explicitly set each style for a given run of text. The disadvantage of the array notation for textStyle is that you have to explicitly un-set each style for a given run of text. ;) set the textStyle[“bold”] of the

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
Thank you, Devin! Sent from my iPhone > On Jul 7, 2017, at 12:01 PM, Devin Asay via use-livecode > wrote: > > Jonathan, > > Here’s a link to my lesson outline when I teach my students about conducting > user evaluations of software. It’s still a bit sparse and

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Dr. Hawkins via use-livecode
In another era, Heathkit reportedly used secretaries to test the instructions to their electronics kits. They found that they could only use any given secretary three times, as she would pick up enough doing the first three to overcome errors in future runs without being stopped by them . . .

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Devin Asay via use-livecode
Jonathan, Here’s a link to my lesson outline when I teach my students about conducting user evaluations of software. It’s still a bit sparse and needs to be fleshed out, but I include some links to a couple of really good articles on evaluation techniques, including one by our very own Jacque

Re: Text style is hit or miss for me

2017-07-07 Thread Roger Eller via use-livecode
That worked perfectly for all but plain. In my plain button, I had to write it as: set the textStyle of the selectedChunk to "plain". Thank you, Mark! ~Roger On Fri, Jul 7, 2017 at 10:40 AM, Mark Waddingham via use-livecode < use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote: > Hi Roger, > > On

Re: Google Static Maps Demo Available

2017-07-07 Thread Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
Hey guys - just a quick warning about google. Read their TOS very carefully before building an app around their service. One can find several horror stories online about Google cancelling contracts without really explaining why. Bill's stack should work well with a little bit of adaptation for

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Mark Wieder via use-livecode
On 07/07/2017 07:29 AM, prothero--- via use-livecode wrote: Actually watching users is invaluable. Absolutely. And try to resist the urge to help them along. And take notes about where they hesitate or stumble. As a QA engineer, I find that when I'm faced with a new application I have about

Re: Text style is hit or miss for me

2017-07-07 Thread Mark Waddingham via use-livecode
Hi Roger, On 2017-07-07 16:36, Roger Eller via use-livecode wrote: How do you guys do formatting buttons? Try set the textStyle["bold"] of the selectedChunk to true set the textStyle["italic"] of the selectedChunk to true Warmest Regards, Mark. -- Mark Waddingham ~ m...@livecode.com

Text style is hit or miss for me

2017-07-07 Thread Roger Eller via use-livecode
I am attempting to add formatting buttons above a field. If the text is typed into the field, my formatting buttons work as expected. When a user pastes text from another application, my formatting works sometimes, but not always. Below is what I use in my Bold button, and Italic button. I

Re: Google Static Maps Demo Available

2017-07-07 Thread Mark Wieder via use-livecode
On 07/06/2017 10:33 PM, William Prothero via use-livecode wrote: Mark: Yes, you’ve done it all. Cool. It's working as expected then. It was intended just to demo the display of a Google Static Map and show how to get the corners of the image so the lat/lon of the mouse position could be

Re: Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread prothero--- via use-livecode
Jonathon, I feel your pain. In my case, I was initiated by my students and very quickly learned how to ask the questions a newbie would ask. I also paid small amounts to graduate students to get their feedback. One of my very effective testers is my grandson, my wife, any of my colleagues who

Re: debugging a CEF browser instance

2017-07-07 Thread Mark Waddingham via use-livecode
Hi Bernard, On 2017-07-07 14:02, Bernard Devlin via use-livecode wrote: This makes it very clear that the problem relates to the way that LC is embedding the CEF browser. This is also confirmed by the fact the page will not load in LC browser widget on OS X. Is there any way of debugging the

Re: debugging a CEF browser instance

2017-07-07 Thread Bernard Devlin via use-livecode
Hi Mark, I've now found an app which has embedded the CEF browser within it. This embedded CEF browser has no trouble loading the page in question. This makes it very clear that the problem relates to the way that LC is embedding the CEF browser. This is also confirmed by the fact the page will

Biased testing and micro-coaching

2017-07-07 Thread Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
I think my experience of the last two days has taught me something - I have been micro-coaching my friends when they try my app. Just the littlest input, like saying "oh, just press the button again to submit" comes so easily and, apparently mucks up testing entirely. While the harm will be

Re: Augmented Earth now on the App Store!

2017-07-07 Thread Jonathan Lynch via use-livecode
Hi Swami, The interface confuses people about whether they are logging in or signing up - I added some things that make that explicit and going to submit as soon as I test on a few friends. If you want to register, fill in the fields for a new user then click the gear again to have the option

Re: Google Static Maps Demo Available

2017-07-07 Thread hh via use-livecode
Hi William, this is a great demo, especially your (clever) library functions. It works all fine here and it is really the base one needs for getting everything else through the GMap APIs. Of course, every LC user from all over the world who is not used to work with numeric coords would be happy

Re: Feature Race: Pick Your Project

2017-07-07 Thread Graham Samuel via use-livecode
I was one of the ones who didn't contribute because I have very little interest in data grids, and right now I have very little time to read this list - so I just went with the 'data grid' headline and concluded that it wasn't for me. Jacque's post belatedly made me regret this. In retrospect

Mobile - "Copy Files" tab of Standalone

2017-07-07 Thread Alan via use-livecode
Using LC9dp7 - I'm adding files and a folder to be used by the Standalone Builder in the "Copy Files" tab. For some reason, when adding a file in a sub-folder, it seems to create the sub-folder as well when testing the app in the Simulator - I'm pretty sure that this didn't used to be the case.