Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
At least i know now how to use it with ISPconfig setups and their howto's to get fantastic VPS Linux setups, maybe how it's working with my VPS helps Op 20-11-2019 om 03:02 schreef Richard Gaskin via use-livecode: Alex Tweedly wrote: On 19/11/2019 18:19, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode wrote: I may be able to help with the workaround, writing a script to set that up. But I'm finding that there are so many different shared hosting configs, each with their own precious special needs, that making a single installation script for all of them is non-trivial. ... That's not *simply* selfishness, because I believe there are perhaps only a handful of ISPs who provide a high percentage of the Livecode (shared) servers found in the real world, and I'm optimistic to think that solving this problem for those cases would be enough to make a difference, and specifically would help anyone coming to LC server as a new user. Google tells me (in a 30 second search, limited to the first two pages) that only on-rev (aka Livecode hosting) and HostM specifically advertise themselves for Livecode servers. Maybe those two would be a good start ? I suppose they would. I don't use either, but you've inspired me. :) I use Dreamhost and Interserver, and conceivably if I write a script that works with both of those we may find that's fine for most others. And then for edge cases we can maintain the code on GitHub so anyone who needs a change for another host can just add that part. In order of prevalence I'd guess that LC deploys are most common on: on-rev.com (very big) hostm.com (kinda big) dreamhost.com (several) jaguarpc.com (a few) ...and after that we're looking at a long but slim tail. I'll give it some thought for when my client work is behind me and I have some spare time. It would also be nice to write a script for installing LC Server on systems that don't have it preinstalled (pretty much everyone right now except on-rev and hostm). Even better would be to handle both shared and VPS hosting. If Let's Encrypt can be automated for so many systems with CertBot (an excellent piece of work), surely we can install LC Server. ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
Alex Tweedly wrote: On 19/11/2019 18:19, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode wrote: I may be able to help with the workaround, writing a script to set that up. But I'm finding that there are so many different shared hosting configs, each with their own precious special needs, that making a single installation script for all of them is non-trivial. ... That's not *simply* selfishness, because I believe there are perhaps only a handful of ISPs who provide a high percentage of the Livecode (shared) servers found in the real world, and I'm optimistic to think that solving this problem for those cases would be enough to make a difference, and specifically would help anyone coming to LC server as a new user. Google tells me (in a 30 second search, limited to the first two pages) that only on-rev (aka Livecode hosting) and HostM specifically advertise themselves for Livecode servers. Maybe those two would be a good start ? I suppose they would. I don't use either, but you've inspired me. :) I use Dreamhost and Interserver, and conceivably if I write a script that works with both of those we may find that's fine for most others. And then for edge cases we can maintain the code on GitHub so anyone who needs a change for another host can just add that part. In order of prevalence I'd guess that LC deploys are most common on: on-rev.com (very big) hostm.com (kinda big) dreamhost.com (several) jaguarpc.com (a few) ...and after that we're looking at a long but slim tail. I'll give it some thought for when my client work is behind me and I have some spare time. It would also be nice to write a script for installing LC Server on systems that don't have it preinstalled (pretty much everyone right now except on-rev and hostm). Even better would be to handle both shared and VPS hosting. If Let's Encrypt can be automated for so many systems with CertBot (an excellent piece of work), surely we can install LC Server. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Systems Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
On 19/11/2019 18:19, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode wrote: I may be able to help with the workaround, writing a script to set that up. But I'm finding that there are so many different shared hosting configs, each with their own precious special needs, that making a single installation script for all of them is non-trivial. Call me a cynic :-) - but I'm an optimistic cynic I know *absolutely* nothing about the workaround or what's involved - but it's easy to believe there are a myriad of special config needs. However, I'm a cynic so I'll admit that I don't care about all the many hundreds or thousands of them - I only care about two; the two ISPs I use for my own sites. That's not *simply* selfishness, because I believe there are perhaps only a handful of ISPs who provide a high percentage of the Livecode (shared) servers found in the real world, and I'm optimistic to think that solving this problem for those cases would be enough to make a difference, and specifically would help anyone coming to LC server as a new user. Google tells me (in a 30 second search, limited to the first two pages) that only on-rev (aka Livecode hosting) and HostM specifically advertise themselves for Livecode servers. Maybe those two would be a good start ? (and by coincidence are the two I care about :-) :-) Alex. ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
It's frustrating, having to choose between adoption-impairing excessive resource usage, or adoption-impairing usability issues raised by the setup complexity of the workaround (custom font config file). I may be able to help with the workaround, writing a script to set that up. But I'm finding that there are so many different shared hosting configs, each with their own precious special needs, that making a single installation script for all of them is non-trivial. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Systems Mark Wieder wrote: On 11/14/19 5:47 PM, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode wrote: Wow. Even worse than I'd thought. LC Server is such a wonderful tool, I feel it could provide a great way to introduce other devs to chunk expressions and more. But after that experience on a popular shared host that couldn't handle LC's resource usage, I began to feel dismayed by the prospects. If we can't find a solution in the engine, at least we have a workaround with a custom font config file. But it's so many extra steps to set that up it rather kills the joy of LC's simplicity. I forgot to mention libgraphite, which is loaded by default by libharfbuzz. FWIW, the following 242 font files are checked (open file, read a few bytes from start of file, close file) on my linux system for each server transaction. This in spite of my executing a simple "hello world" script that uses NO fonts: /etc/fonts/fonts.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d /etc/fonts/conf.d/10-hinting-slight.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/10-scale-bitmap-fonts.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/11-lcdfilter-default.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-dejavu-lgc-sans-mono.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-dejavu-lgc-sans.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-dejavu-lgc-serif.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-dejavu-sans-mono.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-dejavu-sans.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-dejavu-serif.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-vera.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/30-metric-aliases.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/30-opensymbol.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/40-nonlatin.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/45-generic.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/45-latin.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/49-sansserif.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/50-user.conf /home/mwieder/.config/fontconfig/conf.d /home/mwieder/.config/fontconfig/fonts.conf /home/mwieder/.config/font-manager/conf.d /home/mwieder/.config/font-manager/directories.conf /home/mwieder/.config/font-manager/local.conf /home/mwieder/.config/font-manager/select.conf /home/mwieder/.fonts.conf.d /home/mwieder/.fonts.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/51-local.conf /etc/fonts/local.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/57-dejavu-sans-mono.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/57-dejavu-sans.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/57-dejavu-serif.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/58-dejavu-lgc-sans-mono.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/58-dejavu-lgc-sans.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/58-dejavu-lgc-serif.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/59-lohit-devanagari.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/60-generic.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/60-latin.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-01-tlwg-kinnari.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-02-tlwg-norasi.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-10-tlwg-loma.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-11-tlwg-waree.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-13-tlwg-garuda.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-14-tlwg-umpush.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-15-laksaman.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-21-tlwg-typo.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-22-tlwg-typist.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-23-tlwg-mono.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-beng-extra.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-deva-extra.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-gubbi.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-gujr-extra.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-guru-extra.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-orya-extra.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-pagul.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-telu-extra.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-smc-meera.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-smc-rachana.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-droid-sans-fallback.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-fonts-persian.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-fonts-takao-pgothic.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-khmer.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-nonlatin.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-wqy-microhei.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-assamese.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-bengali.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-devanagari.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-gujarati.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-gurmukhi.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-kannada.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-odia.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-tamil-classical.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-tamil.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-telugu.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-fonts-smc-manjari.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-anjalioldlipi.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-chilanka.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-dyuthi.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-karumbi.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-keraleeyam.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-raghumalayalamsans.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-suruma.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-uroob.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/69-unifont.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/70-fonts-noto-cjk.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/70-no-bitmaps.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/80-delicious.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/89-tlwg-garuda-synthetic.conf
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
On 11/14/19 5:47 PM, Richard Gaskin via use-livecode wrote: Wow. Even worse than I'd thought. LC Server is such a wonderful tool, I feel it could provide a great way to introduce other devs to chunk expressions and more. But after that experience on a popular shared host that couldn't handle LC's resource usage, I began to feel dismayed by the prospects. If we can't find a solution in the engine, at least we have a workaround with a custom font config file. But it's so many extra steps to set that up it rather kills the joy of LC's simplicity. I forgot to mention libgraphite, which is loaded by default by libharfbuzz. FWIW, the following 242 font files are checked (open file, read a few bytes from start of file, close file) on my linux system for each server transaction. This in spite of my executing a simple "hello world" script that uses NO fonts: /etc/fonts/fonts.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d /etc/fonts/conf.d/10-hinting-slight.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/10-scale-bitmap-fonts.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/11-lcdfilter-default.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-dejavu-lgc-sans-mono.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-dejavu-lgc-sans.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-dejavu-lgc-serif.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-dejavu-sans-mono.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-dejavu-sans.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-dejavu-serif.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/20-unhint-small-vera.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/30-metric-aliases.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/30-opensymbol.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/40-nonlatin.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/45-generic.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/45-latin.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/49-sansserif.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/50-user.conf /home/mwieder/.config/fontconfig/conf.d /home/mwieder/.config/fontconfig/fonts.conf /home/mwieder/.config/font-manager/conf.d /home/mwieder/.config/font-manager/directories.conf /home/mwieder/.config/font-manager/local.conf /home/mwieder/.config/font-manager/select.conf /home/mwieder/.fonts.conf.d /home/mwieder/.fonts.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/51-local.conf /etc/fonts/local.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/57-dejavu-sans-mono.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/57-dejavu-sans.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/57-dejavu-serif.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/58-dejavu-lgc-sans-mono.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/58-dejavu-lgc-sans.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/58-dejavu-lgc-serif.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/59-lohit-devanagari.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/60-generic.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/60-latin.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-01-tlwg-kinnari.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-02-tlwg-norasi.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-10-tlwg-loma.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-11-tlwg-waree.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-13-tlwg-garuda.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-14-tlwg-umpush.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-15-laksaman.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-21-tlwg-typo.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-22-tlwg-typist.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/64-23-tlwg-mono.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-beng-extra.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-deva-extra.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-gubbi.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-gujr-extra.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-guru-extra.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-orya-extra.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-pagul.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-fonts-telu-extra.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-smc-meera.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-0-smc-rachana.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-droid-sans-fallback.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-fonts-persian.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-fonts-takao-pgothic.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-khmer.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-nonlatin.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/65-wqy-microhei.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-assamese.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-bengali.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-devanagari.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-gujarati.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-gurmukhi.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-kannada.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-odia.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-tamil-classical.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-tamil.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/66-lohit-telugu.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-fonts-smc-manjari.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-anjalioldlipi.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-chilanka.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-dyuthi.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-karumbi.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-keraleeyam.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-raghumalayalamsans.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-suruma.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/67-smc-uroob.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/69-unifont.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/70-fonts-noto-cjk.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/70-no-bitmaps.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/80-delicious.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/89-tlwg-garuda-synthetic.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/89-tlwg-kinnari-synthetic.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/89-tlwg-laksaman-synthetic.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/89-tlwg-umpush-synthetic.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/90-fonts-nanum.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/90-synthetic.conf /usr/share/fonts /var/cache/fontconfig//3830d5c3ddfd5cd38a049b759396e72e-le64.cache-7 /usr/local/share/fonts /var/cache/fontconfig//4c599c202bc5c08e2d34565a40eac3b2-le64.cache-7 /home/mwieder/.local/share/fonts /var/cache/fontconfig//f34f8236e7353d7d85a1ce4a33e70966-le64.cache-7 /usr/share/fonts/X11
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
Mark Wieder wrote: Having looked into this a bit previously, it's somewhat more involved even than that. There a interlocking pieces among (at least) libskia, libcairo, and libharfbuzz, all of which jostle each other to make sure there is a complete list of fonts available in the native system. I haven't yet seen a way to change this behavior without modifying the third-party libraries themselves. Are those libraries loaded from code, or from something in the make file? I believe the problem Richard is referring to (RG: correct me if I'm wrong about this) is that on startup the engine (and this includes the server engine) queries the system for the various places where fonts might be stored, then iterates through the list of locations and makes a list of all the available fonts on the computer *and* the alternates for the fonts it might need for display. I also see the libraries launched again for every extension loaded by the system. Wow. Even worse than I'd thought. LC Server is such a wonderful tool, I feel it could provide a great way to introduce other devs to chunk expressions and more. But after that experience on a popular shared host that couldn't handle LC's resource usage, I began to feel dismayed by the prospects. If we can't find a solution in the engine, at least we have a workaround with a custom font config file. But it's so many extra steps to set that up it rather kills the joy of LC's simplicity. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Systems Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web Ambassador at FourthWorld.com http://www.FourthWorld.com ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
On 11/14/19 10:36 AM, Brian Milby via use-livecode wrote: Although the concept of the change is simple, the implementation is not trivial. It may not be that hard for a Mark, but it does look a little involved to me. The code that does the font stuff isn’t easy to just cut out since so much later depends on those structures being populated. It may be possible to stub it out where a single static font is loaded, but I’m talking way above my head at this point. (different Mark here, but...) Having looked into this a bit previously, it's somewhat more involved even than that. There a interlocking pieces among (at least) libskia, libcairo, and libharfbuzz, all of which jostle each other to make sure there is a complete list of fonts available in the native system. I haven't yet seen a way to change this behavior without modifying the third-party libraries themselves. I believe the problem Richard is referring to (RG: correct me if I'm wrong about this) is that on startup the engine (and this includes the server engine) queries the system for the various places where fonts might be stored, then iterates through the list of locations and makes a list of all the available fonts on the computer *and* the alternates for the fonts it might need for display. I also see the libraries launched again for every extension loaded by the system. -- Mark Wieder ahsoftw...@gmail.com ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
Thanks for looking into this, Brian. My understanding of the team's approval of this IF addition is that anyone adding "-f" to their call invoking a faceless LC engine assumes responsibility if that breaks anything else they try to invoke later. Down the road, the team would like to use "lazy font initialization", described in that bug report in Peter Brett's comments. This addition of a command line flag is merely a stop-gap, a way to allow LC's natural efficiencies at so many tasks needed for CGI work to run unimpeded by the mostly-unused overhead of loading fonts. Given the potential for LC, with its glorious chunk expressions, to one day rival Ruby and Python for CGI tasks, I hate to see adoption inhibited by needless resource consumption. -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Systems Brian Milby wrote: Although the concept of the change is simple, the implementation is not trivial. It may not be that hard for a Mark, but it does look a little involved to me. The code that does the font stuff isn’t easy to just cut out since so much later depends on those structures being populated. It may be possible to stub it out where a single static font is loaded, but I’m talking way above my head at this point. Thanks, Brian On Nov 14, 2019, 1:18 PM -0500, JJS via use-livecode , wrote: Thanks, that was an interesting read. Unfortunately i have zero C++ skills Regards, Jerry Op 13-11-2019 om 22:16 schreef Richard Gaskin via use-livecode: > JJS wrote: > > Op 12-11-2019 om 19:34 schreef Brian Milby via use-livecode: > > > Unless you are doing a HTML5 app (entire stack resides in a web > > > page), none of the GUI stuff applies. The LC code is pretty much > > > a replacement for PHP code, so the GUI piece would be the same > > > (whatever HTML/JS frameworks you choose). > > > > So actually the Dictionary needs some updates of stuff that is not an > > error but also doing nothing when used on server. > > GUI elements can be useful in LC Server for creating custom screen > shots, which can be exported and that file data returned to the client > for display in a browser or an LC app. > > That's the good news. > > That bad news is that 100% of all LC Server use is slower than it > needs to be because it's initializing fonts for the 0.001% of CGIs > using custom graphics export with specified fonts. > > I've discussed the situation with several people at LC Ltd, and while > they're not in a position to put a solution in place right now they > are quite open to accepting a pull request for it, which should be a > relatively simple matter for anyone with C++ skills. > > I've outlined the problem and the proposed solution in detail here: > > http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-livecode/2019-March/253723.html > ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
Although the concept of the change is simple, the implementation is not trivial. It may not be that hard for a Mark, but it does look a little involved to me. The code that does the font stuff isn’t easy to just cut out since so much later depends on those structures being populated. It may be possible to stub it out where a single static font is loaded, but I’m talking way above my head at this point. Thanks, Brian On Nov 14, 2019, 1:18 PM -0500, JJS via use-livecode , wrote: > Thanks, that was an interesting read. > > Unfortunately i have zero C++ skills > > > Regards, > > Jerry > > Op 13-11-2019 om 22:16 schreef Richard Gaskin via use-livecode: > > JJS wrote: > > > Op 12-11-2019 om 19:34 schreef Brian Milby via use-livecode: > > > > Unless you are doing a HTML5 app (entire stack resides in a web > > > > page), none of the GUI stuff applies. The LC code is pretty much > > > > a replacement for PHP code, so the GUI piece would be the same > > > > (whatever HTML/JS frameworks you choose). > > > > > > So actually the Dictionary needs some updates of stuff that is not an > > > error but also doing nothing when used on server. > > > > GUI elements can be useful in LC Server for creating custom screen > > shots, which can be exported and that file data returned to the client > > for display in a browser or an LC app. > > > > That's the good news. > > > > That bad news is that 100% of all LC Server use is slower than it > > needs to be because it's initializing fonts for the 0.001% of CGIs > > using custom graphics export with specified fonts. > > > > I've discussed the situation with several people at LC Ltd, and while > > they're not in a position to put a solution in place right now they > > are quite open to accepting a pull request for it, which should be a > > relatively simple matter for anyone with C++ skills. > > > > I've outlined the problem and the proposed solution in detail here: > > > > http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-livecode/2019-March/253723.html > > > > > > ___ > use-livecode mailing list > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription > preferences: > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
Thanks, that was an interesting read. Unfortunately i have zero C++ skills Regards, Jerry Op 13-11-2019 om 22:16 schreef Richard Gaskin via use-livecode: JJS wrote: > Op 12-11-2019 om 19:34 schreef Brian Milby via use-livecode: >> Unless you are doing a HTML5 app (entire stack resides in a web >> page), none of the GUI stuff applies. The LC code is pretty much >> a replacement for PHP code, so the GUI piece would be the same >> (whatever HTML/JS frameworks you choose). > > So actually the Dictionary needs some updates of stuff that is not an > error but also doing nothing when used on server. GUI elements can be useful in LC Server for creating custom screen shots, which can be exported and that file data returned to the client for display in a browser or an LC app. That's the good news. That bad news is that 100% of all LC Server use is slower than it needs to be because it's initializing fonts for the 0.001% of CGIs using custom graphics export with specified fonts. I've discussed the situation with several people at LC Ltd, and while they're not in a position to put a solution in place right now they are quite open to accepting a pull request for it, which should be a relatively simple matter for anyone with C++ skills. I've outlined the problem and the proposed solution in detail here: http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-livecode/2019-March/253723.html ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
JJS wrote: > Op 12-11-2019 om 19:34 schreef Brian Milby via use-livecode: >> Unless you are doing a HTML5 app (entire stack resides in a web >> page), none of the GUI stuff applies. The LC code is pretty much >> a replacement for PHP code, so the GUI piece would be the same >> (whatever HTML/JS frameworks you choose). > > So actually the Dictionary needs some updates of stuff that is not an > error but also doing nothing when used on server. GUI elements can be useful in LC Server for creating custom screen shots, which can be exported and that file data returned to the client for display in a browser or an LC app. That's the good news. That bad news is that 100% of all LC Server use is slower than it needs to be because it's initializing fonts for the 0.001% of CGIs using custom graphics export with specified fonts. I've discussed the situation with several people at LC Ltd, and while they're not in a position to put a solution in place right now they are quite open to accepting a pull request for it, which should be a relatively simple matter for anyone with C++ skills. I've outlined the problem and the proposed solution in detail here: http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-livecode/2019-March/253723.html -- Richard Gaskin Fourth World Systems Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
Hi Erik, yes i've been busy with that, read most pages,but i can't get my head around it. So i guess it's not quite for me, although it has very much potential. Thanks a lot. Jerry Op 12-11-2019 om 21:31 schreef Erik Beugelaar via use-livecode: Hello Jerry, Maybe you've already heard of revIgniter. revIgniter is a framework to build webapps with LiveCode: https://github.com/revig/revigniter/ The official site is https://revigniter.com/ but is temporarily closed for maintenance purposes. The documentation is excellent. Cheers, Erik On 12/11/2019, 21:06, "use-livecode on behalf of JJS via use-livecode" wrote: Thank you Brian. So actually the Dictionary needs some updates of stuff that is not an error but also doing nothing when used on server. Thanks, Jerry Op 12-11-2019 om 19:34 schreef Brian Milby via use-livecode: > Unless you are doing a HTML5 app (entire stack resides in a web page), none of the GUI stuff applies. The LC code is pretty much a replacement for PHP code, so the GUI piece would be the same (whatever HTML/JS frameworks you choose). > > Thanks, > Brian > On Nov 12, 2019, 1:24 PM -0500, JJS via use-livecode , wrote: >> Hello, >> >> >> i'm really curious how some things from the dictionary should work or >> behave on server. (when filtered on server) >> >> And i can find almost no examples, the forum section is small, the list >> is searchable but not easy, lessons almost nothing and mostly about >> installing the server, dictionary only IDE examples. >> >> As it is serverside, how should for example a field work or a widget. >> >> How should on mouseUp work? i can type on mouseUp and some things in it >> like put"hi" and then end mouseUp, no error, but nothing >> happening either. >> >> Or in better words maybe, how to use a HTML button like an LC button. >> >> How to send data without opening another lc script, i just want to stay >> for example on the same page, but i need the result back without the >> whole page being reloaded. >> >> ( i know how to send data as i can choose categories and products and so >> on each on their own page) >> >> If i need jQuery or Javascript then i can just as good go on with the >> PHP versions i have. >> >> I've rewritten some html/php scripts to html/lc and now i've come to the >> same point, there where the products should go in the basket. >> >> When one uses html form action="check.lc" for instance then when pushing >> the html button it tries to open that script as a page. >> >> So in short what i'm asking is a lot of examples and some answers to the >> above. >> >> >> Thanks for any help. >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> Jerry >> >> >> ___ >> use-livecode mailing list >> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode > ___ > use-livecode mailing list > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
Hello Jerry, Maybe you've already heard of revIgniter. revIgniter is a framework to build webapps with LiveCode: https://github.com/revig/revigniter/ The official site is https://revigniter.com/ but is temporarily closed for maintenance purposes. The documentation is excellent. Cheers, Erik On 12/11/2019, 21:06, "use-livecode on behalf of JJS via use-livecode" wrote: Thank you Brian. So actually the Dictionary needs some updates of stuff that is not an error but also doing nothing when used on server. Thanks, Jerry Op 12-11-2019 om 19:34 schreef Brian Milby via use-livecode: > Unless you are doing a HTML5 app (entire stack resides in a web page), none of the GUI stuff applies. The LC code is pretty much a replacement for PHP code, so the GUI piece would be the same (whatever HTML/JS frameworks you choose). > > Thanks, > Brian > On Nov 12, 2019, 1:24 PM -0500, JJS via use-livecode , wrote: >> Hello, >> >> >> i'm really curious how some things from the dictionary should work or >> behave on server. (when filtered on server) >> >> And i can find almost no examples, the forum section is small, the list >> is searchable but not easy, lessons almost nothing and mostly about >> installing the server, dictionary only IDE examples. >> >> As it is serverside, how should for example a field work or a widget. >> >> How should on mouseUp work? i can type on mouseUp and some things in it >> like put"hi" and then end mouseUp, no error, but nothing >> happening either. >> >> Or in better words maybe, how to use a HTML button like an LC button. >> >> How to send data without opening another lc script, i just want to stay >> for example on the same page, but i need the result back without the >> whole page being reloaded. >> >> ( i know how to send data as i can choose categories and products and so >> on each on their own page) >> >> If i need jQuery or Javascript then i can just as good go on with the >> PHP versions i have. >> >> I've rewritten some html/php scripts to html/lc and now i've come to the >> same point, there where the products should go in the basket. >> >> When one uses html form action="check.lc" for instance then when pushing >> the html button it tries to open that script as a page. >> >> So in short what i'm asking is a lot of examples and some answers to the >> above. >> >> >> Thanks for any help. >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> Jerry >> >> >> ___ >> use-livecode mailing list >> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com >> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode > ___ > use-livecode mailing list > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
Thank you Brian. So actually the Dictionary needs some updates of stuff that is not an error but also doing nothing when used on server. Thanks, Jerry Op 12-11-2019 om 19:34 schreef Brian Milby via use-livecode: Unless you are doing a HTML5 app (entire stack resides in a web page), none of the GUI stuff applies. The LC code is pretty much a replacement for PHP code, so the GUI piece would be the same (whatever HTML/JS frameworks you choose). Thanks, Brian On Nov 12, 2019, 1:24 PM -0500, JJS via use-livecode , wrote: Hello, i'm really curious how some things from the dictionary should work or behave on server. (when filtered on server) And i can find almost no examples, the forum section is small, the list is searchable but not easy, lessons almost nothing and mostly about installing the server, dictionary only IDE examples. As it is serverside, how should for example a field work or a widget. How should on mouseUp work? i can type on mouseUp and some things in it like put"hi" and then end mouseUp, no error, but nothing happening either. Or in better words maybe, how to use a HTML button like an LC button. How to send data without opening another lc script, i just want to stay for example on the same page, but i need the result back without the whole page being reloaded. ( i know how to send data as i can choose categories and products and so on each on their own page) If i need jQuery or Javascript then i can just as good go on with the PHP versions i have. I've rewritten some html/php scripts to html/lc and now i've come to the same point, there where the products should go in the basket. When one uses html form action="check.lc" for instance then when pushing the html button it tries to open that script as a page. So in short what i'm asking is a lot of examples and some answers to the above. Thanks for any help. Cheers, Jerry ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Re: Commands on server and lack of examples
Unless you are doing a HTML5 app (entire stack resides in a web page), none of the GUI stuff applies. The LC code is pretty much a replacement for PHP code, so the GUI piece would be the same (whatever HTML/JS frameworks you choose). Thanks, Brian On Nov 12, 2019, 1:24 PM -0500, JJS via use-livecode , wrote: > Hello, > > > i'm really curious how some things from the dictionary should work or > behave on server. (when filtered on server) > > And i can find almost no examples, the forum section is small, the list > is searchable but not easy, lessons almost nothing and mostly about > installing the server, dictionary only IDE examples. > > As it is serverside, how should for example a field work or a widget. > > How should on mouseUp work? i can type on mouseUp and some things in it > like put"hi" and then end mouseUp, no error, but nothing > happening either. > > Or in better words maybe, how to use a HTML button like an LC button. > > How to send data without opening another lc script, i just want to stay > for example on the same page, but i need the result back without the > whole page being reloaded. > > ( i know how to send data as i can choose categories and products and so > on each on their own page) > > If i need jQuery or Javascript then i can just as good go on with the > PHP versions i have. > > I've rewritten some html/php scripts to html/lc and now i've come to the > same point, there where the products should go in the basket. > > When one uses html form action="check.lc" for instance then when pushing > the html button it tries to open that script as a page. > > So in short what i'm asking is a lot of examples and some answers to the > above. > > > Thanks for any help. > > > Cheers, > > Jerry > > > ___ > use-livecode mailing list > use-livecode@lists.runrev.com > Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription > preferences: > http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
Commands on server and lack of examples
Hello, i'm really curious how some things from the dictionary should work or behave on server. (when filtered on server) And i can find almost no examples, the forum section is small, the list is searchable but not easy, lessons almost nothing and mostly about installing the server, dictionary only IDE examples. As it is serverside, how should for example a field work or a widget. How should on mouseUp work? i can type on mouseUp and some things in it like put"hi" and then end mouseUp, no error, but nothing happening either. Or in better words maybe, how to use a HTML button like an LC button. How to send data without opening another lc script, i just want to stay for example on the same page, but i need the result back without the whole page being reloaded. ( i know how to send data as i can choose categories and products and so on each on their own page) If i need jQuery or Javascript then i can just as good go on with the PHP versions i have. I've rewritten some html/php scripts to html/lc and now i've come to the same point, there where the products should go in the basket. When one uses html form action="check.lc" for instance then when pushing the html button it tries to open that script as a page. So in short what i'm asking is a lot of examples and some answers to the above. Thanks for any help. Cheers, Jerry ___ use-livecode mailing list use-livecode@lists.runrev.com Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription preferences: http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
