Re: All essay text turned to hashtags--commentary
On Sun, 05 Jan 2014 17:07:27 +0100 Josef Latt josef.l...@gmx.net wrote: Am 05.01.2014 15:06, schrieb Hagar Delest: The power shortage is clearly a root cause. Perhaps we need an old disk to test what happens when we pull the plug during a save operation. Whats about the autorecovery function of AOO. It can work, but for critical work relying on it can be catastrophic in the instances that it fails. With an unimportant file, try pulling your power cord a few times; it is not 10% reliable.. -- Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie - To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: users-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: All essay text turned to hashtags--commentary
Despite my fear of being considered too dumb to use OO, here's my experience: when a document I was working on (just trying to insert a line by hitting return between two lines) suddenly became all hashtag gibberish - as then did all my stored OO files - I reinstalled OO. And all was well. On Jan 5, 2014, at 11:15 AM, Rob Weir wrote: On Sun, Jan 5, 2014 at 7:23 AM, Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie wrote: On Sun, 05 Jan 2014 12:47:59 +0100 Andrea Pescetti pesce...@apache.org wrote: Hagar Delest wrote: losing the file saved last time is just unacceptable, it's a major data loss (P1 in the bug tracker). This problem should be investigated as seriously as possible. No bashing needed, just look at the facts. The problem here is all with reproducing the bug. OpenOffice has so many users, on so many systems, that even a problem that occurs, say, once in ten millions save operations will get reported. It's a fact that there exist some users who report losing a document. But it's not even clear if the culprit in those cases is OpenOffice, or the operating system, or a RAM problem, or a disk failure... Like you, I've been a regular OpenOffice user for many years and I never had a similar problem. A random note if this can help: to study this problem, once I tried to deliberately fill the hard disk until I had a few MBytes free. Then I opened a heavy presentation file, with many images, and edited it normally, adding and removing content. An automatic backup failed (due to the full disk) and I think an error message was displayed (I/O error). I then tried a save operation, which failed with the same error. But then I was stuck: the file I was editing was corrupted (the images did not display) and the last saved version on disk was corrupted too (of course this was a test so I had made a backup before testing). Maybe this deserves a better investigation. It could be that some or all of these bug reports are due to a full disk (I do know some people who work with 100 MBytes free on disk, so it's not even a 1 in millions scenario). The good thing is that this scenario can be reproduced. Regards, Andrea. I think there are two problems here, which both Hagar and I are aware of from the Forum. One is the Hashtag problem, which I agree is not readily reproducible and in many cases may be caused by over hasty close down of OO or operating system, the other associated problem is the erasure of the saved copy which seems to occur often alongside the hashtag problem; no matter what causes the hashtag problem, I'm sure we all agree that a saved copy of the file should not be spontaneously erased. The question should be asked When does OpenOffice erase the previous copy of the file?. Surely this should only be after the Save process reaches a conclusion. I can recollect from my CP/M days that one had to adopt a certain sequence in saving a file for best security. One saved the file to File.new (say), then renamed File.org to File.bak then renamed File.new to File.org. Is this or a similar protocol being followed in OO? Perhaps some temporary relief can be obtained by changing the options in OpenOffice to _always_ generate a backup. That would introduce other failure modes: 1) User would require disk space for two complete copies of the document. So in the marginal case a user might load a document, change just a character and then be unable to save. 2) Some file systems handle modify and create permissions separately. So you could have the ability to modify a document, but not create a new (temporary) one. There are certainly cases where such an approach could help. But it is tricky when dealing with the exceptions. The other thing to watch for is that some users cannot find their files after saving, even if there is no problem with the saving. They forget the same, what folder they used, etc. -Rob If the user turns such an option off, then on his own head be the responsibility for file loss! I should say that I have not experienced the hashtag problem in 6 years of heavy use of OO Writer on Windows 2000/XP or linux systems. -- Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie - To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: users-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: users-h...@openoffice.apache.org ___ Unlimited Disk, Data Transfer, PHP/MySQL Domain Hosting http://www.doteasy.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail:
Re: All essay text turned to hashtags--commentary
On Sun, 5 Jan 2014 16:12:20 + Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie wrote: On Sun, 05 Jan 2014 17:07:27 +0100 Josef Latt josef.l...@gmx.net wrote: Am 05.01.2014 15:06, schrieb Hagar Delest: The power shortage is clearly a root cause. Perhaps we need an old disk to test what happens when we pull the plug during a save operation. Whats about the autorecovery function of AOO. It can work, but for critical work relying on it can be catastrophic in the instances that it fails. With an unimportant file, try pulling your power cord a few times; it is not 10% reliable.. Sorry! 10% should read 100% -- Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie - To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: users-h...@openoffice.apache.org -- Rory O'Farrell ofarr...@iol.ie - To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: users-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: All essay text turned to hashtags--commentary
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Anthony J. Rudgers wrote: Greetings All! The present hashtag problem is is symptomatic of the entire OO software suite. An ordinary user of OO, doing ordinary things w/ a word processor or other office-suite software, suddenly gets something that is really screwy, doesn't know what to do to fix it. Much of their production gets lost, or else, they spend a lot of time attempting to get their WP document or spreadsheet the way they want it by trying again again to get around built-in or default features (or bugs!) of OO that they don't understand or know how to modify ( OO documentation, as I have found, is meager inadequate). Unless you're a long-time dedicated user, the OO suite never seems to do quite what you'd like it to do you usually can't figure out how to fix things ON YOUR OWN COMPUTER W/ YOUR EXISTING SOFTWARE. One has to have the ability to fix things quickly on their own w/o going to the experts every time a problem w/ OO arises! For the casual user, the OO product appears flawed. People who use any software product want to spend their time creativity on what they are developing, rather than spending time effort on issues associated w/ the tool they are using to develop it. OO office software needs much effort to make it more efficient, largely error-free, much more user friendly. Beat wishes, Anthony J. Rudgers Orlando, FL U.S.A. Mr. Rudgers; Though your criticism bears much truth I feel it over emphasizes certain aspects. Many of the support questions that are seen here and on the forums are in the ways that AOO differs from other software of the same type. Most of my 20+ years in industry were spent in doing direct support and I know from experience that many ordinary users frequntly do not even bother to consult the help resources that are available or just complain that it does not work like xyz did. This particular problem is one that is very difficult to track down because it happens so infrequently that it is difficult for QA and developers to replicate. You say that documentation is meager and inadequate. I would direct you to https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/OOo3_User_Guides/OOo3.3_User_Guide_Chapters. Though these are for Version 3.3 much of the information they contain is relevant to later versions, including version 4.0.1. Also available is a getting started guide for version 3.4 from http://www.odfauthors.org/apache-openoffice/english/user-guides/getting-started-3.4/published. There is an ongoing documentation effort to create up to date documentation for Version 4 and beyond on the wiki. We are always looking for volunteers to help with this effort and could use your knowledge and skills in this effort. More information can be found at our orientation page at http://openoffice.apache.org/orientation/intro-doc.html. All software is imperfect and has bugs. The only way any software product to improve is open and honest dialog between all parties. This is specially true for Open Source Software. Honest discussion on venues such as this and clear reports of possible bugs in the projects Bugzilla tracking system at https://issues.apache.org/ooo/ are ways that all users can help make this a better product. The QA volunteers have provided excellent hints for creating good bug reports in Bugzilla at https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/QA/HowToFileIssue. Regards Keith N. McKenna -Original Message- From: Gary Frost Sent: Saturday, January 04, 2014 8:26 PM To: users@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: All essay text turned to hashtags Maybe, I'm an anomaly here, but I've never had any of these issues at all. Generally, I work on a MacBook Air with the current up to date OS. I do also create PDFs so that I can work on documents on my iPhone in Pages. Using the iPhone is usefully for last minute work for me. I've thought about good version options for other iOS devices such as the iPad Air which I intend to purchase. I work scrips and other technical documents so it is essential for me to use best practices to prevent loss of work. Sent from my iPhone On Jan 4, 2014, at 5:15 PM, Alan Cliffe drspecta...@sbcglobal.net wrote: I don't know if it can be retrieved; for whatever it's worth, I've had that happen too once or twice so now I always create a PDF copy of everything I do in OO. From: natalie guttridge natalieguttri...@hotmail.co.uk To: users@openoffice.apache.org users@openoffice.apache.org Sent: Saturday, January 4, 2014 8:04 AM Subject: All essay text turned to hashtags Please help My daughter has written a 2000 word essay. She saved it and then when she opened it again the whole text has turned into hashtags...can anything be done? Regards Natalie Sent from my iPad - To unsubscribe, e-mail:
Re: All essay text turned to hashtags--commentary
On Sat, 4 Jan 2014 22:59:31 -0500 Anthony J. Rudgers anthonyrudg...@att.net wrote: Greetings All! The present hashtag problem is is symptomatic of the entire OO software suite. An ordinary user of OO, doing ordinary things w/ a word processor or other office-suite software, suddenly gets something that is really screwy, doesn't know what to do to fix it. Much of their production gets lost, or else, they spend a lot of time attempting to get their WP document or spreadsheet the way they want it by trying again again to get around built-in or default features (or bugs!) of OO that they don't understand or know how to modify ( OO documentation, as I have found, is meager inadequate). Unless you're a long-time dedicated user, the OO suite never seems to do quite what you'd like it to do you usually can't figure out how to fix things ON YOUR OWN COMPUTER W/ YOUR EXISTING SOFTWARE. One has to have the ability to fix things quickly on their own w/o going to the experts every time a problem w/ OO arises! For the casual user, the OO product appears flawed. People who use any software product want to spend their time creativity on what they are developing, rather than spending time effort on issues associated w/ the tool they are using to develop it. OO office software needs much effort to make it more efficient, largely error-free, much more user friendly. Beat wishes, Anthony J. Rudgers Orlando, FL U.S.A. With people like you, your problem with 'software' is you're not smart enough to use it correctly. In the minimum of 10 years I've been using OpenOffice, I've yet to have any of the problems you or the OP have had. Seems an awful lot of other people are the same way. It seems *YOU* are your own worst problem, especially when you come on mailing lists with a bunch of moronic FUD and absolutely nothing to back it up. I'll continue to use AOO, with no problems, on my system and just keep laughing at dimbulbs like you who have no decent reason to own a computer much less the ability to turn one on without breaking it. Now please, go take along walk on a short pier in Antarctic waters. -- http://www.lawcollective.org/ Learn your rights through cartoons! http://www.roadblock.org/rights/ Know your rights about and at roadblocks! http://fija.org/ Learn about Jury Nullification! Take back your rights from the over-reaching: police, justice system and government! Why does the government want to ban semi-auto weapons? Because you won’t get in the box car willingly. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: users-h...@openoffice.apache.org
Re: All essay text turned to hashtags--commentary
I don't get it either. I've never had any of these problems during years of use. Sent from my iPhone On Jan 4, 2014, at 10:07 PM, TN Patriot irgu...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, 4 Jan 2014 22:59:31 -0500 Anthony J. Rudgers anthonyrudg...@att.net wrote: Greetings All! The present hashtag problem is is symptomatic of the entire OO software suite. An ordinary user of OO, doing ordinary things w/ a word processor or other office-suite software, suddenly gets something that is really screwy, doesn't know what to do to fix it. Much of their production gets lost, or else, they spend a lot of time attempting to get their WP document or spreadsheet the way they want it by trying again again to get around built-in or default features (or bugs!) of OO that they don't understand or know how to modify ( OO documentation, as I have found, is meager inadequate). Unless you're a long-time dedicated user, the OO suite never seems to do quite what you'd like it to do you usually can't figure out how to fix things ON YOUR OWN COMPUTER W/ YOUR EXISTING SOFTWARE. One has to have the ability to fix things quickly on their own w/o going to the experts every time a problem w/ OO arises! For the casual user, the OO product appears flawed. People who use any software product want to spend their time creativity on what they are developing, rather than spending time effort on issues associated w/ the tool they are using to develop it. OO office software needs much effort to make it more efficient, largely error-free, much more user friendly. Beat wishes, Anthony J. Rudgers Orlando, FL U.S.A. With people like you, your problem with 'software' is you're not smart enough to use it correctly. In the minimum of 10 years I've been using OpenOffice, I've yet to have any of the problems you or the OP have had. Seems an awful lot of other people are the same way. It seems *YOU* are your own worst problem, especially when you come on mailing lists with a bunch of moronic FUD and absolutely nothing to back it up. I'll continue to use AOO, with no problems, on my system and just keep laughing at dimbulbs like you who have no decent reason to own a computer much less the ability to turn one on without breaking it. Now please, go take along walk on a short pier in Antarctic waters. -- http://www.lawcollective.org/ Learn your rights through cartoons! http://www.roadblock.org/rights/ Know your rights about and at roadblocks! http://fija.org/ Learn about Jury Nullification! Take back your rights from the over-reaching: police, justice system and government! Why does the government want to ban semi-auto weapons? Because you won’t get in the box car willingly. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: users-h...@openoffice.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: users-h...@openoffice.apache.org
