Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
> Bob Proulx wrote:
> >Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
> > > What do other people do? Or are we just going to end up with an
> > > Internet in about 10 years where every single email box is either
> > > on Microsoft 365 or Gmail and the NSA has a wonderful interface to
> > > use to
On 8/5/2014 4:01 PM, Bob Proulx wrote:
Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
What do other people do? Or are we just going to end up with an Internet in
about 10 years where every single email box is either on Microsoft 365 or
Gmail and the NSA has a wonderful interface to use to hunt through whatever
they
Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
> What do other people do? Or are we just going to end up with an Internet in
> about 10 years where every single email box is either on Microsoft 365 or
> Gmail and the NSA has a wonderful interface to use to hunt through whatever
> they want without bothering with a warra
On 31/07/2014 11:36, Dave Warren wrote:
There is a difference: Gmail is a very major source of wanted,
legitimate mail. Most "may 'n pa run outback country dialup ISPs" are
not.
Most mail to most clients are a "very major source of wanted mail"
Again, playing favourites is plain wrong, and i
On 2014-07-31 07:39, David F. Skoll wrote:
Gmail's spam filtering is at least as good as stock SpamAssassin, and
honestly I think it's better. You can achieve equal quality with SpamAssassin
if you're willing to work at it. But it does take a lot of work.
This is the real difference with Gmai
On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 18:05:11 -0700
Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
> > Eventually something will supplany MSFT and yes, even
> > Google will fade eventually.
> People used to say that about General Motors & Ford Motor Company 100
> years ago.
Except for unconscionable intervention by the US and Canadi
On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 1:06 AM, Noel Butler wrote:
> There is no such thing as 'too big' when it comes to handling the shit storm
> of spam that gets spewed out of some organisations, and I'll treat Gmail and
> the likes the same as a ma 'n pa run outback country dialup ISP, there is
At dnswl.
On 2014-07-30 16:06, Noel Butler wrote:
Certainly have done it on employers network before (a public ISP), and
would have no problem doing it again if the need arose.
There is no such thing as 'too big' when it comes to handling the shit
storm of spam that gets spewed out of some organisations,
On Thu, 2014-07-31 at 09:06 +1000, Noel Butler wrote:
> Certainly have done it on employers network before (a public ISP), and
> would have no problem doing it again if the need arose.
> There is no such thing as 'too big' when it comes to handling the shit
> storm of spam that gets spewed out of
On Wed, 2014-07-30 at 09:12 -0400, David F. Skoll wrote:
> On Wed, 30 Jul 2014 09:34:30 +1000
> Noel Butler wrote:
>
> > This is the exact attitude as to why they wont get off their arses,
> > because people think they are too big to block. be damned if I care,
> > I have blocked yahoo and gmai
On 2014-07-30 06:12, David F. Skoll wrote:
On Wed, 30 Jul 2014 09:34:30 +1000
Noel Butler wrote:
This is the exact attitude as to why they wont get off their arses,
because people think they are too big to block. be damned if I care,
I have blocked yahoo and gmail before, and I dare say I'll h
On Wed, 30 Jul 2014 09:34:30 +1000
Noel Butler wrote:
> This is the exact attitude as to why they wont get off their arses,
> because people think they are too big to block. be damned if I care,
> I have blocked yahoo and gmail before, and I dare say I'll have to
> again sometime.
You don't hav
On July 29, 2014 9:50:22 PM Asai wrote:
Make your grass greener than the neighbor's.
provide cold beers to anyone :)
On 7/29/2014 3:20 PM, David F. Skoll wrote:
On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 14:36:51 -0700
Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
There are those who would define disgustingly rich as a requirement
for happiness...
Yes, and most of them are unhappy. But I fear we drift OT again...
That's the plan that these compa
On 30/07/2014 04:29, David F. Skoll wrote:
originates from servers that RBLs cannot block for political or
practical resons. Think Gmail, Hotmail and Yahoo servers, for
This is the exact attitude as to why they wont get off their arses,
because people think they are too big to block. be damn
On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 14:36:51 -0700
Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
> There are those who would define disgustingly rich as a requirement
> for happiness...
Yes, and most of them are unhappy. But I fear we drift OT again...
> That's the plan that these companies like Microsoft and Google have
> designe
On 7/29/2014 2:23 PM, Dave Warren wrote:
On 2014-07-29 13:29, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
On 7/29/2014 12:44 PM, David F. Skoll wrote:
On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 12:37:00 -0700
Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
Hotmail/MSN/Live/Microsoft/365/whatever-the-name-o-the-week-they-call-themselves
all have SIGNIFIC
On 7/29/2014 1:39 PM, David F. Skoll wrote:
On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 13:29:25 -0700
Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
[...]
Yet you don't use your gmail address to post here - so how is this a
fair apples to apples comparison. It isn't. All you saying is - an
email address at gmail that I hardly use, do
On 2014-07-29 13:29, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
On 7/29/2014 12:44 PM, David F. Skoll wrote:
On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 12:37:00 -0700
Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
Hotmail/MSN/Live/Microsoft/365/whatever-the-name-o-the-week-they-call-themselves
all have SIGNIFICANTLY BETTER spam filtering than
Spamassas
On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 13:29:25 -0700
Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
[...]
> Yet you don't use your gmail address to post here - so how is this a
> fair apples to apples comparison. It isn't. All you saying is - an
> email address at gmail that I hardly use, doesn't get a lot of spam -
> and an email
On 7/29/2014 12:44 PM, David F. Skoll wrote:
On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 12:37:00 -0700
Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
Hotmail/MSN/Live/Microsoft/365/whatever-the-name-o-the-week-they-call-themselves
all have SIGNIFICANTLY BETTER spam filtering than
Spamassassin+free/public RBLs+some judicious blacklists.
On 07/29/2014 09:37 PM, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
The commercial RBL's let spam through also. As to whether they let as
much spam through as, say, spamcops RBL, I'll let others argue that
point. But that is NOT the issue I raised in the beginning. The issue
is this automatic assumption that comp
The commercial RBL's let spam through also. As to whether they let as
much spam through as, say, spamcops RBL, I'll let others argue that
point. But that is NOT the issue I raised in the beginning. The issue
is this automatic assumption that companies like Gmail and
Hotmail/MSN/Live/Microsoft/
Make your grass greener than the neighbor's.
--Asai
On 7/29/14 12:37 PM, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
What do you do?
On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 12:37:00 -0700
Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
> Hotmail/MSN/Live/Microsoft/365/whatever-the-name-o-the-week-they-call-themselves
> all have SIGNIFICANTLY BETTER spam filtering than
> Spamassassin+free/public RBLs+some judicious blacklists.
My experience is only with Gmail. And I ha
On Jul 29, 2014, at 12:29 PM, David F. Skoll wrote:
> On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 14:21:56 -0400
> Dave Pooser wrote:
>
> RBLs are a good first line of defense, but unfortunately a lot of spam
> originates from servers that RBLs cannot block for political or
> practical resons. Think Gmail, Hotmail a
The commercial RBL's let spam through also. As to whether they let as
much spam through as, say, spamcops RBL, I'll let others argue that
point. But that is NOT the issue I raised in the beginning. The issue
is this automatic assumption that companies like Gmail and
Hotmail/MSN/Live/Microso
We use the invaluement lists managed by Rob McEwen and have been very
happy with them-- been using them for 3-4 years. A lot of blocking that
doesn't overlap with Spamhaus, very few false positives, and those
that do
occur are addressed quickly with a lot of transparency. Well worth the
cash,
On 2014-07-29 12:20, Axb wrote:
On 07/29/2014 08:21 PM, Dave Pooser wrote:
On 7/29/14, 2:13 PM, "Asai" wrote:
My question regarding all of this interesting topic is, isn't there
some
kind of RBL or something which can be subscribed to for a nominal fee
per year that can aid the small IT shop
On 07/29/2014 08:21 PM, Dave Pooser wrote:
On 7/29/14, 2:13 PM, "Asai" wrote:
My question regarding all of this interesting topic is, isn't there some
kind of RBL or something which can be subscribed to for a nominal fee
per year that can aid the small IT shop in maintaining spam filters?
We
>RBLs are a good first line of defense, but unfortunately a lot of spam
>originates from servers that RBLs cannot block for political or
>practical resons. Think Gmail, Hotmail and Yahoo servers, for
>example. You need something extra to have acceptable catch rates, and
>the "something extra" inv
On July 29, 2014 8:13:49 PM Asai wrote:
My question regarding all of this interesting topic is, isn't there some
kind of RBL or something which can be subscribed to for a nominal fee
per year that can aid the small IT shop in maintaining spam filters?
the best one is one that is not public kn
On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 14:21:56 -0400
Dave Pooser wrote:
> We use the invaluement lists managed by Rob McEwen and have been very
> happy with them-- been using them for 3-4 years. A lot of blocking
> that doesn't overlap with Spamhaus, very few false positives, and
> those that do occur are addresse
On 7/29/14, 2:13 PM, "Asai" wrote:
>My question regarding all of this interesting topic is, isn't there some
>kind of RBL or something which can be subscribed to for a nominal fee
>per year that can aid the small IT shop in maintaining spam filters?
We use the invaluement lists managed by Rob Mc
On Jul 29, 2014, at 11:29 AM, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
>
> On 7/29/2014 10:11 AM, Bowie Bailey wrote:
>
> > 2) If the professional was willing to be paid to re-paint a room
>> that clearly didn't need it, they need to get rid of him and find
>> someone who won't rip them off.
>>
>
> I think y
My question regarding all of this interesting topic is, isn't there some
kind of RBL or something which can be subscribed to for a nominal fee
per year that can aid the small IT shop in maintaining spam filters?
--Asai
On 7/28/14 9:10 AM, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
Hi All,
Just lost another o
]
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2014 9:50 AM
To: users@spamassassin.apache.org
Subject: Drifting OT [was Re: Ready to throw in the towel on email providing...]
On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 13:11:00 -0400
Bowie Bailey wrote:
[Church stuff]
I think this is getting a bit off-topic...
Regards,
David.
On Tue, 29 Jul 2014 13:11:00 -0400
Bowie Bailey wrote:
[Church stuff]
I think this is getting a bit off-topic...
Regards,
David.
On 7/29/2014 10:11 AM, Bowie Bailey wrote:
On 7/29/2014 12:33 PM, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
I learned after a year that if your goal is to have people who don't
understand or appreciate what you do for them, and shit all over what
you do for them, volunteer for a church.
Depends on the church.
On 7/29/2014 12:33 PM, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
I learned after a year that if your goal is to have people who don't
understand or appreciate what you do for them, and shit all over what
you do for them, volunteer for a church.
Depends on the church. I do volunteer work for my church on a regul
On 7/29/2014 9:33 AM, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
On 7/28/2014 4:17 PM, Jay Plesset wrote:
My church decided to go with O-365, without even evaluating any
alternatives. We have an unemployed IT person that talked the staff into
this, even though I've offered to implement a "real" e-mail solution
On 7/28/2014 4:17 PM, Jay Plesset wrote:
My church decided to go with O-365, without even evaluating any
alternatives. We have an unemployed IT person that talked the staff into
this, even though I've offered to implement a "real" e-mail solution
multiple times, and even provide hardware to run
On 07/29/2014 09:11 AM, Matus UHLAR - fantomas wrote:
On 28.07.14 10:29, Nate Metheny wrote:
Sadly, until SMTP is rewritten and we're not using protocols on the
Internet that have been based on very very old code and then just
patched and updated ad infinitum, there isn't a "sure fire" solution.
On 28.07.14 10:29, Nate Metheny wrote:
Sadly, until SMTP is rewritten and we're not using protocols on the
Internet that have been based on very very old code and then just
patched and updated ad infinitum, there isn't a "sure fire" solution.
More patches, more fixes, more filters, more overhea
On Mon, 28 Jul 2014, Ian Zimmerman wrote:
Good summary, but I think you forgot (5):
They have prettier icons.
I am not 100% kidding, either.
Oh, god yes.
Sadly my sigmonster isn't on the ball, so I had to give it a poke...
(h/t to Steve, if he's still around)
--
John Hardin KA7OHZ
My church decided to go with O-365, without even evaluating any
alternatives. We have an unemployed IT person that talked the staff into
this, even though I've offered to implement a "real" e-mail solution
multiple times, and even provide hardware to run it on.
"free" was the biggest draw, the
On Mon, 28 Jul 2014 12:57:38 -0400
"David F. Skoll" wrote:
David> 1) Gmail is actually pretty good at filtering spam. I can't
David> speak for MSFT since I don't use it.
David> 2) Especially in North America, companies are short-sighted and
David> go for quick fixes and things that look cheap u
On 2014-07-28 10:56, Mauricio Tavares wrote:
I think there is also the tolerance level people have depending
on who they are dealing with. If they are dealing with a smaller/local
company, they expect 24/7 support and solutions for problems before
said problems are even conceived.
While
On 2014-07-28 12:40, Daniel Reynolds wrote:
What you could do, is send a regular (weekly or monthly) spam report
that tells your customers how many emails that were blocked vs the
number of ham emails and other such statistics.
We quarantine mail that is between our target threshold and 10 poi
Hi,
>>>Just lost another one, dammit. Small company with about 6 mailboxes
who
>>> some consultant gave them a song and dance about how Gmail's such a
>>> better mail service since "they don't get any spam"
>>
>> The trend towards email service providers for companies to host their
>> mailbox
What you could do, is send a regular (weekly or monthly) spam report that
tells your customers how many emails that were blocked vs the number of ham
emails and other such statistics.
That might get some to stay.
On Jul 28, 2014 3:31 PM, "Kris Deugau" wrote:
> Chris Santerre wrote:
> > I've just
On Mon, 28 Jul 2014 15:31:17 -0400
Kris Deugau wrote:
> > I'm so tired of users complaining they
> > get "Tons of spam" which turns out to be 4. Yeah... 4.
[...]
> When I see this kind of complaint, I pull out two stats from the
> filter logs:
[...]
I sometimes do a more dramatic demonstration:
Chris Santerre wrote:
> I've just about stopped trying to fight them. I write local rules maybe
> once every 2 weeks. I'm so tired of users complaining they get "Tons of
> spam" which turns out to be 4. Yeah... 4. I stop so much and users are
> never satisfied. It was a side project that turned int
On 7/28/2014 10:56 AM, Mauricio Tavares wrote:
On Mon, Jul 28, 2014 at 1:44 PM, John Hardin wrote:
On Mon, 28 Jul 2014, David F. Skoll wrote:
Unfortunately, people usually only care about crappy support and
service after it's too late. You might win back some ex-Google
customers, but it's
On 7/28/2014 10:42 AM, Matthias Leisi wrote:
On Mon, Jul 28, 2014 at 6:10 PM, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
Just lost another one, dammit. Small company with about 6 mailboxes who
some consultant gave them a song and dance about how Gmail's such a
better mail service since "they don't get any
On Mon, Jul 28, 2014 at 1:44 PM, John Hardin wrote:
> On Mon, 28 Jul 2014, David F. Skoll wrote:
>
>> Unfortunately, people usually only care about crappy support and
>> service after it's too late. You might win back some ex-Google
>> customers, but it's really hard to stem the tide beforehand.
On Mon, 28 Jul 2014, David F. Skoll wrote:
Unfortunately, people usually only care about crappy support and
service after it's too late. You might win back some ex-Google
customers, but it's really hard to stem the tide beforehand.
See if the people you won back are willing to talk about thei
On Mon, Jul 28, 2014 at 6:10 PM, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
> Just lost another one, dammit. Small company with about 6 mailboxes who
> some consultant gave them a song and dance about how Gmail's such a
> better mail service since "they don't get any spam"
The trend towards email service provid
> -Original Message-
> From: John Hardin [mailto:jhar...@impsec.org]
> Sent: 2014-07-28 12:55
> To: users@spamassassin.apache.org
> Subject: RE: Ready to throw in the towel on email providing...
>
>
> On Mon, 28 Jul 2014, Greg Ledford wrote:
>
> The only
On Mon, 28 Jul 2014 12:49:24 -0400
Rob McEwen wrote:
> PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong as my example above is anecdotal.. but
> from what I understand, Google doesn't provide ANSWERS and SOLUTIONS
> for situations like this. You just get excuses and delays.
That has been my experience too. We ha
On Mon, 28 Jul 2014 09:10:40 -0700
Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
> Or are we just going to end up with an Internet in about 10 years
> where every single email box is either on Microsoft 365 or Gmail and
> the NSA has a wonderful interface to use to hunt through whatever
> they want without bothering w
On Mon, 28 Jul 2014, Greg Ledford wrote:
Spammer hire staff in foreign countries to format emails until they get
around the filters. Many of them BUY the filters and bounce emails
against them until they get through and THEN send them out.
The only thing that evolves faster than bacteria is s
On 7/28/2014 12:10 PM, Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
> Small company with about 6 mailboxes who some consultant gave them a
> song and dance about how Gmail's such a
> better mail service since "they don't get any spam"
Ted,
fwiw, I had a situation last year where a friend (not one of my own
clients)
edf...@phhwtechnology.com
-Original Message-
From: Nate Metheny [mailto:n...@santafe.edu]
Sent: Monday, July 28, 2014 11:30 AM
To: users@spamassassin.apache.org
Subject: Re: Ready to throw in the towel on email providing...
I definitely appreciate your rant and your point of view.
Sadly, until SM
I definitely appreciate your rant and your point of view.
Sadly, until SMTP is rewritten and we're not using protocols on the
Internet that have been based on very very old code and then just
patched and updated ad infinitum, there isn't a "sure fire" solution.
More patches, more fixes, more f
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