[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript AND five course guitar stringing

2018-01-04 Thread mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk 
es some possible sources of Logy's works 
http://bazhum.muzhp.pl/media//files/Musicology_Today/Musicology_Today-r2004-t1/Musicology_Today-r2004-t1-s77-95/Musicology_Today-r2004-t1-s77-95.pdf


Placement of high octaves on the lower courses of the five course 
guitar 

The sources which clearly indicate the high octave on the 'bass' side 
of the five course are all eighteenth century:  principally 
Stradivari's (c 1710) instructions for stringing a sort of theorboed 
guitar; Diderot in 1757 and Merchi in 1761. A couple of iconographic 
sources may, or may not, indicate the earlier placement continuing into 
the eighteenth century ..

The placement of the high octave on the 'bass' side in the French (aka 
Corbetta) tuning has nowadays been generally accepted and, in some 
circumstances, may seem to resolve some problems of voice leading etc - 
conversely it can also do exactly the opposite!  My view is that for 
much seventeenth century music, voice leading jumps etc resulting from 
a fully re-entrant or French tuning are simply a part of the 
instrument's novel texture and style, but that in the more treble and 
bass orientated works of the eighteenth century (eg the above) the bass 
string of the fourth (and fifth) course is more suitable if on the 
'bass' side of the guitar 
This is much based on my own experience in playing Diesel, the 'Losy' 
guitar works, D-189 MS and some other late 'guitar' sources on the 
mandora (with its bass strings on the bass side). In my view this 
arrangement gives a much more satisfactory musical result for the style 
and period of this later music. But, of course, this is something of a 
subjective judgement...
Martyn


  From: "mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk" <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
 To: dshos...@mac.com 
Cc: VihuelaList <vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>
 Sent: Wednesday, 3 January 2018, 20:28
 Subject: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript
   
The music in tablature appears to be for 5-course guitar.  There are a 
few 5-part chords which could be strummed but it seems to be mainly in 
lute style and perhaps mid 18th century. How do we know that the music 
is actually by Losy? Which library owns it today?
The rest seems to be for mandora or gallichon.  Martyn may know more 
about it if he has read this.

Monica



Original Message
From: dshos...@mac.com
Date: 03/01/2018 19:02 
To: "WALSH STUART"<s.wa...@ntlworld.com>
Cc: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>, "Monica Hall"
<mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

Sorry, letâs try a dropbox: 
https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0

 <https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0>




> On Jan 3, 2018, at 1:57 PM, WALSH STUART <s.wa...@ntlworld.com> 
wrote:
> 
> On 1/3/2018 5:07 PM, DANIEL SHOSKES wrote:
>> Iââ¬â¢ve come across the Moravsky manuscript which is an 
interesting mix of bandora, baroque guitar, ââ¬Å6 string/courseââ
¬Â guitar and other works in standard notation. Much music of Losy 
(Logy).
>> 
>> A link is here: http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271

 <http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271>
> 
> I get the following message:
> 
> You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached 
to this post.
> 
> 
> 
>> 
>> If anyone has info on the Ms, Iââ¬â¢d like to ask the following:
>> 
>> 1) On page 48 there is a page of tuning for guitar and mandora. 
While note values aren't given for the guitar the sixth course for the 
mandora is a G and that seems to work for the guitar pieces. Is there 
evidence for a 6 course guitar that Losy composed for? I've tried them 
on my Romantic guitar just playing the E string stopped at the 3rd 
fret.
>> 
>> 2) Any sources for the tuning that Losy used? Switching between the 
Romatic guitar and my baroque guitar in re-entrant tuning some pieces 
seem better suited to one of the other.
>> 
>> 3) How clear are the attributions to Losy? I did find one Rondeau 
that says Logi but appears in the Haslemere lute MS attributed to 
Weiss 
and in another attributed to von Bohrenfels.
>> 
>> 4) None of the guitar works have strumming indications. All plucked 
or would the performance practice to be strum away?
>> 
>> Thanks
>> 
>> Danny
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> To get on or off this list see list information at
>> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>> 
> 
> 
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
> 


--

[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript AND five course guitar stringing

2018-01-04 Thread Martyn Hodgson 
__

   From: "mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk" <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
   To: dshos...@mac.com
   Cc: VihuelaList <vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>
   Sent: Wednesday, 3 January 2018, 20:28
   Subject: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript
   The music in tablature appears to be for 5-course guitar.  There are a
   few 5-part chords which could be strummed but it seems to be mainly in
   lute style and perhaps mid 18th century. How do we know that the music
   is actually by Losy? Which library owns it today?
   The rest seems to be for mandora or gallichon.  Martyn may know more
   about it if he has read this.
   Monica
   Original Message
   From: [2]dshos...@mac.com
   Date: 03/01/2018 19:02
   To: "WALSH STUART"<[3]s.wa...@ntlworld.com>
   Cc: "VihuelaList"<[4]vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>, "Monica Hall"
   <[5]mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
   Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript
   Sorry, letâs try a dropbox:
   [6]https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?
   dl=0
   <[7]https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf
   ?dl=0>
   > On Jan 3, 2018, at 1:57 PM, WALSH STUART <[8]s.wa...@ntlworld.com>
   wrote:
   >
   > On 1/3/2018 5:07 PM, DANIEL SHOSKES wrote:
   >> Ià ¢Ã¢ ¬Ã¢ ¢ve come across the Moravsky manuscript which is an
   interesting mix of bandora, baroque guitar, à ¢Ã¢ ¬Ã6 string/courseÃ
   ¢Ã¢
   ¬Ã guitar and other works in standard notation. Much music of Losy
   (Logy).
   >>
   >> A link is here:
   [9]http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271
   <[10]http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271>
   >
   > I get the following message:
   >
   > You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached
   to this post.
   >
   >
   >
   >>
   >> If anyone has info on the Ms, Ià ¢Ã¢ ¬Ã¢ ¢d like to ask the
   following:
   >>
   >> 1) On page 48 there is a page of tuning for guitar and mandora.
   While note values aren't given for the guitar the sixth course for the
   mandora is a G and that seems to work for the guitar pieces. Is there
   evidence for a 6 course guitar that Losy composed for? I've tried them
   on my Romantic guitar just playing the E string stopped at the 3rd
   fret.
   >>
   >> 2) Any sources for the tuning that Losy used? Switching between the
   Romatic guitar and my baroque guitar in re-entrant tuning some pieces
   seem better suited to one of the other.
   >>
   >> 3) How clear are the attributions to Losy? I did find one Rondeau
   that says Logi but appears in the Haslemere lute MS attributed to Weiss
   and in another attributed to von Bohrenfels.
   >>
   >> 4) None of the guitar works have strumming indications. All plucked
   or would the performance practice to be strum away?
   >>
   >> Thanks
   >>
   >> Danny
   >>
   >>
   >> --
   >>
   >> To get on or off this list see list information at
   >> [11]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
   >>
   >
   >
   > ---
   > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
   > [12]https://www.avast.com/antivirus
   >
   --

   --

References

   1. 
http://bazhum.muzhp.pl/media//files/Musicology_Today/Musicology_Today-r2004-t1/Musicology_Today-r2004-t1-s77-95/Musicology_Today-r2004-t1-s77-95.pdf
   2. mailto:dshos...@mac.com
   3. mailto:s.wa...@ntlworld.com
   4. mailto:vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu
   5. mailto:mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
   6. https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0
   7. https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0
   8. mailto:s.wa...@ntlworld.com
   9. http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271
  10. http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271
  11. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
  12. https://www.avast.com/antivirus

[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

2018-01-04 Thread Ralf Mattes 
 
Am Donnerstag, 04. Januar 2018 10:59 CET, "mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk" 
 schrieb: 
 
> Updating it yet again - I keep getting interrupted - but the tuning 
> chart seems to indicate that the 5th course is tuned in unison with the 
> third course stopped at the 2nd fret which would make it re-entrant.
> Monica

Which tuning chart? The one on pdf page 97 (pencil foliation 96r.)?
That chart (fol. 96r.) doesn't indicate octave disposition at all. It might
only show pitch class (similar to the bass string indications on fol. 48 v.
The 'Accordo Chitarra9 et Mandora' on that page only gives octaves.
BTW, a Mandora with 12 strings? Pretty interesting, IMHO. Of course that
would be an easy reuse for an out-of-fashion baroque lute.
 
BTW, the 'Fundamenta Chitarra9' on fol. 48r. (pdf 49) does show a 6 string, but
only unfretted.

Cheers, Ralf Mattes




To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

2018-01-04 Thread DANIEL SHOSKES 
Thanks for all your insights Monica!

> On Jan 4, 2018, at 4:59 AM, mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
> 
> Updating it yet again - I keep getting interrupted - but the tuning 
> chart seems to indicate that the 5th course is tuned in unison with the 
> third course stopped at the 2nd fret which would make it re-entrant.
> Monica
> 
> Original Message
> From: mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
> Date: 04/01/2018 9:51 
> To: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>
> Subj: Re: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript
> 
> Updating my previous message - and having looked more carefully at the 
> manuscript I am not sure that all the music in tablature is for 5-
> course guitar. The pieces on p.50-61 seem to require an unstopped 6th 
> course and one piece on p.91 requires 5 open corse. On p.97 there is a 
> table of alfabeto chords and a tuning chart apparently for 5-course 
> guitar.
> 
> Original Message
> From: mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
> Date: 04/01/2018 9:48 
> To: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>
> Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript
> 
> 
> 
> I had a bit more time to look at this - I actually have a pdf of it 
> already. It is (or was) in the 
> Moravské zemské muzeum in Brno in the Czech Republic.
> 
> I don't think we can assume that all the music is by Losy or that all 
> of it was originally composed for guitar. I never had time to look at 
> all the pieces - about 50 pages of them.  Maybe one day.
> Monica
> 
> 
> 
> Original Message----
> From: dshos...@mac.com
> Date: 04/01/2018 0:17 
> To: <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
> Cc: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>
> Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript
> 
> Sadly the only info is what the pdf file contains. One piece that 
> mentions “Logi”. A couple pieces with lute concordances by other 
> composers.
> 
>> On Jan 3, 2018, at 3:27 PM, mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
>> 
>> The music in tablature appears to be for 5-course guitar.  There are 
> a 
>> few 5-part chords which could be strummed but it seems to be mainly 
> in 
>> lute style and perhaps mid 18th century. How do we know that the 
> music 
>> is actually by Losy? Which library owns it today?
>> The rest seems to be for mandora or gallichon.  Martyn may know more 
>> about it if he has read this.
>> 
>> Monica
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Original Message
>> From: dshos...@mac.com
>> Date: 03/01/2018 19:02 
>> To: "WALSH STUART"<s.wa...@ntlworld.com>
>> Cc: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>, "Monica Hall"
>> <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
>> Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript
>> 
>> Sorry, let’s try a dropbox: 
>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> <https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0>
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jan 3, 2018, at 1:57 PM, WALSH STUART <s.wa...@ntlworld.com> 
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> On 1/3/2018 5:07 PM, DANIEL SHOSKES wrote:
>>>> I’ve come across the Moravsky manuscript which is an 
>> interesting mix of bandora, baroque guitar, “6 string/courseâ
> â‚
>> ¬Â guitar and other works in standard notation. Much music of Losy 
>> (Logy).
>>>> 
>>>> A link is here: http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> <http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271>
>>> 
>>> I get the following message:
>>> 
>>> You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached 
>> to this post.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> If anyone has info on the Ms, I’d like to ask the following:
>>>> 
>>>> 1) On page 48 there is a page of tuning for guitar and mandora. 
>> While note values aren't given for the guitar the sixth course for 
> the 
>> mandora is a G and that seems to work for the guitar pieces. Is 
> there 
>> evidence for a 6 course guitar that Losy composed for? I've tried 
> them 
>> on my Romantic guitar just playing the E string stopped at the 3rd 
>> fret.
>>>> 
>>>> 2) Any sources for the tuning that Losy used? Switching between 
> the 
>> Romatic guitar and my baroque guitar in re-entrant tuning some 
> pieces 
>> seem better suited to one of the other.
>>>> 
>>>> 3) How clear are the attributions to Losy? I did find one Rondeau 
>> that says Logi but appears in the Haslemere lute MS attributed to 
> Weiss 
>> and in another attributed to von Bohrenfels.
>>>> 
>>>> 4) None of the guitar works have strumming indications. All 
> plucked 
>> or would the performance practice to be strum away?
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks
>>>> 
>>>> Danny
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> 
>>>> To get on or off this list see list information at
>>>> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ---
>>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>

[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

2018-01-04 Thread mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk 
Updating it yet again - I keep getting interrupted - but the tuning 
chart seems to indicate that the 5th course is tuned in unison with the 
third course stopped at the 2nd fret which would make it re-entrant.
Monica

Original Message
From: mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
Date: 04/01/2018 9:51 
To: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Subj: Re: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

Updating my previous message - and having looked more carefully at the 
manuscript I am not sure that all the music in tablature is for 5-
course guitar. The pieces on p.50-61 seem to require an unstopped 6th 
course and one piece on p.91 requires 5 open corse. On p.97 there is a 
table of alfabeto chords and a tuning chart apparently for 5-course 
guitar.

Original Message
From: mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
Date: 04/01/2018 9:48 
To: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript



I had a bit more time to look at this - I actually have a pdf of it 
already. It is (or was) in the 
Moravské zemské muzeum in Brno in the Czech Republic.

I don't think we can assume that all the music is by Losy or that all 
of it was originally composed for guitar. I never had time to look at 
all the pieces - about 50 pages of them.  Maybe one day.
Monica



Original Message
From: dshos...@mac.com
Date: 04/01/2018 0:17 
To: <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
Cc: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

Sadly the only info is what the pdf file contains. One piece that 
mentions “Logi”. A couple pieces with lute concordances by other 
composers.

> On Jan 3, 2018, at 3:27 PM, mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
> 
> The music in tablature appears to be for 5-course guitar.  There are 
a 
> few 5-part chords which could be strummed but it seems to be mainly 
in 
> lute style and perhaps mid 18th century. How do we know that the 
music 
> is actually by Losy? Which library owns it today?
> The rest seems to be for mandora or gallichon.  Martyn may know more 
> about it if he has read this.
> 
> Monica
> 
> 
> 
> Original Message
> From: dshos...@mac.com
> Date: 03/01/2018 19:02 
> To: "WALSH STUART"<s.wa...@ntlworld.com>
> Cc: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>, "Monica Hall"
> <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
> Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript
> 
> Sorry, let’s try a dropbox: 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0




> <https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0>




> 
> 
> 
>> On Jan 3, 2018, at 1:57 PM, WALSH STUART <s.wa...@ntlworld.com> 
> wrote:
>> 
>> On 1/3/2018 5:07 PM, DANIEL SHOSKES wrote:
>>> I’ve come across the Moravsky manuscript which is an 
> interesting mix of bandora, baroque guitar, “6 string/courseâ
â‚
> ¬Â guitar and other works in standard notation. Much music of Losy 
> (Logy).
>>> 
>>> A link is here: http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271




> <http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271>
>> 
>> I get the following message:
>> 
>> You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached 
> to this post.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> If anyone has info on the Ms, I’d like to ask the following:
>>> 
>>> 1) On page 48 there is a page of tuning for guitar and mandora. 
> While note values aren't given for the guitar the sixth course for 
the 
> mandora is a G and that seems to work for the guitar pieces. Is 
there 
> evidence for a 6 course guitar that Losy composed for? I've tried 
them 
> on my Romantic guitar just playing the E string stopped at the 3rd 
> fret.
>>> 
>>> 2) Any sources for the tuning that Losy used? Switching between 
the 
> Romatic guitar and my baroque guitar in re-entrant tuning some 
pieces 
> seem better suited to one of the other.
>>> 
>>> 3) How clear are the attributions to Losy? I did find one Rondeau 
> that says Logi but appears in the Haslemere lute MS attributed to 
Weiss 
> and in another attributed to von Bohrenfels.
>>> 
>>> 4) None of the guitar works have strumming indications. All 
plucked 
> or would the performance practice to be strum away?
>>> 
>>> Thanks
>>> 
>>> Danny
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> To get on or off this list see list information at
>>> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ---
>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>> 
> 
> 
> --
> 
>

[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

2018-01-04 Thread mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk 
Updating my previous message - and having looked more carefully at the 
manuscript I am not sure that all the music in tablature is for 5-
course guitar. The pieces on p.50-61 seem to require an unstopped 6th 
course and one piece on p.91 requires 5 open corse. On p.97 there is a 
table of alfabeto chords and a tuning chart apparently for 5-course 
guitar.

Original Message
From: mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk
Date: 04/01/2018 9:48 
To: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript



I had a bit more time to look at this - I actually have a pdf of it 
already. It is (or was) in the 
Moravské zemské muzeum in Brno in the Czech Republic.

I don't think we can assume that all the music is by Losy or that all 
of it was originally composed for guitar. I never had time to look at 
all the pieces - about 50 pages of them.  Maybe one day.
Monica



Original Message
From: dshos...@mac.com
Date: 04/01/2018 0:17 
To: <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
Cc: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

Sadly the only info is what the pdf file contains. One piece that 
mentions “Logi”. A couple pieces with lute concordances by other 
composers.

> On Jan 3, 2018, at 3:27 PM, mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
> 
> The music in tablature appears to be for 5-course guitar.  There are 
a 
> few 5-part chords which could be strummed but it seems to be mainly 
in 
> lute style and perhaps mid 18th century. How do we know that the 
music 
> is actually by Losy? Which library owns it today?
> The rest seems to be for mandora or gallichon.  Martyn may know more 
> about it if he has read this.
> 
> Monica
> 
> 
> 
> Original Message
> From: dshos...@mac.com
> Date: 03/01/2018 19:02 
> To: "WALSH STUART"<s.wa...@ntlworld.com>
> Cc: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>, "Monica Hall"
> <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
> Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript
> 
> Sorry, let’s try a dropbox: 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0



> <https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0>



> 
> 
> 
>> On Jan 3, 2018, at 1:57 PM, WALSH STUART <s.wa...@ntlworld.com> 
> wrote:
>> 
>> On 1/3/2018 5:07 PM, DANIEL SHOSKES wrote:
>>> I’ve come across the Moravsky manuscript which is an 
> interesting mix of bandora, baroque guitar, “6 string/courseâ
â‚
> ¬Â guitar and other works in standard notation. Much music of Losy 
> (Logy).
>>> 
>>> A link is here: http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271



> <http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271>
>> 
>> I get the following message:
>> 
>> You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached 
> to this post.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> If anyone has info on the Ms, I’d like to ask the following:
>>> 
>>> 1) On page 48 there is a page of tuning for guitar and mandora. 
> While note values aren't given for the guitar the sixth course for 
the 
> mandora is a G and that seems to work for the guitar pieces. Is 
there 
> evidence for a 6 course guitar that Losy composed for? I've tried 
them 
> on my Romantic guitar just playing the E string stopped at the 3rd 
> fret.
>>> 
>>> 2) Any sources for the tuning that Losy used? Switching between 
the 
> Romatic guitar and my baroque guitar in re-entrant tuning some 
pieces 
> seem better suited to one of the other.
>>> 
>>> 3) How clear are the attributions to Losy? I did find one Rondeau 
> that says Logi but appears in the Haslemere lute MS attributed to 
Weiss 
> and in another attributed to von Bohrenfels.
>>> 
>>> 4) None of the guitar works have strumming indications. All 
plucked 
> or would the performance practice to be strum away?
>>> 
>>> Thanks
>>> 
>>> Danny
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> To get on or off this list see list information at
>>> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ---
>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>> 
> 
> 
> --
> 
>

[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

2018-01-04 Thread mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk 


I had a bit more time to look at this - I actually have a pdf of it 
already. It is (or was) in the 
Moravské zemské muzeum in Brno in the Czech Republic.

I don't think we can assume that all the music is by Losy or that all 
of it was originally composed for guitar. I never had time to look at 
all the pieces - about 50 pages of them.  Maybe one day.
Monica



Original Message
From: dshos...@mac.com
Date: 04/01/2018 0:17 
To: <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
Cc: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

Sadly the only info is what the pdf file contains. One piece that 
mentions “Logi”. A couple pieces with lute concordances by other 
composers.

> On Jan 3, 2018, at 3:27 PM, mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
> 
> The music in tablature appears to be for 5-course guitar.  There are 
a 
> few 5-part chords which could be strummed but it seems to be mainly 
in 
> lute style and perhaps mid 18th century. How do we know that the 
music 
> is actually by Losy? Which library owns it today?
> The rest seems to be for mandora or gallichon.  Martyn may know more 
> about it if he has read this.
> 
> Monica
> 
> 
> 
> Original Message
> From: dshos...@mac.com
> Date: 03/01/2018 19:02 
> To: "WALSH STUART"<s.wa...@ntlworld.com>
> Cc: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>, "Monica Hall"
> <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
> Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript
> 
> Sorry, let’s try a dropbox: 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0


> <https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0>


> 
> 
> 
>> On Jan 3, 2018, at 1:57 PM, WALSH STUART <s.wa...@ntlworld.com> 
> wrote:
>> 
>> On 1/3/2018 5:07 PM, DANIEL SHOSKES wrote:
>>> I’ve come across the Moravsky manuscript which is an 
> interesting mix of bandora, baroque guitar, “6 string/courseâ
â‚
> ¬Â guitar and other works in standard notation. Much music of Losy 
> (Logy).
>>> 
>>> A link is here: http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271


> <http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271>
>> 
>> I get the following message:
>> 
>> You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached 
> to this post.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> If anyone has info on the Ms, I’d like to ask the following:
>>> 
>>> 1) On page 48 there is a page of tuning for guitar and mandora. 
> While note values aren't given for the guitar the sixth course for 
the 
> mandora is a G and that seems to work for the guitar pieces. Is 
there 
> evidence for a 6 course guitar that Losy composed for? I've tried 
them 
> on my Romantic guitar just playing the E string stopped at the 3rd 
> fret.
>>> 
>>> 2) Any sources for the tuning that Losy used? Switching between 
the 
> Romatic guitar and my baroque guitar in re-entrant tuning some 
pieces 
> seem better suited to one of the other.
>>> 
>>> 3) How clear are the attributions to Losy? I did find one Rondeau 
> that says Logi but appears in the Haslemere lute MS attributed to 
Weiss 
> and in another attributed to von Bohrenfels.
>>> 
>>> 4) None of the guitar works have strumming indications. All 
plucked 
> or would the performance practice to be strum away?
>>> 
>>> Thanks
>>> 
>>> Danny
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> To get on or off this list see list information at
>>> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ---
>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>> 
> 
> 
> --
> 
>

[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

2018-01-03 Thread DANIEL SHOSKES 
Sadly the only info is what the pdf file contains. One piece that mentions 
“Logi”. A couple pieces with lute concordances by other composers.

> On Jan 3, 2018, at 3:27 PM, mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk wrote:
> 
> The music in tablature appears to be for 5-course guitar.  There are a 
> few 5-part chords which could be strummed but it seems to be mainly in 
> lute style and perhaps mid 18th century. How do we know that the music 
> is actually by Losy? Which library owns it today?
> The rest seems to be for mandora or gallichon.  Martyn may know more 
> about it if he has read this.
> 
> Monica
> 
> 
> 
> Original Message
> From: dshos...@mac.com
> Date: 03/01/2018 19:02 
> To: "WALSH STUART"<s.wa...@ntlworld.com>
> Cc: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>, "Monica Hall"
> <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
> Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript
> 
> Sorry, let’s try a dropbox: 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0
> <https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0>
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jan 3, 2018, at 1:57 PM, WALSH STUART <s.wa...@ntlworld.com> 
> wrote:
>> 
>> On 1/3/2018 5:07 PM, DANIEL SHOSKES wrote:
>>> I’ve come across the Moravsky manuscript which is an 
> interesting mix of bandora, baroque guitar, “6 string/courseââ‚
> ¬Â guitar and other works in standard notation. Much music of Losy 
> (Logy).
>>> 
>>> A link is here: http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271
> <http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271>
>> 
>> I get the following message:
>> 
>> You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached 
> to this post.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> If anyone has info on the Ms, I’d like to ask the following:
>>> 
>>> 1) On page 48 there is a page of tuning for guitar and mandora. 
> While note values aren't given for the guitar the sixth course for the 
> mandora is a G and that seems to work for the guitar pieces. Is there 
> evidence for a 6 course guitar that Losy composed for? I've tried them 
> on my Romantic guitar just playing the E string stopped at the 3rd 
> fret.
>>> 
>>> 2) Any sources for the tuning that Losy used? Switching between the 
> Romatic guitar and my baroque guitar in re-entrant tuning some pieces 
> seem better suited to one of the other.
>>> 
>>> 3) How clear are the attributions to Losy? I did find one Rondeau 
> that says Logi but appears in the Haslemere lute MS attributed to Weiss 
> and in another attributed to von Bohrenfels.
>>> 
>>> 4) None of the guitar works have strumming indications. All plucked 
> or would the performance practice to be strum away?
>>> 
>>> Thanks
>>> 
>>> Danny
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> To get on or off this list see list information at
>>> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ---
>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>> 
> 
> 
> --
> 
>

[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

2018-01-03 Thread mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk 
The music in tablature appears to be for 5-course guitar.  There are a 
few 5-part chords which could be strummed but it seems to be mainly in 
lute style and perhaps mid 18th century. How do we know that the music 
is actually by Losy? Which library owns it today?
The rest seems to be for mandora or gallichon.  Martyn may know more 
about it if he has read this.

Monica



Original Message
From: dshos...@mac.com
Date: 03/01/2018 19:02 
To: "WALSH STUART"<s.wa...@ntlworld.com>
Cc: "VihuelaList"<vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu>, "Monica Hall"
<mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>
Subj: [VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

Sorry, let’s try a dropbox: 
https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0
 <https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0>



> On Jan 3, 2018, at 1:57 PM, WALSH STUART <s.wa...@ntlworld.com> 
wrote:
> 
> On 1/3/2018 5:07 PM, DANIEL SHOSKES wrote:
>> I’ve come across the Moravsky manuscript which is an 
interesting mix of bandora, baroque guitar, “6 string/courseââ‚
¬Â guitar and other works in standard notation. Much music of Losy 
(Logy).
>> 
>> A link is here: http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271
 <http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271>
> 
> I get the following message:
> 
> You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached 
to this post.
> 
> 
> 
>> 
>> If anyone has info on the Ms, I’d like to ask the following:
>> 
>> 1) On page 48 there is a page of tuning for guitar and mandora. 
While note values aren't given for the guitar the sixth course for the 
mandora is a G and that seems to work for the guitar pieces. Is there 
evidence for a 6 course guitar that Losy composed for? I've tried them 
on my Romantic guitar just playing the E string stopped at the 3rd 
fret.
>> 
>> 2) Any sources for the tuning that Losy used? Switching between the 
Romatic guitar and my baroque guitar in re-entrant tuning some pieces 
seem better suited to one of the other.
>> 
>> 3) How clear are the attributions to Losy? I did find one Rondeau 
that says Logi but appears in the Haslemere lute MS attributed to Weiss 
and in another attributed to von Bohrenfels.
>> 
>> 4) None of the guitar works have strumming indications. All plucked 
or would the performance practice to be strum away?
>> 
>> Thanks
>> 
>> Danny
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> To get on or off this list see list information at
>> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>> 
> 
> 
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
> 


--

[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

2018-01-03 Thread WALSH STUART 
   On 1/3/2018 7:02 PM, DANIEL SHOSKES wrote:

   Sorry, let's try a
   dropbox: [1]https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMan
   dore.pdf?dl=0
   Thanks!
   This MS has come up before -  but I can't remember where. Possibly on
   this vihuela list so it may be worth checking the archives. I'm sure
   there was some discussion of it.
   I think you mean mandora rather bandora. I doubt that there is any
   six-string/course guitar music in it. More likely it is for mandora.
   Stuart

   On Jan 3, 2018, at 1:57 PM, WALSH STUART <[2]s.wa...@ntlworld.com>
   wrote:

   On 1/3/2018 5:07 PM, DANIEL SHOSKES wrote:

 I’ve come across the Moravsky manuscript which is an interesting
 mix of bandora, baroque guitar, “6 string/course” guitar and
 other works in standard notation. Much music of Losy (Logy).
 A link is here:
 [3]http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?tg271
 <[4]http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?tg271>

   I get the following message:
   You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to
   this post.

 If anyone has info on the Ms, I’d like to ask the following:
 1) On page 48 there is a page of tuning for guitar and mandora.
 While note values aren't given for the guitar the sixth course for
 the mandora is a G and that seems to work for the guitar pieces. Is
 there evidence for a 6 course guitar that Losy composed for? I've
 tried them on my Romantic guitar just playing the E string stopped
 at the 3rd fret.
 2) Any sources for the tuning that Losy used? Switching between the
 Romatic guitar and my baroque guitar in re-entrant tuning some
 pieces seem better suited to one of the other.
 3) How clear are the attributions to Losy? I did find one Rondeau
 that says Logi but appears in the Haslemere lute MS attributed to
 Weiss and in another attributed to von Bohrenfels.
 4) None of the guitar works have strumming indications. All plucked
 or would the performance practice to be strum away?
 Thanks
 Danny
 --
 To get on or off this list see list information at
 [5]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

   ---
   This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
   [6]https://www.avast.com/antivirus

   Virus-free. [7]www.avast.com

   --

References

   Visible links
   1. https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0
   2. mailto:s.wa...@ntlworld.com
   3. http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?tg271
   4. http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?tg271
   5. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
   6. https://www.avast.com/antivirus
   7. 
https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email_source=link_campaign=sig-email_content=emailclient

   Hidden links:
   9. 
https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email_source=link_campaign=sig-email_content=emailclient
  10. 
file://localhost/net/ifs-users/lute-arc/L16830-9036TMP.html#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2

[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

2018-01-03 Thread DANIEL SHOSKES 
Sorry, let’s try a dropbox: 
https://www.dropbox.com/s/oaqfczqgfio4gao/Losy-GuitareEtMandore.pdf?dl=0 



> On Jan 3, 2018, at 1:57 PM, WALSH STUART  wrote:
> 
> On 1/3/2018 5:07 PM, DANIEL SHOSKES wrote:
>> I’ve come across the Moravsky manuscript which is an interesting mix 
>> of bandora, baroque guitar, “6 string/course” guitar and other 
>> works in standard notation. Much music of Losy (Logy).
>> 
>> A link is here: http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271 
>> 
> 
> I get the following message:
> 
> You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this 
> post.
> 
> 
> 
>> 
>> If anyone has info on the Ms, I’d like to ask the following:
>> 
>> 1) On page 48 there is a page of tuning for guitar and mandora. While note 
>> values aren't given for the guitar the sixth course for the mandora is a G 
>> and that seems to work for the guitar pieces. Is there evidence for a 6 
>> course guitar that Losy composed for? I've tried them on my Romantic guitar 
>> just playing the E string stopped at the 3rd fret.
>> 
>> 2) Any sources for the tuning that Losy used? Switching between the Romatic 
>> guitar and my baroque guitar in re-entrant tuning some pieces seem better 
>> suited to one of the other.
>> 
>> 3) How clear are the attributions to Losy? I did find one Rondeau that says 
>> Logi but appears in the Haslemere lute MS attributed to Weiss and in another 
>> attributed to von Bohrenfels.
>> 
>> 4) None of the guitar works have strumming indications. All plucked or would 
>> the performance practice to be strum away?
>> 
>> Thanks
>> 
>> Danny
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> To get on or off this list see list information at
>> http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
>> 
> 
> 
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
> 


--

[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

2018-01-03 Thread WALSH STUART 

On 1/3/2018 5:07 PM, DANIEL SHOSKES wrote:

I’ve come across the Moravsky manuscript which is an interesting mix of 
bandora, baroque guitar, “6 string/course” guitar and other works in 
standard notation. Much music of Losy (Logy).

A link is here: http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271 



I get the following message:

You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to 
this post.






If anyone has info on the Ms, I’d like to ask the following:

1) On page 48 there is a page of tuning for guitar and mandora. While note 
values aren't given for the guitar the sixth course for the mandora is a G and 
that seems to work for the guitar pieces. Is there evidence for a 6 course 
guitar that Losy composed for? I've tried them on my Romantic guitar just 
playing the E string stopped at the 3rd fret.

2) Any sources for the tuning that Losy used? Switching between the Romatic 
guitar and my baroque guitar in re-entrant tuning some pieces seem better 
suited to one of the other.

3) How clear are the attributions to Losy? I did find one Rondeau that says 
Logi but appears in the Haslemere lute MS attributed to Weiss and in another 
attributed to von Bohrenfels.

4) None of the guitar works have strumming indications. All plucked or would 
the performance practice to be strum away?

Thanks

Danny


--

To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html




---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

[VIHUELA] Re: Moravsky Manuscript

2018-01-03 Thread mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk 
I wasn't able to access the facsimile of this manuscript so can't 
really comment in details.
However I think it is a bit doubtful whether Losy actually composed any 
music specifically for the guitar; what survives in manuscript may be 
arrangements of lute pieces.  It is also unlikely that he composed 
anything for the 6-stringed guitar. There is no way of knowing what 
method of stringing Losy preferred - if he had any preferences - but 
surviving music attributed to him works well with the so-called 
"French" tuning i.e. a low octave on the 4th course only.
Is the facsimile available on another web site? It would be interesting 
to have a look at it.

MOnica

Original Message
From: dshos...@mac.com
Date: 03/01/2018 17:07 
To: "VihuelaList"
Subj: [VIHUELA] Moravsky Manuscript

I’ve come across the Moravsky manuscript which is an interesting mix 
of bandora, baroque guitar, “6 string/course” guitar and other 
works in standard notation. Much music of Losy (Logy). 

A link is here: http://www.classicalguitardelcamp.com/viewtopic.php?t=67271
 

If anyone has info on the Ms, I’d like to ask the following:

1) On page 48 there is a page of tuning for guitar and mandora. While 
note values aren't given for the guitar the sixth course for the 
mandora is a G and that seems to work for the guitar pieces. Is there 
evidence for a 6 course guitar that Losy composed for? I've tried them 
on my Romantic guitar just playing the E string stopped at the 3rd 
fret. 

2) Any sources for the tuning that Losy used? Switching between the 
Romatic guitar and my baroque guitar in re-entrant tuning some pieces 
seem better suited to one of the other.

3) How clear are the attributions to Losy? I did find one Rondeau that 
says Logi but appears in the Haslemere lute MS attributed to Weiss and 
in another attributed to von Bohrenfels.

4) None of the guitar works have strumming indications. All plucked or 
would the performance practice to be strum away?

Thanks

Danny


--

To get on or off this list see list information at
http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html