Hi, all. Is there a limit to the amount of text you can write in the native
notes app? It seems to me I heard there was. Thanks.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Chuck Dean
Sent: Thursday, August
Sorry about that last partial post. I didn't mean to hit control enter.
Anyway, as I was saying, the conversation about how little pressure you
need in order to work with the IPhone got me thinking. I thought I was
tapping gently, but I tried just the lightest touches, and was amazed how
Hi, all. I have heard that it's important to always log out on your home
computer from your facebook page when you're finished. Same for bookshare
and other web pages. Is this also true on the IPhone? Just wondering.
Thanks.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
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I just went to the blind geek zone web page that Christopher gave a link to
to listen to the podcast on MBraille since I'm thinking seriously about
buying it. I wasn't able to find the podcast anywhere. Any suggestions.
I'd really like to hear it.
Thanks.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
--
You
I am unable to get into safari. I can send and receive emails, but when I
try to open safari it says that safari cannot open the page because the
network connection has been lost. I've tried re-booting the phone holding
down the home and screenlock buttons for 10 seconds two times. I've also
. Then try retyping
the desired website or opening the page from your bookmarks.
Donna
On Sep 8, 2013, at 5:11 PM, Paul and Paula Jordan pau...@roadrunner.com
wrote:
I am unable to get into safari. I can send and receive emails, but when I
try to open safari it says that safari cannot open
Hi all. Is there a way to paste text written within MBraille into another
app. For example, can you write a note in MBraille and move it to your
notes app, or can you write a reply in MBraille and paste it into the body
of an email to reply to someone? I haven't seen anything that answers this.
around the text by paragraph, line, word, or
character.
I would encourage you to check out the built in help for instructions on how
to take advantage of all of these features of the app.
HTH,
Chris Chaffin
From: mailto:pau...@roadrunner.com Paul and Paula Jordan
Sent
Hi, Raul and others. I was unable to get the information from the website
in this email. I keep getting a message that says edit secunia. I don't
know if this has to do with a virus protection I have on my computer or
what. Any thoughts? I would like to read the info.
Thanks in advance.
God
I'm having the same problem on my IPhone 4S running 6.1.3. I wonder if it's
a yahoo weather problem?
God bless!
Paula and Babe
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Geoff Stephens
Sent: Sunday, September 22, 2013 1:11 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
This may be obvious, but I was just reminded by a friend to use siri to
check my calendar events. It works like a charm. I just said, Check my
calendar for the week, and got the whole week's events. Easy solution, at
least for me.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From:
First of all, I just updated to IOS7 on my 4S and would like to thank all
who have given such helpful information. I knew what to expect and how to
deal with many things.
Second, I think this may have been covered earlier, but I can't find it
and my brain is on IOS 7 overload. Is there a
I just hit the home button once to get out of the notifications center or
the control center. Don't know if that's the best way, but it works.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Alexandra -
Hi all. Is anyone using the white pages app? I used it a couple of times
while running IOS 6 with some success. Since I upgraded I can't seem to get
the search feature to work. I go into businesses, type an item to search
and double tap the search button. It takes me to some sort of very
attachment: winmail.dat
Hi, All. I'm finding an odd subject line as I scroll down my viPhone email.
I read: report failure Then the sender's name followed by recall failure:
recall placing an order. When I open The email it just says something like
cannot be recalled and gives the February 14 date.
Might this
I've just purchased the voice dream app. I found the bookshare prompt,
enabled it, entered my bookshare email sign on and password. I was told
that it was authenticated. When I double tapped the ok button it took me
back to the screen that tells what bookshare is and says for more
information
@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: voice dream and bookshare
You're not missing anything at all, back out of that screen and you're ready
to go the add button to start adding books. Hope that helps. Take care.
On Feb 20, 2013, at 2:44 PM, Paul and Paula Jordan wrote:
I've just purchased the voice dream
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: voice dream and bookshare
You're not missing anything at all, back out of that screen and you're ready
to go the add button to start adding books. Hope that helps. Take care.
On Feb 20, 2013, at 2:44 PM, Paul and Paula Jordan wrote:
I've just
Hi. I have a question For anyone out there who is using ShopShop. I use
the app and like it a lot. I have a grocery list, plus two others, and can
switch from list to list. However, I'd like to clear the history, since it
has a lot of junk in it I may never want to get again. Is there a way to
I lost my calendar notifications after I did the update to 6.1.2.
I had to go into the settings menu, then notifications, then swipe until I
saw the calendar. For some reason it showed up in the no notifications
area. I double tapped on it and tapped to turn it back on. All works fine
Hi. I got this information from the list earlier in the week and thought,
it's so simple I'll surely remember it. However, I didn't and can't find
the email.
I have successfully logged onto bookshare using voice dream. After I
got the message authentication succeeded, I thought I could
Hi, all. In IOS 6 I could go into the edit field while on a contact and
find a delete contact button which let me erase the complete contact. I
can't seem to find one in IOS 7. Is there a solution or button I'm
missing? Thanks.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
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You received this message
Just wondering. What's the advantage of making a face time audio call as
opposed to just making a regular phone call? Just curious.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
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On my 4S running IOS 6 I sometimes had this problem. I'd try to reply to an
email or send a text and the keyboard simply wouldn't show up. The only way
I found to re-establish the on-screen keyboard was to turn the phone off and
wait a bit and turn it back on. That solved the problem every
Hi, all. I would like to have an alert each time I get an email rather than
having to go into my mail app to check it over and over. I can't seem to
figure out where to do this in settings. Any help would be appreciated. I
may decide it's making me crazy to hear the sound go off, but I'd like
Hey, all. When I hit the search button it takes me to sometime in 2012. Is
there a way to ask for a specific month or date? I haven't found one, but I
tend to miss these little things. I've tried typing in the name of the
month in the search field, but that didn't seem to help. Any thoughts?
Hi, all. I've found something in IOS 7 that I like very much. I use the
timer this evening for the first time in a while. I found that I could
check the status of the timer while it's running from the locked screen
easily, and was able to find the button to stop the timer also on the locked
Hi, Tom and others. I had this happen periodically while running IOS 6. I
never use a blue tooth keyboard, yet the on-screen keyboard would sometimes
totally disappear. The solution for me was to turn the phone off, wait a
little, then turn it back on. This worked every time.
Hope this helps.
Nope, you're not nuts! The letter announcement was there just a couple of
days ago. No more, though. Interesting.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Alan Paganelli
Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2013
Hi all. I need some advice before I re-download the MBraille app. I have
had significant trouble getting the app to send texts from within the app.
I have tried re-booting the phone holding down the home and lock button, and
have tried turning the phone off and then on again. Neither worked. As
Hi, all. I have an IPhone 4S running IOS 7.02. I've noticed something odd
in the last few days. When I open my mail app, if there are new messages
I'm put into the first message and asked if I want to read or dismiss. If I
tap on dismiss, then I'm taken to the next unread message and asked the
I just downloaded youplayer and it seems to work very nicely. It was free.
My guess is that there's a paid version, but I don't know that for sure.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Shane clark
Sent:
To all who are using the alarmed app with IOS 7.02. When I ask Siri to set
a reminder, it no longer sinks with the alarmed app automatically. Of
course, I can set it up in alarmed, but it was nice to have the native
reminders app sink with alarmed. Is anyone else noticing this? Is there
Hi. There were several inquiries about this subject a couple of weeks ago.
I just ran across this link and thought it might be helpful. Haven't
checked it out myself, since it's something I'm not interested in yet. This
link is from digital trends.
This evening I opened the junk email folder just to see what was in it.
There were several emails there that I don't recall moving into it, so I'm
just curious to know what goes into junk and how does it get there? Thanks.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
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You received this message because you are
There is an app called tempo perfect. Some of the buttons are unlabeled,
but it is accessible. I haven't used it much lately. I found the ticks
hard to hear if you're playing along, so use a small speaker. That seems to
work.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From:
Hi, everyone. A coworker has an IPhone 5 running IOS 6. She does not want
to update right now. Yesterday someone was helping her with her phone, and
the phone asked if she wanted to update. The only option was ok. There
appears to be no way to get out of that screen. We tried re-setting the
Hi, Lelia. Have you taken a look at blind square. It's significantly
cheaper than the Sendero GPS and seems to be pretty good. I've just started
working with it, and so far am impressed. There are some excellent podcasts
about it. The cost is around $24. HTH.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
Shop shop, alarmed, the native calendar, IYot (not sure of the spelling),
kings corner, 10 itemsMBraille, and of course the native apps like email
notes and phone.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of
Hi, Joe. I don't know if you've found the podcast that was done by an
Austrailian woman demonstrating Blind Square. It was rather lengthy, but
gave some good information. Actually, I just went looking for it so I could
tell you where to find it and couldn't find it. I don't think it was on
I have had the same problem. My work-around is to go to my contacts list,
to my friend's name, to the send message, and use the dictate button. That
is very reliable.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Marissa
Sent:
Hi, all. It is reassuring to know that nothing is wrong with my phone. I'm
not even able to use siri to set a two sentence reminder without that
Thomas Jefferson quote and request to make my statement shorter.
Take care.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From:
Has anyone found a good earphone or set of headphones that work well with
bilateral hearing aids? Thanks for any info.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the VIPhone Google
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To search the VIPhone public archive, visit
or it may have confused you even
more! ;)
HTH
Regards,
AnonyMouse
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Paul and Paula Jordan
Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 12:44 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
I have had this happen from time to time. I don't use a Bluetooth keyboard,
but always use the on-screen keyboard or siri. When I lose my keyboard I
shut the phone down completely, wait a couple of minutes, and turn it back
on and the keyboard's magically back. Hope this helps.
God bless!
Paula
I could get hooked on this game. So far, I can't get beyond round 8, but am
having great fun trying.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Ben Mustill-Rose
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2013 12:51 PM
To:
Tap tap see is probably the most useful app I have. I use it to read
medicine bottles, canned foods, frozen bags of vegetables, to check the
colors of my clothing, and much more. I think it's almost as good as having
a sighted person around. My husband, who is also blind, says he agrees and
Sometimes, if you turn the bottle or jar just a little you get more
information.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Larry Lumpkin
Sent: Monday, June 10, 2013 9:21 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: taptapsee
Hi, Alan, is the list app you referred to the one from Yoctaville? Pardon
the spelling. I saw lots of items on the app store and am not sure which
one you are talking about. Thanks.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com
I had exactly the same thing happen with my 4S running ios 7.03 last night.
Holding down the home and lock buttons for 10 seconds fixed it. Very
strange. I've also noticed that my voice-over sometimes stutters a bit.
Boy, it's amazing how much I've grown to like this phone, and when something
Hi, all. Just FYI, when my phone came back, I had to allow my contacts for
MBraille and my calendar for the alarmed app. I don't know if I have to set
location tracking or not, but it will be interesting to find out. No other
things needed to be changed. Indeed, very strange.
God bless!
What about those pictures that come back as failed? I was trying to get a
picture yesterday and got the message that the picture had timed out. There
were 5 or 6 of those timed out ones before I actually got the picture of the
shirt logo which was what I was looking for. Would I be charged for
Hi Cara. Interesting information about crashes. I decided to go in and
have a look. Now I just have a curiosity question. I see the words
assistant and the word backboard in the list of crashes. Both with
underscores after them. Just wondering what those are? Not a big deal.
Just curious as
Hi, all. Some time ago someone sent information about how to label photos
with voice over. I know you double tap and hold to bring up the text field,
but can't remember the exact steps. Could someone help refresh my old
memory, please? Do you have to be in the photo before you label? Thanks
Hi, all. Several weeks ago someone told us about the app doc scan which was
free for the day. Has anyone had success using this one? I can't figure it
out. Thanks in advance for any help.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
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I think I have the same app. It's called I emergency plus. The plus is
written as the plus sign from the more symbols keyboard and the whole thing
is written with no spaces. There's a way to get it as wall paper on the
phone, too. It's fully accessible. I don't remember the cost, but it
Hi. Does anyone know who would be the best person to contact concerning
accessibility of slacker? I like the app and would be happy to keep it.
Since they fixed it once, it's my hope that they will fix it again. Thanks
in advance.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
--
You received this message
I'm having a strange problem. I use MBraille for most of my keyboard work.
Starting last Wednesday or Thursday I have had difficulty sending a text
using MBraille. When I send a message in the usual way using the on-screen
keyboard the text sends, but when I send from within the MBraille app
Hi, all. Well, I realized why I couldn't paste from the MBraille app to an
email. In order to help solve the texting issue I uninstalled and
reinstalled MBraille. I didn't realize that I had to go back and also
reinstall the paid version. I did that and all works fine. So far the
texting
Hi, Just a quick question. Should one delete emails from the all mail
folder from time to time? Mine has about 250 emails in it as of right now.
Just wondering. Thanks.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
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To search
Several people on this list have mentioned a weather radio app that allows
alerts to be set up. I saw 2 weather radio apps in the app store. One was
the NOAA weather radio app that costs $4.95. Is this the one you're
referring to?
On a different topic, what are push notifications?
Hi. I'm having no luck with the NOAA weather radio app. The weather radio
station that is closest to where I live won't play. I double tap the city
name, then I swipe right to something that says zero percent adjustable,
adjust that to 100 percent and double tap the play button. Voice over
Hi, Kelly. I was looking for the same information. Below is what I found
while searching the applevis site. I can't remember who posted it or I'd
give them credit. I haven't gotten my iTunes receipt yet, so haven't tried
to get my refund.
Itunes refunds
To answer to your question. Yes,
I have installed tempo perfect. I haven't done much with it, but it seems
to be fully accessible.
God bless!'
Paula and Babe
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Richard Turner
Sent: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 12:20 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
I've found that talking tuner works reasonably well, especially in a quiet
room. I am able to tune my flute before church, though, and there is a fair
amount of talking in the background. It takes some patience to get
instruments exactly in tune using it though. I found it very helpful when
Hi, all. I just updated my 4 s phone to ios 6. When I go to the store and
tap on the updates button at the bottom of the screen, it says there are 4
updates, but I can't find them. I've flicked, up down and sideways, but
find nothing. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
God bless!
Paula
Kings corner and cards alone are both fun and fully accessible. I also like
iYacht which is a form of yatze. My spelling may be wrong on iYacht.
Anyway, hope you get the idea.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Kliphton
I always use Siri to schedule a reminder. It seems to work fine. I say:
set a reminder for ... date, time and subject of reminder and I've had no
problem. I haven't asked for a reminder for more than a day ahead though so
can't speak to that.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original
Hi, All. Pardon my ignorance, but what is the difference between the
farenheight weather app and the weather app that is already on the home
screen? Just curious.
Thanks, and thanks for all the help that comes our way through this list.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From:
Hi, Steve and all who are interested in HAM radio. Are there other apps out
there for hams?
Thanks.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
_
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Steve
Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2012 2:35 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com;
Hi, Grant. Does your app scan and beep? If it does, perhaps you're holding
the bill and the phone too close together. That's something I've learned by
experience. I hold the bill flat in my left hand about 8 or so inches from
the phone which I'm holding camera lense down in my right hand. Hope
I have my iPhone through Verizon and I'm in Cincinnati, Ohio. I've heard
other people say vVerizon in their area doesn't support iPhones. Very
curious!
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of dan thompson
Just for your information. Verizon will provide Braille bills if you
request them.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Fred Olver
Sent: Tuesday, July 03, 2012 8:18 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
I just purchased touch target and can't find any instructions. I found the
letters and can move them up and down. I assume that you move the letters
down to make words, but can't figure out how to get a word accepted. This
does look like fun, though.
Thanks for the recommendation.
God bless!
I know this has been covered before, but we have a new computer and all my
archived material is not on it, so here's my simple question. I want to
unlock the orientation of my phone so I can try text detective. I went to
the app switcher, did a 3 finger flick to the right to get to page one, then
apps running,
Then go to the app switcher, do the three finger swipe right, and you should
find the unlock button in the lower left corner.
HTH,
Richard
_
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Paul and Paula Jordan
Sent: Saturday, July 21
Hi, There is an excellent pillow speaker I got from the C. Crane Company.
Their phone number is: 1-800-522-8863. The speaker is about as big around
as a 50 cent piece and maybe 3/4 inch thick. It comes with a soft plush
foam cover which I promptly took off. It's incredibly durable and has good
: Paul and Paula Jordan pau...@roadrunner.com
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2012 3:56 PM
Subject: RE: Pillow Speaker for the I4S?
Hi, There is an excellent pillow speaker I got from the C. Crane Company.
Their phone number is: 1-800-522-8863. The speaker is about as big
Hi, Just thought I'd let you all know that the app ten items is a very
simple to do list. It's helped keep my crazy life a little more organized
with very little effort on my part. Thanks to whoever recommended it. I
use it every day.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
--
You received this message
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: ten items, very helpful
hi, what for this app used for?
thanks in advance
Srikanth
On 8/4/12, Paul and Paula Jordan pau...@roadrunner.com wrote:
Hi, Just thought I'd let you all know that the app ten items is a very
simple to do list. It's helped keep my
Hi, all. I would like to remove addresses from my gmail address book. I put
them in when I first got the phone and they are incorrect. I have not added
them to my contact list, though, so don't know how to get rid of and correct
them. Also, When I send email to anyone at work the phone says
Hi, all. For those that use the shopshop app, is there a way to write a
list, then, at a later time, add more items to the same list. I think this
app may be very helpful, but I'm not doing well trying to figure it out and
have found no tutorials on it. Thanks in advance for any information.
Thanks, JoJo, that helps a lot. I've been playing with it off and on all
day and figured a little of it out, but you put me in the whole picture with
this email. Thanks again.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of JoJo and
Another couple of shopshop questions. After some of the buttons I hear
something about voice over and marks. Do you know what it says?
Second question, what is the plus button for? Once I get the iPhone
operator errors and misunderstandings dealt with I think I'm going to like
and use
Hi, The voice over hint I'm curious about says something like marks is not
gone. Anyone know what that means. I've made two different lists, a
shopping list for general stuff and a grocery list for, obviously,
groceries. A friend of mine and I go grocery shopping together and I'm
going to hand
Hi, I just downloaded the ViA app from the Braille institute. For some
reason I am unable to search any app categories. Has anyone used this app?
It looks like it might be helpful if I could get to the categories and look
around.
Thanks.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
--
You received this
Hi, I should know this, but I can't remember. How do I find the contact
information if I want to email someone off list. I'm running JAWS 13 and
windows 7. Thanks.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
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You received this message because you are subscribed to the VIPhone Google
Group.
To search the
This is the first time I've tried to purchase an app, and I'm having nothing
but frustration. I had to enter my password 3 different times, then was
asked for my credit card type. When I tried to double tap to check the
correct card type it still stayed unchecked no matter what I did. The first
I've downloaded smart record and it seems to have good recording quality. I
haven't tried recording for a length of time, so can't speak to that.
God bless!
Paula Jordan and Babe
_
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Hendrik Steyn
Sent:
I also wonder if there is a weather app that shows severe weather warnings.
Thanks.
God bless!
Paula Jordan and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Kristeen Hughes
Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2012 12:41 PM
To:
Can the chime be set withought downloading an app. I haven't seen a setting
for that anywhere. Thanks.
God bless!
Paula Jordan and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Wayne Merritt
Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2012 4:17 PM
To:
Hi. Probably a dumb question, but how would I know if I have the high
quality premium voice?
Just wondering. I've had none of the voice over voice stopping described,
but am still running ios5.
Thanks.
God bless!
Paula Jordan and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com
[mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of paul and paula jordan
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2012 6:06 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: iOS 5.1.1 is out Voiceover going silent bug
Hi. Probably a dumb question, but how would I know if I have the high
quality premium voice?
Just wondering. I've
Just wondering if anyone has had this experience. I can use serie 3 or 4
times in a row, then the next time I press the listen button it doesn't
sound the tone and serie doesn't respond. Just seems odd to me.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
_
From: viphone@googlegroups.com
Amy, could you please write me off list. I have some questions about
ordering a screen overlay. My email is pau...@roadrunner.com. Thanks.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Amy Billman
Sent:
I'm trying to figure out how to play stem stumper, and not having much luck.
Where can I go to get the information. Sorry, I'm not much into games, so
this is all new to me. Thanks.
God bless!
Paula and Babe
_
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
Hi, I just want to know if accessible fruitmachine is as hard as stem
stumper. That game's making me nuts! GRIN!
God bless!
Paula Jordan and Babe
_
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Ramy Moustafa
Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2012 3:06 PM
To:
Well, here I am again, having fun with games but being pretty clueless, too.
I'm having difficulty moving cards from one place to another in kings
corner. I know the suits are alternating and understand stacking from
larger down to smaller, but sometimes it seems like I should be able to
stack
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