date:20131106

[Vo]:Thorium being backed as a future fuel

2013-11-06 Thread Blaze Spinnaker

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-24638816

Nuclear scientists are being urged by the former UN weapons inspector Hans
Blix to develop thorium as a new fuel.

Mr Blix says that the radioactive element may prove much safer in reactors
than uranium.

Re: [Vo]:Thorium being backed as a future fuel

2013-11-06 Thread Blaze Spinnaker

'If thorium ever makes it as a commercial nuclear fuel, uranium may be seen
as a massive and costly diversion. Some supporters of thorium believe that
it was bypassed in the past because governments wanted the plutonium from
certain conventional reactors to make atomic bombs.

They believe thorium was rejected because it was simply too safe.'

That rings true, given the mentality of the cold war.


On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 3:25 AM, Blaze Spinnaker blazespinna...@gmail.comwrote:

 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-24638816

 Nuclear scientists are being urged by the former UN weapons inspector Hans
 Blix to develop thorium as a new fuel.

 Mr Blix says that the radioactive element may prove much safer in reactors
 than uranium.

RE: [Vo]:Incredible Gen3 paper

2013-11-06 Thread Jones Beene

One further point Lou. You wrote:

 I also wish that other spectral anomalies were observed - besides the
broadband soft X-ray/EUV apparently due to hydrogen, but I believe that
the 19.29 nm line is due to the oxidized cathode/anode surfaces -
oxygen contamination.


Yes - this line is close to a known emission/absorption line of
oxygen/ozone... which explains why the strongest solar UV is absorbed before
reaching the earth's surface - due to oxygen in the stratosphere. We would
not be here otherwise.

But several obvious facts make me think that most of energy represented by
this line (and the extreme spike in the charts) - will not be related to
oxidation of electrodes. (a small percentage could be related).

First - good experimenters are not that careless with their apparatus to
allow significant oxidation. Second is the large proportion of net energy
allocated to that line. Third is the fact that electrodes are generally
chosen and manufactured not oxidize. Fourth is the lack of expected signal
at the Rydberg level when all of that hydrogen is present. Fifth is that the
hydrogen in the experiment would reduce any electrode oxidation (clean the
electrode) so the net residual would be tiny. Sixth is cosmological- the
lack of oxygen on the sun despite the sun's strong 19.3 signal. Taken
together, this facts indicate that this line represents far more than a
relic of oxygen.

Our sun is a massive source of 19.3 nm UV, once the observer gets out of the
earth's atmosphere. Given that Hydrogen represents 91.2% of all atoms on the
sun and oxygen accounts for only 8 atoms per every 10,000 it is almost
unimaginable to me that the strong 19.3 nm line is due primarily to oxygen.
There must be another large source. (but again, oxygen could be partly
responsible - a few percent)

In the present RPF hypothesis, this line is mostly due to reversible P+P
fusion to 2He (the diproton) which immediately reverses back to two protons,
with QCD supplying the UV photon release and more. Indeed, several other UV
and soft x-ray lines may result from RPF and QCD interaction. 

So the solar model is a complicated situation - made even more complicated
by the fact that solar RPF reactions could be balanced between exotherm and
endotherm. (the internal UV photons are absorbed and not re-emitted)

Thus the net energy released from the sun may not be augmented to a large
degree - by energy represent in this UV line, or more likely - slightly
augmented.

Jones

RE: [Vo]:Incredible Gen3 paper

2013-11-06 Thread Jones Beene

In re-reading this thread, one other factor is worth mentioning wrt the
oxygen connection to LENR. It does tie the Gen3 paper to Randell Mills via
the Rydberg levels of hydrogen AND oxygen (when aligned and slightly
unbalanced on the high side).

It could easily be true that oxygen is desirable for promoting LENR, whether
through contamination on not, and the emphasis should have been placed on
Rydberg and its proximity in the sense of promoting a limited chain
reaction. Oxygen (or O++) both have a beneficial energy hole at an exact
Rydberg level of ionization potential - so as to make them ideal Mills'
catalysts; and now we find that there could also be this coincidental
relationship of UV resonance at a slightly more energetic ~ 19-20 nm. This
photon would naturally downshift to 22.8 nm in the process of ionization of
neutral catalysts - and that may be why the variance is need not be
explained as being important. In fact, it may be beneficial !!

IOW - for those who do not follow Mills' complex theory, the need for oxygen
would be twofold - not only is it catalytic for ground state redundancy, BUT
if we want to find a valid hybrid of Mills' theory together with LENR and UV
resonance, then we now have the complete answer in the UV (being on the high
side of Rydberg). Mills' theory predicts fractional hydrogen - what are
essentially neutral protons (virtual neutrons) and when these get close
enough to each other - voila - we have RPF without the Coulomb problem ! 

RPR then releases the hotter UV photon which can create another catalytic
hole (when slightly downshifted) especially in oxygen preferentially. A
limited chain reaction, mediated by UV photons, is the result.

In short, this hybridized version provides a more complete picture than
Mills, especially since he depends on angular momentum of electrons as the
ultimate energy source. Bollocks. 

In fact there is no asymmetry to play with - since these electrons
necessarily gain that angular momentum back in the end. RPF is a much more
elegant source for the excess energy since it is true QCD conversion of
mass-to-energy, without the need to explain where are all the hydrinos?.
In fact, they are none as they are immediately reinflated.

This hypothesis also provides a limited kind of chain reaction in three
stages instead of two. Since the UV photon from RPF is more energetic than
required but +close+ to the correct value (wavelength is slightly shorter),
that photon can provide a higher probability of success for the next hole
formation which then makes the necessary fuel to continue the reaction. The
fuel is f/H (fractional hydrogen aka hydrino) but it re-inflates every
time and the reaction would be slightly endothermic without the RPF. 

This may seem like a too-fine distinction, at least to make the claim for a
substantial theoretical improvement over Mills; but it may be just that: a
hybrid which does exactly what CQM cannot do. Which is to explain everything
with fewer loose ends.


One further point Lou. You wrote:

 I also wish that other spectral anomalies were observed - besides the
broadband soft X-ray/EUV apparently due to hydrogen, but I believe that
the 19.29 nm line is due to the oxidized cathode/anode surfaces -
oxygen contamination.


Yes - this line is close to a known emission/absorption line of
oxygen/ozone... which explains why the strongest solar UV is absorbed before
reaching the earth's surface - due to oxygen in the stratosphere. We would
not be here otherwise.

But several obvious facts make me think that most of energy represented by
this line (and the extreme spike in the charts) - will not be related to
oxidation of electrodes. (a small percentage could be related).

First - good experimenters are not that careless with their apparatus to
allow significant oxidation. Second is the large proportion of net energy
allocated to that line. Third is the fact that electrodes are generally
chosen and manufactured not oxidize. Fourth is the lack of expected signal
at the Rydberg level when all of that hydrogen is present. Fifth is that the
hydrogen in the experiment would reduce any electrode oxidation (clean the
electrode) so the net residual would be tiny. Sixth is cosmological- the
lack of oxygen on the sun despite the sun's strong 19.3 signal. Taken
together, this facts indicate that this line represents far more than a
relic of oxygen.

Our sun is a massive source of 19.3 nm UV, once the observer gets out of the
earth's atmosphere. Given that Hydrogen represents 91.2% of all atoms on the
sun and oxygen accounts for only 8 atoms per every 10,000 it is almost
unimaginable to me that the strong 19.3 nm line is due primarily to oxygen.
There must be another large source. (but again, oxygen could be partly
responsible - a few percent)

In the present RPF hypothesis, this line is mostly due to reversible P+P
fusion to 2He (the diproton) which immediately reverses back to two protons,
with QCD supplying the UV photon release and

[Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014)

2013-11-06 Thread Alan Fletcher

Don't hold your breath :

Andrea Rossi
November 5th, 2013 at 7:25 AM

Marco Serra:
Thank you for your attention, I sympathize with you. I do not know when we will 
publish, because it does not depend on me, but surely within 2014. I dare to 
foresee before August/September.
But this is not an engagement.
Warm Regards,
A.R.

Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014)

2013-11-06 Thread Alan Fletcher

ps : Mark Gibbs and I get his seal of approval --

Frank Acland
November 5th, 2013 at 6:30 PM

Dear Andrea,

Is this the Ragone diagram you stand by?
http://b-i.forbesimg.com/markgibbs/files/2013/05/130520_ragone_04-1024×624.png
Best wishes,

Frank Acland


Andrea Rossi
November 5th, 2013 at 8:06 PM

Frank Acland:
Yes,
Warm Regards,
A.R.

Re: [Vo]:Incredible Gen3 paper

2013-11-06 Thread Jeff Driscoll


 RPR then releases the hotter UV photon which can create another catalytic
 hole (when slightly downshifted) especially in oxygen preferentially. A
 limited chain reaction, mediated by UV photons, is the result.

 In short, this hybridized version provides a more complete picture than
 Mills, especially since he depends on angular momentum of electrons as
 the
 ultimate energy source. Bollocks.


According to Mills's theory:
The energy comes from the potential energy of the electron relative to the
proton - electron drops down to a lower fractional orbit (fractional
principal quantum number) and the energy comes from this change in
potential energy.  Energy released takes the form of:
1.  kinetic energy transferred to another hydrogen, or ionization of an
electron or breaking of chemical bonds
2. continuum radiation as the electron spirals down to the next stable
fractional orbit.  This spiral has a non-constant orbit frequency and gives
continuum radiation.

The electron has 1 unity of angular momentum at all orbit states (principal
quantum numbers), including at n = 1, the ground state.  Conservation of
angular momentum is always seen in all energy releases.

Continuum energy is seen in the experiment that matches his theory.  The
19.3 nm oxygen line is in both the control experiment (He) and the active
experiment (H2+He).

My guess is that it is very hard to eliminate all the oxygen from a surface
- plus they may not have a reason to eliminate it.

Jeff

[Vo]:Suzuki's ominous warning on Fukushima

2013-11-06 Thread pagnucco

David Suzuki issues ominous warning for damaged Fukushima plant

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/daily-buzz/david-suzuki-issues-ominous-warning-damaged-fukushima-plant-195522191.html

David Suzuki has issued an ominous warning about the state of Fukushima's
nuclear power plant.

Fukushima is the most terrifying situation I can imagine, the
environmental activist and host of the Nature of Things said last week at
the University of Alberta's symposium Letting in the Light: Science to
Guide Public Water Policy in the 21st Century.

Three out of the four plants were destroyed in the earthquake and in the
tsunami. The fourth one has been so badly damaged that the fear is, if
there's another earthquake of a seven or above that, that building will go
and then all hell breaks loose. And the probably of a seven or above
earthquake in the next three years is over 95 per cent, Suzuki said.

He added that a recent study found another earthquake could require
evacuation of the entire North American coast  and as for Japan  bye
bye, Suzuki said.

RE: [Vo]:Incredible Gen3 paper

2013-11-06 Thread pagnucco

Jones,

I will be delighted if your, or any LENR, theory is proved.

Hopefully, the experiments will be improved and repeated to the point
where 'The Establishment' cannot ignore them - if this is possible.

-- Lou Pagnucco

Jones Beene wrote:
 In re-reading this thread, one other factor is worth mentioning wrt the
 oxygen connection to LENR. It does tie the Gen3 paper to Randell Mills
 via
 the Rydberg levels of hydrogen AND oxygen (when aligned and slightly
 unbalanced on the high side).

 It could easily be true that oxygen is desirable for promoting LENR,
 whether
 through contamination on not, and the emphasis should have been placed on
 Rydberg and its proximity in the sense of promoting a limited chain
 reaction. Oxygen (or O++) both have a beneficial energy hole at an exact
 Rydberg level of ionization potential - so as to make them ideal Mills'
 catalysts; and now we find that there could also be this coincidental
 relationship of UV resonance at a slightly more energetic ~ 19-20 nm. This
 photon would naturally downshift to 22.8 nm in the process of ionization
 of
 neutral catalysts - and that may be why the variance is need not be
 explained as being important. In fact, it may be beneficial !!

 IOW - for those who do not follow Mills' complex theory, the need for
 oxygen
 would be twofold - not only is it catalytic for ground state redundancy,
 BUT
 [...]

Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014)

2013-11-06 Thread fznidarsic

and how long has it been since the 1 MW October test?  Two years!

-Original Message-
From: Alan Fletcher a...@well.com
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wed, Nov 6, 2013 12:11 pm
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014)

ps : Mark Gibbs and I get his seal of approval --

Frank Acland
November 5th, 2013 at 6:30 PM

Dear Andrea,

Is this the Ragone diagram you stand by?
http://b-i.forbesimg.com/markgibbs/files/2013/05/130520_ragone_04-1024×624.png
Best wishes,

Frank Acland

Andrea Rossi
November 5th, 2013 at 8:06 PM

Frank Acland:
Yes,
Warm Regards,
A.R.

Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014)

2013-11-06 Thread Rob Dingemans


Dear Alan,

On 6-11-2013 18:11, Alan Fletcher wrote:

Is this the Ragone diagram you stand by?
http://b-i.forbesimg.com/markgibbs/files/2013/05/130520_ragone_04-1024×624.png


I'm afraid the file is not there anymore, as I get an 404 error.

Kind regards,

Rob

Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014)

2013-11-06 Thread Frank Acland

I think this is the same image:

http://cdn.physorg.com/newman/gfx/news/hires/2013/rossitests2.jpg


On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 2:25 PM, Rob Dingemans manonbrid...@aim.com wrote:

 Dear Alan,


 On 6-11-2013 18:11, Alan Fletcher wrote:

 Is this the Ragone diagram you stand by?
 http://b-i.forbesimg.com/markgibbs/files/2013/05/130520_ragone_04-1024
 ×624.png


 I'm afraid the file is not there anymore, as I get an 404 error.

 Kind regards,

 Rob




-- 
Frank Acland
Publisher, E-Cat World http://www.e-catworld.com

Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014)

2013-11-06 Thread Alan Fletcher

- Original Message -

From: Frank Acland ecatwo...@gmail.com 
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com 
Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 12:41:09 PM 
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014) 

I think this is the same image: 

http://cdn.physorg.com/newman/gfx/news/hires/2013/rossitests2.jpg 

Stolen -- With all the attributions cropped off. 

It's funny -- I pulled up the Forbes image this morning ! 

Still there : 

http://b-i.forbesimg.com/markgibbs/files/2013/05/130520_ragone_04-1024x624.png 

I think that the URL got truncated when I copied the Rossi post into email.

Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014)

2013-11-06 Thread Alan Fletcher

The new customer is still a mystery (invited visits and all that). 

This is actually two tests 

a) Presumably Levi et al 
b) An internal test. 1MW? Hotcat? Something new? 

- Original Message -

From: fznidar...@aol.com 
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com 
Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 12:12:55 PM 
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014) 

and how long has it been since the 1 MW October test? Two years!

Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014)

2013-11-06 Thread James Bowery

So what are the in process evaluations currently?

There was talk of something like an Underwriters Laboratories certification
going on.
There was talk of the original 1MW plant undergoing evaluation.
Are there others?

What is the hold-up on manufacturing?


On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 11:10 AM, Alan Fletcher a...@well.com wrote:

 Don't hold your breath :

 Andrea Rossi
 November 5th, 2013 at 7:25 AM

 Marco Serra:
 Thank you for your attention, I sympathize with you. I do not know when we
 will publish, because it does not depend on me, but surely within 2014. I
 dare to foresee before August/September.
 But this is not an engagement.
 Warm Regards,
 A.R.

Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014)

2013-11-06 Thread Rob Dingemans


Alan,

On 6-11-2013 21:48, Alan Fletcher wrote:

It's funny -- I pulled up the Forbes image this morning !

Still there :

http://b-i.forbesimg.com/markgibbs/files/2013/05/130520_ragone_04-1024x624.png



Yep I see, but there is a slight difference between those two:
The one that works has an x in between while the original has %C3%97 
at the same spot, which doesn't work.


I think that the URL got truncated when I copied the Rossi post into 
email.


Most likely a conversion error.
As you may see the the original link has a very small space followed by 
an x which is a bit lifted from the baseline!


Kind regards,

Rob

Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014)

2013-11-06 Thread Alan Fletcher

I went back to the article : 
http://phys.org/news/2013-05-rossi-e-cat-energy-density-higher.html 

Originally, they just cropped the photo, removing my credits, with a short 
caption. I left a nasty comment. 

I just checked back and they've filled in the caption: 

Ragone plot of the energy density and power density of various sources. The 
plot has been expanded to show conservative estimates of the E-Cat from the 
March tests, as well as known values of Pu-238. Credit: Prepared for Forbes by 
Alan Fletcher based on the original figure by Ahmed F. Ghoniem. Needs, 
resources and climate change: clean and efficient conversion technologies, 
Progress in Energy and Combustion Science 37 (2011), 15-51, fig. 38 

So I guess honor is satisfied !!! 

(Although I prefer leaving the credits on the image, because they tend to get 
copied and separated.) 

From: Frank Acland ecatwo...@gmail.com 
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com 
Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2013 12:41:09 PM 
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rossi Long-term test : LONG WAIT (Aug/Sep 2014) 

I think this is the same image: 

http://cdn.physorg.com/newman/gfx/news/hires/2013/rossitests2.jpg 

Stolen -- With all the attributions cropped off.

[Vo]:The many worlds outlook.

2013-11-06 Thread Axil Axil

The world of the fish is different from the world of the bird. The world of
water is different from the world of air. If we measure pressure in air, it
will read differently from a pressure reading in water.

Each phase of matter is another world that we must understand. When one
views the world as a whole and does not make allowances for the differences
between the phases of matter, then confusion abounds.

Mills has made the ‘only one world mistake’. There are at least 500
different phases of matter, Each phase lives its own world. To understand
that particular world, one must study it in its own context.

*(Phys.org)—Forget solid, liquid, and gas: there are in fact more than 500
phases of matter. In a major paper in today's issue of Science, Perimeter
Faculty member Xiao-Gang Wen reveals a modern reclassification of all of
them. Using modern mathematics, Wen and collaborators reveal a new system
which can, at last, successfully classify symmetry-protected phases of
matter.*

*Their new classification system will provide insight about these quantum
phases of matter, which may in turn increase our ability to design states
of matter for use in superconductors or quantum computers. This paper,
titled, Symmetry-Protected Topological Orders in Interacting Bosonic
Systems, is a revealing look at the intricate and fascinating world of
quantum entanglement, and an important step toward a modern
reclassification of all phases of matter. *

*Read more at:
**http://phys.org/news/2012-12-**phases-phase.html#jCp*http://phys.org/news/2012-12-phases-phase.html#jCp

The world inside the Ni/H reactor is different than what we know here in
the “real world”. Like an open minded and adaptable intergalactic explorer,
in order to make sense of Ni/H reactions, one must study what is happening
in that world.

In like manor, the world of the Gen3 experiment is its own world with its
own phases of matter and with its own rules of the road.

Mixing these various worlds will lead to hopeless confusion. I think this
“there is only one world” outlook is the mistake that Mills has made.

RE: [Vo]:Incredible Gen3 paper

2013-11-06 Thread Jones Beene

Jeff,

Looks like you have been imbibing on the BLP kool-aid...
comments interspersed below...

Do you glow-in-the-dark, yet?  :-)


From: Jeff Driscoll 

JB: RPF then releases the hotter UV photon which can
create another catalytic
hole (when slightly downshifted) especially in oxygen
preferentially. A
limited chain reaction, mediated by UV photons, is the
result.

In short, this hybridized version provides a more complete
picture than
Mills, especially since he depends on angular momentum of
electrons as the
ultimate energy source. Bollocks.

JD: According to Mills' theory:
The energy comes from the potential energy of the electron
relative to the proton - electron drops down to a lower fractional orbit
(fractional principal quantum number) and the energy comes from this change
in potential energy.  

This is nonsense. There is no potential energy for any electron below ground
state unless it can find a stable orbit. Finding a stable orbit will require
substantial net energy input, which makes this part of the equation net
endothermic. There is no way around this problem.

Energy released takes the form of:

1.  kinetic energy transferred to another hydrogen, or
ionization of an electron or breaking of chemical bonds

There is no net energy released from the redundant ground state, without
more. 

Period. 

Again - going below ground state does happen routinely, but it is
endothermic. However, the Mills redundancy reaction can result in a neutral
particle with an electron in very close electron orbital - a virtual neutron
if you will. At a cost. 

THEN AND ONLY THEN can the endotherm be erased by the quark reaction which
is called the QCD color charge.

The finding of robust shrinkage below ground state is the limit of Mills'
actual contribution to the field, and it is brilliant up to a point - but as
for the rest of the continuum nonsense: BS - IMHO. 

Mills could not close the deal. He risks becoming a footnote to Rossi unless
he can produce the working public demo in a reasonable time frame.

2. continuum radiation as the electron spirals down to the
next stable fractional orbit.  

There is no stable orbit without energy input so there is no excess
radiation at all. This is precisely why you see from Mills this silly appeal
to a continuum instead of the (formerly) predicted lines. This continuum
business from Mills is a joke - really the last gasp of a dying theory.

This spiral has a non-constant orbit frequency and gives
continuum radiation.

Nonsense. This is an endothermic reaction. Continuum radiation is a
gigantic fail - a fabrication.

Continuum energy is seen in the experiment that matches his
theory.  

Bollocks. This is a complete fabrication by Mills LOL - and attempt to gloss
over the fact that the specific radiation predicted in the theory was found
to be absent - many years after predicted. Oops time for a theoretical
laxative. What you hear in the background is the sound of Mills old CQM
theory going down the continuum plumbing.

The 19.3 nm oxygen line is in both the control experiment
(He) and the active experiment (H2+He).

Of course it is!  There is an oxygen line in the control since, the oxide
layer cannot be reduced without hydrogen present. 

When H2 is added, the oxide layer is reduced, and the line which is slightly
shifted comes from the solar diproton reaction - the QCD rearrangement of
proton quarks - not from the oxygen layer which is now gone from the
electrode. Oxygen on any electrode cannot survive hot hydrogen bombardment.

My guess is that it is very hard to eliminate all the oxygen
from a surface - plus they may not have a reason to eliminate it. 
Not hard at all ! The Oxygen layer reduction would be routine and immediate.
You many need to check into a BLP abstinence program, Jeff. Mills theory may
be intoxicating at first, but on close inspection he is ultimately wrong
about the source of energy. There is no net energy via electron chemistry. 
IMO, the net energy from the endothermic shrinkage reaction to f/H which
is document can only derive from a nuclear reaction - the identity of which
is RPF in my estimation - reversible proton fusion. It could be another
reaction like the P-e-P reaction, but it is nuclear - not chemical.
RPF is the solar diproton reaction, but on earth it can be made net
exothermic which allows the endotherm of Mills redundancy to proceed apace
without the normal indicia of nuclear reactions. Only EUV would be seen as
evidence.
The reason we do not have a public device from Mills after 23 years and $80
million spent is obvious. He

[Vo]:MFMP detects GAMMA rays in LENR experiment!

2013-11-06 Thread Kevin O'Malley

*MFMP detects GAMMA rays in LENR
experiment*http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/backroom/3088346/posts
*Martin Fleischmann Memorial Project ^
http://www.freerepublic.com/%5Ehttp://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/en/follow/follow-2/347-gamma
* | 06 November 2013. | Robert Greenyer

*Well, to put it plain and simple - it would mean that we have a
incontrovertible demonstration of Low Energy Nuclear Reactions (LENR).*

http://www.freerepublic.com/%7Ekevmo/

Gamma

on 06 November 2013. The smoking gun of LENR?

On January the 14th 2011, Rossi and Focardi gave the first public
demonstration of the low temperature E-Cat to a personally invited group. A
short time afterwards, Francesco Celani, who was present at the
demonstration, sent a review for the event to New Energy Times.

Francesco Celani record of first public E-Cat demonstration in New Energy
Times

In this article, it is noted that Rossi and Focardi had a twin gamma ray
detector set up in order to detect e+e- annihilation that was expected by
Focardi based on previous experiments. The results from that set up were
not meaningful during the guests time in the room.

Bob Greenyer was keen to understand more about this event, so in the day
following ICCF-18, he quizzed Francesco on the matter. Here is a fresh
account of that event.

Francesco was sitting down with other scientists and guests waiting to be
called in for the demonstration, they were 7 – 8m away from E-Cat which was
behind a door in another room.

Francesco had 2 gamma detectors with him, 1 very cheap and 1 very expensive
battery operated 1.25” NaI(TI) detection range of 25keV to 2000 keV.

He notes that the background in Frascatti is normally around 120 because of
local geology, but in Bologna it is 60, Francesco Celani set the detectors
accordingly and the assembled group sat there patiently waiting.

Suddenly and for about 1 second, both detectors topped out 1000+ counts PER
SECOND and sounded their alarms (they could not show any more). Several of
the invited observers considered literally running from the building as it
was speculated that Rossi might be leveraging a radioactive source in his
experiment. Why such concern? Well, radiation falls off according to
Newtons 1/d^2 law as you can see here.

Plugging the minimum 1000 counts per second and 8 meters into the formula
would mean that 50cm from the E-Cat, the counts would be over a quarter
million per second - not good!

However, luckily the momentary signal collapsed and about two minutes
later, Rossi came into the waiting room to invite people in to see the
E-cat saying “the reaction has started”.

Francesco and the rest of the invited guests then went into the room where
the E-Cat was. Whilst in that room and using the NaI(TI) near the operating
reactor, there was a 50-100% count increase over background which was
erratic. Francesco decided to try and get a spectra from the detector, in
order to understand what might be going on and so he switched mode on the
detector. Rossi however saw what he was doing, got upset and Celani was
told to stop the measurements, which he did.

In addition, Celani said that he noted a number of gas cylinders in the
room – but that it would only be speculation to say what they were. If
E-Cats do indeed produce high gamma busts prepping for 'switch on' or
elevated emissions during operation, that might explain challenges in
getting domestic certification and the determination to keep below a fixed
cop and using staged cascades of small to big E-Cats to create larger
effective COPs.

Whatever happened that day, Francesco Celani started investigating surface
modified transition metals with hydrogen the following month. Inverse
Square Law

To help understand the inverse square law we made this little video.

Comparing the 1100 counts per minute at 2 cm from source in that video to
being 8m away, gives around 0.007 counts per minute - i.e. not meaningful
contribution to the 25 or so background. Hopefully this gives a sense of
why there was such excitement at the momentary signal in January 14, 2011.

Celani

After the end of ICCF-18 conference dinner, Bob found himself in a
conversation opposite Francesco Celani and a prominent government funded
scientist. Celani was told essentially that the levels of excess reported
were basically not significant enough to avoid being dismissed and that
what was needed as solid evidence of LENR was either transmutation or
particle/ray emission.

Francesco then said, that when he was testing his wire with Deuterium, he
got gamma emissions, the scientist asked if it was explored but Celani said
no because he was looking for excess heat and actually, that experiment
just produced a clear negative result. Martin Fleischmann Memorial Project
(MFMP)

For the MFMP, this year has largely been about differential experiments,
first the Steel and Glass, then the US dual cells and more recently, the
calibrated dual Celani cells in France. In this latter experiment, the
first of

Re: [Vo]:Incredible Gen3 paper

2013-11-06 Thread Jeff Driscoll

On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 7:04 PM, Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net wrote:

 Jeff,

 Looks like you have been imbibing on the BLP kool-aid...
 comments interspersed below...

 Do you glow-in-the-dark, yet?  :-)


 From: Jeff Driscoll

 JB: RPF then releases the hotter UV photon which can
 create another catalytic
 hole (when slightly downshifted) especially in oxygen
 preferentially. A
 limited chain reaction, mediated by UV photons, is the
 result.

 In short, this hybridized version provides a more complete
 picture than
 Mills, especially since he depends on angular momentum of
 electrons as the
 ultimate energy source. Bollocks.

 JD: According to Mills' theory:
 The energy comes from the potential energy of the electron
 relative to the proton - electron drops down to a lower fractional orbit
 (fractional principal quantum number) and the energy comes from this change
 in potential energy.

 This is nonsense. There is no potential energy for any electron below
 ground
 state unless it can find a stable orbit. Finding a stable orbit will
 require
 substantial net energy input, which makes this part of the equation net
 endothermic. There is no way around this problem.

 Energy released takes the form of:

 1.  kinetic energy transferred to another hydrogen, or
 ionization of an electron or breaking of chemical bonds

 There is no net energy released from the redundant ground state, without
 more.

 Period.


In Mills theory, the electron moves to an orbit that is closer to the
proton, this releases potential energy which is converted into kinetic,
bond breaking, ionization and continuum radiation.  There is no
mathematical reason this can't happen.  The only reason against it is that
it has not been seen previously in physics.  It is not endothermic (heat
absorbing), this is an exothermic (heat releasing) process.

Potential energy is only a function of the orbit radius, the lower the
electron drops (in orbit) the more energy is released.




 Again - going below ground state does happen routinely, but it is
 endothermic. However, the Mills redundancy reaction can result in a neutral
 particle with an electron in very close electron orbital - a virtual
 neutron
 if you will. At a cost.

 THEN AND ONLY THEN can the endotherm be erased by the quark reaction which
 is called the QCD color charge.

 The finding of robust shrinkage below ground state is the limit of Mills'
 actual contribution to the field, and it is brilliant up to a point - but
 as
 for the rest of the continuum nonsense: BS - IMHO.

 Mills could not close the deal. He risks becoming a footnote to Rossi
 unless
 he can produce the working public demo in a reasonable time frame.

 2. continuum radiation as the electron spirals down to the
 next stable fractional orbit.

 There is no stable orbit without energy input so there is no excess
 radiation at all. This is precisely why you see from Mills this silly
 appeal
 to a continuum instead of the (formerly) predicted lines. This
 continuum
 business from Mills is a joke - really the last gasp of a dying theory.

 This spiral has a non-constant orbit frequency and gives
 continuum radiation.

 Nonsense. This is an endothermic reaction. Continuum radiation is a
 gigantic fail - a fabrication.

 Continuum energy is seen in the experiment that matches his
 theory.

 Bollocks. This is a complete fabrication by Mills LOL - and attempt to
 gloss
 over the fact that the specific radiation predicted in the theory was found
 to be absent - many years after predicted. Oops time for a theoretical
 laxative. What you hear in the background is the sound of Mills old CQM
 theory going down the continuum plumbing.



The specific radiation that is predicted is continuum radiation and that is
what BLP shows in their experiments.





 The 19.3 nm oxygen line is in both the control experiment
 (He) and the active experiment (H2+He).

 Of course it is!  There is an oxygen line in the control since, the oxide
 layer cannot be reduced without hydrogen present.

 When H2 is added, the oxide layer is reduced, and the line which is
 slightly
 shifted comes from the solar diproton reaction - the QCD rearrangement of
 proton quarks - not from the oxygen layer which is now gone from the
 electrode. Oxygen on any electrode cannot survive hot hydrogen bombardment.

 My guess is that it is very hard to eliminate all the
 oxygen
 from a surface - plus they may not have a reason to eliminate it.
 Not hard at all ! The Oxygen layer reduction would be routine and
 immediate.
 You many need to check into a BLP abstinence program, Jeff. Mills theory
 may
 be intoxicating at first, but on close inspection he is ultimately wrong

Re: [Vo]:MFMP detects GAMMA rays in LENR experiment!

2013-11-06 Thread James Bowery

The title of the FR post is (annoyingly) misleading.

The MFMP team is saying that they are excited about putting a more
sensitive gamma ray detector into operation -- not that it has, as of now,
detected unambiguous gamma rays.

On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 6:30 PM, Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.com wrote:

*Well, to put it plain and simple - it would mean that we have a
incontrovertible demonstration of Low Energy Nuclear Reactions (LENR).*

http://www.freerepublic.com/%7Ekevmo/

Gamma

on 06 November 2013. The smoking gun of LENR?

Francesco Celani record of first public E-Cat demonstration in New Energy
Times

Bob Greenyer was keen to understand more about this event, so in the day
following ICCF-18, he quizzed Francesco on the matter. Here is a fresh
account of that event.

Francesco was sitting down with other scientists and guests waiting to be
called in for the demonstration, they were 7 – 8m away from E-Cat which was
behind a door in another room.

Francesco had 2 gamma detectors with him, 1 very cheap and 1 very
expensive battery operated 1.25” NaI(TI) detection range of 25keV to 2000
keV.

He notes that the background in Frascatti is normally around 120 because
of local geology, but in Bologna it is 60, Francesco Celani set the
detectors accordingly and the assembled group sat there patiently waiting.

Suddenly and for about 1 second, both detectors topped out 1000+ counts
PER SECOND and sounded their alarms (they could not show any more). Several
of the invited observers considered literally running from the building as
it was speculated that Rossi might be leveraging a radioactive source in
his experiment. Why such concern? Well, radiation falls off according to
Newtons 1/d^2 law as you can see here.

Plugging the minimum 1000 counts per second and 8 meters into the formula
would mean that 50cm from the E-Cat, the counts would be over a quarter
million per second - not good!

However, luckily the momentary signal collapsed and about two minutes
later, Rossi came into the waiting room to invite people in to see the
E-cat saying “the reaction has started”.

Whatever happened that day, Francesco Celani started investigating surface
modified transition metals with hydrogen the following month. Inverse
Square Law

To help understand the inverse square law we made this little video.

Celani

Francesco then said, that when he was testing his wire with Deuterium, he
got gamma emissions, the scientist asked if it was explored but Celani said

Re: [Vo]:Face-Palm moment: Essen et al did it again! [Abd's open letter]

2013-11-06 Thread Kevin O'Malley

On Thu, Jun 27, 2013 at 3:44 PM, Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com wrote:

The pundit writes an article, which will trigger other articles, which --
perhaps in a matter of days -- may trigger an avalanche of interest. Public
opinion changes quickly in the Internet era.

***The MFMP finding Gamma Rays might be just that threshold event...

http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/en/follow/follow-2/347-gamma

Re: [Vo]:MFMP detects GAMMA rays in LENR experiment!

2013-11-06 Thread Kevin O'Malley

Good catch, James. I screwed up, misread the article. There's not much
doubt that Celani has observed gamma rays, but not MFMP.

On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 5:30 PM, James Bowery jabow...@gmail.com wrote:

The title of the FR post is (annoyingly) misleading.

The MFMP team is saying that they are excited about putting a more
sensitive gamma ray detector into operation -- not that it has, as of now,
detected unambiguous gamma rays.

On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 at 6:30 PM, Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.comwrote: