RE: [Vo]:Stationary Fresnel Array (Hybrid)

2008-05-05 Thread Michael Foster
--- On Sun, 5/4/08, Hoyt A. Stearns Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 From: Hoyt A. Stearns Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Subject: RE: [Vo]:Stationary Fresnel Array (Hybrid)
 To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
 Date: Sunday, May 4, 2008, 4:47 PM
 I don't know if this is relevant, but I'm reminded
 of what I thought was a
 clever design of a supermarket bar code reader, whereby
 they built the
 conventional spinning mirrors/optics system, then took a
 hologram of the
 system, and now just spin the laser illuminated hologram to
 scan the complex
 raster on the bar code.

Yes, it's relevant. It's relevant as an example of misapplication of 
technology. I was briefly involved in that one. These discs were made with 
dichromated gelatin, a wonderful but touchy and tempermental holographic 
recording medium, a medium for which I am incorrectly given credit for 
inventing in some books. These were eventually shown to be more expensive than 
the optics they replaced, and certainly more expensive than the simple 
oscillating scanner mirrors that replaced them.

I worked as a consultant about 25 years ago for a company that had a DOE 
contract to research holographic solar energy concentrators. The people who had 
the contract were just a group of scientists who were good at getting 
government contracts. They hadn't a clue how this might actually be done, and 
weren't about to tell the DOE representative who showed up periodically. 
Essentially, I did all the work and they would make sure I wasn't around when 
the DOE showed up.

Their basic idea was to make flat holographic reflectors with a virtual 
parabola. Again dichromated gelatin was used as the recording medium. There 
were to be three closely space foci, each a different spectral band, in other 
words, RGB. The purpose of this was to allow IR wavelenths pass through the 
holographic reflector to avoid heating three different photovoltaics, whose 
maximum efficiency would be at the three wavelengths.

I pointed out to these geniuses that it would be far cheaper to use fresnel 
lenses coupled with transmission blazed diffraction gratings to achieve the 
same result. They said not to mention anything about that, because they would 
lose their DOE funding. So I went ahead and did what they wanted and left. 

This part is the most fun. A month or two after I left, they called me in a 
panic, saying they suddenly couldn't duplicate my results. The reflective 
efficiency and wavelength separation had dropped dramatically. I told them 
their problem lay in the coating, which they initially didn't believe. To 
shorten a rather long and comical story, they had to pay me ten grand for three 
words, Make it thicker.  That was so sweet.

This whole enterprise was a lesson to me in how government contracts are funded 
and for what reasons. These guys spent millions on this boondoggle and they 
knew that's what it was.

M.


  

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Re: [Vo]:Stationary Fresnel Array (Hybrid)

2008-05-04 Thread Stephen A. Lawrence



Stephen A. Lawrence wrote:



Jones Beene wrote:

It is perhaps possible to provide a *stationary*
Fresnel array which has virtual tracking.

Imagine a fixed, stationary array of Fresnel lens and
underlying photocells, somewhat as in this image:

http://www.sinosolargroup.com/en/images/toushe33.JPG

... and, with such a panel sited on a south-facing
roof, exactly the same way as a normal fixed
solar-panel would be sited - except that this one is
requiring 500 time less area of actual photocells than
the normal array.

This site lists the advantage of 500:1 concentration:

http://www.emcore.com/solar_photovoltaics/terrestrial_concentrator_photovoltaic_arrays 



Needless to say, since Nanosolar gives only perhaps a
5-to-1 cost advantage with their printed cell, and it
is a far less-efficient cell, the comparative
advantages of any kind of concentrator array, in cost,
would be *huge* - except- for the one issue.
That issue being the need, added complexity and
aesthetics (for home use) which 2-axis tracking
demands.

Here is how to overcome most of that added (tracking
cost) and other issues, while still keep the solar
array fixed and stationary.
It is not a unique idea, as it has been suggested for
other uses, but it may be unique when it is combined
with a Fresnel concentrator, especially the kind of
Fresnel which itself is already combined with an
angled cone secondary. These are called
self-focusing but that is a misnomer. They are also
called non-imaging

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-imaging_optics
  

I'm not sure about this article.  Among other things it says:

Imaging optics can concentrate sunlight to, at most, the same flux 
found at the surface of the sun.


This is false as written; a lens of f/0.5 produces an image of the sun 
with flux equal to the flux at the surface of the sun, and a larger 
lens -- or shorter focal length -- produces a flux /larger/ than that 
at the surface of the sun.  There's something related and true which 
they may be trying to say, but the statement on the page, as written, 
is not correct.  This leads me to wonder how firmly grounded the rest 
of that particular article is.


Want to produce a spot that's brighter than the surface of the sun?  
No prob; you can get the materials from Edmund's catalog.  Maybe you 
can't build a classical glass lens with f/0.5 but there's no prob 
making a Fresnel lens to do the job.


If you can find a big Fresnel lens of f/0.5 you're all set.  (It's 
possible the refractive indices of available plastics don't allow such 
short f/number lenses; I haven't tried to work out the geometry of the 
lens surface which would be required.)  If you can't, you can make 
one; take three or four ordinary 12 square solar furnace-style 
Fresnel lenses (available from Edmund's, or at least they used to be) 
outside on a sunny day, stack them up in a sandwich (which cuts the 
focal length by a factor equal to the number of lenses in the 
sandwich), focus the sun, and voila, you've blown a hole in the 
concrete sidewalk.  (Or at any rate you can blow a small chip out of 
it; I've done it, using a single 12 square lens, never mind the 
stack.)  But don't look at the spot unless you're equipped with 
something appropriate, like welder's glasses; it is very bright indeed.


As I recall the basic solar furnace Edmund lens was not much over 
f/1 to start with, so four of the them stacked should be neatly under 
f/0.5.


To find the focal length of a stack of lenses, express their focal 
lengths in diopters and just add them up.  A 1 foot diameter circular 
lens with 18 focal length is an F/2 lens.


Er, rather, it's an 1/1.5 lens.

18 = 0.46 meters = 2.2 diopters.  Four of them, stacked, have a focal 
length of about 8.7 diopters, or 0.11 meters, or 4.5 inches.  For a 
12 diameter lens, that's f/0.38, and it should do the job.


A page I happen to have on image brightness:

http://physicsinsights.org/simple_camera_brightness_1.html

And here's a not-quite-airtight proof that you can't build a telescope 
which will make things look brighter when you look through it (sorry, 
you can never see things with your eyes the way they look in the 
Hubble photos, even if they let you go up on the shuttle and look in 
the eyepiece [if it had an eyepiece :-) ] ) :


http://physicsinsights.org/simple_optics_brightness_1.html


This type of optics has some added loss, but it seems
to provide a great deal more latitude than a normal
Fresnel. It will self-focus (in the patent claims at
least) within plus or minus 30 degrees of direct focus
(or better).
With an initial south facing placement, the use of
non-imaging optics will allow you to dispense with one
axis of tracking, just as with the parabolic trough;
but still requires the one axis for early morning and
late evening.
OK - the further enhancement is to implement this type
of limited self-focusing along with a mirrored-slat
louver array, which lays above the Fresnel array.
The mirrored slats are long, thin 

Re: [Vo]:Stationary Fresnel Array (Hybrid)

2008-05-04 Thread R C Macaulay

Howdy Jones,
I was surprised that no one picked up on my comment regarding sealed beam 
headlamps. The technology, the manufacturing process and the materials are 
available except for the element for use as a solar collector.


Richard