Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-09-24 Thread Gergely Kis
Hi,

Just wanted to note, that there is a working MIPS buildslave again:
http://build.webkit.org/buildslaves/mips-1

 It only does builds, no tests yet, we are working on that.

Thank you everyone for your help!

Unfortunately, the MIPS build is still red, because the following patch was
not yet accepted to trunk (we bounced off of the commit bot the first time
because the patch was malformed, but the current one should be fine now):
https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=97243

We also have a MIPS DFG and LLINT implementation which passes the JSC
testsuite and common benchmark suits (sunspider, v8). We are working on
cleaning them up for submission.

Best Regards,
Gergely

On Fri, Sep 14, 2012 at 3:01 AM, Gergely Kis gerg...@homejinni.com wrote:

 Hi,

 Submitted the patch for enabling the MIPS slave in build.webkit.org.

 https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=96713

 Who should I send the buildbot password for the slave?

 Thanks,
 Gergely


 On Thu, Aug 30, 2012 at 9:52 AM, Holger Freyther ze...@selfish.orgwrote:

 On 08/30/2012 12:10 AM, Gergely Kis wrote:

 
  Would this be acceptable for you?

 sure, an actively and publicly maintained MIPS build would be great. We
 have
 some documentation on how to setup a build slave in the wiki[1] and the
 slave
 configuration files are maintained in SVN[2]. The configuration file
 changes
 follow the normal WebKit contribution procedure.

 holger


 [1] http://trac.webkit.org/wiki/BuildBot
 [2]

 http://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/Tools/BuildSlaveSupport/build.webkit.org-config



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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-09-13 Thread Gergely Kis
Hi,

Submitted the patch for enabling the MIPS slave in build.webkit.org.

https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=96713

Who should I send the buildbot password for the slave?

Thanks,
Gergely

On Thu, Aug 30, 2012 at 9:52 AM, Holger Freyther ze...@selfish.org wrote:

 On 08/30/2012 12:10 AM, Gergely Kis wrote:

 
  Would this be acceptable for you?

 sure, an actively and publicly maintained MIPS build would be great. We
 have
 some documentation on how to setup a build slave in the wiki[1] and the
 slave
 configuration files are maintained in SVN[2]. The configuration file
 changes
 follow the normal WebKit contribution procedure.

 holger


 [1] http://trac.webkit.org/wiki/BuildBot
 [2]

 http://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/Tools/BuildSlaveSupport/build.webkit.org-config


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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-08-30 Thread Holger Freyther
On 08/30/2012 12:10 AM, Gergely Kis wrote:

 
 Would this be acceptable for you?

sure, an actively and publicly maintained MIPS build would be great. We have
some documentation on how to setup a build slave in the wiki[1] and the slave
configuration files are maintained in SVN[2]. The configuration file changes
follow the normal WebKit contribution procedure.

holger


[1] http://trac.webkit.org/wiki/BuildBot
[2]
http://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/Tools/BuildSlaveSupport/build.webkit.org-config

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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-08-29 Thread Osztrogonac Csaba

Hi All,

I'd like to inquire about the future of MIPS and SH4 assemblers.

A long time ago we had buildbots for MIPS and SH4 platforms (hosted by Holger).
But their last builds were at 29th June, machine were stopped, bots were removed
from build.webkit.org (2 months before!).  Is there anyone interested in 
maintaining
MIPS and SH4 buildbots (and probably EWS bots) to catch build failures early?

Gábor is working on fixing https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=79040 and it
seems the fix will affect all assemblers. But I don't think if it is a good idea
to try to fix MIPS and SH4 assemblers blindly without EWS and buildbots. And who
knows if MIPS and SH4 builds work now or not?

br,
Ossy

Filip Pizlo írta:

Hi all,

We are actively trying to improve the WebKit JavaScript engine 
(JavaScriptCore), with new debugging, profiling, memory efficiency, and 
performance features.  Because JavaScriptCore is a JIT-based engine, this 
inevitably means doing JIT work, which in turn includes adding new instructions 
to the JIT assemblers and changing the API between the assemblers and the JIT.

Currently, the maintenance situation in the assembler layer is not great.  We 
have three well-supported assemblers, X86-32, X86-64, and ARMv7. Then we have 
three assemblers that appear to be on life support: legacy (non-THUMB2, pre-v7) 
ARM, SH4, and MIPS.  It is increasingly painful to maintain these three 
barely-supported assemblers.  None of these assemblers has been updated to 
support the new JIT or interpreter infrastructure, and there appears to be no 
ongoing effort to do so.  That means that for progress to be made on X86 and 
ARMv7, we need to increasingly scatter #if ENABLE(...) noise throughout the 
system to keep those other assemblers building.  Neither the active 
JavaScriptCore contributors, nor those running the bots for those hardware 
platforms, appear to have much interest in maintaining those assemblers, other 
than the occasional build fix.

This is not a good situation to be in.

So, I am curious: is anyone shipping with the legacy ARM assembler, the MIPS 
assembler, or the SH4 assembler?

As a secondary question, if you are shipping the legacy ARM assembler, are you 
doing so because you have legacy ARM hardware or because you have not had the 
chance to switch to the new ARM assembler in your codebase?

-Filip

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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-08-29 Thread Gergely Kis
Hi All,

We are working on updating WebKit MIPS support. In particular we have a
work in progress LLINT and DFG implementation for MIPS.

We already have results (mozilla testsuite, sunspider and v8 benchmarks run
reasonably well), but there are still some bugs that need to be fixed
before we can submit this work.

Regarding https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=79040, feel free to
contact us if you need help with the MIPS specific bits.

Regarding the MIPS buildbots: I will check internally if we can host a MIPS
build slave (possibly including different boards) for the webkit project,
and get back to you.

Best Regards,
Gergely

On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 12:35 PM, Osztrogonac Csaba o...@inf.u-szeged.huwrote:

 Hi All,

 I'd like to inquire about the future of MIPS and SH4 assemblers.

 A long time ago we had buildbots for MIPS and SH4 platforms (hosted by
 Holger).
 But their last builds were at 29th June, machine were stopped, bots were
 removed
 from build.webkit.org (2 months before!).  Is there anyone interested in
 maintaining
 MIPS and SH4 buildbots (and probably EWS bots) to catch build failures
 early?

 Gábor is working on fixing 
 https://bugs.webkit.org/show_**bug.cgi?id=79040https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=79040and
  it
 seems the fix will affect all assemblers. But I don't think if it is a
 good idea
 to try to fix MIPS and SH4 assemblers blindly without EWS and buildbots.
 And who
 knows if MIPS and SH4 builds work now or not?

 br,
 Ossy

 Filip Pizlo írta:

 Hi all,

 We are actively trying to improve the WebKit JavaScript engine
 (JavaScriptCore), with new debugging, profiling, memory efficiency, and
 performance features.  Because JavaScriptCore is a JIT-based engine, this
 inevitably means doing JIT work, which in turn includes adding new
 instructions to the JIT assemblers and changing the API between the
 assemblers and the JIT.

 Currently, the maintenance situation in the assembler layer is not great.
  We have three well-supported assemblers, X86-32, X86-64, and ARMv7. Then
 we have three assemblers that appear to be on life support: legacy
 (non-THUMB2, pre-v7) ARM, SH4, and MIPS.  It is increasingly painful to
 maintain these three barely-supported assemblers.  None of these assemblers
 has been updated to support the new JIT or interpreter infrastructure, and
 there appears to be no ongoing effort to do so.  That means that for
 progress to be made on X86 and ARMv7, we need to increasingly scatter #if
 ENABLE(...) noise throughout the system to keep those other assemblers
 building.  Neither the active JavaScriptCore contributors, nor those
 running the bots for those hardware platforms, appear to have much interest
 in maintaining those assemblers, other than the occasional build fix.

 This is not a good situation to be in.

 So, I am curious: is anyone shipping with the legacy ARM assembler, the
 MIPS assembler, or the SH4 assembler?

 As a secondary question, if you are shipping the legacy ARM assembler,
 are you doing so because you have legacy ARM hardware or because you have
 not had the chance to switch to the new ARM assembler in your codebase?

 -Filip

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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-08-29 Thread Fu, Chao-Ying
Hi All,

  Before a MIPS buildbot is ready, you can go ahead to change the assembler or 
any parts of code.  We (MIPS) will test new code and submit patches that are 
required to fix the MIPS JSC build.  Don't need to worry about breaking the 
MIPS build.  (I have a cron job that checks out code and builds JSC on a native 
MIPS Linux every night.)  This is the current process that we use, I think.  
Thanks a lot!

Regards,
Chao-ying


 -Original Message-
 From: Osztrogonac Csaba [mailto:o...@inf.u-szeged.hu] 
 Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 3:35 AM
 To: WebKit Development
 Cc: Holger Hans Peter Freyther; Frederic Lepied; Fu, 
 Chao-Ying; Thouraya ANDOLSI
 Subject: Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM 
 assemblers in JavaScriptCore
 
 Hi All,
 
 I'd like to inquire about the future of MIPS and SH4 assemblers.
 
 A long time ago we had buildbots for MIPS and SH4 platforms 
 (hosted by Holger).
 But their last builds were at 29th June, machine were 
 stopped, bots were removed
 from build.webkit.org (2 months before!).  Is there anyone 
 interested in maintaining
 MIPS and SH4 buildbots (and probably EWS bots) to catch build 
 failures early?
 
 Gábor is working on fixing 
 https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=79040 and it
 seems the fix will affect all assemblers. But I don't think 
 if it is a good idea
 to try to fix MIPS and SH4 assemblers blindly without EWS and 
 buildbots. And who
 knows if MIPS and SH4 builds work now or not?
 
 br,
 Ossy
 
 Filip Pizlo írta:
  Hi all,
  
  We are actively trying to improve the WebKit JavaScript 
 engine (JavaScriptCore), with new debugging, profiling, 
 memory efficiency, and performance features.  Because 
 JavaScriptCore is a JIT-based engine, this inevitably means 
 doing JIT work, which in turn includes adding new 
 instructions to the JIT assemblers and changing the API 
 between the assemblers and the JIT.
  
  Currently, the maintenance situation in the assembler layer 
 is not great.  We have three well-supported assemblers, 
 X86-32, X86-64, and ARMv7. Then we have three assemblers that 
 appear to be on life support: legacy (non-THUMB2, pre-v7) 
 ARM, SH4, and MIPS.  It is increasingly painful to maintain 
 these three barely-supported assemblers.  None of these 
 assemblers has been updated to support the new JIT or 
 interpreter infrastructure, and there appears to be no 
 ongoing effort to do so.  That means that for progress to be 
 made on X86 and ARMv7, we need to increasingly scatter #if 
 ENABLE(...) noise throughout the system to keep those other 
 assemblers building.  Neither the active JavaScriptCore 
 contributors, nor those running the bots for those hardware 
 platforms, appear to have much interest in maintaining those 
 assemblers, other than the occasional build fix.
  
  This is not a good situation to be in.
  
  So, I am curious: is anyone shipping with the legacy ARM 
 assembler, the MIPS assembler, or the SH4 assembler?
  
  As a secondary question, if you are shipping the legacy ARM 
 assembler, are you doing so because you have legacy ARM 
 hardware or because you have not had the chance to switch to 
 the new ARM assembler in your codebase?
  
  -Filip
 
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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-08-29 Thread Holger Hans Peter Freyther
On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 12:35:04PM +0200, Osztrogonac Csaba wrote:
 Hi All,

Hi,

my two cents. I failed to engage companies building/using the respective
architectures and I think the best way forward is to remove them. I am
happy to prepare a patch for that.

holger

PS: Using the proper sender address for webkit-dev
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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-08-29 Thread Fu, Chao-Ying
Hi Holger,

  We happily and actively maintain the MIPS port for JSC, and will set up new 
MIPS buildbot soon.
If there are other things that we can help, please let us know.  Thanks a lot!

Regards,
Chao-ying

 -Original Message-
 From: Holger Hans Peter Freyther [mailto:ze...@selfish.org] 
 Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 12:56 PM
 To: Osztrogonac Csaba
 Cc: WebKit Development; Frederic Lepied; Fu, Chao-Ying; 
 Thouraya ANDOLSI
 Subject: Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM 
 assemblers in JavaScriptCore
 
 On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 12:35:04PM +0200, Osztrogonac Csaba wrote:
  Hi All,
 
 Hi,
 
 my two cents. I failed to engage companies building/using the 
 respective
 architectures and I think the best way forward is to remove them. I am
 happy to prepare a patch for that.
 
 holger
 
 PS: Using the proper sender address for webkit-dev
 
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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-08-29 Thread Holger Hans Peter Freyther
On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 05:58:10PM +, Fu, Chao-Ying wrote:
 Hi All,
 
   Before a MIPS buildbot is ready, you can go ahead to change the assembler 
 or any parts of code.  We (MIPS) will test new code and submit patches that 
 are required to fix the MIPS JSC build.  Don't need to worry about breaking 
 the MIPS build.  (I have a cron job that checks out code and builds JSC on a 
 native MIPS Linux every night.)  This is the current process that we use, I 
 think.  Thanks a lot!

Hi,

more pennies. That is not how the other stakeholders develop inside the
WebKit project. There is little to no value for this community if you
test behind closed doors. E.g. how can members of this community know that
a lack of communication is the lack of issues and not you being reassigned
to something else?

holger
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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-08-29 Thread Fu, Chao-Ying
 On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 05:58:10PM +, Fu, Chao-Ying wrote:
  Hi All,
  
Before a MIPS buildbot is ready, you can go ahead to 
 change the assembler or any parts of code.  We (MIPS) will 
 test new code and submit patches that are required to fix the 
 MIPS JSC build.  Don't need to worry about breaking the MIPS 
 build.  (I have a cron job that checks out code and builds 
 JSC on a native MIPS Linux every night.)  This is the current 
 process that we use, I think.  Thanks a lot!
 
 Hi,
 
 more pennies. That is not how the other stakeholders develop 
 inside the
 WebKit project. There is little to no value for this community if you
 test behind closed doors. E.g. how can members of this 
 community know that
 a lack of communication is the lack of issues and not you 
 being reassigned
 to something else?
 
 holger

  Sure.  Will having new MIPS buildbot help to solve this concern?
If yes, then you should not worry because we promise to help on buildbot.
Thanks!

Regards,
Chao-ying
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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-08-29 Thread Gergely Kis
 On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 11:34 PM, Fu, Chao-Ying f...@mips.com wrote:

  On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 05:58:10PM +, Fu, Chao-Ying wrote:
   Hi All,
  
 Before a MIPS buildbot is ready, you can go ahead to
  change the assembler or any parts of code.  We (MIPS) will
  test new code and submit patches that are required to fix the
  MIPS JSC build.  Don't need to worry about breaking the MIPS
  build.  (I have a cron job that checks out code and builds
  JSC on a native MIPS Linux every night.)  This is the current
  process that we use, I think.  Thanks a lot!
 
  Hi,
 
  more pennies. That is not how the other stakeholders develop
  inside the
  WebKit project. There is little to no value for this community if you
  test behind closed doors. E.g. how can members of this
  community know that
  a lack of communication is the lack of issues and not you
  being reassigned
  to something else?
 
  holger

   Sure.  Will having new MIPS buildbot help to solve this concern?
 If yes, then you should not worry because we promise to help on buildbot.
 Thanks!

 Regards,
 Chao-ying


Hi Holger,

We are working together with MIPS to update and maintain the MIPS port of
Webkit. We are setting up a buildbot slave to be integrated with
build.webkit.org. First, it will use qemu emulation to run the on-target
tests. However, this is only a temporary measure until we get at least one
board dedicated to this purpose, then our slave will also execute tests on
actual hardware.

It is our current plan to have the initial qemu-only slave set up by next
week. Should we contact you directly or someone else to get the slave
integrated with build.webkit.org?

Would this be acceptable for you?

Best Regards,
Gergely
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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-07-03 Thread Zoltan Herczeg
The ARM support for DFG-JIT is finished, and the patch is ready to review
at bug 90198.

Regards,
Zoltan

 On the topic of JIT support, the baseline JIT's role is increasingly only
 to serve only to gather profiling data for the DFG JIT, and if you want
 high performance JavaScript on your platform you need to have the DFG JIT
 enabled.

 As the purpose of the two JITs becomes increasingly coupled it may grow
 difficult to support the baseline JIT alone without the DFG JIT (we
 already have a maze of ifdefs for the two JITs, two interpreters,
 assembler support, value profiling support, etc), so any platforms that
 want to continue to keep a JIT enabled should probably look into
 supporting the DFG JIT sooner rather than later.

 cheers,
 G.


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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-23 Thread Zoltan Herczeg
Good for me. Thanks for helping us. This will help to the buildbot
maintainers as well, since if a patch cause a break where all of our names
are CC'ed, they can just disable the JIT until the fix is landed. I think
the several ports of JSC is something we should be proud of and I hope we
can keep them in the future.

Regards,
Zoltan

 Ah, sorry, I misunderstood!

 What about having a convention that assembly port maintainers are CC'd on
 bugs that require new assembler support?

 This will give you probably 10 hours heads up before the patch lands.

 -F


 On Jun 22, 2012, at 9:29 PM, Zoltan Herczeg zherc...@webkit.org wrote:

 I don't want adding instructions to SH4, MIPS, and legacy ARM to be a
 blocker for JSC work.

 I didn't say you have to wait. I just said you should notify us that
 something is coming which will break the build.

 Regards,
 Zoltan


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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-23 Thread Gavin Barraclough
On the topic of JIT support, the baseline JIT's role is increasingly only to 
serve only to gather profiling data for the DFG JIT, and if you want high 
performance JavaScript on your platform you need to have the DFG JIT enabled.

As the purpose of the two JITs becomes increasingly coupled it may grow 
difficult to support the baseline JIT alone without the DFG JIT (we already 
have a maze of ifdefs for the two JITs, two interpreters, assembler support, 
value profiling support, etc), so any platforms that want to continue to keep a 
JIT enabled should probably look into supporting the DFG JIT sooner rather than 
later.

cheers,
G.


On Jun 23, 2012, at 7:12 AM, Zoltan Herczeg wrote:

 Good for me. Thanks for helping us. This will help to the buildbot
 maintainers as well, since if a patch cause a break where all of our names
 are CC'ed, they can just disable the JIT until the fix is landed. I think
 the several ports of JSC is something we should be proud of and I hope we
 can keep them in the future.
 
 Regards,
 Zoltan
 
 Ah, sorry, I misunderstood!
 
 What about having a convention that assembly port maintainers are CC'd on
 bugs that require new assembler support?
 
 This will give you probably 10 hours heads up before the patch lands.
 
 -F
 
 
 On Jun 22, 2012, at 9:29 PM, Zoltan Herczeg zherc...@webkit.org wrote:
 
 I don't want adding instructions to SH4, MIPS, and legacy ARM to be a
 blocker for JSC work.
 
 I didn't say you have to wait. I just said you should notify us that
 something is coming which will break the build.
 
 Regards,
 Zoltan
 
 
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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-22 Thread Zoltan Herczeg
Hi Filip,

we (Gabor Loki and me) are the maintainers of the traditional ARM port,
and we are willing to fix all issues. Just let us know what we need to do.
You can assign the necessary bug reports to us and we are available in the
#squirrelfish (or #webkit) channel as well.

Regards,
Zoltan

 Hi all,

 We are actively trying to improve the WebKit JavaScript engine
 (JavaScriptCore), with new debugging, profiling, memory efficiency, and
 performance features.  Because JavaScriptCore is a JIT-based engine, this
 inevitably means doing JIT work, which in turn includes adding new
 instructions to the JIT assemblers and changing the API between the
 assemblers and the JIT.

 Currently, the maintenance situation in the assembler layer is not great.
 We have three well-supported assemblers, X86-32, X86-64, and ARMv7. Then
 we have three assemblers that appear to be on life support: legacy
 (non-THUMB2, pre-v7) ARM, SH4, and MIPS.  It is increasingly painful to
 maintain these three barely-supported assemblers.  None of these
 assemblers has been updated to support the new JIT or interpreter
 infrastructure, and there appears to be no ongoing effort to do so.  That
 means that for progress to be made on X86 and ARMv7, we need to
 increasingly scatter #if ENABLE(...) noise throughout the system to keep
 those other assemblers building.  Neither the active JavaScriptCore
 contributors, nor those running the bots for those hardware platforms,
 appear to have much interest in maintaining those assemblers, other than
 the occasional build fix.

 This is not a good situation to be in.

 So, I am curious: is anyone shipping with the legacy ARM assembler, the
 MIPS assembler, or the SH4 assembler?

 As a secondary question, if you are shipping the legacy ARM assembler, are
 you doing so because you have legacy ARM hardware or because you have not
 had the chance to switch to the new ARM assembler in your codebase?

 -Filip


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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-22 Thread thouraya andolsi
Hi,

We (STMicroelectronics)  are the maintainer of SH4 port.

We would like to continue maintaining it.
Could you please let me know what we need to do ? and feel free to assign
for me any bug related to SH4.

Regards,

Thouraya.
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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-22 Thread Oliver Hunt
The problem is that as we make changes we end up breaking the SH4, MIPS, 
ARMvOld builds, which we are ostensibly not allowed to do, and so have to spend 
significant amounts of time trying to ensure that the builds don't break/start 
failing horribly, and then having committed the patch[es] we have to spend 
multiple build bot cycles discovering all the cases that we missed.

This consumes a lot of time that would be better spent working on the higher 
level portions of the JIT, that benefit all platforms.

--Oliver

On Jun 21, 2012, at 11:44 PM, Zoltan Herczeg wrote:

 Hi Filip,
 
 we (Gabor Loki and me) are the maintainers of the traditional ARM port,
 and we are willing to fix all issues. Just let us know what we need to do.
 You can assign the necessary bug reports to us and we are available in the
 #squirrelfish (or #webkit) channel as well.
 
 Regards,
 Zoltan
 
 Hi all,
 
 We are actively trying to improve the WebKit JavaScript engine
 (JavaScriptCore), with new debugging, profiling, memory efficiency, and
 performance features.  Because JavaScriptCore is a JIT-based engine, this
 inevitably means doing JIT work, which in turn includes adding new
 instructions to the JIT assemblers and changing the API between the
 assemblers and the JIT.
 
 Currently, the maintenance situation in the assembler layer is not great.
 We have three well-supported assemblers, X86-32, X86-64, and ARMv7. Then
 we have three assemblers that appear to be on life support: legacy
 (non-THUMB2, pre-v7) ARM, SH4, and MIPS.  It is increasingly painful to
 maintain these three barely-supported assemblers.  None of these
 assemblers has been updated to support the new JIT or interpreter
 infrastructure, and there appears to be no ongoing effort to do so.  That
 means that for progress to be made on X86 and ARMv7, we need to
 increasingly scatter #if ENABLE(...) noise throughout the system to keep
 those other assemblers building.  Neither the active JavaScriptCore
 contributors, nor those running the bots for those hardware platforms,
 appear to have much interest in maintaining those assemblers, other than
 the occasional build fix.
 
 This is not a good situation to be in.
 
 So, I am curious: is anyone shipping with the legacy ARM assembler, the
 MIPS assembler, or the SH4 assembler?
 
 As a secondary question, if you are shipping the legacy ARM assembler, are
 you doing so because you have legacy ARM hardware or because you have not
 had the chance to switch to the new ARM assembler in your codebase?
 
 -Filip
 
 
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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-22 Thread Maciej Stachowiak

Is there a way to reduce these costs other than deleting the slower-maintained 
JITs? For example, could we temporarily freeze the JIT (perhaps the whole JSC 
engine somehow) at old versions somehow for architectures that may take time to 
catch up?

Regards,
Maciej

On Jun 22, 2012, at 10:52 AM, Oliver Hunt oli...@apple.com wrote:

 The problem is that as we make changes we end up breaking the SH4, MIPS, 
 ARMvOld builds, which we are ostensibly not allowed to do, and so have to 
 spend significant amounts of time trying to ensure that the builds don't 
 break/start failing horribly, and then having committed the patch[es] we have 
 to spend multiple build bot cycles discovering all the cases that we missed.
 
 This consumes a lot of time that would be better spent working on the higher 
 level portions of the JIT, that benefit all platforms.
 
 --Oliver
 
 On Jun 21, 2012, at 11:44 PM, Zoltan Herczeg wrote:
 
 Hi Filip,
 
 we (Gabor Loki and me) are the maintainers of the traditional ARM port,
 and we are willing to fix all issues. Just let us know what we need to do.
 You can assign the necessary bug reports to us and we are available in the
 #squirrelfish (or #webkit) channel as well.
 
 Regards,
 Zoltan
 
 Hi all,
 
 We are actively trying to improve the WebKit JavaScript engine
 (JavaScriptCore), with new debugging, profiling, memory efficiency, and
 performance features.  Because JavaScriptCore is a JIT-based engine, this
 inevitably means doing JIT work, which in turn includes adding new
 instructions to the JIT assemblers and changing the API between the
 assemblers and the JIT.
 
 Currently, the maintenance situation in the assembler layer is not great.
 We have three well-supported assemblers, X86-32, X86-64, and ARMv7. Then
 we have three assemblers that appear to be on life support: legacy
 (non-THUMB2, pre-v7) ARM, SH4, and MIPS.  It is increasingly painful to
 maintain these three barely-supported assemblers.  None of these
 assemblers has been updated to support the new JIT or interpreter
 infrastructure, and there appears to be no ongoing effort to do so.  That
 means that for progress to be made on X86 and ARMv7, we need to
 increasingly scatter #if ENABLE(...) noise throughout the system to keep
 those other assemblers building.  Neither the active JavaScriptCore
 contributors, nor those running the bots for those hardware platforms,
 appear to have much interest in maintaining those assemblers, other than
 the occasional build fix.
 
 This is not a good situation to be in.
 
 So, I am curious: is anyone shipping with the legacy ARM assembler, the
 MIPS assembler, or the SH4 assembler?
 
 As a secondary question, if you are shipping the legacy ARM assembler, are
 you doing so because you have legacy ARM hardware or because you have not
 had the chance to switch to the new ARM assembler in your codebase?
 
 -Filip
 
 
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 webkit-dev@lists.webkit.org
 http://lists.webkit.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/webkit-dev
 
 
 
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 webkit-dev@lists.webkit.org
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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-22 Thread Oliver Hunt
That would be the ifdef hell we currently deal with. 

One option (that would keep everything building till appropriate people have 
fixed whatever needs to be fixed) would simply be to disable the JIT for 
effected platforms everytime something changes that is too difficult for us to 
blindly fix.  Then people with appropriate hardware and toolchains could make 
the (probably trivial) changes required to bring them up again.

--Oliver

On Jun 22, 2012, at 11:20 AM, Maciej Stachowiak wrote:

 
 Is there a way to reduce these costs other than deleting the 
 slower-maintained JITs? For example, could we temporarily freeze the JIT 
 (perhaps the whole JSC engine somehow) at old versions somehow for 
 architectures that may take time to catch up?
 
 Regards,
 Maciej
 
 On Jun 22, 2012, at 10:52 AM, Oliver Hunt oli...@apple.com wrote:
 
 The problem is that as we make changes we end up breaking the SH4, MIPS, 
 ARMvOld builds, which we are ostensibly not allowed to do, and so have to 
 spend significant amounts of time trying to ensure that the builds don't 
 break/start failing horribly, and then having committed the patch[es] we 
 have to spend multiple build bot cycles discovering all the cases that we 
 missed.
 
 This consumes a lot of time that would be better spent working on the higher 
 level portions of the JIT, that benefit all platforms.
 
 --Oliver
 
 On Jun 21, 2012, at 11:44 PM, Zoltan Herczeg wrote:
 
 Hi Filip,
 
 we (Gabor Loki and me) are the maintainers of the traditional ARM port,
 and we are willing to fix all issues. Just let us know what we need to do.
 You can assign the necessary bug reports to us and we are available in the
 #squirrelfish (or #webkit) channel as well.
 
 Regards,
 Zoltan
 
 Hi all,
 
 We are actively trying to improve the WebKit JavaScript engine
 (JavaScriptCore), with new debugging, profiling, memory efficiency, and
 performance features.  Because JavaScriptCore is a JIT-based engine, this
 inevitably means doing JIT work, which in turn includes adding new
 instructions to the JIT assemblers and changing the API between the
 assemblers and the JIT.
 
 Currently, the maintenance situation in the assembler layer is not great.
 We have three well-supported assemblers, X86-32, X86-64, and ARMv7. Then
 we have three assemblers that appear to be on life support: legacy
 (non-THUMB2, pre-v7) ARM, SH4, and MIPS.  It is increasingly painful to
 maintain these three barely-supported assemblers.  None of these
 assemblers has been updated to support the new JIT or interpreter
 infrastructure, and there appears to be no ongoing effort to do so.  That
 means that for progress to be made on X86 and ARMv7, we need to
 increasingly scatter #if ENABLE(...) noise throughout the system to keep
 those other assemblers building.  Neither the active JavaScriptCore
 contributors, nor those running the bots for those hardware platforms,
 appear to have much interest in maintaining those assemblers, other than
 the occasional build fix.
 
 This is not a good situation to be in.
 
 So, I am curious: is anyone shipping with the legacy ARM assembler, the
 MIPS assembler, or the SH4 assembler?
 
 As a secondary question, if you are shipping the legacy ARM assembler, are
 you doing so because you have legacy ARM hardware or because you have not
 had the chance to switch to the new ARM assembler in your codebase?
 
 -Filip
 
 
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 webkit-dev@lists.webkit.org
 http://lists.webkit.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/webkit-dev
 
 
 
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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-22 Thread Zoltan Herczeg
True, most of the changes are trivial. The problem is that the changes are
usually appear without prior notice. A patch which depends on new macro
assembler instructions, will obviously break the build, and we are not
necessary there to fix it immediately. I think most improvements require
time to finish, so these new instructions are known several days before
the patch is submitted to the bugzilla. If we would know about these new
instructions before the patch appears, we could prepare the macro
assembler to handle them. Would it be possible to share us these new
requirements before such patches appear?

Regards,
Zoltan

 That would be the ifdef hell we currently deal with.

 One option (that would keep everything building till appropriate people
 have fixed whatever needs to be fixed) would simply be to disable the JIT
 for effected platforms everytime something changes that is too difficult
 for us to blindly fix.  Then people with appropriate hardware and
 toolchains could make the (probably trivial) changes required to bring
 them up again.

 --Oliver

 On Jun 22, 2012, at 11:20 AM, Maciej Stachowiak wrote:


 Is there a way to reduce these costs other than deleting the
 slower-maintained JITs? For example, could we temporarily freeze the JIT
 (perhaps the whole JSC engine somehow) at old versions somehow for
 architectures that may take time to catch up?

 Regards,
 Maciej

 On Jun 22, 2012, at 10:52 AM, Oliver Hunt oli...@apple.com wrote:

 The problem is that as we make changes we end up breaking the SH4,
 MIPS, ARMvOld builds, which we are ostensibly not allowed to do, and so
 have to spend significant amounts of time trying to ensure that the
 builds don't break/start failing horribly, and then having committed
 the patch[es] we have to spend multiple build bot cycles discovering
 all the cases that we missed.

 This consumes a lot of time that would be better spent working on the
 higher level portions of the JIT, that benefit all platforms.

 --Oliver

 On Jun 21, 2012, at 11:44 PM, Zoltan Herczeg wrote:

 Hi Filip,

 we (Gabor Loki and me) are the maintainers of the traditional ARM
 port,
 and we are willing to fix all issues. Just let us know what we need to
 do.
 You can assign the necessary bug reports to us and we are available in
 the
 #squirrelfish (or #webkit) channel as well.

 Regards,
 Zoltan

 Hi all,

 We are actively trying to improve the WebKit JavaScript engine
 (JavaScriptCore), with new debugging, profiling, memory efficiency,
 and
 performance features.  Because JavaScriptCore is a JIT-based engine,
 this
 inevitably means doing JIT work, which in turn includes adding new
 instructions to the JIT assemblers and changing the API between the
 assemblers and the JIT.

 Currently, the maintenance situation in the assembler layer is not
 great.
 We have three well-supported assemblers, X86-32, X86-64, and ARMv7.
 Then
 we have three assemblers that appear to be on life support: legacy
 (non-THUMB2, pre-v7) ARM, SH4, and MIPS.  It is increasingly painful
 to
 maintain these three barely-supported assemblers.  None of these
 assemblers has been updated to support the new JIT or interpreter
 infrastructure, and there appears to be no ongoing effort to do so.
 That
 means that for progress to be made on X86 and ARMv7, we need to
 increasingly scatter #if ENABLE(...) noise throughout the system to
 keep
 those other assemblers building.  Neither the active JavaScriptCore
 contributors, nor those running the bots for those hardware
 platforms,
 appear to have much interest in maintaining those assemblers, other
 than
 the occasional build fix.

 This is not a good situation to be in.

 So, I am curious: is anyone shipping with the legacy ARM assembler,
 the
 MIPS assembler, or the SH4 assembler?

 As a secondary question, if you are shipping the legacy ARM
 assembler, are
 you doing so because you have legacy ARM hardware or because you have
 not
 had the chance to switch to the new ARM assembler in your codebase?

 -Filip


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 http://lists.webkit.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/webkit-dev



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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-22 Thread Filip Pizlo

On Jun 22, 2012, at 12:43 PM, Zoltan Herczeg zherc...@webkit.org wrote:

 True, most of the changes are trivial. The problem is that the changes are
 usually appear without prior notice. A patch which depends on new macro
 assembler instructions, will obviously break the build, and we are not
 necessary there to fix it immediately. I think most improvements require
 time to finish, so these new instructions are known several days before
 the patch is submitted to the bugzilla. If we would know about these new
 instructions before the patch appears, we could prepare the macro
 assembler to handle them. Would it be possible to share us these new
 requirements before such patches appear?

I don't want adding instructions to SH4, MIPS, and legacy ARM to be a blocker 
for JSC work.

-F


 
 Regards,
 Zoltan
 
 That would be the ifdef hell we currently deal with.
 
 One option (that would keep everything building till appropriate people
 have fixed whatever needs to be fixed) would simply be to disable the JIT
 for effected platforms everytime something changes that is too difficult
 for us to blindly fix.  Then people with appropriate hardware and
 toolchains could make the (probably trivial) changes required to bring
 them up again.
 
 --Oliver
 
 On Jun 22, 2012, at 11:20 AM, Maciej Stachowiak wrote:
 
 
 Is there a way to reduce these costs other than deleting the
 slower-maintained JITs? For example, could we temporarily freeze the JIT
 (perhaps the whole JSC engine somehow) at old versions somehow for
 architectures that may take time to catch up?
 
 Regards,
 Maciej
 
 On Jun 22, 2012, at 10:52 AM, Oliver Hunt oli...@apple.com wrote:
 
 The problem is that as we make changes we end up breaking the SH4,
 MIPS, ARMvOld builds, which we are ostensibly not allowed to do, and so
 have to spend significant amounts of time trying to ensure that the
 builds don't break/start failing horribly, and then having committed
 the patch[es] we have to spend multiple build bot cycles discovering
 all the cases that we missed.
 
 This consumes a lot of time that would be better spent working on the
 higher level portions of the JIT, that benefit all platforms.
 
 --Oliver
 
 On Jun 21, 2012, at 11:44 PM, Zoltan Herczeg wrote:
 
 Hi Filip,
 
 we (Gabor Loki and me) are the maintainers of the traditional ARM
 port,
 and we are willing to fix all issues. Just let us know what we need to
 do.
 You can assign the necessary bug reports to us and we are available in
 the
 #squirrelfish (or #webkit) channel as well.
 
 Regards,
 Zoltan
 
 Hi all,
 
 We are actively trying to improve the WebKit JavaScript engine
 (JavaScriptCore), with new debugging, profiling, memory efficiency,
 and
 performance features.  Because JavaScriptCore is a JIT-based engine,
 this
 inevitably means doing JIT work, which in turn includes adding new
 instructions to the JIT assemblers and changing the API between the
 assemblers and the JIT.
 
 Currently, the maintenance situation in the assembler layer is not
 great.
 We have three well-supported assemblers, X86-32, X86-64, and ARMv7.
 Then
 we have three assemblers that appear to be on life support: legacy
 (non-THUMB2, pre-v7) ARM, SH4, and MIPS.  It is increasingly painful
 to
 maintain these three barely-supported assemblers.  None of these
 assemblers has been updated to support the new JIT or interpreter
 infrastructure, and there appears to be no ongoing effort to do so.
 That
 means that for progress to be made on X86 and ARMv7, we need to
 increasingly scatter #if ENABLE(...) noise throughout the system to
 keep
 those other assemblers building.  Neither the active JavaScriptCore
 contributors, nor those running the bots for those hardware
 platforms,
 appear to have much interest in maintaining those assemblers, other
 than
 the occasional build fix.
 
 This is not a good situation to be in.
 
 So, I am curious: is anyone shipping with the legacy ARM assembler,
 the
 MIPS assembler, or the SH4 assembler?
 
 As a secondary question, if you are shipping the legacy ARM
 assembler, are
 you doing so because you have legacy ARM hardware or because you have
 not
 had the chance to switch to the new ARM assembler in your codebase?
 
 -Filip
 
 
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 webkit-dev@lists.webkit.org
 http://lists.webkit.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/webkit-dev
 
 
 
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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-22 Thread Fu, Chao-Ying
Hi Filip,

  We will be fine, if the MIPS build isn't ok due to new features or changes.
You can go ahead to check in patches for your targets (even with MIPS JIT 
disabled).
Ex: Suggested by Oliver
http://lists.webkit.org/pipermail/webkit-dev/2012-June/021267.html

  We can catch up to fix.  This situation happened more than one time since I 
worked on MIPS JSC.
When I found out the broken build, I just patched the MIPS assembly support.
It's not a burden for us.  Thanks a lot!

Regards,
Chao-ying

 -Original Message-
 From: webkit-dev-boun...@lists.webkit.org 
 [mailto:webkit-dev-boun...@lists.webkit.org] On Behalf Of Filip Pizlo
 Sent: Friday, June 22, 2012 1:07 PM
 To: Zoltan Herczeg
 Cc: WebKit Development
 Subject: Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM 
 assemblers in JavaScriptCore
 
 
 On Jun 22, 2012, at 12:43 PM, Zoltan Herczeg 
 zherc...@webkit.org wrote:
 
  True, most of the changes are trivial. The problem is that 
 the changes are
  usually appear without prior notice. A patch which depends 
 on new macro
  assembler instructions, will obviously break the build, and 
 we are not
  necessary there to fix it immediately. I think most 
 improvements require
  time to finish, so these new instructions are known several 
 days before
  the patch is submitted to the bugzilla. If we would know 
 about these new
  instructions before the patch appears, we could prepare the macro
  assembler to handle them. Would it be possible to share us these new
  requirements before such patches appear?
 
 I don't want adding instructions to SH4, MIPS, and legacy ARM 
 to be a blocker for JSC work.
 
 -F
 
 
  
  Regards,
  Zoltan
  
  That would be the ifdef hell we currently deal with.
  
  One option (that would keep everything building till 
 appropriate people
  have fixed whatever needs to be fixed) would simply be to 
 disable the JIT
  for effected platforms everytime something changes that is 
 too difficult
  for us to blindly fix.  Then people with appropriate hardware and
  toolchains could make the (probably trivial) changes 
 required to bring
  them up again.
  
  --Oliver
  
  On Jun 22, 2012, at 11:20 AM, Maciej Stachowiak wrote:
  
  
  Is there a way to reduce these costs other than deleting the
  slower-maintained JITs? For example, could we temporarily 
 freeze the JIT
  (perhaps the whole JSC engine somehow) at old versions somehow for
  architectures that may take time to catch up?
  
  Regards,
  Maciej
  
  On Jun 22, 2012, at 10:52 AM, Oliver Hunt 
 oli...@apple.com wrote:
  
  The problem is that as we make changes we end up 
 breaking the SH4,
  MIPS, ARMvOld builds, which we are ostensibly not 
 allowed to do, and so
  have to spend significant amounts of time trying to 
 ensure that the
  builds don't break/start failing horribly, and then 
 having committed
  the patch[es] we have to spend multiple build bot cycles 
 discovering
  all the cases that we missed.
  
  This consumes a lot of time that would be better spent 
 working on the
  higher level portions of the JIT, that benefit all platforms.
  
  --Oliver
  
  On Jun 21, 2012, at 11:44 PM, Zoltan Herczeg wrote:
  
  Hi Filip,
  
  we (Gabor Loki and me) are the maintainers of the 
 traditional ARM
  port,
  and we are willing to fix all issues. Just let us know 
 what we need to
  do.
  You can assign the necessary bug reports to us and we 
 are available in
  the
  #squirrelfish (or #webkit) channel as well.
  
  Regards,
  Zoltan
  
  Hi all,
  
  We are actively trying to improve the WebKit JavaScript engine
  (JavaScriptCore), with new debugging, profiling, 
 memory efficiency,
  and
  performance features.  Because JavaScriptCore is a 
 JIT-based engine,
  this
  inevitably means doing JIT work, which in turn 
 includes adding new
  instructions to the JIT assemblers and changing the 
 API between the
  assemblers and the JIT.
  
  Currently, the maintenance situation in the assembler 
 layer is not
  great.
  We have three well-supported assemblers, X86-32, 
 X86-64, and ARMv7.
  Then
  we have three assemblers that appear to be on life 
 support: legacy
  (non-THUMB2, pre-v7) ARM, SH4, and MIPS.  It is 
 increasingly painful
  to
  maintain these three barely-supported assemblers.  
 None of these
  assemblers has been updated to support the new JIT or 
 interpreter
  infrastructure, and there appears to be no ongoing 
 effort to do so.
  That
  means that for progress to be made on X86 and ARMv7, we need to
  increasingly scatter #if ENABLE(...) noise throughout 
 the system to
  keep
  those other assemblers building.  Neither the active 
 JavaScriptCore
  contributors, nor those running the bots for those hardware
  platforms,
  appear to have much interest in maintaining those 
 assemblers, other
  than
  the occasional build fix.
  
  This is not a good situation to be in.
  
  So, I am curious: is anyone shipping with the legacy 
 ARM assembler,
  the
  MIPS assembler, or the SH4 assembler

Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-22 Thread Zoltan Herczeg
 I don't want adding instructions to SH4, MIPS, and legacy ARM to be a
 blocker for JSC work.

I didn't say you have to wait. I just said you should notify us that
something is coming which will break the build.

Regards,
Zoltan


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Re: [webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-22 Thread Filip Pizlo
Ah, sorry, I misunderstood!

What about having a convention that assembly port maintainers are CC'd on bugs 
that require new assembler support?

This will give you probably 10 hours heads up before the patch lands.

-F


On Jun 22, 2012, at 9:29 PM, Zoltan Herczeg zherc...@webkit.org wrote:

 I don't want adding instructions to SH4, MIPS, and legacy ARM to be a
 blocker for JSC work.
 
 I didn't say you have to wait. I just said you should notify us that
 something is coming which will break the build.
 
 Regards,
 Zoltan
 
 
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[webkit-dev] SH4, MIPS, and legacy-ARM assemblers in JavaScriptCore

2012-06-21 Thread Filip Pizlo
Hi all,

We are actively trying to improve the WebKit JavaScript engine 
(JavaScriptCore), with new debugging, profiling, memory efficiency, and 
performance features.  Because JavaScriptCore is a JIT-based engine, this 
inevitably means doing JIT work, which in turn includes adding new instructions 
to the JIT assemblers and changing the API between the assemblers and the JIT.

Currently, the maintenance situation in the assembler layer is not great.  We 
have three well-supported assemblers, X86-32, X86-64, and ARMv7. Then we have 
three assemblers that appear to be on life support: legacy (non-THUMB2, pre-v7) 
ARM, SH4, and MIPS.  It is increasingly painful to maintain these three 
barely-supported assemblers.  None of these assemblers has been updated to 
support the new JIT or interpreter infrastructure, and there appears to be no 
ongoing effort to do so.  That means that for progress to be made on X86 and 
ARMv7, we need to increasingly scatter #if ENABLE(...) noise throughout the 
system to keep those other assemblers building.  Neither the active 
JavaScriptCore contributors, nor those running the bots for those hardware 
platforms, appear to have much interest in maintaining those assemblers, other 
than the occasional build fix.

This is not a good situation to be in.

So, I am curious: is anyone shipping with the legacy ARM assembler, the MIPS 
assembler, or the SH4 assembler?

As a secondary question, if you are shipping the legacy ARM assembler, are you 
doing so because you have legacy ARM hardware or because you have not had the 
chance to switch to the new ARM assembler in your codebase?

-Filip


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