Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread White Lynx
Michel Fortin wrote: Bugs will need to be fixed with many CSS engines, Withdrawing proposal does not mean that this bugs need not to be fixed. They has to be fixed in any case. and even then the current markup proposal isn't something I'd call pretty even for simpler structures

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread White Lynx
Ian Hickson wrote: There is nothing to read between my lines. I am being as honest and candid as possible. There is no conspiracy here. I have given you the exact reasoning I have used, I have suggested how you can move forward. I am being quite sincere. Very well. In this case please

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread Alexey Feldgendler
On Tue, 20 Jun 2006 14:43:23 +0700, White Lynx [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Very well. In this case please make one small step to show that WHATWG HTML is open to scientific content and add just four elements to HTML5 (feel free to use different element names if nesessary): formula, fraction,

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread Stefan Gössner
Michel Fortin wrote: Something that's definitely missing for elementary algebra is a construct capable of representing a fraction. So I propose that HTML 5 adds fractions, and only fractions. Yes please, that would be a great start. It is quite cheap and a reasonable way to get a certain

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread White Lynx
Robert O'Callahan wrote: From my point of view, a fraction element that can be implemented using inline-block in the UA style sheet seems like a reasonable thing to support in HTML5, since it's basically no effort and is a small increment over existing sup etc. Thus fractions work in MSIE,

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread White Lynx
Alexey Feldgendler wrote: How should formula be used? There has been some discussion about it. In case when everything is reduced to fractions and simple indices, it can be optional. But having such an element is still important for those who want to mark formulae explictly. I've never said

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread Alexey Feldgendler
On Tue, 20 Jun 2006 18:47:42 +0700, White Lynx [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How should formula be used? There has been some discussion about it. In case when everything is reduced to fractions and simple indices, it can be optional. But having such an element is still important for those who

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread juanrgonzaleza
Ian Hickson wrote: On Mon, 19 Jun 2006 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 1) It has been proven that via Standard CSS 2.1 not designed for math one can render math better than browsers with native support (as Firefox 1.0) and infinitely better than MSIE, Safari, and Opera (rendering natively zero

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread Alexey Feldgendler
On Tue, 20 Jun 2006 19:20:28 +0700, White Lynx [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How should formula be used? There has been some discussion about it. In case when everything is reduced to fractions and simple indices, it can be optional. But having such an element is still important for those who

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread Michel Fortin
Le 20 juin 2006 à 3:40, White Lynx a écrit : Yes. The same markup is used in ISO 12083, AAP Math DTD and most of other DTDs that I have seen, modulo naming conventions this markup is: fraction numnumerator/num dennumerator/den /fraction That was what I had in mind. I used to prefer frac

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread juanrgonzaleza
Henri Sivonen wrote: On Jun 20, 2006, at 10:42, White Lynx wrote: Henri Sivonen wrote: There are only stretchy brackets. No stretchy parentheses or braces in sight. Did you check fences part at http://www.geocities.com/chavchan/css/ annotated.css I didn't. I checked the sample

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread Henri Sivonen
On Jun 20, 2006, at 15:26, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: However, it look better that via native MathML support browsers (without downloading and installing special fonts). Comparing anything to a MathML implementation without giving the MathML impl the fonts it needs is totally bogus. Yes,

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread juanrgonzaleza
Robert O'Callahan wrote: I'll speak up as one of the Mozilla layout developers, but speaking only for myself. Since we already have a MathML implementation --- which works fairly well in my experience --- Do you mean structurally invalid, inacessible, not searchable, and sometimes

Re: [whatwg] Mathematics in HTML5

2006-06-20 Thread juanrgonzaleza
White Lynx wrote: The difference between fractions and the rest of proposal is that markup for fractions is the same across many DTDs and it is hard to imagine something different (only W3C can). Thus markup for fractions is more or less unique. In the rest of proposal uniqueness it is not