Re: [whatwg] The real issue with HTML5's sectioning model

2010-08-02 Thread Ian Hickson
On Fri, 30 Apr 2010, Eduard Pascual wrote: Basically, most of the issues with headings boil down to a single fact: the sectioning model is (probably needlessly) over-bloated. [...] And now, in HTML5, not only have h1-6 been kept, but a plethora of new elements: section, nav, aside,

Re: [whatwg] The real issue with HTML5's sectioning model

2010-05-01 Thread Eduard Pascual
On Sat, May 1, 2010 at 3:56 AM, Anne van Kesteren ann...@opera.com wrote: On Sat, 01 May 2010 10:42:03 +0900, James Robinson jam...@google.com wrote: Is this sort of reply really necessary?  I have not been following the surrounding discussion, but this email showed up as a new thread in my

[whatwg] The real issue with HTML5's sectioning model (was: Headings and sections, role of H2-H6 and Should default styles for h1-h6 match the outlining algorithm?)

2010-04-30 Thread Eduard Pascual
I think I already mentioned this before, but seeing how the issues are surfacing again, maybe it's worth to revisit the real *roots* of the problem. Basically, most of the issues with headings boil down to a single fact: the sectioning model is (probably needlessly) over-bloated. Some people will

Re: [whatwg] The real issue with HTML5's sectioning model (was: Headings and sections, role of H2-H6 and Should default styles for h1-h6 match the outlining algorithm?)

2010-04-30 Thread Greg Houston
On Fri, Apr 30, 2010 at 1:57 PM, Eduard Pascual herenva...@gmail.com wrote: So, that's enough of a problem statement (at least for now). My suggestion is to clean things a bit: consolidate the sectioning model into a single element+attribute pair, like this: section stays as is. nav becomes

Re: [whatwg] The real issue with HTML5's sectioning model (was: Headings and sections, role of H2-H6 and Should default styles for h1-h6 match the outlining algorithm?)

2010-04-30 Thread Tab Atkins Jr.
On Fri, Apr 30, 2010 at 11:57 AM, Eduard Pascual herenva...@gmail.com wrote: Actually, if we try to implement the outlining algorithm in the form of selectors that match each level of headings we have: On the case that the h1-only approach, selecting each level of heading requires a list of

Re: [whatwg] The real issue with HTML5's sectioning model (was: Headings and sections, role of H2-H6 and Should default styles for h1-h6 match the outlining algorithm?)

2010-04-30 Thread Nikita Popov
On 30.04.2010 21:47, Greg Houston wrote: On Fri, Apr 30, 2010 at 1:57 PM, Eduard Pascualherenva...@gmail.com wrote: So, that's enough of a problem statement (at least for now). My suggestion is to clean things a bit: consolidate the sectioning model into a single element+attribute pair,

Re: [whatwg] The real issue with HTML5's sectioning model (was: Headings and sections, role of H2-H6 and Should default styles for h1-h6 match the outlining algorithm?)

2010-04-30 Thread Greg Houston
On Fri, Apr 30, 2010 at 3:04 PM, Nikita Popov pri...@ni-po.com wrote: On 30.04.2010 21:47, Greg Houston wrote: section class=section nav class=section aside class=section article class=section address class=section I think this defeats all the purpose of the different sectioning elements.

Re: [whatwg] The real issue with HTML5's sectioning model (was: Headings and sections, role of H2-H6 and Should default styles for h1-h6 match the outlining algorithm?)

2010-04-30 Thread Eduard Pascual
On Fri, Apr 30, 2010 at 10:02 PM, Tab Atkins Jr. jackalm...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Apr 30, 2010 at 11:57 AM, Eduard Pascual herenva...@gmail.com wrote: Actually, if we try to implement the outlining algorithm in the form of selectors that match each level of headings we have: On the case

Re: [whatwg] The real issue with HTML5's sectioning model

2010-04-30 Thread Anne van Kesteren
On Sat, 01 May 2010 03:57:42 +0900, Eduard Pascual herenva...@gmail.com wrote: XHTML2's approach was clean and simple: section, h, and @role do everything. Period. Bullshit: http://www.w3.org/TR/2006/WD-xhtml2-20060726/mod-structural.html#sec_8.5. -- Anne van Kesteren

Re: [whatwg] The real issue with HTML5's sectioning model

2010-04-30 Thread James Robinson
Is this sort of reply really necessary? I have not been following the surrounding discussion, but this email showed up as a new thread in my mail client. Based on this tone, I now have no desire to catch up on the rest of the discussion. - James On Fri, Apr 30, 2010 at 6:26 PM, Anne van

Re: [whatwg] The real issue with HTML5's sectioning model

2010-04-30 Thread Anne van Kesteren
On Sat, 01 May 2010 10:42:03 +0900, James Robinson jam...@google.com wrote: Is this sort of reply really necessary? I have not been following the surrounding discussion, but this email showed up as a new thread in my mail client. Based on this tone, I now have no desire to catch up on the