Re: [Wiki-research-l] (no subject)

2015-03-17 Thread Andrew Gray
I've noted Finland (as a country) before when looking at Erik's data -
IIRC, there's a vaguely normal-looking distribution of
pages-per-internet-user-per-month for the Western European countries,
and Finland is at the upper end but not a dramatic outlier, it's in a
group with eg Sweden, Austria, etc.

http://stats.wikimedia.org/wikimedia/squids/SquidReportPageViewsPerCountryOverview.htm

This pattern has been around since at least 2012:

http://web.archive.org/web/20120922063053/http://stats.wikimedia.org/wikimedia/squids/SquidReportPageViewsPerCountryOverview.htm

(not sure why the 2012 per-country numbers are so much higher...)

Andrew.

On 16 March 2015 at 09:30, Oliver Keyes oke...@wikimedia.org wrote:
 Awesome work! It's interesting to see Finnish as the outlier here. Do
 we have any fi-users on the list who can comment on this and might
 know what's going on? (And, in the absence of Finns: Jan, heard
 anything from across the border? :p)

 The only caution I'd raise is that these numbers don't include spider
 filtering. Why is this important? Well, a lot of traffic is driven by
 crawlers and spiders and automata, particularly on smaller projects,
 and it can lead to weirdness as a result. With the granular pagecount
 files there's some work that can be done to detect this (for example,
 using burst detection and a few heuristics around concentration
 measures to eliminate pages that are clearly driven by automated
 traffic - see the recent analytics mailing list thread) but only some.
 I appreciate this is a flaw in the data we are releasing, not in your
 work, which is an excellent read and highly interesting :). I agree
 that understanding the lack of development in the PRC and ROK is
 crucial - we keep talking about the next billion readers but only
 talking :(

 On 16 March 2015 at 02:21, h hant...@gmail.com wrote:
 Dear all,

 I have some findings to show the page views per Internet user
 measurement may help comparing different language editions of Wikipedia.
 Criticism and suggestions are welcome.


 -
 http://people.oii.ox.ac.uk/hanteng/2015/03/15/comparing-language-development-in-wikipedia-in-terms-of-page-views-per-internet-users/

 Which language version of Wikipedia enjoys the most page views per language
 Internet user than expected? It is Finnish. In terms of absolute positive
 and negative gap, English has the widest positive gap whereas Chinese has
 the largest negative gap.

 ..

 In particular, it is known that Wikipedia (and Google which often favours
 Wikipedia) faces local competition in the People's Republic of China and
 South Korea. Therefore it is understandable the page views may be lower in
 Chinese and Korean Wikipedia language projects simply because some users'
 need to read user-generated encyclopedias are satisfied by other websites.
 However, it remains an important question to examine why these particular
 Latin and Asian languages are under-developed for Wikipedia projects.

 ___
 Wiki-research-l mailing list
 Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org
 https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l




 --
 Oliver Keyes
 Research Analyst
 Wikimedia Foundation

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 Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org
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-- 
- Andrew Gray
  andrew.g...@dunelm.org.uk

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Re: [Wiki-research-l] (no subject)

2015-03-17 Thread h
If the hypothesis on the climate's impact on literacy and thus Wikipedia
viewing holds true, then perhaps Manchuria (or Northeast China)
and/or Russia, should be the target for Wikipedia viewing.

The love for knowledge/information could be strong in East Asian/Confucius
countries where both literacy rates and ICT development index have been
high.

By using some comparative methods from comparative politics and social
sciences, we may be able to tell a bigger stories about online literacy and
the role of Wikipedia in it.

Best,
han-teng liao

2015-03-16 22:02 GMT+01:00 Kerry Raymond kerry.raym...@gmail.com:

 And very long winter nights? Are there seasonal variations?

 -Original Message-
 From: wiki-research-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org
 [mailto:wiki-research-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Leinonen
 Teemu
 Sent: Tuesday, 17 March 2015 4:32 AM
 To: Research into Wikimedia content and communities
 Subject: Re: [Wiki-research-l] (no subject)

  On 16.3.2015, at 11.30, Oliver Keyes oke...@wikimedia.org wrote:
 
  Awesome work! It's interesting to see Finnish as the outlier here. Do
  we have any fi-users on the list who can comment on this and might
  know what's going on? (And, in the absence of Finns: Jan, heard
  anything from across the border? :p)

 To find a certain societal explanation for this, one good have a look of
 the
 Swedish, Norwegian, Danish, Icelandic Wikipedias. If they come high, too, I
 would explain this with the Nordic people's interest in reading (and high
 level of general education).


 Some earlier studies by UNESCO have demonstrated that the people in Nordic
 countries read more newspapers, books etc. than people in the rest of the
 world. If I remember right the Finns has beaten the Nordic countries also
 in
 these comparisons. So the explanation can be reading habits in generate,
 which is a cause of high level of basic education, library network, equal
 society etc.

 - Teemu

 --
 Teemu Leinonen
 http://teemuleinonen.fi
 +358 50 351 6796
 Media Lab
 http://mlab.uiah.fi
 Aalto University
 School of Arts, Design and Architecture
 --
 ___
 Wiki-research-l mailing list
 Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org
 https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l


 ___
 Wiki-research-l mailing list
 Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org
 https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l

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Re: [Wiki-research-l] (no subject)

2015-03-16 Thread Oliver Keyes
Awesome work! It's interesting to see Finnish as the outlier here. Do
we have any fi-users on the list who can comment on this and might
know what's going on? (And, in the absence of Finns: Jan, heard
anything from across the border? :p)

The only caution I'd raise is that these numbers don't include spider
filtering. Why is this important? Well, a lot of traffic is driven by
crawlers and spiders and automata, particularly on smaller projects,
and it can lead to weirdness as a result. With the granular pagecount
files there's some work that can be done to detect this (for example,
using burst detection and a few heuristics around concentration
measures to eliminate pages that are clearly driven by automated
traffic - see the recent analytics mailing list thread) but only some.
I appreciate this is a flaw in the data we are releasing, not in your
work, which is an excellent read and highly interesting :). I agree
that understanding the lack of development in the PRC and ROK is
crucial - we keep talking about the next billion readers but only
talking :(

On 16 March 2015 at 02:21, h hant...@gmail.com wrote:
 Dear all,

 I have some findings to show the page views per Internet user
 measurement may help comparing different language editions of Wikipedia.
 Criticism and suggestions are welcome.


 -
 http://people.oii.ox.ac.uk/hanteng/2015/03/15/comparing-language-development-in-wikipedia-in-terms-of-page-views-per-internet-users/

 Which language version of Wikipedia enjoys the most page views per language
 Internet user than expected? It is Finnish. In terms of absolute positive
 and negative gap, English has the widest positive gap whereas Chinese has
 the largest negative gap.

 ..

 In particular, it is known that Wikipedia (and Google which often favours
 Wikipedia) faces local competition in the People's Republic of China and
 South Korea. Therefore it is understandable the page views may be lower in
 Chinese and Korean Wikipedia language projects simply because some users'
 need to read user-generated encyclopedias are satisfied by other websites.
 However, it remains an important question to examine why these particular
 Latin and Asian languages are under-developed for Wikipedia projects.

 ___
 Wiki-research-l mailing list
 Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org
 https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l




-- 
Oliver Keyes
Research Analyst
Wikimedia Foundation

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Re: [Wiki-research-l] (no subject)

2015-03-16 Thread Ziko van Dijk
Hello,

With all admiration for the maths, I think that we can learn from these
figures less than we might hope to. In these statistics I often see a
strangly high proportion of traffic from the US or other countries that is
difficult to explain. Why, for example, should there be to many people in
the US who are interested in Frisian Wikipedia?

Even if the numbers and proportions are right: there are too many factors
to consider.

Some years ago I did some research to single Wikipedia language versions,
and it still seems to be the most useful way to combine several methods.
Very important are interviews with the local Wikipedians. It would be great
to have more interviews with readers or potential readers (or
potential non-readers) in order to find out why a Wikipedia language
version does grow, or not.

Kind regards
Ziko


Am Montag, 16. März 2015 schrieb Oliver Keyes :

 Awesome work! It's interesting to see Finnish as the outlier here. Do
 we have any fi-users on the list who can comment on this and might
 know what's going on? (And, in the absence of Finns: Jan, heard
 anything from across the border? :p)

 The only caution I'd raise is that these numbers don't include spider
 filtering. Why is this important? Well, a lot of traffic is driven by
 crawlers and spiders and automata, particularly on smaller projects,
 and it can lead to weirdness as a result. With the granular pagecount
 files there's some work that can be done to detect this (for example,
 using burst detection and a few heuristics around concentration
 measures to eliminate pages that are clearly driven by automated
 traffic - see the recent analytics mailing list thread) but only some.
 I appreciate this is a flaw in the data we are releasing, not in your
 work, which is an excellent read and highly interesting :). I agree
 that understanding the lack of development in the PRC and ROK is
 crucial - we keep talking about the next billion readers but only
 talking :(

 On 16 March 2015 at 02:21, h hant...@gmail.com javascript:; wrote:
  Dear all,
 
  I have some findings to show the page views per Internet user
  measurement may help comparing different language editions of Wikipedia.
  Criticism and suggestions are welcome.
 
 
  -
 
 http://people.oii.ox.ac.uk/hanteng/2015/03/15/comparing-language-development-in-wikipedia-in-terms-of-page-views-per-internet-users/
 
  Which language version of Wikipedia enjoys the most page views per
 language
  Internet user than expected? It is Finnish. In terms of absolute positive
  and negative gap, English has the widest positive gap whereas Chinese has
  the largest negative gap.
 
  ..
 
  In particular, it is known that Wikipedia (and Google which often favours
  Wikipedia) faces local competition in the People's Republic of China and
  South Korea. Therefore it is understandable the page views may be lower
 in
  Chinese and Korean Wikipedia language projects simply because some users'
  need to read user-generated encyclopedias are satisfied by other
 websites.
  However, it remains an important question to examine why these particular
  Latin and Asian languages are under-developed for Wikipedia projects.
 
  ___
  Wiki-research-l mailing list
  Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org javascript:;
  https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l
 



 --
 Oliver Keyes
 Research Analyst
 Wikimedia Foundation

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 Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org javascript:;
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Re: [Wiki-research-l] (no subject)

2015-03-16 Thread Pine W
A similar phenomenon occurs here in the US with northern cities
(specifically Seattle and Minneapolis) often ranking highly on measures of
literacy like library checkouts, newspaper circulation,  and education
levels. When people spend free time indoors due to cold and damp weather, I
speculate that they tend to engage in activities like reading, playing
musical instruments and computer games, improving their education, and of
couse watching Seahawks football games. ;) I hope that we will make good
use of this phenomena in Seattle by engaging more people in Cascadia
Wikimedians activities.

Pine
On Mar 16, 2015 1:32 PM, Leinonen Teemu teemu.leino...@aalto.fi wrote:

  On 16.3.2015, at 11.30, Oliver Keyes oke...@wikimedia.org wrote:
 
  Awesome work! It's interesting to see Finnish as the outlier here. Do
  we have any fi-users on the list who can comment on this and might
  know what's going on? (And, in the absence of Finns: Jan, heard
  anything from across the border? :p)

 To find a certain societal explanation for this, one good have a look of
 the Swedish, Norwegian, Danish, Icelandic Wikipedias. If they come high,
 too, I would explain this with the Nordic people’s interest in reading (and
 high level of general education).

 Some earlier studies by UNESCO have demonstrated that the people in Nordic
 countries read more newspapers, books etc. than people in the rest of the
 world. If I remember right the Finns has beaten the Nordic countries also
 in these comparisons. So the explanation can be reading habits in generate,
 which is a cause of high level of basic education, library network, equal
 society etc.

 - Teemu

 --
 Teemu Leinonen
 http://teemuleinonen.fi
 +358 50 351 6796
 Media Lab
 http://mlab.uiah.fi
 Aalto University
 School of Arts, Design and Architecture
 --
 ___
 Wiki-research-l mailing list
 Wiki-research-l@lists.wikimedia.org
 https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wiki-research-l

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Re: [Wiki-research-l] (no subject)

2015-03-16 Thread Kerry Raymond
And very long winter nights? Are there seasonal variations?

-Original Message-
From: wiki-research-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org
[mailto:wiki-research-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Leinonen
Teemu
Sent: Tuesday, 17 March 2015 4:32 AM
To: Research into Wikimedia content and communities
Subject: Re: [Wiki-research-l] (no subject)

 On 16.3.2015, at 11.30, Oliver Keyes oke...@wikimedia.org wrote:
 
 Awesome work! It's interesting to see Finnish as the outlier here. Do
 we have any fi-users on the list who can comment on this and might
 know what's going on? (And, in the absence of Finns: Jan, heard
 anything from across the border? :p)

To find a certain societal explanation for this, one good have a look of the
Swedish, Norwegian, Danish, Icelandic Wikipedias. If they come high, too, I
would explain this with the Nordic people's interest in reading (and high
level of general education).


Some earlier studies by UNESCO have demonstrated that the people in Nordic
countries read more newspapers, books etc. than people in the rest of the
world. If I remember right the Finns has beaten the Nordic countries also in
these comparisons. So the explanation can be reading habits in generate,
which is a cause of high level of basic education, library network, equal
society etc.

- Teemu 

--
Teemu Leinonen
http://teemuleinonen.fi
+358 50 351 6796
Media Lab
http://mlab.uiah.fi
Aalto University 
School of Arts, Design and Architecture
--
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[Wiki-research-l] (no subject)

2015-03-16 Thread h
Dear all,

I have some findings to show the page views per Internet user
measurement may help comparing different language editions of Wikipedia.
Criticism and suggestions are welcome.


-
http://people.oii.ox.ac.uk/hanteng/2015/03/15/comparing-language-development-in-wikipedia-in-terms-of-page-views-per-internet-users/

Which language version of Wikipedia enjoys the most page views per language
Internet user than expected? It is Finnish. In terms of absolute positive
and negative gap, English has the widest positive gap whereas Chinese has
the largest negative gap.

..

In particular, it is known that Wikipedia (and Google which often favours
Wikipedia) faces local competition in the People's Republic of China and
South Korea. Therefore it is understandable the page views may be lower in
Chinese and Korean Wikipedia language projects simply because some users'
need to read user-generated encyclopedias are satisfied by other websites.
However, it remains an important question to examine why these particular
Latin and Asian languages are under-developed for Wikipedia projects.
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