[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org changed: What|Removed |Added See Also|https://bugzilla.wikimedia. | |org/show_bug.cgi?id=59129 | --- Comment #51 from Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org --- *** Bug 59129 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. *** -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 Quim Gil q...@wikimedia.org changed: What|Removed |Added See Also||https://bugzilla.wikimedia. ||org/show_bug.cgi?id=59129 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 --- Comment #50 from Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org --- jidanni: That's really stuff to discuss in bug 49597 (plus your statement is wrong as we will not run unstable development versions in production.) Feel free to create a bug report here asking to backport the 4.5 fix for https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=148564 once we've upgraded to 4.4. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 --- Comment #45 from Quim Gil q...@wikimedia.org --- I started with default quotes, but the comment was getting really long. Let me try harder: (In reply to comment #24) Also, I hope I'm not the only one who thinks it's rather odd that we're trying to build an encyclopedia, but the most important image on the whole site is not an image used to illustrate the topic of an article, but the site's logo. I would hope that people who use our wiki are painstaking[ly] craft[ing] their content rather than a little pretty image. Heh, I was thinking of saying something along those lines too. A wiki where the logo is painstaking[ly] crafted but the content is not painstaking[ly] crafted is worthless. True for Wikipedia, not for all the MediaWikis out there. And even without leaving the Wikimedia context: what about Wiktionary, Wikiquotes, Wikisource...? We can't assume that the quality, completeness, and interest of a wiki page is measured by the existence of an illustrative image or not. That I know of there are 3 current functional uses of the logo being a background-image: - Without any special coding a background-image that is too large gets cut off (we have skins with various logo area sizes, and the logo can be any arbitrary url to any unvetted image), unlike an img which if allowed to grow will overlap the content area. (note that since $wgLogo is an arbitrary url we can't do any ImageMagic stuff with it, iirc MediaWiki also functions mostly in hosts with url fopen wrappers disabled, so we also can't do anything that would require MW to download an image from a url) - Using a background-image with a center center position as we do means we cater to a variety of logo sizes while still perfectly centering them in all skins. - Using a background-image also functions as a way to allow the logo and the logo area to be customized in various ways by css. I don't see why we should protect admins from themselves. Cutting an image right is not that difficult. Our documentation currently says that a logo is expected to be 135x135. Admins playing with other sizes (locally or remotely) do it at ther own risk. https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:$wgLogo I did some testing to see what can be done with an img instead of the background-image. With use of overflow: hidden; it is possible to have the logo area cut off overly large logos easily. Good! One problem less. The centering however is a bit of good and bad. A text-align: center; does permit the logo to be horizontally centered like the background-image. However we cannot vertically center a logo that is an img like we can for a background-image. With some tweaks to the css it is possible to instead make the logo area vertically shrink to fit the logo of whatever height. However this has two caveats, both I'm sure we'll end up with people complaining about. A) Of course, the wiki with vertically small logos may not be happy about their logo area suddenly changing size. Technically they can pad their logos or hardcode margins. However that's not going to make wiki with extra skins including ones where a vertically conservative logo is a good thing happy. And forcing people to hardcode px margins is not a good practice for us (actually if they don't enable site stylesheets they can't even do that without code hacks, another bad tradeoff). If your logo is expected to be 135x135, then you can place your vertically small logo within a square canvas leaving the rest transparent. B) More importantly, while the logo hasn't loaded the navigation will appear higher up in the sidebar, and once it's loaded will move to accommodate the logo. This will have the effect of making the sidebar jump around, create a visual distraction during the loading of the page, and can actually create a usability defect where a user goes to click a link, the logo loads, the sidebar jumps, and then the user clicks a different link. (this problem will be particularly noticed by low-speed Internet users) Mmm even if you are placing that image inside a fixed size div, in combination with the mentioned overflow: hidden? -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 --- Comment #46 from Daniel Friesen mediawiki-b...@nadir-seen-fire.com --- (In reply to comment #45) Heh, I was thinking of saying something along those lines too. A wiki where the logo is painstaking[ly] crafted but the content is not painstaking[ly] crafted is worthless. True for Wikipedia, not for all the MediaWikis out there. And even without leaving the Wikimedia context: what about Wiktionary, Wikiquotes, Wikisource...? We can't assume that the quality, completeness, and interest of a wiki page is measured by the existence of an illustrative image or not. I guess I personally glossed over the image used to illustrate the topic of an article part. When I said content I literally meant content. I view the logo as a superfluous decoration, what's important is the content. Tbh, on a wiki like Wiktionary where pages don't have images I don't really think of the logo as a substitute for them. IMHO pages like those that are text-only and don't have a representative image are typically best shared just like that, as text-only shares. I don't see why we should protect admins from themselves. Cutting an image right is not that difficult. Our documentation currently says that a logo is expected to be 135x135. Admins playing with other sizes (locally or remotely) do it at ther own risk. https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:$wgLogo Our recommendation for logo size is pretty much just pulled out of a hat, we've never had a true standard for image sizes. - In one of MW's first skins, Nostalgia, the logo was simply inserted into the corner as an img there was no fixed sidebar area content simply floated around the logo, you could use absolutely any logo size you wanted. - In Standard/Classic the logo area was somewhere around 135px in height. - MonoBook's logo area is 155px in height. - And Vector's logo area is 160px in height. - And we have no clue what size of logo area other skins use. Now take note of how I stated ###px in height, I mean that quite literally. Our logos only guarantee a specific number of pixels for the height. While by default the width typically matches the same number of pixels as the height, our logo area widths are actually defined as ##em numbers. They are explicitly set so that the width of the logo area can both grow beyond what you'd expect and shrink to smaller than it is by default. So our first skins had no restrictions on logo sizes, our default skins have been changing the restriction each time we make a new one, the width is actually not fixed to a pixel size. I can also confirm that site authors don't care about what our manual says about $wgLogo. They simply create whatever fits in the logo area on their default skin. And that number grows, back when Wikia had monobook as a default I made plenty of 150x150px and 155x155px logos. Rather than protecting site authors, cutting off logos is a little more about protecting site users using non-default skins. There's also the whole bit about customizing the logo by site css. A number of wikis do this in practice. en.wp does it in Common.css to provide mdpi and hdpi logos. And other wikis do it overriding the default logo in some namespaces, etc... If your logo is expected to be 135x135, then you can place your vertically small logo within a square canvas leaving the rest transparent. ... Mmm even if you are placing that image inside a fixed size div, in combination with the mentioned overflow: hidden? A fixed size div will fix the jump, but it won't fix the vertical centering of the logo. We can't know the height of the logo beforehand. And fixing the height will simply leave the logo at the top of that region. So small logos still won't be vertically centered. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 --- Comment #47 from jida...@jidanni.org --- You are receiving this mail because: * You reported the bug. OK that is very nice, but there is no way for me to unsubscribe due to bug 58066 so everybody please stop talking until then. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 Bawolff (Brian Wolff) bawolff...@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added CC||bawolff...@gmail.com --- Comment #48 from Bawolff (Brian Wolff) bawolff...@gmail.com --- (In reply to comment #47) You are receiving this mail because: * You reported the bug. OK that is very nice, but there is no way for me to unsubscribe due to bug 58066 so everybody please stop talking until then. Umm no. Provided comments are on topic, people are going to comment on bug as needed in order to work towards a resolution. If you don't like it, you can: *Change your email prefs in https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/userprefs.cgi?tab=email to not email for bugs you created *Set up an email filter *Delete the email without reading it etc -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 --- Comment #49 from jida...@jidanni.org --- (In reply to comment #48) In fresh Bugzilla it would take me just one click to unsubscribe, just like the CC people. Alas, with this old Bugzilla, one needs to make a Spamassassin Filter for just this one bug, lest one mess up ones other settings. OK I'll use your third option. Certainly this can't last forever. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 Quim Gil q...@wikimedia.org changed: What|Removed |Added CC||q...@wikimedia.org Version|1.20.0 |1.23-git Summary|Make the wiki logo visible |Make the wiki logo visible |to Facebook sharing |to Facebook and Google+ |features|sharing features --- Comment #38 from Quim Gil q...@wikimedia.org --- I just want to mention that this problem affects not only Facebook users sharing URLs of MediaWiki sites, also Google+ users, and probably any other service featuring URLs with an image retrieved automatically. When those pages have no images, these services take automatically the little ugly Powered by MediaWiki banner in the footer, or nothing if it has been removed. The prominent site logo is always ignored. As someone sharing frequently MediaWiki pages in so-called social networks, I believe this problem is being underestimated here. These services are currently the main channel of promotion of URLs, and these services feature prominently the main image contained in those URLs because they make the link more attractive. If you want to promote a MediaWiki page without graphics you will be totally out of luck: there will be no way to use at least your site logo. Meanwhile, other wikis and CMSs... -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 --- Comment #39 from Jared Zimmerman (WMF) jared.zimmer...@wikimedia.org --- is this a dupe of https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=31338 or https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=29242 ? -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 Bartosz Dziewoński matma@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added CC||matma@gmail.com --- Comment #40 from Bartosz Dziewoński matma@gmail.com --- Bug 29242 – nope, entirely different thing. Bug 31338 sounds related, maybe that approach could be used here (but I don't know enough about this stuff to judge). For listeners tuning in now, the reasons again regular img src were outlined in comment 27. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 Bartosz Dziewoński matma@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added See Also||https://bugzilla.wikimedia. ||org/show_bug.cgi?id=31338 -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 --- Comment #41 from Jared Zimmerman (WMF) jared.zimmer...@wikimedia.org --- Can someone make an umbrella tracking bug for Better presentation of content shared via mediawiki on external sites I want to make sure whoever works on this doesn't miss anything. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 --- Comment #42 from Bartosz Dziewoński matma@gmail.com --- What bugs would that track? If you have a list, just create one. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 --- Comment #43 from Quim Gil q...@wikimedia.org --- About comment #27 Ref wiki pages without images being bad. True for Wikipedia, not for all the MediaWikis out there. And even without leaving the Wikimedia context: what about Wiktionary, Wikiquotes, Wikisource...? Ref wrong images becoming site logos. Isn't that problem obvious when it happens, and isn't the first interest of a sane admin to make sure the logo looks good? I don't see why we should protect admins from themselves. Cutting an image right is not that difficult. This leaves us purely with the technical problems described when using img src. I'm not saying they are not relevant, I just want to focus the discussion in the technical arguments, leaving aside the rest. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
[Bug 30113] Make the wiki logo visible to Facebook and Google+ sharing features
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30113 --- Comment #44 from Daniel Friesen mediawiki-b...@nadir-seen-fire.com --- My comment? Could you be a little more specific about which parts of the comment you're referencing, I'm having a little bit of trouble matching them up to parts of my comment. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Wikibugs-l mailing list Wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikibugs-l
