[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-11-06 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069
Bug 53069 depends on bug 72855, which changed state.

Bug 72855 Summary: Purge is required to edit some page as unregistered user
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=72855

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|NEW |RESOLVED
 Resolution|--- |INVALID

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-11-01 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #29 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it ---
I'm going to add some blockers just because this is the tracking bug; it
doesn't mean I think they are requirements for anything.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-11-01 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Depends on||72851

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-11-01 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Depends on||72852

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-11-01 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Depends on||72855

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-11-01 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Depends on|72851   |

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-08-22 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069
Bug 53069 depends on bug 59937, which changed state.

Bug 59937 Summary: Add intermediate screen to warn logged-out editors similar 
to 'anoneditwarning' message
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=59937

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|PATCH_TO_REVIEW |RESOLVED
 Resolution|--- |FIXED

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-08-15 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069
Bug 53069 depends on bug 56834, which changed state.

Bug 56834 Summary: Standard pre-echo you have new messages bar is not 
displayed
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56834

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|PATCH_TO_REVIEW |RESOLVED
 Resolution|--- |FIXED

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-06-09 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #28 from Jon jrob...@wikimedia.org ---
Nemo - See
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Mobile_wikitext_editing#Anonymous_editing

Apps is launching with this first. The web is a small team and we are not ready
to face anonymous editing on Wikimedia sites. Any help with getting the
infrastructure their for 3rd parties though is appreciated. The first helpful
step towards this would be to get a patch for bug 59937.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-06-08 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Assignee|kw...@wikimedia.org |wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia.
   ||org

--- Comment #27 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it ---
Almost one year after being filed, this bug is still lacking serious blockers:
does this mean that the Mobile team is unable to articulate the reasons for
editing to be disabled on the mobile site?

Bug 56834 probably requires about 1 h coding to restore the traditional message
bar on mobile; bug 59937 is not really a blocker. If there were no other
reasons to enable editing on mobile, we could do it in a week.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-06-08 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Assignee|wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia. |mpinc...@wikimedia.org
   |org |

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-29 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|PATCH_TO_REVIEW |ASSIGNED
   Assignee|b...@mzmcbride.com |kw...@wikimedia.org

--- Comment #26 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com ---
(In reply to comment #25)
 Two more technical requirements for anonymous editing are: 
 
 *Ability to notify anonymous mobile editors (e.g. IP block threats, thanking)
 
 *Ability for anonymous mobile editors to view their talk pages 

This bug is a tracking bug. If you look above at the Depends on: list at the
top of the page, you can see which bugs are listed as dependencies for this bug
to be considered resolved (currently bug 53076, bug 56834, and bug 59937). Bug
56831, also listed, has a line through it because it's been resolved.

Bug 56834 covers the ability to notify anonymous mobile editors of new
messages.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-28 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #25 from kenan wang kw...@wikimedia.org ---
Two more technical requirements for anonymous editing are: 

*Ability to notify anonymous mobile editors (e.g. IP block threats, thanking)

*Ability for anonymous mobile editors to view their talk pages 

I know this was brought up previously but let me expand more on this. These
features are important because as
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Blocking_policy#Blocking describes:

Administrators must supply a clear and specific block reason that indicates
why a user was blocked. Block reasons should avoid the use of jargon as much as
possible so that blocked users may better understand them. Administrators
should notify users when blocking them by leaving a message on their user talk
page. It is often easier to explain the reason for a block at the time than it
is to explain a block well after the event.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-24 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #24 from kenan wang kw...@wikimedia.org ---
Hi all,

Here is our plan for Wikitext editing on mobile. As you can see anonymous
editing is a part of that plan. The TLDR is that we do believe that anonymous
editing is important on mobile, but we want to make sure that we roll it out in
a way that does not cause unnecessary headache for the community or the WMF
mobile team; thus we are planning a 3 stage rollout process. Please take a look
and leave comments on the talk page, I look forward to ironing out some of the
details with you all:

https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Mobile_wikitext_editing

Note: This will also be distributed more widely in the next week or so (village
pumps, email lists, etc.)

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-22 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #23 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org ---
Change 106851 abandoned by Jdlrobson:
Allow anonymous editing

Reason:
From the activity on the bug it's clear this needs some more thought. Kenan
Wang is working on a strategy to enable anonymous editing that he says he will
be sharing soon.

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/106851

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-17 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #22 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com ---
From bug 59937 comment 3 by kenan wang:

---
Hi Legoktm. We have decided not to approve this patch as the warning takes up
too much of the limited screen real estate of the edit screen. However,
anonymous mobile editing is an area that we are looking into. In the next few
days we will be publishing a preliminary plan for enabling anonymous editing
within mobile. This will be published on mediawiki.org and available for
comment by the community. When that is published I will also post a link to
that here.
---

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-11 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #17 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com ---
(In reply to comment #0)

[[m:Research:Anonymous edits]] may prove useful here. There may be newer
research as well.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-11 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #18 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com ---
(In reply to comment #17)
 There may be newer research as well.

[[commons:File:Anonymous editors - WMF RD showcase (Dec. 2013).pdf]]

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-11 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Quim Gil q...@wikimedia.org changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Priority|High|Normal

--- Comment #19 from Quim Gil q...@wikimedia.org ---
(In reply to comment #15)
 Comment 7 was not an attempt to have a discussion, it was an attempt to
 lecture. Perhaps in your culture five consecutive bullets of according to
 ...
 constitutes a discussion, but I think it'd be better if you directly
 addressed
 the substantive points raised above or didn't post here.

Good discussions deserve good argumentation, and I did my best trying to
explain why you shouldn't keep reverting the priorities set by maintainers.

I have shared my humble opinion at Bug 53076 comment 12. This discussion about
anonymous mobile editing focuses on Wikimedia principles and needs. The
decision to restrict mobile editing to registered users is more strategic than
technical, and therefore (imho) that discussion belongs more to mobile-l,
wikimedia-l, Meta, etc than to MobileFrontend Bugzilla reports. The Mobile and
Design teams are basically executing according to that strategy. Challenge the
strategy, be convincing, and if/when anonymous mobile editing becomes a higher
priority for these teams then they will work accordingly.

In the meantime, any contributions to MobileFrontend improving the experience
of anonymous editing are welcome, and 3rd party MediaWikis might want to
benefit from them regardless of the decisions made in the Wikimedia context.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-11 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #20 from Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com ---
(In reply to comment #19)

 Good discussions deserve good argumentation, and I did my best trying to
 explain why you shouldn't keep reverting the priorities set by maintainers.
 
 I have shared my humble opinion at Bug 53076 comment 12. This discussion
 about
 anonymous mobile editing focuses on Wikimedia principles and needs. The
 decision to restrict mobile editing to registered users is more strategic
 than
 technical, and therefore (imho) that discussion belongs more to mobile-l,
 wikimedia-l, Meta, etc than to MobileFrontend Bugzilla reports. 

Strategic in what way? Bug 52442 comment 14 which was the rationale that was
given was basically technical issues.

It's unclear why discussions on meta/wikimedia-l/etc. are required. Shouldn't
any violation of [[m:Founding principles]] (it's #2 on the list) immediately be
something that should be fixed?

 The Mobile
 and
 Design teams are basically executing according to that strategy. Challenge
 the
 strategy, be convincing, and if/when anonymous mobile editing becomes a
 higher
 priority for these teams then they will work accordingly.

I'm not sure how to convince someone that the founding principles are extremely
important without just saying that. 

 In the meantime, any contributions to MobileFrontend improving the experience
 of anonymous editing are welcome, and 3rd party MediaWikis might want to
 benefit from them regardless of the decisions made in the Wikimedia context.

Indeed :)

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-11 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #21 from Quim Gil q...@wikimedia.org ---
(In reply to comment #20)
 Strategic in what way? Bug 52442 comment 14 which was the rationale that was
 given was basically technical issues.

Maybe it's simply a matter of wording, it doesn't matter. What matters to
understand the current priorities of the Mobile Web team is this:

https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Engineering/2013-14_Goals#Mobile

As you can see, not only anonymous mobile editing doesn't appear there, in fact
the Mobile team has some targets tightly related to more and more engaged
registered users in Wikimedia projects. 

Developers interested in good support for anonymous mobile editing in
MobileFrontend can contribute in areas where the Mobile team won't focus now.
This work is happening as some contributors are very motivated, very good! If
what you want is to change the priorities of the Mobile team so they can focus
on anonymous editing (necessarily changing their current goals) then this is
requires a more strategic discussion that I really don't think that will or
should happen in Bugzilla reports. This is what I'm trying to say.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Quim Gil q...@wikimedia.org changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 CC||q...@wikimedia.org

--- Comment #7 from Quim Gil q...@wikimedia.org ---
(In reply to comment #6)
 If you're confused about why I set the priority or
 severity a particular way, try discussion instead of blind reversion. Thanks.

Let me try discussion, although this should probably be discussed elsewhere.
I'm happy to continue the conversation wherever you prefer.

* According to https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bug_management/Bugzilla_etiquette
(draft), bug status, priority and milestone should reflect reality (in summary
form), they do not cause it. If in doubt, read about the meaning of the fields
and do not change them, but add a comment suggesting the change and convincing
reasons for it

* According to https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bugzilla/Fields#Priority ,
priority should normally be set by the developers who plan to work on the bug
(or by the bugwrangler), not by the one filing the bug or by outside observers

* According to https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Developers/Maintainers , the
maintainers of MobileFrontend are the WMF mobile team, especially Arthur
Richards (all CCed here)

* According to https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bug_wrangler , Andre's role
includes working closely with product managers and developers to prioritize,
categorize and assign bugs based on Mediawiki features and extensions

* According to Gerrit you don't seem to be a regular contributor to this
extension.

For all these reasons I believe that you, me, or anybody else interested in
this area but not developing for it are not entitled to enter prioritization
wars. This is Bugzilla, and all of us work here to improve things, but if a
maintainer or the bug wrangler defines explicitly a priority and you still
disagree then the solution is not to revert again.

MZMcBride, I'm not attempting to discuss your points in this and other related
reports. I have no opinion about the topic. However, I do have an opinion about
the usefulness of prioritization wars in Bugzilla. After many years seeing them
happening in various reports of different projects the pattern is always the
same: a first round might have some justification but after some back-and-forth
they are always counterproductive, wasting people's energies and damaging
community's collaboration and good mood. And all this for no good reason, since
at the end the maintainers developing the component are the ones deciding what
goes in it and when. They tend not to be convinced by users reverting their
prioritizations in Bugzilla.

You are a vet, and you know all this well. If you want to challenge the current
priorities of the MobileFrontend, fine. You can bring your arguments here as
you do, and you can also escalate to other venues in case you think more eyes
and opinions are needed. Up to you. But please, let the Mobile team reflect
here the current priorities they have for their plans. Thank you.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #8 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it ---
I already said all I have to say about this topic at bug 52442 comment 4 and
below, just a point:

(In reply to comment #7)
 [...] And all this for no good reason,
 since
 at the end the maintainers developing the component are the ones deciding
 what
 goes in it and when. [...]

This is a tracking bug (which also means that usually its priority/severity
fields don't mean much) and part of the rationale provided was:

(In reply to comment #4)
 I believe there's some awful configuration
 variable that needs to be killed in order to resolve this bug. I'll try to
 investigate later.

Configuration matters are not under exclusive control of the extensions'
maintainers. If a WMF/site policy happened to say that a certain configuration
is mandatory, it wouldn't matter much what the authors of the code think about
it and it it takes no intervention on their end to make it happen.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #9 from Quim Gil q...@wikimedia.org ---
(In reply to comment #8)
 If a WMF/site policy happened to say that a certain configuration
 is mandatory, it wouldn't matter much what the authors of the code think
 about it and it it takes no intervention on their end to make it happen.

Yes, I also thought about this too. The situation is the same though: the
decision of enabling anonymous editing or not will not be decided because
certain Bugzilla report have one priority or another. As you point out that
decision doesn't even rely on the Mobile team alone. That discussion can't go
far in MobileFrontend bug reports, it must happen elsewhere. I would start with
the mobile-l or the wikimedia-l mailing list, depending on where do you want to
put the emphasis.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Jon jrob...@wikimedia.org changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Severity|major   |enhancement

--- Comment #10 from Jon jrob...@wikimedia.org ---
Resetting to enhancement. Sigh.
I will write a bot if necessary.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Luis Villa (WMF Legal) lvi...@wikimedia.org changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 CC||lvi...@wikimedia.org

--- Comment #11 from Luis Villa (WMF Legal) lvi...@wikimedia.org ---
This is a tracking bug (which also means that usually its priority/severity
fields don't mean much)

Whether or not those fields mean anything is a decision for the developer who
is charged with resolving the bug, not the bug filer. Quim pointed this out
above, and the fact that it is a tracking bug does not affect that.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #12 from Nemo federicol...@tiscali.it ---
(In reply to comment #11)
 This is a tracking bug (which also means that usually its priority/severity
 fields don't mean much)
 
 Whether or not those fields mean anything is a decision for the developer who
 is charged with resolving the bug

By definition, there's no such a thing for tracking bugs. So you've just
confirmed what I said.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #13 from Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org ---
Change 106851 had a related patch set uploaded by MZMcBride:
Allow anonymous editing

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/106851

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Gerrit Notification Bot gerritad...@wikimedia.org changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|NEW |PATCH_TO_REVIEW

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Assignee|wikibugs-l@lists.wikimedia. |b...@mzmcbride.com
   |org |

--- Comment #14 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com ---
(In reply to comment #10)
 I will write a bot if necessary.

No need. I fixed up Gerrit change 106851 for you. It's ready for review.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #15 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com ---
(In reply to comment #7)
 Let me try discussion, although this should probably be discussed elsewhere.
 I'm happy to continue the conversation wherever you prefer.

Quim: if you're truly interested in discussion, please respond to comment 4 or
the relevant portion of comment 6.

Comment 7 was not an attempt to have a discussion, it was an attempt to
lecture. Perhaps in your culture five consecutive bullets of according to ...
constitutes a discussion, but I think it'd be better if you directly addressed
the substantive points raised above or didn't post here.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Depends on||59937

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #16 from Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com ---
(In reply to comment #3)

 Basically there needs to be some mobile equivalent of the anoneditwarning
 ([[MediaWiki:Anoneditwarning]]).

This is now bug 59937.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-09 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Priority|Normal  |High
   Severity|enhancement |major

--- Comment #4 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com ---
The draft privacy policy at [[m:privacy policy]] reiterates:

---
You are not required to create an account to read or contribute to a Wikimedia
Site, except under rare circumstances. However, if you contribute without
signing in, your contribution will be publicly attributed to the IP address
associated with your device.
---

The human-friendly summary also includes you may: read, edit, or use any
Wikimedia Site without registering an account.

Quoting comment 2, anonymous editing is a [[m:founding principle]] of
Wikimedia
wikis that can't simply be brushed aside by a small development team.

This is a high priority issue. I believe there's some awful configuration
variable that needs to be killed in order to resolve this bug. I'll try to
investigate later.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-09 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Depends on||53076

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-09 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Priority|High|Normal
   Severity|major   |enhancement

--- Comment #5 from Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org ---
MZMcBride: Please don't repeatedly reset priority to high plus keep severity as
enhancement as this request obviously covers enhancing features.
Actionable dependency bugs for this ticket could be high if the development
teams considers them high priority when they triage and assess tickets.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2014-01-09 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Priority|Normal  |High
   Severity|enhancement |major

--- Comment #6 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com ---
(In reply to comment #5)
 MZMcBride: Please don't repeatedly reset priority to high plus keep severity
 as enhancement as this request obviously covers enhancing features.

Andre: It isn't an enhancement to support core functionality. And this is a
high priority given the founding principles and other policies in play, as
explained in comment 4. If you're confused about why I set the priority or
severity a particular way, try discussion instead of blind reversion. Thanks.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-12-24 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Bug 53069 depends on bug 56834, which changed state.

Bug 56834 Summary: Standard pre-echo you have new messages bar is not 
displayed
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56834

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|RESOLVED|REOPENED
 Resolution|WONTFIX |---

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-12-23 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Bug 53069 depends on bug 56834, which changed state.

Bug 56834 Summary: Former pre-echo you have new messages bar is not displayed
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56834

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|REOPENED|RESOLVED
 Resolution|--- |WONTFIX

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-11-12 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Bug 53069 depends on bug 56833, which changed state.

Bug 56833 Summary: 3rd party wiki's with $wgMFAnonymousEditing enabled are not 
allowed to edit
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56833

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|PATCH_TO_REVIEW |RESOLVED
 Resolution|--- |INVALID

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-11-12 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Depends on|56833   |

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-11-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Bug 53069 depends on bug 56834, which changed state.

Bug 56834 Summary: Standard pre-echo you have new messages bar is not 
displayed
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56834

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|RESOLVED|REOPENED
 Resolution|WONTFIX |---

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-11-10 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Bug 53069 depends on bug 56831, which changed state.

Bug 56831 Summary: Anonymous editing broken
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56831

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|PATCH_TO_REVIEW |RESOLVED
 Resolution|--- |FIXED

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-11-09 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Depends on||56831

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-11-09 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Depends on||56833

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-11-09 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #3 from Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com ---
(In reply to comment #0)
 This bug tracks obstacles to enabling anonymous editing via
 [[mw:Extension:MobileFrontend]].

Thanks. I've added blockers for a few technical issues I found when testing.

I'm not going to attempt to respond to everything, just stuff I'm concerned
about.

 It's not quite so simple as a permissions change. Longer explanation below,
 but
 the tl;dr is that there's a lot of design and development work that needs to
 be
 done before we can just flip the switch.
 
 First and most importantly: editing a wiki anonymously  means leaving a
 permanent, searchable trace of your IP address in connection with your edits;
 this is actually a non-trivial and in many cases highly sensitive piece of
 metadata. As a bare minimum requirement to ensure the safety and privacy of
 our
 users, we would need to build an educational system into the mobile editor
 that
 alerted users of their logged out status, made them understand the
 implications
 of this (e.g. if they're in a country where their edits could put them in
 danger, make sure they're aware that they're basically geo-targeting
 themselves
 by editing without an account), and let them login/signup before saving their
 edit. On desktop, we do this with a series of templates and mediawiki
 messages,
 but mobile has a very different, radically constrained UI, and solving this
 problem in a way that doesn't hinder the ability to actually make an edit and
 gets people to read and understand the disclaimer isn't easy or
 straightforward. 

Basically there needs to be some mobile equivalent of the anoneditwarning
([[MediaWiki:Anoneditwarning]]).

 In addition to this bare minimum requirement, there are a
 host
 of other social, UX-related, and technical challenges to opening up an
 anonymous editing funnel on mobile:
 
 1. Mobile devices are quite different from desktop in that it's much easier
 to
 fat-finger and accidentally do something you didn't intend to do. A highly
 motivated IP editor on desktop who accidentally (or as a test) blanks a page
 might discover the page history and the undo button – that's much harder to
 do
 on mobile, where the history view is currently so tiny and cluttered that
 undo
 is barely enough of a target to tap on, let alone see. Until we have a nice,
 clean, mobile-friendly history view and revert actions (something the team is
 going to be working on sometime this year), you'll get a lot of first-time
 users messing up or messing around with no way to clean up the mess.

Is this for users to revert themselves by finding the page history and hitting
undo? 
I'd imagine that if I'm using huggle a revert would be near instantaneous, but
if I had to use my fat-fingers on a mobile device, it would take at least a
minute.

Is there any evidence that logged in users have this issue? Users are already
forced to view a preview and then hit save, so there already is an extra
confirmation step that desktop doesn't have.

 
 2. On desktop, it's not as huge a break from your workflow to leave what
 you're
 editing, log in, and keep editing; on mobile, where everything is so focused
 and zoomed-in, that feels like a huge break. Unless we made it obvious *why*
 an
 account is beneficial, it's doubtful most anon editors would go through the
 trouble of creating an account to fix a typo -- but that means they're
 missing
 out on important features like a watchlist and a notification system (see
 point
 4).

So we're rejecting an edit from a potential contributor because they don't know
that they can experience more features? That sounds backwards.

 
 3. The abuse filter is already a huge problem for mobile, since on many wikis
 it's configured to show a CAPTCHA for certain conditions (non-autoconfirmed
 users adding links, adding/removing large chunks of text, or, on projects
 like
 Portuguese Wikipedia, making edits of any kind), which in turn causes the
 mobile editor to throw an error. Right now the error rate is hovering at an
 alarming 48% across all projects; making editing available to anons would
 guarantee that the error rate would skyrocket. Until we build a replacement
 for
 the abusefilter CAPTCHA (again, a tricky engineering problem on mobile), we'd
 knowingly be showing anons a broken and unusable edit button most of the
 time.

I found bug 53369 for AbuseFilter, but couldn't find one for CAPTCHA. FWIW, the
AbuseFilter can't be told to show a CAPTCHA, they're two totally separate
extensions.

 
 4. A lot of the features we're building on desktop to keep people in the loop
 about what's happening to their edits (like email and Echo notifications) are
 for logged in users only, and those become extra critical communication
 mechanisms on mobile, where it's harder (and, again, a bigger break from your
 workflow) to find and check your talk page. I'm not sure how we'd build a
 notification 

[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-11-09 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Kunal Mehta (Legoktm) legoktm.wikipe...@gmail.com changed:

   What|Removed |Added

 Depends on||56834

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-11-09 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Bug 53069 depends on bug 56834, which changed state.

Bug 56834 Summary: Previous pre-echo you have new messages bar is not 
displayed
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56834

   What|Removed |Added

 Status|NEW |RESOLVED
 Resolution|--- |WONTFIX

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-08-28 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Priority|High|Normal
   Severity|normal  |enhancement

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-08-27 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Priority|Low |High
   Severity|enhancement |normal

--- Comment #2 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com ---
(In reply to comment #0)
 First and most importantly: editing a wiki anonymously  means leaving a
 permanent, searchable trace of your IP address in connection with your edits;
 this is actually a non-trivial and in many cases highly sensitive piece of
 metadata. As a bare minimum requirement to ensure the safety and privacy of
 our users, we would need to build an educational system into the mobile editor
 that alerted users of their logged out status, made them understand the
 implications of this (e.g. if they're in a country where their edits could put
 them in danger, make sure they're aware that they're basically geo-targeting
 themselves by editing without an account), and let them login/signup before
 saving their edit.

This is a red herring, bordering on fear-mongering. This statement tries to
give the impression that anonymous editing is a new, unheard of concept. This
is silly. Anonymous editing has been fully supported in MediaWiki since the
dawn of time. The issues regarding anonymity, actual user privacy, risks
associated with IP editing, etc. are relevant to Wikimedia, but they have
nothing to do with this bug. Philosophical opposition to anonymous editing is
most certainly not an obstacle (or blocker) to re-enabling anonymous editing
via MobileFrontend.

 1. Mobile devices are quite different from desktop in that it's much easier
 to fat-finger and accidentally do something you didn't intend to do. A highly
 motivated IP editor on desktop who accidentally (or as a test) blanks a page
 might discover the page history and the undo button – that's much harder to
 do on mobile, where the history view is currently so tiny and cluttered that
 undo is barely enough of a target to tap on, let alone see.

The mobile team has been working for years now on re-inventing the user
interface with these considerations in mind. If there are specific issues that
relate to anonymous mobile editing, please file separate bugs that block this
bug. As it is, you seem to be arguing that mobile devices are simply cumbersome
to edit from. I personally agree, but this isn't a blocker to re-enabling
anonymous editing.

 2. On desktop, it's not as huge a break from your workflow to leave what
 you're editing, log in, and keep editing; on mobile, where everything is so
 focused and zoomed-in, that feels like a huge break.

Ummm, you've intentionally disabled anonymous editing. _That_ is what is
disrupting user workflow. If you re-enable anonymous editing, you'll solve this
issue altogether. You're currently arguing well we put up this hurdle, but now
there's a hurdle. It's borderline tautological.

 3. The abuse filter is already a huge problem for mobile, since on many wikis
 it's configured to show a CAPTCHA for certain conditions (non-autoconfirmed
 users adding links, adding/removing large chunks of text, or, on projects
 like Portuguese Wikipedia, making edits of any kind), which in turn causes the
 mobile editor to throw an error. Right now the error rate is hovering at an
 alarming 48% across all projects; making editing available to anons would
 guarantee that the error rate would skyrocket.

I'm not sure what this is about, but it sounds worrying if true. If 48% of
mobile edits are erroring, that would be a very high priority bug to get
resolved. Do you have a link to a bug report tracking this issue? Presumably
this bug report would also include links to the data you're basing these claims
upon.

 4. A lot of the features we're building on desktop to keep people in the loop
 about what's happening to their edits (like email and Echo notifications) are
 for logged in users only, and those become extra critical communication
 mechanisms on mobile, where it's harder (and, again, a bigger break from your
 workflow) to find and check your talk page.

There's a big orange bar. MediaWiki has made intentional design decisions to
ensure that this big orange bar works for both anons and logged-in users.
You're erecting obstacles and other I personally don't like anonymous editing
arguments in the hope that one or some of them will stick. These problems are
_hardly_ unique to mobile editing or anonymous editing. Mentioning in them in
this context is misleading and unhelpful.

 This is already a problem on desktop, but it becomes exponentially more
 problematic with the wildly fluctuating IPs of most mobile devices.

Similar to the opening point, this can and should be discussed separately. It
may make sense to holistically re-evaluate our use of IP addresses for
anonymous users, as Brion, Greg Maxwell, and many others have noted. But 

[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-08-22 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Andre Klapper aklap...@wikimedia.org changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Priority|Unprioritized   |Low

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-08-19 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

--- Comment #1 from MZMcBride b...@mzmcbride.com ---
Comment 0 needs a proper reply and dependent bugs, but I'm tired after bug
52442, bug 53069 (this bug), bug 53073, and bug 53076. I'll do it later, maybe.

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[Bug 53069] Obstacles to enabling MobileFrontend for anonymous users (tracking)

2013-08-19 Thread bugzilla-daemon
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=53069

Jon jrob...@wikimedia.org changed:

   What|Removed |Added

   Severity|normal  |enhancement

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