Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-04-23 Thread Andy Mabbett
On 23 April 2015 at 15:20, Serge Wroclawski emac...@gmail.com wrote:

 I am not sure how I missed this discussion, but adding information
 from OSM into Wikidata en mass like this is a violation of the OSM
 license.

Nobody is prosing to add information from OSM into Wikidata en mass.

-- 
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-04-23 Thread Edward Betts
Thad Guidry thadgui...@gmail.com wrote:
 I helped with the Lighthouses schema in Freebase.
 
 Some of which is based on List of Lights (NGA) USA.
 
 I have DB conversion data for the PDFs...just never got around to loading
 them all in.
 
 Let me know if I can help.

I was able to match 407 lighthouses on OSM and Wikidata:

http://edwardbetts.com/osm-wikidata/2015-04-18/match_results/Lighthouses.html

-- 
Edward.

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-04-23 Thread Jo
The best way to link objects from Wikidata and Openstreetmap is by adding
wikidata tags to the OSM objects. That way those Q-numbers can follow along
when an OSM object gets converted from a node to a way (POI to building for
example) or from a way to a relation. (area to a multipolygon for example).

The best way to figure out which objects are connected is the Overpass API.
It would be a good idea to have a poperty on the wikidata side where
Overpass Queries can be stored.

Polyglot

2015-04-23 17:08 GMT+02:00 Peter F. Patel-Schneider pfpschnei...@gmail.com
:

 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA256

 How so?  Oh, because Wikidata is CC0 and the Open Street Map database is
 ODbL, which is somewhat like CC BY-SA.  I don't think that that follows,
 though, as what is being put into Wikidata is contents, which appear to me
 to be covered under the DbCL, which is like CC0.

 Peter F. Patel-Schneider, speaking as an individual


 On 04/23/2015 07:20 AM, Serge Wroclawski wrote:
  I am not sure how I missed this discussion, but adding information from
  OSM into Wikidata en mass like this is a violation of the OSM license.
 
  - Serge
 
  On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 11:32 AM, Yaroslav M. Blanter pute...@mccme.ru
  wrote:
  On 2015-03-10 14:31, Amir E. Aharoni wrote:
 
  Hi,
 
  [ Aude and Christian Consonni, this should especially interest you.
  ]
 
  I was throwing around ideas with a friend about how OpenStreetMap
  could be integrated with Wikidata.
 
  ...
 
  Towns obviously have or can a Wikipedia article about them, but
  probably not every street or shop. But do they fulfill a structural
  need or is it way too much?
 
 
  Hi Amir,
 
  anything which can be remotely considered as a tourist attraction, as
  well as shops, hotels, reataurants and such are withing the scope of
  Wikivoyage and thus of Wikidata. For streets, we have now an approved
  bot task adding all Dutch streets on Wikidata, and I do not see why any
  other country could be different - provided we have good sources.
 
  Cheers Yaroslav
 
 
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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-04-23 Thread Andy Mabbett
On 23 April 2015 at 15:09, Edward Betts edw...@4angle.com wrote:

 Here is my latest mapping between Wikidata items and OpenStreetMap objects:

 I'm still working on debugging the mismatches, before uploading the data to
 OpenStreetMap:

Thank you - I'm looknig forward to seeing thsi happen.

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@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-04-23 Thread Peter F. Patel-Schneider
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA256

How so?  Oh, because Wikidata is CC0 and the Open Street Map database is
ODbL, which is somewhat like CC BY-SA.  I don't think that that follows,
though, as what is being put into Wikidata is contents, which appear to me
to be covered under the DbCL, which is like CC0.

Peter F. Patel-Schneider, speaking as an individual


On 04/23/2015 07:20 AM, Serge Wroclawski wrote:
 I am not sure how I missed this discussion, but adding information from
 OSM into Wikidata en mass like this is a violation of the OSM license.
 
 - Serge
 
 On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 11:32 AM, Yaroslav M. Blanter pute...@mccme.ru
 wrote:
 On 2015-03-10 14:31, Amir E. Aharoni wrote:
 
 Hi,
 
 [ Aude and Christian Consonni, this should especially interest you.
 ]
 
 I was throwing around ideas with a friend about how OpenStreetMap 
 could be integrated with Wikidata.
 
 ...
 
 Towns obviously have or can a Wikipedia article about them, but 
 probably not every street or shop. But do they fulfill a structural 
 need or is it way too much?
 
 
 Hi Amir,
 
 anything which can be remotely considered as a tourist attraction, as
 well as shops, hotels, reataurants and such are withing the scope of
 Wikivoyage and thus of Wikidata. For streets, we have now an approved
 bot task adding all Dutch streets on Wikidata, and I do not see why any
 other country could be different - provided we have good sources.
 
 Cheers Yaroslav
 
 
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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-04-23 Thread Serge Wroclawski
I entirely agree and have been looking at a way we could start this in
OSM in a systematic way.

There are a ton of things OSM could benefit from with this.

But this is, IMHO an OSM issue (an OSM import) and not something the
Wikipedia folks here need to worry about so I think it belongs on an
OSM mailing list.

- Serge

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-04-23 Thread Jo
I'm under the impression people on this mailing list are more interested in
this, than most of us mappers, so it belongs here as well. I agree with you
as far as the import goes, if you can call it that. We should have way to
easily add wikidata tags to OSM elements which already have wikipedia tags.

Knowing how the wikidata related information is stored in OSM, how to
retrieve it and how to work with it, is something that definitely belongs
on this list though.

Polyglot

2015-04-23 18:42 GMT+02:00 Serge Wroclawski emac...@gmail.com:

 I entirely agree and have been looking at a way we could start this in
 OSM in a systematic way.

 There are a ton of things OSM could benefit from with this.

 But this is, IMHO an OSM issue (an OSM import) and not something the
 Wikipedia folks here need to worry about so I think it belongs on an
 OSM mailing list.

 - Serge

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-04-23 Thread Thad Guidry
Tom,

Split tool to the rescue ? :)

Looks like the GeoNames ID is for the islet itself...so probably needs
another entity for the Vinga Lighthouse itself sitting on that islet.


Thad
+ThadGuidry https://www.google.com/+ThadGuidry

On Thu, Apr 23, 2015 at 1:02 PM, Tom Morris tfmor...@gmail.com wrote:

 On Thu, Apr 23, 2015 at 10:16 AM, Edward Betts edw...@4angle.com wrote:

 Thad Guidry thadgui...@gmail.com wrote:
  I helped with the Lighthouses schema in Freebase.
 
  Some of which is based on List of Lights (NGA) USA.
 
  I have DB conversion data for the PDFs...just never got around to
 loading
  them all in.
 
  Let me know if I can help.

 I was able to match 407 lighthouses on OSM and Wikidata:


 http://edwardbetts.com/osm-wikidata/2015-04-18/match_results/Lighthouses.html


 How can something be both a islet, a nature preserve, and a lighthouse?

 http://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3372089

 Tom

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-04-23 Thread Serge Wroclawski
On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 1:15 PM, Markus Bärlocher
markus.baerloc...@lau-net.de wrote:
 Hi Thad,

 I helped with the Lighthouses schema in Freebase.


 :-)

 We have imported the LoL into OSM (40'000 lights),
 and show them on OpenSeaMap:
 http://map.openseamap.org/?zoom=13lat=54.47933lon=10.27177layers=BFTFFFTFFTF0

Sorry I've been absent from this list for a while.

What changesets/user did this import?

Where's the corresponding import page for this as per the OSM
requirements for it?

- Serge

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-04-23 Thread Tom Morris
On Thu, Apr 23, 2015 at 10:16 AM, Edward Betts edw...@4angle.com wrote:

 Thad Guidry thadgui...@gmail.com wrote:
  I helped with the Lighthouses schema in Freebase.
 
  Some of which is based on List of Lights (NGA) USA.
 
  I have DB conversion data for the PDFs...just never got around to loading
  them all in.
 
  Let me know if I can help.

 I was able to match 407 lighthouses on OSM and Wikidata:


 http://edwardbetts.com/osm-wikidata/2015-04-18/match_results/Lighthouses.html


How can something be both a islet, a nature preserve, and a lighthouse?

http://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3372089

Tom
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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-04-23 Thread Edward Betts
Here is my latest mapping between Wikidata items and OpenStreetMap objects:

http://edwardbetts.com/osm-wikidata/2015-04-18/match_results/

I'm still working on debugging the mismatches, before uploading the data to
OpenStreetMap:

http://edwardbetts.com/osm-wikidata/2015-04-18/mismatches.html

-- 
Edward.

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-03-12 Thread Michael Stoner

 On 11 Mar 2015, at 09:37, Magnus Manske magnusman...@googlemail.com wrote:
 On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 9:24 AM Markus Krötzsch 
 mar...@semantic-mediawiki.org mailto:mar...@semantic-mediawiki.org wrote:
 
 No, you are right: this is of course an issue in the completeness of our
 data. If you zoom in to Europe, you can see that some countries have
 costs full of lighthouses, while others seem to lack them almost
 completely. I think it clearly shows that a lot of our data comes from
 Wikipedias (in some specific language).
 
 In this instance, the issue appears to be that the existing lists on 
 Wikipedia have not been touched, e.g.:
 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_lighthouses_in_Spain 
 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_lighthouses_in_Spain
 
 These, including redlinks, could be imported into Wikidata rather easily. 
 Some already have images.
 
 Ideally, we'd want some official (e.g. national, UN) source to cross-check.

This is probably the best source:

NGA List of Lights
The List of Lights, Radio Aids and Fog Signals is published in seven 
volumes, as Publication numbers 110   through 116. Each volume contains 
lights and other aids to navigation that are maintained by or under the 
authority of  foreign governments. 
http://msi.nga.mil/NGAPortal/MSI.portal?_nfpb=true_st=_pageLabel=msi_portal_page_62pubCode=0007
 
http://msi.nga.mil/NGAPortal/MSI.portal?_nfpb=true_st=_pageLabel=msi_portal_page_62pubCode=0007
The US also have another lights list for US
http://msi.nga.mil/NGAPortal/MSI.portal?_nfpb=true_pageLabel=msi_portal_page_62pubCode=0014
 
http://msi.nga.mil/NGAPortal/MSI.portal?_nfpb=true_pageLabel=msi_portal_page_62pubCode=0014

For the US the NOAA have publicly accessible ENC marine charts which show 
'lights':
http://www.nauticalcharts.noaa.gov/ENCOnline/enconline.html 
http://www.nauticalcharts.noaa.gov/ENCOnline/enconline.html


The US also have sailing guides:
the regions http://msi.nga.mil/MSISiteContent/StaticFiles/Images/SDLIMITS.jpg 
http://msi.nga.mil/MSISiteContent/StaticFiles/Images/SDLIMITS.jpg 
where to get the pdf from 
http://msi.nga.mil/NGAPortal/MSI.portal?_nfpb=true_st=_pageLabel=msi_portal_page_62pubCode=0011
 
http://msi.nga.mil/NGAPortal/MSI.portal?_nfpb=true_st=_pageLabel=msi_portal_page_62pubCode=0011
Also Sailing Directions (Enroute) 
http://msi.nga.mil/NGAPortal/MSI.portal?_nfpb=true_st=_pageLabel=msi_portal_page_62pubCode=0010
 
http://msi.nga.mil/NGAPortal/MSI.portal?_nfpb=true_st=_pageLabel=msi_portal_page_62pubCode=0010
Here is a 10MB  example 
http://msi.nga.mil/MSISiteContent/StaticFiles/NAV_PUBS/SD/Pub132/Pub132bk.pdf 
http://msi.nga.mil/MSISiteContent/StaticFiles/NAV_PUBS/SD/Pub132/Pub132bk.pdf 

There is also a crowdsource project here:
http://wikimapia.org/#lang=enlat=38.315801lon=-4.954834z=7m=btag=782 
http://wikimapia.org/#lang=enlat=38.315801lon=-4.954834z=7m=btag=782

Also the The Lighthouse Directory (University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill)
http://www.unc.edu/~rowlett/lighthouse/ 
http://www.unc.edu/~rowlett/lighthouse/



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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-12 Thread Daniel Kinzler
Am 10.03.2015 um 16:32 schrieb Yaroslav M. Blanter:
 Hi Amir,
 
 anything which can be remotely considered as a tourist attraction, as well as
 shops, hotels, reataurants and such are withing the scope of Wikivoyage and 
 thus
 of Wikidata. For streets, we have now an approved bot task adding all Dutch
 streets on Wikidata, and I do not see why any other country could be 
 different -
 provided we have good sources.

I fear doing this is going to kill Wikidata. Neither the software nor the
community scales to managing entries for every street in the world.

-- 
Daniel Kinzler
Senior Software Developer

Wikimedia Deutschland
Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-12 Thread Daniel Kinzler
Am 10.03.2015 um 16:54 schrieb Luca Martinelli:
 2015-03-10 16:28 GMT+01:00 Janko Mihelić jan...@gmail.com:
 What would this new Wikibase have that OpenStreetMap doesn't already have?
 
 The possibility of talking with WMF projects, as Wikidata talks
 with all the other projects...

Only if it's also hosted on the WMF cluster. Or we implement http based
federation (planned, but a lot of work, and waaay down there on the prio list).


-- 
Daniel Kinzler
Senior Software Developer

Wikimedia Deutschland
Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-03-11 Thread Markus Krötzsch

On 11.03.2015 05:40, Tom Morris wrote:

On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 6:41 PM, Markus Krötzsch
mar...@semantic-mediawiki.org mailto:mar...@semantic-mediawiki.org
wrote:


For example, you can see that Portugal has a lot of lighthouses
while Spain has almost none -- maybe we need to look at our data
there ;-)


Perhaps it's a language confusion issue, but does Spain really have few
lighthouses?  That would seem VERY unusual for a territory with an
extensive coastline.



No, you are right: this is of course an issue in the completeness of our 
data. If you zoom in to Europe, you can see that some countries have 
costs full of lighthouses, while others seem to lack them almost 
completely. I think it clearly shows that a lot of our data comes from 
Wikipedias (in some specific language).




Where does Wikidata sit in that mix?  How does it compare with DBpedia,
Freebase, Wikipedia, or even *real* data sources like official
governmental lists of navigational aids for mariners at sea?


Good question. I guess that we could have a much better coverage for 
some of the obvious holes in our data, e.g., by adding classificaiton 
information based on Spanish Wikipedia categories.




Independent of where it sits now, what where does it aspire to sit?


The uncontested target would be:

* Every lighthouse that is found in any Wikipedia (hence in Wikidata) 
should be instance of lighthouse and have coordinates and country defined.


A possible target to discuss would be to add:

* Every lighthouse should be in Wikidata.

Whether or not this makes sense depends on how many lighthouses there 
really are. Maybe we are not so far from completeness. Lighthouses are 
prominent landmarks of historic, nautic, and touristic interest, so 
should be valid Wikipedia topics anyway. Moreover, they tend to change 
very little over time, so data maintenance is relatively easy.


Note that this is quite different from streets, which change names all 
the time, get created, demolished, and merged, and are much larger in 
number. From these properties, I think OSM is much better suited for 
managing this data for now.


In view of the current developments towards Wikidata query support, a 
tangible goal would be to set up integrated query services that provide 
a joint view of the data from OSM and Wikidata without physically moving 
large quantities of data from one to the other.


Markus

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-03-11 Thread James Heald

Note that OSM is likely to be unusable for copyright reasons

  -- J.

On 11/03/2015 11:20, Magnus Manske wrote:

Started scraping Wikipedia lists:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_lighthouses_and_lightvessels

Got to Canada:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/12UaLKolLl5hbOFP9vztShQsiKkr5AZo_TbNr-NV9W-U/edit?usp=sharing

Continue this (someone help!), or start anew from another source?

On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 10:59 AM Markus Bärlocher 
markus.baerloc...@lau-net.de wrote:


Sorry the tags was wrong...
Right is:

_in OpenSeaMap_
you can find 40'000 Lights by a query on:
seamark:type=light_float
seamark:type=light_vessel
seamark:type=light_minor
seamark:type=light_major
seamark:type=light


_in WP for Spain_
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/de:Liste_von_Leuchttürmen_in_Spanien

_in WD for world_
2135 lights today
List: http://tools.wmflabs.org/autolist/autolist1.html?q=CLAIM[31:39715]
Chart: http://tools.wmflabs.org/autolist/autolist1.html?q=

CLAIM[31:39715]


best regards,
Markus

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-03-11 Thread Jo
Openstreetmap has many lighthouses on the Spanish Coast:

http://overpass-turbo.eu/s/87R

You can change the bbox and investigate the other coast lines easily with
that query.

Jo

2015-03-11 10:37 GMT+01:00 Magnus Manske magnusman...@googlemail.com:



 On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 9:24 AM Markus Krötzsch 
 mar...@semantic-mediawiki.org wrote:


 No, you are right: this is of course an issue in the completeness of our
 data. If you zoom in to Europe, you can see that some countries have
 costs full of lighthouses, while others seem to lack them almost
 completely. I think it clearly shows that a lot of our data comes from
 Wikipedias (in some specific language).

 In this instance, the issue appears to be that the existing lists on
 Wikipedia have not been touched, e.g.:
 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_lighthouses_in_Spain

 These, including redlinks, could be imported into Wikidata rather easily.
 Some already have images.

 Ideally, we'd want some official (e.g. national, UN) source to
 cross-check.

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-03-11 Thread Markus Bärlocher

Hi,

_in OpenSeaMap_
you can find 40'000 Lights by a query on:
seamark:type=light_float
seamark:type=light_vessel
seamark:type=minor_light
seamark:type=major_light
seamark:type=light

_in WP for Spain_
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/de:Liste_von_Leuchttürmen_in_Spanien

_in WD for world_
2135 lights today
List: http://tools.wmflabs.org/autolist/autolist1.html?q=CLAIM[31:39715]
Chart: http://tools.wmflabs.org/autolist/autolist1.html?q=CLAIM[31:39715]

best regards,
Markus

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-03-11 Thread Finn Årup Nielsen

On 03/11/2015 12:58 PM, Daniel Kinzler wrote:

Am 11.03.2015 um 12:39 schrieb Jo Walsh:

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Wikidata#Importing_data
*Copying data to Wikidata from OSM* (or even from other Wikimedia projects) *is
not allowed* because Wikidata uses the public-domain style Creative Commons CC0
license which does not contain any attribution or share-alike provisions.
Conversely, data may be copied from Wikidata without restriction.

(OSM is licensed under the Open Database License)


This applies to any copyrightable material. Facts (this is a lighthouse) are
not copyrightable.


Facts are not copyrightable, but in EU a lot of facts are when they are 
assembled in a database due to sui generis database right.


I suppose that OSM falls under UK law and thereby EU sui generis 
database right, so systematic extraction of OSM data into Wikidata will 
constitute a violation in EU of the Open Database License terms.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sui_generis_database_right



/Finn

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-03-11 Thread Jo Walsh
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Wikidata#Importing_data
*Copying data to Wikidata from OSM* (or even from other Wikimedia projects) *is
not allowed* because Wikidata uses the public-domain style Creative Commons
CC0 license which does not contain any attribution or share-alike
provisions. Conversely, data may be copied from Wikidata without
restriction.

(OSM is licensed under the Open Database License)

On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 11:27 AM, James Heald j.he...@ucl.ac.uk wrote:

 Note that OSM is likely to be unusable for copyright reasons

   -- J.


 On 11/03/2015 11:20, Magnus Manske wrote:

 Started scraping Wikipedia lists:
 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_lighthouses_and_lightvessels

 Got to Canada:
 https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/12UaLKolLl5hbOFP9vztShQsiKkr5A
 Zo_TbNr-NV9W-U/edit?usp=sharing

 Continue this (someone help!), or start anew from another source?

 On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 10:59 AM Markus Bärlocher 
 markus.baerloc...@lau-net.de wrote:

  Sorry the tags was wrong...
 Right is:

 _in OpenSeaMap_
 you can find 40'000 Lights by a query on:
 seamark:type=light_float
 seamark:type=light_vessel
 seamark:type=light_minor
 seamark:type=light_major
 seamark:type=light

  _in WP for Spain_
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/de:Liste_von_Leuchttürmen_in_Spanien

 _in WD for world_
 2135 lights today
 List: http://tools.wmflabs.org/autolist/autolist1.html?q=
 CLAIM[31:39715]
 Chart: http://tools.wmflabs.org/autolist/autolist1.html?q=

 CLAIM[31:39715]


 best regards,
 Markus

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-03-11 Thread Daniel Kinzler
Am 11.03.2015 um 12:39 schrieb Jo Walsh:
 http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Wikidata#Importing_data
 *Copying data to Wikidata from OSM* (or even from other Wikimedia projects) 
 *is
 not allowed* because Wikidata uses the public-domain style Creative Commons 
 CC0
 license which does not contain any attribution or share-alike provisions.
 Conversely, data may be copied from Wikidata without restriction.
 
 (OSM is licensed under the Open Database License)

This applies to any copyrightable material. Facts (this is a lighthouse) are
not copyrightable.


-- 
Daniel Kinzler
Senior Software Developer

Wikimedia Deutschland
Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-03-11 Thread Markus Bärlocher

Thanks Daniel for this clear statement:

Facts (this is a lighthouse) are not copyrightable.


The data about lighthouses was imported from NOAA LoL,
which is PD itself :-)

Best regards,
Markus



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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Daniel Kinzler
Am 10.03.2015 um 14:31 schrieb Amir E. Aharoni:
 If it's way too much, how can this be bridged, or federated, or whatever the
 current popular word is? I don't even know exactly how does OSM store labels 
 and
 translations now, but it sounds like another instance of Wikibase, if not
 Wikidata itself, can be used for it.

A separate Wikibase instance, federated with Wikidata sounds ideal (but the
federation bit will need work). Scalability is an issue though. Wikibase is
designed to scale to a few hundred million items. I suspect that OSM would need
a couple of orders of magnitude more...

-- 
Daniel Kinzler
Senior Software Developer

Wikimedia Deutschland
Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-03-10 Thread Markus Bärlocher

Hi Thad,


I helped with the Lighthouses schema in Freebase.


:-)

We have imported the LoL into OSM (40'000 lights),
and show them on OpenSeaMap:
http://map.openseamap.org/?zoom=13lat=54.47933lon=10.27177layers=BFTFFFTFFTF0

It would be great to have a popup in the chart which shows:
- Wikipedia-link to the lighthouse
- Commons picture of the lighthouse
- list of all data about (character, range, sectors, hight, etc.

It would be great to have an infobox in Wikipedia,
filled with data from Wikidata.

It would be fine to find somebody family with Wikidata,
who can build the structure :-)
and has an idea how to get the databases congruent (OSM and WD).

Best regards,
Markus

PS: 3 Mio Wikipedia articles we have already in the chart:
http://map.openseamap.org/?zoom=12lat=54.449lon=10.23044layers=BFTFFFTFFTT0
also some lights - but no systematic


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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Jo
What about bus stops?

Jo

2015-03-10 15:37 GMT+01:00 aude aude.w...@gmail.com:

 On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 2:31 PM, Amir E. Aharoni 
 amir.ahar...@mail.huji.ac.il wrote:

 Hi,

 [ Aude and Christian Consonni, this should especially interest you. ]

 I was throwing around ideas with a friend about how OpenStreetMap could
 be integrated with Wikidata.

 The thing that I care the most in any software is internationalization.
 Having a map in which all labels of towns, streets and everything else is
 translated to all languages sounds like a super-wonderful thing.

 Wikidata allows labeling everything, translating everything, and
 attaching properties to everything, so it sounds like it could be a good
 match.

 But then the question of what IS everything came up. Wikidata was
 created mostly with Wikipedia in mind, so Wikipedia's notability policies
 influenced Wikidata. Roughly, Wikidata has items for every thing about
 which there is, or can be, a Wikipedia article and for things that are
 useful, or if it fulfills some structural need
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Notability.

 Towns obviously have or can a Wikipedia article about them, but probably
 not every street or shop.


 At minimum, supporting Wikivoyage is within scope of Wikidata, so imho
 items for shops would be ok. (at least the ones that would be used in
 Wikivoyage)

 I am not sure about streets... maybe, it depends and is up to the
 community (what extent we want them) and scalability (technical and
 community) might be considerations.  As well, in Wikidata, we want
 references.

 For the OSM use case, for streets, I think the osm name tags are
 sufficient. Transliteration of street names definitely makes sense, but
 maybe can be autogenerated?

 In some cases multilingual (e.g. in Brussels), actual translations might
 be desired, and think osm supports that adequately.

 Katie



 But do they fulfill a structural need or is it way too much?

 If it's way too much, how can this be bridged, or federated, or whatever
 the current popular word is? I don't even know exactly how does OSM store
 labels and translations now, but it sounds like another instance of
 Wikibase, if not Wikidata itself, can be used for it.

 I don't have much to add, but I'd love to hear ideas from people who do
 (again, Aude and Christian Consonni, I'm looking at you :) ).

 --
 Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
 http://aharoni.wordpress.com
 ‪“We're living in pieces,
 I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread aude
On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 2:31 PM, Amir E. Aharoni 
amir.ahar...@mail.huji.ac.il wrote:

 Hi,

 [ Aude and Christian Consonni, this should especially interest you. ]

 I was throwing around ideas with a friend about how OpenStreetMap could be
 integrated with Wikidata.

 The thing that I care the most in any software is internationalization.
 Having a map in which all labels of towns, streets and everything else is
 translated to all languages sounds like a super-wonderful thing.

 Wikidata allows labeling everything, translating everything, and attaching
 properties to everything, so it sounds like it could be a good match.

 But then the question of what IS everything came up. Wikidata was
 created mostly with Wikipedia in mind, so Wikipedia's notability policies
 influenced Wikidata. Roughly, Wikidata has items for every thing about
 which there is, or can be, a Wikipedia article and for things that are
 useful, or if it fulfills some structural need
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Notability.

 Towns obviously have or can a Wikipedia article about them, but probably
 not every street or shop.


At minimum, supporting Wikivoyage is within scope of Wikidata, so imho
items for shops would be ok. (at least the ones that would be used in
Wikivoyage)

I am not sure about streets... maybe, it depends and is up to the community
(what extent we want them) and scalability (technical and community) might
be considerations.  As well, in Wikidata, we want references.

For the OSM use case, for streets, I think the osm name tags are
sufficient. Transliteration of street names definitely makes sense, but
maybe can be autogenerated?

In some cases multilingual (e.g. in Brussels), actual translations might be
desired, and think osm supports that adequately.

Katie



 But do they fulfill a structural need or is it way too much?

 If it's way too much, how can this be bridged, or federated, or whatever
 the current popular word is? I don't even know exactly how does OSM store
 labels and translations now, but it sounds like another instance of
 Wikibase, if not Wikidata itself, can be used for it.

 I don't have much to add, but I'd love to hear ideas from people who do
 (again, Aude and Christian Consonni, I'm looking at you :) ).

 --
 Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
 http://aharoni.wordpress.com
 ‪“We're living in pieces,
 I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Romaine Wiki
Maybe we should ask the question how many translations already are in
OpenStreetMap that can be used/added to Wikidata?


Romaine

2015-03-10 14:31 GMT+01:00 Amir E. Aharoni amir.ahar...@mail.huji.ac.il:

 Hi,

 [ Aude and Christian Consonni, this should especially interest you. ]

 I was throwing around ideas with a friend about how OpenStreetMap could be
 integrated with Wikidata.

 The thing that I care the most in any software is internationalization.
 Having a map in which all labels of towns, streets and everything else is
 translated to all languages sounds like a super-wonderful thing.

 Wikidata allows labeling everything, translating everything, and attaching
 properties to everything, so it sounds like it could be a good match.

 But then the question of what IS everything came up. Wikidata was
 created mostly with Wikipedia in mind, so Wikipedia's notability policies
 influenced Wikidata. Roughly, Wikidata has items for every thing about
 which there is, or can be, a Wikipedia article and for things that are
 useful, or if it fulfills some structural need
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Notability.

 Towns obviously have or can a Wikipedia article about them, but probably
 not every street or shop. But do they fulfill a structural need or is it
 way too much?

 If it's way too much, how can this be bridged, or federated, or whatever
 the current popular word is? I don't even know exactly how does OSM store
 labels and translations now, but it sounds like another instance of
 Wikibase, if not Wikidata itself, can be used for it.

 I don't have much to add, but I'd love to hear ideas from people who do
 (again, Aude and Christian Consonni, I'm looking at you :) ).

 --
 Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
 http://aharoni.wordpress.com
 ‪“We're living in pieces,
 I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Luca Martinelli
2015-03-10 17:10 GMT+01:00 Daniel Kinzler daniel.kinz...@wikimedia.de:
 Am 10.03.2015 um 16:54 schrieb Luca Martinelli:
 2015-03-10 16:28 GMT+01:00 Janko Mihelić jan...@gmail.com:
 What would this new Wikibase have that OpenStreetMap doesn't already have?

 The possibility of talking with WMF projects, as Wikidata talks
 with all the other projects...

 Only if it's also hosted on the WMF cluster. Or we implement http based
 federation (planned, but a lot of work, and waaay down there on the prio 
 list).

Of course, it was just an idea.

BTW, maybe related:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IdeaLab/OSMdata:_a_Wikidata-like_editor_for_OpenStreetMap

L.

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-03-10 Thread Tom Morris
On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 6:41 PM, Markus Krötzsch 
mar...@semantic-mediawiki.org wrote:


 For example, you can see that Portugal has a lot of lighthouses while
 Spain has almost none -- maybe we need to look at our data there ;-)


Perhaps it's a language confusion issue, but does Spain really have few
lighthouses?  That would seem VERY unusual for a territory with an
extensive coastline.

Or am I confusing cyber reality with real reality?

Where does Wikidata sit in that mix?  How does it compare with DBpedia,
Freebase, Wikipedia, or even *real* data sources like official governmental
lists of navigational aids for mariners at sea?

Independent of where it sits now, what where does it aspire to sit?

Tom
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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Cristian Consonni
Hi Amir,

2015-03-10 14:31 GMT+01:00 Amir E. Aharoni amir.ahar...@mail.huji.ac.il:
 [ Aude and Christian Consonni, this should especially interest you. ]

:-)

Luca already posted the link that summarizes my idea about Wikidata and OSM.

2015-03-10 17:38 GMT+01:00 Luca Martinelli martinellil...@gmail.com:
 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IdeaLab/OSMdata:_a_Wikidata-like_editor_for_OpenStreetMap

I just want to add a little bit of context to this, and I want to say
that this proposal stemmed out of what I saw as one of the major
advantages of Wikidata over - say - DBpedia, i.e. the integration with
the other Wikimedia projects through Mediawiki.

I remember that when Wikidata was launched in Washington one key
element behind the idea of using Mediawiki to build a data repository
- which to me  looked a little crazy (and perhaps a litlle more than
just a little) back then, and in part it still does  - was that using
Mediawiki would have provided the users with the same environment that
they were (and are) used to when they edit the projects. Even keeping
the same structure of the site was considered a plus.

In the same sense I wondered what would happen if we do the same
thing with OSM? Would this facilitate the integration of OSM data and
Wikipedia data in the same way that Wikidata is facilitating the
integration of data among all the WIkimedia projects?

I don't know if I have misunderstood or overestimated this unified
environment factor, or if this idea was just born out of a period
where in Wikimedia Italia we were like Let's use Wikibase
everywhere! (we have a project where we are using Wikibase outside of
Wikidata: the EAGLE project [1]. it is going very well and we are very
happy about it).

The next idea was that it should be synchronized with OSM and then I
realized that the net effect would be that this system would provid a
new editor for OSM data, perhaps more specialized and focused in
particular for tags.

And that's basically it.

C
[1] http://www.eagle-network.eu/wiki/index.php/Main_Page

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Janko Mihelić
I am an avid OpenStreetMap user, and I like the Wikidata project very much.
That's why I proposed a OSM tag wikidata=* and I wasn't the only one to
think of this[1].

Making a wikidata element for every or some OSM elements is not quite
possible, at least for now. OSM objects don't have constant IDs like
Wikidata elements do. If you delete a city node, and make a new one with
all the same tags, nobody cares. That's why connecting Wikidata and OSM can
be made only one way, from OSM to Wikidata. The other direction can be made
only with querys like a city within 10km from this coordinate, or a city
with this name within borders of a country with this name. A project
Permanent ID is trying to do this[2]

First use of Wikidata in OpenStreetMap is a 1 to 1 mapping. A town element
in Wikidata is a place=town node in OSM. There can be only one in either
database. We tag this in OSM with a simple wikidata=Q1435.

But then there are more interesting uses, for example artist of this
sculpture is Q313828, architect of this building is Q12633257, this
street is named after Q9036. I think this is the best marriage of both
projects so far. For example in OSM we can see all sculptures made by a
specific artist:

http://overpass-turbo.eu/s/86X

It would be great to see this information in Wikipedia.

[1] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Wikidata
[2] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Overpass_API/Permanent_ID

2015-03-10 15:37 GMT+01:00 aude aude.w...@gmail.com:

 On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 2:31 PM, Amir E. Aharoni 
 amir.ahar...@mail.huji.ac.il wrote:

 Hi,

 [ Aude and Christian Consonni, this should especially interest you. ]

 I was throwing around ideas with a friend about how OpenStreetMap could
 be integrated with Wikidata.

 The thing that I care the most in any software is internationalization.
 Having a map in which all labels of towns, streets and everything else is
 translated to all languages sounds like a super-wonderful thing.

 Wikidata allows labeling everything, translating everything, and
 attaching properties to everything, so it sounds like it could be a good
 match.

 But then the question of what IS everything came up. Wikidata was
 created mostly with Wikipedia in mind, so Wikipedia's notability policies
 influenced Wikidata. Roughly, Wikidata has items for every thing about
 which there is, or can be, a Wikipedia article and for things that are
 useful, or if it fulfills some structural need
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Notability.

 Towns obviously have or can a Wikipedia article about them, but probably
 not every street or shop.


 At minimum, supporting Wikivoyage is within scope of Wikidata, so imho
 items for shops would be ok. (at least the ones that would be used in
 Wikivoyage)

 I am not sure about streets... maybe, it depends and is up to the
 community (what extent we want them) and scalability (technical and
 community) might be considerations.  As well, in Wikidata, we want
 references.

 For the OSM use case, for streets, I think the osm name tags are
 sufficient. Transliteration of street names definitely makes sense, but
 maybe can be autogenerated?

 In some cases multilingual (e.g. in Brussels), actual translations might
 be desired, and think osm supports that adequately.

 Katie



 But do they fulfill a structural need or is it way too much?

 If it's way too much, how can this be bridged, or federated, or whatever
 the current popular word is? I don't even know exactly how does OSM store
 labels and translations now, but it sounds like another instance of
 Wikibase, if not Wikidata itself, can be used for it.

 I don't have much to add, but I'd love to hear ideas from people who do
 (again, Aude and Christian Consonni, I'm looking at you :) ).

 --
 Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
 http://aharoni.wordpress.com
 ‪“We're living in pieces,
 I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata for light houses

2015-03-10 Thread Thad Guidry
I helped with the Lighthouses schema in Freebase.

Some of which is based on List of Lights (NGA) USA.

I have DB conversion data for the PDFs...just never got around to loading
them all in.

Let me know if I can help.


Thad
+ThadGuidry https://www.google.com/+ThadGuidry

On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 10:19 AM, Markus Bärlocher 
markus.baerloc...@lau-net.de wrote:

 It would be fine to have all this together:

 _OSM_
 seamark:type=light*

 _Wikidata_
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q44782

 _Wikipedia_
 https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kategorie:Liste_(Leuchttürme)
 https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_von_Leuchttürmen

 _Commons_
 commons:Lighthouse
 category:Lighthouses

 _Example_
 Wikipedia: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roter_Sand
 Commons: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Leuchtturm_Roter_Sand
 Wikidata: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q220034
 Resonator: http://tools.wmflabs.org/reasonator/?q=Q220034
 OSM-DB: https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/635484478
 OpenSeaMap: http://map.openseamap.org/?zoom=13mlat=53.85557mlon=8.
 08198mtext=Roter%20Sandlayers=BFTFFFTFFTT0FTFF

 Best regards,
 Markus

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Luca Martinelli
2015-03-10 15:08 GMT+01:00 Daniel Kinzler daniel.kinz...@wikimedia.de:
 Am 10.03.2015 um 14:31 schrieb Amir E. Aharoni:
 If it's way too much, how can this be bridged, or federated, or whatever the
 current popular word is? I don't even know exactly how does OSM store labels 
 and
 translations now, but it sounds like another instance of Wikibase, if not
 Wikidata itself, can be used for it.

 A separate Wikibase instance, federated with Wikidata sounds ideal (but the
 federation bit will need work). Scalability is an issue though. Wikibase is
 designed to scale to a few hundred million items. I suspect that OSM would 
 need
 a couple of orders of magnitude more...

A separate Wikibase instance that could serve both OSM and Wikivoyage,
maybe? Might be useful for both to keep the data about shops,
restaurants, hotels, commercial whatelses and whatnots in the same
instance, but keeping it separated by the official Wikidata...

-- 
Luca Sannita Martinelli
http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utente:Sannita

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Andy Mabbett
On 10 March 2015 at 13:31, Amir E. Aharoni amir.ahar...@mail.huji.ac.il wrote:

 I was throwing around ideas with a friend about how OpenStreetMap could be
 integrated with Wikidata.

I and others have done a lot of work on this already:

   http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Wikidata

   http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:wikipedia

My proposal for a bot to tag items in OSM, with the corresponding Wikidata ID:

   http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Pigsonthewing/Wikipedia

has stalled, due to OSM-community opposition to automated edits:

   https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/2014-November/071510.html

though I hope we shall soon be able to get a trial edit done, to show
that a larger set should follow.

-- 
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Susanna Ånäs
I have been fostering the idea of Wikidata as a historical gazetteer, a
place (name) index. Wikidata would be capable of modelling how streets
change name or how municipalities are split or merged or link to changing
geometries over time etc.

Happy to hear this discussed!

Susanna



2015-03-10 16:47 GMT+02:00 Jo winfi...@gmail.com:

 What about bus stops?

 Jo

 2015-03-10 15:37 GMT+01:00 aude aude.w...@gmail.com:

 On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 2:31 PM, Amir E. Aharoni 
 amir.ahar...@mail.huji.ac.il wrote:

 Hi,

 [ Aude and Christian Consonni, this should especially interest you. ]

 I was throwing around ideas with a friend about how OpenStreetMap could
 be integrated with Wikidata.

 The thing that I care the most in any software is internationalization.
 Having a map in which all labels of towns, streets and everything else is
 translated to all languages sounds like a super-wonderful thing.

 Wikidata allows labeling everything, translating everything, and
 attaching properties to everything, so it sounds like it could be a good
 match.

 But then the question of what IS everything came up. Wikidata was
 created mostly with Wikipedia in mind, so Wikipedia's notability policies
 influenced Wikidata. Roughly, Wikidata has items for every thing about
 which there is, or can be, a Wikipedia article and for things that are
 useful, or if it fulfills some structural need
 https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Notability.

 Towns obviously have or can a Wikipedia article about them, but probably
 not every street or shop.


 At minimum, supporting Wikivoyage is within scope of Wikidata, so imho
 items for shops would be ok. (at least the ones that would be used in
 Wikivoyage)

 I am not sure about streets... maybe, it depends and is up to the
 community (what extent we want them) and scalability (technical and
 community) might be considerations.  As well, in Wikidata, we want
 references.

 For the OSM use case, for streets, I think the osm name tags are
 sufficient. Transliteration of street names definitely makes sense, but
 maybe can be autogenerated?

 In some cases multilingual (e.g. in Brussels), actual translations might
 be desired, and think osm supports that adequately.

 Katie



 But do they fulfill a structural need or is it way too much?

 If it's way too much, how can this be bridged, or federated, or whatever
 the current popular word is? I don't even know exactly how does OSM store
 labels and translations now, but it sounds like another instance of
 Wikibase, if not Wikidata itself, can be used for it.

 I don't have much to add, but I'd love to hear ideas from people who do
 (again, Aude and Christian Consonni, I'm looking at you :) ).

 --
 Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
 http://aharoni.wordpress.com
 ‪“We're living in pieces,
 I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬

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 --
 @wikimediadc / @wikidata

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-- 
*Susanna Ånäs *Käyttäjä:Susannaanas
Wikimedia Suomi http://wikimedia.fi/ – Wikimaps
http://wikimaps.wikimedia.fi/ – GLAM
http://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:GLAM
@ https://twitter.com/WMFinlandWMFinland https://twitter.com/WMFinland
 / Facebook https://www.facebook.com/WikimediaSuomi / Liity jäseneksi!
http://fi.wikimedia.org/wiki/Liity_j%C3%A4seneksi
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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Janko Mihelić
2015-03-10 16:19 GMT+01:00 Luca Martinelli martinellil...@gmail.com:


 A separate Wikibase instance that could serve both OSM and Wikivoyage,
 maybe? Might be useful for both to keep the data about shops,
 restaurants, hotels, commercial whatelses and whatnots in the same
 instance, but keeping it separated by the official Wikidata...


What would this new Wikibase have that OpenStreetMap doesn't already have?
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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Yaroslav M. Blanter

On 2015-03-10 16:46, Daniel Kinzler wrote:

Am 10.03.2015 um 16:32 schrieb Yaroslav M. Blanter:

Hi Amir,

anything which can be remotely considered as a tourist attraction, as 
well as
shops, hotels, reataurants and such are withing the scope of 
Wikivoyage and thus
of Wikidata. For streets, we have now an approved bot task adding all 
Dutch
streets on Wikidata, and I do not see why any other country could be 
different -

provided we have good sources.


I fear doing this is going to kill Wikidata. Neither the software nor 
the

community scales to managing entries for every street in the world.


We have an ambition to have a separate entry for every species of 
insects, and the number of insect species is comparable to the number of 
streets.


(I personally would not add streets, but if there is a good database 
under an appropriate license, and an enthusiastic bot owner - why not?)


Cheers
Yaroslav

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Yaroslav M. Blanter

On 2015-03-10 20:47, Andy Mabbett wrote:
On 10 March 2015 at 15:32, Yaroslav M. Blanter pute...@mccme.ru 
wrote:


For streets, we have now an approved bot task adding all Dutch streets 
on

Wikidata


Approved by whom? I foresee the majority of those being deleted as non- 
notable.


By me as a crat. In the future, if you want your opinion on bot tasks to 
be taken into account, please comment on bot permission requests. I 
usually let them pend for several days, which obviously can be extended 
if there are constructive comments.


Cheers
Yaroslav

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Jo
If this is considered notable, I'd consider doing this for all streets in
the Brussels region. I would add wikidata tags to all OSM objects involved
(highway ways and associatedStreet relations) at the same time though. So
if they'd get deleted once again on Wikidata, that would be quite a useless
endeavour... and a lot of junk would remain behind in OSM. In fact, I
hadn't realised wikidata items were prone to deletion once again. I thought
of them as stable 'entities'.

Jo

2015-03-10 20:47 GMT+01:00 Andy Mabbett a...@pigsonthewing.org.uk:

 On 10 March 2015 at 15:32, Yaroslav M. Blanter pute...@mccme.ru wrote:

  For streets, we have now an approved bot task adding all Dutch streets on
  Wikidata

 Approved by whom? I foresee the majority of those being deleted as non-
 notable.

 --
 Andy Mabbett
 @pigsonthewing
 http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Thad Guidry
Think... BIGGER.

Jo has the right idea... Linked Data.

It sounds to me like the right way forward for domain specific interest
data (like OSM) ...is,

Instead of 1 source of data (Wikidata)...and throwing domain specific
interest data into Wikidata (not all data needs to live inside it).

Just use 1 source of data, i.e. Linked Data.

Wikidata does not have to be the 1 sole source... and besides, I am sure
that eventually someone could just allow federated queries / joins to
Linked Data.

Perhaps Wikidata can try to be and eventually help build... the 1 sole
QUERY source for Linked Data. :)

(Select OSM_ROADS contained_in Ardennes)

Thad
+ThadGuidry https://www.google.com/+ThadGuidry
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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Andy Mabbett
On 10 March 2015 at 15:32, Yaroslav M. Blanter pute...@mccme.ru wrote:

 For streets, we have now an approved bot task adding all Dutch streets on
 Wikidata

Approved by whom? I foresee the majority of those being deleted as non- notable.

-- 
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Andy Mabbett
On 10 March 2015 at 20:20, Yaroslav M. Blanter pute...@mccme.ru wrote:
 On 2015-03-10 20:47, Andy Mabbett wrote:

 On 10 March 2015 at 15:32, Yaroslav M. Blanter pute...@mccme.ru wrote:

 For streets, we have now an approved bot task adding all Dutch streets on
 Wikidata


 Approved by whom? I foresee the majority of those being deleted as non-
 notable.


 By me as a crat.

You mean this:


https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Requests_for_permissions/Bot/RobotMichiel1972_2

which was approved after two days, and with only comments - not a
!vote of support - from just one editor other than the proposer?

That's not much discussion, much less evidence of consensus for a
240,000-item import and a precedent for several magnitudes more than
that.

 In the future, if you want your opinion on bot tasks to be
 taken into account, please comment on bot permission requests. I usually let
 them pend for several days, which obviously can be extended if there are
 constructive comments.




-- 
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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Re: [Wikidata-l] OpenStreetMap + Wikidata

2015-03-10 Thread Yaroslav M. Blanter

On 2015-03-10 22:51, Andy Mabbett wrote:
On 10 March 2015 at 20:20, Yaroslav M. Blanter pute...@mccme.ru 
wrote:

On 2015-03-10 20:47, Andy Mabbett wrote:


On 10 March 2015 at 15:32, Yaroslav M. Blanter pute...@mccme.ru 
wrote:


For streets, we have now an approved bot task adding all Dutch 
streets on

Wikidata



Approved by whom? I foresee the majority of those being deleted as 
non-

notable.



By me as a crat.


You mean this:


https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Requests_for_permissions/Bot/RobotMichiel1972_2

which was approved after two days, and with only comments - not a
!vote of support - from just one editor other than the proposer?

That's not much discussion, much less evidence of consensus for a
240,000-item import and a precedent for several magnitudes more than
that.



Yes, this was the request. I am approving (or not approving) virtually 
all bots (with a very few exceptions), and this is how it works. 
Everybody who is interested in the requests should add the permission 
page in their watchlist, and comment on bot requests. Btw for this 
particular request Michiel first opened a topic on tghe Project Chat, 
and I advised him to file the request. Project Chat topic did not raise 
any objections either.


Cheers
Yaroslav

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