Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thoughts on Admin Rights on WMF Wiki (and other things)

2013-05-26 Thread Steve Zhang
On 26 May 2013 07:35, ENWP Pine deyntest...@hotmail.com wrote:


 Gayle, I am going to be frank. I think I know a little more about you and
 your work than the average member of this list does. I appreciate your
 explanations and apologies, but I'm continuing to have a hard time with
 this situation. With your many years of leadership experience, and in your
 position as Chief Culture and Talent Officer, it's shocking that you would
 implement such a significant change in the unprofessional way that you did,
 and of all people I would have expected you and Philippe (Director of
 Community Advocacy) to be acutely aware of our consensus-based culture
 and how to implement changes in a diplomatic and professional way. This
 situation has been a disaster for WMF-Community relations, and I'm sorry
 to say that my feeling is that the credibility of you and Philippe has been
 harmed beyond repair. Do you think you should continue to be WMF's
 Chief Culture and Talent Officer? I have a hard time believing that you
 should continue in that role after this disaster, but I want to hear your
 point of view.


I've thought long and hard about whether to reply here, and I have decided
that I will. Our mailing lists too often become an ugly place where the
worst of us comes out for all to see. I feel that regarding this matter,
some here have stepped over the line. Having your own opinion is fine, as
is providing criticism, but attacking others (or in general, saying things
that make them feel like crap) is not. As one who has worked to resolve the
disputes of others (both on-wiki and in real life) I think it needs to be
said that the current tension that has been created needs to dissipate.
Now, the removal of adminship of volunteer editors on the WMF wiki (among
other changes) happened for a reason, and I'm not going to comment on
whether I think it was the right decision to make or not - I'm not
qualified to do that. I do think that it could have been carried out in a
better fashion, and that if the community was given more notice of the
changes, with an explanation of the reasons for making them, then the
response from the community would not have been as dramatic. But that said,
Gayle has offered her apologies. And I accept them. I think we all should.
We have all made mistakes within our time, and we should not be remembered
solely by our errors. We need to move on.

Remember, we are all working towards the same goal - a world in which every
single human being can freely share in the sum of all knowledge. I would
invite all reading this mailing list thread to reflect on what has
happened, and the actions you have taken. Think about what you can take
away from this, and how you can use the experience to improve yourself. And
most importantly, remember that when you send someone an email, a text, a
tweet, a talk page message, that there is a real person on the receiving
end, and what you say impacts them. If you wouldn't like to be on the
receiving end of what you say, consider whether there's a better way to say
it, or say nothing at all. I think if we all did this in our day to day
lives, they would be much more happy and pleasant ones.

Regards,
*Steven Zhang*
*cro0...@gmail.com*
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thoughts on Admin Rights on WMF Wiki (and other things)

2013-05-26 Thread Federico Leva (Nemo)

I can agree with the rest but this is interesting:

Steve Zhang, 26/05/2013 08:42:

[...]
Now, the removal of adminship of volunteer editors on the WMF wiki (among
other changes) happened for a reason, [...]


really? What reason? I've not yet heard an explanation other than it's 
our wiki and we do whatever we wish: I'll prove you in a second!.
I also agree that judging the decision is useless (it's not going to be 
reverted) and that it's not our job (the WMF board should do that, I 
guess), but if you know the reason then please share it because we're 
all clueless about it.


Nemo

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thoughts on Admin Rights on WMF Wiki (and other things)

2013-05-26 Thread Steve Zhang
On 26 May 2013 16:53, Federico Leva (Nemo) nemow...@gmail.com wrote:

 I can agree with the rest but this is interesting:

 Steve Zhang, 26/05/2013 08:42:

 [...]

 Now, the removal of adminship of volunteer editors on the WMF wiki (among
 other changes) happened for a reason, [...]


 really? What reason? I've not yet heard an explanation other than it's
 our wiki and we do whatever we wish: I'll prove you in a second!.
 I also agree that judging the decision is useless (it's not going to be
 reverted) and that it's not our job (the WMF board should do that, I
 guess), but if you know the reason then please share it because we're all
 clueless about it.

 Nemo


Gayle explained her reasons in the email she sent to this list around 3
days ago, like everyone else this is all the information I have. Whether or
not we agree with her reasons is a moot point, as she has noted that her
decision will stand. I don't think this was ever done to make community
members unhappy, and while that turned out to be one of the results, I
think we should let it go. Like many things on Wikimedia, this is a
discussion that has run its natural should be laid to rest, and we should
move on to more productive things.

Steven Zhang
cro0...@gmail.com
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thoughts on Admin Rights on WMF Wiki (and other things)

2013-05-26 Thread Federico Leva (Nemo)

Steve Zhang, 26/05/2013 09:08:

Gayle explained her reasons in the email she sent to this list around 3
days ago, [...]


Ah. I didn't notice, can you please quote the relevant passage[s]? Maybe 
I missed some, it was a very long message and its purpose didn't seem to 
explain reasons for the action.


Nemo

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thoughts on Admin Rights on WMF Wiki (and other things)

2013-05-26 Thread cro0016
I believe the relevant passage of text is this one:

Wikimedia Foundation wiki has always been uniquely governed among the family 
of Wikimedia wikis, with decision-making
authority historically placed with the WMF itself due to its purpose
(hosting of official documents like bylaws, IRS tax returns, Board
resolutions, staff listings, official WMF communications of various kinds,
etc.). While the Board was described as the decision-making authority for
content disputes before the organization had paid staff, in day-to-day
practice, staff members are now helping to maintain and post many of those
documents.

Consistent with this, my goal was to ensure that the function of a wiki
adminstrator, which is often identified with community self-governance, is
clearly mapped against the governance model of the site: the organization,
with that function delegated to staff members in day-to-day practice, is
directly responsible for making and arbitrating decisions on the Wikimedia
Foundation’s website. This does not preclude volunteers from being granted
administrative-level access where a project requires it and where we have a
good working relationship that makes this possible. However, I wanted to
create clarity as early and possible, and therefore requested that
administrator accounts initially be limited to staff.

Steve Zhang
Sent from my iPad

On 26/05/2013, at 6:04 PM, Federico Leva (Nemo) nemow...@gmail.com wrote:

 Steve Zhang, 26/05/2013 09:08:
 Gayle explained her reasons in the email she sent to this list around 3
 days ago, [...]
 
 Ah. I didn't notice, can you please quote the relevant passage[s]? Maybe I 
 missed some, it was a very long message and its purpose didn't seem to 
 explain reasons for the action.
 
 Nemo
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thoughts on Admin Rights on WMF Wiki (and other things)

2013-05-26 Thread Federico Leva (Nemo)

Deryck Chan, 26/05/2013 11:27:

In contrast to my post in the original thread (that I'm sceptical about how
long WMF wiki will survive without volunteer admins), I do think the WMF is
allowed their own piece of turf.

In general, when there's an owner of a WMF-hosted wiki, we generally
allow the owner group to have totalitarian control over who gets
adminship of the wiki. (eg. chapter wikis, Wikimania wikis - I'm grateful
that thehelpfulone respected the WM2013's local team's request to not grant
adminship to anyone without the team's explicit approval.)


Sure. Except that in those cases it's clear who's in charge, for 
instance the wikimania team. Who's in charge of the wiki here? How many 
other times does this need to be asked?


Nemo



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thoughts on Admin Rights on WMF Wiki (and other things)

2013-05-26 Thread Tomasz W. Kozlowski
Again, this is going to be a general e–mail, so I'm not going to quote 
anyone in particular, and will just refer to some parts of the e–mails 
sent before this one.


First of all, I think some of you guys should really stop freaking out 
about the alleged level of attacks in this thread (and the previous 
one). I haven't seen anyone say anything really outrageous here, and the 
mere expression of an opinion that someone should be fired is /not/ a 
personal attack. Requiring that people better be nice than honest will 
not help solve anything, in the same way that sending small novels 
without really answering any questions does not help anything.


The fact is that none of the questions asked have been answered yet, 
almost three weeks since the situation happened. The thread has not 
died—people are just waiting for some true answers, other than it's our 
wiki and it's always been uniquely governed.


I'm not sure whether this is related to Gayle's joining the WMF just 16 
months ago, but the uniqueness of the WMF wiki was never like she (and 
apparently Sue, if I recall correctly) described it.


The decision-making authority has never been placed with the 
WMF—rather, the wiki was an example of a pretty good symbiosis between 
the WMF staff, who have been posting official documents, press releases, 
keeping the staff list up-to-date, and maintaining their user pages, and 
between the volunteers, who have been doing all sorts of things—from 
fixing typos, importing translations, to creating new accounts and 
deleting redundant templates.


This worked quite well, with some minor to moderate glitches, until May 
(April?) this year, when someone thought it was such a good idea to just 
go ahead and remove adminship from all those volunteers. (Yes, I'm no 
longer AGF-ing here.)


You cannot expect people to stop bringing this topic up until they get — 
in their feeling — satisfactory answers, and it is my impression that at 
least some people don't feel that way.


-- Tomasz

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Spanish Wikipedia first million

2013-05-26 Thread Salvador A
To celebrate this milestone, Iberocoop chapters have made this video that
we share with you:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SLw_Z8w604

Enjoy it!

Regards!


2013/5/17 ENWP Pine deyntest...@hotmail.com

Felicitaciones a la española Wikipedia!
 http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Fogos_artificiais.jpg

 Pine

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-- 
*Salvador Alcántar*
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Spanish Wikipedia first million

2013-05-26 Thread Salvador A
Also, it's in Commons:

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Un_mill%C3%B3n_de_gracias,_de_Wikipedia_en_espa%C3%B1ol.webm


2013/5/26 Salvador A salvador1...@gmail.com

 To celebrate this milestone, Iberocoop chapters have made this video that
 we share with you:

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SLw_Z8w604

 Enjoy it!

 Regards!


 2013/5/17 ENWP Pine deyntest...@hotmail.com

Felicitaciones a la española Wikipedia!
 http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Fogos_artificiais.jpg

 Pine

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[Wikimedia-l] [Language Engineering] Bug triage on Wednesday, May 29, 2013 at 1700 UTC/1000 PDT

2013-05-26 Thread Runa Bhattacharjee
What: Internationalization bug triage
Date: May 29, 2013
Time: 1700-1800 UTC, 1000-1100 PDT (Timezone conversion: http://hexm.de/r0)
Channel: #mediawiki-i18n (Freenode)
Etherpad: http://etherpad.wikimedia.org/BugTriage-i18n-2013-05
Questions can be sent to: runa at wikimedia dot org

Hello,

The Language Engineering team would like to invite everyone for the
upcoming bug triage session on Wednesday, May 29, 2013 at 1700 UTC
(1000 PDT).  During this 1 hour session we will be using the etherpad
listed above to collaborate. We have already listed some bugs, but
please feel free to add more bugs, comments and any other related
issues that you’d like to see addressed during the session. You can
send questions directly to me on email or IRC (nick: arrbee). Please
see above for event details.

Thank you.

regards
Runa

-- 
Language Engineering - Outreach and QA Coordinator
Wikimedia Foundation

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