Re: [Wikimedia-l] WaPo Wikipedia's 'complicated; relationship with net neutrality

2014-12-01 Thread Milos Rancic
On Dec 1, 2014 8:26 AM, Mark delir...@hackish.org wrote:

 On 12/1/14, 7:11 AM, Milos Rancic wrote:

 There are some items -- abused or not for marketing purposes of the
 entities used for achieving interests of their shareholders -- which
belong
 to the corpus of common good. Like air and free knowledge are, for
example.


 If an ISP wanted to make *all* online free-knowledge resources exempt
from per-MB data charges, that would be a much more interesting proposal.
It's the differential pricing between different sources of knowledge that I
find more troubling: why should a user pay more to access the Stanford
Encyclopedia of Philosophy than Wikipedia? That's already attempting to
shape, via differential pricing, where online users get their information.

I agree that we should coordinate with the participants of the broader free
knowledge and free software movement and include their sites while
negotiating with mobile carries.

In the meantime this is what we have. Some corporations find that it's
clever PR idea not to charge for oxygen. That's not fully useful, but it's
quite essential. The next target is nitrogen, then we should take care of
other gases to make air completely free.

Counting the tendency initiated by WMF, net neutrality should move to
exclusively commercial or market terrain. I agree with that, but it's not
about us. Free content is common good and we are fortunate that mobile
providers will be soon forced to recognize that. (First it's about clever
PR, then it becomes the norm.)
___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] WaPo Wikipedia's 'complicated; relationship with net neutrality

2014-12-01 Thread Martijn Hoekstra
On Nov 26, 2014 11:21 PM, Kim Bruning k...@bruning.xs4all.nl wrote:


 Washington post article

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-switch/wp/2014/11/25/wikipedias-complicated-relationship-with-net-neutrality/

 sincerely,
 Kim


This is obviously not the first time this comes up, and it's probably not
going to be the last time either. I think that Wikipedia Zero is a great
and valuable project that does the right thing. I also agree it violates
net neutrality for any reasonable definition of net neutrality, and there
is a number of very good objections to the practice. It would be great if
we were confident enough of this project to come out and say yes, this
violates net neutrality and here are the reasons why we think it's a good
thing in this case. It would make a far stronger case than the well,
actually, ... rule lawyer, question evasion, goalposts moving, talking
around the issue ... and that's why it has nothing to do with net
neutrality!

Wikipedia Zero is a great project that does amazingly good stuff for many
people who need it most. That's an awesome reason to violate net
neutrality, even when it has real dangers and drawbacks. When we start to
deny the dangers and drawbacks, all discussion becomes muddled, and stains
the zero project with dishonesty.

--Martijn
___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] WaPo Wikipedia's 'complicated; relationship with net neutrality

2014-12-01 Thread Tim Starling
On 01/12/14 15:24, svetlana wrote:
 Wikipedia is naturally slow and expensive for many ISPs, because we
 don't use a big CDN.
 
 Why don't we? Is it one of the expensive for us, cheap for users things?

That may be part of it. Also, we have unusual technical requirements
for freshness of content and prompt removal (revision deletion etc.),
and an ops team with a desire for independence.

-- Tim Starling


___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Fundraising banners (again)

2014-12-01 Thread David Gerard
Wikipedia begging for donations per usual. Advertising isn't evil
they say as they throw a second nag at me as I scroll down.

https://twitter.com/enemyplayer/status/539180814739988481

Obnoxious banners *really do damage the brand*.

What are the fundraiser metrics? If they don't include effect on the
brand, they'll be motivating damaging behaviour.


- d.

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia France] WikiCheese crowdfunding - Let's photograph 'em all

2014-12-01 Thread Richard Symonds
Lincolnshire Poacher isn't just a cheese OR a pig...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lincolnshire_Poacher_(numbers_station)

Richard Symonds
Wikimedia UK
0207 065 0992

Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and
Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered
Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A 4LT.
United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia
movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who
operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).

*Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal control
over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*

On 29 November 2014 at 17:35, Chris Keating chriskeatingw...@gmail.com
wrote:

 British cheese is better than its reputation suggests, if you know where to
 look. However British cheeses are difficult to distinguish from British
 breeds of pig. Gloucester Old Spot, Lincolnshire Poacher, Oxford Sandy and
 Black, Balcombe Brown Ring, Yarg, Mangalitsa - can you tell which is a pig
 and which is a cheese without looking it up in a popular online
 encyclopedia? I think not. :)

 On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 2:30 PM, Andrea Zanni zanni.andre...@gmail.com
 wrote:

  This is the best OT in wikimedia-l ever.
 
  Aubrey
 
  On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 1:43 PM, Pierre-Selim ps.hu...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
   I recommend Trappist Rochefort 10, and gulden draak ;)
  
   Pierre-Selim
 Message d'origine
   De: Romaine Wiki
   Envoyé: samedi 29 novembre 2014 11:46
   À: Wikimedia Mailing List
   Répondre à: Wikimedia Mailing List
   Objet: Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia France] WikiCheese crowdfunding -
   Let's photograph 'em all
  
   PS: I can recommend the beers: Kriek, Framboise, Peche, and some more.
  But
   it is recommend to drink these in Brussels to experience the region
 where
   it belongs to.
  
   In London I can recommend a Honey Dew!
  
  
  
  
   2014-11-29 11:44 GMT+01:00 Romaine Wiki romaine.w...@gmail.com:
  
I vote for Brussels  beer, I tasted them the past weeks and it asks
  for
more.
   
The day before yesterday I heard that some beers from Brussels are
   typical
Brussels as the region has a special local micro climate.
   
But I must say, I think it is good to document cheese, as well as
 other
food/drinks, we should have more photos with better quality. I really
   hope
this contributes to this.
   
Romaine
   
2014-11-28 10:32 GMT+01:00 Andrea Zanni zanni.andre...@gmail.com:
   
Me too me too!
But before, Brussels on beer.
   
Aubrey
   
On Fri, Nov 28, 2014 at 10:22 AM, Craig Franklin 
cfrank...@halonetwork.net
wrote:
   
 Forget that, I'd like WMUK to fly me to Scotland so that I can,
 uh,
 research and write about various types of whisky.

 Cheers,
 Craig

 On 25 November 2014 at 18:59, Jon Davies 
  jon.dav...@wikimedia.org.uk
   
 wrote:

  And next the wine project? Count me in.
 
  On 24 November 2014 at 18:22, Christophe Henner 
  christophe.hen...@gmail.com
   wrote:
 
   Good news everyone,
  
   Cheese articles are gonna get improved!
  
   As french, it was dreadful for us to see so few illustrations
 of
cheese
  on
   Wikipedia. This is about to change.
  
   A group of french Wikimedians, lead by Pierre-Yves Beaudouin,
designed
 a
   project to photograph many cheeses, up to 200 for the moment.
  
   This project is perticular as we aim to have it found through
 a
french
   crowdfunding platform, KissKissBankBank.
  
   Of course Wikimedia France could have funded it itself, but we
wanted
 to
   use the project as a way to get the larger audience aware of
  their
  ability
   to contribute and to give a fun image of contributing.
  
   The project in few words iss follow :
   * 10 cheeses per session
   * During the session the cheeses are photographed and their
   articles
   improved
   * During the sessions experimented wikimedian would train new
editors
   * At every session every participant would enjoy eating good
   cheese
too
  
   If you want to read more, or even contribute, about the
 project
   you
can
  go
   on KissKissBankBank :
   http://www.kisskissbankbank.com/fr/projects/wikicheese
  
  
   If you have any questions, please feel free to shoot them on
 or
   off
 list.
  
   All the best,
  
   --
   Christophe
   ___
   Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
   https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
   Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
   Unsubscribe:
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
   mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org
?subject=unsubscribe
  

[Wikimedia-l] Fwd: Let's recruit tech volunteers in your country via GSoC / OPW

2014-12-01 Thread Quim Gil
On the topic of increasing diversity, a tech task that can be driven by
non-tech Wikimedians as well.

Wikimedia is planning to participate in Google Summer of Code 2015 and the
simultaneous FOSS Outreach Program for Women round 10. We want to increase
geographical diversity among candidates by involving local Wikimedia groups
in the promotion of these programs. This, in turn, could help increasing
the technical capacity of these groups. Interested? Please check

Connect Wikimedia groups, Google Developer Groups, and computer science
university departments
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T925

Italy, Russia, China, and Japan have been mentioned already. Adding other
locations is up to you. We are looking for local drivers. The Engineering
Community team and others can help from a distance, but this won't work
without local promoters.

PS: you can register to Phabricator with your Wikimedia account, and you
can subscribe to tasks in order to receive updates -- see
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Phabricator/Help

-- 
Quim Gil
Engineering Community Manager @ Wikimedia Foundation
http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User:Qgil
___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] WaPo Wikipedia's 'complicated; relationship with net neutrality

2014-12-01 Thread Gerard Meijssen
Hoi,
We do have the experience  needed. We have servers in Amsterdam and, it is
something we can repeat.

When the desires of our ops team negatively affect the performance of our
users, they have to reconsider what they are thinking. Imho that is not an
acceptable argument.
Thanks,
   GerardM

On 1 December 2014 at 10:38, Tim Starling tstarl...@wikimedia.org wrote:

 On 01/12/14 15:24, svetlana wrote:
  Wikipedia is naturally slow and expensive for many ISPs, because we
  don't use a big CDN.
 
  Why don't we? Is it one of the expensive for us, cheap for users
 things?

 That may be part of it. Also, we have unusual technical requirements
 for freshness of content and prompt removal (revision deletion etc.),
 and an ops team with a desire for independence.

 -- Tim Starling


 ___
 Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
 Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
 Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
 mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Why is bank transfer no longer possible?

2014-12-01 Thread Federico Leva (Nemo)

Tim Landscheidt, 01/12/2014 04:22:

Also, I'm no expert on EU regulations, but I do observe that
according to the European Payments Council, it seems payees
receiving SEPA credit transfers are advised to communicate
the IBAN only where necessary:
http://www.europeanpaymentscouncil.eu/index.cfm/sepa-credit-transfer/iban-and-bic/
(and likewise for payers making direct debit payments).

That text and Regulation 260/2012 it refers to use only
where necessary to refer to the publication of the*BIC*  as
it is only necessary for routing in the transition period
that ends February 1st, 2016 at the latest.



Besides, «Note: the European Payments Council (EPC), representing the 
European banking industry in relation to payments, is not a European 
Union (EU) legislative body».


Michael Snow, 01/12/2014 03:59:
 I'm not sure why you would conclude they are unaware of a possible form
 for fraud just because they don't specifically identify it on their
 website.

Because part of the ECB mandate is to identify, combat and educate about 
payment systems risks. There are dozens of watchdogs ensuring they 
actually do (the biggest might be BEUC). If WMF, with its certainly 
outstanding computer security knowledge, identified security risks which 
ECB is not forthcoming about, I'd expect WMF to communicate with ECB, 
and if necessary partner with consumerist associations, so that such 
risks are communicated to 516 millions SEPA area citizens.


Risker, 01/12/2014 06:31:
   Banks in Canada regularly call their customers for
 transactions under $5 because fraud is so common - and that is with chip
 cards and PINs.

And what does this tell us about EU/SEPA banking system?

Nemo

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] WaPo Wikipedia's 'complicated; relationship with net neutrality

2014-12-01 Thread Federico Leva (Nemo)
This comparison is quite useful and got rather popular: «For all the 
arcana in telecommunications law, there is a really simple way of 
thinking of the debate over net neutrality: Is access to the Internet 
more like access to electricity, or more like cable television service?».

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/11/upshot/a-super-simple-way-to-understand-the-net-neutrality-debate.html

Tim Starling, 01/12/2014 05:21:

But the pipes are fundamentally not dumb -- there is a complex
arrangement of transit prices and peering, and the companies that
built transoceanic links want to recoup their investment.


I doubt the worldwide internet backbone is (significantly) more complex 
or expensive than the electricity grid.



What you are
saying is that you want the ISPs to provide the necessary
cross-subsidies so that the pipes will appear to be dumb, to the end user.


Opinions on this vary. Historically, for instance, electricity grids 
have been rather fragmented and have been unified only with strong 
regulations or nationalisations. Only now regulators are seriously 
taking care of supranational grids. Certainly we don't want to go 
backwards, because it usually takes decades to progress.


Nemo

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Fundraiser] fundraising blocked in Russia

2014-12-01 Thread Everton Zanella Alvarenga
Isn't a chapter allowed to run its own banner at the local Wikipedia
pointing to the its donnation procedure, I guess adequated to the local
legislation?

I guess a sitenotice is not as efficient as the fancy and well planned WMF
banner, but that could be a start.

2014-11-28 9:29 GMT-02:00 rubin.happy rubin.ha...@gmail.com:

 Update: now we have something about 2 weeks without explanations and
 without fundraising in Russia.
 WMF, are you still with us? :)

 Linar

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] WaPo Wikipedia's 'complicated; relationship with net neutrality

2014-12-01 Thread Mike Godwin
Tim Landscheidt writes:

 I think on the contrary Wikipedia Zero illustrates nicely
 why net neutrality is so important: Wikipedia Zero favours
 solely Wikipedia (und sister projects), while contradicting
 or simply other opinions and resources bite the dust.

I'm not following your reasoning here. I don't see any sense in which
Wikipedia Zero is contradicting other opinions or resulting in
resources that bite the dust. Wikipedia Zero is not rivalrous in any
economic sense that I'm aware of.

 This mainstreaming, forming a monopolistic cabal on all
 things information is why I am a strong proponent of net
 neutrality.  The ease with which information can be shared
 nowadays should be used so that more people provide their
 views, not more people consume one view.

So, you'd rather have users pay by the bit for Wikipedia on their
mobile devices? This does not serve Wikipedia or its users in the
developing world. The chart I use here shows you what the cost of
broadband access is in the developing world, which relies primarily on
mobile platforms.
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/article/20141201000351-209165-wikipedia-zero-will-serve-net-neutrality

 And I have severe doubts that Wikipedia Zero fulfils actual
 needs from the perspective of sustainable development.

But you haven't said what those severe doubts are. Having spent the
last couple of years working on access projects in the developing
world, I haven't encountered an alternative model that doesn't result
in higher prices for subscribers. As the chart I reproduce indicates,
in some places in the developing world, the annual cost of broadband
access exceeds the average per capita income. I do not see how it
serves Wikipedia's mission to require individual users to pay so much
for Wikipedia access.


--Mike

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] WaPo Wikipedia's 'complicated; relationship with net neutrality

2014-12-01 Thread David Gerard
On 1 December 2014 at 14:45, Marc A. Pelletier m...@uberbox.org wrote:

 Net neutrality as currently defined is an alluring concept because -
 as Westerners - we percieve its putative effect as make everything
 uniformly inexpensive to level the playing field for users and content
 providers.  /We/ don't care that Wikipedia is as expensive to use as
 Facebook because the cost to either is marginally neglectable.


This makes me wonder if yep, we sure do violate it, and here's
precisely why might be a good answer. Though I'd rather not hand
Comcast any more sticks. (Compare the FSF's use of copyright
assignment and the typical commercial user of copyright assignment.)

I note a vague similarity to Erik's essay on why -NC is harmful: that
the idea of enforcing noncommerciality is pretty much a first world
affectation and doesn't really do the job people using it want it to.


- d.

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] WaPo Wikipedia's 'complicated; relationship with net neutrality

2014-12-01 Thread Liam Wyatt
I'm finding this highly principled conversation fascinating to read - I'm
genuinely learning a lot about the different arguments (both philosophical
and practical) used to support or critique Wikipedia Zero. What a diverse
and highly informed group of people this list contains! :-)

From my Australian perspective, it's interesting because we've never had
'net neutrality' in the way that it is described in the US and, with
appropriate competition and regulation this is not been a problem. e.g.:

Net neutrality is an honourable aspiration, but the Australian internet
 service provider market has thrived and innovated without it.
 Discriminatory pricing in the form of unmetered content is more a consumer
 bonus than an imposition of someone else’s choice.
 http://theconversation.com/australias-net-neutrality-lesson-for-the-us-22245



While I genuinely support the idealism of the net-neutrality debate, and it
makes sense in certain jurisdictional contexts (notably the USA), I am
won-over by the arguments that have been made here about how WikipediaZero
is non-rivalrous. As Marc P. put it earlier:

 So it's clearly neutral in the equally available sense of the term.
 And it remains neutral in the competition sense of the term since they
 are welcome to zero-rate any other service they wish alongside ours.
 And, finally, it's also neutral from a conflict-of-interest point of
 view.


When looking at the practical reality of a high-school in a poorer district
of South Africa specifically asking for greater access to WP from their
local telecom company[1], it's hard to remain stuck on purely-principled
debates. That is a *real world* group of of people that is *specifically*
asked for easer access to Wikipedia - *of course *we should support that.

This is *not *to discount the importance of principles - and a lot of good
ones have been mentioned here - but I'm not going to argue against a
school-group in a poorer country wanting free-access to the sum of human
knowledge on their mobile phones because of a political fight in richer
countries about heavy-data usage on high-speed broadband.

-Liam

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3j-ktiYTTds
___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] WaPo Wikipedia's 'complicated; relationship with net neutrality

2014-12-01 Thread Nathan
On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 11:30 AM, Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com wrote:



 From my Australian perspective, it's interesting because we've never had
 'net neutrality' in the way that it is described in the US and, with
 appropriate competition and regulation this is not been a problem. e.g.:

 Net neutrality is an honourable aspiration, but the Australian internet
  service provider market has thrived and innovated without it.
  Discriminatory pricing in the form of unmetered content is more a
 consumer
  bonus than an imposition of someone else’s choice.
 
 http://theconversation.com/australias-net-neutrality-lesson-for-the-us-22245
 


Thanks for the interesting link. While the article acknowledges that the
lack of net neutrality has favored certain Australian content providers at
the expense of others, it sounds like the most pernicious effects are
mitigated by the fact that at least part of the ISP infrastructure is
treated as a public utility that must permit competitors.

One more example of how an absolutist and global approach to net neutrality
fails to account for local nuance.
___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

[Wikimedia-l] WaPo Wikipedia's 'complicated' relationship with net neutrality

2014-12-01 Thread Gayle Karen Young
Hi folks,


Hope those of you in the US have had a lovely holiday weekend.  I'm getting
caught up and it’s been interesting to read the discussion this article has
prompted -- as this thread has made clear, there’s a lot to discuss, and
people have passionate feelings about the issue. I'm learning a lot. I’ll
leave some more follow-up on the particulars of the policy issues to the
Wikipedia Zero team, but I wanted to clarify some questions people raised
at the beginning on how I happened to be quoted.


The quotes from the article were never intended to represent the official
WMF position -- they were my own musings and spontaneous thoughts, taken
from what I had thought was just a friendly conversation. Last month I was
at an event hosted by the new US television network Fusion to speak on a
panel about millennial digital activism, and after the panel I chatted
about the future of the internet with someone to whom I had just been
introduced. I shared some thoughts, mostly about the ability of the
internet to increase collaboration. I made a couple of comments related
specifically to Wikipedia, including Wikipedia Zero, but they were more
just me exploring my own nascent ideas, not acting as an official voice. I
didn't know it would be used in a story related to net neutrality, nor did
I have the impression that I was being asked for an official position of
the Wikimedia Foundation. Talk about a surprise to find myself quoted in
the Post!


I think we were all surprised to see my words represented so officially,
and it’s unfortunate they were used as the basis for representing the
position of the Foundation on net neutrality. What IS true is that I -- and
we -- passionately believe in the importance of Wikipedia Zero. Access to
knowledge is a fundamental right, and Wikipedia Zero is one important tool
that helps realize that right. It also gets us one step closer to that
vision of a world where every single person on the planet has free access
to the sum of all human knowledge -- which is certainly why I am here (and
why a lot of you are too).


Warm regards,

Gayle
___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] WaPo Wikipedia's 'complicated; relationship with net neutrality

2014-12-01 Thread Yana Welinder
Hi all,

As Gayle mentioned in her email, the article in the Washington Post did not
represent an official position on net neutrality from the Wikimedia
Foundation, or how we understand Wikipedia Zero. I wanted to provide some
background that does.

Wikipedia Zero is designed to empower people who cannot afford to access
information to get basic access to knowledge and participate in the
creation of knowledge. It’s widely understood that barriers like poverty
and limited internet connectivity are two major blockers preventing people
around the world from full access to knowledge, and there are a number of
groups working to address these issues as part of the broader Access to
Knowledge (A2K) movement.

Wikipedia Zero is a powerful tool for accessing knowledge, but it is not
the solution to the whole problem. It’s one tool in a toolbox. Real change
needs to address issues such as cost barriers, literacy, and access to
infrastructure. That’s why we’re also developing a more coordinated effort
within a broader A2K coalition to collectively address the systemic
challenges.

While Wikipedia Zero serves broader A2K objectives, we are mindful that
zero-rating can be a challenging issue for net neutrality advocacy. In
response, we’ve developed ten operating principles
https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Wikipedia_Zero_Operating_Principles
to make sure that the initiative remains a free knowledge base with
operations that are transparent to users.[1] They are intended to deter
Wikipedia Zero from being used to introduce other zero-rating initiatives
that don't follow the operating principles. We developed these principles
after extensive consultation with net neutrality advocates about their
concerns regarding commercial zero-rating arrangements, and believe they
are strong and useful guidance for advocates to distinguish free access to
Wikipedia from other zero-rating programs.

We’ll continue working with policymakers on net neutrality and welcome your
constructive suggestions in this regard. We believe the vision of Wikimedia
— the sum of all knowledge, available to all — and the values of an open
internet are entirely consistent and in the global public interest. We’re
also learning from your comments and welcome more input on how the
Wikimedia community can support the A2K movement.

Best,
Yana

[1] https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Wikipedia_Zero_Operating_Principles

-- 
Yana Welinder
Senior Legal Counsel
Wikimedia Foundation
415.839.6885 ext. 6867
@yanatweets https://twitter.com/yanatweets

NOTICE:  As an attorney for the Wikimedia Foundation, for legal/ethical
reasons I cannot give legal advice to, or serve as a lawyer for, community
members, volunteers, or staff members in their personal capacity. In other
words, IANYL https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IANAL. For more on what this
means, please see our legal disclaimer
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Legal_Disclaimer.
___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia France] WikiCheese crowdfunding - Let's photograph 'em all

2014-12-01 Thread Peter Southwood
For CNIEL it is free publicity. Putting in for them trivial amount ensures that 
it happens. No-brainer. Nothing wrong with accepting their money as everyone 
gains from the deal. Win- win-win situation.
Cheers,
Peter

-Original Message-
From: wikimedia-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org 
[mailto:wikimedia-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Christophe Henner
Sent: 01 December 2014 07:20 PM
To: Wikimedia Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia France] WikiCheese crowdfunding - Let's 
photograph 'em all

Hi everyone,

A quick update 7 days after launch (pun intended).

We have reached 92% of our first goal. We're receiving huge supports and an 
amazing coverage from medias. This is just awesome.

In the latest news, we just received a 1 200€ pledge from the CNIEL 
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centre_national_interprofessionnel_de_l%27%C3%A9conomie_laiti%C3%A8re
the organisation promoting dairy products in France. Just so you know, we did 
not asked them to.

We're really happy from this unexpected support :)

Thanks also to everyone here who helped spread the word and allowed us to go 
this far. Now, we have to reach the 9 000€ goal so we can produce a documentary 
about how cheese is made.

Thanks again, I tried to remain brie-f



--
Christophe

On 1 December 2014 at 11:58, Richard Symonds  
richard.symo...@wikimedia.org.uk wrote:

 Lincolnshire Poacher isn't just a cheese OR a pig...

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lincolnshire_Poacher_(numbers_station)

 Richard Symonds
 Wikimedia UK
 0207 065 0992

 Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England 
 and Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. 
 Registered Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London 
 EC2A 4LT.
 United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia 
 movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation 
 (who operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).

 *Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal 
 control over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*

 On 29 November 2014 at 17:35, Chris Keating 
 chriskeatingw...@gmail.com
 wrote:

  British cheese is better than its reputation suggests, if you know 
  where
 to
  look. However British cheeses are difficult to distinguish from 
  British breeds of pig. Gloucester Old Spot, Lincolnshire Poacher, 
  Oxford Sandy
 and
  Black, Balcombe Brown Ring, Yarg, Mangalitsa - can you tell which is 
  a
 pig
  and which is a cheese without looking it up in a popular online 
  encyclopedia? I think not. :)
 
  On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 2:30 PM, Andrea Zanni 
  zanni.andre...@gmail.com
  wrote:
 
   This is the best OT in wikimedia-l ever.
  
   Aubrey
  
   On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 1:43 PM, Pierre-Selim ps.hu...@gmail.com
  wrote:
  
I recommend Trappist Rochefort 10, and gulden draak ;)
   
Pierre-Selim
  Message d'origine
De: Romaine Wiki
Envoyé: samedi 29 novembre 2014 11:46
À: Wikimedia Mailing List
Répondre à: Wikimedia Mailing List
Objet: Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia France] WikiCheese 
crowdfunding - Let's photograph 'em all
   
PS: I can recommend the beers: Kriek, Framboise, Peche, and some
 more.
   But
it is recommend to drink these in Brussels to experience the 
region
  where
it belongs to.
   
In London I can recommend a Honey Dew!
   
   
   
   
2014-11-29 11:44 GMT+01:00 Romaine Wiki romaine.w...@gmail.com:
   
 I vote for Brussels  beer, I tasted them the past weeks and 
 it
 asks
   for
 more.

 The day before yesterday I heard that some beers from Brussels 
 are
typical
 Brussels as the region has a special local micro climate.

 But I must say, I think it is good to document cheese, as well 
 as
  other
 food/drinks, we should have more photos with better quality. I
 really
hope
 this contributes to this.

 Romaine

 2014-11-28 10:32 GMT+01:00 Andrea Zanni 
 zanni.andre...@gmail.com
 :

 Me too me too!
 But before, Brussels on beer.

 Aubrey

 On Fri, Nov 28, 2014 at 10:22 AM, Craig Franklin  
 cfrank...@halonetwork.net
 wrote:

  Forget that, I'd like WMUK to fly me to Scotland so that I 
  can,
  uh,
  research and write about various types of whisky.
 
  Cheers,
  Craig
 
  On 25 November 2014 at 18:59, Jon Davies 
   jon.dav...@wikimedia.org.uk

  wrote:
 
   And next the wine project? Count me in.
  
   On 24 November 2014 at 18:22, Christophe Henner  
   christophe.hen...@gmail.com
wrote:
  
Good news everyone,
   
Cheese articles are gonna get improved!
   
As french, it was dreadful for us to see so few
 illustrations
  of
 cheese
   on
Wikipedia. This is about to change.
   
A group of french Wikimedians, lead by Pierre-Yves
 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Issue on Dutch Wikipedia in relation to BLP violating images

2014-12-01 Thread Kim Bruning

Hmmm, 

Is that the fourth or the fifth wiki you are now indeffed from ? ;-)
(I was looking up your illustrious history while chatting with you,
and I admit I lost count somewhere along the way :-P [*])

Checking up on the nl.wikipedia discussions you had, I do agree
that the environment turned toxic pretty quickly ... once 
you started throwing around insults like confetti. ;-)

You were trying to get indeffed on purpose, right!?
Only sane explanation. 

Wikis are like pokemon, gotta get indeffed from them all!

sincerely,
Kim Bruning

[*] NSFL WARNING: do not look up why Russavia was decratted on
Commons: NSFL WARNING [**]
[**] I'm not entirely sure why they were *merely* decratted.
This might be a fatal flaw in commons. 


On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 05:23:30AM +0800, Russavia wrote:
 Michel,
 
 I agree the atmosphere there is extremely toxic.
 
 For the record, I have now been indefinitely blocked on Dutch Wikipedia for
 raising serious concerns on Commons about one of their clique. Concerns
 which involved incontrovertible evidence that they have been accessing
 materials on Commons which was deleted due to privacy concerns and then
 passed around to others who wouldn't otherwise have that access.
 
 The unfunny part about it all, is that this only came to light after I
 publicly told MoiraMoira that given it was me who deleted privacy related
 images on Commons as they related to her, she should have more
 understanding on issues when subjects of articles have complaints about
 images of themselves. It then lead to that evidence being provided to me
 within minutes. The person who provided me the evidence has also been
 indefinitely blocked on Dutch Wikipedia, ostensibly for providing me with
 the evidence which included the person's first name -- a first name that
 was well known to me by way of discussion many years ago when we
 introduced ourselves privately on IRC.
 
 So, I agree wholeheartedly about their abusive and toxic environment, and
 don't really take any notice to those on there who call me a troll, for it
 is those people on Dutch Wikipedia who are playing unacceptable games in
 outright violation of the WMF Board resolution. They think they are
 punishing me, they are not; they are punishing the subject of the article.
 
 Regards,
 
 Russavia
 
 
 On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 4:46 AM, Michel Vuijlsteke wikipe...@zog.org
 wrote:
 
  Quick and easy: don't bother with the Dutch Wikipedia. It is one of the
  more toxic environments on the internet. :)
 
 
 ___
 Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
 Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
 Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
 mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

-- 
[Non-pgp mail clients may show pgp-signature as attachment]
gpg (www.gnupg.org) Fingerprint for key  FEF9DD72
5ED6 E215 73EE AD84 E03A  01C5 94AC 7B0E FEF9 DD72

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Issue on Dutch Wikipedia in relation to BLP violating images

2014-12-01 Thread Austin Hair
C'mon, Kim, you know better. Keep it on IRC.

Austin

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

[Wikimedia-l] Organizational effectiveness tool (for Wikimedia organizations)

2014-12-01 Thread Anasuya Sengupta
tl;dr Request for Wikimedia organizations to take a survey on
organizational effectiveness, that will help us understand and support each
other better: https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/OEQuestionnaire


Dear friends and colleagues of the Wikimedia movement:

The Wikimedia Foundation's Grantmaking team has initiated a project with
TCC Group - a consulting firm focused on social impact - and the larger
Wikimedia communities, to help Wikimedia organizations of all shapes and
sizes (including user groups, chapters, and thematic organizations), to
improve their effectiveness and their ability to have impact for the
movement. The project was initiated in response to growing interest and
conversations by volunteers and organizations, to better understand how
organizations in particular have impact in the Wikimedia movement, which is
unique in that it is online, growing extraordinarily fast, and created and
supported almost entirely by volunteers.

The project seeks to help Wikimedia organizations better understand 1) how
impact is defined from an organizational perspective in their contexts, 2)
what strategies Wikimedia organizations use to achieve that impact, and 3)
what resources and skills Wikimedia organizations may need to be more
effective in the strategies they choose to pursue.

In the first “impact” stage of the project, TCC interviewed several
organizations, administered an impact survey to all organizations, and
attended Wikimania 2014 in London where the project was discussed with
AffCom, an informal organizational effectiveness working group, the FDC and
other grantmaking committees, as well as many other individuals in the
movement. TCC also conducted in-depth research on three organizations,
resulting in case studies illustrating different organizational models
leading to impact. Many thanks to those of you who took your valuable time
to participate in one or more of these exchanges; Wikimedians around the
globe created the foundation for this work.

The second and third stages of the project involve development of an online
organizational effectiveness questionnaire, a user guide to help
organizations interpret their results, and an organizational effectiveness
learning center, which may help organizations think about the different
strategies they are using and how they could build specific capacities to
be more successful with those strategies.

*Learning center:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Organizational_effectiveness/Learning_center.


*User guide:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Organizational_effectiveness/Tool/User_guide

*Questionnaire text:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Organizational_effectiveness/Tool/Questionnaire

*Link to take questionnaire (can be used once per IP address, but more
links can be requested): https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/OEQuestionnaire

The learning center is intended to be a base from which Wikimedia
organizations can grow their knowledge and share their own experiences and
best practices. TCC worked closely with a handful of Wikimedia volunteers
from different organizations to design the Questionnaire you are about to
take.

Wikimedia Foundation has provided funding for this project and has
consulted closely with TCC over the course of the engagement. Please note
that the questionnaire is not intended to be a test of individual
organizations in any way; the Foundation will not be provided with
individual organization results. As part of this consultation, TCC will
aggregate findings from the movement-wide Organizational Effectiveness
Questionnaire and provide them to the Foundation’s grantmaking team, along
with a “capacity building roadmap” to help the team - and the wider
movement - think about how organizations can build capacity for specific
program strategies.


*We request that you respond to the questionnaire by December 21st*, so
that TCC can collate the results and share it with all of us early in the
new year.  Please let us know if you have any difficulties or questions: the
WMF contact for this process is Winifred Olliff. Please contact us with
questions or suggestions at orgeffectiven...@wikimedia.org.


Many thanks to all who offered their time and expertise to the different
stages of this project. We hope this tool will be useful to you in your
work, and we welcome your continued feedback.

Warm regards and looking forward to our continued work together!
Anasuya

-- 


*Anasuya SenguptaSenior Director of GrantmakingWikimedia Foundation*

Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share in
the sum of all knowledge.  Help us make it a reality!
Support Wikimedia https://donate.wikimedia.org/
___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia France] WikiCheese crowdfunding - Let's photograph 'em all

2014-12-01 Thread Chris Keating
CNIEL, are they the equivalent of the British Cheese Board?  ;)
On 1 Dec 2014 18:44, Christophe Henner christophe.hen...@gmail.com
wrote:

 Hi everyone,

 A quick update 7 days after launch (pun intended).

 We have reached 92% of our first goal. We're receiving huge supports and an
 amazing coverage from medias. This is just awesome.

 In the latest news, we just received a 1 200€ pledge from the CNIEL

 https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centre_national_interprofessionnel_de_l%27%C3%A9conomie_laiti%C3%A8re
 the organisation promoting dairy products in France. Just so you know, we
 did not asked them to.

 We're really happy from this unexpected support :)

 Thanks also to everyone here who helped spread the word and allowed us to
 go this far. Now, we have to reach the 9 000€ goal so we can produce a
 documentary about how cheese is made.

 Thanks again, I tried to remain brie-f



 --
 Christophe

 On 1 December 2014 at 11:58, Richard Symonds 
 richard.symo...@wikimedia.org.uk wrote:

  Lincolnshire Poacher isn't just a cheese OR a pig...
 
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lincolnshire_Poacher_(numbers_station)
 
  Richard Symonds
  Wikimedia UK
  0207 065 0992
 
  Wikimedia UK is a Company Limited by Guarantee registered in England and
  Wales, Registered No. 6741827. Registered Charity No.1144513. Registered
  Office 4th Floor, Development House, 56-64 Leonard Street, London EC2A
 4LT.
  United Kingdom. Wikimedia UK is the UK chapter of a global Wikimedia
  movement. The Wikimedia projects are run by the Wikimedia Foundation (who
  operate Wikipedia, amongst other projects).
 
  *Wikimedia UK is an independent non-profit charity with no legal control
  over Wikipedia nor responsibility for its contents.*
 
  On 29 November 2014 at 17:35, Chris Keating chriskeatingw...@gmail.com
  wrote:
 
   British cheese is better than its reputation suggests, if you know
 where
  to
   look. However British cheeses are difficult to distinguish from British
   breeds of pig. Gloucester Old Spot, Lincolnshire Poacher, Oxford Sandy
  and
   Black, Balcombe Brown Ring, Yarg, Mangalitsa - can you tell which is a
  pig
   and which is a cheese without looking it up in a popular online
   encyclopedia? I think not. :)
  
   On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 2:30 PM, Andrea Zanni 
 zanni.andre...@gmail.com
   wrote:
  
This is the best OT in wikimedia-l ever.
   
Aubrey
   
On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 1:43 PM, Pierre-Selim ps.hu...@gmail.com
   wrote:
   
 I recommend Trappist Rochefort 10, and gulden draak ;)

 Pierre-Selim
   Message d'origine
 De: Romaine Wiki
 Envoyé: samedi 29 novembre 2014 11:46
 À: Wikimedia Mailing List
 Répondre à: Wikimedia Mailing List
 Objet: Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia France] WikiCheese
 crowdfunding -
 Let's photograph 'em all

 PS: I can recommend the beers: Kriek, Framboise, Peche, and some
  more.
But
 it is recommend to drink these in Brussels to experience the region
   where
 it belongs to.

 In London I can recommend a Honey Dew!




 2014-11-29 11:44 GMT+01:00 Romaine Wiki romaine.w...@gmail.com:

  I vote for Brussels  beer, I tasted them the past weeks and it
  asks
for
  more.
 
  The day before yesterday I heard that some beers from Brussels
 are
 typical
  Brussels as the region has a special local micro climate.
 
  But I must say, I think it is good to document cheese, as well as
   other
  food/drinks, we should have more photos with better quality. I
  really
 hope
  this contributes to this.
 
  Romaine
 
  2014-11-28 10:32 GMT+01:00 Andrea Zanni 
 zanni.andre...@gmail.com
  :
 
  Me too me too!
  But before, Brussels on beer.
 
  Aubrey
 
  On Fri, Nov 28, 2014 at 10:22 AM, Craig Franklin 
  cfrank...@halonetwork.net
  wrote:
 
   Forget that, I'd like WMUK to fly me to Scotland so that I
 can,
   uh,
   research and write about various types of whisky.
  
   Cheers,
   Craig
  
   On 25 November 2014 at 18:59, Jon Davies 
jon.dav...@wikimedia.org.uk
 
   wrote:
  
And next the wine project? Count me in.
   
On 24 November 2014 at 18:22, Christophe Henner 
christophe.hen...@gmail.com
 wrote:
   
 Good news everyone,

 Cheese articles are gonna get improved!

 As french, it was dreadful for us to see so few
  illustrations
   of
  cheese
on
 Wikipedia. This is about to change.

 A group of french Wikimedians, lead by Pierre-Yves
  Beaudouin,
  designed
   a
 project to photograph many cheeses, up to 200 for the
  moment.

 This project is perticular as we aim to have it found
  through
   a
  french
 crowdfunding platform, KissKissBankBank.

 Of course Wikimedia France 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia France] WikiCheese crowdfunding - Let's photograph 'em all

2014-12-01 Thread Samuel Klein
Pierre-Yves Beaudouin writes:

 I'm the project leader of WikiCheese.

 KissKissBankBank

Christophe writes:
 Thanks again, I tried to remain brie-f

I had a dream like this last week, full of smoke and gorgons.

Kudos à Pyb, Christophe and all: this looks delicious.
___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

[Wikimedia-l] [offlist] Re: WaPo Wikipedia's 'complicated; relationship with net neutrality

2014-12-01 Thread Tim Starling
On 01/12/14 23:11, Federico Leva (Nemo) wrote:
 This comparison is quite useful and got rather popular: «For all the
 arcana in telecommunications law, there is a really simple way of
 thinking of the debate over net neutrality: Is access to the Internet
 more like access to electricity, or more like cable television service?».
 http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/11/upshot/a-super-simple-way-to-understand-the-net-neutrality-debate.html

I don't think the internet is especially similar to either. I think it
is like the postal service. The analogous question to net neutrality
is whether priority mail should be allowed, and whether it should cost
more to send a package to another continent than it does to send it
within the same city.

Nobody is saying ISPs should adopt a cable model, giving you a
subscription to a bundle of 100 websites tailored to your tastes and
preventing access to anything else, as that article suggests. That is
a straw man.

Obviously your electricity company has no opinion on what brand of
hairdryer you use, because your electricity company is not in the
business of shipping hairdryers. But if you buy hairdryers online, the
postal service or courier company will often have bulk discounts with
certain suppliers, so they do effectively participate in selecting
your hairdryer brand.

You don't connect your laptop to the internet each morning and say
one million bits, please! which is then delivered as white noise
through your speakers. ISPs are not selling a commodity.

-- Tim Starling


___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Fundraising banners (again)

2014-12-01 Thread MZMcBride
Ori Livneh wrote:
On Fri, Nov 28, 2014 at 5:55 PM, MZMcBride z...@mzmcbride.com wrote:
The banners may be effective, but they're not aligned with Wikimedia's
values.

I wouldn't come out quite as strongly against these banners, but I share
the underlying sentiment.

What happened to we make the Internet not suck? What happened to the
near-universal agreement that pop-ups are bad?

(a) solicit input from a neutral reputation management consultancy, and

Consultants are the reason the fundraising campaigns and associated
banners are so awful. To the idea that we continue paying people
needlessly for bad advice, I'm going to say no thank you. I'd rather not.

(b) create a forum for staffers to talk openly about this matter, without
fear of reprisal

What's wrong with wikimedia-l? I can assure you that this mailing list has
grade-A reprisal, far better than what you'll receive from work. :-)

David Gerard wrote:
Wikipedia begging for donations per usual. Advertising isn't evil
they say as they throw a second nag at me as I scroll down.

https://twitter.com/enemyplayer/status/539180814739988481

Indeed. It might help if we started referring to the fundraising banners
as full-page advertising. Calling a spade a spade, and all that.

It also occurred to me that it wouldn't be unreasonable for Adblock (Plus)
to reconsider its classification of the fundraising notices (even
banners is generous). Historically banners on Wikimedia wikis have not
been considered ads by Adblock and friends, but this assumed decency and
common sense on Wikimedia's part. These full-page gremlins lack both.

Obnoxious banners *really do damage the brand*.

What are the fundraiser metrics? If they don't include effect on the
brand, they'll be motivating damaging behaviour.

We used to have live-updating statistics about the annual fundraiser at
https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Special:FundraiserStatistics. That
error message is probably highly misleading and we really ought to have
better reporting about donations. As far as I know, we've taken several
steps backward in recent years in terms of donation transparency and this
should be addressed in 2015. (I'm somewhat hoping someone will quickly
prove me wrong with a link to up-to-date donor stats... go on!)

MZMcBride



___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Fundraising banners (again)

2014-12-01 Thread Lila Tretikov
All -- we will not have a pop-up banner.

I know you want more insight into the trends: we will provide some of those
in our upcoming reports and metrics and we will plan to shift to a
quarterly cadence of a more specific metrics report that will include
fundraising.

Just to cover some basic trends: the last two years have significantly
changed our traffic composition. Regionally, we are seeing growth in
emerging languages and regions. This is great: people who need the
knowledge most, but cannot afford it and often live in countries where free
speech is criminalized are learning about Wikipedia. We need to keep
supporting that. In Europe, North America, Australia, etc. we see Wikipedia
becoming a part of the fabric of the internet itself: embedded in web
searches, operating systems, and other online resources. This is great too:
people get knowledge wherever they are. Both of those trends however can
make it more difficult to raise funds (and sometimes contribute), so we
have to make sure we adapt.

We are doing a lot of work around thinking through a diversified
fundraising strategy. That said, our main tool today are the site banners.
Just to be clear: the pop-up banner had advantages. It tested high with
readers, was only shown once to each user and cut the total number of
impressions needed by a factor of 7! We did hear your concerns however. The
Fundraising team listened and quickly integrated your feedback. While our
launch banner will be different from last year’s, it will not be a pop-up,
overlay content, or be sticky. As always this starting design will iterate
daily and have parallel tests, so you may see variations at any given time.

Megan Hernandez will send another email with more details about the process
to-date, and how best to communicate with Fundraising during the coming
month.

And in the spirit of the holidays I'd like to thank the fundraising team
for all of their hard work and to all of the volunteers who have helped
with the campaigns.

 Lila




On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 7:39 PM, MZMcBride z...@mzmcbride.com wrote:

 Ori Livneh wrote:
 On Fri, Nov 28, 2014 at 5:55 PM, MZMcBride z...@mzmcbride.com wrote:
 The banners may be effective, but they're not aligned with Wikimedia's
 values.
 
 I wouldn't come out quite as strongly against these banners, but I share
 the underlying sentiment.

 What happened to we make the Internet not suck? What happened to the
 near-universal agreement that pop-ups are bad?

 (a) solicit input from a neutral reputation management consultancy, and

 Consultants are the reason the fundraising campaigns and associated
 banners are so awful. To the idea that we continue paying people
 needlessly for bad advice, I'm going to say no thank you. I'd rather not.

 (b) create a forum for staffers to talk openly about this matter, without
 fear of reprisal

 What's wrong with wikimedia-l? I can assure you that this mailing list has
 grade-A reprisal, far better than what you'll receive from work. :-)

 David Gerard wrote:
 Wikipedia begging for donations per usual. Advertising isn't evil
 they say as they throw a second nag at me as I scroll down.
 
 https://twitter.com/enemyplayer/status/539180814739988481

 Indeed. It might help if we started referring to the fundraising banners
 as full-page advertising. Calling a spade a spade, and all that.

 It also occurred to me that it wouldn't be unreasonable for Adblock (Plus)
 to reconsider its classification of the fundraising notices (even
 banners is generous). Historically banners on Wikimedia wikis have not
 been considered ads by Adblock and friends, but this assumed decency and
 common sense on Wikimedia's part. These full-page gremlins lack both.

 Obnoxious banners *really do damage the brand*.
 
 What are the fundraiser metrics? If they don't include effect on the
 brand, they'll be motivating damaging behaviour.

 We used to have live-updating statistics about the annual fundraiser at
 https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Special:FundraiserStatistics. That
 error message is probably highly misleading and we really ought to have
 better reporting about donations. As far as I know, we've taken several
 steps backward in recent years in terms of donation transparency and this
 should be addressed in 2015. (I'm somewhat hoping someone will quickly
 prove me wrong with a link to up-to-date donor stats... go on!)

 MZMcBride



 ___
 Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
 Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
 Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
 mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe

___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Organizational effectiveness tool (for Wikimedia organizations)

2014-12-01 Thread Gerard Meijssen
Hoi,
I would assume that statistics are an important tool. There are many
statistics I can think of off the top of my head that make sense in this
context.,

WHERE ARE THEY...

Given that this is a WMF initiative, why are the statistics not there.. You
have the capability ! and the need is obvious when the ED says that metrics
are how chapters are evaluated..
Thanks,
  GerardM

On 1 December 2014 at 22:56, Anasuya Sengupta asengu...@wikimedia.org
wrote:

 tl;dr Request for Wikimedia organizations to take a survey on
 organizational effectiveness, that will help us understand and support each
 other better: https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/OEQuestionnaire


 Dear friends and colleagues of the Wikimedia movement:

 The Wikimedia Foundation's Grantmaking team has initiated a project with
 TCC Group - a consulting firm focused on social impact - and the larger
 Wikimedia communities, to help Wikimedia organizations of all shapes and
 sizes (including user groups, chapters, and thematic organizations), to
 improve their effectiveness and their ability to have impact for the
 movement. The project was initiated in response to growing interest and
 conversations by volunteers and organizations, to better understand how
 organizations in particular have impact in the Wikimedia movement, which is
 unique in that it is online, growing extraordinarily fast, and created and
 supported almost entirely by volunteers.

 The project seeks to help Wikimedia organizations better understand 1) how
 impact is defined from an organizational perspective in their contexts, 2)
 what strategies Wikimedia organizations use to achieve that impact, and 3)
 what resources and skills Wikimedia organizations may need to be more
 effective in the strategies they choose to pursue.

 In the first “impact” stage of the project, TCC interviewed several
 organizations, administered an impact survey to all organizations, and
 attended Wikimania 2014 in London where the project was discussed with
 AffCom, an informal organizational effectiveness working group, the FDC and
 other grantmaking committees, as well as many other individuals in the
 movement. TCC also conducted in-depth research on three organizations,
 resulting in case studies illustrating different organizational models
 leading to impact. Many thanks to those of you who took your valuable time
 to participate in one or more of these exchanges; Wikimedians around the
 globe created the foundation for this work.

 The second and third stages of the project involve development of an online
 organizational effectiveness questionnaire, a user guide to help
 organizations interpret their results, and an organizational effectiveness
 learning center, which may help organizations think about the different
 strategies they are using and how they could build specific capacities to
 be more successful with those strategies.

 *Learning center:

 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Organizational_effectiveness/Learning_center
 .


 *User guide:

 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Organizational_effectiveness/Tool/User_guide

 *Questionnaire text:

 https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Organizational_effectiveness/Tool/Questionnaire

 *Link to take questionnaire (can be used once per IP address, but more
 links can be requested): https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/OEQuestionnaire

 The learning center is intended to be a base from which Wikimedia
 organizations can grow their knowledge and share their own experiences and
 best practices. TCC worked closely with a handful of Wikimedia volunteers
 from different organizations to design the Questionnaire you are about to
 take.

 Wikimedia Foundation has provided funding for this project and has
 consulted closely with TCC over the course of the engagement. Please note
 that the questionnaire is not intended to be a test of individual
 organizations in any way; the Foundation will not be provided with
 individual organization results. As part of this consultation, TCC will
 aggregate findings from the movement-wide Organizational Effectiveness
 Questionnaire and provide them to the Foundation’s grantmaking team, along
 with a “capacity building roadmap” to help the team - and the wider
 movement - think about how organizations can build capacity for specific
 program strategies.


 *We request that you respond to the questionnaire by December 21st*, so
 that TCC can collate the results and share it with all of us early in the
 new year.  Please let us know if you have any difficulties or questions:
 the
 WMF contact for this process is Winifred Olliff. Please contact us with
 questions or suggestions at orgeffectiven...@wikimedia.org.


 Many thanks to all who offered their time and expertise to the different
 stages of this project. We hope this tool will be useful to you in your
 work, and we welcome your continued feedback.

 Warm regards and looking forward to our continued work together!
 Anasuya

 --


 *Anasuya SenguptaSenior Director of 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Fundraising banners (again)

2014-12-01 Thread Anders Wennersten

Thanks Lila, most enlightening.

And as always when it comes to WMFs fundraising efforts, most impressive 
work being done! And  metrics in the new quarterly report will be much 
appreciated.


Anders


Lila Tretikov skrev den 2014-12-02 07:53:

All -- we will not have a pop-up banner.

I know you want more insight into the trends: we will provide some of those
in our upcoming reports and metrics and we will plan to shift to a
quarterly cadence of a more specific metrics report that will include
fundraising.

Just to cover some basic trends: the last two years have significantly
changed our traffic composition. Regionally, we are seeing growth in
emerging languages and regions. This is great: people who need the
knowledge most, but cannot afford it and often live in countries where free
speech is criminalized are learning about Wikipedia. We need to keep
supporting that. In Europe, North America, Australia, etc. we see Wikipedia
becoming a part of the fabric of the internet itself: embedded in web
searches, operating systems, and other online resources. This is great too:
people get knowledge wherever they are. Both of those trends however can
make it more difficult to raise funds (and sometimes contribute), so we
have to make sure we adapt.

We are doing a lot of work around thinking through a diversified
fundraising strategy. That said, our main tool today are the site banners.
Just to be clear: the pop-up banner had advantages. It tested high with
readers, was only shown once to each user and cut the total number of
impressions needed by a factor of 7! We did hear your concerns however. The
Fundraising team listened and quickly integrated your feedback. While our
launch banner will be different from last year’s, it will not be a pop-up,
overlay content, or be sticky. As always this starting design will iterate
daily and have parallel tests, so you may see variations at any given time.

Megan Hernandez will send another email with more details about the process
to-date, and how best to communicate with Fundraising during the coming
month.

And in the spirit of the holidays I'd like to thank the fundraising team
for all of their hard work and to all of the volunteers who have helped
with the campaigns.

 Lila




On Mon, Dec 1, 2014 at 7:39 PM, MZMcBride z...@mzmcbride.com wrote:


Ori Livneh wrote:

On Fri, Nov 28, 2014 at 5:55 PM, MZMcBride z...@mzmcbride.com wrote:

The banners may be effective, but they're not aligned with Wikimedia's
values.

I wouldn't come out quite as strongly against these banners, but I share
the underlying sentiment.

What happened to we make the Internet not suck? What happened to the
near-universal agreement that pop-ups are bad?


(a) solicit input from a neutral reputation management consultancy, and

Consultants are the reason the fundraising campaigns and associated
banners are so awful. To the idea that we continue paying people
needlessly for bad advice, I'm going to say no thank you. I'd rather not.


(b) create a forum for staffers to talk openly about this matter, without
fear of reprisal

What's wrong with wikimedia-l? I can assure you that this mailing list has
grade-A reprisal, far better than what you'll receive from work. :-)

David Gerard wrote:

Wikipedia begging for donations per usual. Advertising isn't evil
they say as they throw a second nag at me as I scroll down.

https://twitter.com/enemyplayer/status/539180814739988481

Indeed. It might help if we started referring to the fundraising banners
as full-page advertising. Calling a spade a spade, and all that.

It also occurred to me that it wouldn't be unreasonable for Adblock (Plus)
to reconsider its classification of the fundraising notices (even
banners is generous). Historically banners on Wikimedia wikis have not
been considered ads by Adblock and friends, but this assumed decency and
common sense on Wikimedia's part. These full-page gremlins lack both.


Obnoxious banners *really do damage the brand*.

What are the fundraiser metrics? If they don't include effect on the
brand, they'll be motivating damaging behaviour.

We used to have live-updating statistics about the annual fundraiser at
https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Special:FundraiserStatistics. That
error message is probably highly misleading and we really ought to have
better reporting about donations. As far as I know, we've taken several
steps backward in recent years in terms of donation transparency and this
should be addressed in 2015. (I'm somewhat hoping someone will quickly
prove me wrong with a link to up-to-date donor stats... go on!)

MZMcBride



___
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe


___
Wikimedia-l