[Wikimedia-l] Staff to follow up on copy and paste issues

2014-12-11 Thread James Heilman
I have made a proposal regarding me hiring staff to follow up on copy and paste issues on Wikipedia. The staff would not only determine how common the issue is, but would also collect data on what type of responses that improve things going forwards. When they pick up issues they will also be

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimédia France board handbook

2014-12-11 Thread Claudia Garád
Thanks for sharing Emeric and Jean-Fred! I would love to see a translation of this important resource and I'm sure it could be useful for others as well. :-) Best Claudia Am 11.12.2014 um 07:20 schrieb Emeric Vallespi: Hi, and thanks for your support :) Sure Winifred, I will add a learning

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimédia France board handbook

2014-12-11 Thread charles andrès (WMCH)
Thanks a lot Wikimedia France, Another good exemple why we need to improve the Translation system on-wiki and allow to start from non-english source. Charles Le 11 déc. 2014 à 10:39, Claudia Garád claudia.ga...@wikimedia.at a écrit : Thanks for sharing Emeric and Jean-Fred! I would

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimédia France board handbook

2014-12-11 Thread Alice Wiegand
On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 10:47 AM, charles andrès (WMCH) charles.andres.w...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks a lot Wikimedia France, Another good exemple why we need to improve the Translation system on-wiki and allow to start from non-english source. Charles So true! Alice. Le 11

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimédia France board handbook

2014-12-11 Thread Pierre-Selim
2014-12-11 11:02 GMT+01:00 Alice Wiegand awieg...@wikimedia.org: On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 10:47 AM, charles andrès (WMCH) charles.andres.w...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks a lot Wikimedia France, Another good exemple why we need to improve the Translation system on-wiki and allow to start

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimédia France board handbook

2014-12-11 Thread Jean-Frédéric Berthelot
Hi, and thanks for your support :) Yes, thanks all for your kind words :) Another good exemple why we need to improve the Translation system on-wiki and allow to start from non-english source. So true! So true! As a reminder, this is tracked in Phabricator:

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Placebook Wiki Project Proposal

2014-12-11 Thread Joe Aeberhard
Thanks for that post Jan - it's interesting to see that the Swedish National Heritage Board has already been doing something similar. Unfortunately, with my very limited Swedish I've not been able to glean much from the content as interesting as it looks! However, it definitely backs up the

[Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Steven Walling
I just noticed a disturbing trend on Commons that highlights a general issue with its use as the media repository for our projects. I recently had an image nominated for deletion under Commons policy against photos of packaging: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:PACKAGING. It was of some

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Russavia
Steven, Quite seriously, if you can't understand the concept of copyright and derivative works, then perhaps this is not the project for you. There's nothing more to say. Russavia On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 12:40 AM, Steven Walling steven.wall...@gmail.com wrote: I just noticed a disturbing

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Steven Walling
This kind of response is case in point on why people find Commons toxic. On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 8:44 AM Russavia russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com wrote: Steven, Quite seriously, if you can't understand the concept of copyright and derivative works, then perhaps this is not the project for you.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Nathan
On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 11:44 AM, Russavia russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com wrote: Steven, Quite seriously, if you can't understand the concept of copyright and derivative works, then perhaps this is not the project for you. There's nothing more to say. Russavia That comment is unhelpful

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Jane Darnell
My takeaway from this mail was that someone finally noticed that Commons does, in fact, thank you for your uploads now. That was a positive byproduct of Wiki Loves Monuments in 2011-2012! On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 5:44 PM, Russavia russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com wrote: Steven, Quite seriously, if

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Russavia
Steven, No Stephen, this is toxic -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOZuxwVk7TU My response was a hard truth unfortunately. As is my comments at https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Deletion_requests/File:Green_tea_Kit-Kat.jpeg about your long, whiny post. Thanks for reading Russavia

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Luis Villa
On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 8:44 AM, Russavia russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com wrote: Steven, Quite seriously, if you can't understand the concept of copyright and derivative works, then perhaps this is not the project for you. I understand the concept of copyright and derivative works, and I think

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Russavia
Luis, I know all about that applause Jimmy received. http://i.imgur.com/SKX3P8J.gif Steven, is that you in the middle? : Russavia On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 12:55 AM, Luis Villa lvi...@wikimedia.org wrote: On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 8:44 AM, Russavia russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com wrote: Steven,

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Nathan
Maybe Russavia is having a bad day and needs a time out. ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe:

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Nick Birse
It would be nice to have a cross-wiki Echo notification when an image you've created or uploaded is used, I do hope such a system could be included when we eventually get cross-wiki Echo notifications. I'm disappointed you needed to call the users on Commons fussy neckbeards and I trust someone

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Katherine Casey
All sniping aside, it seems to me the problem (question?) here is whether Commons's interpretation of package copyright is legally accurate, or whether it is (like many of our projects' copyright policies) deliberately a bit overbroad. If their packaging policy is Just How Copyright Works, then

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Russavia
Oh cry me a river Nathan. What is inappropriate is that we have Steven ranting and raving about a project on which me and others bust our humps on developing. If people can't understand http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/COM:SCOPE, http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/COM:L and

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Russavia
I'm not having a bad day Nathan. It shits me to tears when we continually hear of Commons being broken; when in fact it works very well. I will say that the person who is doing the packaging DR's is going thru them, with our Commons policies in mind. You are attacking that person on a public

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Nathan
What about this file? https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:2007-11-21_Hammamet-VW-2.JPG The image is of a car, and the car has a logo and design motif on it that is surely eligible for copyright. COM:PACKAGING doesn't seem to refer to any packaging specific jurisprudence, so presumably the

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Marco Chiesa
On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 6:02 PM, Katherine Casey fluffernutter.w...@gmail.com wrote: All sniping aside, it seems to me the problem (question?) here is whether Commons's interpretation of package copyright is legally accurate, or whether it is (like many of our projects' copyright policies)

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Russavia
Nathan To answer the tractor question first. Of course not, there is nothing copyrightable in this image. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Template:Trademarked is never a reason for deletion. The logo is clearly PD-textlogo and is de minimis in that situation -- i.e. it's inclusion is

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Jane Darnell
fop On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 6:11 PM, Nathan nawr...@gmail.com wrote: What about this file? https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:2007-11-21_Hammamet-VW-2.JPG The image is of a car, and the car has a logo and design motif on it that is surely eligible for copyright. COM:PACKAGING doesn't

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread geni
On 11 December 2014 at 16:54, Russavia russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com wrote: Steven, No Stephen, this is toxic -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOZuxwVk7TU My response was a hard truth unfortunately. As is my comments at

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Jane Darnell
Marco there's hope! http://www.northbaybusinessjournal.com/102821/ip-minefield-monkey-makes-copyright-history/ On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 6:18 PM, Marco Chiesa chiesa.ma...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 6:02 PM, Katherine Casey fluffernutter.w...@gmail.com wrote: All sniping aside,

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Nathan
On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 12:21 PM, Russavia russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com wrote: Nathan To answer the tractor question first. Of course not, there is nothing copyrightable in this image. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Template:Trademarked is never a reason for deletion. The logo is

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Jeevan Jose
I don't think Commons has a clear stand in this matter. I see many old DRs closed as kept. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Deletion_requests/Beer_bottles https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Deletion_requests/File:Bottle_of_Duff.jpg Regards, Jee On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 11:14

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Luis Villa
On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 9:02 AM, Katherine Casey fluffernutter.w...@gmail.com wrote: All sniping aside, it seems to me the problem (question?) here is whether Commons's interpretation of package copyright is legally accurate, or whether it is (like many of our projects' copyright policies)

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread geni
On 11 December 2014 at 17:54, Jane Darnell jane...@gmail.com wrote: but fop trumps all else when you are outside Not under any legal system I've looked into. Even UK law isn't that liberal. -- geni ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Russavia
Geni You wouldn't be talking about the Skyy Spirits case would you? http://www.law.cornell.edu/copyright/cases/225_f3d_1068.htm This case is not akin to that case in any way, shape or form. That issue was referring to the copyright on the 3D bottle. Refer to

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread
Making defamatory comments about Commons volunteers on this list is not terribly productive, nor a very nice thing to do when anyone is free to express their point of view in the deletion request so that a closing admin can consider all rationales put forward, or raise it on the user's talk page.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Austin Hair
Shut up, Russavia. I wouldn't normally be so curt with someone I just put on moderation, but apparently you think that's an appropriate tone to use on this list. Austin On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 5:56 PM, Russavia russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com wrote: Oh cry me a river Nathan. What is

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread geni
On 11 December 2014 at 18:04, Russavia russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com wrote: Geni You wouldn't be talking about the Skyy Spirits case would you? http://www.law.cornell.edu/copyright/cases/225_f3d_1068.htm This case is not akin to that case in any way, shape or form. That issue was referring

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Risker
Fae, Steven hasn't been a WMFstaffer for some months. Luis is, but he appears to be speaking in his staff role. Risker/Anne On 11 December 2014 at 13:14, Fæ fae...@gmail.com wrote: Making defamatory comments about Commons volunteers on this list is not terribly productive, nor a very nice

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread James Alexander
On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 10:14 AM, Fæ fae...@gmail.com wrote: P.S. Stephen, you are young and handsome, in fact rather dishy to my ageing eyes. Good for you. Keep in mind that your fellow volunteers might not have been born so lucky, and that being young and pretty all too soon passes into

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Jane Darnell
Are you kidding? Most of WLM photos in the Netherlands have cars in them - these all fall under fop On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 7:23 PM, geni geni...@gmail.com wrote: On 11 December 2014 at 18:19, Jane Darnell jane...@gmail.com wrote: Yup - it is in the Netherlands - yay! Nyet. Netherlands

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Austin Hair
Okay, guys, let's all take a step back and remember [[WP:Civility]]. (Yeah, I know that's a Wikipedia pillar, but can't we all at least get on board with that one?) The tone of this thread was accusatory from the start, and quickly went to vicious. Maybe everyone can try it again with a bit of

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Andre Engels
On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 6:21 PM, Russavia russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com wrote: To answer the tractor question first. Of course not, there is nothing copyrightable in this image. I see many copyrightable objects in this image. The tractor. The car. The logo. The boards with demonstration

Re: [Wikimedia-l] File metadata cleanup drive: An update and a request

2014-12-11 Thread Guillaume Paumier
Hi, A quick follow-up: We now have good numbers for the amount of files missing machine-readable metadata on Commons (spoiler: it's about ~500,000 files, meaning ~98% of files have machine-readable markers). Below is a copy of the update I sent to commons-l:

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Andre Engels
No, they do not. The Dutch title of copyright law considering freedom of panorama: Als inbreuk op het auteursrecht op een werk als bedoeld in artikel 10, eerste lid, onder 6°, of op een werk, betrekkelijk tot de bouwkunde als bedoeld in artikel 10, eerste lid, onder 8°, dat is gemaakt om

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Jane Darnell
Wait, are you saying all those pics are going to be deleted then? There must be tens of 1000's out there by now On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 8:27 PM, Andre Engels andreeng...@gmail.com wrote: No, they do not. The Dutch title of copyright law considering freedom of panorama: Als inbreuk op het

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Federico Leva (Nemo)
Steven Walling, 11/12/2014 17:40: I just noticed Really? The day after tomorrow is the 12th birthday of https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Avoid_copyright_paranoiaoldid=649 ! Nemo ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:

[Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Tim Davenport
It is good that Steven Walling is observing the way he is treated by the officious fanatics at Commons and now is thinking twice about ever uploading anything to Commons. It's a completely dysfunctional project that has little to do with the task of creating and illustrating an encyclopedia. It's

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Andre Engels
I don't think those pictures are going to be deleted - there are plenty of pictures of cars on commons, and I haven't seen a movement to get them all deleted (I don't spend much time on commons, though, so I might have missed it). I do think it would be a good thing to keep them, but fop should

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Pipo Le Clown
I'm on the road every two weekends, and processing pictures the rest of the time on my free time. I've provided around 8000 pictures to Commons, and helped to have pictures for articles like Cristiano Ronaldo, Roy Hogdson or Greig Laidlaw... Just to read that I'm a fascist and an anal retentive

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Pierre-Selim
Just on the same page as Pipo, thank you Steven for this nice troll. 2014-12-11 21:39 GMT+01:00 Pipo Le Clown plecl...@gmail.com: I'm on the road every two weekends, and processing pictures the rest of the time on my free time. I've provided around 8000 pictures to Commons, and helped to have

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread
On 11 December 2014 at 16:40, Steven Walling steven.wall...@gmail.com wrote: ... The first issue here is one of demotivating contributors. I took a photo of an object I owned, and gave it away to be used in Wikipedia. The only interaction I ever get on Commons about my photos is a notification

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Steven Walling
On Thu Dec 11 2014 at 12:40:09 PM Pipo Le Clown plecl...@gmail.com wrote: I'm on the road every two weekends, and processing pictures the rest of the time on my free time. I've provided around 8000 pictures to Commons, and helped to have pictures for articles like Cristiano Ronaldo, Roy

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Mark
On 12/11/14, 8:14 PM, Andre Engels wrote: On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 6:21 PM, Russavia russavia.wikipe...@gmail.com wrote: To answer the tractor question first. Of course not, there is nothing copyrightable in this image. I see many copyrightable objects in this image. The tractor. The car. The

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Tim Starling
On 12/12/14 03:40, Steven Walling wrote: Commons should really just have stayed a database shared among projects, not been made into a wiki where all our more important projects are subject to the rules mongering of a tiny broken community. I don't know what that would technically look like.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Pipo Le Clown
As you said, the first issue of Commons is demotivating contributors. And this thread is actually doing a good job at it... STOP the Commons bashing. Stop calling Commons contributors anal retentive or fussy neckbeards. I'm an european. In Europe, one does not call another nazi, as Americans do.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Commons copyright extremism

2014-12-11 Thread Gerard Meijssen
Hoi, This problem is not new. It is not as if the Commons community is not aware of this perception. The perception that there might be a situation where someone is sued is not necessary shared by lawyers. They have to make a living as well so they will sue when they are paid to do so. When