Re: [Wikimedia-l] Invitation to a "Wikimedia Café" casual online meetup

2019-01-02 Thread Pine W
Hi,

The next "Wikimedia Café" meetup will be on Wednesday the 23rd of January,
on a time to be chosen via Doodle poll:
https://doodle.com/poll/5mf5cfkuxpprk727. The plan is that for January's
meetup we will focus on Wikidata. Bluerasberry
, who works extensively
with Wikidata at the University of Virginia's Data Science Institute, plans
to participate.

The Zoom online meeting link will be the same link that we have used for
previous Wikimedia Café meetups; see below.

The Café meetups are usually small, so they are a good place to ask
questions or to discuss ideas, regarding Wikidata or other Wikimedia topics.

Pine
( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )


On Thu, Aug 9, 2018 at 11:15 PM Pine W  wrote:

> Hi folks,
>
> Based on comments that I received on Wikimedia-l, I would like to invite
> people to a casual online meetup one hour before the monthly WMF Metrics
> and Activities Meeting.
>
> There will be no set agenda. You can come with questions or ideas that you
> would like to discuss. Please be willing to listen to questions and ideas
> from other Wikimedians.
>
> I will host the meeting with the Zoom software. You can join with software
> or by using your phone. If you join by phone then your phone number will be
> visible to other participants.
>
> The primary language of the meeting will be English, but if people would
> like to communicate in diverse languages then that is okay too. We can
> facilitate translation by text chat. Many Wikimedians, myself included, are
> multilingual in varying degrees, so we might try to have live
> interpretation also.
>
> Here is information about how to connect:
>
> Join from PC, Mac, Linux, iOS or Android: https://zoom.us/j/136978210
>
> Or iPhone one-tap :
> Argentina: +543415122188,,136978210#
> Or Telephone:
> Dial (for higher quality, dial a number based on your current
> location):
> Argentina: +54 341 512 2188
> Australia: +61 (0) 2 8015 2088  or +61 (0) 8 7150 1149
> Canada: +1 647 558 0588
> Hong Kong, China: +852 5808 6088
> France: +33 (0) 1 8288 0188  or +33 (0) 7 5678 4048
> Germany: +49 (0) 30 3080 6188  or +49 (0) 30 5679 5800
> Israel: +972 (0) 3 978 6688
> Italy: +39 069 480 6488
> Japan: +81 (0) 3 4578 1488  or +81 524 564 439
> Mexico: +52 229 910 0061  or +52 554 161 4288
> Spain: +34 84 368 5025  or +34 91 198 0188
> Sweden: +46 (0) 7 6692 0434  or +46 (0) 8 4468 2488
> Russia: +7 495 283 9788
> United Kingdom: +44 (0) 20 3051 2874  or +44 (0) 20 3695 0088
> US: +1 408 638 0986  or +1 646 558 8665
> Meeting ID: 136 978 210
> International numbers available: https://zoom.us/u/ekaPibJIy
>
> The first "Wikimedia Café" meetup will be on 30 August 2018, at 17:00 UTC
> / 10:00 Pacific.
>
> Let me emphasize that the environment won't be like this
> ,
> so please don't feel intimated if you are nervous about public speaking.
> (If a conversation feels to me like it is becoming uncivil or intimidating,
> then I will ask the debaters to quiet themselves or to move to somewhere
> else.) The meeting will generally have an environment that is more like
> this 
> or this
> .
> I anticipate that few people will come, which is okay. I hope that if you
> come then you will enjoy the environment and conversation.
>
> Until next time,
> Pine
> ( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Blocks which appear to demonstrate prejudice against minorities

2019-01-02 Thread Risker
 I note that we are talking about the block of one single user on one
single project; this particular account has thousands of edits over about a
dozen projects, but is "attached" to hundreds of Wikimedia projects.  The
majority of these "attached" accounts are likely because the editor
"visited" the various projects while logged in, activating the automatic
account creation algorithm.  The account was created 8 years ago, and has
actively edited a wide variety of  projects, including several wikipedias,
Commons, Wikidata, and Meta. While English Wikipedia is the account's
"home" wiki, about 55% of the account's global edits have been made on
Marathi Wikipedia. The Amharic Wikipedia account does not appear to have
edited, which suggests that it was automatically created when the editor
was "looking at" the project on 9  February 2018.  The block for account
name was made on 22 October 2018.  I note that accounts were created on
over a hundred projects over the course of a few days in February 2018.

The point being raised in this thread is that it appears this editor was
blocked on one of the 381 wikis on which they have an account, explicitly
because of the perception that their username calls attention to the sexual
behaviour of the editor. What we do not know is (a) whether that is in fact
a legitimate username block reason on Amharic Wikipedia, or (b) if it is a
legitimate username block reason, *why* it would be a username block
reason. We don't know why this block was applied so long after the account
was created. We don't know the username policy on Amharic Wikipedia, nor do
we know how it is applied; for example, we don't know if a username like
"StraightGuy101" would be blocked.  We do know that there are only 4
administrators on Amharic Wikipedia, and that there are fewer than 50
active users working on the project, which may be part of the reason for
the delay between automatic account creation and the account block.

We also know that one of the challenges of single user login for all
Wikimedia projects has highlighted the fact that certain usernames that are
acceptable on some projects are blocked on other projects; we've known that
for years. We know that each project establishes its own policies when it
comes to usernames. There are legitimate reasons why a username that is
acceptable in one language is not acceptable in another language, even in
cases where the editor had no knowledge that the chosen username would be a
problem in another language. We do know that there have been lots of cases
where usernames have been blocked for "username policy violation" on all
kinds of projects, despite the account operating productively on other
projects.

I also note that there is nothing in this thread that confirms the editor
themself has raised any concerns about this block, and I am always wary of
turning an editor into a "martyr for a cause" without their direct
agreement, as that can be as abusive as the original action. So the first
step in this situation would be to confirm with the individual editor
whether or not they want their "case" to be examined.

Should the editor be agreeable, I suggest that the next step is for someone
who has the ability to converse in Amharic to contact the Amharic Wikipedia
and find out why the block has been issued, how it is consistent with the
username policy on Amharic Wikipedia, whether that policy is driven in part
by external considerations (e.g., does the project risk heavy governmental
scrutiny if it appears to "promote" locally unacceptable activities). I am
personally curious as to why it took over six months to identify that this
account did not meet the local username policy, and whether there was
internal or external discussion about the username.

It is not clear to me what the desired outcome is in this case - at least
in part because we have no idea of the opinion of the editor involved.  I
am hard-pressed to say that a project should be required to allow usernames
that it has a long history of considering unacceptable, especially if it is
applied evenly to all accounts; in this case, if it disallows usernames
that imply sexual preference regardless of what that preference is.

It seems to me that the WMF Trust & Safety group would probably be the
right group to examine this.

Risker/Anne

On Wed, 2 Jan 2019 at 09:42, Ariel Glenn WMF  wrote:

> Additional notes:
> The user's regular page can be viewed on en wikipedia:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:QueerEcofeminist
> Queer may have to do with gender identity as opposed to being an indicator
> of 'sexual behavior', so the blockers didn't even get that right. Example:
> I am gender-nonconforming as to my gender identity and expression; this is
> the primary reason I use the label 'queer'.
>
> I believe this should be reported... somewhere. But I don't know where. The
> WMF CoC only covers technical spaces. A little help here?
>
> Ariel
>
> On Wed, Jan 2, 2019 at 4:26 PM Fæ  wrote:
>
> > Do 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Blocks which appear to demonstrate prejudice against minorities

2019-01-02 Thread Pine W
Sorry, I meant to say Amharic, not Armenian.

Pine
( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )


On Wed, Jan 2, 2019 at 9:45 PM Pine W  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> My opinion is that the block should be lifted. However, to the best of my
> knowledge, an appeal of a local block to the larger Wikiverse has never
> been successful. I am guessing that there are at least four factors here:
> 1. a lack of consensus for a process for appealing a local block to the
> larger community, or whether such a process is desirable, 2. a lack of
> skilled community human resources capacity to review such appeals (I would
> guess that reviewers of appeals would get flooded with hundreds of
> low-value appeals, that the job would be emotionally and intellectually
> difficult, and that the queue for reviews would be many months long), 3. a
> lack of confidence among people who are not proficient in a language to
> review a dispute that happened in that language, and 4. a lack of volunteer
> capacity and financial resources for highly accurate translations of
> appeals and their related content.
>
> Asking WMF to overturn a community block sets a precedent for them to
> substitute their judgement for the community's. There is a history of
> problems with WMF clashing with the community, and I have an ongoing
> objection to WMF's unilateral and opaque uses of global blocks. I would not
> want WMF to forcibly intervene in matters like this. Instead, What I
> recommend is diplomacy. The admin who made the block appears to have
> intermediate proficiency in English. I recommend first having a diplomatic
> discussion with that admin regarding the block. The admin could be
> persuaded to remove it. By "diplomatic discussion" I do not mean telling
> the admin bluntly that "you are wrong and I am right". An assumption of
> good faith, persuasion, and respect are likely to be valuable here. Try
> diplomacy first.
>
> If the admin remains unpersuaded to unblock the user then, to the best of
> my knowledge, the only routes of appeal available are on that wiki. I am
> unfamiliar with the specific situation in Armenian Wikipedia, but I suggest
> looking for a local policy for appealing blocks and looking for a username
> policy. Intermediate proficiency in Armenian is likely to be highly
> desirable, and likely necessary, for productive conversations on that wiki
> regarding a block appeal and/or proposing a change in local username policy.
>
> I realize that the concept of appealing a local block to the global
> community sounds like it is worth considering, but even if in principle
> there becomes a consensus that we should allow this, implementing such an
> option for appeals would likely be difficult and time consuming in
> practice, and without highly accurate translations which we do not appear
> to have sufficient volunteer or financial resources to support at this
> time, I think that the potential for mistakes due to misunderstandings is
> high.
>
> Pine
> ( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Blocks which appear to demonstrate prejudice against minorities

2019-01-02 Thread Pine W
Hi,

My opinion is that the block should be lifted. However, to the best of my
knowledge, an appeal of a local block to the larger Wikiverse has never
been successful. I am guessing that there are at least four factors here:
1. a lack of consensus for a process for appealing a local block to the
larger community, or whether such a process is desirable, 2. a lack of
skilled community human resources capacity to review such appeals (I would
guess that reviewers of appeals would get flooded with hundreds of
low-value appeals, that the job would be emotionally and intellectually
difficult, and that the queue for reviews would be many months long), 3. a
lack of confidence among people who are not proficient in a language to
review a dispute that happened in that language, and 4. a lack of volunteer
capacity and financial resources for highly accurate translations of
appeals and their related content.

Asking WMF to overturn a community block sets a precedent for them to
substitute their judgement for the community's. There is a history of
problems with WMF clashing with the community, and I have an ongoing
objection to WMF's unilateral and opaque uses of global blocks. I would not
want WMF to forcibly intervene in matters like this. Instead, What I
recommend is diplomacy. The admin who made the block appears to have
intermediate proficiency in English. I recommend first having a diplomatic
discussion with that admin regarding the block. The admin could be
persuaded to remove it. By "diplomatic discussion" I do not mean telling
the admin bluntly that "you are wrong and I am right". An assumption of
good faith, persuasion, and respect are likely to be valuable here. Try
diplomacy first.

If the admin remains unpersuaded to unblock the user then, to the best of
my knowledge, the only routes of appeal available are on that wiki. I am
unfamiliar with the specific situation in Armenian Wikipedia, but I suggest
looking for a local policy for appealing blocks and looking for a username
policy. Intermediate proficiency in Armenian is likely to be highly
desirable, and likely necessary, for productive conversations on that wiki
regarding a block appeal and/or proposing a change in local username policy.

I realize that the concept of appealing a local block to the global
community sounds like it is worth considering, but even if in principle
there becomes a consensus that we should allow this, implementing such an
option for appeals would likely be difficult and time consuming in
practice, and without highly accurate translations which we do not appear
to have sufficient volunteer or financial resources to support at this
time, I think that the potential for mistakes due to misunderstandings is
high.

Pine
( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Is the death of Wikipedia imminent?

2019-01-02 Thread Peter Southwood
Interesting, but I don't really understand the implications. Is there an 
example of how such an article might be represented? 
Cheers,
Peter

-Original Message-
From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:wikimedia-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of 
Amir E. Aharoni
Sent: 31 December 2018 21:56
To: Wikimedia Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Is the death of Wikipedia imminent?

‫בתאריך יום ב׳, 31 בדצמ׳ 2018 ב-10:14 מאת ‪Peter Southwood‬‏ <‪
peter.southw...@telkomsa.net‬‏>:‬

Does the technology exist? Is it available?
How does this splitting make maintenance easier?
Cheers,
Peter


Not exactly, but it's doable and it's desirable.

There are two relatively recently developed components in MediaWiki that
are important for developers: Content Model and Multi-Content Revisions.
They are not discussed very much among the less technical editors because
they are pretty internal, and I'm really not an expert on what they do
myself, but as far as I understand them, they can serve as steps to
implementing Jane's suggestion.

This suggestion is not even very new. In a way, the extremely old bug
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T2167 , originally filed in 2004 (!)
suggests pretty much the same thing: separate interlanguage links and other
metadata from the page content. Interlanguage links were mostly separated
from pages thanks to Wikidata, but categories still aren't, and a lot of
other kinds of metadata appeared since then: DEFAULTSORT, newsectionlink,
notoc, and many others. Authority control, navbox, and infobox templates,
as well as links to disambiguation pages, can probably be converted to
separately-stored metadata as well.

Wikidata can probably play a major role in getting this done, but it's not
the only factor, and a lot of development is needed to better integrate
Wikidata with other projects.

But yes—I generally agree with Jane that better modularization of wiki
pages' content components can go a long to making them easier to edit,
easier to search, easier to query, etc. It's not the only major change that
our technical infrastructure needs, but it's among the more important ones.

--
Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
http://aharoni.wordpress.com
‪“We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬


>
> -Original Message-
> From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:wikimedia-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On
> Behalf Of Jane Darnell
> Sent: 30 December 2018 15:42
> To: Wikimedia Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Is the death of Wikipedia imminent?
>
> Well it is not difficult to imagine when you consider for example line
> items in the case of list articles. Many lists could be split into such
> line items and kept in a static assembled form by some sort of "assembly
> template". Many of these line items are either articles or parts of
> articles. Such "line items" may or may not have Wikidata items, may or may
> not be suitable for Wikidata items, and may or may not be able to be
> structured in any way, shape or form than the one they currently have. I
> would like to be able to address these "line items" as "findable editing
> snippets" in the wikiverse, possibly curatable by voice activation,
> reversing the way we can sometimes get them read to us by Siri/Lexa.
>
> On Sun, Dec 30, 2018 at 1:48 PM Peter Southwood <
> peter.southw...@telkomsa.net> wrote:
>
> > Jane,
> > I do not understand what parts you would split these things into, or how
> > they would make Wikipedia easier to curate and edit. Could you link to an
> > explanation or clarify the concept?
> > Cheers,
> > Peter
> >
> >
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Blocks which appear to demonstrate prejudice against minorities

2019-01-02 Thread Ariel Glenn WMF
Additional notes:
The user's regular page can be viewed on en wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:QueerEcofeminist
Queer may have to do with gender identity as opposed to being an indicator
of 'sexual behavior', so the blockers didn't even get that right. Example:
I am gender-nonconforming as to my gender identity and expression; this is
the primary reason I use the label 'queer'.

I believe this should be reported... somewhere. But I don't know where. The
WMF CoC only covers technical spaces. A little help here?

Ariel

On Wed, Jan 2, 2019 at 4:26 PM Fæ  wrote:

> Do we have cross project policies to govern or limit local policies
> for the use of sysop tools? I would like to pass on policy advice, and
> any past cases folks here would like to highlight that set a
> precedent.
>
> The case below is illustrative, though based on my recall of several
> complaints which went nowhere over the years, on email lists, and
> Jimmy's talk page, about apparently arbitrary blocks on different
> non-English Wikipedias, it seems reasonable to believe those
> complaints are the tip of the iceberg, and there are likely to be many
> historical cases of blocks that could have been appealed... had the
> user been confident to complain in English, and have the energy to
> pursue generic WMF policies on terms of use, or
> harassment/discrimination, to establish a meta-level case.
>
> # Example case
>
> An account block on the Amharic Wikipedia (am.wp) was flagged up
> yesterday on the WM LGBT+ Telegram discussion group.[3] The rationale
> for blocking the account was because the account name includes the
> word "Queer"[1]. The incident raises questions about process and
> accountability, particularly as the block gives the impression that
> this is the norm or an agreed interpretation of policy for sysops on
> am.wp, and because the user is well established using this account
> name across Wikimedia projects and has never edited am.wp so the block
> cannot be based on any prior action or dispute.
>
> In this example there is no obvious process for appeal, if sysops on
> that project think that blocking any LGBT+ related account name
> represents local consensus. After off-wiki discussion, the WMF Trust
> and Safety team has been approached for advice,[2] as the rationale
> for the action appears hostile to any openly LGBT+ volunteers who
> might want to include something queer looking in their account name
> (such as my account name, should anyone want to read it as transgender
> related).
>
> # Links
>
> 1.
> https://am.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E1%88%8D%E1%8B%A9:Contributions/QueerEcofeminist
> ;
> the block log states "Names calling attention to your sexual behavior
> have never been allowed here in 15 years and aren't suddenly allowed
> in 2018"
> 2. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Trust_and_Safety
> 3. https://telegram.me/wmlgbt
>
> Thanks
> Fae
> --
> fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_LGBT+
>
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[Wikimedia-l] Blocks which appear to demonstrate prejudice against minorities

2019-01-02 Thread
Do we have cross project policies to govern or limit local policies
for the use of sysop tools? I would like to pass on policy advice, and
any past cases folks here would like to highlight that set a
precedent.

The case below is illustrative, though based on my recall of several
complaints which went nowhere over the years, on email lists, and
Jimmy's talk page, about apparently arbitrary blocks on different
non-English Wikipedias, it seems reasonable to believe those
complaints are the tip of the iceberg, and there are likely to be many
historical cases of blocks that could have been appealed... had the
user been confident to complain in English, and have the energy to
pursue generic WMF policies on terms of use, or
harassment/discrimination, to establish a meta-level case.

# Example case

An account block on the Amharic Wikipedia (am.wp) was flagged up
yesterday on the WM LGBT+ Telegram discussion group.[3] The rationale
for blocking the account was because the account name includes the
word "Queer"[1]. The incident raises questions about process and
accountability, particularly as the block gives the impression that
this is the norm or an agreed interpretation of policy for sysops on
am.wp, and because the user is well established using this account
name across Wikimedia projects and has never edited am.wp so the block
cannot be based on any prior action or dispute.

In this example there is no obvious process for appeal, if sysops on
that project think that blocking any LGBT+ related account name
represents local consensus. After off-wiki discussion, the WMF Trust
and Safety team has been approached for advice,[2] as the rationale
for the action appears hostile to any openly LGBT+ volunteers who
might want to include something queer looking in their account name
(such as my account name, should anyone want to read it as transgender
related).

# Links

1. 
https://am.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E1%88%8D%E1%8B%A9:Contributions/QueerEcofeminist;
the block log states "Names calling attention to your sexual behavior
have never been allowed here in 15 years and aren't suddenly allowed
in 2018"
2. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Trust_and_Safety
3. https://telegram.me/wmlgbt

Thanks
Fae
-- 
fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_LGBT+

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