[Wikimedia-l] อะไรที่ทำให้คุณมีความสุขในสัปดาห์นี้ / What's making you happy this week? (Week of 23 June 2019)

2019-06-23 Thread Pine W
 These "What's making you happy this week?" threads often mention a
smorgasbord of subjects. The English Wiktionary Word of the day

for June 22 was "smorgasbord". Wiktionary's definitions of that word are:
"1. A Swedish-style buffet comprising a variety of cold sandwiches and
other dishes; (by extension) any buffet with a wide selection of dishes.
"2. (figuratively) An abundant and diverse collection of things."

On a related point, Commons has a smorgasbord of featured images of food
and drink

.

Also on Commons, I enjoy this

recent Picture of the day. The caption for the image is, "Linden trees and
the sky with clouds in Planina, Postojna, Slovenia". When I look at this
photo, I imagine myself laying on the ground and looking up at the sky.

While this incident  was
not in the Wikiverse, as someone who has spent time in server rooms I can
sympathize with the engineer who was sent to do a chore when almost everything
that can go wrong, did go wrong
. Perhaps other Wikimedians
will appreciate the story too, especially those who support Wikimedia
technical products or services.

I am grateful for some recent civil and collegial discussions among
Wikipedia/Wikimedia administrators regarding certain problems that we are
collectively interested in addressing, such as vandalism and spambots.

Also, I am grateful to people who do maintenance or administrative tasks
with little expectation for rewards or thanks. My experience with these
people is that frequently they have humble attitudes, are idealistic, and
are interested in public service.

The Wikimania Steering Committee recently recommended

that Wikimania 2020 take place in Bangkok, Thailand. This Wikimania will be
supported by multiple Wikimedia affiliates in the East, Southeast Asia, and
Pacific region .

What's making you happy this week? You are welcome to comment in any
language.

Pine
( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Foundation management of volunteers

2019-06-23 Thread Samuel Klein
An element of our community which gives me hope, is that we are ready to
earnestly engage with any input, even the tendentious.  This is getting a
bit repetitive, however, and as Martijn notes is not the best use of this
list.



On Mon, Jun 17, 2019 at 6:06 PM Martijn Hoekstra 
wrote:

> Wikipedia itself can never be more reliable than the sources it cites. If
> it's allowed to cite itself, then there is no "bottom" to lean on, and its
> quality would quickly drop.
>
> That you conclude from that that wikipedia is unreliable and therefore
> failed is IMO such a silly proposition, that I dont know whether you
> seriously think this, in which case we should probably take this off list,
> or that you're engaging in sophistry and using arguments you don't think
> are reasonable in the first place.
>
> On Mon, Jun 17, 2019, 19:56 Mister Thrapostibongles <
> thrapostibong...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Dennis,
> >
> > I started this thread to discuss both conduct and content policies on
> > Wikipedia, and indeed how the two interact.  Wikipedia is a project to
> > build an encyclopaedia.  By its own criteria, encyclopaedias are reliable
> > sources and Wikipedia is not a reliable source; hence by its own
> criteria,
> > Wikipedia is not an encyclopaedia.  That is, it is currently in a state
> of
> > failure with respect to its own mission.
> >
> > One of the reasons for that state of failure is indeed the failure to
> > provide a collegial working atmosphere.
> >
> > Thrapostibongles
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Jun 17, 2019 at 2:19 PM Dennis During 
> wrote:
> >
> > > "One (and not the most important) pieces of evidence for Wikipedia
> being
> > in
> > > a failed state is precisely that
> > > it does not, by the community's own admission, constitute a reliable
> > source
> > > "
> > >
> > > You have made this argument more than once. That might be a piece of
> > > evidence seems both wrong and not relevant to the sense in which people
> > > here as saying WP has failed, which is as a welcoming, "safe"
> environment
> > > for contributors and would-be contributors.
> > >
> > > It is good policy to make sure that contributors reach out to other
> > > sources, even when one believes that Wikipedia is as reliable as the
> > > average tertiary source we allow as a reference. It prevents us from
> > > relying exclusively on what can easily turn out to be a very narrow set
> > of
> > > points of view.  Does/did the Encyclopedia Britanica cite other EB
> > articles
> > > as references rather than include them as "see alsos"?
> > >
> > > On Mon, Jun 17, 2019 at 8:27 AM Mister Thrapostibongles <
> > > thrapostibong...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Vito
> > > >
> > > > This rather tends to support my point.  One (and not the most
> > important)
> > > > pieces of evidence for Wikipedia being in a failed state is precisely
> > > that
> > > > it does not , by the community's own admission, constitute a reliable
> > > > source:whereas "Reputable tertiary sources
> > > > , such as
> > > > introductory-level university textbooks, almanacs, and encyclopedias,
> > may
> > > > be cited".  So Wikipedia fails in its aim of being an encyclopaedia
> on
> > > one
> > > > of the most important tests one could imagine, namely reliability.
> > And a
> > > > reason for that is its lack of effective content management policies
> > and
> > > > mechanisms to put them into effect (in the old days we called that
> > being
> > > an
> > > > editor, but that word on Wikipedia now is more or less a redundant
> > > synonym
> > > > for contributor).
> > > >
> > > > Now suppose that Wikipedia had effective editorial policies and
> > processes
> > > > that allowed it to assume the status of a reliable source, just like
> > the
> > > > encyclopaedia it aims to be.  You say that even in that situation, it
> > > would
> > > > be easy to manipulate.  On that assumption, how much easier it must
> be
> > to
> > > > "trick" it today when it has no such effective policies and processes
> > in
> > > > place!
> > > >
> > > > Thrapostibongles
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Dennis C. During
> > > ___
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] New Code of Conduct committee candidates

2019-06-23 Thread Amir Sarabadani
Yes, I don't see those to be contradictory. All members need to identify
themselves to WMF but not to each other or public.

On Sun, Jun 23, 2019, 18:36 Thomas Townsend  wrote:

> Amir
>
> > The committee is a body of volunteers and they can't be forced to
> disclose
> > their real identities. There's no such policy in the CoC
>
> That does not appear to be correct.  The CoC policy requires that the
> volunteer committee members identify themselves *to the Foundation*.
>
> The Turnip
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] New Code of Conduct committee candidates

2019-06-23 Thread Thomas Townsend
Amir

> The committee is a body of volunteers and they can't be forced to disclose
> their real identities. There's no such policy in the CoC

That does not appear to be correct.  The CoC policy requires that the
volunteer committee members identify themselves *to the Foundation*.

The Turnip

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Foundation management of volunteers

2019-06-23 Thread Mister Thrapostibongles
Martijn

>
> I'm under no such obligation,


Indeed, none of us is under any such obligation, which is why it is
somewhat pointless for one list member to issue orders to another, such as
"Don't do that."


> I do want to call out when something so egregiously
> off base is put forward as the assertion that wikipedia is unreliable
> *because* it has a policy that prevents it from citing itself,
>

And if anyone were to put forward that assertion, by all means call it
out.  You will have noticed, I'm sure that the initial post on this thread
asserted that Wikipedia has a policy that prevents it from citing itself
*because* it is unreliable.  Quite a different thing.

Thrapostibongles
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