Re: [Wikimedia-l] Use of Wikimedia projects for anti-LGBT+ "humour"

[Delphine Dallison]

Hi Natacha,

I want to thank you for this response, which greatly reflects my own feelings 
on this incident. As an individual who identifies as genderqueer, I was greatly 
saddened by the humour column posted in The Signpost as I felt a) it failed to 
actually be humorous and b) it reflected poorly on the Wikimedia community who 
I consider on the whole a very open-minded, respectful and accepting community 
when it comes to issues of gender and trans rights. As a trainer, I often refer 
to the Q on talk pages of articles such as Chelsea Manning 
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Chelsea_Manning) to illustrate the way in 
which the wiki community reach consensus and operate with respect in situations 
where notable individuals self-declare changes in the gender and pronouns by 
which they wish to be identified. I believe that that should be the message 
that we should be publicizing rather than some tired jokes at the expense of a 
minority group. 
I would also like to second your thanks to both Barbara and Fae, who I agree 
both demonstrated good faith by in turn apologizing for any offense caused and 
for speaking out when the situation required it.

Best wishes,

Delphine Dallison
Wikimedian in Residence
Scottish Library and Information Council 
Turnberry House 
Suite 5:5, Fifth Floor
175 West George Street
Glasgow G2 2LB
Tel: 0141 202 2999
www.scottishlibraries.org 


Enriching lives through libraries


-Original Message-
From: Wikimedia-l  On Behalf Of 
Natacha Rault via Wikimedia-l
Sent: 05 March 2019 14:12
To: Wikimedia Mailing List 
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Use of Wikimedia projects for anti-LGBT+ "humour"

Hi Peter, 

Please take time to reflect that this humour has deeply affected some people 
(and not only the persons who outed publicly taking risks), hence the reaction. 
To those who do not understand how LGBTIQ people feel about jokes on their 
identity and the legitimate desire that adequate language be used to express it 
might just seem superfluous and look like an overreaction, but it does echo a 
deep suffering which takes place after being joked about virtually everywhere 
and not being able to express opinion when on the otherside, freedom of speech 
is invoked to promote such jokes. Advocates of freedom of speech do not try to 
silence opinions. 
Just look at what happened recently in France around the Ligue du lol affair, 
and maybe you will understand what is at stake here (1). 

Jokes are not bad in themselves, they become problematic when they 
systematically target the same group of people (women, LGBTIQ  people, 
minorities ect...) , and when they are issued systematically by the same group 
of people not aware of their own priviledge, and when they are disseminated 
through official channels. They can pave the way to problematic behaviors if 
the « joked about party » cannot in turn express freely what they feel about 
these jokes. 
I have a request : can we have the conversation freely? 
This is in no way underevaluating the value of the Signpost and the remarkable 
work done by people like you.
Maybe more articles on the subject of harassement and gender issues are needed 
in the Signpost to adress this issue, to lay down the cards, and maybe not in 
humour tone.
To finish  I want to thank Barbara  from the bottom of my heart  for showing 
willingness to apologize and understand (because the effect of this is soothing 
and shows willingness to understand) and I thank Fae for speaking out. 
If all protagonists could now calm down and consider that the very fact the 
conversation is taking place is positive, I think we would all have gained in 
freedom of speech. 

Good afternoon, 

Nattes à chat

(1) 
https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nytimes.com%2F2019%2F02%2F12%2Fworld%2Feurope%2Fla-ligue-du-lol-sexual-harassment.htmldata=02%7C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7C148b9268e22b47a8941308d6a1748d1e%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C0%7C0%7C636873919294097051sdata=l1ixYJtHyqRs11zHsD7Ic9Y2NFb2cq%2FdFlUusnLNBVI%3Dreserved=0





> Le 5 mars 2019 à 10:07, Peter Southwood  a 
> écrit :
> 
> "When in danger or in doubt, run in circles, scream and shout."
> Overreacting is a tradition at Wikipedia. 
> Cheers,
> Peter
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:wikimedia-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On 
> Behalf Of Michel Vuijlsteke
> Sent: 03 March 2019 19:49
> To: Wikimedia Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Use of Wikimedia projects for anti-LGBT+ "humour"
> 
> I don't understand in which possible world anyone thought this was a 
> good idea.
> 
> The MfD, that is. It, and the entire discussion in favour, reads as 
> some sort of caricature of the worst SJW-type excesses.
> 
> M.
> 
> 
> 
>> On Sun, 3 Mar 2019 at 16:41, Fæ  wrote:
>> 
>> As the last second repost had the same fo

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Social media cards for sharing from the Wikipedia\tapp

[Delphine Dallison]

Hi Andy,

"Unless there is also a mechanism for including the text /as text/, usually by 
using the "alt" attribute (sometimes erroneously referred to as "alt text", I 
hope people won't do this."

Thanks for highlighting the importance of using the "alt" attribute/"alt text" 
for making images more accessible to the visually impaired. It's an important 
point to raise and we need to encourage more people to build it into their 
practise when uploading images to commons. I don't know if that function is 
included in the tool that John mentioned but if it doesn't I don't think it 
should preclude people from using it as you can use other strategies for making 
these posts available. In fact the more tools get used, the easier it is to 
make the argument for developers to build in more accessibility features. 
Inclusion should be about expecting more, not offering less.

Best wishes,

Delphine


From: Andy Mabbett
Sent: Thursday 26 July, 11:37
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Social media cards for sharing from the Wikipediaapp
To: Wikimedia Mailing List


On 25 July 2018 at 14:14, John Lubbock wrote: > Just wanted to make you all 
aware of a useful new feature of the Wikipedia > mobile app. You can share text 
from any Wikipedia page as a nice image Images of text are inaccessible to 
people with visual impairment (who use software to read text out loud); or with 
no image display in their user agent (such as the free access to Facebook 
provided by many mobile telephone providers, like those some of us used at 
Wikimania last week). -- Andy Mabbett @pigsonthewing 
https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fpigsonthewing.org.uk=02%7C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7C09a9db210d5442dad82908d5f2e3d53d%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C0%7C636681982703062648=Pu%2Bbyv58VGX4ZIyoYs6pnUF0RbxuWNgOwuQ9amtFSHM%3D=0
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Cheat sheets visual editing on Wikipedia

[Delphine Dallison]

What sort of font did you use on the SVG? If the font isn't available on other 
people's computers, this might be the problem...?

Best wishes,

Delphine Dallison
Wikimedian in Residence
Scottish Library and Information Council 
Turnberry House 
Suite 5:5, Fifth Floor
175 West George Street
Glasgow G2 2LB
Tel: 0141 202 2999
www.scottishlibraries.org 


Enriching lives through libraries


-Original Message-
From: Wikimedia-l  On Behalf Of Arne 
Wossink
Sent: 17 July 2018 09:37
To: Wikimedia Mailing List 
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Cheat sheets visual editing on Wikipedia

Hi Lodewijk,

That's interesting. I get the same issue as you're reporting when I look at the 
page in Commons. However, when I download and open the sheet, the text 
runaround conforms to the text boxes, but is rendered in a different font.
So there's definitely something wrong in how the SVG is saved from the original 
Illustrator format.

As I'm not an expert in converting images to SVG, is there someone else who 
recognizes this issue and knows how to solve it? Alternatevely, I can make the 
AI files available to someone with more experience in converting them to SVG.

Best,


Arne Wossink

Projectleider / Project Manager Wikimedia Nederland

*(Werkdagen: maandag, dinsdag, donderdag / Office hours: Monday, Tuesday,
Thursday)*

Tel. +31 (0)6 11000505
E-mail: woss...@wikimedia.nl

*Post/bezoekadres / Mail/visiting address:* Mariaplaats 3
3511 LH Utrecht

2018-07-13 7:20 GMT+02:00 Lodewijk :

> Hmm, the svg's are behaving oddly here. I'll send a screenshot to arne.
>
> Lodewijk
>
> On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 2:46 AM Arne Wossink  wrote:
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I just uploaded the SVG versions of the cheat sheets:
> >
> >
> > https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fc
> > ommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3AVoeg_je_eerste_data=02%7C0
> > 1%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7Cce5b2d45df1040c9bad408d5ebc
> > 07b86%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C0%7C63667413429295941
> > 2sdata=0lBy1cgJeDji2i21muw4QnlCQhpU5UMqPKCmiNTkoEw%3Dreser
> > ved=0
> referentie_toe_aan_Wikipedia.svg
> >
> > https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fc
> > ommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3AMaak_een_account_data=02%7
> > C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7Cce5b2d45df1040c9bad408d5e
> > bc07b86%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C0%7C636674134292959
> > 412sdata=HAXOdIWGu3WQoV7f1BeamTCZlHEFCZMsCFkH%2BRQW7Lc%3Dr
> > eserved=0
> aan_op_Wikipedia.svg
> >
> > https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fc
> > ommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3ASpiekbriefje_data=02%7C01%
> > 7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7Cce5b2d45df1040c9bad408d5ebc07
> > b86%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C0%7C636674134292959412&
> > amp;sdata=virAd6DewmLzGV%2BEljLd3aHifk95he6L8y4WDjTQwgg%3Dreser
> > ved=0
> Visueel_bewerken_op_Wikipedia.svg
> >
> > https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fc
> > ommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3AUpload_je_eerste_data=02%7
> > C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7Cce5b2d45df1040c9bad408d5e
> > bc07b86%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C0%7C636674134292959
> > 412sdata=XPjnTbpRyWAmBeAbGWSDFNJ4d9D2rbZrPWQNzta1Meg%3Dres
> > erved=0
> foto_naar_Wikimedia_Commons.svg
> >
> > https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fc
> > ommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3ACheat_sheet_Visual_data=02
> > %7C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7Cce5b2d45df1040c9bad408d
> > 5ebc07b86%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C0%7C6366741342929
> > 59412sdata=2ki3bXRtFpdvYhk%2FQi719ti5yCsB78kJHpODvBmruc8%3D
> > ;reserved=0
> editing_on_Wikipedia.svg
> >
> > https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fc
> > ommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3ADoe_je_eerste_data=02%7C01
> > %7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7Cce5b2d45df1040c9bad408d5ebc0
> > 7b86%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C0%7C636674134292959412
> > sdata=%2Bu%2BQiRzkhMp3GI%2Fm%2BokD3JfRn3f5M034htBXJStR2HI%3D
> > p;reserved=0
> bewerking_op_Wikipedia.svg
> >
> > As before, I'm still happy to work with anyone to get more language 
> > versions online if you don't the right editing software, but this 
> > should get others going as well.
> >
> > Best,
> >
> >
> > Arne Wossink
> >
> > Projectleider / Project Manager Wikimedia Nederland
> >
> > *(Werkdagen: maandag, dinsdag, donderdag / Office hours: Monday, 
> > Tuesday,
> > Thursday)*
> >
> > Tel. +31 (0)6 11000505
> > E-mail: woss...@wikimedia.nl
>

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Cheat sheets visual editing on Wikipedia

[Delphine Dallison]

It would be great to get all these cheat sheets gathered up in a meta page on 
Wikimedia Resources so we can do a concerted effort to get them translated into 
as many languages as possible and so we don't keep on reinventing the wheel. I 
think both Arne's cheat sheets and the Wikimedia Deutschland ones are great. 
Personally I would probably chose to go with Arne's if I was doing 
institutional level outreach and the other set for more relaxed public 
editathons, so they both have their value. Is anyone on here with metawiki to 
help us gather these in one place including the translations as they start to 
come through?

Best wishes,

Delphine Dallison
Wikimedian in Residence
Scottish Library and Information Council 
Turnberry House 
Suite 5:5, Fifth Floor
175 West George Street
Glasgow G2 2LB
Tel: 0141 202 2999
www.scottishlibraries.org 


Enriching lives through libraries


-Original Message-
From: Wikimedia-l  On Behalf Of 
Cornelius Kibelka
Sent: 11 July 2018 08:17
To: Wikimedia Mailing List 
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Cheat sheets visual editing on Wikipedia

Hey all,

not meant to be competing with Arne ;) , but if you're looking for another
design: Wikimedia Deutschland has created similar "cheat sheets", just with 
another, a bit funnier style:
*
https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3AWikipedia_Spickzettel_Artikel_f%25C3%25BCr_Wikipedia_schreiben.pdfdata=02%7C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7Cdfc73bc663fe486a919308d5e6fe5ad1%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C1%7C636668902476712848sdata=tvr327cjcUS%2B64%2BPCx0G6rEi8AyE4vU2CU%2B3hfmzVq0%3Dreserved=0
("Writing
articles for Wikipedia")
*
https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3AWikipedia_Spickzettel_In_Wikipedia_kommunizieren.pdfdata=02%7C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7Cdfc73bc663fe486a919308d5e6fe5ad1%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C1%7C636668902476712848sdata=AM5n4Cchj%2FWscHNK6jQ40foKXvdcBl63A6ZpmL0z1Aw%3Dreserved=0
("Communicating within the Wikipedia community")
*
https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3AWikipedia_Spickzettel_Mit_dem_Smartphone_Wikipedia_bearbeiten.pdfdata=02%7C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7Cdfc73bc663fe486a919308d5e6fe5ad1%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C1%7C636668902476712848sdata=R2WKNW0GTQIMOScU5n7NIZKA%2FVydv2Q3sfue51B4jfY%3Dreserved=0
("Edit Wikipedia with your smartphone")
*
https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3AWikipedia_Spickzettel_Wikipedia_bearbeiten_und_korrigieren.pdfdata=02%7C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7Cdfc73bc663fe486a919308d5e6fe5ad1%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C1%7C636668902476712848sdata=ov%2FufcPlsVnc8YwvKu7mc61FtZzbJoAI221uCyPGoUM%3Dreserved=0
("Editing & correcting Wikipedia articles")

Let me know if you are interested in, we can share the Illustrator files.

Cheers
Cornelius

On Wed, 11 Jul 2018 at 08:27, Arne Wossink  wrote:

> @Strainu: once the English translations are available, you could 
> translate those into Romanian, and I could help you with formatting 
> them. As long as the texts are as long as the English ones (or 
> shorter), that shouldn't be too hard. Since there's one available in 
> English already, you could start the translation of that one right away, if 
> you want.
>
> @Advrk Aplmrkt: that's a good suggestion! I'll see if I can upload SVG 
> versions of the files as well.
>
> Best,
>
>
> Arne Wossink
>
> Projectleider / Project Manager Wikimedia Nederland
>
> *(Werkdagen: maandag, dinsdag, donderdag / Office hours: Monday, 
> Tuesday,
> Thursday)*
>
> Tel. +31 (0)6 11000505
> E-mail: woss...@wikimedia.nl
>
> *Post/bezoekadres / Mail/visiting address:* Mariaplaats 3
> 3511 LH Utrecht
>
> 2018-07-10 14:40 GMT+02:00 Advrk Aplmrkt :
>
> > Amazing work and much needed, thank you!
> >
> > I can't use proprietary file formats like AI, can you export it to SVG?
> >
> > On 10/07/2018, Arne Wossink  wrote:
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > > For WMNL I've been working on several 1-page cheat sheets on how 
> > > to
> edit
> > > Wikipedia in visual editing mode, to be used during editathons. 
> > > These currently include "create an account", "make your first 
> > > edit", "insert
> a
> > > reference", "upload an image to Wikimedia Commons", and a general 
> > > cheat sheet on the visual editor. They're all in Dutch, except for 
> > > the Visual editing cheat sheet, which is also available in English.
> > >
> > > If anyone's interested 

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Cheat sheets visual editing on Wikipedia

[Delphine Dallison]

Great, Arne. Send me the AI files and I'll make a start. 

Best wishes,

Delphine Dallison
Wikimedian in Residence
Scottish Library and Information Council 
Turnberry House 
Suite 5:5, Fifth Floor
175 West George Street
Glasgow G2 2LB
Tel: 0141 202 2999
www.scottishlibraries.org 


Enriching lives through libraries


-Original Message-
From: Wikimedia-l  On Behalf Of Arne 
Wossink
Sent: 10 July 2018 11:50
To: Wikimedia Mailing List 
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Cheat sheets visual editing on Wikipedia

Hi Delphine,

The English version of the VE cheat sheet is already available so you can start 
working on that right away, if you want. I'll send you the AI file.
I'm going to look into getting English translations for the other files as well.

Best,


Arne Wossink

Projectleider / Project Manager Wikimedia Nederland

*(Werkdagen: maandag, dinsdag, donderdag / Office hours: Monday, Tuesday,
Thursday)*

Tel. +31 (0)6 11000505
E-mail: woss...@wikimedia.nl

*Post/bezoekadres / Mail/visiting address:* Mariaplaats 3
3511 LH Utrecht

2018-07-10 11:45 GMT+02:00 Delphine Dallison <
d.dalli...@scottishlibraries.org>:

> These are fab and I would love to have a version of these in English. 
> If anyone can help with translating the text, I'd be happy to do the 
> layout work with the Illustrator files. Once I have the English 
> version, I'd be happy to translate it to French as well.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Delphine Dallison
> Wikimedian in Residence
> Scottish Library and Information Council Turnberry House Suite 5:5, 
> Fifth Floor
> 175 West George Street
> Glasgow G2 2LB
> Tel: 0141 202 2999
> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=www.scottishlibra
> ries.orgdata=02%7C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7C47dc4
> 5bcd0bc46a3d66508d5e652fae6%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C0
> %7C636668166420505538sdata=uhPQvCzUW2VD%2BCt1fq12F4c4aR461lAokqBd
> Ou3q0gM%3Dreserved=0
>
>
> Enriching lives through libraries
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Wikimedia-l  On Behalf 
> Of Arne Wossink
> Sent: 10 July 2018 10:32
> To: Wikimedia Mailing List 
> Subject: [Wikimedia-l] Cheat sheets visual editing on Wikipedia
>
> Hi all,
>
> For WMNL I've been working on several 1-page cheat sheets on how to 
> edit Wikipedia in visual editing mode, to be used during editathons. 
> These currently include "create an account", "make your first edit", 
> "insert a reference", "upload an image to Wikimedia Commons", and a 
> general cheat sheet on the visual editor. They're all in Dutch, except 
> for the Visual editing cheat sheet, which is also available in English.
>
> If anyone's interested in having these available in their own 
> language, I'm more than happy to work with them to make these 
> available (time permitting). Source files are available in Adobe 
> Illustrator format, so I can make those available as well to those who 
> would like to do the editing themselves.
>
> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> https%3A%2F%2Fcommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%
> 3ACheat_sheet_Visual_editing_on_Wikipedia.pdfdata=02%
> 7C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7Cbc43419b1f5e4e8471ab08d5e6
> 47 
> f6ee%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C1%7C636668119109702582
> mp;
> sdata=yDIHEQgJkYVctR%2B%2FvPf%2BElHv5IX1CgKevol3JhVuwQ4%3Dreserve
> d=0 https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> https%3A%2F%2Fcommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3ASpiekbriefje_Visue
> el_ 
> bewerken.pdfdata=02%7C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%
> 7Cbc43419b1f5e4e8471ab08d5e647f6ee%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7a
> db76%7C1%7C1%7C636668119109702582sdata=R0z4Qgre%2F%
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> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Cheat sheets visual editing on Wikipedia

[Delphine Dallison]

These are fab and I would love to have a version of these in English. If anyone 
can help with translating the text, I'd be happy to do the layout work with the 
Illustrator files. Once I have the English version, I'd be happy to translate 
it to French as well. 

Best wishes,

Delphine Dallison
Wikimedian in Residence
Scottish Library and Information Council 
Turnberry House 
Suite 5:5, Fifth Floor
175 West George Street
Glasgow G2 2LB
Tel: 0141 202 2999
www.scottishlibraries.org 


Enriching lives through libraries


-Original Message-
From: Wikimedia-l  On Behalf Of Arne 
Wossink
Sent: 10 July 2018 10:32
To: Wikimedia Mailing List 
Subject: [Wikimedia-l] Cheat sheets visual editing on Wikipedia

Hi all,

For WMNL I've been working on several 1-page cheat sheets on how to edit 
Wikipedia in visual editing mode, to be used during editathons. These currently 
include "create an account", "make your first edit", "insert a reference", 
"upload an image to Wikimedia Commons", and a general cheat sheet on the visual 
editor. They're all in Dutch, except for the Visual editing cheat sheet, which 
is also available in English.

If anyone's interested in having these available in their own language, I'm 
more than happy to work with them to make these available (time permitting). 
Source files are available in Adobe Illustrator format, so I can make those 
available as well to those who would like to do the editing themselves.

https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcommons.wikimedia.org%2Fwiki%2FFile%3ACheat_sheet_Visual_editing_on_Wikipedia.pdfdata=02%7C01%7Cd.dallison%40scottishlibraries.org%7Cbc43419b1f5e4e8471ab08d5e647f6ee%7C6414ad35a3824075ab2600ed2b7adb76%7C1%7C1%7C636668119109702582sdata=yDIHEQgJkYVctR%2B%2FvPf%2BElHv5IX1CgKevol3JhVuwQ4%3Dreserved=0
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Best,

Arne Wossink

Projectleider / Project Manager Wikimedia Nederland

*(Werkdagen: maandag, dinsdag, donderdag / Office hours: Monday, Tuesday,
Thursday)*

Tel. +31 (0)6 11000505
E-mail: woss...@wikimedia.nl

*Post/bezoekadres / Mail/visiting address:* Mariaplaats 3
3511 LH Utrecht
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Gendergap approach causing problems

[Delphine Dallison]

> Now compiling a repository of such orally transmitted histories and
> traditions would be an amazing idea for a new project in my opinion.

I would suggest that we already have a repository built for purpose to
gather these oral histories and it's Wikimedia Commons. I definitely agree
that finding ways of capturing and uploading those oral histories on a
Creative Commons open license would be a fantastic project, whether that be
in the form of video or oral recordings. There are already many projects of
that type taking place with local history groups or herstory groups, etc, so
maybe we need to find ways to work with those groups to release their
content under the right licenses. Wouldn't it be amazing to have such a
wealth of primary sources available on wiki commons for any researchers to
use and write about so it can then generate secondary sources to be added to
Wikipedia? 

Best wishes,

Delphine Dallison
Wikimedian in Residence
Scottish Library and Information Council
Turnberry House
Suite 5:5, Fifth Floor
175 West George Street
Glasgow G2 2LB
Tel: 0141 202 2999
www.scottishlibraries.org


Enriching lives through libraries


-Original Message-
From: Wikimedia-l <wikimedia-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org> On Behalf Of
Jean-Philippe Béland
Sent: 11 May 2018 14:51
To: Wikimedia Mailing List <wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org>
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Gendergap approach causing problems

When we say we want to keep our current requirements, we need to ask
ourselves if we want to continue to be an encyclopedia written by Westerners
for Westerners. If that's the case, fine. But that's not what we are
claiming to be...

JP

On Fri, May 11, 2018, 09:30 Cameron, <came...@cameron11598.net> wrote:

> Well audio recordings or video recordings of oral histories and
> traditions come to mind. However I'm not sure how comfortable I am
> with an encyclopedia using such sources.
>
> Now as an aspiring historian (Only one semester left on my degree), I
> use primary sources quite often for papers, and projects however those
> are generally frowned upon for Wikipedia; mainly because Wikipedia is
> an encyclopedia not an academic journal. Good encyclopedias are
> typically sourced from secondary sources, and ocassionaly tertiary
> sources.
>
> Now compiling a repository of such orally transmitted histories and
> traditions would be an amazing idea for a new project in my opinion.
> My personal thought on this issue is keeping our current verifiability
> and notability requirements is a good idea. In some areas I think we
> include far too much (fan cruft anyone?).
>
> - Cameron C.
> Cameron11598
>
>  On Thu, 10 May 2018 21:34:15 -0700 peter.southw...@telkomsa.net
> wrote 
>
> If not written, how would they be referenced and verified?
> Cheers,
> Peter
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:wikimedia-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On
> Behalf Of Jean-Philippe Béland
> Sent: Friday, May 11, 2018 6:28 AM
> To: Wikimedia Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Gendergap approach causing problems
>
> You are missing the whole point. I'm not talking about second guessing
> sources but rather changing our narrow point of views of what we
> consider sources of knowledge. A lot of cultures are of oral tradition
> and not written.
>
> JP
>
> On Thu, May 10, 2018, 16:42 Todd Allen, <toddmal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Abandoning notability and verifiability is a wide open sign for
> > spammers and hoaxers. We have enough of that without giving them an
> > engraved invitation.
> >
> > If published sources are biased, the efforts to correct that should
> > be
> made
> > at the source (literally) level. Just like rather than "disputing" a
> > reliable source, if we found evidence that contradicts them, we'd
> > ask
> them
> > to correct, and then once they do we'll update the article
> > accordingly based on their correction. Wikipedia is not there to
> > second-guess what sources choose to publish or find "alternative" or
> > "non-western" or whatever else have you types of information. If our
> > references are
> flawed,
> > the solution lies in getting them to correct what they're doing, not
> > "correcting" for any perceived bias by editors. We reflect sources,
> > we do not second-guess, dispute, or correct them.
> >
> > Todd
> >
> > On Thu, May 10, 2018 at 10:46 AM, Peter Southwood <
> > peter.southw...@telkomsa.net> wrote:
> >
> > > When Wikipedia was new and unknown there were not so many people
> wanting
> > > to use it for purposes that conflict with our purposes. Times change.
> > > Cheers,
> > >