Re: [Wikimedia-l] Rules of engagement for companies in Swedish, Norwegian, Finnish, Danish?

2013-10-22 Thread Peter Gervai
On Tue, Oct 22, 2013 at 7:52 AM, David Richfield
davidrichfi...@gmail.com wrote:

 I'm not in communications at all: I'm in RD, but our Corporate
 Communications team really does want to act in good faith, which is

Yeah, usually when someone wants to play nicely ask asks openly people
start to pour all of their problems with OTHERS who doesn't play
nicely on them. :-P

Human behaviour sucks. Unfortunately lowers, while peaceful, cannot
edit articles. :-)

g

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Rules of engagement for companies in Swedish, Norwegian, Finnish, Danish?

2013-10-22 Thread Johan Jönsson
2013/10/22 David Richfield davidrichfi...@gmail.com

 Thanks all!

 Surprising as it might seem for a company our size, we don't have any
 consultants polishing our Wikipedia pages.

 I'm not in communications at all: I'm in RD, but our Corporate
 Communications team really does want to act in good faith, which is
 why they started talking to me: they're trying to understand the rules
 before doing anything, and I want to help them connect with the right
 people in the projects, and help them figure out how they're allowed
 to contribute responsibly and openly.


Which is appreciated.

//Johan Jönsson
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[Wikimedia-l] Rules of engagement for companies in Swedish, Norwegian, Finnish, Danish?

2013-10-21 Thread David Richfield
Hi all,

When I'm not editing Wikimedia projects, I work for Mondelez
International, and our Social Media team has contacted me for advice
on responsible engagement with Wikipedia.  I know that different
language projects have different rules on whether company
representatives should:

* Edit pages directly or only ever edit talk pages
* Edit under their own names or under company names

What are the rules for the Nordic languages?

Thanks,

David

-- 
David Richfield
[[:en:User:Slashme]]
+491723724440

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Rules of engagement for companies in Swedish, Norwegian, Finnish, Danish?

2013-10-21 Thread Hans A. Rosbach
In no-wp we have a policy that usernames shall be for individuals and thus
typical company usernames are blocked and asked to request change of names.
These users then have no restrictions on which pages to edit. As long as we
don't demand identification of users, restrictions on edits would IMO be
futile anyway.

Hans A. Rosbach / User:Haros



On 21 October 2013 15:14, David Richfield davidrichfi...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi all,

 When I'm not editing Wikimedia projects, I work for Mondelez
 International, and our Social Media team has contacted me for advice
 on responsible engagement with Wikipedia.  I know that different
 language projects have different rules on whether company
 representatives should:

 * Edit pages directly or only ever edit talk pages
 * Edit under their own names or under company names

 What are the rules for the Nordic languages?

 Thanks,

 David

 --
 David Richfield
 [[:en:User:Slashme]]
 +491723724440

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Rules of engagement for companies in Swedish, Norwegian, Finnish, Danish?

2013-10-21 Thread David Richfield
Thanks for the quick reply, Hans!  If our representatives would (for
example) translate an English company page into Norwegian, and then
explain the edits on the talk page, and identify their conflict of
interest on their user pages and also the article talk page, would you
expect that that would be seen as fair and transparent by the
Norwegian Wikipedia community?

On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 3:51 PM, Hans A. Rosbach
hans.a.rosb...@gmail.com wrote:
 In no-wp we have a policy that usernames shall be for individuals and thus
 typical company usernames are blocked and asked to request change of names.
 These users then have no restrictions on which pages to edit. As long as we
 don't demand identification of users, restrictions on edits would IMO be
 futile anyway.

 Hans A. Rosbach / User:Haros



 On 21 October 2013 15:14, David Richfield davidrichfi...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi all,

 When I'm not editing Wikimedia projects, I work for Mondelez
 International, and our Social Media team has contacted me for advice
 on responsible engagement with Wikipedia.  I know that different
 language projects have different rules on whether company
 representatives should:

 * Edit pages directly or only ever edit talk pages
 * Edit under their own names or under company names

 What are the rules for the Nordic languages?

 Thanks,

 David

 --
 David Richfield
 [[:en:User:Slashme]]
 +491723724440

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Rules of engagement for companies in Swedish, Norwegian, Finnish, Danish?

2013-10-21 Thread Hans A. Rosbach
I'm not sure. Someone who posts deficient article that they obviously have
a special relationship to, where the language in addition is deficient, may
easily be meet by a deletion request. The difficulty with promoting a
company in Wikipedia is the promotion part, not the identity of the author.
For a well sourced, well written, well structured article that takes a
neutral point of view about a clearly relevant subject, I cannot see that
the identity of the author should make much difference. That said,
obviously there may be someone who disagrees with me in this.

Hans


On 21 October 2013 16:07, David Richfield davidrichfi...@gmail.com wrote:

 Thanks for the quick reply, Hans!  If our representatives would (for
 example) translate an English company page into Norwegian, and then
 explain the edits on the talk page, and identify their conflict of
 interest on their user pages and also the article talk page, would you
 expect that that would be seen as fair and transparent by the
 Norwegian Wikipedia community?

 On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 3:51 PM, Hans A. Rosbach
 hans.a.rosb...@gmail.com wrote:
  In no-wp we have a policy that usernames shall be for individuals and
 thus
  typical company usernames are blocked and asked to request change of
 names.
  These users then have no restrictions on which pages to edit. As long as
 we
  don't demand identification of users, restrictions on edits would IMO be
  futile anyway.
 
  Hans A. Rosbach / User:Haros
 
 
 
  On 21 October 2013 15:14, David Richfield davidrichfi...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  Hi all,
 
  When I'm not editing Wikimedia projects, I work for Mondelez
  International, and our Social Media team has contacted me for advice
  on responsible engagement with Wikipedia.  I know that different
  language projects have different rules on whether company
  representatives should:
 
  * Edit pages directly or only ever edit talk pages
  * Edit under their own names or under company names
 
  What are the rules for the Nordic languages?
 
  Thanks,
 
  David
 
  --
  David Richfield
  [[:en:User:Slashme]]
  +491723724440
 
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Rules of engagement for companies in Swedish, Norwegian, Finnish, Danish?

2013-10-21 Thread Fred Bauder
 I'm not sure. Someone who posts deficient article that they obviously
 have
 a special relationship to, where the language in addition is deficient,
 may
 easily be meet by a deletion request. The difficulty with promoting a
 company in Wikipedia is the promotion part, not the identity of the
 author.
 For a well sourced, well written, well structured article that takes a
 neutral point of view about a clearly relevant subject, I cannot see that
 the identity of the author should make much difference. That said,
 obviously there may be someone who disagrees with me in this.

 Hans


What you are saying, in practice, is that a major firm that hires a
professional public relations firm that writes the best sort of article,
from the viewpoint of the firm, that could be expected to be acceptable
is OK, but a crude amateur effort by an inexperienced free-lancer is not.
What makes a Wikipedia article better for a firm if serious attention by
a public relations firm is regularly paid to it is rather subtle. The
brights are a little brighter, the dulls a little less boring, and the
pig is cute.

Fred



 On 21 October 2013 16:07, David Richfield davidrichfi...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 Thanks for the quick reply, Hans!  If our representatives would (for
 example) translate an English company page into Norwegian, and then
 explain the edits on the talk page, and identify their conflict of
 interest on their user pages and also the article talk page, would you
 expect that that would be seen as fair and transparent by the
 Norwegian Wikipedia community?

 On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 3:51 PM, Hans A. Rosbach
 hans.a.rosb...@gmail.com wrote:
  In no-wp we have a policy that usernames shall be for individuals and
 thus
  typical company usernames are blocked and asked to request change of
 names.
  These users then have no restrictions on which pages to edit. As long
 as
 we
  don't demand identification of users, restrictions on edits would IMO
 be
  futile anyway.
 
  Hans A. Rosbach / User:Haros
 
 
 
  On 21 October 2013 15:14, David Richfield davidrichfi...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  Hi all,
 
  When I'm not editing Wikimedia projects, I work for Mondelez
  International, and our Social Media team has contacted me for advice
  on responsible engagement with Wikipedia.  I know that different
  language projects have different rules on whether company
  representatives should:
 
  * Edit pages directly or only ever edit talk pages
  * Edit under their own names or under company names
 
  What are the rules for the Nordic languages?
 
  Thanks,
 
  David
 
  --
  David Richfield
  [[:en:User:Slashme]]
  +491723724440
 
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Rules of engagement for companies in Swedish, Norwegian, Finnish, Danish?

2013-10-21 Thread Hans A. Rosbach
Is skewing an article easier if you are good at it? Yes I think it is.

Hans


On 21 October 2013 21:13, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote:

  I'm not sure. Someone who posts deficient article that they obviously
  have
  a special relationship to, where the language in addition is deficient,
  may
  easily be meet by a deletion request. The difficulty with promoting a
  company in Wikipedia is the promotion part, not the identity of the
  author.
  For a well sourced, well written, well structured article that takes a
  neutral point of view about a clearly relevant subject, I cannot see that
  the identity of the author should make much difference. That said,
  obviously there may be someone who disagrees with me in this.
 
  Hans
 

 What you are saying, in practice, is that a major firm that hires a
 professional public relations firm that writes the best sort of article,
 from the viewpoint of the firm, that could be expected to be acceptable
 is OK, but a crude amateur effort by an inexperienced free-lancer is not.
 What makes a Wikipedia article better for a firm if serious attention by
 a public relations firm is regularly paid to it is rather subtle. The
 brights are a little brighter, the dulls a little less boring, and the
 pig is cute.

 Fred


 
  On 21 October 2013 16:07, David Richfield davidrichfi...@gmail.com
  wrote:
 
  Thanks for the quick reply, Hans!  If our representatives would (for
  example) translate an English company page into Norwegian, and then
  explain the edits on the talk page, and identify their conflict of
  interest on their user pages and also the article talk page, would you
  expect that that would be seen as fair and transparent by the
  Norwegian Wikipedia community?
 
  On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 3:51 PM, Hans A. Rosbach
  hans.a.rosb...@gmail.com wrote:
   In no-wp we have a policy that usernames shall be for individuals and
  thus
   typical company usernames are blocked and asked to request change of
  names.
   These users then have no restrictions on which pages to edit. As long
  as
  we
   don't demand identification of users, restrictions on edits would IMO
  be
   futile anyway.
  
   Hans A. Rosbach / User:Haros
  
  
  
   On 21 October 2013 15:14, David Richfield davidrichfi...@gmail.com
  wrote:
  
   Hi all,
  
   When I'm not editing Wikimedia projects, I work for Mondelez
   International, and our Social Media team has contacted me for advice
   on responsible engagement with Wikipedia.  I know that different
   language projects have different rules on whether company
   representatives should:
  
   * Edit pages directly or only ever edit talk pages
   * Edit under their own names or under company names
  
   What are the rules for the Nordic languages?
  
   Thanks,
  
   David
  
   --
   David Richfield
   [[:en:User:Slashme]]
   +491723724440
  
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Rules of engagement for companies in Swedish, Norwegian, Finnish, Danish?

2013-10-21 Thread Johan Jönsson
2013/10/21 David Richfield davidrichfi...@gmail.com

 Hi all,


For Swedish Wikipedia, as I understand our consensus and relevant texts
(WP:IK, WP:Användarkonto, WP:Att skriva om näringsliv, företag och
varumärken):

When I'm not editing Wikimedia projects, I work for Mondelez
 International, and our Social Media team has contacted me for advice
 on responsible engagement with Wikipedia.  I know that different
 language projects have different rules on whether company
 representatives should:

 * Edit pages directly or only ever edit talk pages


Talk pages only, please.

* Edit under their own names or under company names


Their own names (or pseudonyms). We discourage company names as user names.

//Johan Jönsson
--
http://vetsaga.se
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Rules of engagement for companies in Swedish, Norwegian, Finnish, Danish?

2013-10-21 Thread David Richfield
Thanks all!

Surprising as it might seem for a company our size, we don't have any
consultants polishing our Wikipedia pages.

I'm not in communications at all: I'm in RD, but our Corporate
Communications team really does want to act in good faith, which is
why they started talking to me: they're trying to understand the rules
before doing anything, and I want to help them connect with the right
people in the projects, and help them figure out how they're allowed
to contribute responsibly and openly.

Kind regards,

David


On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 9:43 PM, Johan Jönsson brevlis...@gmail.com wrote:
 2013/10/21 David Richfield davidrichfi...@gmail.com

 Hi all,


 For Swedish Wikipedia, as I understand our consensus and relevant texts
 (WP:IK, WP:Användarkonto, WP:Att skriva om näringsliv, företag och
 varumärken):

 When I'm not editing Wikimedia projects, I work for Mondelez
 International, and our Social Media team has contacted me for advice
 on responsible engagement with Wikipedia.  I know that different
 language projects have different rules on whether company
 representatives should:

 * Edit pages directly or only ever edit talk pages


 Talk pages only, please.

 * Edit under their own names or under company names


 Their own names (or pseudonyms). We discourage company names as user names.

 //Johan Jönsson
 --
 http://vetsaga.se
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