Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-06 Thread Samuel Klein
Risker is right. This mainly reflects long-standing reality in a more transparent way, and is an exercise in more effective delegation. A few years back the staff liaison to the Board (James) took many of the notes at meetings, which was helpful; since then the Secretary has done much of that

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-06 Thread Florence Devouard
On 11/6/12 3:26 AM, Risker wrote: On 5 November 2012 20:01, John Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: Bylaw changes are never housekeeping. This resolution does change the composition of the board. Two seats had a defined role, with clear responsibilities. Now they dont. Of course there is

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-06 Thread Risker
On 6 November 2012 03:07, Florence Devouard anthe...@yahoo.com wrote: On 11/6/12 3:26 AM, Risker wrote: On 5 November 2012 20:01, John Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: Bylaw changes are never housekeeping. This resolution does change the composition of the board. Two seats had a

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-06 Thread Federico Leva (Nemo)
Risker, 06/11/2012 03:26: On 5 November 2012 20:01, John Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: Bylaw changes are never housekeeping. [snp] Somewhere in 500,000 bytes, do you really think there was any likelihood that there would have been anything posted that would have improved this

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-06 Thread Federico Leva (Nemo)
Risker, 06/11/2012 09:40: On 6 November 2012 03:07, Florence Devouard anthe...@yahoo.com wrote: Errr. No. At least historically, this is incorrect. Michael Davis was the first treasurer of the board (appointed by Jimbo at the beginning of the WMF). After some time, Michael announced his

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-06 Thread Lodewijk
Hi SJ, to boldly push my question again: do I understand from this correctly there was at this instance (in your opinion) no urgency that would validate the chosen procedure? I know you seem to be in favor of this change as much as I am, but I'm simply trying to understand if there are situations

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-05 Thread Lodewijk
(just for the record: in case someone does have a valid reason, I'm still very open to hearing good reasons why the board chose the procedure they chose (behind closed doors), and whether there was any urgency to the changes proposed. I somehow missed that in the replies but may have missed it.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-05 Thread Risker
It would strike me that one of the urgencies that might be involved is the fact that this resolution was passed so that the Board member who had previously been the secretary could participate as an individual board member, and the appointed secretary could take the minutes. It's extremely rare

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-05 Thread Thomas Dalton
I would be very surprised if the trustee Secretary actually took minutes... That would usually be delegated... On Nov 6, 2012 12:02 AM, Risker risker...@gmail.com wrote: It would strike me that one of the urgencies that might be involved is the fact that this resolution was passed so that the

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-05 Thread Risker
Well, that's the point. Phoebe *was* responsible for this, just as Bishakha has been so far this year. Who's been sending out the minutes and posting resolutions? Further, it's to improve compliance with legislation. Thus, it's housekeeping. Risker On 5 November 2012 19:04, Thomas Dalton

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-05 Thread Thomas Dalton
Being responsible for something doesn't you're the one that actually does it. On Nov 6, 2012 12:30 AM, Risker risker...@gmail.com wrote: Well, that's the point. Phoebe *was* responsible for this, just as Bishakha has been so far this year. Who's been sending out the minutes and posting

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-05 Thread John Vandenberg
Bylaw changes are never housekeeping. This resolution does change the composition of the board. Two seats had a defined role, with clear responsibilities. Now they dont. Of course there is always shared responsibility, but having one person chiefly responsible ensures someone is focused on those

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-05 Thread Risker
On 5 November 2012 20:01, John Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: Bylaw changes are never housekeeping. This resolution does change the composition of the board. Two seats had a defined role, with clear responsibilities. Now they dont. Of course there is always shared responsibility, but

[Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Bishakha Datta
Dear all, At its in-person meeting of 26 October, the Board of Trustees also approved the two following resolutions: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Resolution:Amended_Bylaws This resolution approved the revised and amended Foundation bylaws. The updated Bylaws are being adopted to ensure

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Federico Leva (Nemo)
Just reiterating for the n-th time on this list that people would appreciate if you publicly shared draft bylaws amendments before approving them. The consistent lack of transparency in such fundamental decisions within the WMF is always astonishing. After the fact, I'd appreciate a readable

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Lodewijk
Dear Bishakha, could you please elaborate why the board has chosen for a secretive amendment procedure here, rather than sharing the proposed amendments with the community and asking their input on it? Especially where it concerns such non-trivial changes. I hope that also other board members

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Thomas Dalton
Bishaka, Seeing as there was no public discussion of these amendments, to my knowledge, can you at least explain them now? The responsibilities of the Secretary and Treasurer are board responsibilities. While the day-to-day work of the role may be delegated to staff, it is still the job of the

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Benjamin Lees
On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 5:29 AM, Bishakha Datta bishakhada...@gmail.comwrote: Please note the substantive change in Article V: Officers and Duties. As per the amendments, the Secretary and Treasurer are now non-trustee officer positions. This doesn't seem too unreasonable in itself, but it is

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Bishakha Datta
On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 9:31 PM, Benjamin Lees emufarm...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 5:29 AM, Bishakha Datta bishakhada...@gmail.com wrote: Please note the substantive change in Article V: Officers and Duties. As per the amendments, the Secretary and Treasurer are now

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Bishakha Datta
On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 4:53 PM, Lodewijk lodew...@effeietsanders.orgwrote: Dear Bishakha, could you please elaborate why the board has chosen for a secretive amendment procedure here, rather than sharing the proposed amendments with the community and asking their input on it? Especially

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Bence Damokos
Hi Bishakha, In my opinion, given the generally curious nature of our movement, it might be a good idea to make more preparatory material for the board meetings available publicly in advance. Not necessarily as a way to allow comments or input, but as a matter of transparency. Especially for

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Bishakha Datta
On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 10:03 PM, Bence Damokos bdamo...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Bishakha, In my opinion, given the generally curious nature of our movement, it might be a good idea to make more preparatory material for the board meetings available publicly in advance. Not necessarily as a way

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Thomas Dalton
On Nov 2, 2012 3:07 PM, Bishakha Datta bishakhada...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 5:26 PM, Thomas Dalton thomas.dal...@gmail.com wrote: The responsibilities of the Secretary and Treasurer are board responsibilities. While the day-to-day work of the role may be delegated to

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Lodewijk
Hi Bishakha, 2012/11/2 Bishakha Datta bishakhada...@gmail.com On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 4:53 PM, Lodewijk lodew...@effeietsanders.org wrote: Dear Bishakha, could you please elaborate why the board has chosen for a secretive amendment procedure here, rather than sharing the proposed

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Samuel Klein
It's a good idea to make prep materials available a week in advance, to the community as to the board. Exceptions can be made for any materials that are sensitive in nature. I can think of only one or two examples from the past few meetings. Much of the material is published afterwards anyway.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Thehelpfulone
On 2 November 2012 16:06, Bishakha Datta bishakhada...@gmail.com wrote: Ok, I've added a reference link into the resolution at: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Resolution:Amended_Bylaws Please go through this to compare old and revised versions of the bylaws; since there are many small

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread phoebe ayers
On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 10:35 AM, Lodewijk lodew...@effeietsanders.org wrote: I don't see how this validates the fact that you did not consult the community on these changes. If the changes are fairly trivial and legalistic, then the community will likely have little objection. But as you

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Alice Wiegand
Hi Phoebe, thank you for your thoughts. I must admit that I don't remember these discussions and yes, I understand the frustration even more with this background. Like Bishakha and Sam I will support to publish as much information as possible before our meetings. I agree that this issue would have

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Nathan
While I'm sure most readers understand these principles well already, they are worth restating: the Foundation is not a wiki. It is not purely a democracy. Greater democracy has not, to my knowledge, been shown to correspond with greater effectiveness in non-profit management. The WMF is not a

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Federico Leva (Nemo)
Bishakha Datta, 02/11/2012 17:08: On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 9:31 PM, Benjamin Lees wrote: This doesn't seem too unreasonable in itself, but it is somewhat surprising that you didn't readjust the board's composition accordingly. The justification for having unelected seats is to ensure that the

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board resolutions on bylaw amendments and appointment of Foundation staff officers

2012-11-02 Thread Samuel Klein
On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 6:46 PM, MZMcBride z...@mzmcbride.com wrote: My apologies. I read your previous suggestion during the travel guide discussion and the only real route for communicating with a Board member to solicit a proposal seemed to me to be private user-to-user e-mail. Are there