Re: [Wikimedia-l] Any studies on economic impact of community-produced open data?

2012-06-03 Thread Fred Bauder
We are serving up our product at cost. That we might, by rent seeking, charge a much higher price is due more to the geometry of possible rent seeking opportunities than to economic factors. Rent seeking, or profits, is an optional cost imposed by political decision. This situation can exist

Re: [Wikimedia-l] crazy deletionists!

2012-07-03 Thread Fred Bauder
I think that is a very dismissive misreading of the discussion. Some people have it in their heads that appears in reliable sources equates to article-worthiness, but the problem here is that the doings of celebrities is covered in excruciating detial by the media, including what tey eat,

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Russian Wikipedia goes on strike

2012-07-11 Thread Fred Bauder
Try http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/jul/10/russian-wikipedia-shut-down-protest?INTCMP=SRCH It is quite possible, as in China, political censorship is the actual purpose, and pornography, and whatever, is just the excuse. Fred On 11/07/12 09:40, Milos Rancic wrote: Yep, I forgot it. BTW,

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Russian Wikipedia goes on strike

2012-07-18 Thread Fred Bauder
On Wed, Jul 18, 2012 at 1:47 PM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: But that is not all. The most important issue is extremism. According to the bill, the materials, that are banned for distribution in Russia should be included to the register of banned information on the ground

Re: [Wikimedia-l] In the News

2012-08-10 Thread Fred Bauder
Folks, if this has already been brought to the List, please excuse the repetition. If not, enjoy; http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/08/09/romneys-running-mate-some-say- wikipedia-holds-the-answer/?nl=usemc=edit_cn_20120810 Marc Riddell They probably got that out of Wikipedia, see

Re: [Wikimedia-l] CNET News: Corruption in Wikiland? Paid PR scandal erupts at Wikipedia

2012-09-18 Thread Fred Bauder
Spotted this in my news feed, http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57514677-93/corruption-in-wikiland-paid-pr-scandal-erupts-at-wikipedia/ sincerely, Kim Bruning http://untrikiwiki.com/ Max Klein's wiki editing business His blog response:

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Russian Wikipedia goes on strike

2012-09-19 Thread Fred Bauder
Well, the new law is now being considered for application to block YouTube in Russia. Make of that, what you will. http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-19648808 Jussi-Ville Heiskanen, ~ [[User:Cimon Avaro]] I have never understood anyone who thinks that showing contempt for the Prophet

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Editor retention (was Re: Big data benefits and limitations (relevance: WMF editor engagement, fundraising, and HR practices))

2013-01-04 Thread Fred Bauder
On 4 January 2013 13:03, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: With respect to welcoming and assisting new users on the English Wikipedia where there is a bewildering volume of varied activity by new and experienced users it might be helpful if we had a recent changes options that showed

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Editor retention (was Re: Big data benefits and limitations (relevance: WMF editor engagement, fundraising, and HR practices))

2013-01-04 Thread Fred Bauder
, compliment, or otherwise assist the new user. Obviously access to such a recent changes option by those looking for trouble could also be used in ways that would discourage the new user. Perhaps access could be limited to only flagged newbie helpers. Fred Bauder

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Editor retention (was Re: Big data benefits and limitations (relevance: WMF editor engagement, fundraising, and HR practices))

2013-01-08 Thread Fred Bauder
It's the worst kept secret in the world that you can hire people to decode your captchas -- http://decaptcha.biz/ for example. Better captchas don't work because you are competing against people and if people can't solve the captcha ... Middle name of Jimmy Wales has worked well for me.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Editor retention (was Re: Big data benefits and limitations (relevance: WMF editor engagement, fundraising, and HR practices))

2013-01-09 Thread Fred Bauder
On 09/01/13 10:03, Kim Bruning wrote: On Wed, Jan 09, 2013 at 07:45:41AM +, David Gerard wrote: Right. So anyone in this thread going into detail about en:wp policies is actually not addressing this, and the problem is on a higher level? :-/ Back to the drawing board. That actually

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Editor retention (was Re: Big data benefits and limitations (relevance: WMF editor engagement, fundraising, and HR practices))

2013-01-14 Thread Fred Bauder
Socialization is usually best achieved through rewards rather than through punishments. The principle reward is a sense of achievement when good editing is done or good administrative work done. In the case of editing the reward, absent trouble, is instantaneous as your work is published. Fred

Re: [Wikimedia-l] COI versus OUTING

2013-01-21 Thread Fred Bauder
: edits containing personal identifying information may be deleted or suppressed under our policies and can be retrieved later only under the terms of a court order, so, obviously, get them before they are hidden. Fred Bauder ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The Church of Reason

2013-02-20 Thread Fred Bauder
The primary goal of the Church of Reason, Phaedrus said, is always Socrates's old goal of truth, in its ever-changing forms, as it is revealed by the process of rationality. I'm sorry, but that ship sailed long ago. Wikipedia is compendium of information published in reliable sources. You

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Lessig on Aaron's laws

2013-03-12 Thread Fred Bauder
Le 2013-03-11 11:45, Andrea Zanni a écrit : I feel obliged to remind you of this splendid talk from Lessig on Aaaron's Laws. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embeddedv=9HAw1i4gOU4 Here you can find the transcript (with slides and everything)

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Proposal to use the internal wiki more

2013-04-03 Thread Fred Bauder
for closing both the internal wiki and the internal mailing list: IMO there's nothing on either that needs to be confidential. Thanks, Sue Yes, our work needs to be pubic and accessible. Fred Bauder USA ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l

Re: [Wikimedia-l] French intelligency agency forces removal of a Wikipedia article

2013-04-05 Thread Fred Bauder
Hard to know what was involved from the information you provide. The problem is there is classified information that amounts to nothing and then there is classified information release of which can cause serious damage. Defiance will eventually result in serious trouble. Not that we should knuckle

Re: [Wikimedia-l] French intelligency agency forces removal of a Wikipedia article

2013-04-05 Thread Fred Bauder
, Apr 5, 2013 at 10:52 AM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: Hard to know what was involved from the information you provide. The problem is there is classified information that amounts to nothing and then there is classified information release of which can cause serious damage. Defiance

Re: [Wikimedia-l] French intelligency agency forces removal of a Wikipedia article

2013-04-05 Thread Fred Bauder
for a distance. It's got a civilian radio/TV tower colocated with it. I can't see what would be sensitive in the article.. On Fri, Apr 5, 2013 at 12:12 PM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: Typical. They were not willing to tell our legal counsel why or what was classified; she

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The value of Wikipedia for the economy

2013-04-08 Thread Fred Bauder
The value would be obvious if Wikipedia were a for profit company listed on the stock markets. Not that it would have a real value identical to a computation based on imagined advertising revenue. It is in the billions though. Fred Hi all, Last weekend we had a discussion about how to 'sell'

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The value of Wikipedia for the economy

2013-04-08 Thread Fred Bauder
If the internet could be sold at auction giving the buyer an exclusive permanent monopoly to license all internet activity what would it sell for? Fred The Economist had an estimate recently:

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The value of Wikipedia for the economy

2013-04-08 Thread Fred Bauder
Don't worry. Any one who has thought about this sort of thing much has come away more puzzled than when they began. What for example is the value of a cigarette? The price is rather easy. Fred (sorry, this came off a bit too sharp :) Thanks for all the input, anything is better than nothing

Re: [Wikimedia-l] French intelligency agency forces removal of a Wikipedia article

2013-04-08 Thread Fred Bauder
...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Apr 7, 2013 at 3:32 PM, Romaine Wiki romaine_w...@yahoo.com wrote: On Fri, 5 Apr 2013 12:31:29, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: I can't see what would be sensitive in the article.. I think that the existence of the article is considered too sensitive

Re: [Wikimedia-l] French intelligency agency forces removal of a Wikipedia article

2013-04-08 Thread Fred Bauder
Weapons design is obvious; however much intelligence is about rather ordinary military capability and deployment. We seem to be doing poorly, from the intelligence standpoint responsibly, regarding laser weapons, the next big thing I don't think much has been published in public reliable sources,

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The case for supporting open source machine translation

2013-04-24 Thread Fred Bauder
This is closely tied to software which is being developed, some of it secretly, to enable machines to understand and use language. As of now this will be government and corporate owned and controlled. I say closely tied because that is how translation works; only someone or something that

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Human-assisted machine translation (it was: The case for supporting open source machine translation)

2013-05-01 Thread Fred Bauder
All European languages, with the exception of Basque, are essentially one language with different vocabulary. MT should generally work, but needs help as the example shows. The big, and perhaps insurmountable, problem comes with trying to use it with say, Hopi, which assigns meanings in a wholly

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Russian Wikipedia in blacklist trouble again

2013-05-09 Thread Fred Bauder
On 9 May 2013 12:19, Anthony Cole ahcole...@gmail.com wrote: In your hypothetical case of Russian only being spoken in one country that censors how to smoke marijuana information: If you insist on leaving a paragraph on how to make a bong in the Russian-language Marijuana smoking article,

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Russian Wikipedia in blacklist trouble again

2013-05-09 Thread Fred Bauder
On 05/09/2013 07:19 AM, Anthony Cole wrote: We would be failing in our mission to disseminate educational information effectively and globally if, due to an ideological attachment to NOTCENSORED, we took the former option. You're saying this as though those things were orthogonal to each

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Russian Wikipedia in blacklist trouble again

2013-05-09 Thread Fred Bauder
I've also done a great deal of editing of Tibetan articles. I wish there was a way to transport you back in time to old Tibet. Fred Highlighting the fact that such an old hand was making a rookie-like mistake was actually, y'know, the point. From: dger...@gmail.com Date: Thu, 9 May 2013

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Patience

2013-05-15 Thread Fred Bauder
Florence, I agree with you almost completely, but I would also note that it is also partially about the user's thought processes and business norms that determine how fast it is. My employer, for instance, has a wiki that's meant to be a collaborative resource where disparate elements from

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Patience

2013-05-15 Thread Fred Bauder
We could create a Facebook page, Wikipedia Chill, where only positive interactions are permitted... Only half joking here. We can consciously design interactions in terms of their emotional tenor should we chose to. In an example taken from life, we can keep vicious dogs for the effect they have

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Patience

2013-05-16 Thread Fred Bauder
I agree that patience is a very important virtue in some situations, such as when we coach newbies or seek consensus among many people. But it's sometimes not a virtue, such as in many crisis situations. As a metrics and performance enthusiast, I feel that it's possible to have an appropriate

Re: [Wikimedia-l] evaluation of electronics articles

2013-05-28 Thread Fred Bauder
I think that is a pretty good analysis of the entire project. It is directly related to lack of editorial control and the impossibility of being able to assign writers to problem areas. Fred I ran across this paragraph in the preface to O'Reilly's new book Encyclopedia of Electronic

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Somebody Will

2013-06-03 Thread Fred Bauder
Also, classic Marxism. Draw your own conclusions and parallels as you see fit. Oh, didn't know if anyone else would see that: http://en.communpedia.org/Lyrics:Somebody_Will Fred ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Somebody Will

2013-06-04 Thread Fred Bauder
By the way, is there a license attached to this song, or is it bare copyright? Copyright Sassafrass As it is a song there are special rules for commercial performances, like if you cover it. Cover means sing a song you did no write yourself like on a recording. Fred On Mon, Jun 3, 2013 at

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-09 Thread Fred Bauder
All edits and other actions are archived, but I would think there would be zero interest or utility to NSA. I would simply ignore the matter. Fred This is a simple question with a potentially very complicated answer. What, if any, are the implications of the PRISM scandal for Wikimedia?

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-10 Thread Fred Bauder
help put at ease people worries :) -- Christophe On 10 June 2013 03:34, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: All edits and other actions are archived, but I would think there would be zero interest or utility to NSA. I would simply ignore the matter. Fred This is a simple question

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-10 Thread Fred Bauder
There is plenty of reason to think the government would be interested in Wikipedia access logs. On the other hand, there's very little reason to believe an organization when they say they haven't been turning over information under a top secret order which they're not allowed to tell anyone

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-10 Thread Fred Bauder
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 6:10 AM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: Everything passing over the internet is archived. Nearly everything done at Wikipedia passes over the internet. Encrypted, if you're using https everywhere (and Wikipedia hasn't intentionally or unintentionally

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-10 Thread Fred Bauder
They tap directly into the internet backbone. Only if there is some particular matter which interests them which they would need our help to decipher would they contact the Foundation. There are a few things out there that I can imagine them being interested in, but very few. For example, there

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-10 Thread Fred Bauder
You are right, Anthony, never assume you're not dealing with idiots. If NSA is doing doing detailed surveillance of Tea Party activists or defense lawyers we are truly well along the road to hell. Fred On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 6:21 AM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: Correct

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-10 Thread Fred Bauder
National Security Letters have been served on Libraries. However, as we keep no track whatever off who is reading the site; it is hard to see how serving one on us would accomplish anything; we can't produce records we don't keep. I suppose a secret court order could be applied for which would

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-10 Thread Fred Bauder
It would be good *if* the WMF can provide assurances to editors that they havent received any national security letters or other 'trawling' requests from any U.S. agency. If the WMF has received zero such requests, can the WMF say that? There wouldn't be any gag order.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-10 Thread Fred Bauder
Forwarded to legal at wikimedia.org Fred I think the key here is not to keep more information about users than necessary. Of course, there is the question of if the NSA asks for our checkuser data. I am relatively confident of WMF's honesty here. They have been pretty concerned about

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-10 Thread Fred Bauder
They tap directly into the internet backbone. Only if there is some particular matter which interests them which they would need our help to decipher would they contact the Foundation. There are a few things out there that I can imagine them being interested in, but very few. For example, there

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-10 Thread Fred Bauder
David Gerard wrote: On 10 June 2013 18:01, Rand McRanderson therands...@gmail.com wrote: I think the key here is not to keep more information about users than necessary. In particular - at present. as I understand it, we don't keep full access logs, just 1/1000 samples. We need to not keep

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-11 Thread Fred Bauder
Le 2013-06-10 14:29, Craig Franklin a écrit : If the NSA, CIA, or some other spook agency is getting information off of Wikimedia servers, they don't have a CU account or anything like that. They'd have a program running at the operating system level that extracts the data in a

[Wikimedia-l] Some Unanswered Questions

2013-06-11 Thread Fred Bauder
We can guess, of course, and some of us are very good guessers, but here: http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=5-basic-unknowns-nsa-black-hole-prism Fred ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe:

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-12 Thread Fred Bauder
Le 2013-06-11 14:09, Fred Bauder a écrit : There will always be humans maintaining the system who must, in order to do their work, have potential access to everything. A potential access to everything is a so vast and vague assertion that it practicaly denote nothing. Also, one could come

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-13 Thread Fred Bauder
Fred Bauder, 12/06/2013 22:47: We hack network backbones – like huge internet routers, basically – that give us access to the communications of hundreds of thousands of computers without having to hack every single one, http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/12/edward-snowden-us

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-13 Thread Fred Bauder
I would like to raise the option of a more Wikipedia-like protest. How about, on the English Wikipedia, picking one day to make the Main Page topic-specific, similar to the traditional April 1 selection? Candidates, off the top of my hat: [[NSA]] / [[Black Chamber]] [[PRISM (surveillance

[Wikimedia-l] [Fwd: You've been sent an invitation to read content on GovInfoSecurity.com]

2013-06-14 Thread Fred Bauder
- Fred Bauder has requested you read content on GovInfoSecurity.com: Comments: Title: IT Tools Available to Stop NSA-Type Leaks Link: http://www.govinfosecurity.com/tools-available-to-stop-nsa-type-leaks-a-5826 Thank You, GovInfoSecurity.com Admin Team

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-15 Thread Fred Bauder
On Fri, Jun 14, 2013 at 3:33 PM, Andy Mabbett a...@pigsonthewing.org.ukwrote: PRISM From @ShammaBoyarin on Twitter: Its not as if the NSA were mass downloading articles from JSTOR. Certainly if the evidence showed that the NSA were breaking into wiring closets and hacking into computer

Re: [Wikimedia-l] PRISM

2013-06-15 Thread Fred Bauder
On Sat, Jun 15, 2013 at 10:16 AM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.netwrote: (Yes, you can speculate that they're probably doing this too, but this particular scandal is the NSA getting information from computer networks with the permission of the computer owners, not despite the owners

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikimedia Announcements] PRISM, government surveillance, and Wikimedia: Request for community feedback

2013-06-15 Thread Fred Bauder
The reporting in the UK is that it is aimed at 'foreigners'. I think that is us! Of course that may be for domestic US consumption. Yes, the thing is, we are an international organization, and, frankly, we don't vet people politically before they can create an account or edit. Our trust system

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Tapping into the Backbone

2013-06-22 Thread Fred Bauder
or ever used or how is another matter. Fred Op zaterdag 22 juni 2013 schreef Fred Bauder (fredb...@fairpoint.net) het volgende: The GCHQ mass tapping operation has been built up over five years by attaching intercept probes to transatlantic fibre-optic cables where they land on British shores

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Tapping into the Backbone

2013-06-22 Thread Fred Bauder
would be of interest to an intelligence agencies focused on actual threats. Fred Where is that question in this topic? Huib Op zaterdag 22 juni 2013 schreef Fred Bauder (fredb...@fairpoint.net) het volgende: Can you please stop spamming Us With topics like this? Its not Wikimedia related

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [tangential] Why voting is evil

2013-07-01 Thread Fred Bauder
Rick Falkvinge has been writing a book, Swarmwise, on how the Pirate Party organised. He's been posting it a chapter at a time to his blog. You know how Wikipedia/Wikimedia has (or had) the meme that voting is evil? This sets out why.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Russian Wikipedia in trouble /yet/ again

2013-07-09 Thread Fred Bauder
I don't get it. I was able to use a Wikipedia link to find a place to download The Searchers, a John Ford film starring John Wayne in about 30 seconds. How is that not theft that we are facilitating? Fred Hi there, two months after the smoking cannabis controversy, the Russian Wikipedia is

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Russian Wikipedia in trouble /yet/ again

2013-07-09 Thread Fred Bauder
On 07/09/2013 08:37 PM, Fred Bauder wrote: How is that not theft that we are facilitating? Because theft, is to deprive, temporarily or absolutely, the owner of it, or a person who has a special property or interest in it, of the thing or of his property or interest in it. In some

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Russian Wikipedia in trouble /yet/ again

2013-07-09 Thread Fred Bauder
On 9 July 2013 23:46, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: Well, not wanting to wade into that pirates' little helpers snarkiness, but it takes 30 seconds from anywhere on the web to find a copyright violation. Maybe a bit longer if you have a slow connection. Risker True

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Russian Wikipedia in trouble /yet/ again

2013-07-09 Thread Fred Bauder
- Original Message - From: Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net To: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 4:36 AM Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Russian Wikipedia in trouble /yet/ again On 07/09/2013 08:37 PM, Fred Bauder wrote: How

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Russian Wikipedia in trouble /yet/ again

2013-07-10 Thread Fred Bauder
If you post a creative work on a website the purpose which is to share files you have assumed the rights of the owner, one of which is to determine the conditions which must be met to view or listen to the work. The owner can give his work away to the world but not third parties. Fred

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The soft underbelly of the WP: the sponsored private fiefdoms that thrive in the blind spots

2013-07-23 Thread Fred Bauder
I just checked the archives. The original message was not received by the mailing list, for whatever reason, probably misaddressed. This message of inquiry is the first message in the tread. I think you should resend the original message if your mail program permits that. Sounds interesting...

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The soft underbelly of the WP: the sponsored private fiefdoms that thrive in the blind spots

2013-07-23 Thread Fred Bauder
I just checked the archives. The original message was not received by the mailing list, for whatever reason, probably misaddressed. This message of inquiry is the first message in the tread. I think you should resend the original message if your mail program permits that. Sounds interesting...

[Wikimedia-l] Resend: The soft underbelly of the WP: the sponsored private fiefdoms that thrive in the blind spots

2013-07-23 Thread Fred Bauder
Resent so I have an original copy to reply to. Dear All It is certainly not news that a lot of deliberately biased editing goes on on the Wikipedia. It is equally known that there are mechanims to address these issues. But that is where the problem lies - those intent on skewing information

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Resend: The soft underbelly of the WP: the sponsored private fiefdoms that thrive in the blind spots

2013-07-23 Thread Fred Bauder
I use Flickr as an example, but is it not the firwst time that I have come across this type of behaviour. And so, tiny cliques and coteries flourish like fiefdoms in the blind spots of the mechanisms created to ensure that we all strive for the same principes. What is worse, there are big

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Resend: The soft underbelly of the WP: the sponsored private fiefdoms that thrive in the blind spots

2013-07-23 Thread Fred Bauder
A case in point, the other day I was looking for images of mosquitos sucking blood and and came across blatant pornography on Flickr. I added a few lines about pornography on Flickr and because it was reverted Rui Correia. The Flickr images you linked to, if it was you, were the sort one

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Resend: The soft underbelly of the WP: the sponsored private fiefdoms that thrive in the blind spots

2013-07-23 Thread Fred Bauder
It is this that is tarnishing the name of the Wikipedia and driving away good editors. Rui Correia. When the going gets tough the tough get going. They don't throw their hands up, vainly protest, then give up. Possible conflict of interest is a legitimate concern; however, it is not a

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The soft underbelly of the WP: the sponsored private fiefdoms that thrive in the blind spots

2013-07-23 Thread Fred Bauder
On 07/23/2013 02:03 PM, Todd Allen wrote: I don't think such a proposal would be hopeless on en. How did dewiki circumvent the difficulties regarding attribution and role accounts? Last I checked, our terms of use prohibit password sharing, and IIRC Mike Godwin (legal counsel at the time)

Re: [Wikimedia-l] The soft underbelly of the WP: the sponsored private fiefdoms that thrive in the blind spots

2013-07-23 Thread Fred Bauder
Thanks Andreas Iit didn't cross my mind that you would actually go and check - at the time the search terms were in Portuguese, so you will probably find different results - If I find the original pic I will send it to you. But more importantly, the porn on Flickr is a secondary issue -

[Wikimedia-l] Progress...

2013-07-26 Thread Fred Bauder
As with other inventions that produced an inferior product at a much lower price, from the printing press to the steam-driven loom to Wikipedia, what happens now is largely in the hands of the people experimenting with the new tools, rather than defending themselves from them.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Progress...

2013-07-26 Thread Fred Bauder
On Fri, Jul 26, 2013 at 1:48 PM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: As with other inventions that produced an inferior product at a much lower price, from the printing press to the steam-driven loom to Wikipedia, what happens now is largely in the hands of the people experimenting

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Progress...

2013-07-26 Thread Fred Bauder
on a machine loom compares remotely with Navajo weaving. Fred On 26 July 2013 13:48, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: As with other inventions that produced an inferior product at a much lower price, from the printing press to the steam-driven loom to Wikipedia, what happens now

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Let's have the courage to sit down and talk about VisualEditor

2013-07-30 Thread Fred Bauder
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:13 AM, David Gerard dger...@gmail.com wrote: de:wp convinced you. What would it take to convince you on en:wp? (I'm asking for a clear objective criterion here. If you can only offer a subjective one, please explain how de:wp convinced you when en:wp hasn't.)

[Wikimedia-l] NSA

2013-07-31 Thread Fred Bauder
See attachment. http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/jul/31/nsa-top-secret-program-online-data Fred___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,

Re: [Wikimedia-l] NSA

2013-07-31 Thread Fred Bauder
See attachment. http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/jul/31/nsa-top-secret-program-online-data the NSA has created a multi-tiered system that allows analysts to store interesting content in other databases, such as one named Pinwale which can store material for up to five years. Fred

Re: [Wikimedia-l] NSA

2013-07-31 Thread Fred Bauder
is this related to the foundation? On Wed, Jul 31, 2013 at 9:22 PM, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: See attachment. http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/jul/31/nsa-top-secret-program-online-data Fred ___ Wikimedia

Re: [Wikimedia-l] NSA

2013-07-31 Thread Fred Bauder
I think it's more reasonable to assume that Wikipedia (which shares many features with Google, Yahoo, Twitter, Facebook and other social networks) has been the subject of this kind of demand than that it hasn't. No one with direct knowledge would be able to do anything other than deny it, but

Re: [Wikimedia-l] NSA

2013-07-31 Thread Fred Bauder
I think it's more reasonable to assume that Wikipedia (which shares many features with Google, Yahoo, Twitter, Facebook and other social networks) has been the subject of this kind of demand than that it hasn't. No one with direct knowledge would be able to do anything other than deny it, but we

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Why the WP will never be a real encyclopaedia

2013-08-01 Thread Fred Bauder
Dear Colleagues at the Foundation I just came across an artecle called White Africans of European ancestry. What is that even supposed to mean? Who would be any other white people if not of Europen ancestry? The Ainu people, not that it matters. Fred

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Block evasion might be a federal offense

2013-08-19 Thread Fred Bauder
http://feedly.com/k/14WeLcY I wish I was grossly misrepresenting the situation here. If I am, please do set me straight. You're not wrong, but getting the attention of a federal prosecutor would be easier for jaywalking in a National Park. It applies only to extreme situations. Fred

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Block evasion might be a federal offense

2013-08-21 Thread Fred Bauder
On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 4:09 AM, Peter Gervai grin...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Aug 21, 2013 at 9:37 AM, Martijn Hoekstra martijnhoeks...@gmail.com wrote: On Aug 21, 2013 8:56 AM, Peter Gervai grin...@gmail.com wrote: The account and/or underlying IP is blocked. That is the technical

[Wikimedia-l] A Survey on Science Reporting

2013-08-21 Thread Fred Bauder
If you write or add to articles based on journal articles you might complete this survey: https://lsucommunications.qualtrics.com/SE/?SID=SV_0PTVlA7OUCLqkyV Fred ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Unsubscribe:

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimedia and the politics of encryption

2013-09-03 Thread Fred Bauder
to observe the effect of focusing on past outrages on public morale, but that is their burden to bear not ours to share. Fred Hoi, Fred, what is different in your scenario from what happens in the USA ? Thanks, GerardM On 3 September 2013 00:23, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimedia and the politics of encryption

2013-09-03 Thread Fred Bauder
that it is based in the US is incidental. Thanks, GerardM On 3 September 2013 14:36, Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net wrote: Any censor from the United States or European governments that works directly with us (I have no personal knowledge of this, I just know it has to be) is concerned

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimedia and the politics of encryption

2013-09-03 Thread Fred Bauder
I guess emergencies should not go to legal as there may be a considerable delay. Fred Are there more successful attempts? It would be difficult to enumerate successful attempts since, by definition, they would have been successful at not being known. :-) -- Marc I once suppressed

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikimedia and the politics of encryption

2013-09-03 Thread Fred Bauder
Are there more successful attempts? It would be difficult to enumerate successful attempts since, by definition, they would have been successful at not being known. :-) -- Marc I once suppressed information about a troop movement underway in Iraq after a request. Troop movements are

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself

2013-09-05 Thread Fred Bauder
That was the purpose of the original arbitration committee. Finding a mentor is kind of hard nowdays as there are so many users who might help but probably will not. On the other hand, many requests I have received and looked into are from people who are making trouble themselves; sometimes very

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself

2013-09-05 Thread Fred Bauder
That's Sweden all right, it's like a small town. Thousands of administrators from scores of countries is another matter. Even requests for administration is very difficult as, unless you do big time research, or spend your life monitoring others edits and activity, you just don't know much. Voting

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself

2013-09-05 Thread Fred Bauder
For a serious discussion to happen you will need to disclose some examples. The next step is to move beyond anecdote to see if there is a general problem. The particular incident Rui brought up has been pretty much explained, but the question remains about have a new or casual editor who commits

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself

2013-09-05 Thread Fred Bauder
folks alike, and that everybody shall be able to contribute on equal conditions, a more realistic organization to protect the users must be put in place. Regards Lars Gardenius Von: Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself

2013-09-05 Thread Fred Bauder
Yes, that is pretty much the situation. The howls of outraged anguish from those who were not able to dictate (really bad) content or practices form the core of our organized opposition. That does not mean systemic deficiencies don't exist; just that we must look and think in a noisy environment.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself

2013-09-05 Thread Fred Bauder
OP = original poster, Rui Sorry but I don't what/who OP is. And you still misunderstand. This is not a question about consensus over some article, it is about normal human behaviour, and that it sometimes is not there. If you haven't seen that happening I don't know where you have been

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself

2013-09-05 Thread Fred Bauder
that responsibility nor that power. regards, Lars Gardenius Von: Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org Gesendet: 18:44 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013 Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself

2013-09-05 Thread Fred Bauder
Gardenius Von: Fred Bauder fredb...@fairpoint.net An: Wikimedia Mailing List wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org CC: wikie...@lists.wikimedia.org Gesendet: 13:28 Donnerstag, 5.September 2013 Betreff: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Please, let's save the Wikipedia - from itself

2013-09-05 Thread Fred Bauder
No thank you, I do not have a dispute; you do; please follow the dispute resolution procedure. Fred Hi Tom Thanks for your contribution. However, you seem to have missed the point. So Lisa violates the 3RR principle and you lecture me. And I lodge a complaint over the 3RR and that gets

Re: [Wikimedia-l] : WMF resolution on neutral point of view

2013-09-16 Thread Fred Bauder
Hi all, I realize Resolution:Biographies of living people[1] implies this but I fail to see any resolution that establishes neutral point of view as one of our non-negotiable values. I think there is merit in having an over-arching resolution on a Neutral Point of View policy. I also

Re: [Wikimedia-l] : WMF resolution on neutral point of view

2013-09-17 Thread Fred Bauder
I am not disputing how settled it is but I don't think meta sufficiently achieves expressing how settled this core value really is. As you stated it would be more of a restatement and re-emphasis of what already is a core value. -- とある白い猫 (To Aru Shiroi Neko) Yes, good idea,

Re: [Wikimedia-l] : WMF resolution on neutral point of view

2013-10-02 Thread Fred Bauder
On Wed, Oct 2, 2013 at 11:53 PM, Asaf Bartov abar...@wikimedia.org wrote: ... I, for one, share your perception that NPOV is a problem on some (perhaps most) Wikipedias, asaf, could you please elaborate a little bit what you mean by this? do you not share the experience that the editors

  1   2   >