Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thoughts on the rebranding initiative: "Movement"

2020-06-22 Thread Eduardo Testart
Paul,

From everything I read in discussions and emails, I believe this
distinction between community and movement, makes sense, and... maybe
hasn't been raised before? If it has been, please excuse me, and point me
where :].  I do not know the practical applications that can derive from
it, but I think it adds, at least, a constructive layer for discussion. In
this sense, I consider this observation somewhat refreshing.


Cheers!

On Mon, Jun 22, 2020 at 2:02 AM Paul J. Weiss  wrote:

> [From my comments in the rebranding survey]
>
> "Movement"
>
> Please stop calling us a "movement". I am an active Wikipedia contributor,
> but I do not feel part of a movement. Know that I feel excluded when we are
> referred to as a movement. I would guess that most Wikimedians do not
> consider themselves part of a movement. I feel that I am part of the
> Wikimedia _community_.
>
> Note that in the English Wikipedia the title of the relevant article is
> indeed "Wikipedia community", _not_ "Wikipedia movement" (which is a
> redirect). In fact, the word "movement" does not appear in the main text of
> the article at all. "Wikimedia movement" is the title of its article, but
> it is described as "the global community of contributors to Wikimedia
> Foundation projects". A community of contributors is not the same thing as
> a movement. I would say that none of the definitions given in the
> Definitions section of the Social movement article apply to us.
>
> One significant problem to using "movement" is that some, including the
> WMF, exploit the connotations of the word towards social justice, or a
> "greater good", as a rationalization for behaviors that a community might
> not support (and in many cases our community has indeed opposed WMF's
> behavior). Another is the implication that there is basically a core set of
> beliefs and priorities that all those involved support. This is clearly not
> the case in the Wikimedia community. I also think there is an assumption
> that in a movement, there are institutions that those in the movement
> explicitly or implicitly authorize to speak for them. Again, clearly this
> is not the case in the Wikimedia community overall.
>
> Paul Weiss
> User:Libcub
> ___
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-- 
Eduardo Testart
(56)(98) 293 5278 Móvil
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Thoughts on the rebranding initiative: "Movement"

2020-06-22 Thread Gerard Meijssen
Hoi,
It is abundantly clear that some identify only by their community. It is
abundantly clear that people in some communities do not recognise shared
values like "sharing in the sum of all knowledge".

It is also clear that the Wikimedia Foundation is not bound by what some in
a community insist on. It is exactly what was foreseen when the WMF was
incorporated. It is also why the WMF does not need to agree with what some
in a community express.
Thanks,
 GerardM

On Mon, 22 Jun 2020 at 08:02, Paul J. Weiss  wrote:

> [From my comments in the rebranding survey]
>
> "Movement"
>
> Please stop calling us a "movement". I am an active Wikipedia contributor,
> but I do not feel part of a movement. Know that I feel excluded when we are
> referred to as a movement. I would guess that most Wikimedians do not
> consider themselves part of a movement. I feel that I am part of the
> Wikimedia _community_.
>
> Note that in the English Wikipedia the title of the relevant article is
> indeed "Wikipedia community", _not_ "Wikipedia movement" (which is a
> redirect). In fact, the word "movement" does not appear in the main text of
> the article at all. "Wikimedia movement" is the title of its article, but
> it is described as "the global community of contributors to Wikimedia
> Foundation projects". A community of contributors is not the same thing as
> a movement. I would say that none of the definitions given in the
> Definitions section of the Social movement article apply to us.
>
> One significant problem to using "movement" is that some, including the
> WMF, exploit the connotations of the word towards social justice, or a
> "greater good", as a rationalization for behaviors that a community might
> not support (and in many cases our community has indeed opposed WMF's
> behavior). Another is the implication that there is basically a core set of
> beliefs and priorities that all those involved support. This is clearly not
> the case in the Wikimedia community. I also think there is an assumption
> that in a movement, there are institutions that those in the movement
> explicitly or implicitly authorize to speak for them. Again, clearly this
> is not the case in the Wikimedia community overall.
>
> Paul Weiss
> User:Libcub
> ___
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> 
___
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