Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-15 Thread Orderinchaos78
Indeed, they're totally voluntary to start with, and private messages or
group notices from them are unobtrusive.

2009/1/15 Gnangarra gnanga...@gmail.com

 One does kinda expect to get spammed from facebook groups occassionally

 2009/1/15 Orderinchaos78 orderinchao...@gmail.com

 Yeah I don't see any harm in using the Facebook group.

 2009/1/15 Charles Gregory wikimediaau.li...@chuq.net

 It also just occurred to me the Wikimedia Australia group on facebook is
 another avenue - the membership of the group currently sits at 48, which
 would be close the number of actual financial members WMAU has - but there
 wouldn't be 100% overlap - we may be able to catch a few more along the
 way.  Anyway, it is another avenue to publicise our activities.  It may even
 be a good idea to send a general summary update anyway, perhaps encouraging
 them to join as financial members?

 Regards,

 Charles




 On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 9:01 PM, Lloyd Nguyen zero1...@gmail.comwrote:

 Strike out the spam option and that sounds good. Even if it's a good
 intention that's never a good way to go about it.

 2009/1/14 Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com:
  3) Depending on the number of available spots left we: headhunt
 specific
  Sydney Wikipedians on the Sydney-WIkipedian's category (a ask your
 friends
  approach); We spam on the talkpages of those listed in the
  sydney-wikipedian's category; We advertise in the Wikiproject
 Australia
  noticeboard (and/or similar).
 

 --
 Always here,
 Lloyd Nguyen
 zero1328

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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-14 Thread Lloyd Nguyen
Strike out the spam option and that sounds good. Even if it's a good
intention that's never a good way to go about it.

2009/1/14 Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com:
 3) Depending on the number of available spots left we: headhunt specific
 Sydney Wikipedians on the Sydney-WIkipedian's category (a ask your friends
 approach); We spam on the talkpages of those listed in the
 sydney-wikipedian's category; We advertise in the Wikiproject Australia
 noticeboard (and/or similar).


-- 
Always here,
Lloyd Nguyen
zero1328

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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-14 Thread Charles Gregory
It also just occurred to me the Wikimedia Australia group on facebook is
another avenue - the membership of the group currently sits at 48, which
would be close the number of actual financial members WMAU has - but there
wouldn't be 100% overlap - we may be able to catch a few more along the
way.  Anyway, it is another avenue to publicise our activities.  It may even
be a good idea to send a general summary update anyway, perhaps encouraging
them to join as financial members?

Regards,

Charles



On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 9:01 PM, Lloyd Nguyen zero1...@gmail.com wrote:

 Strike out the spam option and that sounds good. Even if it's a good
 intention that's never a good way to go about it.

 2009/1/14 Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com:
  3) Depending on the number of available spots left we: headhunt specific
  Sydney Wikipedians on the Sydney-WIkipedian's category (a ask your
 friends
  approach); We spam on the talkpages of those listed in the
  sydney-wikipedian's category; We advertise in the Wikiproject Australia
  noticeboard (and/or similar).
 

 --
 Always here,
 Lloyd Nguyen
 zero1328

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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-14 Thread Orderinchaos78
Yeah I don't see any harm in using the Facebook group.

2009/1/15 Charles Gregory wikimediaau.li...@chuq.net

 It also just occurred to me the Wikimedia Australia group on facebook is
 another avenue - the membership of the group currently sits at 48, which
 would be close the number of actual financial members WMAU has - but there
 wouldn't be 100% overlap - we may be able to catch a few more along the
 way.  Anyway, it is another avenue to publicise our activities.  It may even
 be a good idea to send a general summary update anyway, perhaps encouraging
 them to join as financial members?

 Regards,

 Charles




 On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 9:01 PM, Lloyd Nguyen zero1...@gmail.com wrote:

 Strike out the spam option and that sounds good. Even if it's a good
 intention that's never a good way to go about it.

 2009/1/14 Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com:
  3) Depending on the number of available spots left we: headhunt specific
  Sydney Wikipedians on the Sydney-WIkipedian's category (a ask your
 friends
  approach); We spam on the talkpages of those listed in the
  sydney-wikipedian's category; We advertise in the Wikiproject Australia
  noticeboard (and/or similar).
 

 --
 Always here,
 Lloyd Nguyen
 zero1328

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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-14 Thread Gnangarra
One does kinda expect to get spammed from facebook groups occassionally

2009/1/15 Orderinchaos78 orderinchao...@gmail.com

 Yeah I don't see any harm in using the Facebook group.

 2009/1/15 Charles Gregory wikimediaau.li...@chuq.net

 It also just occurred to me the Wikimedia Australia group on facebook is
 another avenue - the membership of the group currently sits at 48, which
 would be close the number of actual financial members WMAU has - but there
 wouldn't be 100% overlap - we may be able to catch a few more along the
 way.  Anyway, it is another avenue to publicise our activities.  It may even
 be a good idea to send a general summary update anyway, perhaps encouraging
 them to join as financial members?

 Regards,

 Charles




 On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 9:01 PM, Lloyd Nguyen zero1...@gmail.com wrote:

 Strike out the spam option and that sounds good. Even if it's a good
 intention that's never a good way to go about it.

 2009/1/14 Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com:
  3) Depending on the number of available spots left we: headhunt
 specific
  Sydney Wikipedians on the Sydney-WIkipedian's category (a ask your
 friends
  approach); We spam on the talkpages of those listed in the
  sydney-wikipedian's category; We advertise in the Wikiproject Australia
  noticeboard (and/or similar).
 

 --
 Always here,
 Lloyd Nguyen
 zero1328

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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-13 Thread Nick Jenkins
  2) The attendance. They can only take 20 people. As there needs to be 1
  curator per 10 people in the non-public areas and they will be providing 2
  curators = max.20 people. I suggest that paid-up members of WM-AU be given
  preference by way of encouraging membership. But nevertheless, it would be
  strongly advisable if we headhunt good content writers (rather than just
  gnomes like myself) to come along even if they're not WM-AU members (yet).
 
 Thanks for your work in organising this.

Kudos for getting this to happen!

 How can we attract people who
 don't usually come to meetups? I expect embarrassingly few will turn
 up if we can't do this.

Yes, my concern too. Thoughts on how to increase turn-out:

== Tell them ==
* We spam everyone in
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Wikipedians_in_Sydney 
, all ~231 of them, via their talk page, notifying them about this event
for Wikipedians in Sydney, and we invite them to bring extra people
along.
* Put it on the Australian Wikipedian's noticeboard.

Let's assume that gets us 7 people.

== Outreach to related communities ==

There are plenty of people that are likely to be interested in this
and/or sympathetic to the aim, many of whom are not on this mailing list
or in Category:Wikipedians_in_Sydney.

Suggestions:
* We tell flickr people, and ask for their expertise with taking
excellent photos. I have no idea how to reach flickr people in Sydney.
Do they congregate somewhere / hang out somewhere / have a mailing list?
* As above for Creative Commons people?
* We tell Linux people - I can blog about it and get it on Planet Slug
( http://planet.slug.org.au/ ), it could also go on Linux Australia's
planet ( http://planet.linux.org.au/ )  [would need to ask for them to
pick up a feed].
* Teachers who are teaching the wikipedia module? To give them a dry run
before school starts with editing and collaboration? Or a class that's
taking this module (has it started yet?)
* Anyone else we're missing? 

Let's assume we do the above, and that gets us 7 more people.

== Maybe add a sweetener? ==

The sweetener doesn't have to be huge or cost a lot, but some sweeteners
that have worked in the past are:
* Come to this meetup and sweetnersay hi to Jimbo/sweetner got ~20
people
* Come to wiki wednesday, discuss wikis, and sweetnerdrink some free
beer and eat some free pizza/sweetner, gets about 35 people.

I don't know what might work... coke and pizza? wikipedia stickers?
lamingtons! :-) We don't have to do it, and if we do then whatever it
is, it should definitely be inexpensive and be something that encourages
socialisation.

Let's assume that gets us 6 more people.

== Exclusivity ==

People like most the things that are hard or impossible to get - so we
emphasise the private-tour backstage-pass element of this, we emphasise
that this has never been done like this before, and we emphasise that
it's first-come first-serve, and we emphasise that if you're too late to
sign up then **tough luck!**

Let's assume we do the above, and that gets us 7 more people.

== Overbooking ==

Airlines do it regularly (5 to 15% over capacity), and you have to pay
for seats, and _still_ people don't turn up. How many people are going
to sign up for something that's free and then not go on the day? So
maybe we over-book - we say we have 25 places, or maybe even 30 places,
when really we have 20. 

Let's assume we lose 7 people on the day due to slackness or inertia.


So basically even if we do all of the above, we'll probably get about 7
+7+6+7-7 = 20 people.

That's my guess anyway.

 My vote is for the 27th.

Me too - personal order of preference is the 27th, then 13th, then 20th,
and can't do the 6th.

-- All the best,
Nick.


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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-13 Thread Lloyd Nguyen
2009/1/13 Nick Jenkins nic...@gmail.com:
 People like most the things that are hard or impossible to get - so we
 emphasise the private-tour backstage-pass element of this, we emphasise
 that this has never been done like this before, and we emphasise that
 it's first-come first-serve, and we emphasise that if you're too late to
 sign up then **tough luck!**


I'm thinking that this fact alone will be way, way more than enough
incentive for people to come along. You'll become a piece of Wiki
history, maybe get a nice photo with the folks, and an awesome story
to talk/gloat about to your peers. If I had some extra money, I myself
wouldn't hesitate going down there, even though I'm a fairly inactive
gnome. All we have to do is spread the word around, and get their
names on a list or something.

Also, whether or not there's a fair number of interested people, I'd
suggest visiting/researching the museum exhibits independently, to
find subjects to look further into. Getting an idea of what's there
beforehand might make the thing go more smoothly, as well as know what
related articles to look into, and in turn, finding editors who have
attached themselves to specific articles, to help spread/sort the
information later on.

-- 
Always here,
Lloyd Nguyen
zero1328

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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-13 Thread Liam Wyatt
 How can we attract people who
 don't usually come to meetups? I expect embarrassingly few will turn
 up if we can't do this.

 Yes, my concern too. Thoughts on how to increase turn-out:

 == Tell them ==
 * We spam everyone in
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Wikipedians_in_Sydney
 , all ~231 of them, via their talk page, notifying them about this  
 event
 for Wikipedians in Sydney,

This I what I was expecting we would do - once the Membership of WM- 
AU have had a chance to settle on a date.

 * Put it on the Australian Wikipedian's noticeboard.
Yep. Even if they can't come because it's full or they're not in the  
city, it makes them more aware of WM-AU as a real entity and  
encourages them to join up in the future. So, it needn't be a we  
need more people notice, but more of a what your chapter is doing  
for you, FYI.


 == Outreach to related communities ==
I really don't think we'll need to go beyond our immediate contacts  
for this one. 20 people will fill up faster that you expect I believe.

 == Maybe add a sweetener? ==

I'm pretty sure there's enough sweetener in this already! :-) WM-AU  
doesn't have any merch of its own as yet...
But did I mention that Powerhouse wants to put their marketing people  
on to this and try to get this event mentioned in the papers/radio  
the next day...? Sweet enough yet?

 == Exclusivity ==

This, I expect will be a major drawcard factor, and something that is  
implicit in the name of the event.

 Let's assume we do the above, and that gets us 7 more people.

 == Overbooking ==

Hmm... not sure, I don't want to second guess a system that has never  
been tested yet.


 So basically even if we do all of the above, we'll probably get  
 about 7
 +7+6+7-7 = 20 people.

 That's my guess anyway.

 -- All the best,
 Nick.

In conclusion - I think we'll get our 20 quick-smart. The trick is  
not so much finding 20 people who are willing to get access to  
Powerhouse for free, but more a question of finding 20 people who  
will repay the Powerhouse's generosity with some effort on WP.  
Remember - this is not just a free-ride, we have to put back too...  
*This will be the trick to making this successful and getting the  
Powerhouse to recommend us to other institutions in the future.* This  
is our job interview.

-Liam
[[user:witty lama]]


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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-13 Thread Orderinchaos78
For this sort of stuff noone should ever be afraid of using WP:AWNB on en.
It's not a terribly busy board, and it's got the content side of the
readers. If it's something really big, make a note on WT:AUS linking back to
the AWNB post. Is there an Australian commons community as well btw?

(I realise the en regulars already know all this but just for those who
aren't)

2009/1/13 Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com

  How can we attract people who
  don't usually come to meetups? I expect embarrassingly few will turn
  up if we can't do this.
 
  Yes, my concern too. Thoughts on how to increase turn-out:
 
  == Tell them ==
  * We spam everyone in
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Wikipedians_in_Sydney
  , all ~231 of them, via their talk page, notifying them about this
  event
  for Wikipedians in Sydney,

 This I what I was expecting we would do - once the Membership of WM-
 AU have had a chance to settle on a date.

  * Put it on the Australian Wikipedian's noticeboard.
 Yep. Even if they can't come because it's full or they're not in the
 city, it makes them more aware of WM-AU as a real entity and
 encourages them to join up in the future. So, it needn't be a we
 need more people notice, but more of a what your chapter is doing
 for you, FYI.
 
 
  == Outreach to related communities ==
 I really don't think we'll need to go beyond our immediate contacts
 for this one. 20 people will fill up faster that you expect I believe.
 
  == Maybe add a sweetener? ==
 
 I'm pretty sure there's enough sweetener in this already! :-) WM-AU
 doesn't have any merch of its own as yet...
 But did I mention that Powerhouse wants to put their marketing people
 on to this and try to get this event mentioned in the papers/radio
 the next day...? Sweet enough yet?
 
  == Exclusivity ==

 This, I expect will be a major drawcard factor, and something that is
 implicit in the name of the event.
 
  Let's assume we do the above, and that gets us 7 more people.
 
  == Overbooking ==

 Hmm... not sure, I don't want to second guess a system that has never
 been tested yet.
 
 
  So basically even if we do all of the above, we'll probably get
  about 7
  +7+6+7-7 = 20 people.
 
  That's my guess anyway.
 
  -- All the best,
  Nick.

 In conclusion - I think we'll get our 20 quick-smart. The trick is
 not so much finding 20 people who are willing to get access to
 Powerhouse for free, but more a question of finding 20 people who
 will repay the Powerhouse's generosity with some effort on WP.
 Remember - this is not just a free-ride, we have to put back too...
 *This will be the trick to making this successful and getting the
 Powerhouse to recommend us to other institutions in the future.* This
 is our job interview.

 -Liam
 [[user:witty lama]]


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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-13 Thread Gnangarra
Liam

This is wonderful, we can offer to do some image restorations as part of
this to that end I've already approached User:Durova she's done a lot of
restorations of early images many are now FP on both commons and en and is
willing to do a digital restoration of some their images, all thats needs is
a large scan preferably in tif format rather than jpg

Norman Lindsay poster restored example
original --
http://lcweb2.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/h?pp/PPALL:@field(numb...@1(cph+3g12164))

restored version -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Trumpetcallsa.jpg

Then theres this one of Labor members
original -- http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:LabourGroup.jpg
restored version -- http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Labor_1901b.jpg

We can offer more then just writting an article...ultimately even some of
the restorations displayed with a credit to the restorer, Commons and WM-au


2009/1/13 Orderinchaos78 orderinchao...@gmail.com

 For this sort of stuff noone should ever be afraid of using WP:AWNB on en.
 It's not a terribly busy board, and it's got the content side of the
 readers. If it's something really big, make a note on WT:AUS linking back to
 the AWNB post. Is there an Australian commons community as well btw?

 (I realise the en regulars already know all this but just for those who
 aren't)

 2009/1/13 Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com

  How can we attract people who

  don't usually come to meetups? I expect embarrassingly few will turn
  up if we can't do this.
 
  Yes, my concern too. Thoughts on how to increase turn-out:
 
  == Tell them ==
  * We spam everyone in
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Wikipedians_in_Sydney
  , all ~231 of them, via their talk page, notifying them about this
  event
  for Wikipedians in Sydney,

 This I what I was expecting we would do - once the Membership of WM-
 AU have had a chance to settle on a date.

  * Put it on the Australian Wikipedian's noticeboard.
 Yep. Even if they can't come because it's full or they're not in the
 city, it makes them more aware of WM-AU as a real entity and
 encourages them to join up in the future. So, it needn't be a we
 need more people notice, but more of a what your chapter is doing
 for you, FYI.
 
 
  == Outreach to related communities ==
 I really don't think we'll need to go beyond our immediate contacts
 for this one. 20 people will fill up faster that you expect I believe.
 
  == Maybe add a sweetener? ==
 
 I'm pretty sure there's enough sweetener in this already! :-) WM-AU
 doesn't have any merch of its own as yet...
 But did I mention that Powerhouse wants to put their marketing people
 on to this and try to get this event mentioned in the papers/radio
 the next day...? Sweet enough yet?
 
  == Exclusivity ==

 This, I expect will be a major drawcard factor, and something that is
 implicit in the name of the event.
 
  Let's assume we do the above, and that gets us 7 more people.
 
  == Overbooking ==

 Hmm... not sure, I don't want to second guess a system that has never
 been tested yet.
 
 
  So basically even if we do all of the above, we'll probably get
  about 7
  +7+6+7-7 = 20 people.
 
  That's my guess anyway.
 
  -- All the best,
  Nick.

 In conclusion - I think we'll get our 20 quick-smart. The trick is
 not so much finding 20 people who are willing to get access to
 Powerhouse for free, but more a question of finding 20 people who
 will repay the Powerhouse's generosity with some effort on WP.
 Remember - this is not just a free-ride, we have to put back too...
 *This will be the trick to making this successful and getting the
 Powerhouse to recommend us to other institutions in the future.* This
 is our job interview.

 -Liam
 [[user:witty lama]]


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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-13 Thread Gnangarra
A notice at WP:AWNB is ok but targeting individuals isnt a good idea

2009/1/14 Nick Perkins superni...@gmail.com

 I would recommend caution with spamming Sydney Wikipedians.

 I remember in recent past where someone spammed Wikipedians who were
 listed as supporting WMAU letting them know some important information and
 community reaction was mixed. Perhaps having notices up in the usual
 places would be good.

 For the future, a WMAU newsletter or similar could be organised to contain
 this kind of information. A bot account could be set up to post this out to
 subscribers on a fairly regular basis. There are a few Australian bot
 runners who might be able to assist with that.

 Nick

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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-13 Thread Charles Gregory
If those people have voluntarily listed themselves as supporting WMAU,
surely a note on their talk page stating that the AGM has occurred and the
result of it (new committee) wouldn't hurt - as well as a link to futher
details on current activities - the PHM, Canberra convention, etc.

Regards,

Charles


2009/1/14 Orderinchaos78 orderinchao...@gmail.com

 I would agree with Gnangarra and Nick on this. The last time upset quite a
 few people and hampered our recruitment efforts.

 2009/1/14 Gnangarra gnanga...@gmail.com

 A notice at WP:AWNB is ok but targeting individuals isnt a good idea

 2009/1/14 Nick Perkins superni...@gmail.com

  I would recommend caution with spamming Sydney Wikipedians.

 I remember in recent past where someone spammed Wikipedians who were
 listed as supporting WMAU letting them know some important information and
 community reaction was mixed. Perhaps having notices up in the usual
 places would be good.

 For the future, a WMAU newsletter or similar could be organised to
 contain this kind of information. A bot account could be set up to post this
 out to subscribers on a fairly regular basis. There are a few Australian bot
 runners who might be able to assist with that.

 Nick

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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-13 Thread Lloyd Nguyen
If you're talking about what I think you're talking about, I believe
that the mixed reaction came when an additional round of notifications
on their talk page was done indiscriminately, on their own volition.
Before that, there was a round of personal emails to people who were
personally supporting WM-AU, and/or were active, and there weren't any
problems. So I think as long as we know what'd going on with doing the
contacting, there shouldn't be a problem.

2009/1/14 Charles Gregory wikimediaau.li...@chuq.net:
 If those people have voluntarily listed themselves as supporting WMAU,
 surely a note on their talk page stating that the AGM has occurred and the
 result of it (new committee) wouldn't hurt - as well as a link to futher
 details on current activities - the PHM, Canberra convention, etc.

 Regards,

 Charles


 2009/1/14 Orderinchaos78 orderinchao...@gmail.com

 I would agree with Gnangarra and Nick on this. The last time upset quite a
 few people and hampered our recruitment efforts.

 2009/1/14 Gnangarra gnanga...@gmail.com

 A notice at WP:AWNB is ok but targeting individuals isnt a good idea

 2009/1/14 Nick Perkins superni...@gmail.com

 I would recommend caution with spamming Sydney Wikipedians.

 I remember in recent past where someone spammed Wikipedians who were
 listed as supporting WMAU letting them know some important information and
 community reaction was mixed. Perhaps having notices up in the usual places
 would be good.

 For the future, a WMAU newsletter or similar could be organised to
 contain this kind of information. A bot account could be set up to post 
 this
 out to subscribers on a fairly regular basis. There are a few Australian 
 bot
 runners who might be able to assist with that.

 Nick
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Always here,
Lloyd Nguyen
zero1328

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Re: [Wikimediaau-l] Backstage Pass event in Sydney

2009-01-13 Thread Liam Wyatt
Yes. And, I really don't think we'll have too much trouble filling 20 spots
for this event.

So, the roll-out plan seems to be (correct me if I'm wrong):

1) People who are WM-AU members sign up to the list on WM-AU wiki noting
their preferred dates. I've already added a couple of other names that have
expressed interest to me personally.

2) We fix a date, in collaboration with the Powerhouse who of course have to
book up their staff. At this point we move the information and signup page
over from WM-AU to Wikipedia.

3) Depending on the number of available spots left we: headhunt specific
Sydney Wikipedians on the Sydney-WIkipedian's category (a ask your friends
approach); We spam on the talkpages of those listed in the
sydney-wikipedian's category; We advertise in the Wikiproject Australia
noticeboard (and/or similar).

This *should* hit the right note of exclusivity (without being
exclusionary) and publication. With the follow-up events that Powerhouse
wish to run - out to their storage facility - their is less of a constraint
so the publicity from the first should hopefully spill over to getting
broader attendance at the second.

On another note, if someone is interested and good at illustrations (I'm
not!) would they like to make the backstage pass programme logo? Mind -
this is not for the powerhouse event, but for the whole concept and could be
used for any subsequent event. I was thinking something based on this image:
* *http://tinyurl.com/9y2jre*

*All the best,
-Liam
[[user:witty lama]]

On 1/14/09, Lloyd Nguyen zero1...@gmail.com wrote:

 If you're talking about what I think you're talking about, I believe
 that the mixed reaction came when an additional round of notifications
 on their talk page was done indiscriminately, on their own volition.
 Before that, there was a round of personal emails to people who were
 personally supporting WM-AU, and/or were active, and there weren't any
 problems. So I think as long as we know what'd going on with doing the
 contacting, there shouldn't be a problem.


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Phone - +61 (0)434 056 914
Skype - Wittylama
Wikipedia - [[User:Witty lama]]
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