DISCLAIMER: My following email is being sent as a volunteer and community member & not as a board member of Wikimedia India.
Dear Manavpreet & other community members I will try my best to answer this question using comparative analysis, why this is happening & will be very informative for you & others.. Who have this query.. & i obviously would want other community members to chip in, in case u miss something out. *CIS-A2K* *Employees : *7 (full time & part time) [I would also like to mention that for administrative work of any organization like Financial audit, bookkeeping & meeting statutory obligations, these 7 team members are not involved & to perform those duties & the team of finance & administration team CIS is involved.So, we can say total. Of 7+4=11 employees] (Reference : https://meta.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/CIS-A2K/Team https://cis-india.org/about/people/our-team) *Funds received from **from WMF for the year 2017-18* : 180,000 ISD (1,20,00,000 INR) (Reference : https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:APG/FDC_recommendations/2016-2017_round_2 ) Note:CIS receives funds from many other donors, but we are talking here specifically of CIS-A2K team, whose annual plan is funded by the APG *Wikimedia India* (WMIN) *Employees : 0* Board members:7 (All Board members are unpaid volunteers who have their own professional lives apart from running the chapter) [I would also like to mention that all these board members are also involved in administrative work of the organization like Financial audit, bookkeeping & meeting statutory obligations & WMIN has no special staff for this] (Reference : http://wiki.wikimedia.in/Executive_Committee_Members) *Funds received from WMF for the year 2017-18 :* 0 INR (I must mention that Board members have applied for Rapid grants from WMF to organise workshops & events) Now, why hasn't Wikimedia India not received funds from WMF & the problems pertaining to that has already been discussed in previous mails & community members, who are curious, can look up the India mailing list archives, but inspite of all adversities, Wikimedia India has a very active board who are managing with whatever little resources the chapter has, using their time & sometimes even their own money to organise events. Manav, I somewhat agree with your point that the chapter is not taking as many initiatives as much as CIS-A2K, to take the movement ahead, & yes to some point, there is a big disconnect between the community & the chapter. But, I see an opportunity here for you & many others who see this problem, and can be very vital to bridge this disconnect & be part of Wikimedia India on an active basis. Now Im sure, you must be thinking , that you are a part of Punjabi User group, that I'm doing well in my user group, why would i want be part of the chapter.... Well i would say that you can be part of a national identity.. Fix the system & take the chapter ahead, as a binding force between the user groups of India. I therefore request you & all others to be part of Wikimedia India on an active basis. Personally, I feel that the Chapter, in entity, truly represents what it means to be a Wikimedian & it is like every Wikimedian around the world, who put in its time & resources to spread the sum of knowledge. Regards, Yohann ------ On Fri 3 Aug, 2018, 16:54 Dr. Manavpreet Kaur, <dr.manavpreetk...@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Asaf, Wikimedia India community members and CIS A2K Team, > > I am sorry for intervening in this whole discussion but I feel the > discussion is deviating from the primary concern as we have received > another mail where a number of concerns have been raised in response to the > primary issue raised by Bodhi. My subscription was faulty and thanks to > Sailesh who fixed it and I got a digest of emails. From what I've learned > through the emails, Wikimedia India representatives are usually sent to > attend the annual wiki gatherings like Wikimedia Conference and this time > it was Wikimania. I am sorry to state that we (community) have never been > approached by anyone from the Chapter to discuss issues, events, Training > or to offer some assistance. We have only one point of contact for all our > issues and plans and that is CIS A2K Team. When Wikimedia India Chapter is > not taking initiatives to bring the communities together or to take the > movement ahead, then what is the purpose of their representatives attending > these events, what do they have to impart to other wikimedians there? and > how are they using the learnings in progressing the movement? > Can someone please clearly address these questions and then we can discuss > the other issues raised in the different thread. > > Regards, > Manavpreet Kaur > > On Fri, 3 Aug 2018 at 3:42 PM, Amritasya Putra < > iamamritasyapu...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Why doesn’t my email reach this list? I have been a member for, like >> three years. >> >> On Fri, 3 Aug 2018 at 10:00 AM, Asaf Bartov <abar...@wikimedia.org> >> wrote: >> >>> Certainly, we can wait. But please understand I did not assert WMIN (or >>> anyone) needs to apologize. Please reread and you'll find I posed it in a >>> conditional, as *one* possible outcome of resolving Bodhisattwa's concern. >>> I also described another possible scenario. >>> >>> A. >>> >>> On Aug 3, 2018 06:21, "Abhinav srivastava" <abhinav...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> Hello Asaf, >>> >>> In consent with my last mail on the thread, please be assured, no >>> discussion whatsoever will take place until WMIN replies to the concerns, >>> the community takes its time to question, inspect and interrogate the >>> matter. Yes, all other issues will be raised on a separate thread and in >>> good spirit only after this matter is resolved. As Subhashish pointed out, >>> the issue is not about one person or an institution but bettering the >>> process. That is essentially the reason they had been brought up. >>> >>> Asaf, It is always nice to hear from you. You have always followed the >>> Indian community closely and helped it in whatever way. We all appreciate >>> that. I would look forward to hearing about the better methodological >>> processes of debates and discussions on resolving community matter. This >>> would also help us in the future course. The Indian community is >>> progressing in resolving its disputes in a peaceful and coherent manner and >>> we wish to learn more of this. >>> >>> In continuity with my second paragraph, it would be great if you guide >>> us on this. This would make the community inclusive and self-sustaining. I >>> am not very happy that when the matter is sub-judice in the people's court, >>> you holding WMF office, is talking about on ways WMIN can apologize. To >>> re-iterate, provide us with methodological solutions and leave the >>> community to decide. >>> >>> Also, I am not sure since you holding WMF office should advise about >>> distractions.concerning the second point clearly deals with conflicts in >>> Wikimedia Foundation policy. Of course, the platform could be a reason and >>> for that, we will make sure we do not jump across topics. In fact, when we >>> move ahead on those issues (only after resolving the principal problem) I >>> would encourage you to be a participant (representing WMF). There are few >>> essentially questions concerning few community members regarding WMF >>> policies which I may share with you personally, whatever you find >>> appropriate can be further asked on the community mailing list. >>> >>> At last, I have spoken to different EC members. Two EC members have also >>> written to me stating that they will reply about WMIN stand. They have >>> assured me that they will reply as soon as possible. As a past EC member, I >>> would like to tell, finalizing a WMIN stand takes some time since EC >>> members need to discuss, deliberate and then provide to their consent. As >>> you all are aware unlike CIS-A2K or WMF, Wikimedia India is a voluntary >>> organization, EC has his/her own personal life (own office work etc), hence >>> at times, it takes some time. However, a reply will follow-up very shortly. >>> >>> To sum up, no more discussions please, let's stick on the principal >>> query, please. >>> >>> Abhinav >>> >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Aug 3, 2018 at 2:33 AM Asaf Bartov <abar...@wikimedia.org> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Folks, >>>> >>>> As an outside observer, may I encourage everyone to try to keep this >>>> one thread about its one, original topic? Abhinav, I found your responses >>>> defensive and distracting -- listing other issues and other groups about >>>> which concerns can be raised is a very poor response to *this* concern >>>> raised on this thread. By all means, raise those concerns if you want to >>>> pursue them (rather than merely use them as distraction on this thread), >>>> *in a separate thread*. >>>> >>>> I encourage the WMIN EC, which is the body accountable to its >>>> membership and to the broader communities in India, to address >>>> Bodhisattwa's concern directly and politely, as befits an organization >>>> aiming to be representative of the entire movement in India. *Please* >>>> don't respond with bluster, nor with [[whataboutism]]. If there was some >>>> poor governance or inappropriate decision-making involved here, just own up >>>> to it, apologize[1], and commit to doing better. Everybody would >>>> appreciate you for doing the right thing. >>>> >>>> If the appearance Bodhisattwa's concern responds to is *incorrect*, by >>>> all means, calmly respond with the facts as they are and demonstrate to the >>>> community that there is nothing to be concerned about. Also reflect on how >>>> that appearance was created despite everything being okay, and what can, >>>> and should, be done to prevent such appearances in the future. Thinking >>>> about this, and sharing your conclusions, would also, I dare say, be >>>> welcomed by the community on this mailing list. >>>> >>>> I look forward to this matter resolving peacefully one way or another, >>>> but please, let us stick to the substance of *this* thread on this thread, >>>> and let us be fair and honest and avoid manipulative arguments and >>>> insinuations. >>>> >>>> Warmly, >>>> >>>> Asaf >>>> >>>> [1] may I humble offer an essay I once wrote on the power of apologies >>>> for our movement? it is here: >>>> >>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/So_you%27ve_made_a_mistake_and_it%27s_public... >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Aug 2, 2018 at 3:01 PM Abhinav srivastava <abhinav...@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hello Bodhisattwa, >>>>> >>>>> The first line of the mail which at 12:02 by Indian Standard Time, you >>>>> stated, "I understand you are felling bad with my tone....I am sorry" . >>>>> >>>>> Apologies for getting this statement wrong, If I have. >>>>> >>>>> I would say, let us first address the point 1 which concerns response >>>>> from WMIN. Other things can be put on *hold* and discussed, >>>>> subsequently. I hope you would be in consent with this. >>>>> >>>>> I have received your mail concerning your Wikimania trip and >>>>> allegations. I would like to re-iterate, neither then nor today, Wikimedia >>>>> India pays any attention to those allegations. To my understanding (since >>>>> I >>>>> am not EC) Wikimedia India continues to have full faith in you. >>>>> >>>>> Rest assured, please be cautious, you are sending a little too many >>>>> emails. I understand at times such issues happen but try and address them >>>>> together. This would otherwise lead to spamming. >>>>> >>>>> Abhinav >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Aug 2, 2018 at 5:15 PM Bodhisattwa Mandal < >>>>> bodhisattwa.rg...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi Abhinav, >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> 1. Now that Bodhisattwa has acknowledged on his inappropriate >>>>>>> tone and it can be believed he would be a caution for future onwards and >>>>>>> since the issue is in public domain, I would urge Wikimedia India to >>>>>>> respond on this. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Sorry missed this part, >>>>>> >>>>>> Where have I acknowledged that my tone was inappropriate? I only said >>>>>> that, if you feel that the tone was not approprate, then I am sorry. To >>>>>> me, >>>>>> my tone and my question are absolutely ok. Along with many others, I have >>>>>> noticed a discrepancy and asked about the reason it in open mailing list, >>>>>> so that everything remains transparent. I had to name the person >>>>>> involved, >>>>>> otherwise the question seemed to be vague and meaningless. Everything I >>>>>> said in my first e-mail was hard fact, almost everyone from India >>>>>> participating in the conference knew about it and had the same question >>>>>> in >>>>>> mind. If my (and others) question is invalid, then why there is no >>>>>> response >>>>>> from WMIN, refuting everything after 6 days? >>>>>> >>>>>> So, instead of diverting the topic, if we stick to and discuss the >>>>>> topic in which the thread was initiated, that would be great. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> Bodhisattwa >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Wikimediaindia-l mailing list >>>>>> Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >>>>>> To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit >>>>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l >>>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Wikimediaindia-l mailing list >>>>> Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >>>>> To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit >>>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Wikimediaindia-l mailing list >>>> Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >>>> To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit >>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wikimediaindia-l mailing list >>> Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >>> To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wikimediaindia-l mailing list >>> Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >>> To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikimediaindia-l mailing list >> Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org >> To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l >> > _______________________________________________ > Wikimediaindia-l mailing list > Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l >
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