Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] How is CIS-A2K eligible to get Annual Plan Grant through FDC?
Hoi, What do you hope to achieve with this legalistic approach ? What is your bias ? Thanks, GerardM On 23 April 2014 15:11, Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.com wrote: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Affiliations_Committee states that The *Affiliations Committee* (formerly known as *Chapters Committee*, colloquially *AffCom*) is a Wikimedia community committeehttp://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:MyLanguage/Wikimedia_Foundation_board_manual#Active_Community_Committeesentrusted with advising the Wikimedia Foundation Board of Trusteeshttp://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:MyLanguage/Wikimedia_Foundation_Board_of_Trusteeson the approval of new movement affiliateshttp://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:MyLanguage/Wikimedia_affiliation_models: national or subnational chapters, thematic organisations and user groups. http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_affiliation_models recognizes only an additional category of affiliation called Movement partners which states that Like-minded organizations that actively support the Wikimedia movement’s work. They are listed publicly and granted limited use of the marks for publicity indicating their support of and collaboration with Wikimedia. Examples for like minded organizations are Mozilla, Creative Commons, WikiEducator, Freenode. A glaring observation about these examples are that they don't get involved with direct Wikimedia content generation work. http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_affiliation_models/Movement_Partners is itself in draft stage yet and there are no known (at least to me) movement partners publicly listed yet. There are no clear guidelines on the nature of work they can do and the extent of funding they can get. There are very clear requirements and application page for chapters, thematic organizations and user groups. Please see the http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requirements_for_future_thematic_organizations In the infobox in the same page, you can see that there are clear and strict guidelines, agreements and requirements that should be met by all such organizations. So, my question is: How is CIS-A2K eligible to get Annual Plan Grant through FDC? What is it's status within the Wikimeda affiliation model? Where are the guidelines, requirements and agreements for that? It is not a joke to be recognized as a movement parter sans any transparency and bottom-up process when other affiliates like chapters and thematic organizations (like Amical Wikimedia) make a very tedious journey to be recognized. If there is no convincing answer for this, CIS-A2K program can only be seen as a proxy program run by WMF to achieve its strategic goals in the region and it has no business doing work that should be done by the WMIN and the respective language communities. Lack of mature regional communities / affiliates is not an excuse to fund unrecognized entities like this. Extensive guidelines should be drafted for movement partners, CIS-A2K should go through the process and then only can it become eligible to apply for next round of funds irrespective of its legacy and history. Thanks, Ravi ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] How is CIS-A2K eligible to get Annual Plan Grant through FDC?
Hoi, As far as I am concerned when the chapter and CIS work together, they will achieve more and bicker less. The more prominent the bickering the stronger will be the urge to cut on funding and to be extra careful when giving additional funding. I am a long time Wikimedian, I have over 300.000 personal edits on Wikidata alone. My dream is to use Wikidata to generate text that can be read in any language. This is not rocket science but it needs the cooperation of people. People that could be you. For me CIS has been important because the support I got from them has given me the stick to get languages supported in Wikidata without any prior localisation. There are two languages I asked it for and one is from India. When I asked for the cooperation of the Tropenmuseum my motivation was that it would make pictures that are in Dutch museums available to people in Indonesia. It did. NB these two languages may be functional next week. When they are it will be REALLY easy to get a foot print in Wikidata and consequently in Reasonator. Reasonator may take some tweaking ... My affiliation is with free knowledge and my aim is to get more of it. CIS has been helpful in this in a practical way. I like to work with people from India and I do so regularly. I like to work with people who make things happen, they are the ones that are important to me. Thanks, GerardM On 23 April 2014 15:43, Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.com wrote: Gerard, I contribute to Tamil Wikimedia movement since 2005. I have made 25000+ edits in total. I serve as bureaucrat and sysop in most of the Tamil Wikimedia projects. I am an ordinary member of WMIN. I have not been in any role with the India chapter. I have hardly written one or two mails there. I have not applied for any jobs with CIS-A2K. You are open to interpret my affiliation and bias with this background info :) Ravi ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] How is CIS-A2K eligible to get Annual Plan Grant through FDC?
To get back to topic and answer the original question, the basis for CIS's eligibility is this WMF Board resolution: https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Resolution:FDC_recognition_for_the_Centre_for_the_Internet_and_Society Best regards, Bence On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 4:11 PM, Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijs...@gmail.com wrote: Hoi, As far as I am concerned when the chapter and CIS work together, they will achieve more and bicker less. The more prominent the bickering the stronger will be the urge to cut on funding and to be extra careful when giving additional funding. I am a long time Wikimedian, I have over 300.000 personal edits on Wikidata alone. My dream is to use Wikidata to generate text that can be read in any language. This is not rocket science but it needs the cooperation of people. People that could be you. For me CIS has been important because the support I got from them has given me the stick to get languages supported in Wikidata without any prior localisation. There are two languages I asked it for and one is from India. When I asked for the cooperation of the Tropenmuseum my motivation was that it would make pictures that are in Dutch museums available to people in Indonesia. It did. NB these two languages may be functional next week. When they are it will be REALLY easy to get a foot print in Wikidata and consequently in Reasonator. Reasonator may take some tweaking ... My affiliation is with free knowledge and my aim is to get more of it. CIS has been helpful in this in a practical way. I like to work with people from India and I do so regularly. I like to work with people who make things happen, they are the ones that are important to me. Thanks, GerardM On 23 April 2014 15:43, Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.com wrote: Gerard, I contribute to Tamil Wikimedia movement since 2005. I have made 25000+ edits in total. I serve as bureaucrat and sysop in most of the Tamil Wikimedia projects. I am an ordinary member of WMIN. I have not been in any role with the India chapter. I have hardly written one or two mails there. I have not applied for any jobs with CIS-A2K. You are open to interpret my affiliation and bias with this background info :) Ravi ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] How is CIS-A2K eligible to get Annual Plan Grant through FDC?
Hoi, Thank you Bence GerardM On 23 April 2014 16:14, Bence Damokos bdamo...@gmail.com wrote: To get back to topic and answer the original question, the basis for CIS's eligibility is this WMF Board resolution: https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Resolution:FDC_recognition_for_the_Centre_for_the_Internet_and_Society Best regards, Bence On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 4:11 PM, Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijs...@gmail.com wrote: Hoi, As far as I am concerned when the chapter and CIS work together, they will achieve more and bicker less. The more prominent the bickering the stronger will be the urge to cut on funding and to be extra careful when giving additional funding. I am a long time Wikimedian, I have over 300.000 personal edits on Wikidata alone. My dream is to use Wikidata to generate text that can be read in any language. This is not rocket science but it needs the cooperation of people. People that could be you. For me CIS has been important because the support I got from them has given me the stick to get languages supported in Wikidata without any prior localisation. There are two languages I asked it for and one is from India. When I asked for the cooperation of the Tropenmuseum my motivation was that it would make pictures that are in Dutch museums available to people in Indonesia. It did. NB these two languages may be functional next week. When they are it will be REALLY easy to get a foot print in Wikidata and consequently in Reasonator. Reasonator may take some tweaking ... My affiliation is with free knowledge and my aim is to get more of it. CIS has been helpful in this in a practical way. I like to work with people from India and I do so regularly. I like to work with people who make things happen, they are the ones that are important to me. Thanks, GerardM On 23 April 2014 15:43, Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.com wrote: Gerard, I contribute to Tamil Wikimedia movement since 2005. I have made 25000+ edits in total. I serve as bureaucrat and sysop in most of the Tamil Wikimedia projects. I am an ordinary member of WMIN. I have not been in any role with the India chapter. I have hardly written one or two mails there. I have not applied for any jobs with CIS-A2K. You are open to interpret my affiliation and bias with this background info :) Ravi ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] How is CIS-A2K eligible to get Annual Plan Grant through FDC?
Gerard, just asking, does there have to be any bias? When I first read Ravi's mail [before bence responded], even I had the same doubt. On 23 April 2014 19:47, Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijs...@gmail.com wrote: Hoi, Thank you Bence GerardM On 23 April 2014 16:14, Bence Damokos bdamo...@gmail.com wrote: To get back to topic and answer the original question, the basis for CIS's eligibility is this WMF Board resolution: https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Resolution:FDC_recognition_for_the_Centre_for_the_Internet_and_Society Best regards, Bence On Wed, Apr 23, 2014 at 4:11 PM, Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijs...@gmail.com wrote: Hoi, As far as I am concerned when the chapter and CIS work together, they will achieve more and bicker less. The more prominent the bickering the stronger will be the urge to cut on funding and to be extra careful when giving additional funding. I am a long time Wikimedian, I have over 300.000 personal edits on Wikidata alone. My dream is to use Wikidata to generate text that can be read in any language. This is not rocket science but it needs the cooperation of people. People that could be you. For me CIS has been important because the support I got from them has given me the stick to get languages supported in Wikidata without any prior localisation. There are two languages I asked it for and one is from India. When I asked for the cooperation of the Tropenmuseum my motivation was that it would make pictures that are in Dutch museums available to people in Indonesia. It did. NB these two languages may be functional next week. When they are it will be REALLY easy to get a foot print in Wikidata and consequently in Reasonator. Reasonator may take some tweaking ... My affiliation is with free knowledge and my aim is to get more of it. CIS has been helpful in this in a practical way. I like to work with people from India and I do so regularly. I like to work with people who make things happen, they are the ones that are important to me. Thanks, GerardM On 23 April 2014 15:43, Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.com wrote: Gerard, I contribute to Tamil Wikimedia movement since 2005. I have made 25000+ edits in total. I serve as bureaucrat and sysop in most of the Tamil Wikimedia projects. I am an ordinary member of WMIN. I have not been in any role with the India chapter. I have hardly written one or two mails there. I have not applied for any jobs with CIS-A2K. You are open to interpret my affiliation and bias with this background info :) Ravi ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l -- Regards, Srikanth Ramakrishnan, What goes around, may not necessarily come around, it may simply bounce back. Please sign this petition for Volvo buses in Coimbatore: https://www.change.org/en-IN/petitions/the-transport-minister-tamil-nadu-introduction-of-volvo-city-buses-in-the-city-of-coimbatore ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] How is CIS-A2K eligible to get Annual Plan Grant through FDC?
Bence, Thanks for the board resolution document. http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:APG/FDC_portal/Eligibility_criteria has 6 requirements and an exception clause that says: In some cases, an exception may be made when an organization is actively working toward meetings these requirements as part of a plan with WMF. However, I assume a WMF board resolution would over rule all these requirements. It is a brilliant plan to create and fund an entity like CIS-A2K (Wikipedia programs) out of nowhere by WMF and then give validity for its own plan by means of board approval. So, the larger global community and the process for recognizing affiliate organizations can be bypassed. The board resolution makes it clear that CIS-A2K is not a recognized movement partner yet. It also makes sense why WMF would hesitate to make the MoU public. Because, it is not a MoU first of all and can only be seen as a service provider agreement in a working relationship. It also makes sense why CIS-A2K would want to consult WMF before providing details about their site visits. // the Wikimedia Foundation (WMF) and the Centre for the Internet and Society (CIS) have engaged in a working relationship// In plainspeak, this is outsourcing and WMF can be held responsible and accountable for all the work done by and through CIS-A2K. CIS-A2K is engaging in paid content generation models and I would welcome WMF's comment on this. See https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants_talk:APG/Proposals/2013-2014_round2/The_Centre_for_Internet_and_Society/Proposal_form#Q15 for context. Their anchor staffs do not have dedicated stand alone user names with CIS-A2K affiliation and it is not clear yet what is the nature of work they undertake in language community programs. https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants_talk:APG/Proposals/2013-2014_round2/The_Centre_for_Internet_and_Society/Proposal_form#Q12 So, what is an edit made during paid time could be misinterpreted for the growth of the community resulting out of their programs. Please note that three of their full time staff are also active community members. If this can be considered paid content generation should be investigated. Especially, for individual engagement grants ( http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IEG#ieg-learn ) it clearly says: Content-creation is not directly funded. Projects should foster conditions that encourage editing by volunteers (e.g. editor recruitment campaigns), not replace volunteer action by funding someone to edit articles, upload photos, etc. //in India since September 1, 2012;// //for the limited term of CIS’ agreement with WMF.// So, can someone clarify what is the end date for this working relationship as per the agreement? Ravi ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] How is CIS-A2K eligible to get Annual Plan Grant through FDC?
Hoi Gerard, This is not a discussion about the usefulness of CIS's work. Most of the Indic Wiki communities till date have only engaged with CIS in good faith. Your comment about WikiData can help at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants_talk:APG/Proposals/2013-2014_round2/The_Centre_for_Internet_and_Society/Proposal_form#Q14 Ravi ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] How is CIS-A2K eligible to get Annual Plan Grant through FDC?
Hoi, I am so in disagreement with you .. If something new has to start and Wikidata is new, then it needs more than just a video or a conference call. I know, I live and breath it, I still discover new opportunities every day. I gave a presentation to professionals who work in data. It took me an hour to set up the environment with them and for them so that they could start.. We had a meeting for three hours and we scratched the surface enough to make a difference. The fact that we were together ensured good faith and enough understanding. Then again, the approach in the questioning of Q14 [1] is such that I find that people assume that they know what the proposal is and, what it aims to achieve. I have seen some of the agenda and if only a fifth of what is started pays of it is well worth the investment. I can also categorically state that the agenda is being worked on for half a year now and preparations have been under way for as long. Just consider what a challenge it is to bring Wikidata to India in a way where it actually makes a difference. It can and it will if only because there is so much to that program. My initial reaction is one of assume good faith.. What I know is that you do not know what is aimed for and I am sure you did not ask. You did not consider how a program can make a difference.. It can when it is has many facets, angles and a chance of making a difference here and there. The question is not can it be a success, but it seems more one of do you want it to be a success. Thanks, GerardM [1] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants_talk:APG/Proposals/2013-2014_round2/The_Centre_for_Internet_and_Society/Proposal_form#Q14 On 23 April 2014 17:27, Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.com wrote: Hoi Gerard, This is not a discussion about the usefulness of CIS's work. Most of the Indic Wiki communities till date have only engaged with CIS in good faith. Your comment about WikiData can help at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants_talk:APG/Proposals/2013-2014_round2/The_Centre_for_Internet_and_Society/Proposal_form#Q14 Ravi ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] How is CIS-A2K eligible to get Annual Plan Grant through FDC?
Gerard, Do not go off-topic. Do not confuse readers. Please. Thanks, On 23 April 2014 22:08, Gerard Meijssen gerard.meijs...@gmail.com wrote: Hoi, I am so in disagreement with you .. If something new has to start and Wikidata is new, then it needs more than just a video or a conference call. I know, I live and breath it, I still discover new opportunities every day. I gave a presentation to professionals who work in data. It took me an hour to set up the environment with them and for them so that they could start.. We had a meeting for three hours and we scratched the surface enough to make a difference. The fact that we were together ensured good faith and enough understanding. Then again, the approach in the questioning of Q14 [1] is such that I find that people assume that they know what the proposal is and, what it aims to achieve. I have seen some of the agenda and if only a fifth of what is started pays of it is well worth the investment. I can also categorically state that the agenda is being worked on for half a year now and preparations have been under way for as long. Just consider what a challenge it is to bring Wikidata to India in a way where it actually makes a difference. It can and it will if only because there is so much to that program. My initial reaction is one of assume good faith.. What I know is that you do not know what is aimed for and I am sure you did not ask. You did not consider how a program can make a difference.. It can when it is has many facets, angles and a chance of making a difference here and there. The question is not can it be a success, but it seems more one of do you want it to be a success. Thanks, GerardM [1] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants_talk:APG/Proposals/2013-2014_round2/The_Centre_for_Internet_and_Society/Proposal_form#Q14 On 23 April 2014 17:27, Ravishankar ravidre...@gmail.com wrote: Hoi Gerard, This is not a discussion about the usefulness of CIS's work. Most of the Indic Wiki communities till date have only engaged with CIS in good faith. Your comment about WikiData can help at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants_talk:APG/Proposals/2013-2014_round2/The_Centre_for_Internet_and_Society/Proposal_form#Q14 Ravi ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l -- Hari Prasad Nadig http://hpnadig.net http://twitter.com/hpnadig http://flickr.com/hpnadig ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] How is CIS-A2K eligible to get Annual Plan Grant through FDC?
Gerard, Let us stick to topic here. I will open another thread where we can discuss about the WikiData Marathon program. Thanks, Ravi ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe from the list / change mailing preferences visit https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
