Re: [Wikitech-l] Recommending Firefox to users using legacy browsers?

2017-08-31 Thread Comet styles 
The recent update of Firefox has made it worse, it basically kills
most of the extensions, deletes your browser bookmark cache and make
nearly all legacy addons useless, so yeah no, unless Firefox stop
making things worse, they should not be the alternative, most would
rather stick with Google Chrome...It has become a danger to even try
to update your browser cause something else breaks after every
update..

On 9/1/17, Legoktm  wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On 08/31/2017 02:20 PM, Fæ wrote:
>> +1 on appearing to be a slippery slope and benefiting from wider,
>> political, discussion.
>
> Just to clarify, I fully plan on turning this into a wider discussion on
> Meta or alternative venue if/when pursuing this further. I was just
> trying to use wikitech-l as a place to gauge initial reactions from.
>
> Where do you think the slippery slope would lead us to? I don't think
> we're ever going to tell our users to start using GNU/Linux or something.
>
>> I've promoted Wikimedia and projects as being deliberately agnostic.
>
> I think we aim for this, but this isn't the actual case when it comes to
> browser support. For some time Chromium users had better load
> performance than Firefox users due to how localStorage was used, and in
> another case Opera 12 users couldn't access some pages with apostrophes
> in them.
>
> In this case, I'm deliberately proposing that we do take a side and
> align ourselves with Mozilla/Firefox. The main takeaway I got from the
> Wikimania session I mentioned earlier was that all of us free software
> and open content projects need to work together and support each other.
>
> We've already seen the open web lose when Mozilla gave into EME, simply
> because it didn't have enough market share to actually make a
> difference[1]. I'm afraid of the future where we no longer have an ally
> who can defend and push the shared Wikimedian ideals in the web browser
> space.
>
>> Strategically, locking Wikimedia into fixed relationships with other
>> organizations with their own drives and timelines, is going to
>> increase risks downstream.
>
> I do agree this adds risks to us, like in terms of public image if
> something bad happens regarding Firefox. But I don't think it should be
> a locked/fixed relationship, it should be something that we can say "no
> this isn't working" and turn off whenever we need to.
>
> [1]
> https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2014/05/14/drm-and-the-challenge-of-serving-users/
>
> -- Legoktm
>
> ___
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> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l


-- 
Cometstyles

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Recommending Firefox to users using legacy browsers?

2017-08-31 Thread Legoktm 
Hi,

On 08/31/2017 02:20 PM, Fæ wrote:
> +1 on appearing to be a slippery slope and benefiting from wider,
> political, discussion.

Just to clarify, I fully plan on turning this into a wider discussion on
Meta or alternative venue if/when pursuing this further. I was just
trying to use wikitech-l as a place to gauge initial reactions from.

Where do you think the slippery slope would lead us to? I don't think
we're ever going to tell our users to start using GNU/Linux or something.

> I've promoted Wikimedia and projects as being deliberately agnostic.

I think we aim for this, but this isn't the actual case when it comes to
browser support. For some time Chromium users had better load
performance than Firefox users due to how localStorage was used, and in
another case Opera 12 users couldn't access some pages with apostrophes
in them.

In this case, I'm deliberately proposing that we do take a side and
align ourselves with Mozilla/Firefox. The main takeaway I got from the
Wikimania session I mentioned earlier was that all of us free software
and open content projects need to work together and support each other.

We've already seen the open web lose when Mozilla gave into EME, simply
because it didn't have enough market share to actually make a
difference[1]. I'm afraid of the future where we no longer have an ally
who can defend and push the shared Wikimedian ideals in the web browser
space.

> Strategically, locking Wikimedia into fixed relationships with other
> organizations with their own drives and timelines, is going to
> increase risks downstream.

I do agree this adds risks to us, like in terms of public image if
something bad happens regarding Firefox. But I don't think it should be
a locked/fixed relationship, it should be something that we can say "no
this isn't working" and turn off whenever we need to.

[1]
https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2014/05/14/drm-and-the-challenge-of-serving-users/

-- Legoktm

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Recommending Firefox to users using legacy browsers?

2017-08-31 Thread Gergo Tisza 
On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 1:37 PM, bawolff  wrote:

> I'm concerned this would be seen as an inapropriate bias.
>

We could send them to something like https://whatbrowser.org/ or
https://browsehappy.com/
Motivating users to update their outdated browsers would definitely be a
good idea. It has the usual problem of notifications though: prompting the
user repeatedly with the same message gets annoying quickly, and we cannot
easily rely on the browser to remember whether it has already seen the
message in the past as the browser could have cookies disabled etc.
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Recommending Firefox to users using legacy browsers?

2017-08-31 Thread Legoktm 
Hi,

On 08/31/2017 01:51 PM, Max Semenik wrote:
> +1 to that. Additionally, the proposed method wouldn't even work because we
> blacklist crappy browsers from receiving JS.

This isn't strictly true, we give legacy browsers some JS to make new
HTML5 elements work using html5shiv[1]. And I think the specific
implementation can be fleshed out a little later, that was just a
concept/idea. :)

[1] https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/369991/

-- Legoktm

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[Wikitech-l] Phabricator monthly statistics - 2017-08

2017-08-31 Thread communitymetrics 

Hi Community Metrics team,

This is your automatic monthly Phabricator statistics mail.

Accounts created in (2017-08): 300
Active Maniphest users (any activity) in (2017-08): 928
Task authors in (2017-08): 519
Users who have closed tasks in (2017-08): 293

Projects which had at least one task moved from one column to another on
their workboard in (2017-08): 317

Tasks created in (2017-08): 2589
Tasks closed in (2017-08): 1882
Open and stalled tasks in total: 35733

Median age in days of open tasks by priority:

Unbreak now: 26
Needs Triage: 303
High: 540
Normal: 747
Low: 997
Lowest: 978

(How long tasks have been open, not how long they have had that priority)

Active Differential users (any activity) in (2017-08): 26

TODO: Numbers which refer to closed tasks might not be correct, as
described in https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T1003 .

Yours sincerely,
Fab Rick Aytor

(via community_metrics.sh on phab1001 at Fri Sep  1 00:00:22 UTC 2017)

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[Wikitech-l] Readers monthly update for August 2017

2017-08-31 Thread Chris Koerner 
Good day,
I'm here again with the monthly update from the Readers department.

As always, feedback and questions are welcome.

== Discussions ==
* Discussion around the mobile app Reading List feature will be
starting soon (Draft). [0]

=== Apps ===
* The Android app rolled out an update with improvements to the
Reading Lists and offline capabilities of the app. [1] [2]
* Android continues work on supporting the ZIM file format to make
offline libraries a built-in part of the app experience. This week we
began user testing with users in India. [3] [4]
* iOS released version 5.6, which included Reading Themes, such as
dark and sepia modes, to make it more personal and comfortable to read
wikipedia, especially at night. The release has been well received,
resulting in our best ever user reviews and prominent featuring by
Apple in the Store, resulting in a 200% increase in downloads. [5]
* iOS also included a pack of Wikipedia themed iMessage stickers. The
stickers themselves are Public Domain and available on Commons, and
hopefully will be popping up on all Wikimedian's social channels soon.
[6]
* Both apps teams are excited by the progress of the ReadingLists
extension, and will be implementing syncing of reading lists for
logged in users as soon as the Extension is fully released!

=== Web ===
* Page previews are now live on all Wikipedias except German and English
* An A/B test for page previews has begun on German and English
Wikipedias as a final feature evaluation prior to release on these
wikis
* A perplexing bug in Firefox caused issues with EventLogging. Wanting
to make sure our logging worked, the deployment of Page Previews was
delayed (but is now back on schedule!) [7]
* We've been continuing work on desktop and mobile PDFs [8] [9]

=== Reading Infrastructure ===
* Wrote Extension:ReadingLists (currently undergoing review) for the
Reading Lists project [10] [11]
* Helped evaluating options for replacing OCG with a more maintainable
system [12]

=== New Readers ===
* New Reader updates can be found at Meta. [13]

=== Multimedia ===
* There was a Structured Data on Commons program offsite following
Wikimania. All of Multimedia was present, along with one or more
members from just about every team involved in the program.
* Consultation around 3D licensing and weaponry model risks continues.
The Multimedia team will be preparing a suggested implementation that
streamlines user prompting, pending design mocks.
* The consultation around enabling the upload of MP3 files to Commons
continues. Commons contributors are encouraged to participate. [14]

=== Discovery ===
The Discovery team provides weekly updates. Here are their updates for
the month of August.
* 2017-08-14 [15]
* 2017-08-21 [16]
* 2017-08-28 [17]


[0] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/CKoerner_(WMF)/Reading_List_Discussion
[1] https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.wikipedia=en
[2] https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/mobile-l/2017-August/010555.html
[3] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T166599
[4] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T167129
[5] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T169142
[6] https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Wikipedia_digital_stickers
[7] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/phame/post/view/61/beacons/
[8] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Reading/Web/PDF_Functionality
[9] 
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Reading/Web/Projects/Print_Styles#Mobile_Printing
[10] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:ReadingLists
[11] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Reading/Reading_Lists
[12] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Offline_content_generator
[13] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/New_Readers/Updates
[14] 
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Village_pump#A_discussion_about_support_for_MP3_on_Commons
[15] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Discovery/Status_updates/2017-08-14
[16] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Discovery/Status_updates/2017-08-21
[17] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Discovery/Status_updates/2017-08-28


---

The archive of all past updates can be found on MediaWiki.org:

https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Reading/Status_updates

Yours,
Chris Koerner
Community Liaison
Wikimedia Foundation

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Recommending Firefox to users using legacy browsers?

2017-08-31 Thread David Gerard 
There's a pile of minor open source browsers too ... maybe redirect to a
page with a list.


- d.

On 31 August 2017 at 22:48, Neil Patel Quinn  wrote:

> Personally (because I have no expertise in thing kind of thing in my WMF
> capacity), I'd very much support this. It *would *be showing a bias towards
> Mozilla and Firefox, but I think it's entirely reasonable for us to be
> biased towards non-profit, open technology. A web with Firefox as a strong
> player is considerably more hospitable to us than one without.
>
> I agree this should be discussed in a wider forum like on Meta, but I look
> forward to supporting it there too :)
>
> On 31 August 2017 at 14:20, Fæ  wrote:
>
> > On 31 August 2017 at 21:37, bawolff  wrote:
> > > On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 8:14 PM, Legoktm 
> > wrote:
> > >> Hello,
> > >>
> > >> This was something that came up during "The Big Open" at Wikimania,
> when
> > >> Katherine Maher talked with Ryan Merkley (CEO of Creative Commons) and
> > >> Mark Surman (ED of Mozilla Foundation). One of the themes mentioned
> was
> > >> that our projects need to work together and support each other.
> > >>
> > >> In that vein, I'm interested in what people think about promoting
> > >> Firefox to users who are using legacy browsers that we don't support
> at
> > >> Grade A (or some other criteria). As part of the "drop IE8 on XP"
> > >> project[1] we're already promoting Firefox as the alternative option.
> I
> > >> was imagining it could be a small and unobtrusive bubble
> > >> notification[2], similar to those that Google pushes Chrome on people
> > with.
> > >>
> > >> If users use modern browsers, they're going to have better security
> > >> support, and most likely a better experience browsing Wikimedia sites
> > >> too. We'd be improving the web by reducing legacy browsers, and
> allowing
> > >> us to move forward with newer technology sooner (ideally).
> > >>
> > >> And we'd be supporting a project that is ideologically aligned with
> us:
> > >> Mozilla.
> > >>
> > >> Thoughts, opinions?
> > >>
> > >> [1] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T147199
> > >> [2] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bubble_notifications
> > >>
> > >> Thanks,
> > >> -- Legoktm
> > >>
> > >> ___
> > >> Wikitech-l mailing list
> > >> Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> > >
> > > I'm concerned this would be seen as an inapropriate bias.
> > >
> > > Suggesting Firefox for IE8 on XP makes sense because it is basically
> > > the only option for that platform that is reasonably secure and not
> > > super obscure. Promoting firefox is general for legacy browsers seems
> > > like a slippery slope to me.
> > >
> > > Additionally, I think this is more a political than a technical
> > > decision, and one that would require consultation with the general
> > > Wikimedia community (e.g. Meta RFC).
> > >
> > > --
> > > Brian
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> > +1 on appearing to be a slippery slope and benefiting from wider,
> > political, discussion.
> >
> > I've promoted Wikimedia and projects as being deliberately agnostic.
> > Strategically, locking Wikimedia into fixed relationships with other
> > organizations with their own drives and timelines, is going to
> > increase risks downstream.
> >
> > Fae
> > --
> > fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
> >
> > ___
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Neil Patel Quinn ,
> product analyst
> Wikimedia Foundation
> ___
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Recommending Firefox to users using legacy browsers?

2017-08-31 Thread Neil Patel Quinn 
Personally (because I have no expertise in thing kind of thing in my WMF
capacity), I'd very much support this. It *would *be showing a bias towards
Mozilla and Firefox, but I think it's entirely reasonable for us to be
biased towards non-profit, open technology. A web with Firefox as a strong
player is considerably more hospitable to us than one without.

I agree this should be discussed in a wider forum like on Meta, but I look
forward to supporting it there too :)

On 31 August 2017 at 14:20, Fæ  wrote:

> On 31 August 2017 at 21:37, bawolff  wrote:
> > On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 8:14 PM, Legoktm 
> wrote:
> >> Hello,
> >>
> >> This was something that came up during "The Big Open" at Wikimania, when
> >> Katherine Maher talked with Ryan Merkley (CEO of Creative Commons) and
> >> Mark Surman (ED of Mozilla Foundation). One of the themes mentioned was
> >> that our projects need to work together and support each other.
> >>
> >> In that vein, I'm interested in what people think about promoting
> >> Firefox to users who are using legacy browsers that we don't support at
> >> Grade A (or some other criteria). As part of the "drop IE8 on XP"
> >> project[1] we're already promoting Firefox as the alternative option. I
> >> was imagining it could be a small and unobtrusive bubble
> >> notification[2], similar to those that Google pushes Chrome on people
> with.
> >>
> >> If users use modern browsers, they're going to have better security
> >> support, and most likely a better experience browsing Wikimedia sites
> >> too. We'd be improving the web by reducing legacy browsers, and allowing
> >> us to move forward with newer technology sooner (ideally).
> >>
> >> And we'd be supporting a project that is ideologically aligned with us:
> >> Mozilla.
> >>
> >> Thoughts, opinions?
> >>
> >> [1] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T147199
> >> [2] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bubble_notifications
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> -- Legoktm
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Wikitech-l mailing list
> >> Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> > I'm concerned this would be seen as an inapropriate bias.
> >
> > Suggesting Firefox for IE8 on XP makes sense because it is basically
> > the only option for that platform that is reasonably secure and not
> > super obscure. Promoting firefox is general for legacy browsers seems
> > like a slippery slope to me.
> >
> > Additionally, I think this is more a political than a technical
> > decision, and one that would require consultation with the general
> > Wikimedia community (e.g. Meta RFC).
> >
> > --
> > Brian
> >
> > ___
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
> +1 on appearing to be a slippery slope and benefiting from wider,
> political, discussion.
>
> I've promoted Wikimedia and projects as being deliberately agnostic.
> Strategically, locking Wikimedia into fixed relationships with other
> organizations with their own drives and timelines, is going to
> increase risks downstream.
>
> Fae
> --
> fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae
>
> ___
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>



-- 
Neil Patel Quinn ,
product analyst
Wikimedia Foundation
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Recommending Firefox to users using legacy browsers?

2017-08-31 Thread Fæ 
On 31 August 2017 at 21:37, bawolff  wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 8:14 PM, Legoktm  wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> This was something that came up during "The Big Open" at Wikimania, when
>> Katherine Maher talked with Ryan Merkley (CEO of Creative Commons) and
>> Mark Surman (ED of Mozilla Foundation). One of the themes mentioned was
>> that our projects need to work together and support each other.
>>
>> In that vein, I'm interested in what people think about promoting
>> Firefox to users who are using legacy browsers that we don't support at
>> Grade A (or some other criteria). As part of the "drop IE8 on XP"
>> project[1] we're already promoting Firefox as the alternative option. I
>> was imagining it could be a small and unobtrusive bubble
>> notification[2], similar to those that Google pushes Chrome on people with.
>>
>> If users use modern browsers, they're going to have better security
>> support, and most likely a better experience browsing Wikimedia sites
>> too. We'd be improving the web by reducing legacy browsers, and allowing
>> us to move forward with newer technology sooner (ideally).
>>
>> And we'd be supporting a project that is ideologically aligned with us:
>> Mozilla.
>>
>> Thoughts, opinions?
>>
>> [1] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T147199
>> [2] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bubble_notifications
>>
>> Thanks,
>> -- Legoktm
>>
>> ___
>> Wikitech-l mailing list
>> Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
> I'm concerned this would be seen as an inapropriate bias.
>
> Suggesting Firefox for IE8 on XP makes sense because it is basically
> the only option for that platform that is reasonably secure and not
> super obscure. Promoting firefox is general for legacy browsers seems
> like a slippery slope to me.
>
> Additionally, I think this is more a political than a technical
> decision, and one that would require consultation with the general
> Wikimedia community (e.g. Meta RFC).
>
> --
> Brian
>
> ___
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

+1 on appearing to be a slippery slope and benefiting from wider,
political, discussion.

I've promoted Wikimedia and projects as being deliberately agnostic.
Strategically, locking Wikimedia into fixed relationships with other
organizations with their own drives and timelines, is going to
increase risks downstream.

Fae
-- 
fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae

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Re: [Wikitech-l] Recommending Firefox to users using legacy browsers?

2017-08-31 Thread Jon Robson 
The best way we can invest in Firefox is via open web technology such as
push notifications imo.

On Thu, 31 Aug 2017 at 16:51 Max Semenik  wrote:

> +1 to that. Additionally, the proposed method wouldn't even work because we
> blacklist crappy browsers from receiving JS.
>
> On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 1:37 PM, bawolff  wrote:
>
> > On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 8:14 PM, Legoktm 
> > wrote:
> > > Hello,
> > >
> > > This was something that came up during "The Big Open" at Wikimania,
> when
> > > Katherine Maher talked with Ryan Merkley (CEO of Creative Commons) and
> > > Mark Surman (ED of Mozilla Foundation). One of the themes mentioned was
> > > that our projects need to work together and support each other.
> > >
> > > In that vein, I'm interested in what people think about promoting
> > > Firefox to users who are using legacy browsers that we don't support at
> > > Grade A (or some other criteria). As part of the "drop IE8 on XP"
> > > project[1] we're already promoting Firefox as the alternative option. I
> > > was imagining it could be a small and unobtrusive bubble
> > > notification[2], similar to those that Google pushes Chrome on people
> > with.
> > >
> > > If users use modern browsers, they're going to have better security
> > > support, and most likely a better experience browsing Wikimedia sites
> > > too. We'd be improving the web by reducing legacy browsers, and
> allowing
> > > us to move forward with newer technology sooner (ideally).
> > >
> > > And we'd be supporting a project that is ideologically aligned with us:
> > > Mozilla.
> > >
> > > Thoughts, opinions?
> > >
> > > [1] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T147199
> > > [2] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bubble_notifications
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > -- Legoktm
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> > I'm concerned this would be seen as an inapropriate bias.
> >
> > Suggesting Firefox for IE8 on XP makes sense because it is basically
> > the only option for that platform that is reasonably secure and not
> > super obscure. Promoting firefox is general for legacy browsers seems
> > like a slippery slope to me.
> >
> > Additionally, I think this is more a political than a technical
> > decision, and one that would require consultation with the general
> > Wikimedia community (e.g. Meta RFC).
> >
> > --
> > Brian
> >
> > ___
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Best regards,
> Max Semenik ([[User:MaxSem]])
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Recommending Firefox to users using legacy browsers?

2017-08-31 Thread Max Semenik 
+1 to that. Additionally, the proposed method wouldn't even work because we
blacklist crappy browsers from receiving JS.

On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 1:37 PM, bawolff  wrote:

> On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 8:14 PM, Legoktm 
> wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > This was something that came up during "The Big Open" at Wikimania, when
> > Katherine Maher talked with Ryan Merkley (CEO of Creative Commons) and
> > Mark Surman (ED of Mozilla Foundation). One of the themes mentioned was
> > that our projects need to work together and support each other.
> >
> > In that vein, I'm interested in what people think about promoting
> > Firefox to users who are using legacy browsers that we don't support at
> > Grade A (or some other criteria). As part of the "drop IE8 on XP"
> > project[1] we're already promoting Firefox as the alternative option. I
> > was imagining it could be a small and unobtrusive bubble
> > notification[2], similar to those that Google pushes Chrome on people
> with.
> >
> > If users use modern browsers, they're going to have better security
> > support, and most likely a better experience browsing Wikimedia sites
> > too. We'd be improving the web by reducing legacy browsers, and allowing
> > us to move forward with newer technology sooner (ideally).
> >
> > And we'd be supporting a project that is ideologically aligned with us:
> > Mozilla.
> >
> > Thoughts, opinions?
> >
> > [1] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T147199
> > [2] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bubble_notifications
> >
> > Thanks,
> > -- Legoktm
> >
> > ___
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
> I'm concerned this would be seen as an inapropriate bias.
>
> Suggesting Firefox for IE8 on XP makes sense because it is basically
> the only option for that platform that is reasonably secure and not
> super obscure. Promoting firefox is general for legacy browsers seems
> like a slippery slope to me.
>
> Additionally, I think this is more a political than a technical
> decision, and one that would require consultation with the general
> Wikimedia community (e.g. Meta RFC).
>
> --
> Brian
>
> ___
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> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>



-- 
Best regards,
Max Semenik ([[User:MaxSem]])
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Re: [Wikitech-l] Recommending Firefox to users using legacy browsers?

2017-08-31 Thread bawolff 
On Thu, Aug 31, 2017 at 8:14 PM, Legoktm  wrote:
> Hello,
>
> This was something that came up during "The Big Open" at Wikimania, when
> Katherine Maher talked with Ryan Merkley (CEO of Creative Commons) and
> Mark Surman (ED of Mozilla Foundation). One of the themes mentioned was
> that our projects need to work together and support each other.
>
> In that vein, I'm interested in what people think about promoting
> Firefox to users who are using legacy browsers that we don't support at
> Grade A (or some other criteria). As part of the "drop IE8 on XP"
> project[1] we're already promoting Firefox as the alternative option. I
> was imagining it could be a small and unobtrusive bubble
> notification[2], similar to those that Google pushes Chrome on people with.
>
> If users use modern browsers, they're going to have better security
> support, and most likely a better experience browsing Wikimedia sites
> too. We'd be improving the web by reducing legacy browsers, and allowing
> us to move forward with newer technology sooner (ideally).
>
> And we'd be supporting a project that is ideologically aligned with us:
> Mozilla.
>
> Thoughts, opinions?
>
> [1] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T147199
> [2] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bubble_notifications
>
> Thanks,
> -- Legoktm
>
> ___
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> Wikitech-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

I'm concerned this would be seen as an inapropriate bias.

Suggesting Firefox for IE8 on XP makes sense because it is basically
the only option for that platform that is reasonably secure and not
super obscure. Promoting firefox is general for legacy browsers seems
like a slippery slope to me.

Additionally, I think this is more a political than a technical
decision, and one that would require consultation with the general
Wikimedia community (e.g. Meta RFC).

--
Brian

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[Wikitech-l] Recommending Firefox to users using legacy browsers?

2017-08-31 Thread Legoktm 
Hello,

This was something that came up during "The Big Open" at Wikimania, when
Katherine Maher talked with Ryan Merkley (CEO of Creative Commons) and
Mark Surman (ED of Mozilla Foundation). One of the themes mentioned was
that our projects need to work together and support each other.

In that vein, I'm interested in what people think about promoting
Firefox to users who are using legacy browsers that we don't support at
Grade A (or some other criteria). As part of the "drop IE8 on XP"
project[1] we're already promoting Firefox as the alternative option. I
was imagining it could be a small and unobtrusive bubble
notification[2], similar to those that Google pushes Chrome on people with.

If users use modern browsers, they're going to have better security
support, and most likely a better experience browsing Wikimedia sites
too. We'd be improving the web by reducing legacy browsers, and allowing
us to move forward with newer technology sooner (ideally).

And we'd be supporting a project that is ideologically aligned with us:
Mozilla.

Thoughts, opinions?

[1] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T147199
[2] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bubble_notifications

Thanks,
-- Legoktm

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[Wikitech-l] Wikilabels incident: Reversed diffs

2017-08-31 Thread Amir Tafreshi 
Hello,
Today, we discovered a major regression in Wikilabels. We've patched the
issue and made an emergency deployment. We also deleted some labels that
were saved while the system was compromised.

Here is the details of of what happened:
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/phame/post/view/69/wikilabels_incident_reversed_diffs/

We're very sorry for this inconvenience,
Yours truly
-- 
Amir Sarabadani Tafreshi
Software Engineer (contractor)
-
Wikimedia Deutschland e.V. | Tempelhofer Ufer 23-24 | 10963 Berlin
http://wikimedia.de
Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e.V.
Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg unter
der Nummer 23855 B. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das Finanzamt für
Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.
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[Wikitech-l] Ganglia deprecation / Authentication will be enabled next Monday

2017-08-31 Thread Moritz Mühlenhoff 
Hi,
for a long time https://ganglia.wikimedia.org has been carrying a note
that Ganglia is deprecated in favour of Grafana
(https://grafana.wikimedia.org).

On next Monday (4th of September) we'll take that deprecation one step
further and move Ganglia behind authentication (the remaining use
cases not covered by Grafana are limited to the fundraising
infrastructure).

Further technical details on the status of the transition can be found at:
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T145659
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T152562

Cheers,
Moritz

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