[WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Keyon Communications
I know they applied for ARRA funds. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:48 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Keyon Communications We were solicited for purchase by this company today. Anyone have anything to share about them? Mark WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
It's the feed that determine the frequency. If there is no markings on it the only reasonable way is to use something like a Bird Site Analyzer to figure out your VSWR on the feed and see where the VSWR and return loss is the best. The dish itself only focus the energy in one particular spot then it's up to the feed to pick out the frequency you are interested in. If it's a grid dish certain spacing between the members are good for certain ranges of frequency but a solid does not have this issue. Polarity comes down to the feed again how it's installed in the dish. By rotating the feed 90deg in the mount will change your polarity. / Eje -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mark McElvy Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 8:43 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
These appear to be Pac Wireless dishes. Is there any instructions on setting the polarity? I seem to remember setting up an new Pac dish and there where instructions showing the polarity setting based on a pin on the feed horn. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Eje Gustafsson Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:08 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency It's the feed that determine the frequency. If there is no markings on it the only reasonable way is to use something like a Bird Site Analyzer to figure out your VSWR on the feed and see where the VSWR and return loss is the best. The dish itself only focus the energy in one particular spot then it's up to the feed to pick out the frequency you are interested in. If it's a grid dish certain spacing between the members are good for certain ranges of frequency but a solid does not have this issue. Polarity comes down to the feed again how it's installed in the dish. By rotating the feed 90deg in the mount will change your polarity. / Eje -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mark McElvy Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 8:43 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
but is that 2' at 2.4 or 5.8? ducks Sent from my iPhone On Oct 21, 2009, at 7:49 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- --- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- --- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- --- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- --- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- --- --- --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- --- --- --- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
Ok, just checking. Good cover...grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:56 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
Diameter is irrelevant and will not tell you frequency. The feed is determine the frequency. If these are Pacific Wireless dishes then they are 5GHz assuming these are solid dishes since Pac never produced a 2.4GHz feedhorn for their solid dishes at least during the 6+ years we been one of their distributors. Only question would be if they are narrow frequency 5GHz or wideband 5GHz feeds. They been selling the wideband feeds for about 2 years now during this time the narrow frequency feeds have not been very popular. But even if they where narrow frequency 5GHz and you used it on the wrong 5Ghz frequency then they would still work except your gain would be down 3-4dB from what they could do. I cannot on top of my head recall how to determine the installed polarity of the feed but will go back to the warehouse to take a quick look to see how the feed needs to be installed for vertical and horizontal since it's impossible to tell by looking at the head of the feed on these dishes. / Eje -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
BTW Mark, if you determine they are PacWireless antennas I'd just punt them on EBay and replace them with RadioWaves or Gabriel 2' antennas. In the long run you'll be a lot happier. Just my opinion... Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:01 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Ok, just checking. Good cover...grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:56 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
Only reason why the feed arm is longer on a higher gain dish or grid is because the grid or dish is larger and the focal point is further away from the dish so the arm has to be longer but that is independent of frequency because the focal point will always be at the same place on the same dish no matter frequency. Think of a dish as a magnifying glass. Depending on the size and shape of the glass you have to hold it so far away to get best magnification. Remember when you where kid and toasted ants with a magnifying glass you had to hold it so far away from the ant to get that really strong white pinpoint on the ant. If you took a different size glass you had to change the distance but the distance was always the same for the one particular glass no matter what kind of light source (sun, light bulb, fluorescent, candle). The same is true with a dish / grid. The size and shape of it determine where all the light (in our case RF) is being strongest bunched up and the frequency is just different light sources. Replace the feed that is designed for a different frequency on the dish/grid and that grid now work on that frequency. But with a grid the higher frequency your wanting to use the closer the spacing between the grid members has to be to be the most efficient. 1 works good for 900 and 2.4 but 0.5 is recommended for 5Ghz or higher. On a solid dish you have no such issues or concerns since it's a perfect mirror. / Eje Dear animal protection activists. No ants where harmed in this telling... ;) -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:56 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List:
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
Assuming they're Pac (not sure how that was determined) You know they are 2.4 or 5Ghz Eje just said: If these are Pacific Wireless dishes then they are 5GHz assuming these are solid dishes since Pac never produced a 2.4GHz feedhorn for their solid dishes at least during the 6+ years we been one of their distributors. Obviously it's 5GHz! Polarity is normally done with an arrow sticker on the base of the feedhorn. Of course if it's been out in the weather it's long gone. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:03 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: BTW Mark, if you determine they are PacWireless antennas I'd just punt them on EBay and replace them with RadioWaves or Gabriel 2' antennas. In the long run you'll be a lot happier. Just my opinion... Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:01 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Ok, just checking. Good cover...grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:56 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
[WISPA] StarOS CBQ
Currently, we have StarOS/WRAP (v2) acting as the AP's on our towers. The CBQ settings are configured to bandwidth shape the customers IP address. I decided it would be better to shape the CPE's IP addy but it doesnt seem to work. The customer gets full throttle unles I shape their addy. The only thing I come up with is that the CPE (Tranzeo bridge) is fooling the CBQ's. Does that make sense of does anyone have any ideas? -RickG WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
I suppose the may not be pacwireless as I have determined they are 2.4 by hooking the up to a CM9 and when ap is in 5.8 I see nothing and when in 2.4 I can see. Now I just need to find 5.8 feedhorns to fit this dish. Mark -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:10 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Assuming they're Pac (not sure how that was determined) You know they are 2.4 or 5Ghz Eje just said: If these are Pacific Wireless dishes then they are 5GHz assuming these are solid dishes since Pac never produced a 2.4GHz feedhorn for their solid dishes at least during the 6+ years we been one of their distributors. Obviously it's 5GHz! Polarity is normally done with an arrow sticker on the base of the feedhorn. Of course if it's been out in the weather it's long gone. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:03 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: BTW Mark, if you determine they are PacWireless antennas I'd just punt them on EBay and replace them with RadioWaves or Gabriel 2' antennas. In the long run you'll be a lot happier. Just my opinion... Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:01 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Ok, just checking. Good cover...grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:56 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
[WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
I decided they are pacwireless based on buying some new dishes several years back and they are built exactly the same. May be a bad assumption. Mark -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:10 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Assuming they're Pac (not sure how that was determined) You know they are 2.4 or 5Ghz Eje just said: If these are Pacific Wireless dishes then they are 5GHz assuming these are solid dishes since Pac never produced a 2.4GHz feedhorn for their solid dishes at least during the 6+ years we been one of their distributors. Obviously it's 5GHz! Polarity is normally done with an arrow sticker on the base of the feedhorn. Of course if it's been out in the weather it's long gone. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:03 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: BTW Mark, if you determine they are PacWireless antennas I'd just punt them on EBay and replace them with RadioWaves or Gabriel 2' antennas. In the long run you'll be a lot happier. Just my opinion... Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:01 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Ok, just checking. Good cover...grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:56 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives:
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
Feed length is based on dish size; where does the parabola focus. Nothing to do with frequency, everything reflects the same. Size of the feed horn isn't always an indicator either. Can depend on a lot of things. Josh Luthman wrote: The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
Are all parabolic grids the same visually? I would expect the mounting hardware to be most distingushable. Do you mean you can NOT depend on a lot of things, Scott? From what I've picked up on this thread is there is no real way to identify a dish nor feedhorn for polarity/frequency. Stickers are a must. Hear that manufacturers? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:30 AM, Scott Reed scottr...@onlyinternet.netwrote: Feed length is based on dish size; where does the parabola focus. Nothing to do with frequency, everything reflects the same. Size of the feed horn isn't always an indicator either. Can depend on a lot of things. Josh Luthman wrote: The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless
Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing.
Scottie, I've had some minor success by talking to a local metal scrap yard. It's a pretty good sized one, they put up a small sign at the pay window saying that if they get any tower sections to not crush or bend them. If they get a get sections they call and I go over. It's usually old American Tower 8 foot sections, like TV tower, but some are pretty useful. They charge usually 30 cents per pound and I pay a few cents over that for good sections in exchange for the sign next to the pay window. A month or so ago they called and I had to go out to a field to look at some that were too big for the metal collector guy to take into the yard. 2 80 foot heavy duty free standing towers in good shape laying in the field all overgrown with weeds. 150 bucks for the pair. Didn't know how much they weighed so I just offered the 150. They will also hold old DirectTV dishs and the J arm mounts for them if the sorters remember. Those are handy to have at 2 bucks each. As long as I pay more than scrap value, they are all over it. They usually have more stuff than I need though. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Cc: motoro...@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. What is a good price to give for a standard Rohn SSV tower, 100' with sections 7N, 6N, 5N, 4N, and 3WN in real good shape, each section still assembled, already down and ready for loading. I priced it new at around $8500. I have looked at www.usedtowers.com, but those are way higher than what I got this one for. I already won it at auction, but just checking to make sure I didn't screw up. Do any of you know where to find used towers besides qth.com, eham.net, ebay, and usedtowers.com? I have a few local places, but I am looking to expand my searches beyond those mentioned and local. TIA, Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS CBQ
The CPE's address on anything I have ever used is for the CPE. Traffic to/from that address is destined for/comes from the CPE. To throttle the customer, you have to do the customer's address(es.) RickG wrote: Currently, we have StarOS/WRAP (v2) acting as the AP's on our towers. The CBQ settings are configured to bandwidth shape the customers IP address. I decided it would be better to shape the CPE's IP addy but it doesnt seem to work. The customer gets full throttle unles I shape their addy. The only thing I come up with is that the CPE (Tranzeo bridge) is fooling the CBQ's. Does that make sense of does anyone have any ideas? -RickG WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.423 / Virus Database: 270.14.24/2449 - Release Date: 10/20/09 18:42:00 -- Scott Reed Sr. Systems Engineer GAB Midwest 1-800-363-1544 x4000 Cell: 260-273-7239 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
The feeds used on the Pac/Laird 2 dishes is 8.5 long from flange to the bottom of the feed. The new wide band feeds are a flat looking disk 5.75 in diameter. http://store.wisp-router.com/customkititems.asp?kc=DA5W%2D29eq=# Shows a picture of the old narrow band feed it's about 2 in diameter. You can see a picture of the wide band feed at http://store.wisp-router.com/customkititems.asp?kc=DA5W%2D32eq= It looks just the same on the 2ft dish even if I linked to the 3ft. If you need a wide band 5Ghz feed for the 2ft dish then this http://store.wisp-router.com/itemdesc.asp?ic=DA5W%2D29%2DFEEDeq=Tp= Should work assuming the length of the arm is correct. (not that the picture is the old style narrow band but the item we have in stock is actually the wideband, guess I need to make sure we get the picture updated for this item). On the wideband if the N-female connector is up/down then you are set for vertical and if the connector is to either side your set for horizontal. On the old style feed the connector is straight back and there should be markings on the base if this marking is up/down your in vertical, side either side it's horizontal. I want to recall it's just a notch or circular depression (do not have any of those feed left so can not verify). / Eje -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mark McElvy Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:22 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency I suppose the may not be pacwireless as I have determined they are 2.4 by hooking the up to a CM9 and when ap is in 5.8 I see nothing and when in 2.4 I can see. Now I just need to find 5.8 feedhorns to fit this dish. Mark -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:10 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Assuming they're Pac (not sure how that was determined) You know they are 2.4 or 5Ghz Eje just said: If these are Pacific Wireless dishes then they are 5GHz assuming these are solid dishes since Pac never produced a 2.4GHz feedhorn for their solid dishes at least during the 6+ years we been one of their distributors. Obviously it's 5GHz! Polarity is normally done with an arrow sticker on the base of the feedhorn. Of course if it's been out in the weather it's long gone. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:03 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: BTW Mark, if you determine they are PacWireless antennas I'd just punt them on EBay and replace them with RadioWaves or Gabriel 2' antennas. In the long run you'll be a lot happier. Just my opinion... Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:01 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Ok, just checking. Good cover...grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:56 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of
Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing.
I have a guy who pays his bill in dish mounts. $2 per mount delivered. We only accept the ones that are clean and reusable. He drops by every couple of weeks with 40-50 of them. Looks like they were removals from Dish/Direct TV. Regards, Chuck Hogg Shelby Broadband 502-722-9292 ch...@shelbybb.com http://www.shelbybb.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Robert West Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 11:36 AM To: sarn...@info-ed.com; 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. Scottie, I've had some minor success by talking to a local metal scrap yard. It's a pretty good sized one, they put up a small sign at the pay window saying that if they get any tower sections to not crush or bend them. If they get a get sections they call and I go over. It's usually old American Tower 8 foot sections, like TV tower, but some are pretty useful. They charge usually 30 cents per pound and I pay a few cents over that for good sections in exchange for the sign next to the pay window. A month or so ago they called and I had to go out to a field to look at some that were too big for the metal collector guy to take into the yard. 2 80 foot heavy duty free standing towers in good shape laying in the field all overgrown with weeds. 150 bucks for the pair. Didn't know how much they weighed so I just offered the 150. They will also hold old DirectTV dishs and the J arm mounts for them if the sorters remember. Those are handy to have at 2 bucks each. As long as I pay more than scrap value, they are all over it. They usually have more stuff than I need though. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Cc: motoro...@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. What is a good price to give for a standard Rohn SSV tower, 100' with sections 7N, 6N, 5N, 4N, and 3WN in real good shape, each section still assembled, already down and ready for loading. I priced it new at around $8500. I have looked at www.usedtowers.com, but those are way higher than what I got this one for. I already won it at auction, but just checking to make sure I didn't screw up. Do any of you know where to find used towers besides qth.com, eham.net, ebay, and usedtowers.com? I have a few local places, but I am looking to expand my searches beyond those mentioned and local. TIA, Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS CBQ
If you use CPE that is a router there is only 1 ip address used but for a CPE bridge you are using 2 ip address's (1 for the CPE and 1 for the customer). This is why you have to use the customer ip on a CPE bridge. LaRoy McCann Data Technology RickG wrote: Currently, we have StarOS/WRAP (v2) acting as the AP's on our towers. The CBQ settings are configured to bandwidth shape the customers IP address. I decided it would be better to shape the CPE's IP addy but it doesnt seem to work. The customer gets full throttle unles I shape their addy. The only thing I come up with is that the CPE (Tranzeo bridge) is fooling the CBQ's. Does that make sense of does anyone have any ideas? -RickG WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by the Data Technology MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing.
Yep, those mounts are handy. Looks like 2 bucks is the going rate! Some of these scrap guys just travel around charging a few bucks to remove old dishs or to take down an old TV tower. 75 bucks to take down an old American Tower isn't bad, then they go get a few bucks when they take it to the metal yard. Hard way to make money, in my opinion. I have one customer who always has to cash in her cans before she pays her bill. I always think, if you have to collect cans all month to pay your internet bill, maybe you should re-think your priorities. But it's not for me to tell her what to do. She is always late! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Chuck Hogg Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 11:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. I have a guy who pays his bill in dish mounts. $2 per mount delivered. We only accept the ones that are clean and reusable. He drops by every couple of weeks with 40-50 of them. Looks like they were removals from Dish/Direct TV. Regards, Chuck Hogg Shelby Broadband 502-722-9292 ch...@shelbybb.com http://www.shelbybb.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Robert West Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 11:36 AM To: sarn...@info-ed.com; 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. Scottie, I've had some minor success by talking to a local metal scrap yard. It's a pretty good sized one, they put up a small sign at the pay window saying that if they get any tower sections to not crush or bend them. If they get a get sections they call and I go over. It's usually old American Tower 8 foot sections, like TV tower, but some are pretty useful. They charge usually 30 cents per pound and I pay a few cents over that for good sections in exchange for the sign next to the pay window. A month or so ago they called and I had to go out to a field to look at some that were too big for the metal collector guy to take into the yard. 2 80 foot heavy duty free standing towers in good shape laying in the field all overgrown with weeds. 150 bucks for the pair. Didn't know how much they weighed so I just offered the 150. They will also hold old DirectTV dishs and the J arm mounts for them if the sorters remember. Those are handy to have at 2 bucks each. As long as I pay more than scrap value, they are all over it. They usually have more stuff than I need though. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Cc: motoro...@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. What is a good price to give for a standard Rohn SSV tower, 100' with sections 7N, 6N, 5N, 4N, and 3WN in real good shape, each section still assembled, already down and ready for loading. I priced it new at around $8500. I have looked at www.usedtowers.com, but those are way higher than what I got this one for. I already won it at auction, but just checking to make sure I didn't screw up. Do any of you know where to find used towers besides qth.com, eham.net, ebay, and usedtowers.com? I have a few local places, but I am looking to expand my searches beyond those mentioned and local. TIA, Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
They are not. Without markings or other things to reference by all you can do is measure current focal length and find a feed that matches that focal length or adjust the new feed to the same focal length because the parabolic curve determines where the focus point is on the dish/grid and different manufactures can have slightly different parabolic curve on theirs but one good thing is that a lot of grids and dishes sold on the market today are sourced from a few true manufactures so brand X dish might be the same as Brand Z the only difference between them is the feed itself where brand X makes their own and Brand Z uses the Chines developed/copied design. Most mfgs have some kind of marking or labeling on them but weather will kill the labeling over time and you have to rely on the markings but to understand the markings one have to know the make which might be as easy to figure out as trying to read the weather beaten label. / Eje -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:33 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Are all parabolic grids the same visually? I would expect the mounting hardware to be most distingushable. Do you mean you can NOT depend on a lot of things, Scott? From what I've picked up on this thread is there is no real way to identify a dish nor feedhorn for polarity/frequency. Stickers are a must. Hear that manufacturers? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:30 AM, Scott Reed scottr...@onlyinternet.netwrote: Feed length is based on dish size; where does the parabola focus. Nothing to do with frequency, everything reflects the same. Size of the feed horn isn't always an indicator either. Can depend on a lot of things. Josh Luthman wrote: The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
Actually they did produce some 2.4GHz feeds but as far as I know they decided not to market them but Pac sourced their solid dishes from China and I know others that sold the same dish but the feeds many times where different and they brought out their own feed for the dish. So it might be same dish but branded different and sold with a 2.4GHz feed as I know there at least used to be others selling 2ft solid dishes with 2.4GHz feeds. But I know few that was interested in paying that much for a solid dish to use as a 2.4GHz backhaul or use a solid dish at a CPE. Most people if they used 2.4GHz for backhauling they where/are to cheap to use a solid dish or 5GHz radios so they all seem to go with cheap grid dishes or panels. / Eje -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:10 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Assuming they're Pac (not sure how that was determined) You know they are 2.4 or 5Ghz Eje just said: If these are Pacific Wireless dishes then they are 5GHz assuming these are solid dishes since Pac never produced a 2.4GHz feedhorn for their solid dishes at least during the 6+ years we been one of their distributors. Obviously it's 5GHz! Polarity is normally done with an arrow sticker on the base of the feedhorn. Of course if it's been out in the weather it's long gone. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:03 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: BTW Mark, if you determine they are PacWireless antennas I'd just punt them on EBay and replace them with RadioWaves or Gabriel 2' antennas. In the long run you'll be a lot happier. Just my opinion... Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:01 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Ok, just checking. Good cover...grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:56 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
Pac uses the same grid, some mount, for 2.4 and 5. Difference is the feed horn. Length of the feedhorn is the same as the focal point of the parabola does not change with frequency. Simple math on that one. The depends comment is that different performance parameters change the size of the feed. For example, Pac uses a 2 or so diameter feed in a 29dB grid and a 6 or so feed in the 2' dish, also about 29dB I believe. Josh Luthman wrote: Are all parabolic grids the same visually? I would expect the mounting hardware to be most distingushable. Do you mean you can NOT depend on a lot of things, Scott? From what I've picked up on this thread is there is no real way to identify a dish nor feedhorn for polarity/frequency. Stickers are a must. Hear that manufacturers? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:30 AM, Scott Reed scottr...@onlyinternet.netwrote: Feed length is based on dish size; where does the parabola focus. Nothing to do with frequency, everything reflects the same. Size of the feed horn isn't always an indicator either. Can depend on a lot of things. Josh Luthman wrote: The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA
[WISPA] choice of upstreams
I'm a GigE circuit to the mix, and I've got a choice of: Abovenet Cogent Global Crossing Level3 Savvis I'm looking for recommendations of who the better upstream is. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Level 3 has been solid for us. On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 12:07 PM, Marco Coelho coelh...@gmail.com wrote: I'm a GigE circuit to the mix, and I've got a choice of: Abovenet Cogent Global Crossing Level3 Savvis I'm looking for recommendations of who the better upstream is. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
I've been a big fan of Level3 but yesterday they had the same issue twice in Atlanta. Massive outage. Can't really say much more then I am disappointed to hear why it happened. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 12:32 PM, can...@believewireless.net p...@believewireless.net wrote: Level 3 has been solid for us. On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 12:07 PM, Marco Coelho coelh...@gmail.com wrote: I'm a GigE circuit to the mix, and I've got a choice of: Abovenet Cogent Global Crossing Level3 Savvis I'm looking for recommendations of who the better upstream is. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Stay far far away from Savvis. They did me VERY dirty on a circuit I needed to move. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Marco Coelho Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 11:07 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] choice of upstreams I'm a GigE circuit to the mix, and I've got a choice of: Abovenet Cogent Global Crossing Level3 Savvis I'm looking for recommendations of who the better upstream is. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
I'll second that. I can't tell you how many pac dishes have either leaked water into the feed or have major problems with icing in the winter. I triple seal everything on my dishes and have had pac grids and solids somehow still get water into the center pin of the connector. I have no idea how it happens, but after about the 20th time, I just plain quit using them. I've never had this trouble on a Gabriel or Radiowaves dish and I apply the same sealing technique. Also, I've noticed in bench testing that that the Gabriel feeds have better SWR plots and provide MUCH better isolation between their dual pol feeds than the PAC. Cameron Brad Belton wrote: BTW Mark, if you determine they are PacWireless antennas I'd just punt them on EBay and replace them with RadioWaves or Gabriel 2' antennas. In the long run you'll be a lot happier. Just my opinion... Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:01 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Ok, just checking. Good cover...grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:56 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/
Re: [WISPA] StarOS CBQ
That is correct, I allocate an IP for the bridge and one for the client. The more I think about it, the more it makes sense. I was just hoping that by slowing down the bridge, they would slow down as well. I'm switching to routers as CPE, so eventually I'll get there. Thanks! -RickG On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Data Technology w...@dtisp.com wrote: If you use CPE that is a router there is only 1 ip address used but for a CPE bridge you are using 2 ip address's (1 for the CPE and 1 for the customer). Â This is why you have to use the customer ip on a CPE bridge. LaRoy McCann Data Technology RickG wrote: Currently, we have StarOS/WRAP (v2) acting as the AP's on our towers. The CBQ settings are configured to bandwidth shape the customers IP address. I decided it would be better to shape the CPE's IP addy but it doesnt seem to work. The customer gets full throttle unles I shape their addy. The only thing I come up with is that the CPE (Tranzeo bridge) is fooling the CBQ's. Does that make sense of does anyone have any ideas? -RickG WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by the Data Technology MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Cogent has a bad rap but they have been solid for us for the past year. Prior to that they had a few hickups. Their peering is pretty good. Low latency to all major content sites. Level3 seems to have more outages than a provider of their reputation should. Savvis is has poor peering from what I hear. I'd like to add Abovenet or Global crossing to my mix. On 10/21/09, Marco Coelho coelh...@gmail.com wrote: I'm a GigE circuit to the mix, and I've got a choice of: Abovenet Cogent Global Crossing Level3 Savvis I'm looking for recommendations of who the better upstream is. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Sent from my mobile device WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Cogent has cheap bandwidth, and its decently peered. Only other one I can comment on is Level3. Here in orlando they have there share of outages/problems, but have good peering. Really, if your looking for a good mix of routes, with cheap bandwidth cogent is the way to go. They do a lot of peering. Nick Olsen Brevard Wireless (321) 205-1100 x106 From: Jon Auer j...@tapodi.net Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 12:58 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams Cogent has a bad rap but they have been solid for us for the past year. Prior to that they had a few hickups. Their peering is pretty good. Low latency to all major content sites. Level3 seems to have more outages than a provider of their reputation should. Savvis is has poor peering from what I hear. I'd like to add Abovenet or Global crossing to my mix. On 10/21/09, Marco Coelho wrote: I'm a GigE circuit to the mix, and I've got a choice of: Abovenet Cogent Global Crossing Level3 Savvis I'm looking for recommendations of who the better upstream is. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Sent from my mobile device WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Choices choices choices.Qwest out here, everything else, you pay Qwest 2x to get to them. 360 Networks is breaking out some fiber here soon though. -Kevin On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:07 AM, Marco Coelho coelh...@gmail.com wrote: I'm a GigE circuit to the mix, and I've got a choice of: Abovenet Cogent Global Crossing Level3 Savvis I'm looking for recommendations of who the better upstream is. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
If you need a good deal on Cogent, shoot me off-list.. --- Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer WISPA Board Member - wispa.org Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik WISP Support Services WISPA Vendor Member Office: 314-735-0270 Website: http://www.linktechs.net LIVE On-Line Mikrotik Training Author of Learn RouterOS -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Kevin Neal Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 12:28 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams Choices choices choices.Qwest out here, everything else, you pay Qwest 2x to get to them. 360 Networks is breaking out some fiber here soon though. -Kevin On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:07 AM, Marco Coelho coelh...@gmail.com wrote: I'm a GigE circuit to the mix, and I've got a choice of: Abovenet Cogent Global Crossing Level3 Savvis I'm looking for recommendations of who the better upstream is. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power
Just curious about something. If' I'm using an R5H card with a 54meg tx power of 21db, then switch it to 1/2 size channels (10mhz), will I still be limited to 21db txpower, or something closer to 25 (the 24M full size channel tx power)? I'm pretty sure the txpower is tied to the modulation, not the size of the channel, but I've seen mention of getting better signal strengths under smaller channels (spectral density?). -- Randy Cosby Vice President InfoWest, Inc 435-674-0165 x 2010 http://www.infowest.com/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power
Better signal due to noise floor change. 10Mhz has been a life send. Steve Barnes Manager PCS-WIN RC-WiFi Wireless Internet Service Character cannot be developed in ease and quiet. Only through experience of trial and suffering can the soul be strengthened, vision cleared, ambition inspired, and success achieved. - Helen Keller -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Randy Cosby Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power Just curious about something. If' I'm using an R5H card with a 54meg tx power of 21db, then switch it to 1/2 size channels (10mhz), will I still be limited to 21db txpower, or something closer to 25 (the 24M full size channel tx power)? I'm pretty sure the txpower is tied to the modulation, not the size of the channel, but I've seen mention of getting better signal strengths under smaller channels (spectral density?). -- Randy Cosby Vice President InfoWest, Inc 435-674-0165 x 2010 http://www.infowest.com/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
I always hear about Cogent having a bad rap, but where does that come from? I can't say that one bit! They've worked great for us and during the initial install clearly went above and beyond the call of duty when we encountered a problem even waking a VP up at 1AM on a Sunday morning because we need to have the circuit up and running by first thing Monday! When I have add to call their tech support up about questions that actually understand what BGP is and how it works! Bret On Wed, 2009-10-21 at 11:58 -0500, Jon Auer wrote: Cogent has a bad rap but they have been solid for us for the past year. Prior to that they had a few hickups. Their peering is pretty good. Low latency to all major content sites. Level3 seems to have more outages than a provider of their reputation should. Savvis is has poor peering from what I hear. I'd like to add Abovenet or Global crossing to my mix. On 10/21/09, Marco Coelho coelh...@gmail.com wrote: I'm a GigE circuit to the mix, and I've got a choice of: Abovenet Cogent Global Crossing Level3 Savvis I'm looking for recommendations of who the better upstream is. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing.
Sounds like a good idea guys. The guy that owns the landfill in my area is a relative, so I may be able to get some good deals that way. I had never thought about that. Thanks. Scottie -- Original Message -- From: Chuck Hogg ch...@shelbybb.com Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 11:39:41 -0400 I have a guy who pays his bill in dish mounts. $2 per mount delivered. We only accept the ones that are clean and reusable. He drops by every couple of weeks with 40-50 of them. Looks like they were removals from Dish/Direct TV. Regards, Chuck Hogg Shelby Broadband 502-722-9292 ch...@shelbybb.com http://www.shelbybb.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Robert West Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 11:36 AM To: sarn...@info-ed.com; 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. Scottie, I've had some minor success by talking to a local metal scrap yard. It's a pretty good sized one, they put up a small sign at the pay window saying that if they get any tower sections to not crush or bend them. If they get a get sections they call and I go over. It's usually old American Tower 8 foot sections, like TV tower, but some are pretty useful. They charge usually 30 cents per pound and I pay a few cents over that for good sections in exchange for the sign next to the pay window. A month or so ago they called and I had to go out to a field to look at some that were too big for the metal collector guy to take into the yard. 2 80 foot heavy duty free standing towers in good shape laying in the field all overgrown with weeds. 150 bucks for the pair. Didn't know how much they weighed so I just offered the 150. They will also hold old DirectTV dishs and the J arm mounts for them if the sorters remember. Those are handy to have at 2 bucks each. As long as I pay more than scrap value, they are all over it. They usually have more stuff than I need though. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Cc: motoro...@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. What is a good price to give for a standard Rohn SSV tower, 100' with sections 7N, 6N, 5N, 4N, and 3WN in real good shape, each section still assembled, already down and ready for loading. I priced it new at around $8500. I have looked at www.usedtowers.com, but those are way higher than what I got this one for. I already won it at auction, but just checking to make sure I didn't screw up. Do any of you know where to find used towers besides qth.com, eham.net, ebay, and usedtowers.com? I have a few local places, but I am looking to expand my searches beyond those mentioned and local. TIA, Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
Right on. Did you know you can find the focal point, even of an off-center feed, of a solid parabolic by busting a mirror? Yeah, break a mirror into a thousand pieces. Use a glue stick or rubber cement to glue 30 - 40 of the pieces to the dish surface. Using a car headlight or really bright flashlight BEAM, you can posit a die (singular dice) or a crumpled up piece of paper in the dish focus and see the focal point. Cool stuff. It has nothing to do with frequency. A bright red light would work, so would a green one. Yep, even a gain microwave signal pointed at it would work; IF you could see microwaves. :-) It looks like Mark is rapidly answering his own question. Mike At 10:30 AM 10/21/2009, you wrote: Feed length is based on dish size; where does the parabola focus. Nothing to do with frequency, everything reflects the same. Size of the feed horn isn't always an indicator either. Can depend on a lot of things. Josh Luthman wrote: The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and buying new feeds in the range you want unless you you have a few hours of extra time on your hands. Cameron Mark McElvy wrote: I have 4 two ft dishes that where pulled down when the previous wisp went out of business. There are no markings on them and I need to determine frequency and polarity. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing.
VERY Useful! I am going to make a sign and go visit my local landfill lady real soon. Thanks for a great idea. Mike At 10:35 AM 10/21/2009, Robert West wrote: Scottie, I've had some minor success by talking to a local metal scrap yard. It's a pretty good sized one, they put up a small sign at the pay window saying that if they get any tower sections to not crush or bend them. If they get a get sections they call and I go over. It's usually old American Tower 8 foot sections, like TV tower, but some are pretty useful. They charge usually 30 cents per pound and I pay a few cents over that for good sections in exchange for the sign next to the pay window. A month or so ago they called and I had to go out to a field to look at some that were too big for the metal collector guy to take into the yard. 2 80 foot heavy duty free standing towers in good shape laying in the field all overgrown with weeds. 150 bucks for the pair. Didn't know how much they weighed so I just offered the 150. They will also hold old DirectTV dishs and the J arm mounts for them if the sorters remember. Those are handy to have at 2 bucks each. As long as I pay more than scrap value, they are all over it. They usually have more stuff than I need though. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Cc: motoro...@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. What is a good price to give for a standard Rohn SSV tower, 100' with sections 7N, 6N, 5N, 4N, and 3WN in real good shape, each section still assembled, already down and ready for loading. I priced it new at around $8500. I have looked at www.usedtowers.com, but those are way higher than what I got this one for. I already won it at auction, but just checking to make sure I didn't screw up. Do any of you know where to find used towers besides qth.com, eham.net, ebay, and usedtowers.com? I have a few local places, but I am looking to expand my searches beyond those mentioned and local. TIA, Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing.
VERY Useful! I am going to make a sign and go visit my local landfill lady real soon. Thanks for a great idea. Mike At 10:35 AM 10/21/2009, Robert West wrote: Scottie, I've had some minor success by talking to a local metal scrap yard. It's a pretty good sized one, they put up a small sign at the pay window saying that if they get any tower sections to not crush or bend them. If they get a get sections they call and I go over. It's usually old American Tower 8 foot sections, like TV tower, but some are pretty useful. They charge usually 30 cents per pound and I pay a few cents over that for good sections in exchange for the sign next to the pay window. A month or so ago they called and I had to go out to a field to look at some that were too big for the metal collector guy to take into the yard. 2 80 foot heavy duty free standing towers in good shape laying in the field all overgrown with weeds. 150 bucks for the pair. Didn't know how much they weighed so I just offered the 150. They will also hold old DirectTV dishs and the J arm mounts for them if the sorters remember. Those are handy to have at 2 bucks each. As long as I pay more than scrap value, they are all over it. They usually have more stuff than I need though. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Cc: motoro...@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. What is a good price to give for a standard Rohn SSV tower, 100' with sections 7N, 6N, 5N, 4N, and 3WN in real good shape, each section still assembled, already down and ready for loading. I priced it new at around $8500. I have looked at www.usedtowers.com, but those are way higher than what I got this one for. I already won it at auction, but just checking to make sure I didn't screw up. Do any of you know where to find used towers besides qth.com, eham.net, ebay, and usedtowers.com? I have a few local places, but I am looking to expand my searches beyond those mentioned and local. TIA, Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power
Hi, In my experience, when changing from 20mhz to 10mhz channel size, I see a +3db in signal strength on each side of the link. This is with no other changes, we leave all the power settings at default. Travis Microserv Randy Cosby wrote: Just curious about something. If' I'm using an R5H card with a 54meg tx power of 21db, then switch it to 1/2 size channels (10mhz), will I still be limited to 21db txpower, or something closer to 25 (the 24M full size channel tx power)? I'm pretty sure the txpower is tied to the modulation, not the size of the channel, but I've seen mention of getting better signal strengths under smaller channels (spectral density?). WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power
Only problem I've got with 10Mhz (or 5Mhz) is that a vast majority of laptops cannot see that, and it kills our hotspot capabilities. Beyond that, yes, it's fantastic. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Steve Barnes Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 1:08 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power Better signal due to noise floor change. 10Mhz has been a life send. Steve Barnes Manager PCS-WIN RC-WiFi Wireless Internet Service Character cannot be developed in ease and quiet. Only through experience of trial and suffering can the soul be strengthened, vision cleared, ambition inspired, and success achieved. - Helen Keller -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Randy Cosby Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power Just curious about something. If' I'm using an R5H card with a 54meg tx power of 21db, then switch it to 1/2 size channels (10mhz), will I still be limited to 21db txpower, or something closer to 25 (the 24M full size channel tx power)? I'm pretty sure the txpower is tied to the modulation, not the size of the channel, but I've seen mention of getting better signal strengths under smaller channels (spectral density?). -- Randy Cosby Vice President InfoWest, Inc 435-674-0165 x 2010 http://www.infowest.com/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
On Wed, 2009-10-21 at 10:00 -0500, Eje Gustafsson wrote: I cannot on top of my head recall how to determine the installed polarity of the feed but will go back to the warehouse to take a quick look to see how the feed needs to be installed for vertical and horizontal since it's impossible to tell by looking at the head of the feed on these dishes. It seems to me that when installed as vertical, the 2 bolts will be vertical (where you bolt the feed to the dish). Rotating it 90 degrees will make the bolts (and signal polarity) be horizontal . -- * Butch Evans * Professional Network Consultation* * http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering * * http://www.wispa.org/ * Wired or Wireless Networks * * http://blog.butchevans.com/ * ImageStream, Mikrotik and MORE! * WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
On the PAC solids, as I recall, there is a bump on the feed that can go into one of two slots in the center hole of the dish. When the bump is vertical, the polarity is vertical. When the bump is horizontal, polarity is horizontal. Cameron Butch Evans wrote: On Wed, 2009-10-21 at 10:00 -0500, Eje Gustafsson wrote: I cannot on top of my head recall how to determine the installed polarity of the feed but will go back to the warehouse to take a quick look to see how the feed needs to be installed for vertical and horizontal since it's impossible to tell by looking at the head of the feed on these dishes. It seems to me that when installed as vertical, the 2 bolts will be vertical (where you bolt the feed to the dish). Rotating it 90 degrees will make the bolts (and signal polarity) be horizontal . WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
They had congestion problems back prior to 2005 from what I hear due to crazy overselling. Three years ago we had a horrid time with their local POP dropping off the net every other week. I would have to call them and tell them their POP was paritioned because I only saw routes from their other local customers. About two years ago they upgraded the pop from a cisco GSR with some gig fiber leased from a local isp to a 7609/RSP720 running 10gigE on dark fiber from mccleod. Since then they have been amazing. Now they call us if there is a outage or our BGP drops. On 10/21/09, Bret Clark bcl...@spectraaccess.com wrote: I always hear about Cogent having a bad rap, but where does that come from? I can't say that one bit! They've worked great for us and during the initial install clearly went above and beyond the call of duty when we encountered a problem even waking a VP up at 1AM on a Sunday morning because we need to have the circuit up and running by first thing Monday! When I have add to call their tech support up about questions that actually understand what BGP is and how it works! Bret On Wed, 2009-10-21 at 11:58 -0500, Jon Auer wrote: Cogent has a bad rap but they have been solid for us for the past year. Prior to that they had a few hickups. Their peering is pretty good. Low latency to all major content sites. Level3 seems to have more outages than a provider of their reputation should. Savvis is has poor peering from what I hear. I'd like to add Abovenet or Global crossing to my mix. On 10/21/09, Marco Coelho coelh...@gmail.com wrote: I'm a GigE circuit to the mix, and I've got a choice of: Abovenet Cogent Global Crossing Level3 Savvis I'm looking for recommendations of who the better upstream is. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Sent from my mobile device WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power
Drop a MT 433A in place with a 2nd R52 as your hotspot on an Omni Down lower on the tower. Then you have a dedicated Radio for Subscribers secured on a 10Mhz channel and a Hotspot Radio that if it has some goofy laptop in a semi trying to connected at -88 it doesn't kill all your subs. Steve Barnes Manager PCS-WIN RC-WiFi Wireless Internet Service Character cannot be developed in ease and quiet. Only through experience of trial and suffering can the soul be strengthened, vision cleared, ambition inspired, and success achieved. - Helen Keller -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jason Hensley Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 3:13 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power Only problem I've got with 10Mhz (or 5Mhz) is that a vast majority of laptops cannot see that, and it kills our hotspot capabilities. Beyond that, yes, it's fantastic. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Steve Barnes Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 1:08 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power Better signal due to noise floor change. 10Mhz has been a life send. Steve Barnes Manager PCS-WIN RC-WiFi Wireless Internet Service Character cannot be developed in ease and quiet. Only through experience of trial and suffering can the soul be strengthened, vision cleared, ambition inspired, and success achieved. - Helen Keller -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Randy Cosby Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 2:06 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power Just curious about something. If' I'm using an R5H card with a 54meg tx power of 21db, then switch it to 1/2 size channels (10mhz), will I still be limited to 21db txpower, or something closer to 25 (the 24M full size channel tx power)? I'm pretty sure the txpower is tied to the modulation, not the size of the channel, but I've seen mention of getting better signal strengths under smaller channels (spectral density?). -- Randy Cosby Vice President InfoWest, Inc 435-674-0165 x 2010 http://www.infowest.com/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Wire center boundary GIS data
Does anyone know of a public domain source for telco wirecenter boundary and CO location information? Something that could be imported into Google Earth would be wonderful. -- Patrick Shoemaker Vector Data Systems LLC shoemak...@vectordatasystems.com office: (301) 358-1690 x36 http://www.vectordatasystems.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Cogent can be ok, but they are not equal to AboveNET, XO, ATT, Level3 etc... We have multiple upstream GigE feeds and Cogent is one of them. It took us months to get Cogent to resolve a flapping switch or router within their network. After a couple dozen screenshots and trace routes from various looking glass sites they finally conceded. Granted the outages were only between 5 and 60 seconds long when they occurred and rarely were long enough to break BGP sessions, but they were hell on VoIP! It took us less than a day to find the specific Cogent IP or device where the problem was occurring, but months before Cogent acted on the information we provided them. Cogent Support honestly wasn't that bad, but said their hands were tied until management further up the chain completed their investigation. During that time we had to route voice traffic around Cogent as best we could. Cogent is great as a cheap third or fourth GigE upstream, but never a sole or primary Internet feed, IMO. While Cogent goes about their BGP peering a little different than most, I do agree their BGP Support is equal to anyone else's we've worked with. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Bret Clark Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 1:15 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams I always hear about Cogent having a bad rap, but where does that come from? I can't say that one bit! They've worked great for us and during the initial install clearly went above and beyond the call of duty when we encountered a problem even waking a VP up at 1AM on a Sunday morning because we need to have the circuit up and running by first thing Monday! When I have add to call their tech support up about questions that actually understand what BGP is and how it works! Bret On Wed, 2009-10-21 at 11:58 -0500, Jon Auer wrote: Cogent has a bad rap but they have been solid for us for the past year. Prior to that they had a few hickups. Their peering is pretty good. Low latency to all major content sites. Level3 seems to have more outages than a provider of their reputation should. Savvis is has poor peering from what I hear. I'd like to add Abovenet or Global crossing to my mix. On 10/21/09, Marco Coelho coelh...@gmail.com wrote: I'm a GigE circuit to the mix, and I've got a choice of: Abovenet Cogent Global Crossing Level3 Savvis I'm looking for recommendations of who the better upstream is. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Wire center boundary GIS data
It doesn't exist...I've searched for years. Had to resort to buying it. On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 3:42 PM, Patrick Shoemaker shoemak...@vectordatasystems.com wrote: Does anyone know of a public domain source for telco wirecenter boundary and CO location information? Something that could be imported into Google Earth would be wonderful. -- Patrick Shoemaker Vector Data Systems LLC shoemak...@vectordatasystems.com office: (301) 358-1690 x36 http://www.vectordatasystems.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Thank You, Brian Webster 214 Eggleston Hill Rd. Cooperstown, NY 13326 www.wirelessmapping.com 607-643-4055 Voice 607-435-3988 Mobile 208-692-1898 Fax WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power
Makes sense. Same power in half the with is like doubling the power Jerry -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 12:08 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] 1/2 size channels and tx power Hi, In my experience, when changing from 20mhz to 10mhz channel size, I see a +3db in signal strength on each side of the link. This is with no other changes, we leave all the power settings at default. Travis Microserv Randy Cosby wrote: Just curious about something. If' I'm using an R5H card with a 54meg tx power of 21db, then switch it to 1/2 size channels (10mhz), will I still be limited to 21db txpower, or something closer to 25 (the 24M full size channel tx power)? I'm pretty sure the txpower is tied to the modulation, not the size of the channel, but I've seen mention of getting better signal strengths under smaller channels (spectral density?). WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
On Wed, 2009-10-21 at 14:31 -0500, ccrum wrote: On the PAC solids, as I recall, there is a bump on the feed that can go into one of two slots in the center hole of the dish. When the bump is vertical, the polarity is vertical. When the bump is horizontal, polarity is horizontal. That may be what I am remembering. I know there is something in the way it gets bolted to the dish that is a good indicator, but I can't remember what it is, exactly. -- * Butch Evans * Professional Network Consultation* * http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering * * http://www.wispa.org/ * Wired or Wireless Networks * * http://blog.butchevans.com/ * ImageStream, Mikrotik and MORE! * WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
You're not thinking of the arrow sticker are you..? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 4:35 PM, Butch Evans but...@butchevans.com wrote: On Wed, 2009-10-21 at 14:31 -0500, ccrum wrote: On the PAC solids, as I recall, there is a bump on the feed that can go into one of two slots in the center hole of the dish. When the bump is vertical, the polarity is vertical. When the bump is horizontal, polarity is horizontal. That may be what I am remembering. I know there is something in the way it gets bolted to the dish that is a good indicator, but I can't remember what it is, exactly. -- * Butch Evans * Professional Network Consultation* * http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering * * http://www.wispa.org/ * Wired or Wireless Networks * * http://blog.butchevans.com/ * ImageStream, Mikrotik and MORE! * WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
It should be noted that an Upstreams performance can be directly proportional to the location where they have more peering. In the DC and NY markets, Cogent has excellent performance and peering, and has shown to outperform EVERY provider we have tried, period. (And yes, some of the carriers we tried were Level3, XO, and Abovenet.) I recognize that Cogent's performance may not be as good for ALL markets where they potentially could have a weaker presence. But saying Cogent is only worthy of the 3rd or 4th transit connection is simply untrue. Cogent's weak point now is internal processes and communication. They've lost touch with the value of having personal Account Reps, and render the reps powerless to manage the accounts, in favor of the customer relationship managed by the clueless billing/collections department. Its a shame. You might even get away with saying Cogent has a few more short duration (less than 15 minutes?) outages than other carriers. But their tech support has been the best by far in the industry, and oversubscription has never been a problem from what I see. In picking a Transit provider its really a decision about where your traffic typically flows, and where you need good performance to. NOT anyone has best performance everywhere. For example, Hurricane has excellent performance AND they are inexpensive. They have a really good peering presensence in CA. I'm not confident that they have nearly as good a presence on the East coast though, but those that have used them on teh east coast that I know have been happy. We were considering using them. Abovenet has great Gig-E Transport. But their transit is expensive, and its because its more expensive for them to provide it, because they are not as well positioned to do it cost effectively, not because its necessarilly better. Level3 as well, has many strength. They have a lot of web host clients. It can really help performance to reach certain sites. Level3 also tends to blocks smaller BGP block announcements, more so than someone like Cogent. Level3 is good for a secondaryu because they usually have diverse routes. Some providers have good performance to France, Amsterdam, India, others dont. Savvis tends to have real peering to NY finacnial markets. I often see Blended bandwdith combining Global Cross and Level3, not sure why these two are chosen as a pair. Maybe its simply becaue they tend to be colocated at the same carrier hotels? But selecting a transit provider is not as simple as saying one is better. My personaly opinion is, find the two lowest cost providers, and then you can afford to buy more bandwidth, and have two options to route customers. You also need to consider the path to where you take it. For example, Cogent remote tenant buildings likely have routers with less ram that cant handle full BGP tables, so they require creating session to two seperate BGP servers (with the second one having full routes.). But of you connect to them inb a major colo center that doesn;t exist. Similar things exist with other providers depending on where you pick up the circuit. What I like about Abovenet, is they'll map out their network for you, so you know exactly what you are buying, so true redunancy can be built into the network design. Cogent is a bit more secrative about the traffic path. XO has had some really good account reps, and I liked that. But for me, they didn't really give me anything exciting as far as price or performance, more than anyone else. It should also be noted that it could make a big difference which local colo you pick the circuit up in also. So when you are evaluating a provider you are also evaluating the venue where the circuit is in. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton b...@belwave.com To: bcl...@spectraaccess.com; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 3:47 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams Cogent can be ok, but they are not equal to AboveNET, XO, ATT, Level3 etc... We have multiple upstream GigE feeds and Cogent is one of them. It took us months to get Cogent to resolve a flapping switch or router within their network. After a couple dozen screenshots and trace routes from various looking glass sites they finally conceded. Granted the outages were only between 5 and 60 seconds long when they occurred and rarely were long enough to break BGP sessions, but they were hell on VoIP! It took us less than a day to find the specific Cogent IP or device where the problem was occurring, but months before Cogent acted on the information we provided them. Cogent Support honestly wasn't that bad, but said their hands were tied until management further up the chain completed their investigation. During that time we had to route voice traffic around Cogent as best we could. Cogent is great as a cheap
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
On Wed, 2009-10-21 at 16:57 -0400, Josh Luthman wrote: You're not thinking of the arrow sticker are you..? The last one I actually got a close look at may have had a sticker, but I don't recall. There was something physical about how you installed it that was different for vertical/horizontal. -- * Butch Evans * Professional Network Consultation* * http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering * * http://www.wispa.org/ * Wired or Wireless Networks * * http://blog.butchevans.com/ * ImageStream, Mikrotik and MORE! * WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Isn't XO a Level3 reseller? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 5:28 PM, Tom DeReggi wirelessn...@rapiddsl.netwrote: It should be noted that an Upstreams performance can be directly proportional to the location where they have more peering. In the DC and NY markets, Cogent has excellent performance and peering, and has shown to outperform EVERY provider we have tried, period. (And yes, some of the carriers we tried were Level3, XO, and Abovenet.) I recognize that Cogent's performance may not be as good for ALL markets where they potentially could have a weaker presence. But saying Cogent is only worthy of the 3rd or 4th transit connection is simply untrue. Cogent's weak point now is internal processes and communication. They've lost touch with the value of having personal Account Reps, and render the reps powerless to manage the accounts, in favor of the customer relationship managed by the clueless billing/collections department. Its a shame. You might even get away with saying Cogent has a few more short duration (less than 15 minutes?) outages than other carriers. But their tech support has been the best by far in the industry, and oversubscription has never been a problem from what I see. In picking a Transit provider its really a decision about where your traffic typically flows, and where you need good performance to. NOT anyone has best performance everywhere. For example, Hurricane has excellent performance AND they are inexpensive. They have a really good peering presensence in CA. I'm not confident that they have nearly as good a presence on the East coast though, but those that have used them on teh east coast that I know have been happy. We were considering using them. Abovenet has great Gig-E Transport. But their transit is expensive, and its because its more expensive for them to provide it, because they are not as well positioned to do it cost effectively, not because its necessarilly better. Level3 as well, has many strength. They have a lot of web host clients. It can really help performance to reach certain sites. Level3 also tends to blocks smaller BGP block announcements, more so than someone like Cogent. Level3 is good for a secondaryu because they usually have diverse routes. Some providers have good performance to France, Amsterdam, India, others dont. Savvis tends to have real peering to NY finacnial markets. I often see Blended bandwdith combining Global Cross and Level3, not sure why these two are chosen as a pair. Maybe its simply becaue they tend to be colocated at the same carrier hotels? But selecting a transit provider is not as simple as saying one is better. My personaly opinion is, find the two lowest cost providers, and then you can afford to buy more bandwidth, and have two options to route customers. You also need to consider the path to where you take it. For example, Cogent remote tenant buildings likely have routers with less ram that cant handle full BGP tables, so they require creating session to two seperate BGP servers (with the second one having full routes.). But of you connect to them inb a major colo center that doesn;t exist. Similar things exist with other providers depending on where you pick up the circuit. What I like about Abovenet, is they'll map out their network for you, so you know exactly what you are buying, so true redunancy can be built into the network design. Cogent is a bit more secrative about the traffic path. XO has had some really good account reps, and I liked that. But for me, they didn't really give me anything exciting as far as price or performance, more than anyone else. It should also be noted that it could make a big difference which local colo you pick the circuit up in also. So when you are evaluating a provider you are also evaluating the venue where the circuit is in. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton b...@belwave.com To: bcl...@spectraaccess.com; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 3:47 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams Cogent can be ok, but they are not equal to AboveNET, XO, ATT, Level3 etc... We have multiple upstream GigE feeds and Cogent is one of them. It took us months to get Cogent to resolve a flapping switch or router within their network. After a couple dozen screenshots and trace routes from various looking glass sites they finally conceded. Granted the outages were only between 5 and 60 seconds long when they occurred and rarely were long enough to break BGP sessions, but they were hell on VoIP! It took us less than a day to find the specific Cogent
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
I bought some gabriel dishes probably 8-10 years ago, and they all failed, so gabriel gave us a deal on new feedhorns, and most of them have since failed too. Perhaps things are better now. We had one fail this past winter, and just took it off the tower this summer. We just tossed the dish and feedhorn in the grass and forgot about it. I'm not going to buy another feedhorn for it. We're mostly using pacwireless for dishes as a result. We've had a few of them fail a couple years ago, but they've fixed that, and percentagewise, they've been more reliable. A radome also protects the feedhorn quite well, and we use a radome anytime where we are near the ocean or are being careful not to overload a tower, as the radome both protects the feedhorn and reduces windloading. We also only buy the dual pole ones now. We'd started to for the trangolink45's which can switch polarity with software. Now, it looks like 2x2 MIMO based products are the future for backhaul, and we'd like to not have to upgrade antennas with the radios. If you use a radome, you have to actually disassemble the thing to change feedhorns, so do it right the first time. The Gabriels are a lot lighter due to their all alloy construction. On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:38:17AM -0500, ccrum wrote: I'll second that. I can't tell you how many pac dishes have either leaked water into the feed or have major problems with icing in the winter. I triple seal everything on my dishes and have had pac grids and solids somehow still get water into the center pin of the connector. I have no idea how it happens, but after about the 20th time, I just plain quit using them. I've never had this trouble on a Gabriel or Radiowaves dish and I apply the same sealing technique. Also, I've noticed in bench testing that that the Gabriel feeds have better SWR plots and provide MUCH better isolation between their dual pol feeds than the PAC. Cameron Brad Belton wrote: BTW Mark, if you determine they are PacWireless antennas I'd just punt them on EBay and replace them with RadioWaves or Gabriel 2' antennas. In the long run you'll be a lot happier. Just my opinion... Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:01 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Ok, just checking. Good cover...grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:56 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went out of business. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. 573.729.9200 - Office 573.729.9203 - Fax 573.247.9980 - Mobile http://www.accubak.com/ http://www.accubak.net/ Nationwide Internet Access Accurate backups for your critical data! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:29 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Got a spectrum analyzer and a frequency generator? Or a good network analyzer will do, but most people don't have one laying around. The feeds could literally be anything. You might be better off just calling the MFG of the dish and
Re: [WISPA] Wire center boundary GIS data
Telcodata.us has some info such as CO information and who's in the COs. You can use the web interface or buy the whole database of them for a modest subscription. I don't know of any good information about wirecenter boundaries. I'd be interested as wirecenter boundaries would be good to target for wireless, as DSL is pretty spotty in such areas. On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 03:42:51PM -0400, Patrick Shoemaker wrote: Does anyone know of a public domain source for telco wirecenter boundary and CO location information? Something that could be imported into Google Earth would be wonderful. -- Patrick Shoemaker Vector Data Systems LLC shoemak...@vectordatasystems.com office: (301) 358-1690 x36 http://www.vectordatasystems.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Trade Shows in Spring
Does anyone whether vendor or WISP have a comprehensive list of all the Trade Shows and their run dates relating to the Wireless Industry between February, 2010 and June, 2010. If so please email me OFF-LIST at for...@wispa.org Thank you, Forbes Mercy WISPA - Promotions Committee Chair WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
While I agree no solution can be considered equal in any given location, there are trends or a general barometer to help place one carrier over another. This is the reality that typically puts Cogent towards the back of the bus in most people's minds. The biggest proponents of Cogent are those that are largely dependent on Cogent due to any number of reasons. Budget constraints, lack of alternate higher quality peer availability etc, etc. Cogent makes no excuse promoting themselves as the low end, budget driven bottom dollar provider. They are good for what they offer, but again not what a network administrator looking for high availability is going to pick as a first choice. You might even get away with saying Cogent has a few more short duration (less than 15 minutes?) outages than other carriers. This is exactly my point (being made by Tom, a Cogent customer!) why Cogent should not be depended on as a sole or primary Internet feed. If Cogent's all you got then you're SOL! Bottom line is any carrier can break. If you can only have one then find one that breaks the least. If you can have more than one, Cogent is a good low cost second or third to have in a pinch for relatively little cost. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Tom DeReggi Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 4:28 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams It should be noted that an Upstreams performance can be directly proportional to the location where they have more peering. In the DC and NY markets, Cogent has excellent performance and peering, and has shown to outperform EVERY provider we have tried, period. (And yes, some of the carriers we tried were Level3, XO, and Abovenet.) I recognize that Cogent's performance may not be as good for ALL markets where they potentially could have a weaker presence. But saying Cogent is only worthy of the 3rd or 4th transit connection is simply untrue. Cogent's weak point now is internal processes and communication. They've lost touch with the value of having personal Account Reps, and render the reps powerless to manage the accounts, in favor of the customer relationship managed by the clueless billing/collections department. Its a shame. You might even get away with saying Cogent has a few more short duration (less than 15 minutes?) outages than other carriers. But their tech support has been the best by far in the industry, and oversubscription has never been a problem from what I see. In picking a Transit provider its really a decision about where your traffic typically flows, and where you need good performance to. NOT anyone has best performance everywhere. For example, Hurricane has excellent performance AND they are inexpensive. They have a really good peering presensence in CA. I'm not confident that they have nearly as good a presence on the East coast though, but those that have used them on teh east coast that I know have been happy. We were considering using them. Abovenet has great Gig-E Transport. But their transit is expensive, and its because its more expensive for them to provide it, because they are not as well positioned to do it cost effectively, not because its necessarilly better. Level3 as well, has many strength. They have a lot of web host clients. It can really help performance to reach certain sites. Level3 also tends to blocks smaller BGP block announcements, more so than someone like Cogent. Level3 is good for a secondaryu because they usually have diverse routes. Some providers have good performance to France, Amsterdam, India, others dont. Savvis tends to have real peering to NY finacnial markets. I often see Blended bandwdith combining Global Cross and Level3, not sure why these two are chosen as a pair. Maybe its simply becaue they tend to be colocated at the same carrier hotels? But selecting a transit provider is not as simple as saying one is better. My personaly opinion is, find the two lowest cost providers, and then you can afford to buy more bandwidth, and have two options to route customers. You also need to consider the path to where you take it. For example, Cogent remote tenant buildings likely have routers with less ram that cant handle full BGP tables, so they require creating session to two seperate BGP servers (with the second one having full routes.). But of you connect to them inb a major colo center that doesn;t exist. Similar things exist with other providers depending on where you pick up the circuit. What I like about Abovenet, is they'll map out their network for you, so you know exactly what you are buying, so true redunancy can be built into the network design. Cogent is a bit more secrative about the traffic path. XO has had some really good account reps, and I liked that. But for me, they didn't really give me anything exciting as far as price or performance, more
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Brad Belton wrote: While I agree no solution can be considered equal in any given location, there are trends or a general barometer to help place one carrier over another. Such as? This is exactly my point (being made by Tom, a Cogent customer!) why Cogent should not be depended on as a sole or primary Internet feed. If Cogent's all you got then you're SOL! Baloney, we've used them as one of our primary's for well over a year without hiccup. Our so other better providers have given us more frustration. Bottom line is any carrier can break. If you can only have one then find one that breaks the least. If you can have more than one, Cogent is a good low cost second or third to have in a pinch for relatively little cost. Where are you getting your data from? Curious as to why you feel they are a second or third alternative? Bret WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
As we can all see, This is very dependent on market. Bret here has had a great time with cogent, where others are quick to say its a lesser provider. Arguing which carrier has better uptime is a waste of time. Long story short, Pick what is the best in that market. You might even get away with looking up some of the big company's in your city, and if they peer with someone you might also want to peer with (like cogent). Give them a call and see if you can get a tech, see what they have to say about $CARRIER in your area. They might tell you to jump in a lake, but you might get someone cool who is willing to talk. Nick Olsen Brevard Wireless (321) 205-1100 x106 From: Bret Clark bcl...@spectraaccess.com Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 6:10 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams Brad Belton wrote: While I agree no solution can be considered equal in any given location, there are trends or a general barometer to help place one carrier over another. Such as? This is exactly my point (being made by Tom, a Cogent customer!) why Cogent should not be depended on as a sole or primary Internet feed. If Cogent's all you got then you're SOL! Baloney, we've used them as one of our primary's for well over a year without hiccup. Our so other better providers have given us more frustration. Bottom line is any carrier can break. If you can only have one then find one that breaks the least. If you can have more than one, Cogent is a good low cost second or third to have in a pinch for relatively little cost. Where are you getting your data from? Curious as to why you feel they are a second or third alternative? Bret WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing.
I'll add this one thing I was trying to buy an old 65 foot free standing DX tower from a guy, the thing was laying in his field covered in weeds near his barn. I saw it all the time and finally stopped and told him I'd buy it for 100 bucks. He looked at me and said, For a CB tower?! That's too much for a CB tower, you can have it for 50. I still tried to give him the 100 cause it's worth it but he kept saying over and over, too much for a CB tower.. One man's trash is another's treasure time and time again. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 2:50 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. Sounds like a good idea guys. The guy that owns the landfill in my area is a relative, so I may be able to get some good deals that way. I had never thought about that. Thanks. Scottie -- Original Message -- From: Chuck Hogg ch...@shelbybb.com Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 11:39:41 -0400 I have a guy who pays his bill in dish mounts. $2 per mount delivered. We only accept the ones that are clean and reusable. He drops by every couple of weeks with 40-50 of them. Looks like they were removals from Dish/Direct TV. Regards, Chuck Hogg Shelby Broadband 502-722-9292 ch...@shelbybb.com http://www.shelbybb.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Robert West Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 11:36 AM To: sarn...@info-ed.com; 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. Scottie, I've had some minor success by talking to a local metal scrap yard. It's a pretty good sized one, they put up a small sign at the pay window saying that if they get any tower sections to not crush or bend them. If they get a get sections they call and I go over. It's usually old American Tower 8 foot sections, like TV tower, but some are pretty useful. They charge usually 30 cents per pound and I pay a few cents over that for good sections in exchange for the sign next to the pay window. A month or so ago they called and I had to go out to a field to look at some that were too big for the metal collector guy to take into the yard. 2 80 foot heavy duty free standing towers in good shape laying in the field all overgrown with weeds. 150 bucks for the pair. Didn't know how much they weighed so I just offered the 150. They will also hold old DirectTV dishs and the J arm mounts for them if the sorters remember. Those are handy to have at 2 bucks each. As long as I pay more than scrap value, they are all over it. They usually have more stuff than I need though. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Cc: motoro...@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. What is a good price to give for a standard Rohn SSV tower, 100' with sections 7N, 6N, 5N, 4N, and 3WN in real good shape, each section still assembled, already down and ready for loading. I priced it new at around $8500. I have looked at www.usedtowers.com, but those are way higher than what I got this one for. I already won it at auction, but just checking to make sure I didn't screw up. Do any of you know where to find used towers besides qth.com, eham.net, ebay, and usedtowers.com? I have a few local places, but I am looking to expand my searches beyond those mentioned and local. TIA, Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing.
It comes from being a cheap S.O.B. Those J mounts aren't cheap new but the used ones for 2 bucks are usually perfect. A little WD-40 on the adjuster and it's all good. I don't know what they're made of, maybe some aluminum alloy but they are really light, I doubt they have much value as scrap so the 2 bucks is probably more than equitable for them. This is a metal yard that I deal with. Have the landfill lady hint to the junk collectors that good tower sections not bent or damaged much might bring more cash. They get really careful if they think they might make an extra 50 cents. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 3:06 PM To: WISPA General List; sarn...@info-ed.com; 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. VERY Useful! I am going to make a sign and go visit my local landfill lady real soon. Thanks for a great idea. Mike At 10:35 AM 10/21/2009, Robert West wrote: Scottie, I've had some minor success by talking to a local metal scrap yard. It's a pretty good sized one, they put up a small sign at the pay window saying that if they get any tower sections to not crush or bend them. If they get a get sections they call and I go over. It's usually old American Tower 8 foot sections, like TV tower, but some are pretty useful. They charge usually 30 cents per pound and I pay a few cents over that for good sections in exchange for the sign next to the pay window. A month or so ago they called and I had to go out to a field to look at some that were too big for the metal collector guy to take into the yard. 2 80 foot heavy duty free standing towers in good shape laying in the field all overgrown with weeds. 150 bucks for the pair. Didn't know how much they weighed so I just offered the 150. They will also hold old DirectTV dishs and the J arm mounts for them if the sorters remember. Those are handy to have at 2 bucks each. As long as I pay more than scrap value, they are all over it. They usually have more stuff than I need though. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Cc: motoro...@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. What is a good price to give for a standard Rohn SSV tower, 100' with sections 7N, 6N, 5N, 4N, and 3WN in real good shape, each section still assembled, already down and ready for loading. I priced it new at around $8500. I have looked at www.usedtowers.com, but those are way higher than what I got this one for. I already won it at auction, but just checking to make sure I didn't screw up. Do any of you know where to find used towers besides qth.com, eham.net, ebay, and usedtowers.com? I have a few local places, but I am looking to expand my searches beyond those mentioned and local. TIA, Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing.
Never seen the aluminum ones. Every Dish/Direct dish mount I've seen are epoxy paint coated steel. At 05:54 PM 10/21/2009, you wrote: It comes from being a cheap S.O.B. Those J mounts aren't cheap new but the used ones for 2 bucks are usually perfect. A little WD-40 on the adjuster and it's all good. I don't know what they're made of, maybe some aluminum alloy but they are really light, I doubt they have much value as scrap so the 2 bucks is probably more than equitable for them. This is a metal yard that I deal with. Have the landfill lady hint to the junk collectors that good tower sections not bent or damaged much might bring more cash. They get really careful if they think they might make an extra 50 cents. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 3:06 PM To: WISPA General List; sarn...@info-ed.com; 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. VERY Useful! I am going to make a sign and go visit my local landfill lady real soon. Thanks for a great idea. Mike At 10:35 AM 10/21/2009, Robert West wrote: Scottie, I've had some minor success by talking to a local metal scrap yard. It's a pretty good sized one, they put up a small sign at the pay window saying that if they get any tower sections to not crush or bend them. If they get a get sections they call and I go over. It's usually old American Tower 8 foot sections, like TV tower, but some are pretty useful. They charge usually 30 cents per pound and I pay a few cents over that for good sections in exchange for the sign next to the pay window. A month or so ago they called and I had to go out to a field to look at some that were too big for the metal collector guy to take into the yard. 2 80 foot heavy duty free standing towers in good shape laying in the field all overgrown with weeds. 150 bucks for the pair. Didn't know how much they weighed so I just offered the 150. They will also hold old DirectTV dishs and the J arm mounts for them if the sorters remember. Those are handy to have at 2 bucks each. As long as I pay more than scrap value, they are all over it. They usually have more stuff than I need though. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Cc: motoro...@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. What is a good price to give for a standard Rohn SSV tower, 100' with sections 7N, 6N, 5N, 4N, and 3WN in real good shape, each section still assembled, already down and ready for loading. I priced it new at around $8500. I have looked at www.usedtowers.com, but those are way higher than what I got this one for. I already won it at auction, but just checking to make sure I didn't screw up. Do any of you know where to find used towers besides qth.com, eham.net, ebay, and usedtowers.com? I have a few local places, but I am looking to expand my searches beyond those mentioned and local. TIA, Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Hello Bret, You missed the point about the biggest proponents of Cogent are those that only have Cogentsilence... Spectraaccess ASN: 36645 http://www.cidr-report.org/cgi-bin/as-report?as=AS36645 http://bgplay.routeviews.org/bgplay/208.65.172.0/22 208.82.132.0/22 Tom appears to be in the same boat: Rapiddsl ASN: 12214 http://www.cidr-report.org/cgi-bin/as-report?as=AS12214 http://bgplay.routeviews.org/bgplay/69.46.240.0/20 I'm not a Cogent basher as we have a Cogent GigE feed too and at times have depended on it, but I among many, many others do not consider Cogent as an equal to a variety of other providers. I'm not making this up it's just a well known fact. Cogent gets de-peered with others on a far more frequent basis than any other major provider. Just Google cogent depeered vs. abovenet depeered or level3 depeered. There is no comparison. So, what are you going to do when your customers are calling asking why they can't get to a particular site? All because you're caught up in some pissing match between carriers. I know our clients don't care what the reason is, they are more interested in what we're going to do to fix it. If Cogent is all you got then you're SOL! Again, the bottom line is any carrier can break. If you can only have one then find one that breaks the least...that may very well be Cogent in your particular area, but not in most cases. If you can have more than one, Cogent is a good low cost second or third to have as a complement to your network. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Bret Clark Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 5:10 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams Brad Belton wrote: While I agree no solution can be considered equal in any given location, there are trends or a general barometer to help place one carrier over another. Such as? This is exactly my point (being made by Tom, a Cogent customer!) why Cogent should not be depended on as a sole or primary Internet feed. If Cogent's all you got then you're SOL! Baloney, we've used them as one of our primary's for well over a year without hiccup. Our so other better providers have given us more frustration. Bottom line is any carrier can break. If you can only have one then find one that breaks the least. If you can have more than one, Cogent is a good low cost second or third to have in a pinch for relatively little cost. Where are you getting your data from? Curious as to why you feel they are a second or third alternative? Bret -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 5:01 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams While I agree no solution can be considered equal in any given location, there are trends or a general barometer to help place one carrier over another. This is the reality that typically puts Cogent towards the back of the bus in most people's minds. The biggest proponents of Cogent are those that are largely dependent on Cogent due to any number of reasons. Budget constraints, lack of alternate higher quality peer availability etc, etc. Cogent makes no excuse promoting themselves as the low end, budget driven bottom dollar provider. They are good for what they offer, but again not what a network administrator looking for high availability is going to pick as a first choice. You might even get away with saying Cogent has a few more short duration (less than 15 minutes?) outages than other carriers. This is exactly my point (being made by Tom, a Cogent customer!) why Cogent should not be depended on as a sole or primary Internet feed. If Cogent's all you got then you're SOL! Bottom line is any carrier can break. If you can only have one then find one that breaks the least. If you can have more than one, Cogent is a good low cost second or third to have in a pinch for relatively little cost. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Tom DeReggi Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 4:28 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams It should be noted that an Upstreams performance can be directly proportional to the location where they have more peering. In the DC and NY markets, Cogent has excellent performance and peering, and has shown to outperform EVERY provider we have tried, period. (And yes, some of the carriers we tried were Level3, XO, and Abovenet.) I recognize that Cogent's performance may not be as good for ALL markets where they potentially could have a weaker presence. But saying Cogent is only worthy of the 3rd or 4th transit connection is simply untrue. Cogent's weak point now is internal processes and communication. They've lost touch with the value of
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
With any provider, you should have a BGP mix. Cogent has had peering disputes with some of the bigger networks over the years. If you were multi-homed, you had no problem. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Bret Clark bcl...@spectraaccess.com Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 1:15 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams I always hear about Cogent having a bad rap, but where does that come from? I can't say that one bit! They've worked great for us and during the initial install clearly went above and beyond the call of duty when we encountered a problem even waking a VP up at 1AM on a Sunday morning because we need to have the circuit up and running by first thing Monday! When I have add to call their tech support up about questions that actually understand what BGP is and how it works! Bret On Wed, 2009-10-21 at 11:58 -0500, Jon Auer wrote: Cogent has a bad rap but they have been solid for us for the past year. Prior to that they had a few hickups. Their peering is pretty good. Low latency to all major content sites. Level3 seems to have more outages than a provider of their reputation should. Savvis is has poor peering from what I hear. I'd like to add Abovenet or Global crossing to my mix. On 10/21/09, Marco Coelho coelh...@gmail.com wrote: I'm a GigE circuit to the mix, and I've got a choice of: Abovenet Cogent Global Crossing Level3 Savvis I'm looking for recommendations of who the better upstream is. Marco -- Marco C. Coelho Argon Technologies Inc. POB 875 Greenville, TX 75403-0875 903-455-5036 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Tom, Can you explain how you tested that Cogent "outperformed" every other provider? The only way I know to test that is to actually have all those providers, running full BGP routes to your router and seeing where the traffic goes. Is that how you tested? Travis Microserv Tom DeReggi wrote: It should be noted that an Upstreams performance can be directly proportional to the location where they have more peering. In the DC and NY markets, Cogent has excellent performance and peering, and has shown to outperform EVERY provider we have tried, period. (And yes, some of the carriers we tried were Level3, XO, and Abovenet.) I recognize that Cogent's performance "may" not be as good for ALL markets where they potentially could have a weaker presence. But saying Cogent is only worthy of the 3rd or 4th transit connection is simply untrue. Cogent's weak point now is internal processes and communication. They've lost touch with the value of having personal Account Reps, and render the reps powerless to manage the accounts, in favor of the customer relationship managed by the clueless billing/collections department. Its a shame. You might even get away with saying Cogent has a few more short duration (less than 15 minutes?) outages than other carriers. But their tech support has been the best by far in the industry, and oversubscription has never been a problem from what I see. In picking a Transit provider its really a decision about where your traffic typically flows, and where you need good performance to. NOT anyone has best performance everywhere. For example, Hurricane has excellent performance AND they are inexpensive. They have a really good peering presensence in CA. I'm not confident that they have nearly as good a presence on the East coast though, but those that have used them on teh east coast that I know have been happy. We were considering using them. Abovenet has great Gig-E Transport. But their transit is expensive, and its because its more expensive for them to provide it, because they are not as well positioned to do it cost effectively, not because its necessarilly better. Level3 as well, has many strength. They have a lot of web host clients. It can really help performance to reach certain sites. Level3 also tends to blocks smaller BGP block announcements, more so than someone like Cogent. Level3 is good for a secondaryu because they usually have diverse routes. Some providers have good performance to France, Amsterdam, India, others dont. Savvis tends to have real peering to NY finacnial markets. I often see Blended bandwdith combining Global Cross and Level3, not sure why these two are chosen as a pair. Maybe its simply becaue they tend to be colocated at the same carrier hotels? But selecting a transit provider is not as simple as saying one is better. My personaly opinion is, find the two lowest cost providers, and then you can afford to buy more bandwidth, and have two options to route customers. You also need to consider the path to where you take it. For example, Cogent remote tenant buildings likely have routers with less ram that cant handle full BGP tables, so they require creating session to two seperate BGP servers (with the second one having full routes.). But of you connect to them inb a major colo center that doesn;t exist. Similar things exist with other providers depending on where you pick up the circuit. What I like about Abovenet, is they'll map out their network for you, so you know exactly what you are buying, so true redunancy can be built into the network design. Cogent is a bit more secrative about the traffic path. XO has had some really good account reps, and I liked that. But for me, they didn't really give me anything exciting as far as price or performance, more than anyone else. It should also be noted that it could make a big difference which local colo you pick the circuit up in also. So when you are evaluating a provider you are also evaluating the venue where the circuit is in. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: "Brad Belton" b...@belwave.com To: bcl...@spectraaccess.com; "'WISPA General List'" wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 3:47 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams Cogent can be ok, but they are not equal to AboveNET, XO, ATT, Level3 etc... We have multiple upstream GigE feeds and Cogent is one of them. It took us months to get Cogent to resolve a flapping switch or router within their network. After a couple dozen screenshots and trace routes from various looking glass sites they finally conceded. Granted the outages were only between 5 and 60 seconds long when they occurred and rarely were long enough to break BGP sessions, but they were hell on VoIP! It took us less than a day to find the specific Cogent IP or device where the problem was occurring, but months before
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Brad Belton wrote: Hello Bret, You missed the point about the biggest proponents of Cogent are those that only have Cogentsilence... We prepend our other peers, because Cogent has been the most stable and latency/jitter the lowest. So I don't get you point... I'm not a Cogent basher as we have a Cogent GigE feed too and at times have depended on it, but I among many, many others do not consider Cogent as an equal to a variety of other providers. I'm not making this up it's just a well known fact. ' But you are bashing them. Besides they all have their skeletons and I've been involved with many of them on those skeletons. Recently had to stop announcing routes to ATT because of continuous route flaps. Try to get a hold of someone at ATT who has 1/2 clue. Cogent gets de-peered with others on a far more frequent basis than any other major provider. Just Google cogent depeered vs. abovenet depeered or level3 depeered. There is no comparison. Does this fall into the category of If its on the Internet is must be true? :). I won't disagree that Cogent seems to get depeered more often recently with Sprint last year, but if Cogent is taking business away from the other tier providers, I could see some of them trying to flex their muscles by pulling the depeering card. But I guess if you want to bash Cogent, I haven't been happy with how they are handling IP6 right now. So, what are you going to do when your customers are calling asking why they can't get to a particular site? All because you're caught up in some pissing match between carriers. I know our clients don't care what the reason is, they are more interested in what we're going to do to fix it. If Cogent is all you got then you're SOL! Regardless of our point of views, if you anyone is going to offer Internet services to customers, you should never have just one upstream connection. Additionally I find too many people have opinions of a provider based on there personal experience in a particular region. Cogent works great out of the Boston NAP and I know numerous other providers who would state the same. Maybe in you location that's not true. Bret WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency
The problems with the Gabriel 2' dual polarity dishes has been fixed. Chances are you only saw these issues because you were not using radomes. The epoxy or whatever sealant they were using at the tip of the feedhorn to hold the end cap on was breaking down and the feedhorn would wick moisture when the feedhorn temp would change hot to cold and back. We had quite a few failures but none with radomes because there was no direct moisture contact with the end. Still use them to this day with no issues. -B- Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: jp j...@saucer.midcoast.com Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2009 17:42:32 To: WISPA General Listwireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency I bought some gabriel dishes probably 8-10 years ago, and they all failed, so gabriel gave us a deal on new feedhorns, and most of them have since failed too. Perhaps things are better now. We had one fail this past winter, and just took it off the tower this summer. We just tossed the dish and feedhorn in the grass and forgot about it. I'm not going to buy another feedhorn for it. We're mostly using pacwireless for dishes as a result. We've had a few of them fail a couple years ago, but they've fixed that, and percentagewise, they've been more reliable. A radome also protects the feedhorn quite well, and we use a radome anytime where we are near the ocean or are being careful not to overload a tower, as the radome both protects the feedhorn and reduces windloading. We also only buy the dual pole ones now. We'd started to for the trangolink45's which can switch polarity with software. Now, it looks like 2x2 MIMO based products are the future for backhaul, and we'd like to not have to upgrade antennas with the radios. If you use a radome, you have to actually disassemble the thing to change feedhorns, so do it right the first time. The Gabriels are a lot lighter due to their all alloy construction. On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 11:38:17AM -0500, ccrum wrote: I'll second that. I can't tell you how many pac dishes have either leaked water into the feed or have major problems with icing in the winter. I triple seal everything on my dishes and have had pac grids and solids somehow still get water into the center pin of the connector. I have no idea how it happens, but after about the 20th time, I just plain quit using them. I've never had this trouble on a Gabriel or Radiowaves dish and I apply the same sealing technique. Also, I've noticed in bench testing that that the Gabriel feeds have better SWR plots and provide MUCH better isolation between their dual pol feeds than the PAC. Cameron Brad Belton wrote: BTW Mark, if you determine they are PacWireless antennas I'd just punt them on EBay and replace them with RadioWaves or Gabriel 2' antennas. In the long run you'll be a lot happier. Just my opinion... Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Brad Belton Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 10:01 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Ok, just checking. Good cover...grin Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:56 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency The feedhorn specifically. Maybe the length will help you too. I know with higher gain the 5GHz grids are noticeably longer. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Brad Belton b...@belwave.com wrote: Hmmm, pretty sure a 2' dish is a 2' dish regardless of frequency...or are you speaking of the diameter of the feed? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Identifying 2ft dish frequency Can you measure diameter and compare it with the 2.4 and 5.8 GHz dishes? Never thought about it but they would have to be different sizes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 10:34 AM, Mark McElvy mmce...@accubak.com wrote: I happen to know they are either 5.8 or 2.4 as this was the only equipment I have found of theirs, they left it all when they went
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Brad, Once again I disagree. Cogent represents themselves as low cost, but they have never represented themselves as low quality. Second, Cogent is most ideal as the FIRST PRIMARY provider, because Cogent is higher performing, and faster speed connections are more affordable. I agree, a backup secondary provider is needed to help when there are short outages. The backup providers dont need to be as high a capacity, or as quality, as they are seldom used exempt in the rare emergencies. Third, What determines how inexpensive a Transit provider is has nothing to do with Quality, it has to do with who has more settlement free peers. Cogent costs less, because Cogent has to pay fewer other ISPs for capacity. This DOES NOT mean they use low quality public peering, it means that they have more quality private peering negotiated at better terms. Bottom line is any carrier can break That, I agree with. Which is why its important to have two upstreams. But, that is not a reason to not buy Cogent first. By buying Cogent first it allows a provider to become more profitable sooner, and therefore able to afford sooner multiple upstreams. Its also depends on what the downstream offers in its value proposition. With Cogent, I offer my custoemrs Gig-E when others can offer 100mb. With Cogent, I can offer my customers half the price, if not 1/3rd the price that my tier2 competitiors can offer. With Cogent, I offer excellent performance, better than most, most of the time, and if they get an outage so what. Is it really better to have less good performance all the time, to gain .009 better uptime? That depends on the target client base of the WISP. You also got another thing right... I am largely dependant on Cogent, and I hate that. But its relevent to ask why I'm dependant? When I first started out, it was because of price, but not anymore. I'm dependant on Cogent because its really hard to find a Tier1 Carrier that can offer anywhere near as equivellent consistent performance and tech support. My customers really noticed, everytime I tried someone else, so someone else never lastest. Note that I did not say uptime, I said performance. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton b...@belwave.com To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 6:01 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams While I agree no solution can be considered equal in any given location, there are trends or a general barometer to help place one carrier over another. This is the reality that typically puts Cogent towards the back of the bus in most people's minds. The biggest proponents of Cogent are those that are largely dependent on Cogent due to any number of reasons. Budget constraints, lack of alternate higher quality peer availability etc, etc. Cogent makes no excuse promoting themselves as the low end, budget driven bottom dollar provider. They are good for what they offer, but again not what a network administrator looking for high availability is going to pick as a first choice. You might even get away with saying Cogent has a few more short duration (less than 15 minutes?) outages than other carriers. This is exactly my point (being made by Tom, a Cogent customer!) why Cogent should not be depended on as a sole or primary Internet feed. If Cogent's all you got then you're SOL! Bottom line is any carrier can break. If you can only have one then find one that breaks the least. If you can have more than one, Cogent is a good low cost second or third to have in a pinch for relatively little cost. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Tom DeReggi Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 4:28 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams It should be noted that an Upstreams performance can be directly proportional to the location where they have more peering. In the DC and NY markets, Cogent has excellent performance and peering, and has shown to outperform EVERY provider we have tried, period. (And yes, some of the carriers we tried were Level3, XO, and Abovenet.) I recognize that Cogent's performance may not be as good for ALL markets where they potentially could have a weaker presence. But saying Cogent is only worthy of the 3rd or 4th transit connection is simply untrue. Cogent's weak point now is internal processes and communication. They've lost touch with the value of having personal Account Reps, and render the reps powerless to manage the accounts, in favor of the customer relationship managed by the clueless billing/collections department. Its a shame. You might even get away with saying Cogent has a few more short duration (less than 15 minutes?) outages than other carriers. But their tech support has been the best by
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Nathan, Like your perspective. I'll say the reason that I admit that I have had some uptime issues is that. I once had an ATT- T1, that never had a single outage or degregation in the 4 years that we had it. NOT one. It was special to have that experience, and see something so reliable over time, that simply could be relied on. Some people have that high of a standard. For example, I bet the NY Stock Exchange would pay about anything to guarantee 4 years of ZERO downtime. But, in my opinon we no longer live in that age. Networks are getting complicated. We are in the age of SHARED infrastructure. All it takes is a single config mistake for a new sub, and a metro network can accidentally be taken down. Short outages now and then are tolerable and to be expected on any carriers network, and Carriers expect tier2/3 ISPs to have backup transits. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Nathan Stooke nstooke...@wisperisp.com To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 6:33 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams Hello, I know when we where shopping for bandwidth all of the other providers said Cogent was bad yet almost all of Cogent customers said they were great!! You have to take into account the bias of the person that started the rumor. We have had cogent for almost 3 years. 2 times have we gone down. First, for 30 min, was the part failing and the second, 3 hours, was replacing the part after it failed a second time. Their support is great and they know their stuff. No matter who you chose to go with 2 providers is better than 1. However, we still only have one for cost and the given track record of Cogent. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Nick Olsen Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 5:24 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams As we can all see, This is very dependent on market. Bret here has had a great time with cogent, where others are quick to say its a lesser provider. Arguing which carrier has better uptime is a waste of time. Long story short, Pick what is the best in that market. You might even get away with looking up some of the big company's in your city, and if they peer with someone you might also want to peer with (like cogent). Give them a call and see if you can get a tech, see what they have to say about $CARRIER in your area. They might tell you to jump in a lake, but you might get someone cool who is willing to talk. Nick Olsen Brevard Wireless (321) 205-1100 x106 From: Bret Clark bcl...@spectraaccess.com Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 6:10 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams Brad Belton wrote: While I agree no solution can be considered equal in any given location, there are trends or a general barometer to help place one carrier over another. Such as? This is exactly my point (being made by Tom, a Cogent customer!) why Cogent should not be depended on as a sole or primary Internet feed. If Cogent's all you got then you're SOL! Baloney, we've used them as one of our primary's for well over a year without hiccup. Our so other better providers have given us more frustration. Bottom line is any carrier can break. If you can only have one then find one that breaks the least. If you can have more than one, Cogent is a good low cost second or third to have in a pinch for relatively little cost. Where are you getting your data from? Curious as to why you feel they are a second or third alternative? Bret WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Isn't XO a Level3 reseller? I dont know, they could be in some markets. But what I can tell you is that XO does own their own national fiber backbone that covers some US markets. But that brings up a new topic about why some can be more cost competitive in certain areas. It really boils down to what assets they have strong in that market. I like to use a specific real world example of mine. I'll leave out the exact locations, to respect vendor. The path is from point A (NOC) to Point B (Neutral Carrier Hotel.) Above.net owns the fiber to the PointA building. Cogent buy's Above.net's dark fiber to deliver our transit service. Prices below are per month. Above.net DarkFiber- $8k per month Above.net Gig-E transport from PointA to PointB- $2k Above.net 200mbps Transit at PointB -$2k Above.net 200mbps Transit delivered to PointA - $4k Cogent Gig-E transit at PointA- $4k Cogent 200mbps transit at PointA- $1600 Cogent Gig-E transport from Point A to Point B- $6k Cogent 100mbps PTP PointA to B- $1k XO transit 100mbps PointA - $3000k (because they have to pay more for transport to that site) Those above prices make absolutely no sense. Why is it? The most expensive service offers the less (dark fiber). Itsclear why, when abovenet sees Cogent's selling retail lower than the dark fiber owner, and a desire to prevent that situation from replicating to more competitors. Cogent's fiber costs are very minimal. The biggest cost to both the Tier1 carriers is peering cross connects. They are $300 per Cross connect. EVEN if the peer only passes 10mbps of traffic on average. Cogent does way higher volume in the region, therefore divides that cost of all peering connection by those higher number of connections, and develops a lower cost for peering per subscriber. Therefore Cogent can afford more peers at the site. As they get more peers, their transit cost go down. But Cogent's volume gets large enough that their transit becomes cheap enough, that they can charge me less for it, than selling me the transport without the transit. Its worth it to them, to own my Transit, even if not being compensated for it, because it discourages customers from peering with others. My point here is, the priciing in this example has nothing to do with quality, it has to do with volume at a particular venue or market. Whoever gained more momentum has the potential to offer lower price, quality of the network design never really enters into the equation. Cogents strategy has always been to low ball price to gain more momentum, and control more traffic, to negotiate lower peering costs. My second point is, these costs dont consider Colocation costs. It was determined that Colocation and peering really does not pay off until one is doing over 1GB of traffic, if reason for colo is to save cost by peering. So if doing under a gig, comparing carriers is about the cost comparison at PointA. ISPs get locked into an upstream Tier1 because of their position to remote facilities. If doing over 1GB, well, then its a different game, because all carriers are closer positioned at that Carrier Neutral hotel, and there are different metric for differentiation. But there are so many scenarios today, its near impossbile to predict who will offer better bandwdith, before trying it. Even Resellers now can offer better performance sometimes than the tier1. When a fiber line between NewYork and DC can be had with only a added 1-2ms of latency, its leaves room for games to reduce cost. One game is to peer at Carrier Hotels with low cost Cross Connects, where its $100/mon, and then Transport all the traffic back to a central source where one does it s primary high capacity peers. The performance degregation of the extra hop is often unnoticeable. Again, cost comes back to how much volume can be sold by that reseller from that venue. IF enough Tranffic can be offloaded to peering, only a small percentage of traffic needs to be split between a couple upstream transit providers. My recommendation is to always do a short term contract the first time you try a new provider at a specific venue, then after shown thats it performs well, upgrade to long term contract to reduce cost. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 5:31 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams Isn't XO a Level3 reseller? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Oct 21, 2009 at 5:28 PM, Tom DeReggi wirelessn...@rapiddsl.netwrote: It should be noted that an Upstreams performance can be directly proportional to the location where they have more
Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing.
Yep, the j mounts that the dish goes on. They make good mounts for the nano stations -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 7:03 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. Pole mounts are 8 bucks at Skywalker. When you say 2 bucks are those used from the dish installer? On 10/21/09, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com wrote: It comes from being a cheap S.O.B. Those J mounts aren't cheap new but the used ones for 2 bucks are usually perfect. A little WD-40 on the adjuster and it's all good. I don't know what they're made of, maybe some aluminum alloy but they are really light, I doubt they have much value as scrap so the 2 bucks is probably more than equitable for them. This is a metal yard that I deal with. Have the landfill lady hint to the junk collectors that good tower sections not bent or damaged much might bring more cash. They get really careful if they think they might make an extra 50 cents. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 3:06 PM To: WISPA General List; sarn...@info-ed.com; 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. VERY Useful! I am going to make a sign and go visit my local landfill lady real soon. Thanks for a great idea. Mike At 10:35 AM 10/21/2009, Robert West wrote: Scottie, I've had some minor success by talking to a local metal scrap yard. It's a pretty good sized one, they put up a small sign at the pay window saying that if they get any tower sections to not crush or bend them. If they get a get sections they call and I go over. It's usually old American Tower 8 foot sections, like TV tower, but some are pretty useful. They charge usually 30 cents per pound and I pay a few cents over that for good sections in exchange for the sign next to the pay window. A month or so ago they called and I had to go out to a field to look at some that were too big for the metal collector guy to take into the yard. 2 80 foot heavy duty free standing towers in good shape laying in the field all overgrown with weeds. 150 bucks for the pair. Didn't know how much they weighed so I just offered the 150. They will also hold old DirectTV dishs and the J arm mounts for them if the sorters remember. Those are handy to have at 2 bucks each. As long as I pay more than scrap value, they are all over it. They usually have more stuff than I need though. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Cc: motoro...@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. What is a good price to give for a standard Rohn SSV tower, 100' with sections 7N, 6N, 5N, 4N, and 3WN in real good shape, each section still assembled, already down and ready for loading. I priced it new at around $8500. I have looked at www.usedtowers.com, but those are way higher than what I got this one for. I already won it at auction, but just checking to make sure I didn't screw up. Do any of you know where to find used towers besides qth.com, eham.net, ebay, and usedtowers.com? I have a few local places, but I am looking to expand my searches beyond those mentioned and local. TIA, Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. -- - - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- - - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- - - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- - - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/
Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing.
That's probably what they are. Very thin wall and light. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 7:18 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. Never seen the aluminum ones. Every Dish/Direct dish mount I've seen are epoxy paint coated steel. At 05:54 PM 10/21/2009, you wrote: It comes from being a cheap S.O.B. Those J mounts aren't cheap new but the used ones for 2 bucks are usually perfect. A little WD-40 on the adjuster and it's all good. I don't know what they're made of, maybe some aluminum alloy but they are really light, I doubt they have much value as scrap so the 2 bucks is probably more than equitable for them. This is a metal yard that I deal with. Have the landfill lady hint to the junk collectors that good tower sections not bent or damaged much might bring more cash. They get really careful if they think they might make an extra 50 cents. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2009 3:06 PM To: WISPA General List; sarn...@info-ed.com; 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. VERY Useful! I am going to make a sign and go visit my local landfill lady real soon. Thanks for a great idea. Mike At 10:35 AM 10/21/2009, Robert West wrote: Scottie, I've had some minor success by talking to a local metal scrap yard. It's a pretty good sized one, they put up a small sign at the pay window saying that if they get any tower sections to not crush or bend them. If they get a get sections they call and I go over. It's usually old American Tower 8 foot sections, like TV tower, but some are pretty useful. They charge usually 30 cents per pound and I pay a few cents over that for good sections in exchange for the sign next to the pay window. A month or so ago they called and I had to go out to a field to look at some that were too big for the metal collector guy to take into the yard. 2 80 foot heavy duty free standing towers in good shape laying in the field all overgrown with weeds. 150 bucks for the pair. Didn't know how much they weighed so I just offered the 150. They will also hold old DirectTV dishs and the J arm mounts for them if the sorters remember. Those are handy to have at 2 bucks each. As long as I pay more than scrap value, they are all over it. They usually have more stuff than I need though. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2009 9:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Cc: motoro...@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] OT: Used Tower Pricing. What is a good price to give for a standard Rohn SSV tower, 100' with sections 7N, 6N, 5N, 4N, and 3WN in real good shape, each section still assembled, already down and ready for loading. I priced it new at around $8500. I have looked at www.usedtowers.com, but those are way higher than what I got this one for. I already won it at auction, but just checking to make sure I didn't screw up. Do any of you know where to find used towers besides qth.com, eham.net, ebay, and usedtowers.com? I have a few local places, but I am looking to expand my searches beyond those mentioned and local. TIA, Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/
Re: [WISPA] choice of upstreams
Travis, Right now, we currently only have two Cogent transit connections live. One in Maryland, and one in DC. There is a story behind why that is the case right now, but I prefer to keep that off a PUBLIC INTERNET list. But just because that is the case today, does not mean that that has always been the case. NO, I have not taken 4-5 Transit connections from the same venue from diverse providers, and tested them side by side simultaneously in a scientific case. If you want that, go buy a InterNAP connection at $60/mb/mon, and they'll give you a monthly report of which of their 5-7 upstream are performing best to what destinations. But that experiment wouldn't really teach us anything. That would only test the performance from that specific Venue location. As I said before, different providers perform differently at different venues that they are best individually positioned to perform from. And any test I did here, really wouldn't help you in Idaho. A year ago, we setup a client to host their critical application servers with InterNAP bandwidth at Equinix Ashburn, because of the promise to Route Optimize between 5+ tier1s. Ironically, we are now in the process of moving them to CRGWest to colocate, where they will use us for Bandwidth, one hop from our DC Cogent transit. Why? Because my client has an office in DC, and their backup servers are in their office, and I have provided them their office bandwdith for the last 2 years. Their customers (spread between mutliple ISPs and cities) had more consistent performance testing to the backup/development servers accross my Cogent connection, than they do to the servers located behind InterNAP bandwdith. He said, WHY in the world should I continue to pay 6 times more, and not noticeably gain anything? But to answer your question. I made generalizations based on my experiences over the years with different carriers. Not all my experiences comes from the DC market, and not all of my circuits use my own RapidDSL IP BLocks. I just started routing my own IP blocks w/BGP two years ago, and I have rather simple BGP needs, but I've been buying transit for 14 years. Some of my circuits used only upstream's IP and not even BGP, in some cases, for example when I bought circuits for specific events. I dont funnel all my network to one primary transit destination. I have three primary NOCs, and route shortest path to the closest transit connection, and wireless to the backup NOC where appropriate. (Note I used to have 4 Transit connections, but I recently disconnected two) I also rarely ever had more than two providers at one time, because I have no need for that. I tried a backup for a while, then when it didn't work well, at the end of the term, I tried another. In some cases, I was smart enough to buy service for only 1 month, to first see if I really gained anything. I often did that at a Carrier hotel, where a partner or reseller had a cage, and then if the link didn;t work well, well I never committed to buying colocation space, becaue the coloc space just added a few $1000 for no gain. But in the last 7 years (at different times) we have had 100 mbps connections from Yipes, Cogent, Level3, Global Crossing, Hurricaine, InterNap, Abovenet, and XO, and several Blended reseller carriers. They were NOT always from the same locations, because we dont currently colocate in carrier hotels, although that is about to change. I've gained more experience this year than others, because we had taken on a lot of temporary broadband jobs in remote cities. For example, we did LA last year for the Oscars, we did New York a few weeks ago, We partnered with another ISP in Chicago a few months ago. When we do these jobs, we use a local transit provider in that city. Sometimes we buy a circuit of our own, sometimes we find a local ISP and buy transit from their already live network. But it gives us teh opportunity to do some tests from that location for a couple of days, to see how it performed. We also have done short studies by askign other local ISPs if we could do some tests from their NOCs, and compare results. Often we might pick thirty well known sites to test latency or max capacity transfers to. But it does not require having a connection ourselves to test a provider's connection. Looking Glasses help. For example, we like to Use Quest's looking glass, and then test to various Internet sites. And then we can compare the results from our Cogent link to those same sites. We can then see at what providers the latency rises along paths. But there are many mroe looking glassses to compare. Then there are the 10 or so most common speed test sites. We've done studies for customers where they had DS3s with other carriers, and we offered to do free performance comparision before they'd agree to try/buy our service. So we'd go to their site, connect to their ISP, and run tests, and give them side by
