[WISPA] UL 1Gbps Link
List I have to propose a half mile 100 Mbps upgradable to 1 Gbps Link, I was thinking on 60 or 70/80 Ghz gear, customer budget is below $20k, What are the options? Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] UL 1Gbps Link
Is terrabeam still in business? - Original Message - From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 8:14 AM Subject: [WISPA] UL 1Gbps Link List I have to propose a half mile 100 Mbps upgradable to 1 Gbps Link, I was thinking on 60 or 70/80 Ghz gear, customer budget is below $20k, What are the options? Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] UL 1Gbps Link
This is well out of your budget for this project, but we recently put up a BridgeWave 80GHz with 2' antennas. Nice gear aside from the rinky-dink ODU enclosure. Pretty amazing to see a product at that price level with a plastic single edge housing seal with one center thumb screw holding the lid on. Good thing we bought a spare for the shelf because I don't see how water won't get in eventually. The gear has performed as expected. Full Duplex GigE and auto-rates down to 100MB FDX if necessary. It has withstood some pretty brutal storms the past several months and has only completely dropped traffic for about 10-15 seconds during the worst of it. The link is 2.35 miles, so we're very pleased with the overall uptime. I'm not sure you can find a GigE link for under $20K. Have you tried Steven Patrick with http://www.cablefreesolutions.com ? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gino Villarini Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 9:14 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] UL 1Gbps Link List I have to propose a half mile 100 Mbps upgradable to 1 Gbps Link, I was thinking on 60 or 70/80 Ghz gear, customer budget is below $20k, What are the options? Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] UL 1Gbps Link
I think they are proxim now ... Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2 Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 10:38 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] UL 1Gbps Link Is terrabeam still in business? - Original Message - From: Gino Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 8:14 AM Subject: [WISPA] UL 1Gbps Link List I have to propose a half mile 100 Mbps upgradable to 1 Gbps Link, I was thinking on 60 or 70/80 Ghz gear, customer budget is below $20k, What are the options? Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] UL 1Gbps Link
Done a good quantity of BridgeWave and have had no issues with water incursion. Did a dual 80 Ghz. (one of the first deployments :-P ) last year. 2 links running side by side with less than 100 ft separation (factory wanted 400+ feet but the cost to make the building wider prohibited that. That link was over 2 miles also. The 60 Ghz. product lists for under $20K. Proxim's Gigabeam (which I think was Terror Wave g) is less than that. Bridgewave has a licensed 80 Ghz. system while Proxim has a licensed 70 Ghz. Bob On Apr 30, 2008, at 10:39 AM, Brad Belton wrote: This is well out of your budget for this project, but we recently put up a BridgeWave 80GHz with 2' antennas. Nice gear aside from the rinky- dink ODU enclosure. Pretty amazing to see a product at that price level with a plastic single edge housing seal with one center thumb screw holding the lid on. Good thing we bought a spare for the shelf because I don't see how water won't get in eventually. The gear has performed as expected. Full Duplex GigE and auto- rates down to 100MB FDX if necessary. It has withstood some pretty brutal storms the past several months and has only completely dropped traffic for about 10-15 seconds during the worst of it. The link is 2.35 miles, so we're very pleased with the overall uptime. I'm not sure you can find a GigE link for under $20K. Have you tried Steven Patrick with http://www.cablefreesolutions.com ? Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gino Villarini Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 9:14 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] UL 1Gbps Link List I have to propose a half mile 100 Mbps upgradable to 1 Gbps Link, I was thinking on 60 or 70/80 Ghz gear, customer budget is below $20k, What are the options? Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ Bob Moldashel [EMAIL PROTECTED] WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] UL 1Gbps Link
Sorry..That should have been Terror Beam :-) Bob Moldashel [EMAIL PROTECTED] WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] UL 1Gbps Link
It won't get you to 1Gbps, but Trango has their Giga links on sale for about $10k. That is 100Mbps full duplex, then another $1500 gets you a software upgrade key to 300Mbps full duplex. That would be a licensed link at 18GHz. (let us know what you end up with) On April 30, at 10:14 AM April 30, Gino Villarini wrote: I have to propose a half mile 100 Mbps upgradable to 1 Gbps Link, I was thinking on 60 or 70/80 Ghz gear, customer budget is below $20k, What are the options? Gino A. Villarini WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] channels / bandwidth planning for 4.9 GHz
How do you optimally divide a 4.9 public safety network for bandwidth planning for, say, a city police or fire department? (I'm googling for resources that help tell where to find the appropriate bandwidth / channel, but don't see anything good.) WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Tranzeo 900 mhz gear
Anyone got any they can sell me ? I need to use an access point w/N connector on a base station and I need 4 CPE's, self enclosed. If you can help, offlist please... WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Maryland Possibility
Does anyone server Oakland, Maryland? Please contact me offlist. Thanks, Eric WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] channels / bandwidth planning for 4.9 GHz
On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 10:32 AM, Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We would advise use of 5 MHz channels for starters, and preferably tighter mask gear since you'll get high capacity at long range in a small channel. Low mask gear's capacity dies at very close range since the allowed power is a small fraction of tight mask gear. I was going to ask what that meant, but I continued googling and found this PDF, which helped explain things for me a little bit better. http://www.ic.gc.ca/epic/site/smt-gst.nsf/vwapj/dgtp-005-05-49ghz-canada.pdf/$FILE/dgtp-005-05-49ghz-canada.pdf WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Metered Broadband
So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Half my customers have pulled less than 1G since April 16 or so when I started tracking it. I'll be optimistic and think they would all do 1G per month. I don't think I am going to drop a $33 per month customer down to $2 per month. I might consider $30 base and $2/G over X/Gig, but I haven't figured out what X is, yet. Mike Hammett wrote: So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Scott Reed Owner NewWays Networking, LLC Wireless Networking Network Design, Installation and Administration Mikrotik Advanced Certified www.nwwnet.net (765) 855-1060 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Hi, Although it's a great thought, I don't think "metered" broadband will ever catch on in the US. Even the cell phone companies are moving to an "unlimited voice/data/SMS package for only $99" service pricing. My power company will do a "level-pay" program on my power after being activated for a full year. They take the average of the 12 months and that's your fixed monthly payment. They make adjustments each year, if necessary. There are a couple things I see: (1) People would rather have a higher monthly rate, if they know it's a fixed price. Nobody likes surprises, especially when it comes to bills. (2) You are basically cutting your own throat by doing something like this. Why would you go install a customer that may be a $15/mo customer (because they only check email) compared with installing a $29/mo customer? It's the same amount of time, equipment, customer support, tower rent, AP, etc. If you have people that are using more than a "fair" amount of bandwidth, then charge them more or ask them to leave... but there's no reason to completely remodel your pricing structure because of a few customers. Travis Microserv Scott Reed wrote: Half my customers have pulled less than 1G since April 16 or so when I started tracking it. I'll be optimistic and think they would all do 1G per month. I don't think I am going to drop a $33 per month customer down to $2 per month. I might consider $30 base and $2/G over X/Gig, but I haven't figured out what X is, yet. Mike Hammett wrote: So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
I agree mosth customers havn't hit 1GB transfer for this year. But what about the customer that downloaded 25GB last week? I have a few of those. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 9:45 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband Hi, Although it's a great thought, I don't think metered broadband will ever catch on in the US. Even the cell phone companies are moving to an unlimited voice/data/SMS package for only $99 service pricing. My power company will do a level-pay program on my power after being activated for a full year. They take the average of the 12 months and that's your fixed monthly payment. They make adjustments each year, if necessary. There are a couple things I see: (1) People would rather have a higher monthly rate, if they know it's a fixed price. Nobody likes surprises, especially when it comes to bills. (2) You are basically cutting your own throat by doing something like this. Why would you go install a customer that may be a $15/mo customer (because they only check email) compared with installing a $29/mo customer? It's the same amount of time, equipment, customer support, tower rent, AP, etc. If you have people that are using more than a fair amount of bandwidth, then charge them more or ask them to leave... but there's no reason to completely remodel your pricing structure because of a few customers. Travis Microserv Scott Reed wrote: Half my customers have pulled less than 1G since April 16 or so when I started tracking it. I'll be optimistic and think they would all do 1G per month. I don't think I am going to drop a $33 per month customer down to $2 per month. I might consider $30 base and $2/G over X/Gig, but I haven't figured out what X is, yet. Mike Hammett wrote: So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Those are the ones you give your competition. Kurt Fankhauser wrote: I agree mosth customers havn't hit 1GB transfer for this year. But what about the customer that downloaded 25GB last week? I have a few of those. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 9:45 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband Hi, Although it's a great thought, I don't think metered broadband will ever catch on in the US. Even the cell phone companies are moving to an unlimited voice/data/SMS package for only $99 service pricing. My power company will do a level-pay program on my power after being activated for a full year. They take the average of the 12 months and that's your fixed monthly payment. They make adjustments each year, if necessary. There are a couple things I see: (1) People would rather have a higher monthly rate, if they know it's a fixed price. Nobody likes surprises, especially when it comes to bills. (2) You are basically cutting your own throat by doing something like this. Why would you go install a customer that may be a $15/mo customer (because they only check email) compared with installing a $29/mo customer? It's the same amount of time, equipment, customer support, tower rent, AP, etc. If you have people that are using more than a fair amount of bandwidth, then charge them more or ask them to leave... but there's no reason to completely remodel your pricing structure because of a few customers. Travis Microserv Scott Reed wrote: Half my customers have pulled less than 1G since April 16 or so when I started tracking it. I'll be optimistic and think they would all do 1G per month. I don't think I am going to drop a $33 per month customer down to $2 per month. I might consider $30 base and $2/G over X/Gig, but I haven't figured out what X is, yet. Mike Hammett wrote: So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Haven't done 1 GB this YEAR? Are you sure anything's there? I wouldn't be surprised if I've had a GB of traffic used up just in script kiddies port scanning. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Kurt Fankhauser [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 9:12 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband I agree mosth customers havn't hit 1GB transfer for this year. But what about the customer that downloaded 25GB last week? I have a few of those. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 9:45 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband Hi, Although it's a great thought, I don't think metered broadband will ever catch on in the US. Even the cell phone companies are moving to an unlimited voice/data/SMS package for only $99 service pricing. My power company will do a level-pay program on my power after being activated for a full year. They take the average of the 12 months and that's your fixed monthly payment. They make adjustments each year, if necessary. There are a couple things I see: (1) People would rather have a higher monthly rate, if they know it's a fixed price. Nobody likes surprises, especially when it comes to bills. (2) You are basically cutting your own throat by doing something like this. Why would you go install a customer that may be a $15/mo customer (because they only check email) compared with installing a $29/mo customer? It's the same amount of time, equipment, customer support, tower rent, AP, etc. If you have people that are using more than a fair amount of bandwidth, then charge them more or ask them to leave... but there's no reason to completely remodel your pricing structure because of a few customers. Travis Microserv Scott Reed wrote: Half my customers have pulled less than 1G since April 16 or so when I started tracking it. I'll be optimistic and think they would all do 1G per month. I don't think I am going to drop a $33 per month customer down to $2 per month. I might consider $30 base and $2/G over X/Gig, but I haven't figured out what X is, yet. Mike Hammett wrote: So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
You call them and say We have noticed very heavy activity on your account. Your current package does not permit that type of activity. We do have a package that allows that type of activity, and it is $xx per month. Travis Microserv Kurt Fankhauser wrote: I agree mosth customers havn't hit 1GB transfer for this year. But what about the customer that downloaded 25GB last week? I have a few of those. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 9:45 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband Hi, Although it's a great thought, I don't think metered broadband will ever catch on in the US. Even the cell phone companies are moving to an unlimited voice/data/SMS package for only $99 service pricing. My power company will do a level-pay program on my power after being activated for a full year. They take the average of the 12 months and that's your fixed monthly payment. They make adjustments each year, if necessary. There are a couple things I see: (1) People would rather have a higher monthly rate, if they know it's a fixed price. Nobody likes surprises, especially when it comes to bills. (2) You are basically cutting your own throat by doing something like this. Why would you go install a customer that may be a $15/mo customer (because they only check email) compared with installing a $29/mo customer? It's the same amount of time, equipment, customer support, tower rent, AP, etc. If you have people that are using more than a fair amount of bandwidth, then charge them more or ask them to leave... but there's no reason to completely remodel your pricing structure because of a few customers. Travis Microserv Scott Reed wrote: Half my customers have pulled less than 1G since April 16 or so when I started tracking it. I'll be optimistic and think they would all do 1G per month. I don't think I am going to drop a $33 per month customer down to $2 per month. I might consider $30 base and $2/G over X/Gig, but I haven't figured out what X is, yet. Mike Hammett wrote: So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
oh, I'm not having any issues with excessive customers. I use more (excluding my friend) than 30 other customers combined. Discussions on another list prompted me to ask around about this. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Travis Johnson To: WISPA General List Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband Hi, Although it's a great thought, I don't think metered broadband will ever catch on in the US. Even the cell phone companies are moving to an unlimited voice/data/SMS package for only $99 service pricing. My power company will do a level-pay program on my power after being activated for a full year. They take the average of the 12 months and that's your fixed monthly payment. They make adjustments each year, if necessary. There are a couple things I see: (1) People would rather have a higher monthly rate, if they know it's a fixed price. Nobody likes surprises, especially when it comes to bills. (2) You are basically cutting your own throat by doing something like this. Why would you go install a customer that may be a $15/mo customer (because they only check email) compared with installing a $29/mo customer? It's the same amount of time, equipment, customer support, tower rent, AP, etc. If you have people that are using more than a fair amount of bandwidth, then charge them more or ask them to leave... but there's no reason to completely remodel your pricing structure because of a few customers. Travis Microserv Scott Reed wrote: Half my customers have pulled less than 1G since April 16 or so when I started tracking it. I'll be optimistic and think they would all do 1G per month. I don't think I am going to drop a $33 per month customer down to $2 per month. I might consider $30 base and $2/G over X/Gig, but I haven't figured out what X is, yet. Mike Hammett wrote: So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Cell phones and some telecom companies are the only things where you can get an all you can eat. Note: I'm just playing devil's advocate and providing countering points from other lists to see what others can bring to the conversation. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Travis Johnson To: WISPA General List Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband Hi, Although it's a great thought, I don't think metered broadband will ever catch on in the US. Even the cell phone companies are moving to an unlimited voice/data/SMS package for only $99 service pricing. My power company will do a level-pay program on my power after being activated for a full year. They take the average of the 12 months and that's your fixed monthly payment. They make adjustments each year, if necessary. There are a couple things I see: (1) People would rather have a higher monthly rate, if they know it's a fixed price. Nobody likes surprises, especially when it comes to bills. (2) You are basically cutting your own throat by doing something like this. Why would you go install a customer that may be a $15/mo customer (because they only check email) compared with installing a $29/mo customer? It's the same amount of time, equipment, customer support, tower rent, AP, etc. If you have people that are using more than a fair amount of bandwidth, then charge them more or ask them to leave... but there's no reason to completely remodel your pricing structure because of a few customers. Travis Microserv Scott Reed wrote: Half my customers have pulled less than 1G since April 16 or so when I started tracking it. I'll be optimistic and think they would all do 1G per month. I don't think I am going to drop a $33 per month customer down to $2 per month. I might consider $30 base and $2/G over X/Gig, but I haven't figured out what X is, yet. Mike Hammett wrote: So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
I am not sure what the costs should or will be? But...I will say that is where I think broadband will be headed, for sure, if the FCC keeps going the way they are headed(since the Comcast deal) with the completely open concept, such as no bandwidth shaping of any sort. Even the BIG players such as the major cable companies and the major telcos cannot operate their networks very long with the new bandwidth intensive apps coming along(unless its on their own network) with no bandwidth shaping. IMHO, I think this is how it should be, a cost per data transfer or a limit and then overage charges, just as electric, long distance, water usage, etc... have been for a long time. My 2 pence worth. Scott -- Original Message -- From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:23:58 -0500 So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Most of those are heavily funded and can operate at that point for a while. Wait till they see 80% of their customers using 18,000 minutes of off network minutes a month and see what happens! That's 300 hours a month that I used to see on dial-up usage of many customers. Scott -- Original Message -- From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 21:34:04 -0500 Cell phones and some telecom companies are the only things where you can get an all you can eat. Note: I'm just playing devil's advocate and providing countering points from other lists to see what others can bring to the conversation. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Travis Johnson To: WISPA General List Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband Hi, Although it's a great thought, I don't think metered broadband will ever catch on in the US. Even the cell phone companies are moving to an unlimited voice/data/SMS package for only $99 service pricing. My power company will do a level-pay program on my power after being activated for a full year. They take the average of the 12 months and that's your fixed monthly payment. They make adjustments each year, if necessary. There are a couple things I see: (1) People would rather have a higher monthly rate, if they know it's a fixed price. Nobody likes surprises, especially when it comes to bills. (2) You are basically cutting your own throat by doing something like this. Why would you go install a customer that may be a $15/mo customer (because they only check email) compared with installing a $29/mo customer? It's the same amount of time, equipment, customer support, tower rent, AP, etc. If you have people that are using more than a fair amount of bandwidth, then charge them more or ask them to leave... but there's no reason to completely remodel your pricing structure because of a few customers. Travis Microserv Scott Reed wrote: Half my customers have pulled less than 1G since April 16 or so when I started tracking it. I'll be optimistic and think they would all do 1G per month. I don't think I am going to drop a $33 per month customer down to $2 per month. I might consider $30 base and $2/G over X/Gig, but I haven't figured out what X is, yet. Mike Hammett wrote: So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
I think things are going the other way... cell phones now have "unlimited" plans. Long distance can now be purchased as "unlimited". The water at my home and business (separate towns and utilities) are both "unlimited". Your local dial-tone has been unlimited for how many years? Travis Microserv Scottie Arnett wrote: I am not sure what the costs should or will be? But...I will say that is where I think broadband will be headed, for sure, if the FCC keeps going the way they are headed(since the Comcast deal) with the completely "open" concept, such as no bandwidth shaping of any sort. Even the BIG players such as the major cable companies and the major telcos cannot operate their networks very long with the new bandwidth intensive apps coming along(unless its on their own network) with no bandwidth shaping. IMHO, I think this is how it should be, a cost per data transfer or a limit and then overage charges, just as electric, long distance, water usage, etc... have been for a long time. My 2 pence worth. Scott -- Original Message -- From: "Mike Hammett" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:23:58 -0500 So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Question: If you are privately owned and have received no federal (or otherwise) money for your network AND it is spelled out in your contract, could the FCC actually tell you you have to run wide open / allow any app? If so, where would the line get drawn (Universities, Libraries, etc...)? My contract prohibits running servers or peer to peer applications on the connection. Jason Scottie Arnett wrote: I am not sure what the costs should or will be? But...I will say that is where I think broadband will be headed, for sure, if the FCC keeps going the way they are headed(since the Comcast deal) with the completely open concept, such as no bandwidth shaping of any sort. Even the BIG players such as the major cable companies and the major telcos cannot operate their networks very long with the new bandwidth intensive apps coming along(unless its on their own network) with no bandwidth shaping. IMHO, I think this is how it should be, a cost per data transfer or a limit and then overage charges, just as electric, long distance, water usage, etc... have been for a long time. My 2 pence worth. Scott -- Original Message -- From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:23:58 -0500 So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- AV Spam Filtering by M+Guardian - Risk Free Email (TM) --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Music industry is not going to sit back and let the FCC pass a law that will prohibit ISP'S from blocking P2P. I got P2P blocked from noon to midnight. Some kid calls me up wondering why his limewire won't connect. I say try it after midnight. He says well hows that gonna work for me I tell him, its easy, you just do your illegal downloading after midnight. Then he says, ok thanks. Click... Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jason Wallace Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 11:31 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband Question: If you are privately owned and have received no federal (or otherwise) money for your network AND it is spelled out in your contract, could the FCC actually tell you you have to run wide open / allow any app? If so, where would the line get drawn (Universities, Libraries, etc...)? My contract prohibits running servers or peer to peer applications on the connection. Jason Scottie Arnett wrote: I am not sure what the costs should or will be? But...I will say that is where I think broadband will be headed, for sure, if the FCC keeps going the way they are headed(since the Comcast deal) with the completely open concept, such as no bandwidth shaping of any sort. Even the BIG players such as the major cable companies and the major telcos cannot operate their networks very long with the new bandwidth intensive apps coming along(unless its on their own network) with no bandwidth shaping. IMHO, I think this is how it should be, a cost per data transfer or a limit and then overage charges, just as electric, long distance, water usage, etc... have been for a long time. My 2 pence worth. Scott -- Original Message -- From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:23:58 -0500 So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- AV Spam Filtering by M+Guardian - Risk Free Email (TM) --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Have you considered $19/mo for 1 Gig, $39/mo for 5 Gig and $59/mo for 10 Gig +$x per gig over what they normally pay? Another thought is do the tiers, and throttle them after they hit a point, after 1 gig, then you get throttled to 64k for the rest of the month. John Mike Hammett wrote: So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
I think that's the catch phrase... "open" meaning, not blocked. So don't block p2p or any other traffic, just throttle it down... WAY down... Travis Scottie Arnett wrote: Jason, My TOS do the same thing, but just do a search about Comcast blocking Vuze(bittorrent) and see what has been happening over the last few months. First the FCC said it was a matter of them not having a statement of shaping traffic in their TOS, now it has come to that any provider offering internet service should have an "open" network! Scott -- Original Message -- From: Jason Wallace [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:31:29 -0700 Question: If you are privately owned and have received no federal (or otherwise) money for your network AND it is spelled out in your contract, could the FCC actually tell you you have to run wide open / allow any app? If so, where would the line get drawn (Universities, Libraries, etc...)? My contract prohibits running "servers" or "peer to peer applications" on the connection. Jason Scottie Arnett wrote: I am not sure what the costs should or will be? But...I will say that is where I think broadband will be headed, for sure, if the FCC keeps going the way they are headed(since the Comcast deal) with the completely "open" concept, such as no bandwidth shaping of any sort. Even the BIG players such as the major cable companies and the major telcos cannot operate their networks very long with the new bandwidth intensive apps coming along(unless its on their own network) with no bandwidth shaping. IMHO, I think this is how it should be, a cost per data transfer or a limit and then overage charges, just as electric, long distance, water usage, etc... have been for a long time. My 2 pence worth. Scott -- Original Message -- From: "Mike Hammett" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:23:58 -0500 So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- AV Spam Filtering by M+Guardian - Risk Free Email (TM) --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Jason, My TOS do the same thing, but just do a search about Comcast blocking Vuze(bittorrent) and see what has been happening over the last few months. First the FCC said it was a matter of them not having a statement of shaping traffic in their TOS, now it has come to that any provider offering internet service should have an open network! Scott -- Original Message -- From: Jason Wallace [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:31:29 -0700 Question: If you are privately owned and have received no federal (or otherwise) money for your network AND it is spelled out in your contract, could the FCC actually tell you you have to run wide open / allow any app? If so, where would the line get drawn (Universities, Libraries, etc...)? My contract prohibits running servers or peer to peer applications on the connection. Jason Scottie Arnett wrote: I am not sure what the costs should or will be? But...I will say that is where I think broadband will be headed, for sure, if the FCC keeps going the way they are headed(since the Comcast deal) with the completely open concept, such as no bandwidth shaping of any sort. Even the BIG players such as the major cable companies and the major telcos cannot operate their networks very long with the new bandwidth intensive apps coming along(unless its on their own network) with no bandwidth shaping. IMHO, I think this is how it should be, a cost per data transfer or a limit and then overage charges, just as electric, long distance, water usage, etc... have been for a long time. My 2 pence worth. Scott -- Original Message -- From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:23:58 -0500 So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- AV Spam Filtering by M+Guardian - Risk Free Email (TM) --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Good idea! Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 11:54 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband I think that's the catch phrase... open meaning, not blocked. So don't block p2p or any other traffic, just throttle it down... WAY down... Travis Scottie Arnett wrote: Jason, My TOS do the same thing, but just do a search about Comcast blocking Vuze(bittorrent) and see what has been happening over the last few months. First the FCC said it was a matter of them not having a statement of shaping traffic in their TOS, now it has come to that any provider offering internet service should have an open network! Scott -- Original Message -- From: Jason Wallace mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List mailto:wireless@wispa.org wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:31:29 -0700 Question: If you are privately owned and have received no federal (or otherwise) money for your network AND it is spelled out in your contract, could the FCC actually tell you you have to run wide open / allow any app? If so, where would the line get drawn (Universities, Libraries, etc...)? My contract prohibits running servers or peer to peer applications on the connection. Jason Scottie Arnett wrote: I am not sure what the costs should or will be? But...I will say that is where I think broadband will be headed, for sure, if the FCC keeps going the way they are headed(since the Comcast deal) with the completely open concept, such as no bandwidth shaping of any sort. Even the BIG players such as the major cable companies and the major telcos cannot operate their networks very long with the new bandwidth intensive apps coming along(unless its on their own network) with no bandwidth shaping. IMHO, I think this is how it should be, a cost per data transfer or a limit and then overage charges, just as electric, long distance, water usage, etc... have been for a long time. My 2 pence worth. Scott -- Original Message -- From: Mike Hammett mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List mailto:wireless@wispa.org wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:23:58 -0500 So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- AV Spam Filtering by M+Guardian - Risk Free Email (TM) --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Travis Johnson wrote: I think things are going the other way... cell phones now have "unlimited" plans. Long distance can now be purchased as "unlimited". The water at my home and business (separate towns and utilities) are both "unlimited". Your local dial-tone has been unlimited for how many years? In many areas, your local dial tone WAS unlimited. Now, 50 or 400 here in SW lower MI... Travis Microserv Scottie Arnett wrote: I am not sure what the costs should or will be? But...I will say that is where I think broadband will be headed, for sure, if the FCC keeps going the way they are headed(since the Comcast deal) with the completely "open" concept, such as no bandwidth shaping of any sort. Even the BIG players such as the major cable companies and the major telcos cannot operate their networks very long with the new bandwidth intensive apps coming along(unless its on their own network) with no bandwidth shaping. IMHO, I think this is how it should be, a cost per data transfer or a limit and then overage charges, just as electric, long distance, water usage, etc... have been for a long time. My 2 pence worth. Scott -- Original Message -- From: "Mike Hammett" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:23:58 -0500 So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
There are arguments for flat rate and for metered for most utilities and services. All you can eat attracts people who don't want to worry about overages, where tiered usage plans cater to the penny-pincher who knows exactly how much (or little) he needs. For a service provider it is much simpler to offer flat-rate pricing than metered because you don't have to track usage. But it boils down to *your* needs and your customer base as an ISP. Ultimately customers need to understand that not all networks are created equal, and never will be 100% the same. Just as each physical medium has its own limitations, management styles, network design, and target customer each introduce variables that change the behavior of the network. You have to look at your target customer base and design a system for them, not let a few power-users dictate how you will run your business. The (generally illegal) actions of 10% of your users should not affect and hinder the (value added) service(s) you provide to the other 90+%. The real Net Neutrality concern should be about network owners purposefully hindering access to legitimate but less preferred content providers. Proponents cannot consider end-users as content providers, and that's what they're trying to do with the whole P2P mess. I pity the pro-P2P advocates; if the overwhelming percentage of P2P traffic that is illegitimate was taken out of the picture, their miniscule amount of valid traffic would fly under the radar and P2P would no longer be a problem. Scottie Arnett wrote: Jason, My TOS do the same thing, but just do a search about Comcast blocking Vuze(bittorrent) and see what has been happening over the last few months. First the FCC said it was a matter of them not having a statement of shaping traffic in their TOS, now it has come to that any provider offering internet service should have an open network! Scott -- Original Message -- From: Jason Wallace [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:31:29 -0700 Question: If you are privately owned and have received no federal (or otherwise) money for your network AND it is spelled out in your contract, could the FCC actually tell you you have to run wide open / allow any app? If so, where would the line get drawn (Universities, Libraries, etc...)? My contract prohibits running servers or peer to peer applications on the connection. Jason Scottie Arnett wrote: I am not sure what the costs should or will be? But...I will say that is where I think broadband will be headed, for sure, if the FCC keeps going the way they are headed(since the Comcast deal) with the completely open concept, such as no bandwidth shaping of any sort. Even the BIG players such as the major cable companies and the major telcos cannot operate their networks very long with the new bandwidth intensive apps coming along(unless its on their own network) with no bandwidth shaping. IMHO, I think this is how it should be, a cost per data transfer or a limit and then overage charges, just as electric, long distance, water usage, etc... have been for a long time. My 2 pence worth. Scott WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
My customers on average consume about 5 gigs each. I suspect 10% use about 75% of the traffic. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Mike Hammett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 6:23 PM Subject: [WISPA] Metered Broadband So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
What ever you do decide to charge on a bit cap metered unit price plan, start the base fee off at the competitive market price and then work backwards to determine how much transfer is included. An example: if you like $2.00 per gig unit price, and the typical market price in your area is say $40.00, then you charge 40.00 +/- and give them a 20 gig +/- bandwidth allowance. Question, is the transfer both up and down combined? Mike Hammett wrote: So what types of rates would be appropriate for a metered broadband service? It obviously depends on what your costs are. I'll just throw something out to start a conversation, not necessarily reflective of any costs. $2/gig transferred, no other costs or limits. $10 base, $1.50/gig transferred, no other limits. -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Metered Broadband
Bryan, In most part, I agree with your reasoning. For legitamate things, such as WOW's maker's (used to be Blizzard I think) updates, their is nothing stopping them from offering their updates via ftp, but no...they prefer to offer it via bittorrent that brings our wirelesss connections down to a crawl. Why? because it does not entirely bring their own network down to a crawl. Same for releases of Linux. I can ftp to any reputable college and ftp down a complete copy of any new linux release. Now they are taking advantage of the final end providers! Where does it stop? Are we supposed to build networks for Netflix, Youtube, etc... and offer it for a consumable price? thats where I believe its going or trying to go? If it goes there, I will resort to farming...its a no win prop! Scott -- Original Message -- From: Bryan Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 22:51:17 -0600 There are arguments for flat rate and for metered for most utilities and services. All you can eat attracts people who don't want to worry about overages, where tiered usage plans cater to the penny-pincher who knows exactly how much (or little) he needs. For a service provider it is much simpler to offer flat-rate pricing than metered because you don't have to track usage. But it boils down to *your* needs and your customer base as an ISP. Ultimately customers need to understand that not all networks are created equal, and never will be 100% the same. Just as each physical medium has its own limitations, management styles, network design, and target customer each introduce variables that change the behavior of the network. You have to look at your target customer base and design a system for them, not let a few power-users dictate how you will run your business. The (generally illegal) actions of 10% of your users should not affect and hinder the (value added) service(s) you provide to the other 90+%. The real Net Neutrality concern should be about network owners purposefully hindering access to legitimate but less preferred content providers. Proponents cannot consider end-users as content providers, and that's what they're trying to do with the whole P2P mess. I pity the pro-P2P advocates; if the overwhelming percentage of P2P traffic that is illegitimate was taken out of the picture, their miniscule amount of valid traffic would fly under the radar and P2P would no longer be a problem. Scottie Arnett wrote: Jason, My TOS do the same thing, but just do a search about Comcast blocking Vuze(bittorrent) and see what has been happening over the last few months. First the FCC said it was a matter of them not having a statement of shaping traffic in their TOS, now it has come to that any provider offering internet service should have an open network! Scott -- Original Message -- From: Jason Wallace [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 20:31:29 -0700 Question: If you are privately owned and have received no federal (or otherwise) money for your network AND it is spelled out in your contract, could the FCC actually tell you you have to run wide open / allow any app? If so, where would the line get drawn (Universities, Libraries, etc...)? My contract prohibits running servers or peer to peer applications on the connection. Jason Scottie Arnett wrote: I am not sure what the costs should or will be? But...I will say that is where I think broadband will be headed, for sure, if the FCC keeps going the way they are headed(since the Comcast deal) with the completely open concept, such as no bandwidth shaping of any sort. Even the BIG players such as the major cable companies and the major telcos cannot operate their networks very long with the new bandwidth intensive apps coming along(unless its on their own network) with no bandwidth shaping. IMHO, I think this is how it should be, a cost per data transfer or a limit and then overage charges, just as electric, long distance, water usage, etc... have been for a long time. My 2 pence worth. Scott WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/
