Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread Mike Hammett
Once your users figure out they can watch their favorite shows or movies online, your tune will change. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com From: Travis Johnson Sent: Friday, March 20, 2009 2:45 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread Mike Hammett
20 MHz works now, why wouldn't it work later? Because the international markets where WiMAX was designed for don't have that sort of capacity. 10 MHz doesn't add that much distance over 20 MHz in other systems. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread Mike Hammett
I'm not asking for a wireless solution that does 60 megs to each customer, but I am asking for one that does more than the 2 vendors and other WISPs want. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Marlon

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread Jack Unger
Once you figure out that physics is physics and that license-free wireless frequencies will NEVER support fiber speeds no matter how much you DEMAND from manufacturers then your tune will change... Mike Hammett wrote: Once your users figure out they can watch their favorite shows or movies

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread Jack Unger
Once you figure out that physics is physics and that license-free wireless frequencies will NEVER support fiber speeds no matter how much you DEMAND from manufacturers then your tune will change... Mike Hammett wrote: Once your users figure out they can watch their favorite shows or movies

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread Mike Hammett
I can do it now with Mikrotik. I'm not sure how it doesn't work with WiMAX, given all of its magic and high cost. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Jack Unger jun...@ask-wi.com Sent: Saturday,

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread Jack Unger
hope Mike Hammett wrote: I can do it now with Mikrotik. I'm not sure how it doesn't work with WiMAX, given all of its magic and high cost. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: "Jack Unger"

[WISPA] 3.650 and the FCC

2009-03-21 Thread Mike Cowan
Hi Folks, Help me understand what the FCC is doing.. They are approving low end 3.650 gear, PTP gear etc. A lot of this gear is the spit and bailing wire type systems that are not spectrally efficient, don't support GPS, and certainly don't coordinate or play nice with other systems. I

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread Gino Villarini
I don't want to bug anyone especifically, but ... If we don't play by the rules on part90 3.65, We are at risk of 1- being fined, 2- giving negative feedback to FCC which gives more power to License users that are always against us (Unlicensed - Lite License users) To operate on 3.65 you MUST

Re: [WISPA] 3.650 and the FCC

2009-03-21 Thread Gino Villarini
Well it seems Also, GPS sync its not the same on all the systems, take for instance Airspan, their FCC certified Micromax AP for 3.65 would not allow channel reuse even with gps ... I would just help cochannel issues between Aps ... So how do you plan for a big cell network with limited GPS and

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread Travis Johnson
We already have this happening... and we cap them at 128k and then call and tell them our service does not support this. if you continue, we will terminate your service. Most people are OK with that. I'm not going to provide them a 2meg connection for them to use 24x7 for $49.95/month when it

[WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread Harold Bledsoe
Those of you that are paying $50/Mbps, what is keeping you from building your own backhaul to cheaper bandwidth (wireless, dark fiber, etc.)? It seems to me that this would be a major consideration in the business plan as this is a big MRC. Don't wait for someone to bring you cheap

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread Josh Luthman
Between towers we have AN50s. They were at least $6,000 when they were put up - I'm sure it took months for that ROI but the worst part is the upkeep. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to

Re: [WISPA] 3.650 and the FCC

2009-03-21 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
Probably not Mike. But the FCC DID leave the rules wide open. My belief is that they wanted to see what kind of creative interference avoidance mechanisms the manufacturers could create. If you believe that the new equipment is really bad, you might try pointing out that it'll be impossible

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread George Rogato
Thats what I see happening, older customers that never even knew how to find youtube , never mind understnd or use P2P, are now doing the netflix and dish on demand. I'm seeing a growing number of people using those products now. Kinda scary in some ways. George Mike Hammett wrote: Once your

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
It's the economies of it all in so many places. Many areas will require the construction of 100+ foot towers. At what, $10 to $20k per tower (complete install), even for a small one that won't hold many antennas. Then there are hills, mountains, permitting issues etc. I know I can get a

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
Personally I think it's great! I see the day when everyone tells Dish and Direct to take a flying leap. They'll stop paying for the shows that they not only don't watch but don't even want to support (anyone seen how screwed up MTV is now?). They'll just pay a few pennies per show and watch

[WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
Hi All, I just got a notice that Quickbooks is going to REQUIRE an upgrade in order to continue to keep sending out bills via email. And we have all of 1 month or so to get it done I HATE Intuit and would like to replace them. Here's the work flow in our office. New customer calls in.

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread Mike Hammett
A few areas it's just not available. The rest... lack of knowledge of what's in the area and how to get at it. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Harold Bledsoe hbled...@deliberant.net Sent:

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Charles Wu
Hi Marlon, In no particular order, here's a list of some of the more popular ISP/WISP billing packages that we see in the market Platypus/Tucows PowerCode Rodopi BillMax Freeside Emerald / IEA Software Every package has their strengths and weaknesses -- ultimately, it comes down to personal

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread George Rogato
Well you either use freeside at no cost but you pay for the programming, someone on this list is an expert freeside programmer by the way, or you use Platypus which is not free but needs less programing. There are others like Platypus, billmax rodolphi etc. You may want to search the archives.

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
Thanks Charles. I've heard of most of those, and a few more, but haven't talked to many people that use the. I probably know Freeside the best because that's what Matt Larsen uses. He's showed me some of what he's doing (customer monitoring etc.) with it and I'm very impressed. But he's

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread Scott Carullo
Have to pay for tower space and colo charges and possibly cross connect fees and after that your router and bandwidth come from another city That coupled with the most important ingredient of your business now with less reliability than local fiber and more jitter and latency Scott Carullo

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
http://intrameta.com/ They are a vendor member and good guys. I've talked to them (David Wilson got us hooked up) quite a bit. It sounds like they have a nice system. But the costs are higher than I can justify at this point and last I talked to them they didn't have a billing mechanism in

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
Grin. I know that this has come up from time to time. I'm after current info and thoughts. laters, marlon - Original Message - From: George Rogato wi...@oregonfast.net To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2009 8:01 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] ISP

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread Charles Wu
Hi Hal, In the grand scheme of things...bandwidth / port costs are a minute fraction of an ISP/WISPs operating expenses (heck, I find that for a residential WISP...the credit card processing bill can be higher than the bandwidth bill) That said, look at it this way Based on our

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread George Rogato
Here's a thought, been using Platypus for years, supports my isp very well. I'm happy. Marlon K. Schafer wrote: Grin. I know that this has come up from time to time. I'm after current info and thoughts. laters, marlon - Original Message - From: George Rogato

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread Mike Hammett
Someone once asked me what was in their area, so I looked. There were I'm recalling at least 4 major international carriers right in their town must have been a landing station. It pays to know what's in your area. ;-) - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Charles Wu
As for merchant services, we have a very nice system in place through our local bank. We're quite happy with it and we're getting very good rates. Good for you Remember, credit card rates are all based upon fraud risk (e.g., a swiped card has a lower transaction rate than a phone order /

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread J. Vogel
Where did you look? Mike Hammett wrote: Someone once asked me what was in their area, so I looked. There were I'm recalling at least 4 major international carriers right in their town must have been a landing station. It pays to know what's in your area. ;-) - Mike Hammett

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
OK, what are the rates you get people? We're at 2 or 3% last time I looked. Most companies wanted 4% or more, so I didn't move from our old win95 based system until a year or two ago. marlon - Original Message - From: Charles Wu c...@cticonnect.com To: WISPA General List

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread J. Vogel
Charles, I would love to live in the world you describe here. :) Bandwidth cost dwarfs credit card processing cost where I live. It also seems very optimistic to put 1000 customers on a 20mb link. At best, I would think that if they are consuming ~20mbps, that you should have at least twice

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread RickG
Blair, You must be reading my mind! Your post fits my scenario perfectly. -RickG On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 8:11 PM, Blair Davis the...@wmwisp.net wrote: Some simple numbers... $1700/month for 10Mbits. Much better than the $600 per 1.54Mbit I was paying out here. 1Mbit per Netflix or IPTV

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread RickG
George, Sounds great and mus be nice but there are no facilities in the boondocks! -RickG On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 10:15 PM, George Rogato wi...@oregonfast.netwrote: Kinda high If you are lucky and you have access to fiber consider this Cogent, if you buy a GigE port and commit to 200 megs,

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread George Rogato
Yeah I realize that. We're luycky that Boneville and Williams did a big fiber deal many years ago that put fiber all across the North West.. Still is not easy to get access, the transport costs are quite high, but it's possible. maybe some of the emp[hasis on the broadband stimulus money ought

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread George Rogato
Agreed we have a tad more than a 1000 wireless subs and we hit our cap nightly @ 30megs. And I try like hell to avoid the power users. J. Vogel wrote: Charles, I would love to live in the world you describe here. :) Bandwidth cost dwarfs credit card processing cost where I live. It

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread RickG
Thats what I'm hoping for. Otherwise, a 10x10 fiber from TimeWarner for $1800 is considered an upgrade in these parts! -RickG On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 12:24 PM, George Rogato wi...@oregonfast.netwrote: Yeah I realize that. We're luycky that Boneville and Williams did a big fiber deal many years

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread RickG
Co$t! 35 miles as a crow flys to the nearest fiber facility. Worse yet, only one major provider there and they are expensive. -RickG On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 9:47 AM, Harold Bledsoe hbled...@deliberant.netwrote: Those of you that are paying $50/Mbps, what is keeping you from building your own

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread RickG
We're in total agreement there. I keep getting asked by my customers what the stimulus plan will do for our area - I chuckle and say let's hope for capacity to come our way. Of course, I dont really believe it On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 12:36 PM, George Rogato wi...@oregonfast.netwrote: Rick

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Frank Muto
What version of QB are you using now? Frank Muto - Original Message - From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Cc: memb...@wispa.org; Odessa Office 509-982-2181 off...@odessaoffice.com Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2009 10:51 AM Subject:

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread rghering
In my neck of the woods there is no dark fiber for rent, and I'm 185 miles from the nearest fiber facility. We have to backhaul a DS3 nearly 50 miles, then cross connect it into Qwest land from CenturyTel land into the qwest ATM cloud. THEN I have a fat UBR pipe to a Tier 2. I have no other

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Mark Nash
Marlon, I looked at Intrameta and PowerCode and chose PowerCode for bang for buck. You really should look at them. It has its faults, but it's like a drug that we can't do without. It handles alot for us. Do a demo one day and check it out. Mark Nash UnwiredWest 78 Centennial Loop, Suite E

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread George Rogato
What you need Rick, is one of these bad boys: http://www.directionaldrills.com/imageview.php?product=251 Then all you have to do is drill your way past the incumbant. (this is supposed to be humorous) RickG wrote: Co$t! 35 miles as a crow flys to the nearest fiber facility. Worse yet, only

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Mark Nash
We just got activated yesterday. We used Authorize.Net / Chase processing. The rates were better w/IP-Pay and we get better reporting from it. It would take Authorize.Net 3 days from now to show transactions that we did today, regardless of business day. IP-Pay has a real-time option where

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread Mike Hammett
It is 60 ish miles away, but Eugene has Electric Lightwave, 360 networks, Global Crossing, Level3 (they may even have fiber in your town). - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: George Rogato

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Brian Rohrbacher
Butch Evans and Jeremy Davis are getting me set up with Freeside (partly because quickbooks did the same thing to me). I am not using it yet, but I sure do like that for X per hour I can say, "Hey Jeremy, make freeside do this, and he says ok". Brian Mark Nash wrote: Marlon, I looked at

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Jack Unger
Marlon, I got a notice like that from Quickbooks maybe 6 months ago. I irked me because I didn't want them to be able to force me to upgrade when my 2004 edition was doing just fine. I started using the following workaround. 1. Rather than emailing invoices directly from QB via their email

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Frank Muto
That may work for a smaller amount of customers, but when dealing with a significant amount of customers that can not be cost/time efficient thing to do. Frank - Original Message - From: Jack Unger jun...@ask-wi.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, March

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
06 pro I think. marlon - Original Message - From: Frank Muto frank.m...@secureemailplus.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2009 9:41 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software. What version of QB are you using now? Frank Muto

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread John McDowell
You guys should read the threads on the Moto list. Lot of people tired of the way the company is doing it's customers. And tired of testing beta software full of bugs with every release. This includes us. A Powercode customer of 2 years. Sent from my iPhone On Mar 21, 2009, at 11:54 AM,

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
Thanks for the suggestion Jack. I don't think that would work very well for 500 to 600 invoices that all come out on the same day every month marlon - Original Message - From: Jack Unger jun...@ask-wi.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2009

Re: [WISPA] 2nd Look @ 3.65 ?

2009-03-21 Thread Mike Hammett
I knew of NOANET, but their network map is hard to find. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: George Rogato wi...@oregonfast.net Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2009 12:39 PM To: WISPA General List

Re: [WISPA] ISP billing/management software.

2009-03-21 Thread Jack Unger
Well, that could make for a long day. :) Marlon K. Schafer wrote: Thanks for the suggestion Jack. I don't think that would work very well for 500 to 600 invoices that all come out on the same day every month marlon - Original Message - From: "Jack Unger"

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread Travis Johnson
Because it's 200+ miles away and crosses state lines. It would be at least 10 hops. Tower space is roughly $250/month around here so that's $2,500 per month just for the towers... then you have maintenance, equipment cost ($100k) and it would only save me about $1,000 per month. Travis

Re: [WISPA] Cost of bandwidth

2009-03-21 Thread RickG
LOL! I'd like to use it on their CO :) On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 1:04 PM, George Rogato wi...@oregonfast.net wrote: What you need Rick, is one of these bad boys: http://www.directionaldrills.com/imageview.php?product=251 Then all you have to do is drill your way past the incumbant. (this is