Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
It seems premature to suggest that Clearwire is tanking. When you consider that an additional 4 million shares were issued and that the overall market is currently down, I think their stock has move as expected. I bought in at $20.68 and am quite happy with my position. -Matt -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
Matt Liotta wrote: It seems premature to suggest that Clearwire is tanking. When you consider that an additional 4 million shares were issued and that the overall market is currently down, I think their stock has move as expected. I bought in at $20.68 and am quite happy with my position. -Matt Issuing the extra 4 million shares actually diluted the value of the stock. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
Correct and that I believe is what Matt's point is. Too early to kick CLWR to the curb for at least two reasons: (1) short term market downturn (2) additional 4M shares issued Both of these items can and often will soften a stock value. All that said I think $20 - $24 a share is ridiculous for CLWR. I expect CLWR will bump back up maybe even beyond the IPO price once the market bounces back. The smart money will jump ship saving their skin and the stock will turn downward from that point on. Clearwire has lost more than $460 million during its four-year existence. The company generates about $100 million in annual sales... Certainly McCaw can afford this type of bleeding, but for how long and more importantly how long will Wall Street wait to see the light at the end of the tunnel? Will CLWR ever bask in the sunshine? Long term I only see a decline in value unless they start producing profits real quick! CLWR isn't making any money and doesn't have a bright future of EVER making any money. Hope I'm wrong because a CLWR failure is a failure for fixed wireless as a whole. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter R. Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:37 AM To: Matt Liotta Cc: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Matt Liotta wrote: It seems premature to suggest that Clearwire is tanking. When you consider that an additional 4 million shares were issued and that the overall market is currently down, I think their stock has move as expected. I bought in at $20.68 and am quite happy with my position. -Matt Issuing the extra 4 million shares actually diluted the value of the stock. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
Brad Belton wrote: Certainly McCaw can afford this type of bleeding, but for how long and more importantly how long will Wall Street wait to see the light at the end of the tunnel? Will CLWR ever bask in the sunshine? I think you are asking the wrong question. The real question is how long the incumbents will let Clearwire take their market share, which has already passed 10% in half of their markets. -Matt -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
Who says they ever have to make money, for their stock to hold or increase its value? And who says a profit needs to be made for a company to survive long term, when they are kept alive by the stock market? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 11:55 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Correct and that I believe is what Matt's point is. Too early to kick CLWR to the curb for at least two reasons: (1) short term market downturn (2) additional 4M shares issued Both of these items can and often will soften a stock value. All that said I think $20 - $24 a share is ridiculous for CLWR. I expect CLWR will bump back up maybe even beyond the IPO price once the market bounces back. The smart money will jump ship saving their skin and the stock will turn downward from that point on. Clearwire has lost more than $460 million during its four-year existence. The company generates about $100 million in annual sales... Certainly McCaw can afford this type of bleeding, but for how long and more importantly how long will Wall Street wait to see the light at the end of the tunnel? Will CLWR ever bask in the sunshine? Long term I only see a decline in value unless they start producing profits real quick! CLWR isn't making any money and doesn't have a bright future of EVER making any money. Hope I'm wrong because a CLWR failure is a failure for fixed wireless as a whole. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter R. Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:37 AM To: Matt Liotta Cc: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Matt Liotta wrote: It seems premature to suggest that Clearwire is tanking. When you consider that an additional 4 million shares were issued and that the overall market is currently down, I think their stock has move as expected. I bought in at $20.68 and am quite happy with my position. -Matt Issuing the extra 4 million shares actually diluted the value of the stock. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
On Wed, 14 Mar 2007 11:55:31 -0500, Brad Belton wrote Correct and that I believe is what Matt's point is. Too early to kick CLWR to the curb for at least two reasons: (1) short term market downturn (2) additional 4M shares issued Both of these items can and often will soften a stock value. All that said I think $20 - $24 a share is ridiculous for CLWR. I expect CLWR will bump back up maybe even beyond the IPO price once the market bounces back. The smart money will jump ship saving their skin and the stock will turn downward from that point on. Clearwire has lost more than $460 million during its four-year existence. The company generates about $100 million in annual sales... Ok, Clearwire expects to continue to build out. They expect to spend 1.1 billion, and market hacks expect them to triple the customer base over the next year or so. So, even next year, they're going to spend between 3 and 4 times their gross revenue. AND, they have 664 million debt, too. If they stopped building out and concentrated on sales, I don't know, and nobody seems to know, how much the'll be spending. In other words, nobody seems to know how much of this spending is fixed cost and how much is expansion. Their own claim, is that expenses are near 300 million annual. However, they're apparently not concentrating on market growth, as annual sales only went from 67 to 100 million for all of '06. I read elsewhere that almost all of that growth is due to equipment sales, not customer sales. Then the next article contradicts that. http://biz.yahoo.com/seekingalpha/070308/29050_id.html?.v=2 http://www.fool.com/investing/value/2007/03/12/clearwire-burns-cash-churns- investors.aspx?source=eptyholnk303100logvisit=ynpu=y http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/clearwire-shares-pummeled-path- profit/story.aspx?guid=%7BBFAAD8AC%2D3B2E%2D48D4%2DA100%2DDCEC9ACDCAE4% 7Dsiteid=yhoodist=yhoo Certainly McCaw can afford this type of bleeding, but for how long and more importantly how long will Wall Street wait to see the light at the end of the tunnel? Will CLWR ever bask in the sunshine? Long term I only see a decline in value unless they start producing profits real quick! CLWR isn't making any money and doesn't have a bright future of EVER making any money. Hope I'm wrong because a CLWR failure is a failure for fixed wireless as a whole. Actually, it appears they could make money. But the question is, will they stay for ever in the build out mode and spend themselves totally out of money, without marketing to and finding enough customers to pay the bills? I had a potential investor, who was the opposite mind of the CLWR management, who insisted that I not expand to any of my yet not deployed but originally planned sites until I had completely maxed out capacity on everything now in place. Oddly enough, the more sites I have in strategic locations, the greater success I have at potential customer's sites. Then again, I'm not just putting up every location I can find. I figure I can't expect to get more than 3% market penetration in the areas where DSL and/or cable exist, and probably less, and not more than 30% where I'm the lone provider. With a target size of 600-1100 customers in the next 3 years, this means I have to either target 4000 residences with nothing else available, or 40,000 where there's competition. There's more than 4000 homes in the area I'm willing to expand to. The trick is that many of them are isolated areas of a 1, 5, 30 square miles, and we have to continue to do inexpensive expansions to hit those areas. I have a good 1/2 of those covered now, and we're going to add the next 1/4 this spring. If I have 1000 customers, I'll have about $40K a month rolling in, with fixed expenses (not including wages and labor) of about 10%. So, does Clearwire's model sound better than mine, when it comes to likelyhood of survival? Mark Koskenmaki Neofast, Inc Broadband for the Walla Walla Valley and Blue Mountains 541-969-8200 -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
Market forces dictate that Tom. Sure there are lots of companies that don't make a profit and have some relatively high stock prices. But the market forces are that if a company is not a viable eventual profit maker, then people sell those shares and the price goes down. If the price goes down the next time the company goes to sell shares to raise capital or wants to use its stock as collateral it's pickings are pretty slim. Most of the equity a major shareholder has, is in stock, if the price goes down the major shareholder takes a hit. So the short story is, a company can not expect to survive based on stock price alone, they have to perform , either turn a profit, or lower losses and get closer to an eventual profit. Tom DeReggi wrote: Who says they ever have to make money, for their stock to hold or increase its value? And who says a profit needs to be made for a company to survive long term, when they are kept alive by the stock market? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 11:55 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Correct and that I believe is what Matt's point is. Too early to kick CLWR to the curb for at least two reasons: (1) short term market downturn (2) additional 4M shares issued Both of these items can and often will soften a stock value. All that said I think $20 - $24 a share is ridiculous for CLWR. I expect CLWR will bump back up maybe even beyond the IPO price once the market bounces back. The smart money will jump ship saving their skin and the stock will turn downward from that point on. Clearwire has lost more than $460 million during its four-year existence. The company generates about $100 million in annual sales... Certainly McCaw can afford this type of bleeding, but for how long and more importantly how long will Wall Street wait to see the light at the end of the tunnel? Will CLWR ever bask in the sunshine? Long term I only see a decline in value unless they start producing profits real quick! CLWR isn't making any money and doesn't have a bright future of EVER making any money. Hope I'm wrong because a CLWR failure is a failure for fixed wireless as a whole. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter R. Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:37 AM To: Matt Liotta Cc: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Matt Liotta wrote: It seems premature to suggest that Clearwire is tanking. When you consider that an additional 4 million shares were issued and that the overall market is currently down, I think their stock has move as expected. I bought in at $20.68 and am quite happy with my position. -Matt Issuing the extra 4 million shares actually diluted the value of the stock. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
wispa wrote: Ok, Clearwire expects to continue to build out. They expect to spend 1.1 billion, and market hacks expect them to triple the customer base over the next year or so. So, even next year, they're going to spend between 3 and 4 times their gross revenue. What is interesting is that year over year their revenue is currently growing at 125%, but their expenses are growing at 43%. -Matt -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
Nothing, and why I feel the way I do about the stock. I believe CLWR will bounce back up, but will ultimately slide downward until profits are realized. No stock has ever been able to hold value without realizing profits at one point or another. Why should CLWR be any different? People invest into companies because they believe the company is solvent and profitable or will be before they need or want to sell. This isn't to say there isn't ample opportunity for investors to profit on the buying and selling of a stock during these periods. Eventually the shorts will get a hold of it and the stock will only continue to drop until profits are realized. Even then we've seen stocks continue to drop even after they become profitable. There are no guarantees! The bottom line after all the good news, bad news, market swings etc. The company needs to make a profit in order to sustain value long term. Many believe CLWR's profitability future is unclear at best. The swings you see on many IPOs are due to the market makers timing their in's and out's taking profits when they can. As they say for every buyer there is a seller, but that doesn't always work the other way around. I certainly have a few shares of various companies over the years that I'd love to sell, but no buyers are to be found. sigh Like I said before, I'm hoping CLWR does well and McCaw brings the company into the black...I just don't see it happening. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom DeReggi Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 1:47 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Who says they ever have to make money, for their stock to hold or increase its value? And who says a profit needs to be made for a company to survive long term, when they are kept alive by the stock market? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 11:55 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Correct and that I believe is what Matt's point is. Too early to kick CLWR to the curb for at least two reasons: (1) short term market downturn (2) additional 4M shares issued Both of these items can and often will soften a stock value. All that said I think $20 - $24 a share is ridiculous for CLWR. I expect CLWR will bump back up maybe even beyond the IPO price once the market bounces back. The smart money will jump ship saving their skin and the stock will turn downward from that point on. Clearwire has lost more than $460 million during its four-year existence. The company generates about $100 million in annual sales... Certainly McCaw can afford this type of bleeding, but for how long and more importantly how long will Wall Street wait to see the light at the end of the tunnel? Will CLWR ever bask in the sunshine? Long term I only see a decline in value unless they start producing profits real quick! CLWR isn't making any money and doesn't have a bright future of EVER making any money. Hope I'm wrong because a CLWR failure is a failure for fixed wireless as a whole. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter R. Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:37 AM To: Matt Liotta Cc: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Matt Liotta wrote: It seems premature to suggest that Clearwire is tanking. When you consider that an additional 4 million shares were issued and that the overall market is currently down, I think their stock has move as expected. I bought in at $20.68 and am quite happy with my position. -Matt Issuing the extra 4 million shares actually diluted the value of the stock. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
Matt Liotta wrote: wispa wrote: Ok, Clearwire expects to continue to build out. They expect to spend 1.1 billion, and market hacks expect them to triple the customer base over the next year or so. So, even next year, they're going to spend between 3 and 4 times their gross revenue. What is interesting is that year over year their revenue is currently growing at 125%, but their expenses are growing at 43%. -Matt Based on their GAAP accounting method and what silo they are putting expenses and revenues in. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
On Wed, 14 Mar 2007 14:09:20 -0400, Matt Liotta wrote wispa wrote: Ok, Clearwire expects to continue to build out. They expect to spend 1.1 billion, and market hacks expect them to triple the customer base over the next year or so. So, even next year, they're going to spend between 3 and 4 times their gross revenue. What is interesting is that year over year their revenue is currently growing at 125%, but their expenses are growing at 43%. -Matt It depends on who provides you the figures... It looks like they really can't lose unless they just spend themselves broke without aquiring more customers. I know they spent or spend big time around here, and for the most part, customer satisifaction has been rather mixed. I don't directly c ompete with them, except for a small overlap on the edge of what I consider to be my market, and from what the guy who tried to get hooked up with them told me, he's a whale of lot happier with me than them. Apparently not every technical hurdle has been overcome. Mark Koskenmaki Neofast, Inc Broadband for the Walla Walla Valley and Blue Mountains 541-969-8200 -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
Not to compare it to a skunk, but look at Vonage stock. Tanked quick despite their accounting methods. (Sure some of that was from the patent lawsuit, but it was fading before that). - Peter -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
George Rogato wrote: wispa wrote: It depends on who provides you the figures... People go to jail when those figures are wrong. Sometimes they do. The key to GAAP Accounting is that you have to be consistent. SO if in your first quarter you decide that hardware is in this column and advertsing is over there and customer care is in column D, you just have to continue that method. So in the case of a VoIP company that doesn't want spiffs, rebates or advertising to be calculated with customer acquisition, you count them all in different silos. The same works for att and VZ - advertising is the cost of doing business and is not factored in to any metrics. All depends on how the CFO decided to have the numbers looked at and maybe valued. - Peter -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
Peter R. wrote: Not to compare it to a skunk, but look at Vonage stock. Tanked quick despite their accounting methods. (Sure some of that was from the patent lawsuit, but it was fading before that). - Peter Yeah, but Vonage also shot itself in the foot on IPO We will offer refunds if our stock goes down Was the stupidest thing for a company to ever say, was unheard of, especially when they renegeed and said they changed their mind and was not going to give a refund That stink will be with them for awhile. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
Isn't Clearwire's value irrelevent? If we have lots of extra money sitting around to invest, shouldn't we be investing it in ourselves for a higher return and less risk? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 1:15 PM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Nothing, and why I feel the way I do about the stock. I believe CLWR will bounce back up, but will ultimately slide downward until profits are realized. No stock has ever been able to hold value without realizing profits at one point or another. Why should CLWR be any different? People invest into companies because they believe the company is solvent and profitable or will be before they need or want to sell. This isn't to say there isn't ample opportunity for investors to profit on the buying and selling of a stock during these periods. Eventually the shorts will get a hold of it and the stock will only continue to drop until profits are realized. Even then we've seen stocks continue to drop even after they become profitable. There are no guarantees! The bottom line after all the good news, bad news, market swings etc. The company needs to make a profit in order to sustain value long term. Many believe CLWR's profitability future is unclear at best. The swings you see on many IPOs are due to the market makers timing their in's and out's taking profits when they can. As they say for every buyer there is a seller, but that doesn't always work the other way around. I certainly have a few shares of various companies over the years that I'd love to sell, but no buyers are to be found. sigh Like I said before, I'm hoping CLWR does well and McCaw brings the company into the black...I just don't see it happening. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom DeReggi Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 1:47 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Who says they ever have to make money, for their stock to hold or increase its value? And who says a profit needs to be made for a company to survive long term, when they are kept alive by the stock market? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 11:55 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Correct and that I believe is what Matt's point is. Too early to kick CLWR to the curb for at least two reasons: (1) short term market downturn (2) additional 4M shares issued Both of these items can and often will soften a stock value. All that said I think $20 - $24 a share is ridiculous for CLWR. I expect CLWR will bump back up maybe even beyond the IPO price once the market bounces back. The smart money will jump ship saving their skin and the stock will turn downward from that point on. Clearwire has lost more than $460 million during its four-year existence. The company generates about $100 million in annual sales... Certainly McCaw can afford this type of bleeding, but for how long and more importantly how long will Wall Street wait to see the light at the end of the tunnel? Will CLWR ever bask in the sunshine? Long term I only see a decline in value unless they start producing profits real quick! CLWR isn't making any money and doesn't have a bright future of EVER making any money. Hope I'm wrong because a CLWR failure is a failure for fixed wireless as a whole. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter R. Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:37 AM To: Matt Liotta Cc: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Matt Liotta wrote: It seems premature to suggest that Clearwire is tanking. When you consider that an additional 4 million shares were issued and that the overall market is currently down, I think their stock has move as expected. I bought in at $20.68 and am quite happy with my position. -Matt Issuing the extra 4 million shares actually diluted the value of the stock. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http
RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
It's largely irrelevant to me as I don't own CLWR or have any immediate plans to own any shares. As for our industry I believe CLWR's value and performance could have some impact on future fixed wireless ventures public or private. Bankers and investors alike will look at CLWR and may be more inclined to think if McCaw couldn't pull it off with billions at his disposal how could the next guy? Let's just hope CLWR doesn't give the industry yet another black eye like Teligent and WindStar did. We still run into property owners/managers that are reeling from their dismal wireless experiences. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom DeReggi Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 3:26 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Isn't Clearwire's value irrelevent? If we have lots of extra money sitting around to invest, shouldn't we be investing it in ourselves for a higher return and less risk? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 1:15 PM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Nothing, and why I feel the way I do about the stock. I believe CLWR will bounce back up, but will ultimately slide downward until profits are realized. No stock has ever been able to hold value without realizing profits at one point or another. Why should CLWR be any different? People invest into companies because they believe the company is solvent and profitable or will be before they need or want to sell. This isn't to say there isn't ample opportunity for investors to profit on the buying and selling of a stock during these periods. Eventually the shorts will get a hold of it and the stock will only continue to drop until profits are realized. Even then we've seen stocks continue to drop even after they become profitable. There are no guarantees! The bottom line after all the good news, bad news, market swings etc. The company needs to make a profit in order to sustain value long term. Many believe CLWR's profitability future is unclear at best. The swings you see on many IPOs are due to the market makers timing their in's and out's taking profits when they can. As they say for every buyer there is a seller, but that doesn't always work the other way around. I certainly have a few shares of various companies over the years that I'd love to sell, but no buyers are to be found. sigh Like I said before, I'm hoping CLWR does well and McCaw brings the company into the black...I just don't see it happening. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom DeReggi Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 1:47 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Who says they ever have to make money, for their stock to hold or increase its value? And who says a profit needs to be made for a company to survive long term, when they are kept alive by the stock market? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 11:55 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Correct and that I believe is what Matt's point is. Too early to kick CLWR to the curb for at least two reasons: (1) short term market downturn (2) additional 4M shares issued Both of these items can and often will soften a stock value. All that said I think $20 - $24 a share is ridiculous for CLWR. I expect CLWR will bump back up maybe even beyond the IPO price once the market bounces back. The smart money will jump ship saving their skin and the stock will turn downward from that point on. Clearwire has lost more than $460 million during its four-year existence. The company generates about $100 million in annual sales... Certainly McCaw can afford this type of bleeding, but for how long and more importantly how long will Wall Street wait to see the light at the end of the tunnel? Will CLWR ever bask in the sunshine? Long term I only see a decline in value unless they start producing profits real quick! CLWR isn't making any money and doesn't have a bright future of EVER making any money. Hope I'm wrong because a CLWR failure is a failure for fixed wireless as a whole. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter R. Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:37 AM To: Matt Liotta Cc: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Matt Liotta wrote: It seems premature to suggest that Clearwire is tanking. When you consider that an additional 4 million shares were issued and that the overall market is currently down, I
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
Tom DeReggi wrote: Isn't Clearwire's value irrelevent? If we have lots of extra money sitting around to invest, shouldn't we be investing it in ourselves for a higher return and less risk? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband Actually, if you have lots of extra money sitting around - divest! Invest the money in other areas so you are cushioned. The Problem With Passion:Good entrepreneurs can be bad investors. http://www.inc.com/magazine/20070201/finance-wealth-management_Printer_Friendly.html Entrepreneurs are quick to reinvest profits back into their companies. But the key to retirement just might be outside investments. http://www.inc.com/resources/wealth/articles/20061001/lancaster.html Even the Big Boys invest internationally. Regards, Peter Radizeski RAD-INFO, Inc. -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
And the stock market has been kept alive by the U.S Federal Reserve printing too much money (inflation of the money supply) and by the yen carry trade where people borrow money at 0.5% in Japan and invest it into stock markets where they hope to make 20% in speculative profits. This carry trade is now unwinding (going into reverse) and with it, the world-wide stock markets and the U.S. sub-prime home mortgage market. http://www.kitco.com/ind/Laird/mar142007.html In short, we've been living in an overinflated asset bubble brought on by excessive world-wide Central Bank printing of money, too-low U.S. Federal Reserve Bank interest rates, excessive Wall Street greed, and unethical mortgage-banking industry practices. This trillion-dollar asset/liquidity bubble is now starting to deflate. Everyone better hang onto their hats... jack Tom DeReggi wrote: Who says they ever have to make money, for their stock to hold or increase its value? And who says a profit needs to be made for a company to survive long term, when they are kept alive by the stock market? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 11:55 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Correct and that I believe is what Matt's point is. Too early to kick CLWR to the curb for at least two reasons: (1) short term market downturn (2) additional 4M shares issued Both of these items can and often will soften a stock value. All that said I think $20 - $24 a share is ridiculous for CLWR. I expect CLWR will bump back up maybe even beyond the IPO price once the market bounces back. The smart money will jump ship saving their skin and the stock will turn downward from that point on. Clearwire has lost more than $460 million during its four-year existence. The company generates about $100 million in annual sales... Certainly McCaw can afford this type of bleeding, but for how long and more importantly how long will Wall Street wait to see the light at the end of the tunnel? Will CLWR ever bask in the sunshine? Long term I only see a decline in value unless they start producing profits real quick! CLWR isn't making any money and doesn't have a bright future of EVER making any money. Hope I'm wrong because a CLWR failure is a failure for fixed wireless as a whole. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Peter R. Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:37 AM To: Matt Liotta Cc: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Matt Liotta wrote: It seems premature to suggest that Clearwire is tanking. When you consider that an additional 4 million shares were issued and that the overall market is currently down, I think their stock has move as expected. I bought in at $20.68 and am quite happy with my position. -Matt Issuing the extra 4 million shares actually diluted the value of the stock. -- Jack Unger ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. FCC License # PG-12-25133 Serving the Broadband Wireless Industry Since 1993 Author of the WISP Handbook - Deploying License-Free Wireless WANs True Vendor-Neutral Wireless Consulting-Training-Troubleshooting Phone (VoIP Over Broadband Wireless) 818-227-4220 www.ask-wi.com -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping
Brad, Excellent Point. The industry clearly needs more successes, not failures. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 2:38 PM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping It's largely irrelevant to me as I don't own CLWR or have any immediate plans to own any shares. As for our industry I believe CLWR's value and performance could have some impact on future fixed wireless ventures public or private. Bankers and investors alike will look at CLWR and may be more inclined to think if McCaw couldn't pull it off with billions at his disposal how could the next guy? Let's just hope CLWR doesn't give the industry yet another black eye like Teligent and WindStar did. We still run into property owners/managers that are reeling from their dismal wireless experiences. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom DeReggi Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 3:26 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Isn't Clearwire's value irrelevent? If we have lots of extra money sitting around to invest, shouldn't we be investing it in ourselves for a higher return and less risk? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 1:15 PM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Nothing, and why I feel the way I do about the stock. I believe CLWR will bounce back up, but will ultimately slide downward until profits are realized. No stock has ever been able to hold value without realizing profits at one point or another. Why should CLWR be any different? People invest into companies because they believe the company is solvent and profitable or will be before they need or want to sell. This isn't to say there isn't ample opportunity for investors to profit on the buying and selling of a stock during these periods. Eventually the shorts will get a hold of it and the stock will only continue to drop until profits are realized. Even then we've seen stocks continue to drop even after they become profitable. There are no guarantees! The bottom line after all the good news, bad news, market swings etc. The company needs to make a profit in order to sustain value long term. Many believe CLWR's profitability future is unclear at best. The swings you see on many IPOs are due to the market makers timing their in's and out's taking profits when they can. As they say for every buyer there is a seller, but that doesn't always work the other way around. I certainly have a few shares of various companies over the years that I'd love to sell, but no buyers are to be found. sigh Like I said before, I'm hoping CLWR does well and McCaw brings the company into the black...I just don't see it happening. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom DeReggi Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 1:47 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Who says they ever have to make money, for their stock to hold or increase its value? And who says a profit needs to be made for a company to survive long term, when they are kept alive by the stock market? Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Brad Belton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 11:55 AM Subject: RE: [WISPA] Clearwire stock dropping Correct and that I believe is what Matt's point is. Too early to kick CLWR to the curb for at least two reasons: (1) short term market downturn (2) additional 4M shares issued Both of these items can and often will soften a stock value. All that said I think $20 - $24 a share is ridiculous for CLWR. I expect CLWR will bump back up maybe even beyond the IPO price once the market bounces back. The smart money will jump ship saving their skin and the stock will turn downward from that point on. Clearwire has lost more than $460 million during its four-year existence. The company generates about $100 million in annual sales... Certainly McCaw can afford this type of bleeding, but for how long and more importantly how long will Wall Street wait to see the light at the end of the tunnel? Will CLWR ever bask in the sunshine? Long term I only see a decline in value unless they start producing profits real quick! CLWR isn't making any money and doesn't have a bright future of EVER making any money. Hope I'm wrong because a CLWR failure is a failure for fixed wireless as a whole. Best, Brad -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL
