Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-07-02 Thread Bob Elliott - RCS
I can vouch for MailFoundry as well. 

Bob Elliott
Information Systems
RCS Communications
502.587.7384


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Christopher Hair
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 3:59 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

Check out Mailfoundry also...

http://www.mailfoundry.com/



.

Christopher Hair 
NTInet Inc


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Andy Trimmell
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 3:38 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

We've been using Barracuda boxes. Pretty happy with them. 

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 3:16 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

Have you looked into Postini?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
improbable, must be the truth.
--- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle


On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Pat O'Connor p...@inlandnet.com wrote:

 We're switching to this over this weekend.

 http://www.redcondor.com/products/appliances.htm





 rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:
  One of the things I've done in the spam war is to use something
called
 ASSP,
  which is just Anti Spam SMTP Proxy.
 
  It does a passable job of prevening inbound spam, and it prevents
anyone
 not
  on my network from sending mail out through my server, via firewall
rules
  put on the server.
 
  You can use a similar setup to have your customer's emails filtered
 outbound
  through something like this.It can also be placed on alternate
ports
 and
  using firewall rules, prevent any cust omer from sending mail
directly
 out.
 
  I haven't needed to do that, at least not yet.
 
  ASSP, when run on the mail server machine itself, can also act as an
  authentication and filtering of outbound emails.
 
 
 
 
  
  insert witty tagline here
 
  - Original Message -
  From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
  To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
  Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
 
 
  Hi All,
 
  What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for
it's
  reliability, ease of use etc.
 
  Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We
don't
  catch
  things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.
This
  has
  now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
 
  My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other
than to
  limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone
rang
  off
  the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
 
  The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get
(up
 to
  40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the
reply
  address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's
not
  even
  mine (faked info).  sigh
 
  We use Courier MTA.
 
  My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per
day
  per
  user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
  messages
  received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of
all
  those
  sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no
response
 from
  the server admins.
 
  Suggestions?
 
  laters,
  marlon
 
 
 
 



  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 



 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
 
 



  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 



 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 







 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/





 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-07-02 Thread Matt
With Exim you can ratelimit.  Used to have the same problem tell I did this.

http://www.exim.org/exim-html-current/doc/html/spec_html/ch40.html#SECTratelimiting

# This limits each IP to 1000 recipients in 12 hour period
warn ratelimit = 1000 / 12h / per_rcpt / strict
delay = 20s
log_message = Sender $sender_address rate $sender_rate /
$sender_rate_period excedes limit delayed 20 seconds
You can also do this with Mikrotik in limited way.  It only counts TCP
connections.

http://wiki.mikrotik.com/wiki/How_to_autodetect_infected_or_spammer_users_and_temporary_block_the_SMTP_output

Matt

On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 10:33 AM, Marlon K. Schafer 
o...@odessaoffice.comwrote:

 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
 off
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
 even
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
 those
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon





WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-07-01 Thread John Thomas
I don't know about those, but Frontbridge got blacklisted once and they 
are an anti-spam provider

John


George Rogato wrote:
 How come Google, Yahoo, and Live.com don't get black listed.
 I'm pretty sure 1 million times more spam comes out of those domains 
 than any small independent isp's ...



 Marlon K. Schafer wrote:
   
 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's 
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch 
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has 
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to 
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off 
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to 
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply 
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even 
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per 
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages 
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those 
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from 
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
  
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 


 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
  
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



   




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-07-01 Thread John Thomas
http://www.mxlogic.com/services/email-filtering/index.cfm

they have done good by us.

John


George Rogato wrote:
 Wonder how much it is.
 Says it's based on qty of email addresses.



 RickG wrote:
   
 Cost?

 On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Pat O'Connorp...@inlandnet.com wrote:
 
 We're switching to this over this weekend.

 http://www.redcondor.com/products/appliances.htm





 rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:
   
 One of the things I've done in the spam war is to use something called 
 ASSP,
 which is just Anti Spam SMTP Proxy.

 It does a passable job of prevening inbound spam, and it prevents anyone 
 not
 on my network from sending mail out through my server, via firewall rules
 put on the server.

 You can use a similar setup to have your customer's emails filtered 
 outbound
 through something like this.It can also be placed on alternate ports 
 and
 using firewall rules, prevent any cust omer from sending mail directly out.

 I haven't needed to do that, at least not yet.

 ASSP, when run on the mail server machine itself, can also act as an
 authentication and filtering of outbound emails.




 
 insert witty tagline here

 - Original Message -
 From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff



 
 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't
 catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This
 has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
 off
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
 even
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day
 per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
 messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
 those
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

   
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

   
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
  
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 


 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
  
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



   




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-28 Thread Tom DeReggi
I've heard this type arguement for years, and I don;t thinl people really 
get what its all really about

In the ISP business there are two type of providers

1) Ones that take responsibilty and go beyond the call of duty to help their 
customers. That is called customers servic, support, and value add..

2) Then there are ones who deny responsibility or defer responsibilty to 
someone else. That is called a , commodity provider.

Whether or not an ISP chooses to host Email or outsource Emal, either way it 
has absolutely no bearing on whether an ISP is Type 1 or 2 provider.

In other words, even if you host Email, you don't have to take Grandma's 
calls. You can point her to a self help fax, online help, to the paid 
support division, otr simply ignore her until she goes away, IF you don;t 
want to take the calls
And if you outsource Email, you still ahve the option to accept Granda's 
call. Just because she now uses yahoo or google, doesn;t mean you can;t help 
her. And I guarantee is you do help her once, the next time she needs help, 
she is goign to call you for more help, instead of yahoo or google.

The fact is, subscribers call the people for help, that they feel will most 
likely help them, they don;t stop for a second to question who is 
responisble for supporting them.

There are two answers for this 1) You can use that call to your 
advantage.  or 2) you can turn it away, so that you are no longer the one 
that she trusts to call first.

I have a slew of resellers. I'm responisble for supporting the services that 
we offer to the customer's of our resellers, if I'm asked. But I'm not 
usually the one they ask, because they trust the reseller. Thats why they 
ordered from the reseller in the first place.

If you want to outsource, fine. If you want to manage internally fine. There 
are cost, time, and feature justifications for that decission.

I don't know about you, but I want my customers calling me. Some of my 
customers choose Gmail an Hotmail, and I'm fine with that. But I stil;l help 
them with theior Email problems, and it takes me twice as long to help them, 
than it does for me to help my custoemrs that use our own Email system.

What I've challenged myself with is I need to do a better job using 
their call to my advantage. Every time they call, its an opportunity to

1) verify their billing is current, and collect payment if overdue.
2) To ask them if they have been happy with service, and if they ahve any 
feedback.
3) To upsell them an additional add-on service.

What I'm learning is some people aren't looking for it to be free. They just 
want it better.

Interestingly, I can;t remember one customer that has cancelled because our 
service was to expensive. If it was to expensive they never would ahve 
ordered it in the first place.
If they like our service and it is to expensive, they call me to try and 
negotiate better terms so that they can keep our service that they love. 
I'm finding that there are people that complain about speed and paying 
$49/mon, but gladly would ahve been paying $69 for upgraded service, but 
never knew the plan existed. Or gladly would have paid an extra $50 for a 
better SPAM system.

I can give an example of a business sub that was complaining that our $150 
broadband plan was to expensive, and I asked who they used for Email. I 
learned they pay $250 per month for Outsourced Exchange Email hosting. 
Thats right they wee rwilling to pay twice the cost of our broadband, just 
for Email, even when we offered free Email. And our Email service is pretty 
darn good.  My point is Email was a pain point, they saw the value in 
paying for a solution that was supported at a higher priority.

I can give another example, of a customer that left us, because they were 
closing an office, and ordered a competitor's cheaper service at the other 
office, because they had to cut back financially. (Duh, they just closed anb 
office).  BUT, they asked how much it would cost to keep our Email service. 
I told them, we only provide Email for our customers, because Email support 
cost us more than providing broadband does. So I made a special deal with 
him, and he agreed to pay $50/mon to keep our Email. (half his previous 
BRoadband fee).

I started thinking, maybe I should get into the Email business, and give 
broadband away for Free as a Promo :-) Just kidding.

Anyway, my point is,.providers are throwing away an opportunity, when they 
dont take advantage of the opportunity to solve their customer's pain 
points.

Rant done.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 6:58 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff


 Email?  We don't need no stinkin' email!

 We gave up email hosting.  We were sending invoices via email and lots of
 the customers were never

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-28 Thread Robert West
We still help all of our customers when their calls no matter who they use
for email for whatever.  My point was that since we stopped hosting email,
out trouble tickets went way down because now that they mostly use the web
based mail, the problem being with their home PC pretty much goes away.  We
never ignore them and for example, we have one customer who has had issues
with his MSN mail for so many years I can recite his username and password
forward and backwards!  When it comes to mail, now we usually only have to
log into their yahoo and help them set up their junk filters and the like.
Heck, we even have to deal with their manufacturers warranties because they
can't understand the customer service people.  We never, ever turn anyone
away.

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Tom DeReggi
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 5:47 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

I've heard this type arguement for years, and I don;t thinl people really 
get what its all really about

In the ISP business there are two type of providers

1) Ones that take responsibilty and go beyond the call of duty to help their

customers. That is called customers servic, support, and value add..

2) Then there are ones who deny responsibility or defer responsibilty to 
someone else. That is called a , commodity provider.

Whether or not an ISP chooses to host Email or outsource Emal, either way it

has absolutely no bearing on whether an ISP is Type 1 or 2 provider.

In other words, even if you host Email, you don't have to take Grandma's 
calls. You can point her to a self help fax, online help, to the paid 
support division, otr simply ignore her until she goes away, IF you don;t 
want to take the calls
And if you outsource Email, you still ahve the option to accept Granda's 
call. Just because she now uses yahoo or google, doesn;t mean you can;t help

her. And I guarantee is you do help her once, the next time she needs help, 
she is goign to call you for more help, instead of yahoo or google.

The fact is, subscribers call the people for help, that they feel will most 
likely help them, they don;t stop for a second to question who is 
responisble for supporting them.

There are two answers for this 1) You can use that call to your 
advantage.  or 2) you can turn it away, so that you are no longer the one 
that she trusts to call first.

I have a slew of resellers. I'm responisble for supporting the services that

we offer to the customer's of our resellers, if I'm asked. But I'm not 
usually the one they ask, because they trust the reseller. Thats why they 
ordered from the reseller in the first place.

If you want to outsource, fine. If you want to manage internally fine. There

are cost, time, and feature justifications for that decission.

I don't know about you, but I want my customers calling me. Some of my 
customers choose Gmail an Hotmail, and I'm fine with that. But I stil;l help

them with theior Email problems, and it takes me twice as long to help them,

than it does for me to help my custoemrs that use our own Email system.

What I've challenged myself with is I need to do a better job using 
their call to my advantage. Every time they call, its an opportunity to

1) verify their billing is current, and collect payment if overdue.
2) To ask them if they have been happy with service, and if they ahve any 
feedback.
3) To upsell them an additional add-on service.

What I'm learning is some people aren't looking for it to be free. They just

want it better.

Interestingly, I can;t remember one customer that has cancelled because our 
service was to expensive. If it was to expensive they never would ahve 
ordered it in the first place.
If they like our service and it is to expensive, they call me to try and 
negotiate better terms so that they can keep our service that they love. 
I'm finding that there are people that complain about speed and paying 
$49/mon, but gladly would ahve been paying $69 for upgraded service, but 
never knew the plan existed. Or gladly would have paid an extra $50 for a 
better SPAM system.

I can give an example of a business sub that was complaining that our $150 
broadband plan was to expensive, and I asked who they used for Email. I 
learned they pay $250 per month for Outsourced Exchange Email hosting. 
Thats right they wee rwilling to pay twice the cost of our broadband, just 
for Email, even when we offered free Email. And our Email service is pretty 
darn good.  My point is Email was a pain point, they saw the value in 
paying for a solution that was supported at a higher priority.

I can give another example, of a customer that left us, because they were 
closing an office, and ordered a competitor's cheaper service at the other 
office, because they had to cut back financially. (Duh, they just closed anb

office).  BUT, they asked how much it would cost to keep

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-28 Thread David
We have been using policyd for a while in conjunction with redirecting all 
outbound port 25 traffic to our smtp server.  Works great. 

David

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Jon Auer
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 9:48 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
 We are moving to Postfix with PolicyD (http://www.policyd.org) to
 solve this exact problem.
 PolicyD lets you limit the total number of emails sent per user per
 day. No reason a normal home user should be sending 1000 messages per
 day and this will let us limit it. There may be a plugin for Courier
 that does the same thing.
 
 There is still the issue of people flagging the jokes between friends
 and church newsletters as spam instead of deleting...
 
 Some larger mail shops run all their outbound email through a spam
 filter to stop outbound stuff. If the spam is coming from a botnet
 there is a chance the spam signature is already in the spam filter
 database. I know some people use SpamAssassian for this.
 
 On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 10:33 AM, Marlon K.
 Schafero...@odessaoffice.com wrote:
  Hi All,
 
  What are you guys doing for email these days? �I LOVE my setup for
 it's
  reliability, ease of use etc.
 
  Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though. �We don't
 catch
  things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.
 �This has
  now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
 
  My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than
 to
  limit cc's to 25 per message. �We did that once before and my phone
 rang off
  the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
 
  The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get
 (up to
  40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
  address. �So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's
 not even
  mine (faked info). �sigh
 
  We use Courier MTA.
 
  My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per
 day per
  user. �And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
 messages
  received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of
 all those
  sending. �Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response
 from
  the server admins.
 
  Suggestions?
 
  laters,
  marlon
 
 
 
  -
 ---
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
  -
 ---
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
 ---
 -
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 ---
 -
 
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-28 Thread Tom DeReggi
Rob,

That makes sense to me.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 5:59 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff


 We still help all of our customers when their calls no matter who they use
 for email for whatever.  My point was that since we stopped hosting email,
 out trouble tickets went way down because now that they mostly use the web
 based mail, the problem being with their home PC pretty much goes away. 
 We
 never ignore them and for example, we have one customer who has had issues
 with his MSN mail for so many years I can recite his username and password
 forward and backwards!  When it comes to mail, now we usually only have to
 log into their yahoo and help them set up their junk filters and the like.
 Heck, we even have to deal with their manufacturers warranties because 
 they
 can't understand the customer service people.  We never, ever turn anyone
 away.

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Tom DeReggi
 Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 5:47 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 I've heard this type arguement for years, and I don;t thinl people really
 get what its all really about

 In the ISP business there are two type of providers

 1) Ones that take responsibilty and go beyond the call of duty to help 
 their

 customers. That is called customers servic, support, and value add..

 2) Then there are ones who deny responsibility or defer responsibilty to
 someone else. That is called a , commodity provider.

 Whether or not an ISP chooses to host Email or outsource Emal, either way 
 it

 has absolutely no bearing on whether an ISP is Type 1 or 2 provider.

 In other words, even if you host Email, you don't have to take Grandma's
 calls. You can point her to a self help fax, online help, to the paid
 support division, otr simply ignore her until she goes away, IF you don;t
 want to take the calls
 And if you outsource Email, you still ahve the option to accept Granda's
 call. Just because she now uses yahoo or google, doesn;t mean you can;t 
 help

 her. And I guarantee is you do help her once, the next time she needs 
 help,
 she is goign to call you for more help, instead of yahoo or google.

 The fact is, subscribers call the people for help, that they feel will 
 most
 likely help them, they don;t stop for a second to question who is
 responisble for supporting them.

 There are two answers for this 1) You can use that call to your
 advantage.  or 2) you can turn it away, so that you are no longer the one
 that she trusts to call first.

 I have a slew of resellers. I'm responisble for supporting the services 
 that

 we offer to the customer's of our resellers, if I'm asked. But I'm not
 usually the one they ask, because they trust the reseller. Thats why they
 ordered from the reseller in the first place.

 If you want to outsource, fine. If you want to manage internally fine. 
 There

 are cost, time, and feature justifications for that decission.

 I don't know about you, but I want my customers calling me. Some of my
 customers choose Gmail an Hotmail, and I'm fine with that. But I stil;l 
 help

 them with theior Email problems, and it takes me twice as long to help 
 them,

 than it does for me to help my custoemrs that use our own Email system.

 What I've challenged myself with is I need to do a better job using
 their call to my advantage. Every time they call, its an opportunity 
 to

 1) verify their billing is current, and collect payment if overdue.
 2) To ask them if they have been happy with service, and if they ahve any
 feedback.
 3) To upsell them an additional add-on service.

 What I'm learning is some people aren't looking for it to be free. They 
 just

 want it better.

 Interestingly, I can;t remember one customer that has cancelled because 
 our
 service was to expensive. If it was to expensive they never would ahve
 ordered it in the first place.
 If they like our service and it is to expensive, they call me to try and
 negotiate better terms so that they can keep our service that they love.
 I'm finding that there are people that complain about speed and paying
 $49/mon, but gladly would ahve been paying $69 for upgraded service, but
 never knew the plan existed. Or gladly would have paid an extra $50 for a
 better SPAM system.

 I can give an example of a business sub that was complaining that our $150
 broadband plan was to expensive, and I asked who they used for Email. I
 learned they pay $250 per month for Outsourced Exchange Email hosting.
 Thats right they wee rwilling to pay twice the cost of our broadband, just
 for Email, even when we offered free Email. And our Email service is 
 pretty
 darn good.  My point is Email was a pain

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-28 Thread Tom DeReggi
 redirecting all outbound port 25 traffic to our smtp server

Doesn't that create a lot of extra work for you, or problems for your 
clients?
For example, when they use their office server mail from home, or an 
Internet born Email service such as from their Web site provider (usually 
with smtp auth), and your SMTP server not listed as an approved sending 
server in their SPF records? You usually dont want to be be a SPF approved 
sender for a domain owned by a high valoume web provder.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: David ad...@speedyquick.net
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 7:01 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff


 We have been using policyd for a while in conjunction with redirecting all 
 outbound port 25 traffic to our smtp server.  Works great.

 David

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Jon Auer
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 9:48 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 We are moving to Postfix with PolicyD (http://www.policyd.org) to
 solve this exact problem.
 PolicyD lets you limit the total number of emails sent per user per
 day. No reason a normal home user should be sending 1000 messages per
 day and this will let us limit it. There may be a plugin for Courier
 that does the same thing.

 There is still the issue of people flagging the jokes between friends
 and church newsletters as spam instead of deleting...

 Some larger mail shops run all their outbound email through a spam
 filter to stop outbound stuff. If the spam is coming from a botnet
 there is a chance the spam signature is already in the spam filter
 database. I know some people use SpamAssassian for this.

 On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 10:33 AM, Marlon K.
 Schafero...@odessaoffice.com wrote:
  Hi All,
 
  What are you guys doing for email these days? �I LOVE my setup for
 it's
  reliability, ease of use etc.
 
  Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though. �We don't
 catch
  things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.
 �This has
  now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
 
  My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than
 to
  limit cc's to 25 per message. �We did that once before and my phone
 rang off
  the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
 
  The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get
 (up to
  40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
  address. �So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's
 not even
  mine (faked info). �sigh
 
  We use Courier MTA.
 
  My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per
 day per
  user. �And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
 messages
  received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of
 all those
  sending. �Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response
 from
  the server admins.
 
  Suggestions?
 
  laters,
  marlon
 
 
 
  -
 ---
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
  -
 ---
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 


 ---
 -
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 ---
 -

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-28 Thread David
We have only had a couple of customers with problems with this and have 
excluded them from the rule.  On the other side we have stopped many customers 
virus infected computers from doing much damage and as a result our smtp server 
never gets black listed anymore.  The amount of time we spend on email server 
administration (specifically the issues relating to outgoing spam) is a small 
fraction of what it used to be before policyd. 

David 

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Tom DeReggi
 Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 5:45 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
  redirecting all outbound port 25 traffic to our smtp server
 
 Doesn't that create a lot of extra work for you, or problems for your
 clients?
 For example, when they use their office server mail from home, or an
 Internet born Email service such as from their Web site provider
 (usually
 with smtp auth), and your SMTP server not listed as an approved sending
 server in their SPF records? You usually dont want to be be a SPF
 approved
 sender for a domain owned by a high valoume web provder.
 
 
 Tom DeReggi
 RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
 IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
 
 
 - Original Message -
 From: David ad...@speedyquick.net
 To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 7:01 PM
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
 
  We have been using policyd for a while in conjunction with
 redirecting all
  outbound port 25 traffic to our smtp server.  Works great.
 
  David
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
  Behalf Of Jon Auer
  Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 9:48 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
  We are moving to Postfix with PolicyD (http://www.policyd.org) to
  solve this exact problem.
  PolicyD lets you limit the total number of emails sent per user per
  day. No reason a normal home user should be sending 1000 messages
 per
  day and this will let us limit it. There may be a plugin for Courier
  that does the same thing.
 
  There is still the issue of people flagging the jokes between
 friends
  and church newsletters as spam instead of deleting...
 
  Some larger mail shops run all their outbound email through a spam
  filter to stop outbound stuff. If the spam is coming from a botnet
  there is a chance the spam signature is already in the spam filter
  database. I know some people use SpamAssassian for this.
 
  On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 10:33 AM, Marlon K.
  Schafero...@odessaoffice.com wrote:
   Hi All,
  
   What are you guys doing for email these days? ?I LOVE my setup for
  it's
   reliability, ease of use etc.
  
   Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though. ?We
 don't
  catch
   things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.
  ?This has
   now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
  
   My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other
 than
  to
   limit cc's to 25 per message. ?We did that once before and my
 phone
  rang off
   the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
  
   The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I
 get
  (up to
   40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the
 reply
   address. ?So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user
 that's
  not even
   mine (faked info). ?sigh
  
   We use Courier MTA.
  
   My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages
 per
  day per
   user. ?And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
  messages
   received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of
  all those
   sending. ?Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no
 response
  from
   the server admins.
  
   Suggestions?
  
   laters,
   marlon
  
  
  
   --
 ---
  ---
   WISPA Wants You! Join today!
   http://signup.wispa.org/
   --
 ---
  ---
  
   WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
  
   Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
   http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
  
   Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
  
 
 
  
 ---
  -
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
  
 ---
  -
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
  -
 ---
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-27 Thread Robert West
And that would be perfect for us if they would just use our domain for their
mail but around here they are all Yahooaholics.  If it ain't yahoo, they
ain't a usin' it!  But seriously, for us the usage was just not there and
the ones that were using it were ones who needed hand holding for every
simple step in everything computers.  I have no problem educating and
helping when there is a problem, I used to teach all this new fangled
computer and internets at the local college so I'm used to it all, however
it was really eating up too much cash for so little utilization.  

I saw the other day one of the big dial up ISP's were using the G-mail for
ISPs but I can't remember which one it was.  It was setup in outlook
express.  The only reason I saw it was we also have a computer repair shop
and a repair customer had it on their PC.  



-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of George Rogato
Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 1:42 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

I almost feel the same way too.
But a funny thing is, some of our customers like our email. It never has 
virus, and we have a spam filter provider that sends a daily quarantine 
report and those emails never make it to my server.
So for the most part, everything is great till we get blacklisted.
And a nice thing is, it's free advertising that you just can't buy.

When I see some of the emails people send to their groups cc'd and not 
bcc'd, and I see my domain in the bulk of those emails, I know other 
people do too that don't use my service.
When they get tired of poor support from their isp, like charter or 
qwest, they already know we are serving their friends and find their way 
to us.

We get a lot of word of mouth advertising that way.

RickG wrote:
 I have thought about this many times as well. I couldnt make a clean
 break so I practically keep it a secret that we offer it. They only
 get our email if they ask. Now, if we can drop the electrical
 storms!!!
 -RickG
 
 On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 6:58 PM, Robert Westrobert.w...@just-micro.com
wrote:
 Email?  We don't need no stinkin' email!

 We gave up email hosting.  We were sending invoices via email and lots of
 the customers were never getting them because they never used the email
 address we gave them, they were mostly using Yahoo online!  The user
 accounts were jammed packed of just junk mail and such because they never
 grabbed mail from their box.  Well!  After some thought, we stopped
giving
 out email addresses and giving them a list of free email sites such as
Gmail
 and yahoo.  (In an effort to keep our prices as friendly as we can.
 blah, blah, blah.)  We grandfathered the existing users and hosted
them
 but eventually they all moved to the free providers also.  So now what?
No
 more support calls on the email, I can tell ya that!  More than half of
our
 trouble tickets went away.  I no longer have to recite to grandma how to
 reenter her user name and password just because the grandkids wiped it
out
 of her incredimail.  YES!!!



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:33 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't
catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This
has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
off

 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up
to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
even

 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day
per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
those

 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response
from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon





 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/


 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-27 Thread Robert West
We use a hosting service for our domain (no need to run a webserver anymore)
and it's a shared hosting account that will allow me to add email if I want.
They scan for the virus's, they do the backup, etc.  The cost is 100 bucks a
year and rarely a headache.  Being a shared hosting service, we can also add
domains to it.  Say, a business signs up and they have no email for the
business setup and no website.  We can offer to setup a domain, vanity email
for their business and they can have a nice little website.  The cost for us
is nothing since it's a shared hosting account and we can charge a little
more for the service of setting it up.  For that 100 bucks a year, we have
16 business customers on the shared host all with their own @whatever email
addresses and a website if they want it.  They take care of their own
password changes and all, we just enter the information when it's first
setup.  They can also add and change or whatever to their site if they
please.  Easy money on all that at least.

I try to do what's practical for us and with less hassle.  The less people
we have to have on staff the better and this simple 100 bucks a year easily
saves us one person on staff.

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of RickG
Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 12:44 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

I have thought about this many times as well. I couldnt make a clean
break so I practically keep it a secret that we offer it. They only
get our email if they ask. Now, if we can drop the electrical
storms!!!
-RickG

On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 6:58 PM, Robert Westrobert.w...@just-micro.com
wrote:
 Email?  We don't need no stinkin' email!

 We gave up email hosting.  We were sending invoices via email and lots of
 the customers were never getting them because they never used the email
 address we gave them, they were mostly using Yahoo online!  The user
 accounts were jammed packed of just junk mail and such because they never
 grabbed mail from their box.  Well!  After some thought, we stopped giving
 out email addresses and giving them a list of free email sites such as
Gmail
 and yahoo.  (In an effort to keep our prices as friendly as we can.
 blah, blah, blah.)  We grandfathered the existing users and hosted
them
 but eventually they all moved to the free providers also.  So now what?
 No
 more support calls on the email, I can tell ya that!  More than half of
our
 trouble tickets went away.  I no longer have to recite to grandma how to
 reenter her user name and password just because the grandkids wiped it out
 of her incredimail.  YES!!!



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:33 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't
catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This
has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
off

 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
even

 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day
per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
those

 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon





 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/


 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/






 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/




 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/





WISPA Wants You

[WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
Hi All,

What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's 
reliability, ease of use etc.

Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch 
things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has 
now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to 
limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off 
the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to 
40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply 
address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even 
mine (faked info).  sigh

We use Courier MTA.

My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per 
user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages 
received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those 
sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from 
the server admins.

Suggestions?

laters,
marlon




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread George Rogato
How come Google, Yahoo, and Live.com don't get black listed.
I'm pretty sure 1 million times more spam comes out of those domains 
than any small independent isp's ...



Marlon K. Schafer wrote:
 Hi All,
 
 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's 
 reliability, ease of use etc.
 
 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch 
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has 
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
 
 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to 
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off 
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
 
 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to 
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply 
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even 
 mine (faked info).  sigh
 
 We use Courier MTA.
 
 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per 
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages 
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those 
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from 
 the server admins.
 
 Suggestions?
 
 laters,
 marlon
 
 
 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
  
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
Yeah, I wonder about that too.  Probably for two reasons, mainly because 
they ARE the biggest spammers :-).  There's money in it after all 
hehehehe

Mostly I'll bet that they have people watching for such activity in real 
time.  And they can tweak servers constantly.  I have to catch things after 
the damage is done.

There has to be a better way.
marlon

- Original Message - 
From: George Rogato wi...@oregonfast.net
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:36 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff


 How come Google, Yahoo, and Live.com don't get black listed.
 I'm pretty sure 1 million times more spam comes out of those domains
 than any small independent isp's ...



 Marlon K. Schafer wrote:
 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't 
 catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This 
 has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang 
 off
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up 
 to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not 
 even
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day 
 per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of 
 messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all 
 those
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response 
 from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Jon Auer
We are moving to Postfix with PolicyD (http://www.policyd.org) to
solve this exact problem.
PolicyD lets you limit the total number of emails sent per user per
day. No reason a normal home user should be sending 1000 messages per
day and this will let us limit it. There may be a plugin for Courier
that does the same thing.

There is still the issue of people flagging the jokes between friends
and church newsletters as spam instead of deleting...

Some larger mail shops run all their outbound email through a spam
filter to stop outbound stuff. If the spam is coming from a botnet
there is a chance the spam signature is already in the spam filter
database. I know some people use SpamAssassian for this.

On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 10:33 AM, Marlon K. Schafero...@odessaoffice.com 
wrote:
 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Terry Hickey
MailwatchMailScannerSpamAssassian Virus Program of your choice MTA 
of your choice
Monitor blacklist stuff with DNSStuff

- Original Message - 
From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 9:42 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff


 Yeah, I wonder about that too.  Probably for two reasons, mainly because
 they ARE the biggest spammers :-).  There's money in it after all
 hehehehe

 Mostly I'll bet that they have people watching for such activity in real
 time.  And they can tweak servers constantly.  I have to catch things 
 after
 the damage is done.

 There has to be a better way.
 marlon

 - Original Message - 
 From: George Rogato wi...@oregonfast.net
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:36 AM
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff


 How come Google, Yahoo, and Live.com don't get black listed.
 I'm pretty sure 1 million times more spam comes out of those domains
 than any small independent isp's ...



 Marlon K. Schafer wrote:
 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't
 catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This
 has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
 off
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up
 to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
 even
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day
 per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
 messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
 those
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response
 from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Chuck Profito
Marlon
We use FRANK MUTO.  Ever since we made the change, email has been a nice 5
letter word, instead of a repetitive prefixed 4 letter one :-).
And our customers really like the change.  Mostly for the full featured back
end and their own spam control.
Not to mention, 90% of that bandwidth usage never makes it to the gateway or
our pocketbook, or latency.
Since it is a paid service, I usually refer the 'extras' kids to Gmail.
Have a good weekend fellow wisps, I'm outta here.

Chuck Profito
209-988-7388
CV-ACCESS, INC
cprof...@cv-access.com 
Providing High Speed Broadband 
to Rural Central California

 

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

Hi All,

What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's 
reliability, ease of use etc.

Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch 
things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has 
now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to 
limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off

the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to 
40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply 
address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even

mine (faked info).  sigh

We use Courier MTA.

My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per 
user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages 
received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those

sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from 
the server admins.

Suggestions?

laters,
marlon





WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/


 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Charles Wyble
There are whitelist companies. Goog/yahoo/live and other popular web 
sites (ie mc donalds/BofA etc) pay 50k+ a year to be on that list.

People then subscribe to that list and pass the traffic uninhibited for 
a share of the profit.

I previously worked at an event management company that got well over 10 
million visitors a day, and sent out massive amounts of e-mail. We paid 
to be on such lists.

George Rogato wrote:
 How come Google, Yahoo, and Live.com don't get black listed.
 I'm pretty sure 1 million times more spam comes out of those domains 
 than any small independent isp's ...
 
 
 
 Marlon K. Schafer wrote:
 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's 
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch 
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has 
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to 
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off 
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to 
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply 
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even 
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per 
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages 
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those 
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from 
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
  
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
  
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 



WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread reader
One of the things I've done in the spam war is to use something called ASSP, 
which is just Anti Spam SMTP Proxy.

It does a passable job of prevening inbound spam, and it prevents anyone not 
on my network from sending mail out through my server, via firewall rules 
put on the server.

You can use a similar setup to have your customer's emails filtered outbound 
through something like this.It can also be placed on alternate ports and 
using firewall rules, prevent any cust omer from sending mail directly out.

I haven't needed to do that, at least not yet.

ASSP, when run on the mail server machine itself, can also act as an 
authentication and filtering of outbound emails.





insert witty tagline here

- Original Message - 
From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff


 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't 
 catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This 
 has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang 
 off
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not 
 even
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day 
 per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of 
 messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all 
 those
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Pat O'Connor
We're switching to this over this weekend.

http://www.redcondor.com/products/appliances.htm





rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:
 One of the things I've done in the spam war is to use something called ASSP, 
 which is just Anti Spam SMTP Proxy.

 It does a passable job of prevening inbound spam, and it prevents anyone not 
 on my network from sending mail out through my server, via firewall rules 
 put on the server.

 You can use a similar setup to have your customer's emails filtered outbound 
 through something like this.It can also be placed on alternate ports and 
 using firewall rules, prevent any cust omer from sending mail directly out.

 I haven't needed to do that, at least not yet.

 ASSP, when run on the mail server machine itself, can also act as an 
 authentication and filtering of outbound emails.




 
 insert witty tagline here

 - Original Message - 
 From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff


   
 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't 
 catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This 
 has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang 
 off
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not 
 even
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day 
 per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of 
 messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all 
 those
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 
 



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
  
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

   




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Josh Luthman
Have you looked into Postini?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
improbable, must be the truth.
--- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle


On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Pat O'Connor p...@inlandnet.com wrote:

 We're switching to this over this weekend.

 http://www.redcondor.com/products/appliances.htm





 rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:
  One of the things I've done in the spam war is to use something called
 ASSP,
  which is just Anti Spam SMTP Proxy.
 
  It does a passable job of prevening inbound spam, and it prevents anyone
 not
  on my network from sending mail out through my server, via firewall rules
  put on the server.
 
  You can use a similar setup to have your customer's emails filtered
 outbound
  through something like this.It can also be placed on alternate ports
 and
  using firewall rules, prevent any cust omer from sending mail directly
 out.
 
  I haven't needed to do that, at least not yet.
 
  ASSP, when run on the mail server machine itself, can also act as an
  authentication and filtering of outbound emails.
 
 
 
 
  
  insert witty tagline here
 
  - Original Message -
  From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
  To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
  Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
 
 
  Hi All,
 
  What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
  reliability, ease of use etc.
 
  Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't
  catch
  things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This
  has
  now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
 
  My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
  limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
  off
  the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
 
  The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up
 to
  40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
  address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
  even
  mine (faked info).  sigh
 
  We use Courier MTA.
 
  My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day
  per
  user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
  messages
  received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
  those
  sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response
 from
  the server admins.
 
  Suggestions?
 
  laters,
  marlon
 
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 




 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/

 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Andy Trimmell
We've been using Barracuda boxes. Pretty happy with them. 

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 3:16 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

Have you looked into Postini?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
improbable, must be the truth.
--- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle


On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Pat O'Connor p...@inlandnet.com wrote:

 We're switching to this over this weekend.

 http://www.redcondor.com/products/appliances.htm





 rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:
  One of the things I've done in the spam war is to use something
called
 ASSP,
  which is just Anti Spam SMTP Proxy.
 
  It does a passable job of prevening inbound spam, and it prevents
anyone
 not
  on my network from sending mail out through my server, via firewall
rules
  put on the server.
 
  You can use a similar setup to have your customer's emails filtered
 outbound
  through something like this.It can also be placed on alternate
ports
 and
  using firewall rules, prevent any cust omer from sending mail
directly
 out.
 
  I haven't needed to do that, at least not yet.
 
  ASSP, when run on the mail server machine itself, can also act as an
  authentication and filtering of outbound emails.
 
 
 
 
  
  insert witty tagline here
 
  - Original Message -
  From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
  To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
  Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
 
 
  Hi All,
 
  What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for
it's
  reliability, ease of use etc.
 
  Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We
don't
  catch
  things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.
This
  has
  now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
 
  My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other
than to
  limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone
rang
  off
  the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
 
  The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get
(up
 to
  40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the
reply
  address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's
not
  even
  mine (faked info).  sigh
 
  We use Courier MTA.
 
  My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per
day
  per
  user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
  messages
  received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of
all
  those
  sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no
response
 from
  the server admins.
 
  Suggestions?
 
  laters,
  marlon
 
 
 
 



  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 



 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
 
 



  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 



 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 







 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/





 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/





WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/


 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 
Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.92/2203 - Release Date:
06/26/09 05:53:00



WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Christopher Hair
Check out Mailfoundry also...

http://www.mailfoundry.com/



.

Christopher Hair 
NTInet Inc


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Andy Trimmell
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 3:38 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

We've been using Barracuda boxes. Pretty happy with them. 

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 3:16 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

Have you looked into Postini?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
improbable, must be the truth.
--- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle


On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Pat O'Connor p...@inlandnet.com wrote:

 We're switching to this over this weekend.

 http://www.redcondor.com/products/appliances.htm





 rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:
  One of the things I've done in the spam war is to use something
called
 ASSP,
  which is just Anti Spam SMTP Proxy.
 
  It does a passable job of prevening inbound spam, and it prevents
anyone
 not
  on my network from sending mail out through my server, via firewall
rules
  put on the server.
 
  You can use a similar setup to have your customer's emails filtered
 outbound
  through something like this.It can also be placed on alternate
ports
 and
  using firewall rules, prevent any cust omer from sending mail
directly
 out.
 
  I haven't needed to do that, at least not yet.
 
  ASSP, when run on the mail server machine itself, can also act as an
  authentication and filtering of outbound emails.
 
 
 
 
  
  insert witty tagline here
 
  - Original Message -
  From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
  To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
  Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
 
 
  Hi All,
 
  What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for
it's
  reliability, ease of use etc.
 
  Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We
don't
  catch
  things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.
This
  has
  now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
 
  My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other
than to
  limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone
rang
  off
  the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
 
  The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get
(up
 to
  40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the
reply
  address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's
not
  even
  mine (faked info).  sigh
 
  We use Courier MTA.
 
  My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per
day
  per
  user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
  messages
  received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of
all
  those
  sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no
response
 from
  the server admins.
 
  Suggestions?
 
  laters,
  marlon
 
 
 
 



  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 



 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
 
 



  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 



 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 







 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/





 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/





WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/


 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Jeremy Parr
I was running a Barracuda for a few years until it died, and had to
implement a Postfix box with some addins in a hurry. The
Postfix+spamassasin+rbls+greylisting now works as well as the
Barracuda, and doesn't require the annual support fees.

On 6/26/09, Andy Trimmell atrimm...@precisionds.com wrote:
 We've been using Barracuda boxes. Pretty happy with them.

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Josh Luthman
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 3:16 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 Have you looked into Postini?

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
 improbable, must be the truth.
 --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle


 On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Pat O'Connor p...@inlandnet.com wrote:

 We're switching to this over this weekend.

 http://www.redcondor.com/products/appliances.htm





 rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:
  One of the things I've done in the spam war is to use something
 called
 ASSP,
  which is just Anti Spam SMTP Proxy.
 
  It does a passable job of prevening inbound spam, and it prevents
 anyone
 not
  on my network from sending mail out through my server, via firewall
 rules
  put on the server.
 
  You can use a similar setup to have your customer's emails filtered
 outbound
  through something like this.It can also be placed on alternate
 ports
 and
  using firewall rules, prevent any cust omer from sending mail
 directly
 out.
 
  I haven't needed to do that, at least not yet.
 
  ASSP, when run on the mail server machine itself, can also act as an
  authentication and filtering of outbound emails.
 
 
 
 
  
  insert witty tagline here
 
  - Original Message -
  From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
  To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
  Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
  Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
 
 
  Hi All,
 
  What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for
 it's
  reliability, ease of use etc.
 
  Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We
 don't
  catch
  things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.
 This
  has
  now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
 
  My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other
 than to
  limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone
 rang
  off
  the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
 
  The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get
 (up
 to
  40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the
 reply
  address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's
 not
  even
  mine (faked info).  sigh
 
  We use Courier MTA.
 
  My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per
 day
  per
  user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
  messages
  received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of
 all
  those
  sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no
 response
 from
  the server admins.
 
  Suggestions?
 
  laters,
  marlon
 
 
 
 

 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
 
 

 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 





 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/


 
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

 No virus found in this incoming message.
 Checked

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Robert West
Email?  We don't need no stinkin' email!

We gave up email hosting.  We were sending invoices via email and lots of
the customers were never getting them because they never used the email
address we gave them, they were mostly using Yahoo online!  The user
accounts were jammed packed of just junk mail and such because they never
grabbed mail from their box.  Well!  After some thought, we stopped giving
out email addresses and giving them a list of free email sites such as Gmail
and yahoo.  (In an effort to keep our prices as friendly as we can.
blah, blah, blah.)  We grandfathered the existing users and hosted them
but eventually they all moved to the free providers also.  So now what?  No
more support calls on the email, I can tell ya that!  More than half of our
trouble tickets went away.  I no longer have to recite to grandma how to
reenter her user name and password just because the grandkids wiped it out
of her incredimail.  YES!!!



-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:33 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

Hi All,

What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's 
reliability, ease of use etc.

Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch 
things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has 
now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to 
limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off

the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to 
40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply 
address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even

mine (faked info).  sigh

We use Courier MTA.

My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per 
user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages 
received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those

sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from 
the server admins.

Suggestions?

laters,
marlon





WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/


 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Josh Luthman
I use Gmail for ISPs.  Minimal support.

On 6/26/09, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com wrote:
 Email?  We don't need no stinkin' email!

 We gave up email hosting.  We were sending invoices via email and lots of
 the customers were never getting them because they never used the email
 address we gave them, they were mostly using Yahoo online!  The user
 accounts were jammed packed of just junk mail and such because they never
 grabbed mail from their box.  Well!  After some thought, we stopped giving
 out email addresses and giving them a list of free email sites such as Gmail
 and yahoo.  (In an effort to keep our prices as friendly as we can.
 blah, blah, blah.)  We grandfathered the existing users and hosted them
 but eventually they all moved to the free providers also.  So now what?  No
 more support calls on the email, I can tell ya that!  More than half of our
 trouble tickets went away.  I no longer have to recite to grandma how to
 reenter her user name and password just because the grandkids wiped it out
 of her incredimail.  YES!!!



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:33 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off

 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even

 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those

 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



-- 
Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
improbable, must be the truth.
--- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle



WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Gino Villarini
We provide service mostly to business, many of them run their own  
email servers.

So we are looking for a transparent outgoing email filter

Any sugestions?



Sent from my Motorola Startac...


On Jun 26, 2009, at 7:25 PM, Josh Luthman  
j...@imaginenetworksllc.com wrote:

 I use Gmail for ISPs.  Minimal support.

 On 6/26/09, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com wrote:
 Email?  We don't need no stinkin' email!

 We gave up email hosting.  We were sending invoices via email and  
 lots of
 the customers were never getting them because they never used the  
 email
 address we gave them, they were mostly using Yahoo online!  The user
 accounts were jammed packed of just junk mail and such because they  
 never
 grabbed mail from their box.  Well!  After some thought, we stopped  
 giving
 out email addresses and giving them a list of free email sites such  
 as Gmail
 and yahoo.  (In an effort to keep our prices as friendly as we  
 can.
 blah, blah, blah.)  We grandfathered the existing users and  
 hosted them
 but eventually they all moved to the free providers also.  So now  
 what?  No
 more support calls on the email, I can tell ya that!  More than  
 half of our
 trouble tickets went away.  I no longer have to recite to grandma  
 how to
 reenter her user name and password just because the grandkids wiped  
 it out
 of her incredimail.  YES!!!



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless- 
 boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:33 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for  
 it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We  
 don't catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.   
 This has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other  
 than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone  
 rang off

 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get  
 (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's  
 not even

 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per  
 day per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of  
 messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of  
 all those

 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no  
 response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 --- 
 --- 
 --- 
 ---
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 --- 
 --- 
 --- 
 ---
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 --- 
 --- 
 --- 
 --- 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 --- 
 --- 
 --- 
 --- 
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 -- 
 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
 improbable, must be the truth.
 --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle


 --- 
 --- 
 --- 
 --- 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 --- 
 --- 
 --- 
 --- 
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
We already use postini for email.  Been doing that long before I even knew 
Franks name!

He's a good guy and postini is amazingly good.

He does your outbound too?

- Original Message - 
From: Chuck Profito cprof...@cv-access.com
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:57 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff


 Marlon
 We use FRANK MUTO.  Ever since we made the change, email has been a nice 5
 letter word, instead of a repetitive prefixed 4 letter one :-).
 And our customers really like the change.  Mostly for the full featured 
 back
 end and their own spam control.
 Not to mention, 90% of that bandwidth usage never makes it to the gateway 
 or
 our pocketbook, or latency.
 Since it is a paid service, I usually refer the 'extras' kids to Gmail.
 Have a good weekend fellow wisps, I'm outta here.

 Chuck Profito
 209-988-7388
 CV-ACCESS, INC
 cprof...@cv-access.com
 Providing High Speed Broadband
 to Rural Central California



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't 
 catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This 
 has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang 
 off

 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not 
 even

 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day 
 per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of 
 messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all 
 those

 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Josh Luthman
Yes.  Gmail goes in/out of Postini before it reaches the Internets.

Archiving all that email makes things great!

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
improbable, must be the truth.
--- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle


On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 8:12 PM, Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.comwrote:

 We already use postini for email.  Been doing that long before I even knew
 Franks name!

 He's a good guy and postini is amazingly good.

 He does your outbound too?

 - Original Message -
 From: Chuck Profito cprof...@cv-access.com
 To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:57 AM
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff


  Marlon
  We use FRANK MUTO.  Ever since we made the change, email has been a nice
 5
  letter word, instead of a repetitive prefixed 4 letter one :-).
  And our customers really like the change.  Mostly for the full featured
  back
  end and their own spam control.
  Not to mention, 90% of that bandwidth usage never makes it to the gateway
  or
  our pocketbook, or latency.
  Since it is a paid service, I usually refer the 'extras' kids to Gmail.
  Have a good weekend fellow wisps, I'm outta here.
 
  Chuck Profito
  209-988-7388
  CV-ACCESS, INC
  cprof...@cv-access.com
  Providing High Speed Broadband
  to Rural Central California
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
  Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
  Hi All,
 
  What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
  reliability, ease of use etc.
 
  Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't
  catch
  things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This
  has
  now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
 
  My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
  limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
  off
 
  the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
 
  The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up
 to
  40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
  address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
  even
 
  mine (faked info).  sigh
 
  We use Courier MTA.
 
  My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day
  per
  user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
  messages
  received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
  those
 
  sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response
 from
  the server admins.
 
  Suggestions?
 
  laters,
  marlon
 
 
 
 
 
  
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
  
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/

 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Frank Muto
They switched over to a hosted service after first having Postini.  



Frank Muto
www.SecureEmailPlus.com
WISPA Vendor Member






- Original Message - 
From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:12 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff


 We already use postini for email.  Been doing that long before I even knew 
 Franks name!
 
 He's a good guy and postini is amazingly good.
 
 He does your outbound too?
 
 - Original Message - 
 From: Chuck Profito cprof...@cv-access.com
 To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:57 AM
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
 
 Marlon
 We use FRANK MUTO.  Ever since we made the change, email has been a nice 5
 letter word, instead of a repetitive prefixed 4 letter one :-).
 And our customers really like the change.  Mostly for the full featured 
 back
 end and their own spam control.
 Not to mention, 90% of that bandwidth usage never makes it to the gateway 
 or
 our pocketbook, or latency.
 Since it is a paid service, I usually refer the 'extras' kids to Gmail.
 Have a good weekend fellow wisps, I'm outta here.

 Chuck Profito
 209-988-7388
 CV-ACCESS, INC
 cprof...@cv-access.com
 Providing High Speed Broadband
 to Rural Central California



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't 
 catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This 
 has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang 
 off

 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not 
 even

 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day 
 per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of 
 messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all 
 those

 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 
 
 
 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Charles Wu
There are a bunch of companies that will outsource it for cheap -- for 
example...I know IKANO is reselling a branded gmail interface (e.g., you get 
all the functionality of Gmail and GApps but with your domain)

-Charles

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Marlon K. Schafer
Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:33 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

Hi All,

What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's 
reliability, ease of use etc.

Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch 
things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has 
now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to 
limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off 
the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to 
40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply 
address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even 
mine (faked info).  sigh

We use Courier MTA.

My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per 
user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages 
received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those 
sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from 
the server admins.

Suggestions?

laters,
marlon




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Jayson Baker
Gmail Partner Edition.  $0.35/mo/box and never a worry.  We paid nothing for
setup fees, going through Joseph M at IKANO.

We used Everyone.net in the past, but I'd stay as *far away* from them as
possible.  We had some large clients hosted with them and when the large
clients were a few months behind on their payments to us and we threatened
to turn them off, they went direct to Everyone.net and got their own
account.  Everyone.net transferred their accounts over without so much as an
email to us.  Everyone.net was worthless in trying to resolve the issue and
basically just ignored us for months.  Besides, compared to Gmail, their
webmail interface and storage space is severely lacking.

Jayson Baker


On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 9:33 AM, Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.comwrote:

 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
 off
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
 even
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
 those
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon




 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/

 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Josh Luthman
Couldn't you just go to google.com/a and sign up yourself?

On 6/26/09, Charles Wu c...@cticonnect.com wrote:
 There are a bunch of companies that will outsource it for cheap -- for
 example...I know IKANO is reselling a branded gmail interface (e.g., you get
 all the functionality of Gmail and GApps but with your domain)

 -Charles

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:33 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



-- 
Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
improbable, must be the truth.
--- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle



WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Jayson Baker
The partner edition gives you migration capability, an API for integration
with a CRM, better support from Google, and some other things.
There were a couple other reasons we had to go partner, I don't recall them
all.  But at only 35c/mo/box, it's not bad.

On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 8:49 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 Couldn't you just go to google.com/a and sign up yourself?

 On 6/26/09, Charles Wu c...@cticonnect.com wrote:
  There are a bunch of companies that will outsource it for cheap -- for
  example...I know IKANO is reselling a branded gmail interface (e.g., you
 get
  all the functionality of Gmail and GApps but with your domain)
 
  -Charles
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
  Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:33 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
  Hi All,
 
  What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
  reliability, ease of use etc.
 
  Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't
 catch
  things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This
 has
  now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
 
  My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
  limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
 off
  the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
 
  The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up
 to
  40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
  address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
 even
  mine (faked info).  sigh
 
  We use Courier MTA.
 
  My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day
 per
  user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
 messages
  received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
 those
  sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response
 from
  the server admins.
 
  Suggestions?
 
  laters,
  marlon
 
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 


 --
 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
 improbable, must be the truth.
 --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/

 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Josh Luthman
Partner is ISP edition, right?

If so coming from the free edition you actually get support.  Free
does not offer support.

Thanks for sharing the 35c/user figure, heard a lot of it isn't free
talk but numbers.

On 6/26/09, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com wrote:
 The partner edition gives you migration capability, an API for integration
 with a CRM, better support from Google, and some other things.
 There were a couple other reasons we had to go partner, I don't recall them
 all.  But at only 35c/mo/box, it's not bad.

 On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 8:49 PM, Josh Luthman
 j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 Couldn't you just go to google.com/a and sign up yourself?

 On 6/26/09, Charles Wu c...@cticonnect.com wrote:
  There are a bunch of companies that will outsource it for cheap -- for
  example...I know IKANO is reselling a branded gmail interface (e.g., you
 get
  all the functionality of Gmail and GApps but with your domain)
 
  -Charles
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
  Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:33 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
  Hi All,
 
  What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
  reliability, ease of use etc.
 
  Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't
 catch
  things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This
 has
  now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
 
  My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
  limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
 off
  the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
 
  The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up
 to
  40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
  address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
 even
  mine (faked info).  sigh
 
  We use Courier MTA.
 
  My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day
 per
  user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
 messages
  received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
 those
  sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response
 from
  the server admins.
 
  Suggestions?
 
  laters,
  marlon
 
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 


 --
 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
 improbable, must be the truth.
 --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/

 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



-- 
Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
improbable, must be the truth.
--- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle



WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Jayson Baker
Yes, ISP edition.

Another of the big points was with the paid version, you don't get any ads.
Obviously with the free version, you have a side full of ads (unless, of
course, you use IMAP/POP3).

On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 9:08 PM, Josh Luthman
j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 Partner is ISP edition, right?

 If so coming from the free edition you actually get support.  Free
 does not offer support.

 Thanks for sharing the 35c/user figure, heard a lot of it isn't free
 talk but numbers.

 On 6/26/09, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com wrote:
  The partner edition gives you migration capability, an API for
 integration
  with a CRM, better support from Google, and some other things.
  There were a couple other reasons we had to go partner, I don't recall
 them
  all.  But at only 35c/mo/box, it's not bad.
 
  On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 8:49 PM, Josh Luthman
  j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:
 
  Couldn't you just go to google.com/a and sign up yourself?
 
  On 6/26/09, Charles Wu c...@cticonnect.com wrote:
   There are a bunch of companies that will outsource it for cheap -- for
   example...I know IKANO is reselling a branded gmail interface (e.g.,
 you
  get
   all the functionality of Gmail and GApps but with your domain)
  
   -Charles
  
   -Original Message-
   From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
 On
   Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
   Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:33 AM
   To: WISPA General List
   Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
  
   Hi All,
  
   What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for
 it's
   reliability, ease of use etc.
  
   Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't
  catch
   things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.
  This
  has
   now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
  
   My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than
 to
   limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone
 rang
  off
   the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
  
   The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get
 (up
  to
   40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
   address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's
 not
  even
   mine (faked info).  sigh
  
   We use Courier MTA.
  
   My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per
 day
  per
   user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
  messages
   received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
  those
   sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response
  from
   the server admins.
  
   Suggestions?
  
   laters,
   marlon
  
  
  
  
 
 
   WISPA Wants You! Join today!
   http://signup.wispa.org/
  
 
 
  
   WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
  
   Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
   http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
  
   Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
  
  
  
 
 
   WISPA Wants You! Join today!
   http://signup.wispa.org/
  
 
 
  
   WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
  
   Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
   http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
  
   Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
  
 
 
  --
  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373
 
  When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
  improbable, must be the truth.
  --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle
 
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 


 --
 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
 improbable, must be the truth.
 --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread Jon Auer
You might want to check out the Tucows hosted email solution.
IIRC their price per box was a bit lower than Gmail.
They had a API, migration assistance, etc.
We looked at both and decided to keep rolling our own as it was
cheaper to pay someone to maintain than to outsource.

On 6/26/09, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com wrote:
 The partner edition gives you migration capability, an API for integration
 with a CRM, better support from Google, and some other things.
 There were a couple other reasons we had to go partner, I don't recall them
 all.  But at only 35c/mo/box, it's not bad.

 On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 8:49 PM, Josh Luthman
 j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote:

 Couldn't you just go to google.com/a and sign up yourself?

 On 6/26/09, Charles Wu c...@cticonnect.com wrote:
  There are a bunch of companies that will outsource it for cheap -- for
  example...I know IKANO is reselling a branded gmail interface (e.g., you
 get
  all the functionality of Gmail and GApps but with your domain)
 
  -Charles
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
  Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
  Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 10:33 AM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff
 
  Hi All,
 
  What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
  reliability, ease of use etc.
 
  Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't
 catch
  things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This
 has
  now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.
 
  My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
  limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
 off
  the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.
 
  The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up
 to
  40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
  address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
 even
  mine (faked info).  sigh
 
  We use Courier MTA.
 
  My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day
 per
  user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
 messages
  received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
 those
  sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response
 from
  the server admins.
 
  Suggestions?
 
  laters,
  marlon
 
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 
 
 
 
  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
  http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 
 
  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
 


 --
 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
 improbable, must be the truth.
 --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/

 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


-- 
Sent from my mobile device



WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread RickG
Cost?

On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Pat O'Connorp...@inlandnet.com wrote:
 We're switching to this over this weekend.

 http://www.redcondor.com/products/appliances.htm





 rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:
 One of the things I've done in the spam war is to use something called ASSP,
 which is just Anti Spam SMTP Proxy.

 It does a passable job of prevening inbound spam, and it prevents anyone not
 on my network from sending mail out through my server, via firewall rules
 put on the server.

 You can use a similar setup to have your customer's emails filtered outbound
 through something like this.    It can also be placed on alternate ports and
 using firewall rules, prevent any cust omer from sending mail directly out.

 I haven't needed to do that, at least not yet.

 ASSP, when run on the mail server machine itself, can also act as an
 authentication and filtering of outbound emails.




 
 insert witty tagline here

 - Original Message -
 From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff



 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't
 catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This
 has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
 off
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
 even
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day
 per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
 messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
 those
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/





 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread RickG
I have thought about this many times as well. I couldnt make a clean
break so I practically keep it a secret that we offer it. They only
get our email if they ask. Now, if we can drop the electrical
storms!!!
-RickG

On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 6:58 PM, Robert Westrobert.w...@just-micro.com wrote:
 Email?  We don't need no stinkin' email!

 We gave up email hosting.  We were sending invoices via email and lots of
 the customers were never getting them because they never used the email
 address we gave them, they were mostly using Yahoo online!  The user
 accounts were jammed packed of just junk mail and such because they never
 grabbed mail from their box.  Well!  After some thought, we stopped giving
 out email addresses and giving them a list of free email sites such as Gmail
 and yahoo.  (In an effort to keep our prices as friendly as we can.
 blah, blah, blah.)  We grandfathered the existing users and hosted them
 but eventually they all moved to the free providers also.  So now what?  No
 more support calls on the email, I can tell ya that!  More than half of our
 trouble tickets went away.  I no longer have to recite to grandma how to
 reenter her user name and password just because the grandkids wiped it out
 of her incredimail.  YES!!!



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:33 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off

 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even

 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those

 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread RickG
How long have you been using them?
Has it worked out well?
-RickG

On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 7:24 PM, Josh
Luthmanj...@imaginenetworksllc.com wrote:
 I use Gmail for ISPs.  Minimal support.

 On 6/26/09, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com wrote:
 Email?  We don't need no stinkin' email!

 We gave up email hosting.  We were sending invoices via email and lots of
 the customers were never getting them because they never used the email
 address we gave them, they were mostly using Yahoo online!  The user
 accounts were jammed packed of just junk mail and such because they never
 grabbed mail from their box.  Well!  After some thought, we stopped giving
 out email addresses and giving them a list of free email sites such as Gmail
 and yahoo.  (In an effort to keep our prices as friendly as we can.
 blah, blah, blah.)  We grandfathered the existing users and hosted them
 but eventually they all moved to the free providers also.  So now what?  No
 more support calls on the email, I can tell ya that!  More than half of our
 trouble tickets went away.  I no longer have to recite to grandma how to
 reenter her user name and password just because the grandkids wiped it out
 of her incredimail.  YES!!!



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:33 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off

 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even

 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those

 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 --
 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however
 improbable, must be the truth.
 --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle


 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread George Rogato
I almost feel the same way too.
But a funny thing is, some of our customers like our email. It never has 
virus, and we have a spam filter provider that sends a daily quarantine 
report and those emails never make it to my server.
So for the most part, everything is great till we get blacklisted.
And a nice thing is, it's free advertising that you just can't buy.

When I see some of the emails people send to their groups cc'd and not 
bcc'd, and I see my domain in the bulk of those emails, I know other 
people do too that don't use my service.
When they get tired of poor support from their isp, like charter or 
qwest, they already know we are serving their friends and find their way 
to us.

We get a lot of word of mouth advertising that way.

RickG wrote:
 I have thought about this many times as well. I couldnt make a clean
 break so I practically keep it a secret that we offer it. They only
 get our email if they ask. Now, if we can drop the electrical
 storms!!!
 -RickG
 
 On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 6:58 PM, Robert Westrobert.w...@just-micro.com 
 wrote:
 Email?  We don't need no stinkin' email!

 We gave up email hosting.  We were sending invoices via email and lots of
 the customers were never getting them because they never used the email
 address we gave them, they were mostly using Yahoo online!  The user
 accounts were jammed packed of just junk mail and such because they never
 grabbed mail from their box.  Well!  After some thought, we stopped giving
 out email addresses and giving them a list of free email sites such as Gmail
 and yahoo.  (In an effort to keep our prices as friendly as we can.
 blah, blah, blah.)  We grandfathered the existing users and hosted them
 but eventually they all moved to the free providers also.  So now what?  No
 more support calls on the email, I can tell ya that!  More than half of our
 trouble tickets went away.  I no longer have to recite to grandma how to
 reenter her user name and password just because the grandkids wiped it out
 of her incredimail.  YES!!!



 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:33 AM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang off

 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not even

 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all those

 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

 
 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
  
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives

Re: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff

2009-06-26 Thread George Rogato
Wonder how much it is.
Says it's based on qty of email addresses.



RickG wrote:
 Cost?
 
 On Fri, Jun 26, 2009 at 2:07 PM, Pat O'Connorp...@inlandnet.com wrote:
 We're switching to this over this weekend.

 http://www.redcondor.com/products/appliances.htm





 rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote:
 One of the things I've done in the spam war is to use something called ASSP,
 which is just Anti Spam SMTP Proxy.

 It does a passable job of prevening inbound spam, and it prevents anyone not
 on my network from sending mail out through my server, via firewall rules
 put on the server.

 You can use a similar setup to have your customer's emails filtered outbound
 through something like this.It can also be placed on alternate ports and
 using firewall rules, prevent any cust omer from sending mail directly out.

 I haven't needed to do that, at least not yet.

 ASSP, when run on the mail server machine itself, can also act as an
 authentication and filtering of outbound emails.




 
 insert witty tagline here

 - Original Message -
 From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 8:33 AM
 Subject: [WISPA] OT, pesky email stuff



 Hi All,

 What are you guys doing for email these days?  I LOVE my setup for it's
 reliability, ease of use etc.

 Hacked customer accounts and virus's are killing me though.  We don't
 catch
 things until 100,000s of messages go out and we get black listed.  This
 has
 now happened 3 or 4 times in the last couple of years.

 My server admins aren't coming up with a solution to this other than to
 limit cc's to 25 per message.  We did that once before and my phone rang
 off
 the hook because people can't send jokes to their friends.

 The other thing that makes it hard is that the log files that I get (up to
 40 megs per day!) don't list the authenticated sender, only the reply
 address.  So I see tens of thousands of messages from a user that's not
 even
 mine (faked info).  sigh

 We use Courier MTA.

 My thought is to set the server to allow a max of 1000 messages per day
 per
 user.  And to somehow make the log file ONLY send me the number of
 messages
 received per a user, and the number sent, user name and ip addy of all
 those
 sending.  Twice now I've asked about that idea and gotten no response from
 the server admins.

 Suggestions?

 laters,
 marlon



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

 
 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
  
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
 
 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/