Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] [WIRELESS-LAN] To provide (wireless) service, or not to provide (wireless) service...
Matthew, I didn’t mean that 802.11ac is not better than 802.11n in many aspects, but more that many of us could live many more years with 802.11n and be quite fine especially if cost is an issue. Thanks, Philippe Philippe Hanset www.anyroam.net On May 13, 2015, at 10:38 AM, Williams, Matthew mwill...@kent.edu wrote: Philippe, I see value in 802.11ac running on 40MHz channels. It still plays nice with N and the performance, though negligible, is still better. The biggest complaint that I have about AC is that management hears the sales pitch about how awesome it is at 80MHz and how it will solve all of our problems and they decree that it will be so. In reality it will only make things worse for us. We still run APs down the hall at full power (predecessor’s decision on the power) and we have an Airport less than 5 miles away. We completed that phase of the upgrade in December… we’ve been trying to fix problems ever since. Just my 2 cents. Respectfully, Matthew Williams IT Manager, Wireless Kent State University Office: (330) 672-7246 Mobile: (330) 469-0445 From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU]On Behalf Of Philippe Hanset Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2015 10:21 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] AW: [WIRELESS-LAN] To provide (wireless) service, or not to provide (wireless) service... So the Cellular industry is having seminars and investing big on Wi-Fi offload and some schools are considering LTE offload, what an irony. At the end of the day the cost of providing 1 byte over LTE is much higher than the cost 1 byte over Wi-Fi. (DAS, Microcell, MacroTower, all more expensive than Wi-Fi…and much more complicated as far as contracting is concerned) Before doing anything I would first analyze the average monthly bandwidth need of a student and then do a comparison between Wi-Fi cost over 5-8 years VS LTE cost (with comparable quality of service). And BTW, why do we all need to upgrade to 802.11ac? (802.11n seems perfectly fine to me) Because premature EOL is coming upon us? On another note, having a low capacity/expensive Data Wireless in residence halls might have interesting side effects: -Students will watch their shows in class rather at night -Students will start reading books again in their rooms -Students will hang around campus late at night just to have Wi-Fi access (do you plan to shutdown campus Wi-Fi after hours ? ;-) -Students will meet in hallways and talk to each other rather using Social Media -No need to filter peer-to-peer in residence halls, no one can afford to download anything But here my main concern…how will you enable eduroam on Cellular? ;-) Philippe Philippe Hanset www.eduroam.us http://www.eduroam.us/ On May 13, 2015, at 9:24 AM, Brian Helman bhel...@salemstate.edu mailto:bhel...@salemstate.edu wrote: I have a little more information to provide now. I absolutely appreciate that it will be extremely tempting to respond with biased opinions. I don’t think there is anything that can be said that I haven’t already expressed to my team. However, that will not help me write up my recommendation. So that being said, feel free to chime in with tangible reasons to do this or not… Apparently, our president heard that some schools are investigating purchasing bulk data contracts with mobile (“cellular”) carriers for data. The idea is, we would stop providing 802.11g/n/ac wireless in the residence halls and instead provide students with the abilities to register their devices with the mobile carrier to use 4G/LTE data. The University will pay for this. Pros: No wireless (802.11) to purchase, support Reduced POE requirements on switches No wireless driver/configuration mismatches problems to support Cons: Is mobile wireless signal available everywhere inside the buildings? Costs to improve signal. What speeds are available (what range of speeds)? Is it by user or aggregate? How is congestion handled? What devices – mobile phones only? Hotspots to provide access to non-cellular devices (e.g wifi-only tablets; laptops) More Ethernet ports needed for devices that previously depended on wireless What provider(s)? Support shifted from “device to institutional wifi” to “device to myfi” or “devide to 3rd party” Cost per user, per GB? What else? If you know of any institutions who have attempted this (I have heard MIT is looking at it, but we aren’t MIT), please let me know. By the way, the background here is .. we installed our 802.11n network ~5 years ago and haven’t had any commitment to fund it since. So now we are trying to deal with capacity (BYOD) issues that didn’t exist 5 years ago
RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] [WIRELESS-LAN] To provide (wireless) service, or not to provide (wireless) service...
Absolutely, agree. I think the push to AC is mostly a managerial/competitive advantage push. We get to deal with the ramifications. Respectfully, Matthew Williams IT Manager, Wireless Kent State University Office: (330) 672-7246 Mobile: (330) 469-0445 From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Philippe Hanset Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2015 10:46 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] [WIRELESS-LAN] To provide (wireless) service, or not to provide (wireless) service... Matthew, I didn’t mean that 802.11ac is not better than 802.11n in many aspects, but more that many of us could live many more years with 802.11n and be quite fine especially if cost is an issue. Thanks, Philippe Philippe Hanset www.anyroam.nethttp://www.anyroam.net On May 13, 2015, at 10:38 AM, Williams, Matthew mwill...@kent.edumailto:mwill...@kent.edu wrote: Philippe, I see value in 802.11ac running on 40MHz channels. It still plays nice with N and the performance, though negligible, is still better. The biggest complaint that I have about AC is that management hears the sales pitch about how awesome it is at 80MHz and how it will solve all of our problems and they decree that it will be so. In reality it will only make things worse for us. We still run APs down the hall at full power (predecessor’s decision on the power) and we have an Airport less than 5 miles away. We completed that phase of the upgrade in December… we’ve been trying to fix problems ever since. Just my 2 cents. Respectfully, Matthew Williams IT Manager, Wireless Kent State University Office: (330) 672-7246 Mobile: (330) 469-0445 From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU]On Behalf Of Philippe Hanset Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2015 10:21 AM To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDUmailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] AW: [WIRELESS-LAN] To provide (wireless) service, or not to provide (wireless) service... So the Cellular industry is having seminars and investing big on Wi-Fi offload and some schools are considering LTE offload, what an irony. At the end of the day the cost of providing 1 byte over LTE is much higher than the cost 1 byte over Wi-Fi. (DAS, Microcell, MacroTower, all more expensive than Wi-Fi…and much more complicated as far as contracting is concerned) Before doing anything I would first analyze the average monthly bandwidth need of a student and then do a comparison between Wi-Fi cost over 5-8 years VS LTE cost (with comparable quality of service). And BTW, why do we all need to upgrade to 802.11ac? (802.11n seems perfectly fine to me) Because premature EOL is coming upon us? On another note, having a low capacity/expensive Data Wireless in residence halls might have interesting side effects: -Students will watch their shows in class rather at night -Students will start reading books again in their rooms -Students will hang around campus late at night just to have Wi-Fi access (do you plan to shutdown campus Wi-Fi after hours ? ;-) -Students will meet in hallways and talk to each other rather using Social Media -No need to filter peer-to-peer in residence halls, no one can afford to download anything But here my main concern…how will you enable eduroam on Cellular? ;-) Philippe Philippe Hanset www.eduroam.ushttp://www.eduroam.us/ On May 13, 2015, at 9:24 AM, Brian Helman bhel...@salemstate.edumailto:bhel...@salemstate.edu wrote: I have a little more information to provide now. I absolutely appreciate that it will be extremely tempting to respond with biased opinions. I don’t think there is anything that can be said that I haven’t already expressed to my team. However, that will not help me write up my recommendation. So that being said, feel free to chime in with tangible reasons to do this or not… Apparently, our president heard that some schools are investigating purchasing bulk data contracts with mobile (“cellular”) carriers for data. The idea is, we would stop providing 802.11g/n/ac wireless in the residence halls and instead provide students with the abilities to register their devices with the mobile carrier to use 4G/LTE data. The University will pay for this. Pros: No wireless (802.11) to purchase, support Reduced POE requirements on switches No wireless driver/configuration mismatches problems to support Cons: Is mobile wireless signal available everywhere inside the buildings? Costs to improve signal. What speeds are available (what range of speeds)? Is it by user or aggregate? How is congestion handled? What devices – mobile phones only? Hotspots to provide access to non-cellular devices (e.g wifi-only tablets; laptops) More Ethernet ports needed for devices that previously depended on wireless What provider(s)? Support shifted from “device to institutional wifi
Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] [WIRELESS-LAN] To provide (wireless) service, or not to provide (wireless) service...
We are MIT, and we’re not looking into this. :) -Chris == Chris Murphy Technology Consultant MIT Information Services Technology Room W92-191 77 Massachusetts Avenue Cambridge, MA 02139 ch...@mit.edu 617-253-4105 On May 13, 2015, at 9:24 AM, Brian Helman bhel...@salemstate.edu wrote: If you know of any institutions who have attempted this (I have heard MIT is looking at it, but we aren’t MIT), please let me know. ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
