Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

2006-12-01 Thread Blair Davis
We are common carriers.  We no more have to copy peoples e-mail than the 
phone company has to record the contents of every call.


Tim Kerns wrote:

I caught a brief report on FoxNews today about a requirement for 
keeping copies of E-mail. It seems that we may be required to maintain 
a copy for use at later time for criminal courts. Anyone know of this 
or have more info on it? Is it every ISP or only Corporations. This 
could be disasterious. sell alot of storage devices... The Foxnews 
report says the requirement begins today and as usual not a lot of 
detail.


Tim Kerns
CV-Access, Inc.




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Blair Davis

AOL IM Screen Name --  Theory240

West Michigan Wireless ISP
269-686-8648

A division of:
Camp Communication Services, INC

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Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

2006-12-01 Thread Tim Kerns
As a common carrier I can understand and agree. What about providing E-mail 
services to our customers, do we then need to keep copies of all e-mail that 
comes into or goes out our server?


Tim Kerns

- Original Message - 
From: Blair Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 11:45 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?


We are common carriers.  We no more have to copy peoples e-mail than the 
phone company has to record the contents of every call.


Tim Kerns wrote:

I caught a brief report on FoxNews today about a requirement for keeping 
copies of E-mail. It seems that we may be required to maintain a copy for 
use at later time for criminal courts. Anyone know of this or have more 
info on it? Is it every ISP or only Corporations. This could be 
disasterious. sell alot of storage devices... The Foxnews report says 
the requirement begins today and as usual not a lot of detail.


Tim Kerns
CV-Access, Inc.




--
Blair Davis

AOL IM Screen Name --  Theory240

West Michigan Wireless ISP
269-686-8648

A division of:
Camp Communication Services, INC

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Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

2006-12-01 Thread Matt Liotta
I find it interesting that people are stating their organizations are 
common carriers. The term common carrier has a very specific legal 
meaning. Specifically, a common carrier is an entity licensed by the FCC 
or a state agency to supply local and/or long distance 
telecommunications services to the general public at established and 
stated rates.


How many WISPs fit the above definition?

-Matt

Tim Kerns wrote:
As a common carrier I can understand and agree. What about providing 
E-mail services to our customers, do we then need to keep copies of 
all e-mail that comes into or goes out our server?


Tim Kerns

- Original Message - From: Blair Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 11:45 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?


We are common carriers.  We no more have to copy peoples e-mail than 
the phone company has to record the contents of every call.


Tim Kerns wrote:

I caught a brief report on FoxNews today about a requirement for 
keeping copies of E-mail. It seems that we may be required to 
maintain a copy for use at later time for criminal courts. Anyone 
know of this or have more info on it? Is it every ISP or only 
Corporations. This could be disasterious. sell alot of storage 
devices... The Foxnews report says the requirement begins today and 
as usual not a lot of detail.


Tim Kerns
CV-Access, Inc.




--
Blair Davis

AOL IM Screen Name --  Theory240

West Michigan Wireless ISP
269-686-8648

A division of:
Camp Communication Services, INC

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Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

2006-12-01 Thread Mark Del Bianco
Tim-

It's an amendment to the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure and it governs what a 
company that's sued has to do to comply with discovery requests.  It doesn't 
single out WISPs or carriers.  Here's a good explanation: 
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/01/AR2006120100233.html

Mark C. Del Bianco 
Law Office of Mark Del Bianco 
3929 Washington St.  Kensington, MD 20895 
301-933-7216 

Communications Law for the Digital Age 
 
Tim Kerns [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As a common carrier I can understand and 
agree. What about providing E-mail 
services to our customers, do we then need to keep copies of all e-mail that 
comes into or goes out our server?

Tim Kerns

- Original Message - 
From: Blair Davis 
To: WISPA General List 
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 11:45 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?


 We are common carriers.  We no more have to copy peoples e-mail than the 
 phone company has to record the contents of every call.

 Tim Kerns wrote:

 I caught a brief report on FoxNews today about a requirement for keeping 
 copies of E-mail. It seems that we may be required to maintain a copy for 
 use at later time for criminal courts. Anyone know of this or have more 
 info on it? Is it every ISP or only Corporations. This could be 
 disasterious. sell alot of storage devices... The Foxnews report says 
 the requirement begins today and as usual not a lot of detail.

 Tim Kerns
 CV-Access, Inc.



 -- 
 Blair Davis

 AOL IM Screen Name --  Theory240

 West Michigan Wireless ISP
 269-686-8648

 A division of:
 Camp Communication Services, INC

 -- 
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

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Mark C. Del Bianco 
Law Office of Mark Del Bianco 
3929 Washington St. 
Kensington, MD 20895 
301-933-7216 

Communications Law for the Digital Age 
 
 
This e-mail and any attachments thereto, is intended only for use by the named 
addressee(s) and may contain legally privileged and/or confidential 
information. If you are not the intended recipient of this e-mail, you are 
hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this email, 
and any attachments thereto, is strictly prohibited. If you receive this email 
in error, please immediately notify me at (301) 933-7216 and permanently delete 
the original copy and any copy of any e-mail, and any printout thereof.
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RE: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

2006-12-01 Thread Patrick Leary
I'm going to look into this, but current law ALREADY requires ISPs to
retain records of e-mail traffic and Web searches for 90 days. This was
per an amendment to the 1986 Stored Communications Act.

Patrick Leary
AVP WISP Markets
Alvarion, Inc.
o: 650.314.2628
c: 760.580.0080
Vonage: 650.641.1243
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Tim Kerns
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 9:30 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

I caught a brief report on FoxNews today about a requirement for keeping

copies of E-mail. It seems that we may be required to maintain a copy
for 
use at later time for criminal courts. Anyone know of this or have more
info 
on it? Is it every ISP or only Corporations. This could be
disasterious. 
sell alot of storage devices... The Foxnews report says the requirement 
begins today and as usual not a lot of detail.

Tim Kerns
CV-Access, Inc.

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Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

2006-12-01 Thread Frank Muto
To dispel the FUD about this, the law is dealing with the 2006 Amendments to 
the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure addressing discovery of electronically 
stored information. Link to pdf http://tinyurl.com/htarf review. 

Secondly, if you are presented with a properly written subpoena, you do have 
rules to live by, e.g., Electronic Communications Privacy Act or 1986. 



Frank Muto
President/CEO
FSM Marketing Group, Inc




- Original Message - 
From: Tim Kerns [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 4:43 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?


 As a common carrier I can understand and agree. What about providing E-mail 
 services to our customers, do we then need to keep copies of all e-mail that 
 comes into or goes out our server?
 
 Tim Kerns
 
 - Original Message - 
 From: Blair Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 11:45 AM
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?
 
 
 We are common carriers.  We no more have to copy peoples e-mail than the 
 phone company has to record the contents of every call.

 Tim Kerns wrote:

 I caught a brief report on FoxNews today about a requirement for keeping 
 copies of E-mail. It seems that we may be required to maintain a copy for 
 use at later time for criminal courts. Anyone know of this or have more 
 info on it? Is it every ISP or only Corporations. This could be 
 disasterious. sell alot of storage devices... The Foxnews report says 
 the requirement begins today and as usual not a lot of detail.

 Tim Kerns
 CV-Access, Inc.



 -- 
 Blair Davis

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RE: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

2006-12-01 Thread Rick Smith
and you have to do NOTHING until you get a subpoena to do so.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Blair Davis
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 2:46 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

We are common carriers.  We no more have to copy peoples e-mail than the
phone company has to record the contents of every call.

Tim Kerns wrote:

 I caught a brief report on FoxNews today about a requirement for 
 keeping copies of E-mail. It seems that we may be required to maintain 
 a copy for use at later time for criminal courts. Anyone know of this 
 or have more info on it? Is it every ISP or only Corporations. This 
 could be disasterious. sell alot of storage devices... The Foxnews 
 report says the requirement begins today and as usual not a lot of 
 detail.

 Tim Kerns
 CV-Access, Inc.



--
Blair Davis

AOL IM Screen Name --  Theory240

West Michigan Wireless ISP
269-686-8648

A division of:
Camp Communication Services, INC

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Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

2006-12-01 Thread Blair Davis

I'll drop e-mail services before I'll do that.  I am not a cop.

Tim Kerns wrote:

As a common carrier I can understand and agree. What about providing 
E-mail services to our customers, do we then need to keep copies of 
all e-mail that comes into or goes out our server?


Tim Kerns

- Original Message - From: Blair Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 11:45 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?


We are common carriers.  We no more have to copy peoples e-mail than 
the phone company has to record the contents of every call.


Tim Kerns wrote:

I caught a brief report on FoxNews today about a requirement for 
keeping copies of E-mail. It seems that we may be required to 
maintain a copy for use at later time for criminal courts. Anyone 
know of this or have more info on it? Is it every ISP or only 
Corporations. This could be disasterious. sell alot of storage 
devices... The Foxnews report says the requirement begins today and 
as usual not a lot of detail.


Tim Kerns
CV-Access, Inc.




--
Blair Davis

AOL IM Screen Name --  Theory240

West Michigan Wireless ISP
269-686-8648

A division of:
Camp Communication Services, INC

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--
Blair Davis

AOL IM Screen Name --  Theory240

West Michigan Wireless ISP
269-686-8648

A division of:
Camp Communication Services, INC


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Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

2006-12-01 Thread Blair Davis
Common carrier refers to things other than Telecom.  Trucking companies, 
bus lines, rail transport, air lines to name some.


The common denominator seems to be providing transport for data, product 
or people that is for general, public hire at established rates.  I'm 
sure there is more to this definition, but this seems to be a good, 
working definition.


I'm not a lawyer.

A more interesting question is this:

 If you are a Telco, and you offer voice mail services to your 
customers, do you have the right or an obligation to archive their voice 
messages without their knowledge and consent, absent a court order to do so?


Matt Liotta wrote:

I find it interesting that people are stating their organizations are 
common carriers. The term common carrier has a very specific legal 
meaning. Specifically, a common carrier is an entity licensed by the 
FCC or a state agency to supply local and/or long distance 
telecommunications services to the general public at established and 
stated rates.


How many WISPs fit the above definition?

-Matt

Tim Kerns wrote:

As a common carrier I can understand and agree. What about providing 
E-mail services to our customers, do we then need to keep copies of 
all e-mail that comes into or goes out our server?


Tim Kerns

- Original Message - From: Blair Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 11:45 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?


We are common carriers.  We no more have to copy peoples e-mail than 
the phone company has to record the contents of every call.


Tim Kerns wrote:

I caught a brief report on FoxNews today about a requirement for 
keeping copies of E-mail. It seems that we may be required to 
maintain a copy for use at later time for criminal courts. Anyone 
know of this or have more info on it? Is it every ISP or only 
Corporations. This could be disasterious. sell alot of storage 
devices... The Foxnews report says the requirement begins today and 
as usual not a lot of detail.


Tim Kerns
CV-Access, Inc.




--
Blair Davis

AOL IM Screen Name --  Theory240

West Michigan Wireless ISP
269-686-8648

A division of:
Camp Communication Services, INC

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Blair Davis

AOL IM Screen Name --  Theory240

West Michigan Wireless ISP
269-686-8648

A division of:
Camp Communication Services, INC

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Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

2006-12-01 Thread Frank Muto
Here is a link which provides an overview of the ECPA from the DOJ and a 
handy reference to keep on hand.

http://www.usdoj.gov/criminal/cybercrime/ssmanual2002.htm#_IIID1_

We are going through some personal and business issues regarding such issues 
relating to electronic storage.



Frank Muto
President/CEO
FSM Marketing Group, Inc






- Original Message - 
From: Patrick Leary [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 2:53 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?



I'm going to look into this, but current law ALREADY requires ISPs to
retain records of e-mail traffic and Web searches for 90 days. This was
per an amendment to the 1986 Stored Communications Act.

Patrick Leary
AVP WISP Markets
Alvarion, Inc.
o: 650.314.2628
c: 760.580.0080
Vonage: 650.641.1243
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Tim Kerns
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 9:30 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

I caught a brief report on FoxNews today about a requirement for keeping

copies of E-mail. It seems that we may be required to maintain a copy
for
use at later time for criminal courts. Anyone know of this or have more
info
on it? Is it every ISP or only Corporations. This could be
disasterious.
sell alot of storage devices... The Foxnews report says the requirement
begins today and as usual not a lot of detail.

Tim Kerns
CV-Access, Inc.


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RE: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

2006-12-01 Thread Forbes Mercy
This is one of those times when we need to ride the coats of the big guys.  
They spent millions in lobbying and legal fees to make sure they didn't have to 
be regulated like a common carrier by defining the new term information 
service.  All of us are in that business and even though Cable, Power 
companies and to some extent even the Telco's did this so they could slap us 
small guys around the advantage is we are also unregulated thanks to them.  So 
if we can say anything it's that we don’t have to join the very messy regulated 
crowd.  

Did you see the court decision this week stating Cable could refuse service and 
the person sued them up to the Court of Appeals and lost with the court saying 
that cable is not a utility and thus not required to give service to anyone?  
Aren't you glad Cable paid to get that judgment rather then you having to go 
broke trying?   They may be crappy at service and high priced but they do love 
to spend money that gives us legal precedent for free.

Forbes Mercy
President -Washington Broadband, Inc.

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tim Kerns
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 1:43 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

As a common carrier I can understand and agree. What about providing E-mail 
services to our customers, do we then need to keep copies of all e-mail that 
comes into or goes out our server?

Tim Kerns

- Original Message - 
From: Blair Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 11:45 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?


 We are common carriers.  We no more have to copy peoples e-mail than the 
 phone company has to record the contents of every call.

 Tim Kerns wrote:

 I caught a brief report on FoxNews today about a requirement for keeping 
 copies of E-mail. It seems that we may be required to maintain a copy for 
 use at later time for criminal courts. Anyone know of this or have more 
 info on it? Is it every ISP or only Corporations. This could be 
 disasterious. sell alot of storage devices... The Foxnews report says 
 the requirement begins today and as usual not a lot of detail.

 Tim Kerns
 CV-Access, Inc.



 -- 
 Blair Davis

 AOL IM Screen Name --  Theory240

 West Michigan Wireless ISP
 269-686-8648

 A division of:
 Camp Communication Services, INC

 -- 
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

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Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?

2006-12-01 Thread Blake Bowers

I found that a little interesting also.  I don't really
think a WISP would WANT to be termed a common
carrier.

communications common carrier: 1. The term communications common carrier 
as used in this part [of 47CFR] means any person (individual, partnership, 
association, joint-stock company, trust, corporation, or other entity) 
engaged as a common carrier for hire, in interstate or foreign communication 
by wire or radio or in interstate or foreign radio transmission of energy, 
including such carriers as are described in subsection 2(b) (2) and (3) of 
the Communications Act of 1934, as amended, and, in addition, for purposes 
of subpart H of this part, includes any individual, partnership, 
association, joint-stock company, trust, corporation, or other entity which 
owns or controls, directly or indirectly, or is under direct or indirect 
common control with, any such carrier. [47CFR] 2. Any person engaged in 
rendering communication service for hire to the public. [47CFR] Synonym 
common carrier.



Internet providers have historicaly fought to NOT be
called a communications provider, but rather a
information services provider.

The FCC has held, that the ISP is not providing the
telecommunications network, but rather overlaying
their information on the common carrier network.


- Original Message - 
From: Matt Liotta [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 4:04 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] New Recording LAW in effect today?


I find it interesting that people are stating their organizations are 
common carriers. The term common carrier has a very specific legal meaning. 
Specifically, a common carrier is an entity licensed by the FCC or a state 
agency to supply local and/or long distance telecommunications services to 
the general public at established and stated rates.


How many WISPs fit the above definition?

-Matt

Tim Kerns wrote:

As a common carrier I can understand and agree. What about providing

We are common carriers.  We no more have to copy peoples e-mail than



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