Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-17 Thread rabbtux rabbtux

Butch,
how do you get the 10 min time factor to change the queue or BW limit?
Looked thru MT stuff  don't see anything that would help with this
automatic system.  Would a scheduled script be involved?  Any tips or
pointers would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Marshall
Rabbit Meadows Technology

On 12/14/06, Butch Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

On Thu, 14 Dec 2006, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote:

customer's location via speakeasy!  grin Maybe I'll see if Butch
can come up with something that will choke people back after 10
minutes of anything over say, 2 megs, then slow them down down down
till they stop using the net for an hour or two.  Wonder how hard
it would be to set up the MT boxes to do that?

Not too hard for TCP for sure...For other protocols, it can probably
be accomplished, but I've never tried that.

--
Butch Evans
Network Engineering and Security Consulting
573-276-2879
http://www.butchevans.com/
Mikrotik Certified Consultant
(http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html)
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Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-16 Thread Frank Muto

Marlon,
Mario may be talking about the use of the catchall user under the domain 
settings. The catchall user is a legacy feature that was available as a work 
around for directory sync issues. This may or may not be discontinued, but 
may be used in limited setups. The problem is that people are using the 
catchall user to filter complete domains instead of paying for actual user 
accounts to be spam filtered. Some people where also doing this with aliases 
and thus the limit on 5 aliases per primary user account. If anyone using 
Postini is doing this now, I suggest not doing so.


Postini does however have a new Directory Sync feature for the Service 
Provider Edition as well as filtering all unregistered users for viruses. 
They have also added a second virus scan using Authentium, When McAfee scans 
an email clean it then will be scanned once again by Authentium.



Frank Muto
FSM Marketing Group, Inc.
Postini Partner Reseller
http://wispa.spam-virus.com









- Original Message - 
From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 [EMAIL PROTECTED]




And how would I do that?

Last I knew, Postini wanted to get paid too.

grin


- Original Message - 
From: Mario Pommier [EMAIL PROTECTED]




Marlon,
   You can make all your mail traffic go through Postini without being 
charged more, and you can still charge the customer the $1 fee for usage.

   And, yeah, people do like.


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Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-16 Thread Mike Ireton


Marlon -

	We've recently installed the Barracuda spam firewall and it does  a 
very good job. Espically since there's no per-user liscensing fees, we 
don't have to concern ourselves with an additional $1 here or there. 
Heck, we could also just filter your entire domain thru it for you 
without much problem or expense and it's practically self 
administering They have a free trial by the way.




Postini does however have a new Directory Sync feature for the Service 
Provider Edition as well as filtering all unregistered users for 
viruses. They have also added a second virus scan using Authentium, When 
McAfee scans an email clean it then will be scanned once again by 
Authentium.





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Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-15 Thread Butch Evans

On Thu, 14 Dec 2006, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote:

customer's location via speakeasy!  grin Maybe I'll see if Butch 
can come up with something that will choke people back after 10 
minutes of anything over say, 2 megs, then slow them down down down 
till they stop using the net for an hour or two.  Wonder how hard 
it would be to set up the MT boxes to do that?


Not too hard for TCP for sure...For other protocols, it can probably 
be accomplished, but I've never tried that.


--
Butch Evans
Network Engineering and Security Consulting
573-276-2879
http://www.butchevans.com/
Mikrotik Certified Consultant
(http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html)
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Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-15 Thread Mario Pommier

Marlon,
   You can make all your mail traffic go through Postini without being 
charged more, and you can still charge the customer the $1 fee for usage.

   And, yeah, people do like.

Mario

Marlon K. Schafer wrote:

We don't put everyone on Postini.  We charge those that want the 
filtering $1 per month.  Like John and Forbes, it's cost is too high 
to just include automatically.  Instead, we make money on spam.  I'd 
say around half of our customers and almost all hosted domains take 
Postini.


We're actually using the usage stats to help us sell Postini.  No one 
wants to pay an overage fee just to receive all that dang spam :-).


laters,
marlon

- Original Message - From: Frank Muto [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 4:34 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help


If you have not done it already, putting everyone on your Postini 
system will decrease your mail server bandwidth substantially.




Frank Muto
FSM Marketing Group, Inc.
Postini Partner Reseller
http://wispa.spam-virus.com







- Original Message - From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


I want to keep billing per bit.  It's, by far, the most effective 
way to compete against cable and dsl.  It's also a good way to push 
the hogs over to competing services.  Our average user is running at 
about 1.7 gigs per month.  This includes all of my servers and the 
mail server alone hit 50 gigs last month.  So I'll bet that the 
average user is actually under 1.5 gigs per month.



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Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-15 Thread John Scrivner

Can you explain this in more detail? I am not quite following you on this.
Thanks,
Scriv


Mario Pommier wrote:


Marlon,
   You can make all your mail traffic go through Postini without being 
charged more, and you can still charge the customer the $1 fee for usage.

   And, yeah, people do like.

Mario

Marlon K. Schafer wrote:

We don't put everyone on Postini.  We charge those that want the 
filtering $1 per month.  Like John and Forbes, it's cost is too high 
to just include automatically.  Instead, we make money on spam.  I'd 
say around half of our customers and almost all hosted domains take 
Postini.


We're actually using the usage stats to help us sell Postini.  No one 
wants to pay an overage fee just to receive all that dang spam :-).


laters,
marlon

- Original Message - From: Frank Muto [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 4:34 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help


If you have not done it already, putting everyone on your Postini 
system will decrease your mail server bandwidth substantially.




Frank Muto
FSM Marketing Group, Inc.
Postini Partner Reseller
http://wispa.spam-virus.com







- Original Message - From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 
982-2181 [EMAIL PROTECTED]


I want to keep billing per bit.  It's, by far, the most effective 
way to compete against cable and dsl.  It's also a good way to push 
the hogs over to competing services.  Our average user is running 
at about 1.7 gigs per month.  This includes all of my servers and 
the mail server alone hit 50 gigs last month.  So I'll bet that the 
average user is actually under 1.5 gigs per month.




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Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-15 Thread Frank Muto
Postini has what is called, non-account bouncing and it will allow those 
accounts not in the Postini data base to be passed through. Another benefit 
is that Postini will filter all non-accounts for viruses using two filtering 
engines, McAfee and Authentium. If McAfee finds an email clean, it will be 
also be scanned by Authentium.
With non-account bouncing, you can also see those email accounts via 
reporting and see how much data they pass on to your system.



Frank Muto
President
FSM Marketing Group, Inc.
Postini Partner Reseller
http://wispa.spam-virus.com





- Original Message - 
From: John Scrivner [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Can you explain this in more detail? I am not quite following you on this.
Thanks,
Scriv


Mario Pommier wrote:


Marlon,
   You can make all your mail traffic go through Postini without being 
charged more, and you can still charge the customer the $1 fee for usage.

   And, yeah, people do like.

Mario

Marlon K. Schafer wrote:

We don't put everyone on Postini.  We charge those that want the 
filtering $1 per month.  Like John and Forbes, it's cost is too high to 
just include automatically.  Instead, we make money on spam.  I'd say 
around half of our customers and almost all hosted domains take Postini.


We're actually using the usage stats to help us sell Postini.  No one 
wants to pay an overage fee just to receive all that dang spam :-).


laters,
marlon

- Original Message - From: Frank Muto [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 4:34 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help


If you have not done it already, putting everyone on your Postini 
system will decrease your mail server bandwidth substantially.


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Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-15 Thread rabbtux rabbtux

How would one go about implementing Marlon's idea in MT?  Just started
using it and any tips are appreciated.  - Marshall

On 12/14/06, Butch Evans [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

On Thu, 14 Dec 2006, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote:

customer's location via speakeasy!  grin Maybe I'll see if Butch
can come up with something that will choke people back after 10
minutes of anything over say, 2 megs, then slow them down down down
till they stop using the net for an hour or two.  Wonder how hard
it would be to set up the MT boxes to do that?

Not too hard for TCP for sure...For other protocols, it can probably
be accomplished, but I've never tried that.

--
Butch Evans
Network Engineering and Security Consulting
573-276-2879
http://www.butchevans.com/
Mikrotik Certified Consultant
(http://www.mikrotik.com/consultants.html)
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Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-15 Thread Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181

And how would I do that?

Last I knew, Postini wanted to get paid too.

grin

Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - 
From: Mario Pommier [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 7:48 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help



Marlon,
   You can make all your mail traffic go through Postini without being 
charged more, and you can still charge the customer the $1 fee for usage.

   And, yeah, people do like.

Mario

Marlon K. Schafer wrote:

We don't put everyone on Postini.  We charge those that want the 
filtering $1 per month.  Like John and Forbes, it's cost is too high 
to just include automatically.  Instead, we make money on spam.  I'd 
say around half of our customers and almost all hosted domains take 
Postini.


We're actually using the usage stats to help us sell Postini.  No one 
wants to pay an overage fee just to receive all that dang spam :-).


laters,
marlon

- Original Message - From: Frank Muto [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 4:34 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help


If you have not done it already, putting everyone on your Postini 
system will decrease your mail server bandwidth substantially.




Frank Muto
FSM Marketing Group, Inc.
Postini Partner Reseller
http://wispa.spam-virus.com







- Original Message - From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


I want to keep billing per bit.  It's, by far, the most effective 
way to compete against cable and dsl.  It's also a good way to push 
the hogs over to competing services.  Our average user is running at 
about 1.7 gigs per month.  This includes all of my servers and the 
mail server alone hit 50 gigs last month.  So I'll bet that the 
average user is actually under 1.5 gigs per month.



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RE: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-14 Thread Larry A Weidig
Marlon:
The first part is pretty easy, we will just assume a 30 month
day:

Bytes = 1,000,000 bps * 60 seconds/min * 60 min/hour * 24 hours/day * 30
days / 8 bits/byte
  = 324,000,000,000

The next part to covert to gigabytes is where people will have disputes.
I use  1GB = 1,073,741,824 bytes, but you can see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigabyte for the entire discussion.
Therefore in a month of continuous transfer they would move about 301.7
GB! 
We also charge residential customers for transfer and have the
limit set at 4GB which is more than enough for 95%+ of our customers.
The other 5% simply get slowed down to dialup rates when they cross the
limit by our bandwidth monitor.  If they want to pump the speed back up
they need to pay for additional transfer which we sell in 4GB blocks at
about the same as the monthly cost for the service.  This definitely
cuts down on the abusers of the system which are of course the hardest
on the network.
For business customers we just price service accordingly and do
not place transfer limits on these accounts.  That is just my 2 cents
worth, hope it helps.

Larry 


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 11:21 AM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Cc: isp-wireless@isp-wireless.com
Subject: [WISPA] Overage plan help

Hi All,

As most of you know, we bill for bits not speed.  All of our customers
go as 
fast as we can make them go.  They do have to be responsible users
though.

To this end we had a 1 gig per month transfer limit.  When I say gig, I
mean 
it in the sense of what 1mbps service would be.  So I guess that's byte
not 
bit.  Though I must admit, I get mixed up on the translation from bits
per 
second to bits transferred.

Anyhow, using the data we got from that great new usage tracking
software 
that Brandon wrote for us, it's clear that 1 gig won't cut it.  (The 
original 1 gig is the result of figuring out that our average dial-up
user 
in 1999 used 110 meg per month.)  Today, I've raised the included
service 
level to 4 gigs.

The 5th gig is an extra $5.  The next one is $10, then $20, then $40
etc. 
etc. etc.  By the time you hit 25 gigs of data transfer, you're into me
for 
over $5,000,000.  Naturally, no one will pay that and they aren't really

expected to.

However, our billing rate is designed for folks that are spending $35 to
$40 
per month and doing less than 4 gigs per month.  If someone is using a
lot 
of data there are two main issues that I have to recover costs for.  One
is 
that I pay for internet access based on usage.  So the more the
customers 
use the more I have to pay, and it's up by 15% last month!  Next, there
is 
only so much capacity on each tower, if we have heavy users in a
particular 
zone we have to add capacity for them.

In the end, what I'm trying to do is either bill or run off the 5% of
the 
customer base that are costing us money instead of generating a profit. 
Customers like this one 
http://radius.odessaoffice.com/iptrack/search.php?ip=64.146.146.112mont
h=12year=2006period=month 
they do more than 4 gigs almost every day.

I'm looking for two things.  One is, if someone had a constant 1 mbps of

data transfer rate, how many gigs would they use per month.  (we pay for

internet based on the mbps rates we consume)

Next, what's a more reasonable overage table?  Our minimum bill for
anything 
at all here is $5.00 just to cover the costs of writing the bill.

I want to keep billing per bit.  It's, by far, the most effective way to

compete against cable and dsl.  It's also a good way to push the hogs
over 
to competing services.  Our average user is running at about 1.7 gigs
per 
month.  This includes all of my servers and the mail server alone hit 50

gigs last month.  So I'll bet that the average user is actually under
1.5 
gigs per month.

Thoughts and ideas
Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



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Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-14 Thread Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181

That helps.

Thanks!

As an fyi here's what I pay for my bw.

In Odessa I have a 10 meg fiber link.  I pay for internet at $200 per month 
based on our average usage.  In and out are combined.


In Ephrata, where we have the servers etc. I have a 100 meg fiber link.  I 
pay for internet at $250 at the 95%.  This is the one that's killing me. 
When we moved to this new upstream provider our connectivity improved 
noticeably.  Our costs have also now gone up because things work so much 
better than they did.


I really don't want to rate limit people.  But I've got to figure out a way 
to keep that 95th% thing down better but still be able to pull 30 megs at a 
fiber customer's location via speakeasy!  grin  Maybe I'll see if Butch can 
come up with something that will choke people back after 10 minutes of 
anything over say, 2 megs, then slow them down down down till they stop 
using the net for an hour or two.  Wonder how hard it would be to set up the 
MT boxes to do that?


laters,
Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - 
From: Larry A Weidig [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 10:05 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Overage plan help


Marlon:
The first part is pretty easy, we will just assume a 30 month
day:

Bytes = 1,000,000 bps * 60 seconds/min * 60 min/hour * 24 hours/day * 30
days / 8 bits/byte
 = 324,000,000,000

The next part to covert to gigabytes is where people will have disputes.
I use  1GB = 1,073,741,824 bytes, but you can see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigabyte for the entire discussion.
Therefore in a month of continuous transfer they would move about 301.7
GB!
We also charge residential customers for transfer and have the
limit set at 4GB which is more than enough for 95%+ of our customers.
The other 5% simply get slowed down to dialup rates when they cross the
limit by our bandwidth monitor.  If they want to pump the speed back up
they need to pay for additional transfer which we sell in 4GB blocks at
about the same as the monthly cost for the service.  This definitely
cuts down on the abusers of the system which are of course the hardest
on the network.
For business customers we just price service accordingly and do
not place transfer limits on these accounts.  That is just my 2 cents
worth, hope it helps.

Larry


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 11:21 AM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Cc: isp-wireless@isp-wireless.com
Subject: [WISPA] Overage plan help

Hi All,

As most of you know, we bill for bits not speed.  All of our customers
go as
fast as we can make them go.  They do have to be responsible users
though.

To this end we had a 1 gig per month transfer limit.  When I say gig, I
mean
it in the sense of what 1mbps service would be.  So I guess that's byte
not
bit.  Though I must admit, I get mixed up on the translation from bits
per
second to bits transferred.

Anyhow, using the data we got from that great new usage tracking
software
that Brandon wrote for us, it's clear that 1 gig won't cut it.  (The
original 1 gig is the result of figuring out that our average dial-up
user
in 1999 used 110 meg per month.)  Today, I've raised the included
service
level to 4 gigs.

The 5th gig is an extra $5.  The next one is $10, then $20, then $40
etc.
etc. etc.  By the time you hit 25 gigs of data transfer, you're into me
for
over $5,000,000.  Naturally, no one will pay that and they aren't really

expected to.

However, our billing rate is designed for folks that are spending $35 to
$40
per month and doing less than 4 gigs per month.  If someone is using a
lot
of data there are two main issues that I have to recover costs for.  One
is
that I pay for internet access based on usage.  So the more the
customers
use the more I have to pay, and it's up by 15% last month!  Next, there
is
only so much capacity on each tower, if we have heavy users in a
particular
zone we have to add capacity for them.

In the end, what I'm trying to do is either bill or run off the 5% of
the
customer base that are costing us money instead of generating a profit.
Customers like this one
http://radius.odessaoffice.com/iptrack/search.php?ip=64.146.146.112mont
h=12year=2006period=month
they do more than 4 gigs almost every day.

I'm looking for two things.  One is, if someone had a constant 1 mbps of

data transfer rate, how many gigs would they use per month.  (we pay for

internet based on the mbps rates we consume)

Next, what's a more reasonable overage table?  Our minimum bill for
anything
at all here is $5.00 just to cover the costs of writing the bill.

I want

RE: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-14 Thread Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless
You can setup limits based on a block of Ips, you can say, 2 meg for say 30
min, then drop them down to another speed, such as 128k.   This is very
effective; however, the hard part is that this is an overall rate for a
specific IP.  So if you have a business with 20 users behind their router,
it's an average over all the users.  One user can slow the rest of the
network down.  Not to mention that slows down web access.

As far as running multiple, I DON'T think you can do that.  Multiple, being,
after so long turn them down to this, then after so long turn them down to
this, unless that was a script looking at overall bits transferred.  

The simplest thing to do is to start charging that customer that is pulling
30+ gigs a month, and charge him for that. Either that customer will pay or
get off of your internet service and got your completion.

I remember a Dialup ISP doing something like that in the past, they looked
at there base and found 4%, and it was a specifc 4% of their users caused
90% of all of the helpdesk calls. 

They said, you can have this cheaper rate, but if you have to call in, we
will charge you per min (people PC like) or you can discontinue service with
us. 

Even after about 1/2 of them customers they sent this letter to left, they
ended up letting 3 techs go, and were actually saving more than double the
cost that those dial up customers income brought in.

Same difference.

Dennis


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 12:42 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

That helps.

Thanks!

As an fyi here's what I pay for my bw.

In Odessa I have a 10 meg fiber link.  I pay for internet at $200 per month 
based on our average usage.  In and out are combined.

In Ephrata, where we have the servers etc. I have a 100 meg fiber link.  I 
pay for internet at $250 at the 95%.  This is the one that's killing me. 
When we moved to this new upstream provider our connectivity improved 
noticeably.  Our costs have also now gone up because things work so much 
better than they did.

I really don't want to rate limit people.  But I've got to figure out a way 
to keep that 95th% thing down better but still be able to pull 30 megs at a 
fiber customer's location via speakeasy!  grin  Maybe I'll see if Butch can 
come up with something that will choke people back after 10 minutes of 
anything over say, 2 megs, then slow them down down down till they stop 
using the net for an hour or two.  Wonder how hard it would be to set up the

MT boxes to do that?

laters,
Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - 
From: Larry A Weidig [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 10:05 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Overage plan help


Marlon:
The first part is pretty easy, we will just assume a 30 month
day:

Bytes = 1,000,000 bps * 60 seconds/min * 60 min/hour * 24 hours/day * 30
days / 8 bits/byte
  = 324,000,000,000

The next part to covert to gigabytes is where people will have disputes.
I use  1GB = 1,073,741,824 bytes, but you can see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigabyte for the entire discussion.
Therefore in a month of continuous transfer they would move about 301.7
GB!
We also charge residential customers for transfer and have the
limit set at 4GB which is more than enough for 95%+ of our customers.
The other 5% simply get slowed down to dialup rates when they cross the
limit by our bandwidth monitor.  If they want to pump the speed back up
they need to pay for additional transfer which we sell in 4GB blocks at
about the same as the monthly cost for the service.  This definitely
cuts down on the abusers of the system which are of course the hardest
on the network.
For business customers we just price service accordingly and do
not place transfer limits on these accounts.  That is just my 2 cents
worth, hope it helps.

Larry


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 11:21 AM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Cc: isp-wireless@isp-wireless.com
Subject: [WISPA] Overage plan help

Hi All,

As most of you know, we bill for bits not speed.  All of our customers
go as
fast as we can make them go.  They do have to be responsible users
though.

To this end we had a 1 gig per month transfer limit.  When I say gig, I
mean
it in the sense of what 1mbps service would be.  So I guess that's byte
not
bit.  Though I must admit, I get mixed up on the translation from bits
per
second to bits transferred.

Anyhow, using the data we got from

Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-14 Thread Jason

Gang,

   What's everyone using to do rate limiting or bandwidth shaping.  
Bandwidth shaping is something I'm interested in.  Are there any linux 
packages that can do this well?


Jason

Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote:

That helps.

Thanks!

As an fyi here's what I pay for my bw.

In Odessa I have a 10 meg fiber link.  I pay for internet at $200 per 
month based on our average usage.  In and out are combined.


In Ephrata, where we have the servers etc. I have a 100 meg fiber 
link.  I pay for internet at $250 at the 95%.  This is the one that's 
killing me. When we moved to this new upstream provider our 
connectivity improved noticeably.  Our costs have also now gone up 
because things work so much better than they did.


I really don't want to rate limit people.  But I've got to figure out 
a way to keep that 95th% thing down better but still be able to pull 
30 megs at a fiber customer's location via speakeasy!  grin  Maybe 
I'll see if Butch can come up with something that will choke people 
back after 10 minutes of anything over say, 2 megs, then slow them 
down down down till they stop using the net for an hour or two.  
Wonder how hard it would be to set up the MT boxes to do that?


laters,
Marlon
(509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
(408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



- Original Message - From: Larry A Weidig [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 10:05 AM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Overage plan help


Marlon:
The first part is pretty easy, we will just assume a 30 month
day:

Bytes = 1,000,000 bps * 60 seconds/min * 60 min/hour * 24 hours/day * 30
days / 8 bits/byte
 = 324,000,000,000

The next part to covert to gigabytes is where people will have disputes.
I use  1GB = 1,073,741,824 bytes, but you can see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigabyte for the entire discussion.
Therefore in a month of continuous transfer they would move about 301.7
GB!
We also charge residential customers for transfer and have the
limit set at 4GB which is more than enough for 95%+ of our customers.
The other 5% simply get slowed down to dialup rates when they cross the
limit by our bandwidth monitor.  If they want to pump the speed back up
they need to pay for additional transfer which we sell in 4GB blocks at
about the same as the monthly cost for the service.  This definitely
cuts down on the abusers of the system which are of course the hardest
on the network.
For business customers we just price service accordingly and do
not place transfer limits on these accounts.  That is just my 2 cents
worth, hope it helps.

Larry


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 11:21 AM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Cc: isp-wireless@isp-wireless.com
Subject: [WISPA] Overage plan help

Hi All,

As most of you know, we bill for bits not speed.  All of our customers
go as
fast as we can make them go.  They do have to be responsible users
though.

To this end we had a 1 gig per month transfer limit.  When I say gig, I
mean
it in the sense of what 1mbps service would be.  So I guess that's byte
not
bit.  Though I must admit, I get mixed up on the translation from bits
per
second to bits transferred.

Anyhow, using the data we got from that great new usage tracking
software
that Brandon wrote for us, it's clear that 1 gig won't cut it.  (The
original 1 gig is the result of figuring out that our average dial-up
user
in 1999 used 110 meg per month.)  Today, I've raised the included
service
level to 4 gigs.

The 5th gig is an extra $5.  The next one is $10, then $20, then $40
etc.
etc. etc.  By the time you hit 25 gigs of data transfer, you're into me
for
over $5,000,000.  Naturally, no one will pay that and they aren't really

expected to.

However, our billing rate is designed for folks that are spending $35 to
$40
per month and doing less than 4 gigs per month.  If someone is using a
lot
of data there are two main issues that I have to recover costs for.  One
is
that I pay for internet access based on usage.  So the more the
customers
use the more I have to pay, and it's up by 15% last month!  Next, there
is
only so much capacity on each tower, if we have heavy users in a
particular
zone we have to add capacity for them.

In the end, what I'm trying to do is either bill or run off the 5% of
the
customer base that are costing us money instead of generating a profit.
Customers like this one
http://radius.odessaoffice.com/iptrack/search.php?ip=64.146.146.112mont
h=12year=2006period=month
they do more than 4 gigs almost every day.

I'm looking for two things.  One is, if someone had a constant 1 mbps of

data transfer rate, how many gigs would

RE: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-14 Thread Dennis Burgess - 2K Wireless
MT MT MT MT MT MT MT MT MT 

Oh and MT ...


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jason
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 5:51 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

Gang,

What's everyone using to do rate limiting or bandwidth shaping.  
Bandwidth shaping is something I'm interested in.  Are there any linux 
packages that can do this well?

Jason

Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote:
 That helps.

 Thanks!

 As an fyi here's what I pay for my bw.

 In Odessa I have a 10 meg fiber link.  I pay for internet at $200 per 
 month based on our average usage.  In and out are combined.

 In Ephrata, where we have the servers etc. I have a 100 meg fiber 
 link.  I pay for internet at $250 at the 95%.  This is the one that's 
 killing me. When we moved to this new upstream provider our 
 connectivity improved noticeably.  Our costs have also now gone up 
 because things work so much better than they did.

 I really don't want to rate limit people.  But I've got to figure out 
 a way to keep that 95th% thing down better but still be able to pull 
 30 megs at a fiber customer's location via speakeasy!  grin  Maybe 
 I'll see if Butch can come up with something that will choke people 
 back after 10 minutes of anything over say, 2 megs, then slow them 
 down down down till they stop using the net for an hour or two.  
 Wonder how hard it would be to set up the MT boxes to do that?

 laters,
 Marlon
 (509) 982-2181   Equipment sales
 (408) 907-6910 (Vonage)Consulting services
 42846865 (icq)And I run my own wisp!
 64.146.146.12 (net meeting)
 www.odessaoffice.com/wireless
 www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam



 - Original Message - From: Larry A Weidig [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 10:05 AM
 Subject: RE: [WISPA] Overage plan help


 Marlon:
 The first part is pretty easy, we will just assume a 30 month
 day:

 Bytes = 1,000,000 bps * 60 seconds/min * 60 min/hour * 24 hours/day * 30
 days / 8 bits/byte
  = 324,000,000,000

 The next part to covert to gigabytes is where people will have disputes.
 I use  1GB = 1,073,741,824 bytes, but you can see
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigabyte for the entire discussion.
 Therefore in a month of continuous transfer they would move about 301.7
 GB!
 We also charge residential customers for transfer and have the
 limit set at 4GB which is more than enough for 95%+ of our customers.
 The other 5% simply get slowed down to dialup rates when they cross the
 limit by our bandwidth monitor.  If they want to pump the speed back up
 they need to pay for additional transfer which we sell in 4GB blocks at
 about the same as the monthly cost for the service.  This definitely
 cuts down on the abusers of the system which are of course the hardest
 on the network.
 For business customers we just price service accordingly and do
 not place transfer limits on these accounts.  That is just my 2 cents
 worth, hope it helps.

 Larry


 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
 Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181
 Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 11:21 AM
 To: wireless@wispa.org
 Cc: isp-wireless@isp-wireless.com
 Subject: [WISPA] Overage plan help

 Hi All,

 As most of you know, we bill for bits not speed.  All of our customers
 go as
 fast as we can make them go.  They do have to be responsible users
 though.

 To this end we had a 1 gig per month transfer limit.  When I say gig, I
 mean
 it in the sense of what 1mbps service would be.  So I guess that's byte
 not
 bit.  Though I must admit, I get mixed up on the translation from bits
 per
 second to bits transferred.

 Anyhow, using the data we got from that great new usage tracking
 software
 that Brandon wrote for us, it's clear that 1 gig won't cut it.  (The
 original 1 gig is the result of figuring out that our average dial-up
 user
 in 1999 used 110 meg per month.)  Today, I've raised the included
 service
 level to 4 gigs.

 The 5th gig is an extra $5.  The next one is $10, then $20, then $40
 etc.
 etc. etc.  By the time you hit 25 gigs of data transfer, you're into me
 for
 over $5,000,000.  Naturally, no one will pay that and they aren't really

 expected to.

 However, our billing rate is designed for folks that are spending $35 to
 $40
 per month and doing less than 4 gigs per month.  If someone is using a
 lot
 of data there are two main issues that I have to recover costs for.  One
 is
 that I pay for internet access based on usage.  So the more the
 customers
 use the more I have to pay, and it's up by 15% last month!  Next, there
 is
 only so much capacity on each tower, if we have heavy users in a
 particular
 zone we have to add capacity for them.

 In the end, what I'm trying to do is either bill or run off the 5% of
 the
 customer

Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-14 Thread Frank Muto
If you have not done it already, putting everyone on your Postini system 
will decrease your mail server bandwidth substantially.




Frank Muto
FSM Marketing Group, Inc.
Postini Partner Reseller
http://wispa.spam-virus.com







- Original Message - 
From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 [EMAIL PROTECTED]


I want to keep billing per bit.  It's, by far, the most effective way to 
compete against cable and dsl.  It's also a good way to push the hogs over 
to competing services.  Our average user is running at about 1.7 gigs per 
month.  This includes all of my servers and the mail server alone hit 50 
gigs last month.  So I'll bet that the average user is actually under 1.5 
gigs per month.


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Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help

2006-12-14 Thread Marlon K. Schafer
We don't put everyone on Postini.  We charge those that want the filtering 
$1 per month.  Like John and Forbes, it's cost is too high to just include 
automatically.  Instead, we make money on spam.  I'd say around half of our 
customers and almost all hosted domains take Postini.


We're actually using the usage stats to help us sell Postini.  No one wants 
to pay an overage fee just to receive all that dang spam :-).


laters,
marlon

- Original Message - 
From: Frank Muto [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2006 4:34 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Overage plan help


If you have not done it already, putting everyone on your Postini system 
will decrease your mail server bandwidth substantially.




Frank Muto
FSM Marketing Group, Inc.
Postini Partner Reseller
http://wispa.spam-virus.com







- Original Message - 
From: Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 [EMAIL PROTECTED]


I want to keep billing per bit.  It's, by far, the most effective way to 
compete against cable and dsl.  It's also a good way to push the hogs 
over to competing services.  Our average user is running at about 1.7 
gigs per month.  This includes all of my servers and the mail server 
alone hit 50 gigs last month.  So I'll bet that the average user is 
actually under 1.5 gigs per month.


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WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 


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