Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-06 Thread Tom DeReggi
Trango is not clear on the algorythm's exact details they use to calculate 
MSE.  (I personally believe that is intentional, as it is sorta like a 
proprietary trade secret, but nobody has said that).
What we do know is MSE is the method to evaluated link quality and noise via 
a single parameter value, to make it easy.
The point that I am making is... We should not automatically assume the 
problem is correctable by radio settings, or possibly assume problem with a 
radio. Our experience has shown the opposite.
Nor should we assume the answer is APEX, when a Giga gets a low MSE.
Travis is right about the Apex being a fine radio with excellent value, 
probably a first choice for many, but there are still many reasons where a 
Giga is more appropriate to use, and Giga still offers excellent value, and 
reliable operation.

If the MSE is low, (below 32), then there is usually a problem needing 
addressed. It can be... 1) an antenna moving out of alignment. Note that 
misalignment may not always reflect itself via lost RSSI, but could also 
result in picking up more interference or multi-path in some cases, causing 
degrated MSE.  2) new noise.

The first step for troubleshooting, is to disable every advanced feature 
like AGC, ATPC, Auto Modulation Adjust. Hard set  Transmit power and 
Modulation to a conservative level. That means lower modulation, and that 
means also slightly lower power, just to rule out transmitter/receive 
overload, even though at the expense that maybe your RSSI might now be 
closer to the suspect noise.
Also shrink your channel size.  If you have a 40Mhz channel, switch to using 
only 10-20Mhz, to again create more isolation from adjacent channel noise. 
Sure all these things would take time, and result in short downtime, when 
radios reconfigured for this. But they are ways to isolate noise Before 
suspecting a Radio itself or incurring any large cost, like a tower climb, 
radio repurchase, or a New Freq Coord.

There are a couple of ways Noise could be generated by others, even if they 
responisbly did Freq Coords. For example, what if they got a Verticle Pol 
Freq Coord, but the installer got confused and accidentally mounted in 
Horizontal Pol, thinking they were on their allocated channel, but actually 
they weren't?  And also double check that your installer did not make that 
mistake.

Brad made a good point, that it should not be a first choice to change 
Channels, as that could cause interference with another Licensee. I'd 
explore all other options first. The ethical thing todo would  be to 
determine what channel is still free from your Freq Coordinator, prior to 
doing that.  I made the suggestion based on... I had multiple links on 
thesame path, so I could turn down the other link, to borrow the cahannel 
for testing.

That may not be as expensive or hard as some think. For example, when you 
get your Freq Coord, they may deterine 1 or 2 free channels, so there is a 
backup channel, in case there was an objection during the PON process for 
the first one selected (Its easier to assign a different channel, that to 
negotiate a dispute, and easier to get more info in the original freq Coord, 
than go back later to repeat it.). So they may already have a record of 
additional unused channels, or for that matter ones that were not free to 
avoid. They also have a record of any newer PONs that were sent out in your 
area. So if no new PONs were sent, the old Freq Cord info would still be 
relevent and accurate.

We also found that at the higher freqs, loss is not always symetrical, 
dependant on misalignment of one side. With 2 degree beamwidths it can be 
hard to tell if a antenna moved visually. For example, in one of our 
cases... We took great care to inspect the antenna mount to the pole, 
because we mounted to less than 4 dia pole, and wanted to make sure it was 
secure for long term. But we forgot to inspect the mounts holding the pole 
to the super structure. And as it turned out, it was the pole itself that 
moved.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: Gino Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2009 12:26 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem


 Travis,

 I assume the Apex Calculates the MSE, and you dont have to input any
 cable loss figures 

 Got the Apex Manual handy that you can send offlist?,

 thanks


 Gino A. Villarini
 g...@aeronetpr.com
 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
 tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145



 

 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Travis Johnson
 Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2009 12:17 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem


 Brad,

 We put 3 Apex units up about 4 months ago. They are basically the same
 as the Giga, with only a few minor differences. The only frustrating
 part for us

Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-06 Thread Gino Villarini
Tom

Great Piece of info,  I was able to lower my channel size from 40 to 10,
I lowered my modulation to qpsk, disabled all auto features and set the
power to 10 db

This are my numbers now: (similar on both ends)

(trango-config)# linktest 10
LOCK   RSSI  MSEBER
  1 1  -36.00 dBm  -34.57 dB   0.00E+00
  2 1  -36.00 dBm  -34.57 dB   0.00E+00
  3 1  -36.00 dBm  -34.60 dB   0.00E+00
  4 1  -36.00 dBm  -34.63 dB   0.00E+00
  5 1  -36.00 dBm  -34.52 dB   0.00E+00
  6 1  -36.00 dBm  -34.56 dB   0.00E+00
  7 1  -36.00 dBm  -34.53 dB   0.00E+00
  8 1  -36.00 dBm  -34.60 dB   0.00E+00
  9 1  -36.00 dBm  -34.55 dB   0.00E+00
 10 1  -36.00 dBm  -34.63 dB   0.00E+00
(trango-config)# 

I'll start upping modulation and channel size and confirm where I start
to have problems, anyone thinks this is interference?

BTW: what (HI)  means:

65 1  -37.00 dBm (HI)  -34.31 dB  0.00E+00


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Tom DeReggi
Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 1:25 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Trango is not clear on the algorythm's exact details they use to
calculate MSE.  (I personally believe that is intentional, as it is
sorta like a proprietary trade secret, but nobody has said that).
What we do know is MSE is the method to evaluated link quality and noise
via a single parameter value, to make it easy.
The point that I am making is... We should not automatically assume the
problem is correctable by radio settings, or possibly assume problem
with a radio. Our experience has shown the opposite.
Nor should we assume the answer is APEX, when a Giga gets a low MSE.
Travis is right about the Apex being a fine radio with excellent value,
probably a first choice for many, but there are still many reasons where
a Giga is more appropriate to use, and Giga still offers excellent
value, and reliable operation.

If the MSE is low, (below 32), then there is usually a problem needing
addressed. It can be... 1) an antenna moving out of alignment. Note that
misalignment may not always reflect itself via lost RSSI, but could also
result in picking up more interference or multi-path in some cases,
causing degrated MSE.  2) new noise.

The first step for troubleshooting, is to disable every advanced feature
like AGC, ATPC, Auto Modulation Adjust. Hard set  Transmit power and
Modulation to a conservative level. That means lower modulation, and
that means also slightly lower power, just to rule out
transmitter/receive overload, even though at the expense that maybe your
RSSI might now be closer to the suspect noise.
Also shrink your channel size.  If you have a 40Mhz channel, switch to
using only 10-20Mhz, to again create more isolation from adjacent
channel noise. 
Sure all these things would take time, and result in short downtime,
when radios reconfigured for this. But they are ways to isolate
noise Before suspecting a Radio itself or incurring any large cost,
like a tower climb, radio repurchase, or a New Freq Coord.

There are a couple of ways Noise could be generated by others, even if
they responisbly did Freq Coords. For example, what if they got a
Verticle Pol Freq Coord, but the installer got confused and accidentally
mounted in Horizontal Pol, thinking they were on their allocated
channel, but actually they weren't?  And also double check that your
installer did not make that mistake.

Brad made a good point, that it should not be a first choice to change
Channels, as that could cause interference with another Licensee. I'd
explore all other options first. The ethical thing todo would  be to
determine what channel is still free from your Freq Coordinator, prior
to doing that.  I made the suggestion based on... I had multiple links
on thesame path, so I could turn down the other link, to borrow the
cahannel for testing.

That may not be as expensive or hard as some think. For example, when
you get your Freq Coord, they may deterine 1 or 2 free channels, so
there is a backup channel, in case there was an objection during the PON
process for the first one selected (Its easier to assign a different
channel, that to negotiate a dispute, and easier to get more info in the
original freq Coord, than go back later to repeat it.). So they may
already have a record of additional unused channels, or for that matter
ones that were not free to avoid. They also have a record of any newer
PONs that were sent out in your area. So if no new PONs were sent, the
old Freq Cord info would still be relevent and accurate.

We also found that at the higher freqs, loss is not always symetrical,
dependant on misalignment of one side

Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-05 Thread Brad Belton
It's just how Trango designed the Giga.  As I mentioned in an off list
email, the modem that calculates the Giga's RSSI is located in the IDU and
not the ODU.  This is why the IF cable is so critical with the Giga.  There
were/are reasons why Trango designed the Giga this way (regarding future
product enhancements utilizing multiple modems in the IDU for greater
throughput capacity), but it would be best that you take it up with Trango
if you are interested in that.

You need to know what your expected RSSI for the path is supposed to be.
That doesn't mean the link will always end up there, but it gives you a
starting point.  For example we have a link that one end is behind a metal
based glass.  That link is about 10db off from expected RSSI due to the
glass attenuation.  Once we accounted for this by adjusting our target rssi
we have a much more solid link.

The bottom line is, while it may be frustrating for the first time Giga user
to get their initial Giga up and running the Giga has proven itself as a
solid product.  We have several deployed, continue to order them and have
been pleased with their performance. 

Yes, the Apex is an all ODU design and while we haven't deployed an Apex
yet, I understand the configuration is a bit more simple.  We expect to have
a couple Apex's on hand in the next week or two and I'll know a lot more
about the Apex once we have them hung.

Best,


Brad





-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2009 2:30 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

That's why I asked, it doesn't completely explain how it works, for
example

Rssi on end 1 is -39 , mse is -30 targetrssi is -39

Why in the heck if I change the target rssi to -35, the real rssi
changes too??? To -35 ...?!?!?! MSE still is -30

I have not changed the power on the other end and atpc is off ...wtf? 

BTW: The Apex being an all outdoor unit, it's the same? Got the Apex
user manual handy?

Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2009 11:03 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

MSE concept explained on Page 18 of the manual or page 20 of this pdf...

How is the link looking now after adjusting power, target rssi and cable
loss settings?


Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2009 8:39 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

How the mse would show interference? 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Tom DeReggi
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 7:41 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Also, don't assume its not interference. Licensed gets interference to.
If your MSE is showing Interference its very possible that is exactly
what you are having.
You may need to briefly/temporarilly change channels to verifiy.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message -
From: Brad Belton b...@belwave.com
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem


 Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

 Cable run length and type of cable used.
 What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis What is your 
 targetrssi set to What are your cableloss settings What is your power 
 set to Run a link 10 command from both sides and provide results What 
 version software are you running on both sides

 Maybe the best thing to do is run a sysinfo command on both ends and
send 
 me
 the results off list.

 Best,


 Brad




 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
On
 Behalf Of Gino Villarini
 Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:38 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

 I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop 
 packets, auto rate has dropped speed to qpsk, still MSE and BER is
being
 affected sometimes on one end or both ...ATPC is on, rssi is -35 on
both
 ends

 anyway to tell where the problem is?


 Gino A. Villarini
 g...@aeronetpr.com
 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
 tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145







 
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 WISPA Wireless List

Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-05 Thread Travis Johnson




Brad,

We put 3 Apex units up about 4 months ago. They are basically the same
as the Giga, with only a few minor differences. The only frustrating
part for us was having to run two CAT5 cables (one for transport, one
for management). We had to do that because we don't use VLANs, and
that's the only way to do in-band management on the transport
interface. It wasn't a huge deal (and could actually come in handy
later, because you can run the PoE over either cable, or over both to
have redundancy).

The coolest option was using the GBIC module to run fiber for the
transport. It ended up costing about $300 more per radio for the module
and the custom made fiber cable (outdoor rated, etc) but it has been a
life saver at one of our FM station repeaters.

We will probably be ordering more APEX units this summer to upgrade
some of our backhauls that are needing more bandwidth. I don't see why
anyone would use anything else when you can get a complete link
(including all FCC licensing) for around $11,500. :)

Travis
Microserv

Brad Belton wrote:

  It's just how Trango designed the Giga.  As I mentioned in an off list
email, the "modem" that calculates the Giga's RSSI is located in the IDU and
not the ODU.  This is why the IF cable is so critical with the Giga.  There
were/are reasons why Trango designed the Giga this way (regarding future
product enhancements utilizing multiple "modems" in the IDU for greater
throughput capacity), but it would be best that you take it up with Trango
if you are interested in that.

You need to know what your expected RSSI for the path is supposed to be.
That doesn't mean the link will always end up there, but it gives you a
starting point.  For example we have a link that one end is behind a metal
based glass.  That link is about 10db off from expected RSSI due to the
glass attenuation.  Once we accounted for this by adjusting our target rssi
we have a much more solid link.

The bottom line is, while it may be frustrating for the first time Giga user
to get their initial Giga up and running the Giga has proven itself as a
solid product.  We have several deployed, continue to order them and have
been pleased with their performance. 

Yes, the Apex is an all ODU design and while we haven't deployed an Apex
yet, I understand the configuration is a bit more simple.  We expect to have
a couple Apex's on hand in the next week or two and I'll know a lot more
about the Apex once we have them hung.

Best,


Brad





-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2009 2:30 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

That's why I asked, it doesn't completely explain how it works, for
example

Rssi on end 1 is -39 , mse is -30 targetrssi is -39

Why in the heck if I change the target rssi to -35, the "real rssi
changes too??? To -35 ...?!?!?! MSE still is -30

I have not changed the power on the other end and atpc is off ...wtf? 

BTW: The Apex being an all outdoor unit, it's the same? Got the Apex
user manual handy?

Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2009 11:03 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

MSE concept explained on Page 18 of the manual or page 20 of this pdf...

How is the link looking now after adjusting power, target rssi and cable
loss settings?


Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2009 8:39 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

How the mse would show interference? 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Tom DeReggi
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 7:41 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Also, don't assume its not interference. Licensed gets interference to.
If your MSE is showing Interference its very possible that is exactly
what you are having.
You may need to briefly/temporarilly change channels to verifiy.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message -
From: "Brad Belton" b...@belwave.com
To: "'WISPA General List'" wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem


  
  
Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

Cable run length and type of cable used.
What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis What is your 
targetrssi set to What are your cableloss settings Wha

Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-05 Thread Gino Villarini
Travis,
 
 I assume the Apex Calculates the MSE, and you dont have to input any
cable loss figures 
 
Got the Apex Manual handy that you can send offlist?,
 
thanks
 

Gino A. Villarini 
g...@aeronetpr.com 
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. 
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145 

 



From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2009 12:17 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem


Brad,

We put 3 Apex units up about 4 months ago. They are basically the same
as the Giga, with only a few minor differences. The only frustrating
part for us was having to run two CAT5 cables (one for transport, one
for management). We had to do that because we don't use VLANs, and
that's the only way to do in-band management on the transport interface.
It wasn't a huge deal (and could actually come in handy later, because
you can run the PoE over either cable, or over both to have redundancy).

The coolest option was using the GBIC module to run fiber for the
transport. It ended up costing about $300 more per radio for the module
and the custom made fiber cable (outdoor rated, etc) but it has been a
life saver at one of our FM station repeaters.

We will probably be ordering more APEX units this summer to upgrade some
of our backhauls that are needing more bandwidth. I don't see why anyone
would use anything else when you can get a complete link (including all
FCC licensing) for around $11,500. :)

Travis
Microserv

Brad Belton wrote: 

It's just how Trango designed the Giga.  As I mentioned in an
off list
email, the modem that calculates the Giga's RSSI is located in
the IDU and
not the ODU.  This is why the IF cable is so critical with the
Giga.  There
were/are reasons why Trango designed the Giga this way
(regarding future
product enhancements utilizing multiple modems in the IDU for
greater
throughput capacity), but it would be best that you take it up
with Trango
if you are interested in that.

You need to know what your expected RSSI for the path is
supposed to be.
That doesn't mean the link will always end up there, but it
gives you a
starting point.  For example we have a link that one end is
behind a metal
based glass.  That link is about 10db off from expected RSSI due
to the
glass attenuation.  Once we accounted for this by adjusting our
target rssi
we have a much more solid link.

The bottom line is, while it may be frustrating for the first
time Giga user
to get their initial Giga up and running the Giga has proven
itself as a
solid product.  We have several deployed, continue to order them
and have
been pleased with their performance. 

Yes, the Apex is an all ODU design and while we haven't deployed
an Apex
yet, I understand the configuration is a bit more simple.  We
expect to have
a couple Apex's on hand in the next week or two and I'll know a
lot more
about the Apex once we have them hung.

Best,


Brad





-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2009 2:30 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

That's why I asked, it doesn't completely explain how it works,
for
example

Rssi on end 1 is -39 , mse is -30 targetrssi is -39

Why in the heck if I change the target rssi to -35, the real
rssi
changes too??? To -35 ...?!?!?! MSE still is -30

I have not changed the power on the other end and atpc is off
...wtf? 

BTW: The Apex being an all outdoor unit, it's the same? Got the
Apex
user manual handy?

Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2009 11:03 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

MSE concept explained on Page 18 of the manual or page 20 of
this pdf...

How is the link looking now after adjusting power, target rssi
and cable
loss settings?


Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2009 8:39 AM
To: WISPA General List

Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-04 Thread Brad Belton
Have to disagree with Tom's advice here.  It is never a good idea to
briefly/temporarily change channels within a licensed band without
consulting a qualified frequency coordinator.

We did consider interference as a possibility once upon a time, but
consulted with our frequency coordinator before trying a different channel
plan.  Only after indentifying a second available freq pair did we change
channels briefly/temporarily just to see if interference was the issue.  It
was not.  

While interference is possible in the licensed bands it will most likely be
caused by someone briefly/temporarily changing channels when they
shouldn't.

You can also simply turn off the transmitter on the far side and view RSSI
readings.  If they show higher than what your expected noise floor should be
then you might have an interfering source to hunt down.  Simply changing
channels at will briefly or otherwise within licensed bands should never be
attempted.

Best,


Brad



-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Tom DeReggi
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 6:41 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Also, don't assume its not interference. Licensed gets interference to. If 
your MSE is showing Interference its very possible that is exactly what you 
are having.
You may need to briefly/temporarilly change channels to verifiy.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: Brad Belton b...@belwave.com
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem


 Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

 Cable run length and type of cable used.
 What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis
 What is your targetrssi set to
 What are your cableloss settings
 What is your power set to
 Run a link 10 command from both sides and provide results
 What version software are you running on both sides

 Maybe the best thing to do is run a sysinfo command on both ends and send 
 me
 the results off list.

 Best,


 Brad




 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Gino Villarini
 Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:38 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

 I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop
 packets, auto rate has dropped speed to qpsk, still MSE and BER is being
 affected sometimes on one end or both ...ATPC is on, rssi is -35 on both
 ends

 anyway to tell where the problem is?


 Gino A. Villarini
 g...@aeronetpr.com
 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
 tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145






 
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Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-04 Thread Gino Villarini
How the mse would show interference? 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Tom DeReggi
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 7:41 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Also, don't assume its not interference. Licensed gets interference to.
If your MSE is showing Interference its very possible that is exactly
what you are having.
You may need to briefly/temporarilly change channels to verifiy.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message -
From: Brad Belton b...@belwave.com
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem


 Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

 Cable run length and type of cable used.
 What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis
 What is your targetrssi set to
 What are your cableloss settings
 What is your power set to
 Run a link 10 command from both sides and provide results
 What version software are you running on both sides

 Maybe the best thing to do is run a sysinfo command on both ends and
send 
 me
 the results off list.

 Best,


 Brad




 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
On
 Behalf Of Gino Villarini
 Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:38 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

 I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop
 packets, auto rate has dropped speed to qpsk, still MSE and BER is
being
 affected sometimes on one end or both ...ATPC is on, rssi is -35 on
both
 ends

 anyway to tell where the problem is?


 Gino A. Villarini
 g...@aeronetpr.com
 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
 tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145







 
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 http://signup.wispa.org/



 

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Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-04 Thread Gino Villarini
That's why I asked, it doesn't completely explain how it works, for
example

Rssi on end 1 is -39 , mse is -30 targetrssi is -39

Why in the heck if I change the target rssi to -35, the real rssi
changes too??? To -35 ...?!?!?! MSE still is -30

I have not changed the power on the other end and atpc is off ...wtf? 

BTW: The Apex being an all outdoor unit, it's the same? Got the Apex
user manual handy?

Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2009 11:03 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

MSE concept explained on Page 18 of the manual or page 20 of this pdf...

How is the link looking now after adjusting power, target rssi and cable
loss settings?


Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2009 8:39 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

How the mse would show interference? 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Tom DeReggi
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 7:41 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Also, don't assume its not interference. Licensed gets interference to.
If your MSE is showing Interference its very possible that is exactly
what you are having.
You may need to briefly/temporarilly change channels to verifiy.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message -
From: Brad Belton b...@belwave.com
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem


 Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

 Cable run length and type of cable used.
 What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis What is your 
 targetrssi set to What are your cableloss settings What is your power 
 set to Run a link 10 command from both sides and provide results What 
 version software are you running on both sides

 Maybe the best thing to do is run a sysinfo command on both ends and
send 
 me
 the results off list.

 Best,


 Brad




 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
On
 Behalf Of Gino Villarini
 Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:38 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

 I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop 
 packets, auto rate has dropped speed to qpsk, still MSE and BER is
being
 affected sometimes on one end or both ...ATPC is on, rssi is -35 on
both
 ends

 anyway to tell where the problem is?


 Gino A. Villarini
 g...@aeronetpr.com
 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
 tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145







 
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 http://signup.wispa.org/



 

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Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-03 Thread Brad Belton
Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

Cable run length and type of cable used.
What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis
What is your targetrssi set to
What are your cableloss settings
What is your power set to
Run a link 10 command from both sides and provide results 
What version software are you running on both sides

Maybe the best thing to do is run a sysinfo command on both ends and send me
the results off list.

Best,


Brad




-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:38 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop
packets, auto rate has dropped speed to qpsk, still MSE and BER is being
affected sometimes on one end or both ...ATPC is on, rssi is -35 on both
ends
 
anyway to tell where the problem is?
 

Gino A. Villarini 
g...@aeronetpr.com 
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. 
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145 

 




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Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-03 Thread Gino Villarini
I'll do that, Link was working for months 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

Cable run length and type of cable used.
What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis What is your
targetrssi set to What are your cableloss settings What is your power
set to Run a link 10 command from both sides and provide results What
version software are you running on both sides

Maybe the best thing to do is run a sysinfo command on both ends and
send me the results off list.

Best,


Brad




-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:38 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop
packets, auto rate has dropped speed to qpsk, still MSE and BER is being
affected sometimes on one end or both ...ATPC is on, rssi is -35 on both
ends
 
anyway to tell where the problem is?
 

Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. 
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145 

 





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Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-03 Thread Joe Miller

First off, I believe your signal is too hot. turn the tx power down til you 
reach between a -50 and -60 dB. That is usually the sweet spot on most RF 
equipment. Right now you are screaming at each other. 



- Original Message 
From: Gino Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, April 3, 2009 1:38:09 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop
packets, auto rate has dropped speed to qpsk, still MSE and BER is being
affected sometimes on one end or both ...ATPC is on, rssi is -35 on both
ends

anyway to tell where the problem is?


Gino A. Villarini 
g...@aeronetpr.com 
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. 
tel  787.273.4143  fax  787.273.4145 





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Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-03 Thread Brad Belton
I know the feeling.  We had one of our early Giga links working for months
not realizing we had made mistakes until later.

Got your configs...but also send me the link 10 results along with the type
and length of cable on each end.

Brad


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:55 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I'll do that, Link was working for months 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

Cable run length and type of cable used.
What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis What is your
targetrssi set to What are your cableloss settings What is your power
set to Run a link 10 command from both sides and provide results What
version software are you running on both sides

Maybe the best thing to do is run a sysinfo command on both ends and
send me the results off list.

Best,


Brad




-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:38 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop
packets, auto rate has dropped speed to qpsk, still MSE and BER is being
affected sometimes on one end or both ...ATPC is on, rssi is -35 on both
ends
 
anyway to tell where the problem is?
 

Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. 
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145 

 





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Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-03 Thread Gino Villarini
We are using lmr400 on both ends, about 100' per end

Linktest 10 results

End 1

(trango-view)# linktest 10
LOCK   RSSI  MSEBER
  1 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.78 dB   7.42E-07
  2 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.58 dB   0.00E+00
  3 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.77 dB   0.00E+00
  4 1  -31.00 dBm  -27.09 dB   0.00E+00
  5 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.82 dB   0.00E+00
  6 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.77 dB   7.11E-10
  7 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.95 dB   0.00E+00
  8 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.84 dB   0.00E+00
  9 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.54 dB   0.00E+00
 10 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.78 dB   7.69E-10
(trango-view)# 

End 2 


Trango Broadband Wireless:  TrangoLINK Giga Command Line Interface
v2.3.8

(trango-view)# linktest 10
LOCK   RSSI  MSEBER
  1 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.61 dB   4.09E-10
  2 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.60 dB   0.00E+00
  3 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.63 dB   0.00E+00
  4 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.56 dB   0.00E+00
  5 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.90 dB   0.00E+00
  6 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.57 dB   0.00E+00
  7 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.57 dB   0.00E+00
  8 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.68 dB   0.00E+00
  9 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.56 dB   0.00E+00
 10 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.46 dB   0.00E+00
(trango-view)# 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 3:31 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I know the feeling.  We had one of our early Giga links working for
months not realizing we had made mistakes until later.

Got your configs...but also send me the link 10 results along with the
type and length of cable on each end.

Brad


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:55 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I'll do that, Link was working for months 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

Cable run length and type of cable used.
What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis What is your
targetrssi set to What are your cableloss settings What is your power
set to Run a link 10 command from both sides and provide results What
version software are you running on both sides

Maybe the best thing to do is run a sysinfo command on both ends and
send me the results off list.

Best,


Brad




-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:38 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop
packets, auto rate has dropped speed to qpsk, still MSE and BER is being
affected sometimes on one end or both ...ATPC is on, rssi is -35 on both
ends
 
anyway to tell where the problem is?
 

Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. 
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145 

 





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Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-03 Thread Brad Belton
Not necessarily true with high frequency or millimeter microwave gear.  Due
to large fade issues inherent with higher frequencies it is not uncommon to
engineer a link with -35 RSSI levels.

I believe the Giga is safe down to -25 RSSI or thereabouts.  However the
higher the modulation rate the less hot you can run it.


Brad


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Joe Miller
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:30 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem


First off, I believe your signal is too hot. turn the tx power down til you
reach between a -50 and -60 dB. That is usually the sweet spot on most RF
equipment. Right now you are screaming at each other. 



- Original Message 
From: Gino Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, April 3, 2009 1:38:09 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop
packets, auto rate has dropped speed to qpsk, still MSE and BER is being
affected sometimes on one end or both ...ATPC is on, rssi is -35 on both
ends

anyway to tell where the problem is?


Gino A. Villarini 
g...@aeronetpr.com 
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. 
tel  787.273.4143  fax  787.273.4145 






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Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-03 Thread Travis Johnson
Gino,

Looks to me like you are running a little hot. You want the MSE to be 
-32 or better I would try turning the power down on each side 1db at 
a time until you get the best MSE (on the remote side) while still 
having the best signal.

We had to turn one of our links down to +12 to get the best MSE, while 
still having a -40 signal.

Travis
Microserv

Gino Villarini wrote:
 We are using lmr400 on both ends, about 100' per end

 Linktest 10 results

 End 1

 (trango-view)# linktest 10
 LOCK   RSSI  MSEBER
   1 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.78 dB   7.42E-07
   2 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.58 dB   0.00E+00
   3 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.77 dB   0.00E+00
   4 1  -31.00 dBm  -27.09 dB   0.00E+00
   5 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.82 dB   0.00E+00
   6 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.77 dB   7.11E-10
   7 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.95 dB   0.00E+00
   8 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.84 dB   0.00E+00
   9 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.54 dB   0.00E+00
  10 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.78 dB   7.69E-10
 (trango-view)# 

 End 2 


 Trango Broadband Wireless:  TrangoLINK Giga Command Line Interface
 v2.3.8

 (trango-view)# linktest 10
 LOCK   RSSI  MSEBER
   1 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.61 dB   4.09E-10
   2 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.60 dB   0.00E+00
   3 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.63 dB   0.00E+00
   4 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.56 dB   0.00E+00
   5 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.90 dB   0.00E+00
   6 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.57 dB   0.00E+00
   7 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.57 dB   0.00E+00
   8 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.68 dB   0.00E+00
   9 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.56 dB   0.00E+00
  10 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.46 dB   0.00E+00
 (trango-view)# 


 Gino A. Villarini
 g...@aeronetpr.com
 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
 tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Brad Belton
 Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 3:31 PM
 To: 'WISPA General List'
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

 I know the feeling.  We had one of our early Giga links working for
 months not realizing we had made mistakes until later.

 Got your configs...but also send me the link 10 results along with the
 type and length of cable on each end.

 Brad


 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Gino Villarini
 Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:55 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

 I'll do that, Link was working for months 


 Gino A. Villarini
 g...@aeronetpr.com
 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
 tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Brad Belton
 Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
 To: 'WISPA General List'
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

 Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

 Cable run length and type of cable used.
 What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis What is your
 targetrssi set to What are your cableloss settings What is your power
 set to Run a link 10 command from both sides and provide results What
 version software are you running on both sides

 Maybe the best thing to do is run a sysinfo command on both ends and
 send me the results off list.

 Best,


 Brad




 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Gino Villarini
 Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:38 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

 I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop
 packets, auto rate has dropped speed to qpsk, still MSE and BER is being
 affected sometimes on one end or both ...ATPC is on, rssi is -35 on both
 ends
  
 anyway to tell where the problem is?
  

 Gino A. Villarini
 g...@aeronetpr.com
 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. 
 tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145 

  


 
 
 
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Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-03 Thread Gino Villarini
Whats the relation of target rssi and real rssi?

If I change target rssi on end 1, rssi changes on the linktest on end 1
without touching power on end 2 ...wtf?

Atpc is off on both ends 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: Brad Belton [mailto:b...@belwave.com] 
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 3:58 PM
To: Gino Villarini
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

If you are running 100' of LMR400 on each end then your cableloss
settings are probably close enough, but I'd adjust them slightly to
this:

cableloss 1.5 2.3 3.9

Check now and see if your End 1 link 10 results have improved.

If not then adjust your End 1 targetrssi from -35 to -31 and run your
link 10 command again.


We've never enabled ATPC, so I'm not sure if that is helping you are
possibly hurting you.  Let's disable it on both ends and see if we can
manually get the link to settle in with better than -32db MSE and
0.00E+00 BER readings.  We'll do this by adjusting your power levels,
targetrssi and cableloss settings.

What does your path analysis show your expected RSSI should be and at
what power level?

I assume this link has production traffic running across it and can't be
taken offline?


Brad Belton
BelWave Communications
O:  817-737-3124 #101
F:  817-336-7031







-Original Message-
From: Gino Villarini [mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com]
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:41 PM
To: WISPA General List
Cc: b...@belwave.com
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

We are using lmr400 on both ends, about 100' per end

Linktest 10 results

End 1

(trango-view)# linktest 10
LOCK   RSSI  MSEBER
  1 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.78 dB   7.42E-07
  2 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.58 dB   0.00E+00
  3 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.77 dB   0.00E+00
  4 1  -31.00 dBm  -27.09 dB   0.00E+00
  5 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.82 dB   0.00E+00
  6 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.77 dB   7.11E-10
  7 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.95 dB   0.00E+00
  8 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.84 dB   0.00E+00
  9 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.54 dB   0.00E+00
 10 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.78 dB   7.69E-10
(trango-view)# 

End 2 


Trango Broadband Wireless:  TrangoLINK Giga Command Line Interface
v2.3.8

(trango-view)# linktest 10
LOCK   RSSI  MSEBER
  1 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.61 dB   4.09E-10
  2 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.60 dB   0.00E+00
  3 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.63 dB   0.00E+00
  4 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.56 dB   0.00E+00
  5 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.90 dB   0.00E+00
  6 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.57 dB   0.00E+00
  7 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.57 dB   0.00E+00
  8 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.68 dB   0.00E+00
  9 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.56 dB   0.00E+00
 10 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.46 dB   0.00E+00
(trango-view)# 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 3:31 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I know the feeling.  We had one of our early Giga links working for
months not realizing we had made mistakes until later.

Got your configs...but also send me the link 10 results along with the
type and length of cable on each end.

Brad


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:55 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I'll do that, Link was working for months 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

Cable run length and type of cable used.
What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis What is your
targetrssi set to What are your cableloss settings What is your power
set to Run a link 10 command from both sides and provide results What
version software are you running on both sides

Maybe the best thing to do is run a sysinfo command on both ends and
send me the results off list.

Best,


Brad




-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:38 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop
packets, auto rate has

Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-03 Thread Brad Belton
Replied off list...


Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 3:30 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Whats the relation of target rssi and real rssi?

If I change target rssi on end 1, rssi changes on the linktest on end 1
without touching power on end 2 ...wtf?

Atpc is off on both ends 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: Brad Belton [mailto:b...@belwave.com] 
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 3:58 PM
To: Gino Villarini
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

If you are running 100' of LMR400 on each end then your cableloss
settings are probably close enough, but I'd adjust them slightly to
this:

cableloss 1.5 2.3 3.9

Check now and see if your End 1 link 10 results have improved.

If not then adjust your End 1 targetrssi from -35 to -31 and run your
link 10 command again.


We've never enabled ATPC, so I'm not sure if that is helping you are
possibly hurting you.  Let's disable it on both ends and see if we can
manually get the link to settle in with better than -32db MSE and
0.00E+00 BER readings.  We'll do this by adjusting your power levels,
targetrssi and cableloss settings.

What does your path analysis show your expected RSSI should be and at
what power level?

I assume this link has production traffic running across it and can't be
taken offline?


Brad Belton
BelWave Communications
O:  817-737-3124 #101
F:  817-336-7031







-Original Message-
From: Gino Villarini [mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com]
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:41 PM
To: WISPA General List
Cc: b...@belwave.com
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

We are using lmr400 on both ends, about 100' per end

Linktest 10 results

End 1

(trango-view)# linktest 10
LOCK   RSSI  MSEBER
  1 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.78 dB   7.42E-07
  2 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.58 dB   0.00E+00
  3 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.77 dB   0.00E+00
  4 1  -31.00 dBm  -27.09 dB   0.00E+00
  5 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.82 dB   0.00E+00
  6 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.77 dB   7.11E-10
  7 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.95 dB   0.00E+00
  8 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.84 dB   0.00E+00
  9 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.54 dB   0.00E+00
 10 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.78 dB   7.69E-10
(trango-view)# 

End 2 


Trango Broadband Wireless:  TrangoLINK Giga Command Line Interface
v2.3.8

(trango-view)# linktest 10
LOCK   RSSI  MSEBER
  1 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.61 dB   4.09E-10
  2 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.60 dB   0.00E+00
  3 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.63 dB   0.00E+00
  4 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.56 dB   0.00E+00
  5 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.90 dB   0.00E+00
  6 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.57 dB   0.00E+00
  7 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.57 dB   0.00E+00
  8 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.68 dB   0.00E+00
  9 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.56 dB   0.00E+00
 10 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.46 dB   0.00E+00
(trango-view)# 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 3:31 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I know the feeling.  We had one of our early Giga links working for
months not realizing we had made mistakes until later.

Got your configs...but also send me the link 10 results along with the
type and length of cable on each end.

Brad


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:55 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I'll do that, Link was working for months 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

Cable run length and type of cable used.
What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis What is your
targetrssi set to What are your cableloss settings What is your power
set to Run a link 10 command from both sides and provide results What
version software are you running on both sides

Maybe the best thing to do is run a sysinfo command on both ends and
send me the results off list.

Best,


Brad




-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun

Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-03 Thread Brad Belton
Ahhh, I see you're replying on and off list.  No problem for me to reply on
list...I was only concerned with sharing your information on a group list.

Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: Brad Belton [mailto:b...@belwave.com] 
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 3:33 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Replied off list...


Best,


Brad


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 3:30 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Whats the relation of target rssi and real rssi?

If I change target rssi on end 1, rssi changes on the linktest on end 1
without touching power on end 2 ...wtf?

Atpc is off on both ends 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: Brad Belton [mailto:b...@belwave.com] 
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 3:58 PM
To: Gino Villarini
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

If you are running 100' of LMR400 on each end then your cableloss
settings are probably close enough, but I'd adjust them slightly to
this:

cableloss 1.5 2.3 3.9

Check now and see if your End 1 link 10 results have improved.

If not then adjust your End 1 targetrssi from -35 to -31 and run your
link 10 command again.


We've never enabled ATPC, so I'm not sure if that is helping you are
possibly hurting you.  Let's disable it on both ends and see if we can
manually get the link to settle in with better than -32db MSE and
0.00E+00 BER readings.  We'll do this by adjusting your power levels,
targetrssi and cableloss settings.

What does your path analysis show your expected RSSI should be and at
what power level?

I assume this link has production traffic running across it and can't be
taken offline?


Brad Belton
BelWave Communications
O:  817-737-3124 #101
F:  817-336-7031







-Original Message-
From: Gino Villarini [mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com]
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:41 PM
To: WISPA General List
Cc: b...@belwave.com
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

We are using lmr400 on both ends, about 100' per end

Linktest 10 results

End 1

(trango-view)# linktest 10
LOCK   RSSI  MSEBER
  1 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.78 dB   7.42E-07
  2 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.58 dB   0.00E+00
  3 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.77 dB   0.00E+00
  4 1  -31.00 dBm  -27.09 dB   0.00E+00
  5 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.82 dB   0.00E+00
  6 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.77 dB   7.11E-10
  7 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.95 dB   0.00E+00
  8 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.84 dB   0.00E+00
  9 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.54 dB   0.00E+00
 10 1  -31.00 dBm  -26.78 dB   7.69E-10
(trango-view)# 

End 2 


Trango Broadband Wireless:  TrangoLINK Giga Command Line Interface
v2.3.8

(trango-view)# linktest 10
LOCK   RSSI  MSEBER
  1 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.61 dB   4.09E-10
  2 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.60 dB   0.00E+00
  3 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.63 dB   0.00E+00
  4 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.56 dB   0.00E+00
  5 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.90 dB   0.00E+00
  6 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.57 dB   0.00E+00
  7 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.57 dB   0.00E+00
  8 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.68 dB   0.00E+00
  9 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.56 dB   0.00E+00
 10 1  -34.00 dBm  -31.46 dB   0.00E+00
(trango-view)# 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 3:31 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I know the feeling.  We had one of our early Giga links working for
months not realizing we had made mistakes until later.

Got your configs...but also send me the link 10 results along with the
type and length of cable on each end.

Brad


-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:55 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

I'll do that, Link was working for months 


Gino A. Villarini
g...@aeronetpr.com
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Brad Belton
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

Cable run length and type of cable used.
What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis What is your
targetrssi

Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

2009-04-03 Thread Tom DeReggi
Also, don't assume its not interference. Licensed gets interference to. If 
your MSE is showing Interference its very possible that is exactly what you 
are having.
You may need to briefly/temporarilly change channels to verifiy.


Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: Brad Belton b...@belwave.com
To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 2:47 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem


 Going to need lots more info to be able to help.

 Cable run length and type of cable used.
 What is your expected RSSI per your path analysis
 What is your targetrssi set to
 What are your cableloss settings
 What is your power set to
 Run a link 10 command from both sides and provide results
 What version software are you running on both sides

 Maybe the best thing to do is run a sysinfo command on both ends and send 
 me
 the results off list.

 Best,


 Brad




 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Gino Villarini
 Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 1:38 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] Trango Giga Problem

 I have a 2 mile 18 ghz link using Trango Giga, Im starting to drop
 packets, auto rate has dropped speed to qpsk, still MSE and BER is being
 affected sometimes on one end or both ...ATPC is on, rssi is -35 on both
 ends

 anyway to tell where the problem is?


 Gino A. Villarini
 g...@aeronetpr.com
 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
 tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145




 
 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 




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http://signup.wispa.org/

 
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