Re: [WSG] IE in Virtual PC
On 20 Aug 2005, at 7:48 AM, Chris Kennon wrote: Would some knowledgeable participant enlighten on the behavior of IE in Virtual PC for the MAC? Respectfully, C PS I hope my questions are not banal, due to the absences of replies, I'm beginning to feel like the carrier of something contagious :) Well, not banal, maybe, but certainly a little vague... (at least this one). The answer that first comes to mind is - it displays web sites. Now, what is it that you really want to know? N ___ Omnivision. Websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] javascript and no script -- best practices
thanks for the citehelp/cite with my last question. now i have a
page with javascript opening a new window from a link. the reason for
this is that i want to allow the visitor to close the window and still
be at the site from whence they came. my problem and question is. what
is the best practice for allowing someone to click the link and go to
the site with js disabled?
here's the script:
a href=JavaScript: void(0) onclick=window.open('pagename.htm',
'_blank', 'optionlist')link text/a
hope all of you are having a smashing weekend.
dwain
--
Dwain Alford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.alforddesigngroup.com
The Teacher answered:
There is no sin.
'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala'
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Re: [WSG] javascript and no script -- best practices
On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 04:35:50 -0500, dwain alford wrote:
here's the script:
a href=JavaScript: void(0) onclick=window.open('pagename.htm',
'_blank', 'optionlist')link text/a
E!
Not a good method, that.
How about:
a href=/dir/to/target.html onclick=return !window.open(this.href,
'awindow', 'optionlist');link text/a
This well work nicely if JS is off :)
I think the main 'debatable point' is whether or not negating the
window.open works.
(written from memory - needs testing)
I like:
http://www.sitepoint.com/print/perfect-pop-up
as reference material.
HIH
Lea
--
Lea de Groot
Elysian Systems - http://elysiansystems.com/
Brisbane, Australia
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RE: [WSG] javascript and no script -- best practices
There's an article for accessible popups over at
http://www.alistapart.com/articles/popuplinks/
The code you posted has some issues that will need to be dealt with.
thanks for the citehelp/cite with my last question. now i have a
page with javascript opening a new window from a link. the reason for
this is that i want to allow the visitor to close the window and still
be at the site from whence they came. my problem and question is. what
is the best practice for allowing someone to click the link and go to
the site with js disabled?
here's the script:
a href=JavaScript: void(0) onclick=window.open('pagename.htm',
'_blank', 'optionlist')link text/a
hope all of you are having a smashing weekend.
dwain
**
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See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] javascript and no script -- best practices
Lea de Groot wrote: How about: a href=/dir/to/target.html onclick=return !window.open(this.href, 'awindow', 'optionlist');link text/a This well work nicely if JS is off :) I think the main 'debatable point' is whether or not negating the window.open works. (written from memory - needs testing) I like: http://www.sitepoint.com/print/perfect-pop-up as reference material. HIH Lea thanks lea for your quick response. do i insert the js (all of it) as written with the this.href being the page i want to go to? dwain -- Dwain Alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alforddesigngroup.com The Teacher answered: There is no sin. 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] javascript and no script -- best practices
On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 05:04:15 -0500, dwain alford wrote:
thanks lea for your quick response. do i insert the js (all of it)
as written with the this.href being the page i want to go to?
No, no - thats the whole 'trick' to this.
You only type the real url (in my example '/dir/to/target.html') once,
in the regular href= position.
Then the javascript uses an internal property 'this.href' to get the
href from the current object.
Its quite nifty.
So, where you had:
a href=JavaScript: void(0) onclick=window.open('pagename.htm',
'_blank', 'optionlist')link text/a
I would put:
a href=pagename.htm onclick=return !window.open(this.href,
'awindow', 'optionlist');link text/a
this means that folks without javascript effectively get:
a href=pagename.htmlink text/a
and people with js get the popup.
and because we return a false when the popup executes correctly they do
not get moved on in the current window.
What a long explanation for such a simple concept :)
Lea
--
Lea de Groot
Elysian Systems - http://elysiansystems.com/
Brisbane, Australia
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[WSG] stink emails
well i thought it would never happen to me, but someone hijacked my [EMAIL PROTECTED] account and is sending out a virus. dwain -- Dwain Alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alforddesigngroup.com The Teacher answered: There is no sin. 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] web accessibility toolbar
Hi Joshua, et al, Let me put it the other way around: A lot of designers love to use pixels for font sizing. AFAIK, the only problem with it is that users can't resize text in IE. If they could, that would be great. With tools such as this, they can. So what I mean is : should it be that we all push for a) all browsers to do this, and b) 'advertise' the existence of such tools as an interim measure, and [most importantly] would it solve some of our problems? Thanks, Bob Joshua Street wrote: On Sat, 2005-08-20 at 13:34 +0100, designer wrote: Good afternoon (or whatever), Does the web accessibility toolbar let me off the hook as far as using pixels for text sizing in IE is concerned? I have recently got the excellent WAT from http://www.nils.org.au/ais/ and it has an excellent zoom facility, like opera. (A great, and very educational tool anyway). I ask the question partly tongue-in-cheek, but it does make me wonder if tools such as this should be the butt of responsibility? I just wondered, as it does seem to put the pixel argument into a different perspective. No rants please: this is intended as an intelligent question, expecting and wanting the same type of response. Seeing as you've indicated you don't desire rants, I'll simply suggest that the assumption the burden of ensuring accessibility falls upon client-side (third part) utilities is akin to assuming all your potential viewers have Firefox or Opera. To extend this one step further, the need for any internal website search is negated, as, clearly, we may safely assume all users have installed the Google toolbar (obviously!) and are capable of typing site:yoursite.com query into the field. I'm pretty sure you know what the answer to your question should be, seeing as there's no way you can assume that the responsibility falls on the user -- given the rate of adoption of alternative web browsers as a precedent. At any rate, all this tool does is render pixel sized text even more irrelevant, as, clearly, it's not being respected anyway. You can actually improve your control over appearance through using relative font sizes and appropriate design practises to match this, rather than trying to force your users/visitors into one particular framework which then breaks as they attempt to escape it. Kind Regards, Joshua Street base10solutions Website: http://www.base10solutions.com.au/ Phone: (02) 9898-0060 Fax: (02) 8572-6021 Mobile: 0425 808 469 Multimedia Development Agency E-mails and any attachments sent from base10solutions are to be regarded as confidential. Please do not distribute or publish any of the contents of this e-mail without the sender’s consent. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by replying to the e-mail, and then delete the message without making copies or using it in any way. Although base10solutions takes precautions to ensure that e-mail sent from our accounts are free of viruses, we encourage recipients to undertake their own virus scan on each e-mail before opening, as base10solutions accepts no responsibility for loss or damage caused by the contents of this e-mail. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] javascript and no script -- best practices
Lea de Groot wrote:
On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 05:04:15 -0500, dwain alford wrote:
thanks lea for your quick response. do i insert the js (all of it)
as written with the this.href being the page i want to go to?
No, no - thats the whole 'trick' to this.
You only type the real url (in my example '/dir/to/target.html') once,
in the regular href= position.
Then the javascript uses an internal property 'this.href' to get the
href from the current object.
Its quite nifty.
So, where you had:
a href=JavaScript: void(0) onclick=window.open('pagename.htm',
'_blank', 'optionlist')link text/a
I would put:
a href=pagename.htm onclick=return !window.open(this.href,
'awindow', 'optionlist');link text/a
this means that folks without javascript effectively get:
a href=pagename.htmlink text/a
and people with js get the popup.
and because we return a false when the popup executes correctly they do
not get moved on in the current window.
What a long explanation for such a simple concept :)
Lea
ok, all is clear. i don't know nothin' bout writtin no javascript lea.
--
Dwain Alford
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.alforddesigngroup.com
The Teacher answered:
There is no sin.
'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala'
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THREAD CLOSED Re: [WSG] stink emails
On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 05:33:02 -0500, dwain alford wrote: well i thought it would never happen to me, but someone hijacked my [EMAIL PROTECTED] account and is sending out a virus. If you wish to discuss this please do so offlist. warmly, Lea ~ with concerned looks in Dwain's direction -- Lea de Groot WSG Core member ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] web accessibility toolbar
On Sun, 2005-08-21 at 11:35 +0100, designer wrote: Hi Joshua, et al, Let me put it the other way around: A lot of designers love to use pixels for font sizing. AFAIK, the only problem with it is that users can't resize text in IE. If they could, that would be great. With tools such as this, they can. So what I mean is : should it be that we all push for a) all browsers to do this, and b) 'advertise' the existence of such tools as an interim measure, and [most importantly] would it solve some of our problems? Do we love to use pixels for font sizing because it has any intrinsic advantage, or simply because we'd rather be designing for print? This list has seen some debates of epic proportions in the past months regarding font sizes, and I recognise this is a little different, but isn't it worth thinking _why_ designers love to use pixel-based font sizing? Are these the same designers that don't embrace fluid layouts? (I'm not saying that because fluid layouts are intrinsically better, just that it's a good thing to have an open mind towards) If you're talking about an Opera-esque zoom that scales images as well, then there's a problem there because, well, scaled raster images look like crap. As designers, we should be opposed to that. As CSS and web standards advocates, we should recognise that needn't be a problem if we adopt design practises that enable us to build layouts that are sufficiently flexible to enable us to use relative font sizing, whilst the rest of the layout remains static (obviously within reason -- it's generally safe to assume no-one is going to resize your text greater than 250%!) And, if you don't mean a whole-site zoom like Opera uses, but rather just a text-resizing feature (ala Firefox, et al.), then it's really worth asking why on earth you were using pixels in the first place, as you know that you're ultimately relinquishing control, and all you're really doing is irritating your users by not respecting their text-size defaults. Kind Regards, Joshua Street base10solutions Website: http://www.base10solutions.com.au/ Phone: (02) 9898-0060 Fax: (02) 8572-6021 Mobile: 0425 808 469 Multimedia Development Agency E-mails and any attachments sent from base10solutions are to be regarded as confidential. Please do not distribute or publish any of the contents of this e-mail without the sender’s consent. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by replying to the e-mail, and then delete the message without making copies or using it in any way. Although base10solutions takes precautions to ensure that e-mail sent from our accounts are free of viruses, we encourage recipients to undertake their own virus scan on each e-mail before opening, as base10solutions accepts no responsibility for loss or damage caused by the contents of this e-mail. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: THREAD CLOSED Re: [WSG] stink emails
Lea de Groot wrote: On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 05:33:02 -0500, dwain alford wrote: well i thought it would never happen to me, but someone hijacked my [EMAIL PROTECTED] account and is sending out a virus. If you wish to discuss this please do so offlist. warmly, Lea ~ with concerned looks in Dwain's direction sorry, i just wanted folks to know about the possibility of getting such a message. my extreme apologies. dwain -- Dwain Alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alforddesigngroup.com The Teacher answered: There is no sin. 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] web accessibility toolbar
On 21/08/05, Joshua Street [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Do we love to use pixels for font sizing because it has any intrinsic advantage, or simply because we'd rather be designing for print? ... Print? Is print in pixels? Never heard that. My screen is measured in pixels, I view the web on my screen... And there was a time when pixels were the only good choice: http://old.alistapart.com/stories/fear4/ Ok, that was long time ago. Are these the same designers that don't embrace fluid layouts? (I'm not saying that because fluid layouts are intrinsically better, just that it's a good thing to have an open mind towards) ... If anything is better than fixed layout it is elastic layout: that means line length defined in em's. How good layout is for reading does not depend on open-mindness of the designer, it depends on physiology of our sight, and alas tall and narrow is better than wde and shallow. And, if you don't mean a whole-site zoom like Opera uses, but rather just a text-resizing feature (ala Firefox, et al.), then it's really worth asking why on earth you were using pixels in the first place, Why not? In terms of CSS pixels are relative units, just like em and ex. I'd like to quote Joe Clark presentation at @media 2005: Today, I want everyone in the room to take a vow never to say anything like that ever again. Do not tell people, or tell yourself, or even think that there's something inherently wrong with pixel-based fonts. What there's something inherently wrong with is Internet Explorer for Windows ( http://www.joeclark.org/atmedia/atmedia-NOTES-2.html ) ... you know that you're ultimately relinquishing control, and all you're really doing is irritating your users by not respecting their text-size defaults. So this means we shouldn't touch font-size at all. In theory. In practice that just means users are not aware of any text-size defaults. Regards, Rimantas -- http://rimantas.com/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] web accessibility toolbar
Rimantas Liubertas wrote: Why not? In terms of CSS pixels are relative units, just like em and ex. Just to be sure we understand, here's the definition, current and probably future: http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-CSS2/syndata.html#length-units http://www.w3.org/TR/2005/WD-css3-values-20050726/#relative0 Everything on a web page is relative to the viewing device, and so px is not relative to anything relevant in the text sizing context. At any given resolution, px is no less absolute or fixed than cm, in, or pt, all of which cannot be resized by IE users. So this means we shouldn't touch font-size at all. In theory. In practice that just means users are not aware of any text-size defaults. Whether they are aware or not, they are all humans who cannot read something that isn't big enough to see. By sticking not just to relative units, but to relative units *and* medium/1em/100% as the size dominating your pages, you're making them accessible to absolutely everyone. -- Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life? Matthew 6:27 NIV Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 Felix Miata *** http://members.ij.net/mrmazda/auth/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] web accessibility toolbar
On 21/08/05, Felix Miata [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Everything on a web page is relative to the viewing device, and so px is not relative to anything relevant in the text sizing context. At any given resolution, px is no less absolute or fixed than cm, in, or pt, all of which cannot be resized by IE users. IE _for Windows_ users. And that's not a problem of px. Opera has no problem resizing px, not only text but images too. Shall I quote again? Joe Clark at @media 2005: Today, I want everyone in the room to take a vow never to say anything like that ever again. Do not tell people, or tell yourself, or even think that there's something inherently wrong with pixel-based fonts. What there's something inherently wrong with is Internet Explorer for Windows Whether they are aware or not, they are all humans who cannot read something that isn't big enough to see. By sticking not just to relative units, but to relative units *and* medium/1em/100% as the size dominating your pages, you're making them accessible to absolutely everyone. absolutely everyone. Wow. Regards, Rimantas, -- http://rimantas.com/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] IE in Virtual PC
Hi, Does IE in Virtual PC display the same quirks as the XP, 2000 version of IE? I'm a MAC OS user, but would like to test CSS in IE before going to Browser CAM. Hope this clarifies :) C PS The wit of this list is just a sharp as the knowledge. On Aug 21, 2005, at 12:37 AM, Nick Gleitzman wrote: On 20 Aug 2005, at 7:48 AM, Chris Kennon wrote: Would some knowledgeable participant enlighten on the behavior of IE in Virtual PC for the MAC? Respectfully, C PS I hope my questions are not banal, due to the absences of replies, I'm beginning to feel like the carrier of something contagious :) Well, not banal, maybe, but certainly a little vague... (at least this one). The answer that first comes to mind is - it displays web sites. Now, what is it that you really want to know? N ___ Omnivision. Websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] IE in Virtual PC
On 21 Aug 2005, at 9:31 pm, Chris Kennon wrote: Does IE in Virtual PC display the same quirks as the XP, 2000 version of IE? I'm a MAC OS user, but would like to test CSS in IE before going to Browser CAM. Inside Virtual PC, you create virtual machines that run the 'real' Win OS of your choice. IE win will behave mostly as if it runs on a real PC. I say mostly, depending on the power of your Mac [1], you might see small problems like painting bugs when scrolling fast through pages. If you intend to run complex scripts, you might see some performance issues. Otherwise ? It displays web sites, with the same quirks, bugs and stupidities, same risks in browsing the web, same everything. [1] I now run VPC 7 + XP on an old, tired dual 450Mhz G4; it isn't fast, but it does the job. Philippe --- Philippe Wittenbergh http://emps.l-c-n.com/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] javascript and no script -- best practices
Lea de Groot wrote: I would put: a href=pagename.htm onclick=return !window.open(this.href, 'awindow', 'optionlist');link text/a this works ok, terrific would be if the window that opened allowed you to maximize it or opened maximized with scroll bars. the page with this code is up at: http://www.alforddesigngroup.com/sandbox/resources.html dwain -- Dwain Alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alforddesigngroup.com The Teacher answered: There is no sin. 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] IE in Virtual PC
On 21 Aug 2005, at 10:31 PM, Chris Kennon wrote: Does IE in Virtual PC display the same quirks as the XP, 2000 version of IE? I'm a MAC OS user, but would like to test CSS in IE before going to Browser CAM. Hope this clarifies :) C PS The wit of this list is just a sharp as the knowledge. Thanks for the compliment, Chris (I think). Philippe has pretty much answered the question. You load Win OS into VPC from original MS disks, so there's no reason to suspect anything will be different... I run WIn 2K and XP on VP7 on a 2x2GHz G5, and it's still much slower than a native Wintel box, as the processor is emulated by the software, but it's plenty good enough for testing. I've never come across anything that renders differently... HTH N ___ Omnivision. Websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] javascript and no script -- best practices
Lea de Groot wrote: I would put: a href=pagename.htm onclick=return !window.open(this.href, 'awindow', 'optionlist');link text/a this means that folks without javascript effectively get: a href=pagename.htmlink text/a and people with js get the popup. and because we return a false when the popup executes correctly they do not get moved on in the current window. What a long explanation for such a simple concept :) thanks for the snippet. the window opens, but it is small and does not offer a maximization setting or scroll bars. what do i need to add to the code for the window to open maximized or be able to be maximized? i realize that this is coding 101, but i'm coming from the remedial coding group. ;^) dwain -- Dwain Alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alforddesigngroup.com The Teacher answered: There is no sin. 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] IE in Virtual PC
On Aug 21, 2005, at 5:47 AM, Philippe Wittenbergh wrote: It displays web sites, with the same quirks, bugs and stupidities, same risks in browsing the web, same everything. Does this statement imply the machine hosting Virtual PC and IE becomes vulnerable to malicious software? [1] I now run VPC 7 + XP on an old, tired dual 450Mhz G4; it isn't fast, but it does the job. Philippe A means of breathing life into the old boy: (http://www.smalldog.com/category/x/x/upgrades+memory/upgrade/wag115/ wag10015) ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] javascript and no script -- best practices
a href=pagename.htm onclick=return !window.open(this.href, 'awindow', 'optionlist');link text/a thanks for the snippet. the window opens, but it is small and does not offer a maximization setting or scroll bars. what do i need to add to the code for the window to open maximized or be able to be maximized? Leave out the 'optionlist' parameter. -- Jan Brasna aka JohnyB :: www.alphanumeric.cz | www.janbrasna.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] IE in Virtual PC
Hi, It was a compliment :) How does using VPC, compare to just using Browser Cam? Does using VPC provide a better control for testing pages in IE, justifying the expense, than s justifying the expense? On Aug 21, 2005, at 6:25 AM, Nick Gleitzman wrote: Thanks for the compliment, Chris (I think). Philippe has pretty much answered the question. You load Win OS into VPC from original MS disks, so there's no reason to suspect anything will be different... I run WIn 2K and XP on VP7 on a 2x2GHz G5, and it's still much slower than a native Wintel box, as the processor is emulated by the software, but it's plenty good enough for testing. I've never come across anything that renders differently... HTH ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] IE in Virtual PC
Does this statement imply the machine hosting Virtual PC and IE becomes vulnerable to malicious software? No. Only the guest OS (WXP, W2K) is vulnerable. It runs in sandbox. no reason to suspect anything will be different Colors are different (due to the matter of Mac's different gamma). How does using VPC, compare to just using Browser Cam? You can try behavior or interaction too. AFAIK BCam has now a remote access, but I've never seen it. -- Jan Brasna aka JohnyB :: www.alphanumeric.cz | www.janbrasna.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] javascript and no script -- best practices
Jan Brasna wrote: a href=pagename.htm onclick=return !window.open(this.href, 'awindow', 'optionlist');link text/a thanks for the snippet. the window opens, but it is small and does not offer a maximization setting or scroll bars. what do i need to add to the code for the window to open maximized or be able to be maximized? Leave out the 'optionlist' parameter. jan, very much appreciate the words. they did the trick, of course you knew that. will you point me in the direction for my next addition? i want the visitor to be able to tab through the links. i don't know how this is done. references? dwain -- Dwain Alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alforddesigngroup.com The Teacher answered: There is no sin. 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] tabbing through links
again, thanks to all for the responses to the new page opener script. i feel like columbo, for those familiar with him, but i've got just one more question. i would like for visitors, with and without scripting enabled, to be able to tab through the links on the page. how would i accomplish this? i did a google and didn't have much luck. the only item i found, i didn't understand how to apply it. may i ask again for help with this matter? dwain -- Dwain Alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alforddesigngroup.com The Teacher answered: There is no sin. 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] tabbing through links
On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 15:51:05 -0500, dwain alford wrote: i would like for visitors, with and without scripting enabled, to be able to tab through the links on the page. how would i accomplish this? i did a google and didn't have much luck. the only item i found, i didn't understand how to apply it. may i ask again for help with this matter? I'm not sure what you are asking for - they hit they tab key and they go to the next link? Lea -- Lea de Groot Elysian Systems - http://elysiansystems.com/ Brisbane, Australia ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] IE in Virtual PC
On 22 Aug 2005, at 12:18 AM, Jan Brasna wrote: Does this statement imply the machine hosting Virtual PC and IE becomes vulnerable to malicious software? No. Only the guest OS (WXP, W2K) is vulnerable. It runs in sandbox. no reason to suspect anything will be different Colors are different (due to the matter of Mac's different gamma). It's straightforward to set up a monitor profile with a gamma that matches a PC's. How does using VPC, compare to just using Browser Cam? You can try behavior or interaction too. ...and resize browser windows, zoom text etc, to check effectiveness of liquid design. Personally, I find being able to test CSS variations (box model hacks, for instance) in real time, in a real browser environment, an invaluable dvelopment tool, and one that was well worth the expense. Heck, I covered the cost of the software in the time I saved testing the first site I built after I installed it! N ___ Omnivision. Websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] tabbing through links
Tabbing of course happans automatically. However, on a three column layout I added a top hidden nav that showed on focus that linked to each column so the visitor could choose the column to tab down. Is this what you mean? If so, unless someone here has the info at hand I will have to look it up. Bruce Prochnau BKDesign Solutions On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 15:51:05 -0500, dwain alford wrote: i would like for visitors, with and without scripting enabled, to be able to tab through the links on the page. how would i accomplish this? i did a google and didn't have much luck. the only item i found, i didn't understand how to apply it. may i ask again for help with this matter? I'm not sure what you are asking for - they hit they tab key and they go to the next link? Lea -- Lea de Groot Elysian Systems - http://elysiansystems.com/ Brisbane, Australia ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] tabbing through links
Bruce wrote: Tabbing of course happans automatically. However, on a three column layout I added a top hidden nav that showed on focus that linked to each column so the visitor could choose the column to tab down. Is this what you mean? If so, unless someone here has the info at hand I will have to look it up. i had not thought of that. give me a clue and i'll try my hand at searching for it. if i have any problems, i'll be in touch. i love standards, it's so much fun! cheers, dwain -- Dwain Alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alforddesigngroup.com The Savior replied; There is no such thing as sin;... 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] tabbing through links
What I did was have a hidden menu at page top. When a user tabbed it showed up (onfocus), and gave a link to top of each column. I'm having trouble finding it now...but above gives the idea Bruce Prochnau BKDesign Solutions - Original Message - From: dwain alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 6:12 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] tabbing through links Bruce wrote: Tabbing of course happans automatically. However, on a three column layout I added a top hidden nav that showed on focus that linked to each column so the visitor could choose the column to tab down. Is this what you mean? If so, unless someone here has the info at hand I will have to look it up. i had not thought of that. give me a clue and i'll try my hand at searching for it. if i have any problems, i'll be in touch. i love standards, it's so much fun! cheers, dwain -- Dwain Alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alforddesigngroup.com The Savior replied; There is no such thing as sin;... 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] tabbing through links
I see what you mean, it is hard to find! I did a takeoff of this page using three links to top of each column: http://www.usability.com.au/resources/menus-links.cfm At top of page they have links that you can tab to, and then go to that part to tab down. #Skip to area navigation # Skip to content Bruce Prochnau BKDesign Solutions - Original Message - From: dwain alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 6:12 PM Subject: Re: [WSG] tabbing through links Bruce wrote: Tabbing of course happans automatically. However, on a three column layout I added a top hidden nav that showed on focus that linked to each column so the visitor could choose the column to tab down. Is this what you mean? If so, unless someone here has the info at hand I will have to look it up. i had not thought of that. give me a clue and i'll try my hand at searching for it. if i have any problems, i'll be in touch. i love standards, it's so much fun! cheers, dwain -- Dwain Alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alforddesigngroup.com The Savior replied; There is no such thing as sin;... 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] web accessibility toolbar
Hi designer As the person who developed the web accessibility toolbar (WAT) I do not recommend the use of its magnify function as a way to overcome the pixel issue in internet explorer. This function is simply intended to give an idea to designers/developers of how some people may view a web page. it does not work across pages, so a user would have to reactivate the function each time they opened a page. As a web accessibility consultant I reccommend the use of em's or % over pixels, but if a designer decides they must use pixels to set font-size users of internet explorer can override this by using the IE menu Internet options accessibility ignore font sizes specified on web pages this allows users to change the text size via the IE menu view text size function. This is a rather convoluted process and many users are not aware of it, so give clear instructions on its use if you choose to go down this path. PS: both the accessibility dialog and the text size functions are also available through the WAT IE options menu. they have been put there to make it easier for designers/developers to test their pages (in IE) to ensure that their designs don't break when settings are changed by the user. with regards Steven Faulkner Web Accessibility Consultant National Information Library Service (NILS) 454 Glenferrie Road Kooyong Victoria 3144 Phone: (613) 9864 9281 Fax: (613) 9864 9210 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Get the Web Accessibility Toolbar [http://www.nils.org.au/ais/web/resources/toolbar/] |-+--- | | designer| | | [EMAIL PROTECTED]| | | rnet.co.uk | | | Sent by:| | | [EMAIL PROTECTED]| | | p.org | | | | | | | | | 20/08/2005 10:34 PM | | | Please respond to wsg | | | | |-+--- ---| | | | To: webstandards group [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | cc: | | Subject: [WSG] web accessibility toolbar | ---| Good afternoon (or whatever), Does the web accessibility toolbar let me off the hook as far as using pixels for text sizing in IE is concerned? I have recently got the excellent WAT from http://www.nils.org.au/ais/ and it has an excellent zoom facility, like opera. (A great, and very educational tool anyway). I ask the question partly tongue-in-cheek, but it does make me wonder if tools such as this should be the butt of responsibility? I just wondered, as it does seem to put the pixel argument into a different perspective. No rants please: this is intended as an intelligent question, expecting and wanting the same type of response. Thanks, Bob ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] tabbing through links
Watch out for IE keyboard navigation bug. Depending on your method for setting the destination anchor, things can go a little awry. For details, see: http://www.motive.co.nz/glossary/anchor.php Cheers, -- Andy Kirkwood | Creative Director Motive | web.design.integrity http://www.motive.co.nz ph: (04) 3 800 800 fx: (04) 970 9693 mob: 021 369 693 93 Rintoul St, Newtown PO Box 7150, Wellington South, New Zealand ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] tabbing through links
Also See Keyboard Navigation and Internet Explorer : http://juicystudio.com/article/ie-keyboard-navigation.php with regards Steven Faulkner Web Accessibility Consultant National Information Library Service (NILS) 454 Glenferrie Road Kooyong Victoria 3144 Phone: (613) 9864 9281 Fax: (613) 9864 9210 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] National Information Library Service A subsidiary of RBS.RVIB.VAF Ltd. |-+- | | Andy Kirkwood | | | | Motive| | | [EMAIL PROTECTED]| | || | | Sent by: | | | [EMAIL PROTECTED]| | | dsgroup.org | | | | | | | | | 22/08/2005 10:59 | | | AM| | | Please respond to | | | wsg | | | | |-+- ---| | | | To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | cc: | | Subject: Re: [WSG] tabbing through links | ---| Watch out for IE keyboard navigation bug. Depending on your method for setting the destination anchor, things can go a little awry. For details, see: http://www.motive.co.nz/glossary/anchor.php Cheers, -- Andy Kirkwood | Creative Director Motive | web.design.integrity http://www.motive.co.nz ph: (04) 3 800 800 fx: (04) 970 9693 mob: 021 369 693 93 Rintoul St, Newtown PO Box 7150, Wellington South, New Zealand ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] tabbing through links
Andy Kirkwood | Motive wrote: Watch out for IE keyboard navigation bug. Depending on your method for setting the destination anchor, things can go a little awry. For details, see: http://www.motive.co.nz/glossary/anchor.php Cheers, thanks for the heads up. got it bookmarked for later perusal. i checked out the tabbing in ie6 and it seemed to function as i expected. imagine that. cheers, dwain -- Dwain Alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alforddesigngroup.com The Savior replied; There is no such thing as sin;... 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] tabbing through links
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Also See Keyboard Navigation and Internet Explorer : http://juicystudio.com/article/ie-keyboard-navigation.php thanks steven. this is really what i had in mind when i initially asked the question; the tab index method. all seems to be fine in ie6/pc. if you have a mac would you check it out in ie5.2? http://www.alforddesigngroup.com/sandbox/resources.html thanks for all of the help folks. i'm overwhelmed. cheers, dwain -- Dwain Alford [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.alforddesigngroup.com The Savior replied; There is no such thing as sin;... 'The Gospel of Mary of Magdala' ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] tabbing through links
From: Bruce [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2005 7:00 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] tabbing through links
I see what you mean, it is hard to find!
I did a takeoff of this page using three links to top of each
column:
http://www.usability.com.au/resources/menus-links.cfm
At top of page they have links that you can tab to, and then go to
that part
to tab down.
#Skip to area navigation # Skip to content
Hi Bruce,
Those hidden links are always hidden in IE6 and always visible in
modern browsers. Tab through this page:
http://www.projectseven.com/tutorials/accessibility/pop_integrated/pmmsite/
You should see the navigation link light up when tabbed to. To make
this kind of thing work in both modern browsers and IE-Windows, you
need to use both the a:active and a:focus pseudoclasses.
Here are the style rules that drive that top hidden link:
#skipit, #skipit:visited, #skipit:hover {
font-size: .8em;
text-decoration: none;
color: #FF;
display: block;
padding: 2px;
border: 1px solid #FF;
cursor: default;
}
#skipit:active, #skipit:focus {
background-color: #33;
border: 1px solid #33;
}
The id skipit is assigned to the a element. Color and border for
the default, visited, and hover classes match the page page
background. The cursor is set to default so that mousers waving over
the hidden link have no visual clue it is there.
The active and focus classes change the background and border colors,
making the link pop out when they have focus. Active is what causes
IE-Windows to behave like modern browsers. IE-Win does not support the
focus pseudoclass, but an anomaly in its implementation of the active
psedoclass causes it to behave almost like modern browsers do for
focus.
Steven Faulkner's link is also good reading, though if one properly
fixes a layout for MSIE, those workarounds should already be present
to fix other things :-)
Al Sparber
PVII
http://www.projectseven.com
Designing with CSS is sometimes like barreling down a crumbling
mountain road at 90 miles per hour secure in the knowledge that
repairs are scheduled for next Tuesday.
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
RE: [WSG] IFrame Question
What IFrame? There is no IFrame in your page. But there are a few ways to do what you want: 1. You can use javascript to change the image source. 2. You can put both images in the page in separate divs and hide one - then use a show/hide script to swap the divs over. 3. You can put the images in an actual iframe and use a href=guitar2.jpg target=imageFrame to change the images. But what ever you do, get rid of the tables. You should never need to use a single cell table. cheers, Geoff -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Jeff Sent: Saturday, 20 August 2005 12:08 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [WSG] IFrame Question I have a crude IFrame scrollbox test page setup and need to know if it is possible to do the following: From within the IFrame, use a link to change the graphic to the right of the IFrame. For example, I will be scrolling several small graphics of the guitar models in each color they are available in. Once the small image of a red sunburst colored guitar is clicked on in the IFrame, the larger image of the same red sunburst guitar appears to the right on the page and so forth for each available color guitar. In this crude demo, I have used text links but of course they open in a new page. Here is the url: http://www.olpguitars.com/08122005/scrollertest.htm TIA Jeff ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Center aligning links with a specified height
Hi everybody, Long time reader - first time poster here. I've currently got a doozie that I've been struggling with for hours. The final product looks simple enough, but I can't for the life of me get it - help me WSG, you're my only hope. What I want is a center aligned list (UL LI's) of links with a rollover state on the links. div id=footer ul lia href=#Test/a/li lia href=#Test/a/li lia href=#Test/a/li /ul pCopyright line goes here/p /div The kicker is that I need to be able to specify a height on the anchor link (40px in this case; as the background image is this height). Since it's an inline element I can't set a height on it directly, so if I convert it to block it takes up the whole row, if I float it it won't be centered, I can't set a width value on the LI because it's a content managed section... everything I've tried doesn't work, and I'm pretty sure I've tried everything. Does anybody have a solution to this one? Looking forward to your responses, Cheers, Adam. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
