Re: [WSG] Suggestions Please for: CMS / E-commerce Solutions
On 5/28/07, Mark Hedley [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am currently looking for a cost-effective (preferably opensource) solution to run our companies UK based web site. If you can afford to wait a few months, Magento is open-source and looks to be pretty good: http://www.magentocommerce.com/ Matthew. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Content Management issue ?
On Tue, 29 May 2007 01:51:16 am Kevin Ross wrote: Can anyone lend a hand? Thanks very much... Regards, Kevin. Have you tried looking at http://www.opensourcecms.com/? They have working installations of all Open Source CMS that you can try as user and administrator. Sit down with the client and try each one out. -- Regards, Steve Bathurst Computer Solutions URL: www.bathurstcomputers.com.au e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mobile: 0407 224 251 _ ... (0) ... / / \ .. / / . ) .. V__/_ Linux Powered! Registered Linux User #355382 * If you read the same things as others and say the same things they say, then you're perceived as intelligent. I'm a bit more independent and radical and consider intelligence the ability to think about matters on your own and ask a lot of skeptical questions to get at the real truth, not just what you're told it is. Apple's Inventor - Steve Wozniak 2006 * *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Suggestions Please for: CMS / E-commerce Solutions
On Tue, 29 May 2007 06:20:05 am Mark Hedley wrote: Hi everyone. I am currently looking for a cost-effective (preferably opensource) solution to run our companies UK based web site. Have you looked at the e-Commerce section at http://www.opensourcecms.com? -- Regards, Steve Bathurst Computer Solutions URL: www.bathurstcomputers.com.au e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Mobile: 0407 224 251 _ ... (0) ... / / \ .. / / . ) .. V__/_ Linux Powered! Registered Linux User #355382 * If you read the same things as others and say the same things they say, then you're perceived as intelligent. I'm a bit more independent and radical and consider intelligence the ability to think about matters on your own and ask a lot of skeptical questions to get at the real truth, not just what you're told it is. Apple's Inventor - Steve Wozniak 2006 * *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Suggestions Please for: CMS / E-commerce Solutions
Micky Hulse wrote: You might want to look at these sites: http://www.cmsmatrix.org/ http://start.websitebaker.org/en/introduction.html Doh, just noticed I pasted the website baker url in the wrong spot, I meant to suggest these two sites: http://www.cmsmatrix.org/ http://www.opensourcecms.com/ :) -- Wishlists: http://snipurl.com/1gqpj Switch: http://browsehappy.com/ BCC?: http://snipurl.com/w6f8 My: http://del.icio.us/mhulse *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Accessible Photoshop and flash
Marvin, I for one don't really understand what it is that you are trying to achieve, but then that may partly be the language barrier! Regards, Mike -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of marvin hunkin Sent: Monday, May 28, 2007 3:04 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Accessible Photoshop and flash Hi. doing certificate iv in web site development at my local college. now for second semester, will be using photo shop, to manipulate 2 and 3 d objects. now, is there any way to do this accessibly with jaws? also, need to use flash, to create 2 and 3 d buttons, objects, etc. is there an accessible way to code this? let me know asap. cheers Marvin. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] OT on list
Hi folks Is it just me. or have a whole slew of recent posts been OT? CMS: there's a CMS list just for you guys. Please use it... Photoshop and JAWS: sorry, Marvin, but that's just OT for this list. Can we get back to the on topic issues of Web Standards, perchance? Check the guidelines - if you you need to preface a post with, This is probably OT, but... then it is. So don't post... Thanks N ___ omnivision. websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Content Management issue ?
Hi Mark, Have you looked at Karova? www.karova.com It is XML/XSLT based, so that may be an issue if you want a PHP based solution, but you can get in and edit the XSLTs and of course CSS, so it is pretty flexible and compliant. Not sure about the Protx support. One thing to be aware of is that it is a hosted solution, and not available to install on your own server as far as I know. It has been used for some large clients such as World Wildlife Fund (not our client unfortunately), and we used it to build a store at the following URL if you want a look: http://retailstore.haptic.co.uk I think they were working on a PHP-based version, and are working on more friendly URLs - so might be worth a look. Cheers, Nick -- Nick Roper partner logical elements Mark Hedley wrote: Keeping an eye on it myself. Just a shame their doesn't seem to be support for non-native Commerce yet. Hopefully development will grow for UK and other territories soon : ) Mark Hedley Web Development Manager Mayborn Baby Child Division http://www.tommeetippee.com Jackel International Limited is a company registered in England Wales (registered number 1894022). Our registered office is at Dudley Lane, Cramlington, Northumberland, NE23 7RH. Tel (0191) 2501864, Fax (0191) 2501727. Sangenic International Limited is a company registered in England Wales (registered number 1308939). Our registered office is at Dudley Lane, Cramlington, Northumberland, NE23 7RH. Tel (0191) 2501864, Fax (0191) 2501727. Jackel International and Sangenic International are part of the Mayborn Group This transmission and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the named addressee(s). If you are not the addressee, please do not read, copy, use or disclose this transmission and notify us immediately by telephone (0191) 2501864 or by reply. Please then delete this transmission from your system. You should also be aware that all incoming e-mails are monitored for system security purposes. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tate Johnson Sent: 29 May 2007 01:47 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Content Management issue ? On Tue, 29 May 2007 10:50:15 +1200 Robin Gorry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have head very good things about silver stripe http://www.silverstripe.com/home/ This is an open source cms writen in php which you are able to cusomise and manipulate. Simple. Intuitive and user-friendly Flexible. MVC framework Scalable. From 1 page to a million Fast. As responsive as a desktop app thanks to native Ajax support Standards Compliant. Fully XHTML compliant Modular. Easy to extend Template Freedom. No restrictions on the look and feel of your site Open source. It's free in every sense of the word! (BSD) Cross platform (Windows/Linux/Mac) and easy to install (PHP based Silverstripe is fantastic. It's relatively new in relation to other CMS's, but it sure has a lot of potential. Primarily, it's developed by a NZ company and was originally a closed source, proprietary CMS. It's extremely flexible for developers/designers to create custom templates/sites. The community is growing larger, and the SS staff are quite helpful. They provide a forum and IRC channel for support and discussion. More importantly, it's easy for clients/content writers to create pages, the interface is quite intuitive. There are a few quirks here and there, no official blog/news module exists, but there is a guide/tutorial for how to create one. The next release (v2.1) will feature a tonne of improvements and those extra modules too. It's exciting times ahead for Silverstripe, and I certainly encourage you all to keep your eye on it. I'm actually developing a web site using Silverstripe at the moment, first time :) Cheers, Tate Johnson *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] need help with tabular interface
On 29 May 2007, at 02:10:02, Sander Aarts wrote: I'm glad the designers I work with know that rounded corners can be a real pain in the ass, so they always ask before implementing them in the design. I want your designers! ;-) -- Nick Fitzsimons http://www.nickfitz.co.uk/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
On 5/25/07, David Dorward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Not causing validation issues does not make them fine; even if the vast majority of user agents don't respect it, img / in an HTML document means An image element followed by a greater than sign. The HTML specification explicitly advises authors to avoid them: http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/appendix/notes.html#h-B.3.7 Interesting, but I don't understand how that section applies? How do you get from these constructs technically introduce no ambiguity in that section, to a self-closed image being An image element followed by a greater than sign? Especially since this case is explicitly shown in the compatibility guidelines (http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/#C_2). Is Vlad from Xstandard wrong when he said: if an authoring tool generates XHTML in a backwards compatible way, then there is no need to have a configuration to produce either HTML or XHTML. The backwards compatible XHTML will work in HTML and XHTML templates. (http://alastairc.ac/2007/02/wysiwyg-editor-spec-checklist/#comment-12741 ) Or is this a case of it doesn't quite comply to part of a spec but doesn't make any difference in practice? If it isn't, perhaps the W3C's HTML validator should be updated? Cheers, -Alastair *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
On 29 May 2007, at 12:50, Alastair Campbell wrote: On 5/25/07, David Dorward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Not causing validation issues does not make them fine; even if the vast majority of user agents don't respect it, img / in an HTML document means An image element followed by a greater than sign. The HTML specification explicitly advises authors to avoid them: http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/appendix/notes.html#h-B.3.7 Interesting, but I don't understand how that section applies? How do you get from these constructs technically introduce no ambiguity in that section, to a self-closed image being An image element followed by a greater than sign? Because, in an HTML document, an XHTML style img tag unambiguously means An image element followed by a greater than sign. Especially since this case is explicitly shown in the compatibility guidelines (http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/#C_2). ... because most browsers don't support img / correctly in HTML documents, you can write XHTML documents that are compatible with most HTML user agents (this is not the same as being compatible with HTML). Is Vlad from Xstandard wrong when he said: if an authoring tool generates XHTML in a backwards compatible way, then there is no need to have a configuration to produce either HTML or XHTML. The backwards compatible XHTML will work in HTML and XHTML templates. (http://alastairc.ac/2007/02/wysiwyg-editor-spec-checklist/ #comment-12741 ) Depends on your definition of work. It renders as the author intends in most HTML user agents. It doesn't mean what the author intends in anything that parses the HTML correctly. Or is this a case of it doesn't quite comply to part of a spec but No. The spec allows img /, it just means something different. doesn't make any difference in practice? W3 used to parse the construct correctly under HTML rules (when I used it from time to time). Since then, I think they have crippled its HTML handling to cope with the amount of bad markup out there. If it isn't, perhaps the W3C's HTML validator should be updated? Anywhere an img element is allowed in an HTML document, a greater than sign is also allowed. So the construct is valid and the validator should not claim otherwise. It just doesn't mean what the author intends. -- David Dorward http://dorward.me.uk/ http://blog.dorward.me.uk/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
On May 29, 2007, at 9:26 AM, David Dorward wrote: Because, in an HTML document, an XHTML style img tag unambiguously means An image element followed by a greater than sign. Sorry to be dense, I'm trying to grasp this concept. Does (at least strictly speaking) the inclusion of a forward slash within the tag of any element prevent the tag in question from being terminated? I guess my question is how a tag that has not been terminated (with ) can be said to be followed by anything at all? And further: ... because most browsers don't support img / correctly in HTML documents How is img / (or presumably br /) correctly supported? And which browsers do correctly support it? Thanks, Andrew 109B SE 4th Av Gainesville FL 32601 Cell: 352-870-6661 http://www.andrewmaben.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a well designed user interface, the user should not need instructions. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
On 29 May 2007, at 14:55, Andrew Maben wrote: On May 29, 2007, at 9:26 AM, David Dorward wrote: Because, in an HTML document, an XHTML style img tag unambiguously means An image element followed by a greater than sign. Sorry to be dense, I'm trying to grasp this concept. Does (at least strictly speaking) the inclusion of a forward slash within the tag of any element prevent the tag in question from being terminated? No. A forward slash terminates the tag (so the character is outside the tag, so its character data). In HTML all these mean the same thing: img / img imggt; (and title/ foo / means the same as title foo /title) ... because most browsers don't support img / correctly in HTML documents How is img / (or presumably br /) correctly supported? And which browsers do correctly support it? An image (or line break) followed by a character. So Hellobr / World should be rendered: Hello World (in HTML). The only browser I know of, off the top of my head, that gets it right is W3 (and as mentioned, I believe it was intentionally crippled to cope with fallout from Appendix C). Of course nsgmls and related programs also get it right. -- David Dorward http://dorward.me.uk/ http://blog.dorward.me.uk/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] Out of office - Stuart McPhail
Thank you for your email. I am out of the office until Monday 4th June. Stuart *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
Assistive technology off topic??? On Tue, May 29, 2007 11:52 am, Nick Gleitzman wrote: Hi folks Is it just me. or have a whole slew of recent posts been OT? CMS: there's a CMS list just for you guys. Please use it... Photoshop and JAWS: sorry, Marvin, but that's just OT for this list. Can we get back to the on topic issues of Web Standards, perchance? Check the guidelines - if you you need to preface a post with, This is probably OT, but... then it is. So don't post... Thanks N ___ omnivision. websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Stuart Foulstone. http://www.bigeasyweb.co.uk BigEasy Web Design 69 Flockton Court Rockingham Street Sheffield S1 4EB Tel. 07751 413451 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
On 5/29/07, David Dorward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Because, in an HTML document, an XHTML style img tag unambiguously means An image element followed by a greater than sign. I still can't see where it says that in the spec, do you need to know the SGML spec as well? It seems strange that the closing slash is taken as the close, rather than the greater than sign, is that in the HTML spec somewhere? Since this is either ill defined or not defined in the HTML spec so far (unless WHATWG tackled it?), I'd suggest that the method implied by XHTML compatibility guidelines might be a more suitable reference in future? the construct is valid and the validator should not claim otherwise. It just doesn't mean what the author intends. Given the mis-match in meaning that does not produce an error, surely it's something that should change then? Kind regards, -Alastair *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
Assistive Technology is by no means off topic when Web Standards are involved. On 5/29/07, Stuart Foulstone [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Assistive technology off topic??? On Tue, May 29, 2007 11:52 am, NickGleitzman wrote: Hi folks Is it just me. or have a whole slew of recent posts been OT? CMS: there's a CMS list just for you guys. Please use it... Photoshop and JAWS: sorry, Marvin, but that's just OT for this list. Can we get back to the on topic issues of Web Standards, perchance? Check the guidelines - if you you need to preface a post with, This is probably OT, but... then it is. So don't post... Thanks N ___ omnivision. websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- Stuart Foulstone. http://www.bigeasyweb.co.uk BigEasy Web Design 69 Flockton Court Rockingham Street Sheffield S1 4EB Tel. 07751 413451 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
Nick Gleitzman wrote: Photoshop and JAWS: sorry, Marvin, but that's just OT for this list. Stuart Foulstone wrote: Assistive technology off topic??? It's worth making the point: Don't get intimidated by this - JAWS is a perfectly legitimate thing to discuss here. Regards, Barney *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
Quoting Stuart Foulstone [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Assistive technology off topic??? How to use JAWS to work with Photoshop or similar apps to create/manipulate graphics seems a bit far from web standards, so I'd agree OT. P -- Patrick H. Lauke __ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com __ Co-lead, Web Standards Project (WaSP) Accessibility Task Force http://webstandards.org/ __ Take it to the streets ... join the WaSP Street Team http://streetteam.webstandards.org/ __ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
On 29 May 2007, at 15:58:53, Stuart Foulstone wrote: Assistive technology off topic??? Photoshop and JAWS: sorry, Marvin, but that's just OT for this list. Can we get back to the on topic issues of Web Standards, perchance? Use of assistive technology with desktop applications doesn't really have anything to do with Web Standards, surely? Remember, screen readers aren't web browsers... Regards, Nick. -- Nick Fitzsimons http://www.nickfitz.co.uk/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
I still can't see where it says that in the spec, do you need to know the SGML spec as well? It seems strange that the closing slash is taken as the close, rather than the greater than sign, is that in the HTML spec somewhere? http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/sgml/sgmldecl.html FEATURES, SHORTTAG YES ... Regards, Rimantas -- http://rimantas.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
On 5/29/07, Rimantas Liubertas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/sgml/sgmldecl.html FEATURES, SHORTTAG YES I guess from that I should deduce that I do need to know the SGML spec to know that a slash will terminate a tag? I hope HTML5 does away with this... -Alastair *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
Jamie Collins wrote: Assistive Technology is by no means off topic when Web Standards are involved. !? and Web Standards and Photoshop intersect exactly where? :-) -- Hassan Schroeder - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Webtuitive Design === (+1) 408-938-0567 === http://webtuitive.com opinion: webtuitive.blogspot.com dream. code. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
On 29 May 2007, at 16:14:53, Alastair Campbell wrote: On 5/29/07, David Dorward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Because, in an HTML document, an XHTML style img tag unambiguously means An image element followed by a greater than sign. I still can't see where it says that in the spec, do you need to know the SGML spec as well? Yes, HTML is an SGML application, as described in the spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/intro/sgmltut.html#h-3.1 Therefore a compliant parser must parse according to the rules of SGML. The spec does include an appendix: http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/appendix/notes.html#sgmlfeatures listing aspects of SGML that are poorly supported by existing user agents; however, that doesn't excuse or justify improper behaviour by parsers, and the entire appendix is informative, not normative. The specific SGML SHORTTAG construct under discusssion in this thread is included in the appendix at http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/appendix/notes.html#h-B.3.7 Cheers, Nick. -- Nick Fitzsimons http://www.nickfitz.co.uk/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
On 29 May 2007, at 16:20:28, Barney Carroll wrote: It's worth making the point: Don't get intimidated by this - JAWS is a perfectly legitimate thing to discuss here. Only in connection with its use in conjunction with a web browser. Would you argue that a discussion of the use of Jaws with Microsoft Excel (which is, judging by the manufacturer's FAQs, one of its commonest uses) is related to Web Standards? Regards, Nick. -- Nick Fitzsimons http://www.nickfitz.co.uk/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
On 29/05/07, Alastair Campbell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 5/29/07, David Dorward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Because, in an HTML document, an XHTML style img tag unambiguously means An image element followed by a greater than sign. I still can't see where it says that in the spec, do you need to know the SGML spec as well? Just in the same way you can't know XHTML if you have no knowledge of XML, you can't really know HTML 2-4.01 with no knowledge of SGML. You don't need to know all of SGML however, just the subset that is used for HTML. It seems strange that the closing slash is taken as the close, rather than the greater than sign, is that in the HTML spec somewhere? Yes, in the SGML declaration. Since this is either ill defined or not defined in the HTML spec so far (unless WHATWG tackled it?), I'd suggest that the method implied by XHTML compatibility guidelines might be a more suitable reference in future? Or the mechanism specified in the HTML 5 draft. But that's not even a WD yet, so it'll have to wait. the construct is valid and the validator should not claim otherwise. It just doesn't mean what the author intends. Given the mis-match in meaning that does not produce an error, surely it's something that should change then? HTML 5 will change it by no longer specifying that HTML is SGML. And just for fun, let me give you an example of three documents: uri:http://liorean.net/samplelayout.html uri:http://liorean.net/sgml-goodness.html uri:http://liorean.net/xhtmllayout.xhtml All of them are valid documents and except for DOCTYPE, XML prologue and XHTML namespace the document they describe is identical. -- David liorean Andersson *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
Nick Fitzsimons wrote: Would you argue that a discussion of the use of Jaws with Microsoft Excel (which is, judging by the manufacturer's FAQs, one of its commonest uses) is related to Web Standards? Only if the .csv was downloaded off the cybercom. A statement in the root post would easily be understood as JAWS is OT for users with no knowledge of whatever topic that was referring to. They shouldn't be put off. But I digress: Let's see how popular we can make this thread. A web standards list about grammar, oblique self-references and wilful misunderstanding, that's what we could all do with. Hehehe. Regards, Barney *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
If you read what i said properly you will understand what i said. Do you see the part that says'When Web Standards Are Involved'? I didnt mention photoshop anywere, i said when Web Standards are Involved. So since when does Photoshop mean Web Standards? Because i didn't say that. On 5/29/07, Hassan Schroeder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jamie Collins wrote: Assistive Technology is by no means off topic when Web Standards are involved. !? and Web Standards and Photoshop intersect exactly where? :-) -- Hassan Schroeder - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Webtuitive Design === (+1) 408-938-0567 === http://webtuitive.com opinion: webtuitive.blogspot.com dream. code. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] Firefox Wmode
Hello, Does anyone have any experience dealing with the bug in Firefox that disables mouseover events in Flash when the animation file is placed in an absolutely positioned element and the Wmode parameter of the animation is set to transparent or opaque? I've built a page where an animation is positioned beneath some other elements, and a button is not clickable in Firefox. Thanks, John *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] Web Accessibility Update from Shawn Henry, London, Tuesday 5 June
Hi All, Shawn Henry will be speaking about Web accessibility in London next week at a free event at the University of Westminster hosted by RNIB. Shawn will mostly talk about Web guidelines and standards, and also talk a little about the relationship between accessibility and usability and designing positive user experiences for people with disabilities. Title:Web Accessibility Update: What's New, WCAG 2.0, and Current Issues Date:Tuesday June 5th Time:6.45 so we can start at 7pm Venue:Department of Electronics, Communications and Software Engineering, Westminster University, New Cavendish Street campus Location: The campus is a short walk from Goodge Street tube Registration (free): http://wailondon.eventwax.com/whats-new-wcag-20-and-current-issues---sha wn-henry-web-accessibility-initiative Description: http://www.rnib.org.uk/wacblog/conferences/shawn-henry-from-wai-presents -whats-new-wcag-20-and-current-issues-tuesday-june-5th-london/ Hopefully see a few of you there. Henny www.rnib.org.uk/wacblog -- DISCLAIMER: NOTICE: The information contained in this email and any attachments is confidential and may be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient you should not use, disclose, distribute or copy any of the content of it or of any attachment; you are requested to notify the sender immediately of your receipt of the email and then to delete it and any attachments from your system. RNIB endeavours to ensure that emails and any attachments generated by its staff are free from viruses or other contaminants. However, it cannot accept any responsibility for any such which are transmitted. We therefore recommend you scan all attachments. Please note that the statements and views expressed in this email and any attachments are those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of RNIB. RNIB Registered Charity Number: 226227 Website: http://www.rnib.org.uk This message has been scanned for viruses by BlackSpider MailControl - www.blackspider.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
Thanks Liorean, On 5/29/07, liorean [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just in the same way you can't know XHTML if you have no knowledge of XML, you can't really know HTML 2-4.01 with no knowledge of SGML. You don't need to know all of SGML however, just the subset that is used for HTML. It seems strange that the closing slash is taken as the close, rather than the greater than sign, is that in the HTML spec somewhere? Yes, in the SGML declaration. Which someone linked to earlier, and I still can't translate to see anything on forward slashes... is there actually an SGML spec? You'd have thought it would be linked to from here: http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/intro/sgmltut.html or googlable with SGML spec, but no such luck. Cheers, -Alastair *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Web Accessibility Update from Shawn Henry, London, Tuesday 5 June
By an chance will Shawn's talk be available via web conferencing or telephone or podcast? On 5/29/07 11:19 AM, Swan, Henny [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, Shawn Henry will be speaking about Web accessibility in London next week at a free event at the University of Westminster hosted by RNIB. Shawn will mostly talk about Web guidelines and standards, and also talk a little about the relationship between accessibility and usability and designing positive user experiences for people with disabilities. Title:Web Accessibility Update: What's New, WCAG 2.0, and Current Issues Date:Tuesday June 5th Time:6.45 so we can start at 7pm Venue:Department of Electronics, Communications and Software Engineering, Westminster University, New Cavendish Street campus Location: The campus is a short walk from Goodge Street tube Registration (free): http://wailondon.eventwax.com/whats-new-wcag-20-and-current-issues---sha wn-henry-web-accessibility-initiative Description: http://www.rnib.org.uk/wacblog/conferences/shawn-henry-from-wai-presents -whats-new-wcag-20-and-current-issues-tuesday-june-5th-london/ Hopefully see a few of you there. Henny www.rnib.org.uk/wacblog *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
Jamie Collins wrote: If you read what i said properly you will understand what i said. If you read the original posting properly... :-) Do you see the part that says'When Web Standards Are Involved'? I didnt mention photoshop anywere, i said when Web Standards are Involved. To quote the OP: now for second semester, will be using photo shop, to manipulate 2 and 3 d objects. now, is there any way to do this accessibly with jaws? -- Hassan Schroeder - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Webtuitive Design === (+1) 408-938-0567 === http://webtuitive.com opinion: webtuitive.blogspot.com dream. code. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
On 29 May 2007, at 17:32:08, Alastair Campbell wrote: It seems strange that the closing slash is taken as the close, rather than the greater than sign, is that in the HTML spec somewhere? Yes, in the SGML declaration. Which someone linked to earlier, and I still can't translate to see anything on forward slashes... is there actually an SGML spec? You'd have thought it would be linked to from here: http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/intro/sgmltut.html or googlable with SGML spec, but no such luck. The SGML spec is ISO 8879:1986, but being ISO, they charge a fortune for you to see it :-( The topic under discussion is, as I mentioned in my earlier post, mentioned in HTML 4.01 at http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/appendix/notes.html#h-B.3.7 as being something with poor support in HTML user agents. Regards, Nick. -- Nick Fitzsimons http://www.nickfitz.co.uk/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
I think it would be more useful to try an work out where Marvin is coming from when he mentions those two programs. He's on a web design course and has some awareness of web standards and that it's good to support screen readers. Some of these courses are still teaching 'Save as HTML' and bingo you're done (perhaps with some tweaks), whereas I assume most people on this list have got all the basic concepts down and write all their code by hand and are used to using css to convey design. I'm guessing, and no offence to Marvin at all, that he's getting confused by the minefield of opinions that abound around the topic of web standards and is still working through the basic concepts and principles that we take for granted. I've not read the whole thread but I'm not sure anybody has actually tried to answer his questions. So, Marvin, Photoshop is for creating/editing graphics and sometimes designing a website. You code your website content with HTML, You then use the graphics/design created in photoshop via the CSS to style the HTML. JAWS is then used by some people to read the HTML out. Photoshop has nothing to do with web standards directly and JAWS compatibility is down to the quality of your HTML. That's probably an over simplified explanation but my point is instead of arguing about what's OT at least try and get it onT where possible. We're here to educate aswell as discuss. Rob Jamie Collins wrote: If you read what i said properly you will understand what i said. Do you see the part that says'When Web Standards Are Involved'? I didnt mention photoshop anywere, i said when Web Standards are Involved. So since when does Photoshop mean Web Standards? Because i didn't say that. On 5/29/07, *Hassan Schroeder* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jamie Collins wrote: Assistive Technology is by no means off topic when Web Standards are involved. !? and Web Standards and Photoshop intersect exactly where? :-) -- Hassan Schroeder - [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Webtuitive Design === (+1) 408-938-0567 === http://webtuitive.com opinion: webtuitive.blogspot.com http://webtuitive.blogspot.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
On 29/05/07, Alastair Campbell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 5/29/07, liorean [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It seems strange that the closing slash is taken as the close, rather than the greater than sign, is that in the HTML spec somewhere? Yes, in the SGML declaration. Which someone linked to earlier, and I still can't translate to see anything on forward slashes... is there actually an SGML spec? Yes. Linking it probably won't help you though. You'll soon understand why: http://www.iso.org/iso/en/CatalogueDetailPage.CatalogueDetail?CSNUMBER=16387scopelist= More useful would be the SGML Handbook or some summary site, such as uri:http://xml.coverpages.org//sgmlsyn/contents.htm You'd have thought it would be linked to from here: http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/intro/sgmltut.html or googlable with SGML spec, but no such luck. Well, I got more than enough matches on SGML and Standard. -- David liorean Andersson *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
On 5/29/07, Nick Fitzsimons [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The topic under discussion is, as I mentioned in my earlier post, mentioned in HTML 4.01 at http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/appendix/notes.html#h-B.3.7 as being something with poor support in HTML user agents. Which I read, thank you, but unless I'm being particularly thick (quite possible, it was a long weekend ;), I can't see how that affects terminating characters. Without the SGML spec, what is a NET character? It's just frustrating not to be able to get to the source and find out what these things are. Further googling lead to these which actually explain the issue, so for anyone else who was confused: http://www.rikkertkoppes.com/thoughts/2005/01/27/ http://lachy.id.au/log/2005/04/xhtml-future Cheers, -Alastair *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Web Accessibility Update from Shawn Henry, London, Tuesday 5 June
I'll be there. Anyone else? Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Swan, Henny Sent: 29 May 2007 17:19 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Web Accessibility Update from Shawn Henry, London, Tuesday 5 June Hi All, Shawn Henry will be speaking about Web accessibility in London next week at a free event at the University of Westminster hosted by RNIB. Shawn will mostly talk about Web guidelines and standards, and also talk a little about the relationship between accessibility and usability and designing positive user experiences for people with disabilities. Title:Web Accessibility Update: What's New, WCAG 2.0, and Current Issues Date:Tuesday June 5th Time:6.45 so we can start at 7pm Venue:Department of Electronics, Communications and Software Engineering, Westminster University, New Cavendish Street campus Location: The campus is a short walk from Goodge Street tube Registration (free): http://wailondon.eventwax.com/whats-new-wcag-20-and-current-issues---sha wn-henry-web-accessibility-initiative Description: http://www.rnib.org.uk/wacblog/conferences/shawn-henry-from-wai-presents -whats-new-wcag-20-and-current-issues-tuesday-june-5th-london/ Hopefully see a few of you there. Henny www.rnib.org.uk/wacblog -- DISCLAIMER: NOTICE: The information contained in this email and any attachments is confidential and may be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient you should not use, disclose, distribute or copy any of the content of it or of any attachment; you are requested to notify the sender immediately of your receipt of the email and then to delete it and any attachments from your system. RNIB endeavours to ensure that emails and any attachments generated by its staff are free from viruses or other contaminants. However, it cannot accept any responsibility for any such which are transmitted. We therefore recommend you scan all attachments. Please note that the statements and views expressed in this email and any attachments are those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of RNIB. RNIB Registered Charity Number: 226227 Website: http://www.rnib.org.uk This message has been scanned for viruses by BlackSpider MailControl - www.blackspider.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
The bottom line is, yes its ok to discuss Jaws as long as its related to Web Standards. Obviously photoshop has no relation to Web Standards, so the point of this topic is useless, next time reporting the issue to an Admin may be a better idea :) On 5/29/07, Hassan Schroeder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jamie Collins wrote: If you read what i said properly you will understand what i said. If you read the original posting properly... :-) Do you see the part that says'When Web Standards Are Involved'? I didnt mention photoshop anywere, i said when Web Standards are Involved. To quote the OP: now for second semester, will be using photo shop, to manipulate 2 and 3 d objects. now, is there any way to do this accessibly with jaws? -- Hassan Schroeder - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Webtuitive Design === (+1) 408-938-0567 === http://webtuitive.com opinion: webtuitive.blogspot.com dream. code. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Web Accessibility Update from Shawn Henry, London, Tuesday 5 June
I'll be blogging it in the RNIB Web Access Centre blog (www.rnib.org.uk/wacblog) and am hoping to also podcast it after the event. Henny -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of McLaughlin, Gail G Sent: 29 May 2007 17:36 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Web Accessibility Update from Shawn Henry, London, Tuesday 5 June By an chance will Shawn's talk be available via web conferencing or telephone or podcast? On 5/29/07 11:19 AM, Swan, Henny [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi All, Shawn Henry will be speaking about Web accessibility in London next week at a free event at the University of Westminster hosted by RNIB. Shawn will mostly talk about Web guidelines and standards, and also talk a little about the relationship between accessibility and usability and designing positive user experiences for people with disabilities. Title:Web Accessibility Update: What's New, WCAG 2.0, and Current Issues Date:Tuesday June 5th Time:6.45 so we can start at 7pm Venue:Department of Electronics, Communications and Software Engineering, Westminster University, New Cavendish Street campus Location: The campus is a short walk from Goodge Street tube Registration (free): http://wailondon.eventwax.com/whats-new-wcag-20-and-current-issues---s ha wn-henry-web-accessibility-initiative Description: http://www.rnib.org.uk/wacblog/conferences/shawn-henry-from-wai-presen ts -whats-new-wcag-20-and-current-issues-tuesday-june-5th-london/ Hopefully see a few of you there. Henny www.rnib.org.uk/wacblog *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- DISCLAIMER: NOTICE: The information contained in this email and any attachments is confidential and may be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient you should not use, disclose, distribute or copy any of the content of it or of any attachment; you are requested to notify the sender immediately of your receipt of the email and then to delete it and any attachments from your system. RNIB endeavours to ensure that emails and any attachments generated by its staff are free from viruses or other contaminants. However, it cannot accept any responsibility for any such which are transmitted. We therefore recommend you scan all attachments. Please note that the statements and views expressed in this email and any attachments are those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of RNIB. RNIB Registered Charity Number: 226227 Website: http://www.rnib.org.uk This message has been scanned for viruses by BlackSpider MailControl - www.blackspider.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Firefox Wmode
Have you checked the adobe site for info? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John Gribben Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 12:28 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Firefox Wmode Hello, Does anyone have any experience dealing with the bug in Firefox that disables mouseover events in Flash when the animation file is placed in an absolutely positioned element and the Wmode parameter of the animation is set to transparent or opaque? I've built a page where an animation is positioned beneath some other elements, and a button is not clickable in Firefox. Thanks, John *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
On 5/29/07, Hassan Schroeder [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jamie Collins wrote: If you read what i said properly you will understand what i said. If you read the original posting properly... :-) Wouldn't that make the point and topic of this e-mail off topic? Do you see the part that says'When Web Standards Are Involved'? I didnt mention photoshop anywere, i said when Web Standards are Involved. To quote the OP: now for second semester, will be using photo shop, to manipulate 2 and 3 d objects. now, is there any way to do this accessibly with jaws? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Firefox Wmode
Mark Hedley Web Development Manager Mayborn Baby Child Division http://www.tommeetippee.com http://www.tommeetippee.com/ Jackel International Limited is a company registered in England Wales (registered number 1894022). Our registered office is at Dudley Lane, Cramlington, Northumberland, NE23 7RH. Tel (0191) 2501864, Fax (0191) 2501727. Sangenic International Limited is a company registered in England Wales (registered number 1308939). Our registered office is at Dudley Lane, Cramlington, Northumberland, NE23 7RH. Tel (0191) 2501864, Fax (0191) 2501727. Jackel International and Sangenic International are part of the Mayborn Group This transmission and any attachments are confidential and are intended solely for the named addressee(s). If you are not the addressee, please do not read, copy, use or disclose this transmission and notify us immediately by telephone (0191) 2501864 or by reply. Please then delete this transmission from your system. You should also be aware that all incoming e-mails are monitored for system security purposes. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of ByteDreams Sent: 29 May 2007 18:36 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] Firefox Wmode Have you checked the adobe site for info? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John Gribben Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 12:28 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Firefox Wmode Hello, Does anyone have any experience dealing with the bug in Firefox that disables mouseover events in Flash when the animation file is placed in an absolutely positioned element and the Wmode parameter of the animation is set to transparent or opaque? I've built a page where an animation is positioned beneath some other elements, and a button is not clickable in Firefox. Thanks, John *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Firefox Wmode
Have you tried giving the element a z-index? I used to have similar issues with a menu which displayed over a flash element. Using a z-index solved this. Hope that's useful? Regards, Mark Hedley Web Development Manager Tommee Tippee http://www.tommeetippee.com/ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of ByteDreams Sent: 29 May 2007 18:36 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] Firefox Wmode Have you checked the adobe site for info? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John Gribben Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 12:28 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Firefox Wmode Hello, Does anyone have any experience dealing with the bug in Firefox that disables mouseover events in Flash when the animation file is placed in an absolutely positioned element and the Wmode parameter of the animation is set to transparent or opaque? I've built a page where an animation is positioned beneath some other elements, and a button is not clickable in Firefox. Thanks, John *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Firefox Wmode
John wrote: Hello, Does anyone have any experience dealing with the bug in Firefox that disables mouseover events in Flash when the animation file is placed in an absolutely positioned element and the Wmode parameter of the animation is set to transparent or opaque? I've built a page where an animation is positioned beneath some other elements, and a button is not clickable in Firefox. Thanks, John --- Do you have other flash items on the page? We had a problem like this while building Yahoo! Tech. We played around with z-index elements for days. Eventually, we discovered an overlapping flash module that was actually throwing a transparent layer above other elements. While the bad flash movie was fairly small, it had animated sections that grew and caused the problem. Also go through your javascript and look for anything that is creating a container with z-index that could be causing an overlap. I hope that helps Ted Drake www.last-child.com http://www.last-child.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Firefox Wmode
Just set the element with a z-index and the problem will be solved. Cheers, Mark From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ted Drake Sent: 29 May 2007 19:27 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] Firefox Wmode John wrote: Hello, Does anyone have any experience dealing with the bug in Firefox that disables mouseover events in Flash when the animation file is placed in an absolutely positioned element and the Wmode parameter of the animation is set to transparent or opaque? I've built a page where an animation is positioned beneath some other elements, and a button is not clickable in Firefox. Thanks, John --- Do you have other flash items on the page? We had a problem like this while building Yahoo! Tech. We played around with z-index elements for days. Eventually, we discovered an overlapping flash module that was actually throwing a transparent layer above other elements. While the bad flash movie was fairly small, it had animated sections that grew and caused the problem. Also go through your javascript and look for anything that is creating a container with z-index that could be causing an overlap. I hope that helps Ted Drake www.last-child.com http://www.last-child.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] need help with tabular interface
Nick Fitzsimons schreef: On 29 May 2007, at 02:10:02, Sander Aarts wrote: I'm glad the designers I work with know that rounded corners can be a real pain in the ass, so they always ask before implementing them in the design. I want your designers! ;-) Well, it's only because they know that otherwise I'd have to punish them real hard ;-) *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
My apologies to the group... I was not aware of the CMS list. Is there a way to have the entire post, http://www.mail-archive.com/wsg@webstandardsgroup.org/msg28689.html ported over to the [WSG-CMS] list? Regards, Kevin. On 5/29/07, Nick Gleitzman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi folks Is it just me. or have a whole slew of recent posts been OT? CMS: there's a CMS list just for you guys. Please use it... Photoshop and JAWS: sorry, Marvin, but that's just OT for this list. Can we get back to the on topic issues of Web Standards, perchance? Check the guidelines - if you you need to preface a post with, This is probably OT, but... then it is. So don't post... Thanks N ___ omnivision. websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] OT on list
Where on the site do you sign up for the CMS List? I am also after support from people in this list. Cheers, Mark From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kevin Ross Sent: 29 May 2007 20:04 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] OT on list My apologies to the group... I was not aware of the CMS list. Is there a way to have the entire post, http://www.mail-archive.com/wsg@webstandardsgroup.org/msg28689.html ported over to the [WSG-CMS] list? Regards, Kevin. On 5/29/07, Nick Gleitzman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi folks Is it just me. or have a whole slew of recent posts been OT? CMS: there's a CMS list just for you guys. Please use it... Photoshop and JAWS: sorry, Marvin, but that's just OT for this list. Can we get back to the on topic issues of Web Standards, perchance? Check the guidelines - if you you need to preface a post with, This is probably OT, but... then it is. So don't post... Thanks N ___ omnivision. websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
Nick Fitzsimons schreef: On 29 May 2007, at 16:20:28, Barney Carroll wrote: Would you argue that a discussion of the use of Jaws with Microsoft Excel (which is, judging by the manufacturer's FAQs, one of its commonest uses) is related to Web Standards? No, because MS and Web Standards ar enot related at all ;-) ...oh, sorry... *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] OT on list
Hi Mark, You can sign up for the CMS list by logging into WSG at http://webstandardsgroup.org/manage/login_edit.cfm then set your preferences to Full CMS list or CMS list in digest mode. Regards, Elaine http://www.webdandy.co.uk *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
Mark Hedley wrote: Where on the site do you sign up for the CMS List? I am also after support from people in this list. Yeah, the CMS list is hard to find. I signed-up for it when I signed-up for this list... Other than that, I have not found any reference to the CMS list on the net. I would love to see a webpage that talks about the CMS list... It would be a great way to spread the word about the WSG-CMS list. I emailed WSG tech support about this, but have yet to hear back from anyone. :) So, anyone know of a webpage that talks about the WSG-CMS and how one would become a member of that listserv? Thanks! M -- Wishlists: http://snipurl.com/1gqpj Switch: http://browsehappy.com/ BCC?: http://snipurl.com/w6f8 My: http://del.icio.us/mhulse *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
Alastair Campbell wrote: On 5/29/07, Rimantas Liubertas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/sgml/sgmldecl.html FEATURES, SHORTTAG YES I guess from that I should deduce that I do need to know the SGML spec to know that a slash will terminate a tag? I hope HTML5 does away with this... HTML5 disposes of the myth that HTML is an application of SGML, so you don't need to understand SGML at all. In fact, in HTML5, the trailing slash is explicitly permitted for void elements, though it's not necessary. Void elements (formerly known as empty elements in SGML) are elements like br, img, meta, etc. Thus, in HTML5, both img and img/ are permitted and mean the same thing. The slash is ignored by the parser. However, the slash is not permitted for non-empty elements. e.g. p/ is not allowed in HTML, though it is in XHTML because XML rules apply. -- Lachlan Hunt http://lachy.id.au/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list
Stuart Foulstone wrote: Assistive technology off topic? Barney Carroll wrote: It's worth making the point: Don't get intimidated by this - JAWS is a perfectly legitimate thing to discuss here. When it's used to access Photoshop - which in my experience doesn't have a whole lot to do with Web Standards - yes, it's OT. Just to fill in a small blank for those who don't know: Marvin, who asked the original question, is blind, so the use of JAWS is immensely more relevant to him than it is to we sighted members. But the simple fact remains, that while I hope that Marvin can get the help and advice he needs, this ain't the place to ask. Barney Carroll also wrote: But I digress: Let's see how popular we can make this thread. A web standards list about grammar, oblique self-references and wilful misunderstanding, that's what we could all do with. Hehehe. You guys crack me up. Anyone like to hear what I did on my holidays? N ___ omnivision. websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: self-closing tags in HTML, was: [WSG] A CMS for POSH sites?
Alastair Campbell wrote: On 5/29/07, Nick Fitzsimons [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The topic under discussion is, as I mentioned in my earlier post, mentioned in HTML 4.01 at http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/appendix/notes.html#h-B.3.7 as being something with poor support in HTML user agents. Which I read, thank you, but unless I'm being particularly thick (quite possible, it was a long weekend ;), I can't see how that affects terminating characters. Without the SGML spec, what is a NET character? It's just frustrating not to be able to get to the source and find out what these things are. SGML and HTML Explained by Martin Bryan [1] will explain everything you need to know about SGML. In particular, chapter 4 explains the SHORTTAG NET features. Figure 4.4 [2] lists the default delimiter characters from the reference concrete syntax, which includes: / NET Null end-tag That can be set in the SGML declaration, but because it's not explicitly set in HTML4, it uses the default. [1] http://www.is-thought.co.uk/book/ [2] http://www.is-thought.co.uk/book/sgml-4.htm#Fig4-4 -- Lachlan Hunt http://lachy.id.au/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] OT on list - ADMIN - THREAD CLOSED
Enough with the discussion on off topic on topic. Causing far to much green house gas emissions. Thanks Russ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] need help with tabular interface
Ive been following the sliding doors II article and have it working somewhat well. However I cant see the reason for the 1st set of decendent selectors below. The second set with the anchor tag is used to create the current link state but I dont see what the first set is for. The first selector in comma separated pairs are used to id in the body tag. Can someone explain this? || http://alistapart.com/d/slidingdoors2/v1/ex10a.html |*#home #nav-home, #news #nav-news, #products #nav-products, #about #nav-about, #contact #nav-contact* { background-position:0% -150px; border-width:0; } *#home #nav-home a, #news #nav-news a, #products #nav-products a, #about #nav-about a, #contact #nav-contact a* { background-position:100% -150px; color:#333; padding-bottom:5px; } thanks kevin mcmonagle | *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
[WSG] WCAG 2.0
Hi all. This one didn't make it to the Reccomended readings, but it seems well worth to me: http://accessites.org/site/2007/05/wcag2-woeful-to-wonderful-in-one-easy-draft/ djn -- - Dejan Kozina Dolina 346 (TS) - I-34018 Italy tel./fax: +39 040 228 436 - cell.: +39 348 7355 225 skype: dejankozina http://www.kozina.com/ - e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
FW: RE: Re: [WSG] Accessible Photoshop and flash
From: Daniel Longstaff [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: marvin hunkin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Re: [WSG] Accessible Photoshop and flash Date: Wed, 30 May 2007 11:03:13 +0930 Hi Marvin I'm not quite sure if you understand what will be required in these subjects. Photoshop and Flash are only the tools being used in these subjects. The actual assessment is creating and manipulating visual objects. For example: 1. In 4MDI you need to be able to capture a number of photographic images using a digital camera, then use photoshop to manipulate these images. This involves brightness, contrast, cropping, colour depth, quality, compression, editting the photo etc. It also involves you be able to create a images and buttons that can be used in websites. 2. In 4M2D you need to create 2D animations using Flash. Once again this is all visual and requires little coding. The advanced subject involves action script. Regards Daniel -Original Message- From: marvin hunkin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, 30 May 2007 10:36 AM To: Daniel Longstaff Subject: FW: Re: [WSG] Accessible Photoshop and flash From: Robert O'Rourke [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: marvin hunkin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [WSG] Accessible Photoshop and flash Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 10:13:50 +0100 marvin hunkin wrote: Hi. doing certificate iv in web site development at my local college. now for second semester, will be using photo shop, to manipulate 2 and 3 d objects. now, is there any way to do this accessibly with jaws? also, need to use flash, to create 2 and 3 d buttons, objects, etc. is there an accessible way to code this? let me know asap. cheers Marvin. Hi Marvin, Firstly with regards to using photoshop it has nothing to do with website accessibility in terms of jaws unless you are putting the website text into the image which is bad practice for larger blocks of text. Any text contained in images needs to be in the HTML or in the alt attribute of img tags. Basically what a lot of people doing web design do these days is design their site in photoshop including the text, the backgrounds, any icons etc... and then slice that image up in such a way that they can recreate the design by using css. So long as you maintain the separation between the content (all text and images) and the design (the visual representation on screen e.g. background colours, fonts etc...) then your site should be accessible. Flash is currently not accessible to Jaws or any screen readers although there are methods for only sending it to the people who can use it. Using flash for buttons is a nice way to create animations however it is now an old practice. It's better to use animated gifs as link backgrounds so you can change them via css when you hover over a link. Saying that you should do what you have to for your course (learning flash is useful) but ask your tutor about accessibility and the use of flash so you know what to consider when using it. Rob Hi Daniel. could you please read this and pass it on to lowan and the other members of your team. got some responses from some of the blind mailling lists, regarding web accessability, photoshop and flash. cheers Marvin. _ Advertisement: Show me the money! Upgrade your pay at www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eexecutive%2Ese ek%2Ecom%2Eau%2Fjobsearch%2F%3Ftracking%3Dsk%3Ahet%3Ase%3Anine%3A0%3Ahot %3Atext_t=763838044_r=seek_may07_upgradepay_m=EXT Hi. this is what i got from my lecturer. if any one has done these subjects, using jaws or any other screen reader let me know. cheers marvin. _ Advertisement: Your Future Starts Here. Dream it? Then be it! Find it at www.seek.com.au http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Eseek%2Ecom%2Eau%2F%3Ftracking%3Dsk%3Ahet%3Ask%3Anine%3A0%3Ahot%3Atext_t=763838044_r=seek_may07_futurestartshere_m=EXT *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Site Review (www.richardson.co.nz)
www.richardson.co.nz In Firefox 2/Opera on Windows the lightbox images show 'null' as the caption. All the best. This email with any attachments is confidential and may be subject to legal privilege. If it is not intended for you please reply immediately, destroy it and do not copy, disclose or use it in any way. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: FW: RE: Re: [WSG] Accessible Photoshop and flash
Subject: FW: Re: [WSG] Accessible Photoshop and flash Flash is currently not accessible to Jaws or any screen readers although there are methods for only sending it to the people who can use it. Rob As far as I understood, the latest version of Adobe Flash *is* accessible to Jaws and Windows-Eyes, on Windows-based operating systems, through MSAA (Microsoft Active Accessibility). http://www.adobe.com/resources/accessibility/flash8/author.html Kat *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***