Re: Using CSS instead of JS for accessibility (was Re: [WSG] CSS Expandable Menu)

2010-06-29 Thread daniel a. thornbury
I used to use cssplay menus 6+ years ago but they're not the friendliest or 
most compliant to work with. 

I really like superfish - i've been using that for a few years with no problems 
at all. and I find it very easy to customise.

I haven't really drilled down on it but it degrades nicely - works well in IE 
without any weird conditionals - and all my sites are XHTML strict compliant. 

- daniel

On 29/06/2010, at 8:21 PM, David Dorward wrote:

 On 29 Jun 2010, at 11:04, wrote:
 I'd recommend using one from
 The trick is deciding which one to use, really. =)
 Having taken a quick look, I'd run a mile from them.
 The first one I looked at was missing and pointed me somewhere else, which 
 assured me that I've love a newer version and directed me to
 It was wrong, I don't love it. It seems to have all the problems I described 
 earlier (although it does, at least, bother to have basic links at the top (I 
 wonder how many people bother to put something useful that that can 
 substitute for the menu on those pages…)
 lia href=../menu/index.htmlDEMOS!--[if gte IE 
 !--[if lte IE 6]tabletrtd![endif]--
 This hideous excuse for markup can't be worth removing the dependancy on JS, 
 can it? (Especially since you need to implement the same fallbacks anyway!)
 David Dorward
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2009-09-13 Thread daniel a. thornbury

Well, it's fortunate that this is not an English validation list,  
because so many of the posters would fail abysmally. Having worked at  
an RTO I'm curious how someone involved in training a Certificate IV  
level course could have such poor spelling and grammar. I do, at  
least, admire someone involved in web training to be enthusiastic abut  
adopting some standards compliant training.

Marvin: Your banner is the tag that is not closed - make the following  
correction and all is well (as far as the validator is concerned).

div id=banner
h1 Corvette Veterans Club/h1


div id=content class=content

The errors at the bottom occur because the validator reaches the end  
of the document, finding closing tags for the encapsulating parent  
tags, without ever finding the close for that div.

~ daniel

On 13/09/2009, at 8:24 PM, Alan Coleman wrote:

This guy should not be allowed anywhere near a computer let alone code
He gets everyone else to fix his stuff ups.


-Original Message-
[] On

Behalf Of Marvin Hunkin
Sent: Sunday, 13 September 2009 3:44 PM

well thanks for that.
got my css vallidated.
now can you help.
vallidating another student project.
and cannot seem to find the errors.
will paste my contents of the text file and the vallidation error  

can you help and to help me to locate where the problem is.
cheers Marvin.

!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC -//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN;
html xmlns=;
meta http-equiv=Content-Type content=text/html;  
charset=iso-8859-1 /

titleCorvette Veterans Club Obituary Three/title
link href=../styles/styles.css rel=stylesheet type=text/css /
meta name=keywords content=Corvette Veterans Club /
meta name=description content=Corvette Veterans Club /
!--#include file=../javascript/ships.js --
p a name=Top/a /p
div id=entire class=entire
div id=banner
h1 Corvette Veterans Club/h1
div id=content class=content
h2Obituary Three/h2

pimg src=../images/OldMan3.jpg alt=Corvette Veterans Club  

Three Logo width=123 height=122 / /p

pWelcome to the Corvette Veterans Club Obituary Three Page.  Read
 about Corvette Veterans who have died while serving in armed combat  

 World War Two./p

h1Obituary: Alice DeWittbr /

pSagamore Hills- Alice DeWitt, 88, a nurse in combat hospitals  
World War II and an associate director of the former St. Alexis  
nursing school, died Monday at Marymount Hospital in Garfield  

pShe was the wife of the late Dr. Paul DeWitt, a pathologist for the
Summit County medical examiner's office. He died in a car accident  
in 1980,

16 years after they married./p
pShe was born Alice Koprowski in Cleveland. She enlisted in the  
Army Nurse
Corps in 1942 and over the next three years worked in hospitals in  

in northern Africa; Marseilles, France; and Palermo, Sicily./p
pIn 1991, she told her local paper, The News Leader, that while  
she was in

the hospital in Bizerte, it came under attack from planes dropping
pYou have a second nature at times like that, she said. You  
freeze, not
even thinking about how you could have been hurt until after it's  
over. When

it finally was over, everybody headed for the latrines./p
pShe received several service medals for her work./p
pAfter the war, DeWitt graduated from nursing school, then earned a
master's degree in education from John Carroll University. She  
retired when

the St. Alexis nursing school closed./p
pShe was a member of St. Stanislaus Catholic Church in Cleveland  
and was
active in several church and arts charities. She regularly rescued  
and cared

for stray and sick animals before finding homes for them./p

pa href=; title=Search For More  
World War
Two Corvette Ships Obituaries On Altavista Australia  

For More World War Two Corvette Sites On Altavista Australia/a /p
p a href=#Top target=_topTop Of Page/a /p
pa href=../html/obituaryTwo.html title=Obituary Two
div id=nav class=nav
p a href=index.html title=Corvette Veterans Club
br / a href=events.html title=Corvette Veterans Club Upcoming  

br / a href=stories.html title=Corvette Veterans Club Stories
br / a href=history.html title=Corvette Veterans Club History
br / a href=obituaries.html title=Corvette Veterans Club  

br / a href=links.html title=Corvette Veterans Club Links
br / a href=site.html title=Corvette Veterans Club Site Map
target=_topSite Map/a
br / a href=chat.html title=Corvette Veterans Club Chat Room
target=_topChat Room/a
br / a href=contact.html title=Corvette 

Re: [WSG] My best practice HTML sheet

2009-06-25 Thread daniel a. thornbury

Very useful!

...but I would love the PDF or ODT versions to be available so I can  
print it up to stick onto the wall for quick-reference (and to make me  
look a little smarter)...

On 26/06/2009, at 5:28 AM, Keryx Web wrote:

Hello all!

I have updated my best practice table at

I've switched from XHTML to HTML and I've added an experimental  
layout with rotated column headers in Firefox 3.5 (JS required, but  
progressive enhancement is used).

Please report any content issues.

Please report any problems in FFox 3.5.

Known issue: The checkmarks (✓) do not work in MSIE or Webkit based  
browsers. It does not make the table less understandable though.

Keryx Web (Lars Gunther)

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Re: [WSG] Box model in IE7

2009-04-24 Thread daniel a. thornbury

On 24/04/2009, at 7:47 PM, Rimantas Liubertas wrote:
And there is NOTHING wrong with pixel sizes.

On 2009/04/24 12:47 (GMT+0300) Rimantas Liubertas composed:
On the contrary, everything is wrong with pixel sizing fonts,  
because any
size in px totally disregards the size the visitor has set in his  


I wouldn't agree with Felix's statement at all, and tend to think  
Rimantas is correct - there is NOTHING wrong with px font sizes. They  
are not absolute and browsers are able to modify the size without any  
problems. You are merely suggesting the font size. i.e.: increasing  
the preferred font size in the browser still adjusts pxs - if the  
browser does not behave this way then it's a browser problem, not the  

Likewise, font sizes are irrelevant for accessibility. All  
accessibility software and screen readers should be able to scale the  
fonts accordingly, if not then it's an issue with the accessibility  
software. It's easier to keep track of em and percentage sizes for  
site wide but px is

Joe Clarke gave a great presentation on this at @media 2007 titled  
When Web Accessibility Is Not Your Problem, notes available here:

~ daniel a. thornbury

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