Re: [WSG] Adobe Installation Nightm Mares

2011-12-09 Thread John Unsworth
Hi Marvin,

Two years ago I was using the subscription service for the CS
packages, and it all went terribly wonky. So I rang the help line -
hopeless - used the supplied assistance email address - also hopeless
- and then read with amusement that Adobe were in the process of
improving their customer service. I would hope by now they managed to
do that! But at the time I got results via the Get Satisfaction site.
Here's the Adobe link;

http://getsatisfaction.com/adobe/topics

Shortly after posting I got answers and problem solved. Not the same
issue you've encountered, but Get Satisfaction works as a public forum
and another user may have an answer for you.

Good luck Marv!

Cheers,
John Unsworth

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Re: [WSG] which programming or web development tools which works well with jaws

2011-08-18 Thread John Unsworth
Hey there Marvin,

I understand software like JAWS and NVDA
(http://www.nvda-project.org/) read out the entire screen activity of
a PC (as opposed to FANGS which only reads inside Firefox and
therefore only websites or at least browser based software) and as
such like an inaccessible website that is not coded with screen
readers (in this instance) in mind, then if JAWS or NVDA can't
translate what's on the PC screen then the software is lacking.

But I would of thought Windows with their own accessibility ambitions
would by now of considered their development platforms, and for that
matter Adobe as well.

However I assume you wouldn't be asking this question if experience
suggested otherwise!

What I wonder though is do you really need these advanced software
packages to do what you can achieve with a good text editor? And
wouldn't a simpler tools be less likely to cause issues?

Ian Lloyd in his Sitepoint Book Build your own web site the right way
using HTML  CSS recommends NoteTab (www.notetab.com) for Windows
users. It has a free lite version. There appear to be a number of
other free development tools online for Windows users, but by now were
discussing the merits of software and not web standards :)

My other suggestion would be to write to the guys behind NVDA (or join
the forum). They are blind computer developers and likely have some
experience that could assist you.

Hope this is helpful somehow and congrats on the study decision,

Cheers
John Unsworth

On 18 August 2011 15:52, Peter Mount i...@petermount.com wrote:
 You might want to look at Lynx as well.

 http://lynx.isc.org

 Peter Mount
 Web Development for Business
 Mobile: 0411 276602
 i...@petermount.com
 http://www.petermount.com

 On 19/08/2011, at 7:53 AM, Marvin Hunkin startrekc...@gmail.com wrote:

    hi.
 well enrolling in a diploma in website development.
 and developing a website.
 now what web site development tools, and which programming tools which works 
 best with Jaws?
 visual basic, visual web developer, c#, dream weaver, vs 2008, or 2010.
 which works best with jaws?
 marvin.
 ps: will take your more expertise in this area.


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Re: [WSG] major web site project

2011-08-10 Thread John Unsworth
Hey there Marvin,

When you first posted for suggestions for your site I did think that
the subject of the blind computer user was apt, but I was reluctant to
suggest it as you may of been reluctant to follow this path, concerned
you may get pigeonholed. But as you have now indeed settled on the
subject here is my suggestion.

Rather than a portal for web designers et al to services, information
etc. might I suggest an education site for non-web geeks. There maybe
site like this that exist, but most of the stuff I know of is either
technical or hosted on web industry sites. Of course if I view
information on the subject within that context it's not surprising.

Rather what I was thinking was, describing and drawing upon your
experience creating a site that illustrates to the lay person just
what the experience of browsing the web without perfect eyesight is
like. Now I accept that it's not likely the lay person will
intentionally look for such a site or even stumble across it generally
browsing. But for those of us in the WSG group trying to explain and
convince website owners the merit of incorporating accessibility
features and rather than referring to and citing those previously
mentioned sites, to refer to a site that they understand is describing
real experience...

Such a site I would suggest could include recordings of sample
passages read by your Windows Eyes software, and even a comparison of
site; the good and the bad. One idea that came to mind might be to
have a page that is completely dark, but as the user mouses over a
kind of peek-a-boo magnify glass reveals the text underneath,
attempting to depict what it would be like having to 'discover' the
page bit by bit as opposed to a visual glance.

Hope that is the sort of thing you were looking for and all the very
best with the project.

Kind regards,
John Unsworth


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Re: [WSG] major web site project

2011-08-10 Thread John Unsworth
Sorry folks, quick correction here.

Instead of 'education site for non-web geeks.' what I really meant was
'non-geek web users'.

All the best,

John Unsworth


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Re: [WSG] setting up visualf web developer with iis

2011-05-24 Thread John Unsworth
Hey there Marvin,

I'm sorry I can't help you at all with this, but if you will excuse me
for the benefit of other users who may not of had the opportunity to
'meet' you in the WSG list...

Just a quick reminder or heads up to members on the WSG list, Marvin
is a young blind developer who as his email address might suggest is
'boldly going where others have not been' (apologies Marvin if I've
mucked up the phrase, not quite the Star Trek boffin I gather you are
:-) )

So whilst his question has nothing to do with the usual mailing list
information, Marvin on these occasions has come to us as a sympathetic
forum as presumably finding the information he needs might not of been
as accessible as some of us take for granted.

Marvin, if I've overstepped the line (or indeed anyone else on the
list) one word and I'll pull my head in, but some past questions from
Marvin have had to have this information explained.

Cheers WSG'ers

John Unsworth

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Re: [WSG] Horizontal Menu Bar Help Needed

2011-03-28 Thread John Unsworth
Hi Emily,

Firstly the problem you describe might be your browser. I'm using
Safari on a Mac and the desired effect appears to occur, whether I use
the back button or click Home again. So this might be the reason your
not getting the expected effect.

Secondly, the standards group I would imagine are collectively having
kittens seeing all that table based layout rendered by Dreamweaver.
Whilst there is often some debate, on the whole most people employ a
list for navigation rather than a table, however I'm assuming the
whole page is a table layout and thus whilst I would encourage you to
reconsider, I'm not going to go into an entire rewrite. I would then
suggest to you it's time to learn some CSS.

Your Dreamweaver behaviours are embedded Javascript(s), added to which
all your presentation information, such as width and height are inline
to boot. What you want to strive for is plain simple HTML, with
externally linked CSS and JS files. This approach is sometimes
referred to as 'three layers'. That being Content (HTML), Presentation
(CSS) and finally Behaviours (Javascript).

Presuming this is not just a practice piece of work and the error your
getting is just within your browser, I don't think there is a simple
bit of 'code' that will fix this. Moving forward I can only suggest
you change your methods in line with the sentiments of the standards
group.

Personally if your starting out I can't recommend Ian Lloyd's 'Build
your website the right way, using HTML and CSS' from Sitepoint, and
'HTML Dog, The best-practice guide to XHTML  CSS' by Patrick
Griffiths enough.

All the best,
John Unsworth


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Re: [WSG] Site for Vision Impaired

2010-11-26 Thread John Unsworth
Hi Daniel,

It maybe has incorrectly become a by-word for accessibility, but web
standards are certainly your first step to provide sites for vision or
indeed other disability needs.

 I was wondering if any of you have done any work on sites for the visually
 impaired?

I have never specifically done a site for an audience explicitly identified
as visually impaired, I've has presumed that users of any site maybe
impaired and worked from that premise.

 What are the considerations I need to take into account with a project
like
 this? eg ability to change contrast, text size etc? Are there any good
 resources or advice you could share with me?

It is a considerable subject area and there are a vast array of tools and
resources, but here are a few modest suggestions. The good people of Think
Vitamin have made available all their tutorial videos for accessibility for
free; http://membership.thinkvitamin.com/library/accessibility/?cid=106
Vision Australia has a number of very good resources and are focused on
vision issues; http://www.visionaustralia.org.au/info.aspx?page=740
Formerly of Vision Australia was a gentleman called Steve Faulkner, he
created the Web Accessibility Toolbar, and is now in the USA with the
Paciello Group and they to have a number of useful tools and resources;
http://www.paciellogroup.com/index.php


 It would be greatly appreciated.


The only other consideration I would encourage you to think about is the
content. If your clients are visually impaired then whilst a pleasing design
a good thing, not at the expense of the information your audience is after.

Hope this is helpful,
Cheers,
John Unsworth


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Re: [WSG] [Job] Senior Freelance Web Designer | Melbourne

2010-07-13 Thread John Unsworth
This is getting a bit out of hand people! But to bring the notion of
standards back into the fray, I've met the people at 10Collective and if
there was an understanding of good standards in the recruitment industry
these people would be WCAG 2 compliant.
Oh, and it is Julien, not Julia.
Meanwhile, let's stop this thread hey?
John Unsworth.


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Re: [WSG] Video Accessibility Help

2010-06-15 Thread John Unsworth
Hi Michael,

Your first port of call might be the WCAG2 guidelines, found here;
http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/WCAG20/#media-equiv

I also did a quick search for accessible online video best practice
and this link to a PDF from the US Department of Health and Human
Services exactly on the topic of Online Viral Video Requirements and
Best Practices might be useful to you. It is dated Jan 2010 and
covers the departments use of YouTube (and other video providers) and
importantly Section 508 compliance. A good deal of the document
regards brand guidelines as much as technical requirements, but in
that regards questions about dimension and file size and type might be
useful knowledge. This was the PDF link;
www.cdc.gov/socialmedia/Tools/guidelines/pdf/onlinevideo.pdf

Accessibility advocate Joe Clark I recall became very interested in
the question and quality of captioned video.

From my search above this resource of links from the Victorian
Government in Australia might also be useful;
http://www.egov.vic.gov.au/website-practice/online-video-content.html

I'm not that knowledgeable about Flash, but to your questions I recall
seeing a presentation from Adobe regards CS4 and that their Audio
program, whose name escapes me, could extract Caption text and that in
turn that file could be brought into Flash. However I thought it was
an XML file. I also understood that using ActionScript you could
program the import of the XML file, but the last time I used Flash was
at school and it was Flash8 and given the presentation I mentioned it
might be a tool built in??

Of course how this would be handled in HTML5 I'm less clear on:)

Didn't really answer your questions directly, but I hope some of this is useful.

Cheers,
John Unsworth


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Re: [WSG] Yes/No structure?

2010-06-03 Thread John Unsworth
Hi Lucien,

The first thing that occurs to me regarding the semantics of the
action is what is the Yes/No proposition in regards to, and that this
might provide a clearer notion as to what to do.

By this what I mean is, in the first instance so far as semantic mark
up is concerned it would appear that a radio button is exactly what
you would use. Here it is a case of either on or off. Yes or no.

However the first thing I thought of, and I suppose this is in more
regards a UI/UX consideration is the design pattern we see with
webmail clients and the Remember me check box.

So returning to the first point, are you simply asking for a Yes/No
action or like the Remember me function a call to action with an
Option Yes or Option No result? In which case your question might be
rephrased by improving the microcopy of your markup. Instead of Do
you..? the semantics are improved by fixing the proposition, ie;
Remember me for 2 weeks - tick on = Yes, un-ticked = No, or another
example, rather than Would you like to receive our email newsletter?
radio buttons Yes/No, checkbox pre-selected followed by Uncheck if
you would not like to receive our email newsletter.

In addition to my thoughts I had a look into the Robert Hoekman Jr
book Designing the Obvious and in Chapter 16 about Simplifying Long
Forms he cites an example that begins with a series of Yes/No
propositions that given further consideration can be better addressed
by better directed questions and ultimately checkboxes. If you have a
Safari Books Online account you can access this book, or at the least
here is a link to his presentation at Web Directions in 2008;
http://www.webdirections.org/resources/robert-hoekman-jr/ which
contains links to his book on Amazon and an introduction to his
approach.

But I'll try and quickly summarise it for you. Original form starts -
Do you...have any Group Medical, Dental or Vision coverage..with Acme
Insurance = Radio Button Yes/No.
Second iteration - Do you...have any Group Medical, Dental or Vision
coverage..with Acme Insurance = Radio Button Yes, then checkbox's for
Medical, Dental, Vision - Radio Button No.
Third iteration - Do you...have any Group Medical, Dental or Vision
coverage..with Acme Insurance = checkbox's for Medical, Dental,
Vision - implied is if you don't check any, you would of selected No.

So to sum up, before it's a question of which is the best markup to
use, what is the actual end result of this action and can it be
handled a better way?

Cheers,
John Unsworth



On 4 June 2010 12:29, nedlud ned...@gmail.com wrote:
 I have a web form I'm building and there is a simple yes/no question in it.
 I got to wondering what the best semantic  mark up for this is? Does anyone
 have any good UI/UX suggestions?
 My three ideas were...
 Two radio buttons for yes and no...
 pDo you...?/p
 label for=ans-yesYes/labelinput type=radio name=ans id=ans-yes
 label for=ans-noNo/labelinput type=radio name=ans id=ans-no
 A single check box. A tick implies a yes answer while no tick implies
 no...
 pDo you...?/p
 input type=checkbox name=ans id=ans
 Or a selection list with a yes and a no answer...
 pDo you...?/p
 select name=ans id=ans
    option value=yesYes/option
    option value=noNo/option
 /select
 Which is the preferred way? Or can you suggest a better way?
 Lucien.
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Re: [WSG] Yes/No structure?

2010-06-03 Thread John Unsworth
Lucien,

Interestingly the Robert Hoekman Jr example I cited started originally
as a paper form. In his write up when the form was first put up online
before he came along it ran to page after page, resulting in people
never completing it!

In your example the first thing that strikes me, but this could be a
can of worms (based on your observation about asking a non-English
speaker to advise What language? when they might not be able to
understand even that) is either links in the available languages to
the same form in those languages, or at least to a page in the
selected language with information about what to do next - even though
that might mean calling a help line instead, or lastly the form begins
with say language Flag Icons and if someone chooses anything other
than English off to the alternate page or form. That action becomes
your Yes or No scenario.

There was a visitor from the W3C who spoke to the WSG in Melbourne
some time ago now called Richard Ishida who is all about
internationalisation on the web. More links; http://rishida.net/

Cheers,
John Unsworth

On 4 June 2010 14:41, nedlud ned...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hmm.
 I hadn't considered the wording of the actual question to be so important.
 But I can sure see your point.
 The full questions in the form is Do you require an interpreter?
 This is followed by: If so, what language?
 I am porting a paper based for onto the web, and the paper based version has
 explicit check boxes for yes and no. But it occurred to me that on the
 web, I could reduce the two check boxes down to one. Tick the box if you
 require an interpreter. Then dynamically insert the what language
 question if they answer yes. (Yes, an obvious problem with all this is that
 the form is all written in English. I guess the client is assuming an
 English speaker is helping the Non-English speaker with the form).
 I often look for the simplest way to represent thing, an in this case, a
 single check box can easily represent both the yes and no states
 (checked or not checked). But is this the best UX? Are people more
 comfortable with explicit yes/no choices? Even when it might be more verbose
 than absolutely necessary?
 Lucien.

 On 4 June 2010 13:29, John Unsworth john.unswo...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi Lucien,

 The first thing that occurs to me regarding the semantics of the
 action is what is the Yes/No proposition in regards to, and that this
 might provide a clearer notion as to what to do.

 By this what I mean is, in the first instance so far as semantic mark
 up is concerned it would appear that a radio button is exactly what
 you would use. Here it is a case of either on or off. Yes or no.

 However the first thing I thought of, and I suppose this is in more
 regards a UI/UX consideration is the design pattern we see with
 webmail clients and the Remember me check box.

 So returning to the first point, are you simply asking for a Yes/No
 action or like the Remember me function a call to action with an
 Option Yes or Option No result? In which case your question might be
 rephrased by improving the microcopy of your markup. Instead of Do
 you..? the semantics are improved by fixing the proposition, ie;
 Remember me for 2 weeks - tick on = Yes, un-ticked = No, or another
 example, rather than Would you like to receive our email newsletter?
 radio buttons Yes/No, checkbox pre-selected followed by Uncheck if
 you would not like to receive our email newsletter.

 In addition to my thoughts I had a look into the Robert Hoekman Jr
 book Designing the Obvious and in Chapter 16 about Simplifying Long
 Forms he cites an example that begins with a series of Yes/No
 propositions that given further consideration can be better addressed
 by better directed questions and ultimately checkboxes. If you have a
 Safari Books Online account you can access this book, or at the least
 here is a link to his presentation at Web Directions in 2008;
 http://www.webdirections.org/resources/robert-hoekman-jr/ which
 contains links to his book on Amazon and an introduction to his
 approach.

 But I'll try and quickly summarise it for you. Original form starts -
 Do you...have any Group Medical, Dental or Vision coverage..with Acme
 Insurance = Radio Button Yes/No.
 Second iteration - Do you...have any Group Medical, Dental or Vision
 coverage..with Acme Insurance = Radio Button Yes, then checkbox's for
 Medical, Dental, Vision - Radio Button No.
 Third iteration - Do you...have any Group Medical, Dental or Vision
 coverage..with Acme Insurance = checkbox's for Medical, Dental,
 Vision - implied is if you don't check any, you would of selected No.

 So to sum up, before it's a question of which is the best markup to
 use, what is the actual end result of this action and can it be
 handled a better way?

 Cheers,
 John Unsworth



 On 4 June 2010 12:29, nedlud ned...@gmail.com wrote:
  I have a web form I'm building and there is a simple yes/no question in
  it.
  I got to wondering what the best

[WSG] Monospace font sizing

2010-03-18 Thread John Unsworth
Hi all,

I've no doubt some of you know this, and some of you have read the
article, however in a turn of happy coincidence for myself as I was
trying to puzzle out the answer as to why my Monospace font heading in
Safari was not behaving as I thought it should, I happened to have Mr
Eric Meyers blog open in another browser; http://meyerweb.com and
therein was the answer;
http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2010/02/12/fixed-monospace-sizing

To quickly summarise the article, firstly I didn't actually know (or
hadn't remembered) that whilst browsers default font size to 16px,
monospace fonts are sized at 13px. Additionally, sized in em's not all
browsers will transfer a monospace styled element it's parent font
size, and finally even after specifying the font family Safari still
won't confer the desired sizing.

As it transpires the work around is in the font-stack. Oddly by
setting the font-stack with 'serif' (or even sans-serif I presume) as
the final font family Safari finally plays ball, eg; (font-family:
Corier Neu, monospace, serif; font-size: 1em;) - snippet taken from
Mr Meyers' article -
http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2010/02/12/fixed-monospace-sizing/

As this nearly became a question to the group and only lucky chance
provided the answer in minutes, and the information was previously
unknown to me, I thought I'd share especially to those creating novel
font stacks.

Cheers,
John Unsworth


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[WSG] NVDA-screen reader software for windows

2010-03-10 Thread John Unsworth
Hello all,

Last night on the TV here in Australia, on the national broadcaster
the ABC (Australian Broadcasting Corporation), on a program called
The New Inventors took time out from their usual competition style
format to highlight inventions concerned with Access and Ability.

Included amongst the inventions was Screen Reader software for
Windows, that was not only programmed by two blind computer users, is
licensed open source and thus freely available. It is called NVDA.

Personally I hadn't heard of this software before, so please excuse me
if this is old to some of you, but in general I thought this maybe of
interest to the group.

Amongst it's many features highlighted by the program was it's
portability - a user is able to load the software onto a USB stick to
take to any other computer, and an intriguing audio implementation to
signify the cursors position on the page - high pitches for top of the
page, descending to lower pitches at the bottom of the page, and
stereo panning to indicate left and right of the screen.

The ABC page for this show is at this link;
http://www.abc.net.au/tv/newinventors/specials/

The program was titled Access and Ability and there appear to be
video of the segments, and I assume these are internationally
available.

The home page for the NVDA software where it can be downloaded is;
http://www.nvda-project.org/

And the parent site for this project is at; http://www.nvaccess.org/

I hope this will be of interest to the group, and I apologise in
advance if people think otherwise.

Cheers,
John Unsworth


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Re: [WSG] character codes and accessibility

2009-11-14 Thread John Unsworth
Hi Luc,

I might suggest that 'double right arrow' is purely presentational and
not 'semantically' relevant, so it's not such a good idea to muddy up
the HTML with extraneous code. If you want to avoid using a background
image you could write your CSS in a 'progressive enhancement' fashion
by using the :after property on the list items. Of course browsers
that don't understand that will not display the arrows.

As regards the question what does a screen reader do? I'm afraid I've no idea.

I think this is best served with the image. One image in the CSS as
opposed to multiple character codes in the HTML.

Regards,
John Unsworth

2009/11/15 Luc l...@dzinelabs.com:
 Good evening list,

 When you use a character code, e.g. #x00BB; as a list marker
 (hardcoded in the li), how is that interpreted by a speech browser?
 Does the user hear those characters as they appear or are they
 converted into 'double right arrow'?

 Might be a stupid question but it would prevent using background
 images

 --
 Regards,
  Luc
 _

 Using the best e-mail client: The Bat! version 4.2.6 with
 Windows XP (build 2600), version
 5.1 Service Pack 3 and
 using the best browser: Opera.

 Pussy Galore: My name is Pussy Galore. - James Bond: I must be
 dreaming. - Bond meets Pussy Galore - Goldfinger (film 1964)



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Re: [WSG] using images for my website and accessibility

2009-07-14 Thread John Unsworth
Hi Marvin,
Um, sorry but I'm a bit confused. Have you already found these images
and now you need to contact the owner, or are you looking for images
of fruit and vegetables that you can use legally? If what your saying
is that you've got these images, but don't know where they are from,
and your searching for banana.jpg - well the mind boggles! I would
assume you'd find loads and then it's a bit like a pin in a haystack!
Let alone trying to find img_0537.jpg?
I would suggest you find some images on Flickr and set your search
options for open Creative Commons licensed images. You set your
options in the Advanced Search panel; for example
http://www.flickr.com/search/advanced/?q=mushroom
I appreciate with your being blind you will be heavily reliant on the
alt attribute, or the photo meta tags, but at least the images have
been released for legal use.
I've usually been fortunate to either be able to create my own images,
or have them supplied to me and then proceeded with the understanding
that the client has already cleared there use. Thus far no problems.
Hope this might help.
John Unsworth.

2009/7/14 Marvin Hunkin startrekc...@gmail.com:
 hi.
 tried looking for these images for a web project.
 and needs the url, so i can contact the owner to get permission to use these
 images.
 will paste the names below.
 tried looking on google, altavista, yahoo, etc.
 but no luck.
 cheers Marvin.
 ps:have these images on my hard disk, but need to get permission to use
 these.

 the images i am looking for are:

 banana.jpg
 cherry.jpg
 image002.gifimage002.gif
 img_0537.jpg
 logo_01.gif
 mango.png
 Mushrooms.jpg
 pineapple.jpg
 rockmelon_large.jpg

 E-Mail: startrekc...@gmail.com
  Msn: startrekc...@msn.com
  Skype: startrekcafe
 Visit my Jaws Australia Group at http://groups.yahoo.com/groups/JawsOz/




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Re: [WSG] Website Creation Documentation Standards

2009-05-05 Thread John Unsworth
Hi Lorrie,

When I read your email, it seemed to me you were referring to what
I've read in web design books called 'deliverables'. A concept I think
inherited from print and graphic design.
For instance I recently bought a copy of Elliot Jay Stocks Sexy Web
Design from Sitepoint ( http://www.sitepoint.com/books/ ) and last
chapter speaks of this. However, beyond being called a style guide, I
don't discern a common set of rules such that there exists software
to assist you explicitly with a style guide.
Another Sitepoint book from a few years back by Shirley Kaiser
Deliver First Class Web Sites (
http://www.sitepoint.com/books/checklists1/?SID=3598de07047196325426cba641ee236c
) in the third chapter refers to a technique called content
inventory which whilst different to a style guide, could class as a
handover document. She refers to an excellent article by Jeffrey Veen
on the subject which might assist -
http://www.adaptivepath.com/ideas/essays/archives/40.php
Finally in somewhat the same vein as Franks answer and using a similar
technique, a presentation from a Natalie Downe of Clearleft in England
on Maintainable CSS. At the end of the presentation she appears to
create a HTML document that allows any future front end developer to
quickly understand the styles and patterns in a technical sense. So
whilst useful for a developer, probably of little consequence to a
website owner. See the presentation here - http://natbat.net/
In the end, presuming I was in the ball park when I assumed you meant
deliverables, as best as I can tell there is only techniques that work
for you, rather than a standard such that the W3C would endorse.
Hope some of this is helpful.

John Unsworth


    List,

    I am a web designer as a hobby and have run into a situation where
    I am not sure where to search. Does a standard exist for the
    creation of web site creation documentation? By this I mean
    documentation that would/might be turned over to the end user:

     1. to allow the end user to mange the site himself
     2. to document the project and for future reference

    Having created a few sites I have been trying on my own to
    determine what information should be documented and in what format
    and by what specs. I hope this makes sense. If they do exist,
    would someone point me to them and some examples as well as any
    software, open source if possible, that exists. If not, are there
    any industry general practices that I can read?

    One last question, if such standard exist are they working with
    the W3C community and where might that info be, please?

    Lorrie


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Re: [WSG] Accessibility Transcripts for Audio and Video

2008-10-19 Thread John Unsworth
Hi Jennie,
Granted it was at the product launch of CS4 for Adobe, but one of the
items they promoted was a feature in their sound program Soundbooth
that did just this. It certainly appeared convincing, but as I say, it
was a promotion night! There didn't seem to be any suggestion that it
couldn't handle multiple voices, but then again, they didn't
explicitly say that it could. As a tool, it might provide some heavy
lifting when doing it the old fashioned way and allow you to tidy up
the results. Also as I understood it, this feature previously existed
elsewhere, and that Adobe had aquired it.
Later I spoke with a guy who worked for the Australian Broadcasting
Service, and he implied that the method you described,  the old
fashioned way, was previously all they had.
For video work I might suggest you might find good info at Creative
Cow;  http://forums.creativecow.net/ or even the Adobe website. Not
surprisingly a quick google search provides some info, and this link
looked informed.
http://www.jeroenwijering.com/?item=Making_Video_Accessible

Not exactly your question answered, but hope it might of helped.
Cheers,
John Unsworth


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[WSG] Question about presenting numeric percentages and accessibility.

2008-10-15 Thread John Unsworth
Hi all,
Just a quick question. I'm writing up a website for a simple brochure
site, and the copy I'm provided with refers to something 1/3 of
total or colour 2/3 of natural and so on. And it just occured to
me, would Number Slash Number (ie; 1/2) cause any issue in regards
accessibility, be it screen readers or poor reading or math skills
(the correct term for this alludes me for the moment, I'm thinking
dyslexia, but not sure that correctly accounts for all potential
users). As such I wondered if the abbr tag might be appropriate, or
if anyone has a better, more suitable sugestion?
Many thanks,
John Unsworth.


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[WSG] Incorporating Terms and Cons in signup page

2008-09-30 Thread John Unsworth
Hi WSG,
I'm wondering about the best method to incorporate in a signup form a
Terms and Conditions agreement, which being so long will be bought to
the page externally. Or if it's thought best, maybe not!
On a previous occasion I went forward using the object tag. The
advantage to my mind is that, my document (that may change in future)
is separate to the form and for those who don't have a browser capable
of using the object tag, can see alternative text to link to the
separately hosted TC page.
But it's been put to me at work, there might be a way to house the
document in a div, give the div a fixed size and make it scrollable.
Alternatively I could use a textarea element, although I'm given to
understand it would need to be outside the form so as not include it
in the 'Signup' event when the submit button is clicked. However to
satisfy the designer, who follows that the convention is that the form
is visually seen before the last submit button, I'd use CSS to
position it - but that doesn't sound very semantic to me?
Putting it on another page, that you would link to, read, then return
to the form to agree to has been rejected for the sanctity of the
concept of a single page signup document.
I hope I've been clear, and I guess I'm interested in anything similar
to this in best practice, accessibility and standards.
Cheers for just being there folks,
John Unsworth


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[WSG] Position and peace of mind

2008-09-03 Thread John Unsworth
Hello WSG'ers,
I'm experiencing some frustrations with a current project and could
use some experienced opinions. Warning though, I might get a bit wordy
as it's going to be a multi-part question, as I'd like feedback about
my chosen process. Also I would class myself advanced beginner, as I
only been in web dev for about a year.
OK, it's a new homepage for my employer. It's basically a series of
rectangular div's 980px wide (wrapper is 1000px with 10px padding
right and left) but varying heights, down the page, from top to bottom
appears as;
1. Header
2. Navigation
3. Banner Photo
4. Five even sized boxes with current product promotions floated in
their div left to appear horizontal across page
5. Two (2/3 page and 1/3 page) boxes for general introduction and
client login (again horizontal)
6. Three even boxes for everyday products and customer contact (ditto
the horizontal)
7. and final footer with copyright notice and repeated links

My problem has arisen because I decided that I should write the markup
so that steps 4 and 5 occur the other way around. So as a percieved
accessibility benefit (even though I've included a 'skip to content'
link at the top of the page) a screen reader would not have to skip
through the promotions first, but read the introduction content, then
the products. Concurrent to this I've attempted to write the CSS up as
an elastic layout in em's should a user need to resize the page. I've
also used the Eric Meyer reset, and set body font size to 1em (16px)
and line height to 1.3em. I broadly understand the in and out's of
em's, but am novice at implementing it.
The problem I initially encountered was that when I used relative
positioning for steps 4 and 5, to visually re-position them the
margins between 4,5 and 6 varied across browsers. I was able to live
with that, but the graphic designer of the site couldn't. This
variation in margins also occured when trying to evenly space the five
boxes of step 4 across the page and achieve alignment left and right.
I tried %'s instead of em's, and for testing purposes without changing
the rest of the layout, used pixels, but it never quite went flush to
the edges.
Then I tried absolute positioning with all the div's below the banner
photo, and at least on the mac, across Safari 2, FF3, Opera 9.5, and
Camino 1.6.3 (the five boxes were not entirely solved, but the layout
was evenly spaced) my problems appeared to be solved. But then I tried
it on a PC with IE7 and steps 4 and 5 were just plain gone???
I've also encountered another quirk that just appear in Opera when I
tried to use image replacement for some links as buttons, that's
causing the page to scroll horizontally, but given our likely audience
I think even the designer might be able to live with that.

So my questions to the group are;
Was the decision to write the markup in the order I did correct or
pedantic? Because if I didn't then I wouldn't have the layout issues
I'm having I'd guess.
Was it a mistake to try and create an elastic layout in em's and
expect the entire interface to expand? In this case might it be better
to use pixel for width's but em's for font and % for height and allow
the boxes to expand with the text? Or should I just stick to pixel's
all round.
Is there a 'golden rule' about repositioning sections of markup out of
the order they're written, and why was there variation with the
margins across apparently very well behaved browsers?
Finally why did the absolute position boxes just vanish in the IE7? I
realise this might be too vauge a question, but I'm not even quite
sure what my search terms might be trying to find the answer to this
via Google. Generally the whole IE thing I ignore until required.

Wow! I didn't intend to take so long, but would appreciate feedback
even if it's just on one point.
Sincerly,
John Unsworth


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Fwd: [WSG] Position and peace of mind

2008-09-03 Thread John Unsworth
-- Forwarded message --
From: John Unsworth [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 4 Sep 2008 14:05
Subject: Re: [WSG] Position and peace of mind
To: Kepler Gelotte [EMAIL PROTECTED]


On 04/09/2008, Kepler Gelotte [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  John,
 
   It would really help when you have a specific issue like this to post a url
   where people could see your site. Most hosting companies allow you to create
   subdomains so you could put the web site on your host as
   http://problemsite.mydomain.com/
 
   Best regards,
 
 
   Kepler Gelotte
   Neighbor Webmaster, Inc.
   156 Normandy Dr., Piscataway, NJ 08854
   www.neighborwebmaster.com
   phone/fax: (732) 302-0904


Thanks for replying Kepler,
 I've arranged to put the two versions up for viewing.
 The relatively positioned div's is at;
 http://distributeit.com.au/wsg/relative-index.html
 and the absolutes are here;
 http://distributeit.com.au/wsg/absolute-index.html

 The issue with the More Info buttons in Opera disapears when I
 removed the absolute position call in the CSS...but so do the images.
 And I'd like to advise that the call in the head of the HTML for the
 CSS is taken from Jon Hicks' presentation A Day in Deployment, I
 thought it was a good method although I am aware that the Yahoo front
 end optimisation people advise that the @import rule is not perfect.
 For anyone not aware of the Jon Hicks presentation, you'll find it
 here;
 http://www.hicksdesign.co.uk/journal/design-to-deployment

 Many thanks

John Unsworth


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Re: [WSG] resetting input boxes

2008-08-07 Thread John Unsworth
Was just walking back from work when it occurred to me I should of
specified that I was referring to Safari 2.1, sadly I'm stuck on a
Hackintosh so no opportunity to run Safari 3.
John Unsworth


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Re: [WSG] resetting input boxes

2008-08-07 Thread John Unsworth
 Paul Bennett wrote:

  Hi Kevin,
 
  It's not clear what you're trying to achieve. Can you give us some more
 information?
 
  Paul
 
 Christian Snodgrass wrote:

 
  I think he's essentially talking about a CSS reset file, specific to input,
 to neutralize all of the browser differences.

  I'm not sure of the specific elements, but just about any CSS reset should
 handle it. This is the one I prefer:
 http://meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2007/05/01/reset-reloaded/

  Yahoo also has it's own, but it's a lot bigger and I think somewhat of an
 overkill.

  --
  Christian Snodgrass
  Azure Ronin Web Design
  http://www.arwebdesign.net
  Phone: 859.816.7955


Having just been working on a series of pages consisting predominately
of form elements, including inputs fields/boxes etc, and also using
the Eric Meyer reset, it's my experience thus far that the reset does
not neutralize all the browser differences. Opera for one seems to
treat the sizing of the input boxes differently to Firefox and Safari.
Added to that you can differing results depending on the system of
measurement you use, ie: em's vs pixel vs percentage, although I'm
inclined now to stick to percentage, ensuring the containing div or
fieldset is sized consistently across browsers with either em's or
px's.
I'm not informed or smart enough to know exactly why this is, but
suspect that as the browser is applying the OS input elements, in the
process it is creating dimensions that go beyond padding and margin.
Otherwise the reset would work?
Slightly off topic, but still with the Eric Meyer reset, I found that
when it declares a universal - background: transparent; - it disabled
Safari and IE7 from applying a class to the tr in a table when I
tried to Zebra stripe the table rows. I removed it (the univeral
reset), and at least in Safari (not yet tested on IE7) it was fixed.
Firefox, Opera and Camino all rendered the stripes as expected. Can
anyone possibly explain that?

Cheers people,
John Unsworth.


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Re: [WSG] Re: Form (layout/accessibiity)

2008-07-09 Thread John Unsworth
Shaun,

Somewhat new subscriber to the list, first time respondent...

It's a bit late of night, but if I read this right, if this section
(as it is a form, right?) is wrapped in a fieldset you can then hide
both labels and use legend to identify that's it's postcode. I'm
relatively new in this web malarky, but have been working on a lot of
form pages for a web app, and think fieldset legend are as good
as, and as easy to work with as div's. So if your fieldset carries
your id, then you can target your form elements. So to take your
snippet..

fieldset id=postcode
legendPostcode/legend
label for=PostCode1Postcode:/labelinput type=text
id=PostCode1 name=PostCode1  maxlength=4 /label
for=PostCode2
second part of postcode:/labelinput type=text id=PostCode2 
name=PostCode2  maxlength=4 /
/fieldset

Then style the font etc of the legend, and hide the label the same
as your CSS, and size the input likewise.
Example - #postcode input { width: 2em;} #postcode label { position:
absolute; left: -px;}

Alternatively, if you can't or won't use fieldset then you might use
a Definition List. The term postcode is the dt, then just add input
elements in the dd and use title to explain the input use for screen
readers.

To all the more experienced members, please step forward to clarify or
correct my advice.

Your faithfully,
I've got no signature set up,
John Unsworth,
New Web Designing Bloke.

On Wed, Jul 9, 2008 at 6:49 PM,  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I have created a form which acts as a interface to a system outside of my
 control. This takes UK postcode in two parts (postcode1 - the initial part
 e.g. ng1 and postcode2 the later part e.g.7sw)

 Is it appropriate that I have one label for two inputs or does anyone
 know of a surefire way to hide second label I have tried this but it does not
 seem cross browser

 html snippet
 label for=PostCode1Postcode:/labelinput type=text class=postcode
 id=PostCode1 name=PostCode1  maxlength=4 /label for=PostCode2
 class=hidesecond part of postcode:/labelinput class=postcode
 type=text id=PostCode2 name=PostCode2  maxlength=4 /


 css selectors relating to this
 #su_housing input.postcode
{
width:2em;
}

 #su_housing label.hide
{
position:absolute;
left:;
font-size:0;
color:#fff;

}

 Would appreciate anyones thoughts help

 Many Thanks
 Shaun




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Re: [WSG] Re: WSG Digest

2008-03-18 Thread John Unsworth
Assuming it's only a soundtrack and doesn't require any controlling,
ie: play, pause, volume, etc. then a tiny .swf containing the music
track (again set to loop, without control) could sit fairly
unobtrusive, and marked up, at the bottom of your HTML. However as has
been pointed out, without that control, he could do his reputation
more damage than good.

A better approach if it were my client would be to persuade them that
plugging music (oh so subjective!) into the site for some spurious
benefit is better abandoned for a clean standards page. Especially for
a nightclub, a good visual website will stay relevant much longer than
a hot soundtrack.

It's not an area I'm well informed in, but others might be able to
answer this, but is it possible to pull in an API from say Last.fm and
let users chose their own soundtrack?

On Wed, Mar 19, 2008 at 1:04 PM, jenni provenzano-sherwood
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I realize this is wsg, but why not do the whole site in flash, how many
  pages could it be!
  or at least do the frameset banner in flash.

  - Original Message -
  From: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
  To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
  Sent: Wednesday, March 19, 2008 3:20 AM
  Subject: WSG Digest


  *
  WEB STANDARDS GROUP MAIL LIST DIGEST
  *


  From: John Hancock [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2008 03:26:32 +1100
  Subject: Re: [WSG] SEO, fact or fiction

  I'd use flash. http://www.gothamsounddesign.com/ is a fairly good
  example of an 'unobtrusive' flash player.


  On 18/03/2008, at 3:10 AM, kevin mcmonagle wrote:

   hi,
   Im doing a site for a nightclub.  So im doing a hybrid.
   The owner has demanded a music track playing continuously.
   What would you lot do if you had to put in a continually playing
   music track?
   I mean the only solution that  is a frameset right but i just want
   some feedback of the dangers of this.
  
   -thanks in advance
   kev
  
  
  
  
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  best wishes,

  John Hancock
  Identity
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  t: +61 2 8012 2967
  f: +61 2 9799 6135







  *
  From: Faul, Mark [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2008 12:26:52 -0400
  Subject: Out of Office AutoReply: WSG Digest

  I will be out of the office on Monday March 17. If you require immediate
  assistance, please contact Chris Wightman at [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  and/or 613-580-2424 ext 25123. Thank you.


  This e-mail originates from the City of Ottawa e-mail system. Any
  distribution, use or copying of this e-mail or the information it
  contains by other than the intended recipient(s) is unauthorized.
  If you are not the intended recipient, please notify me at the
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  Le présent courriel a été expédié par le système de courriels de
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  *
  From: Frederick Matzen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2008 10:36:59 -0600
  Subject: Re: [WSG] SEO, fact or fiction

  If you can't talk the guy out of it then try and get him to at least allow
  the USER to start the music. If not that then I would suggest teh next
  course is a flash player but at half volume and make SURE that the START and
  STOP button is easy to find.

  I wouldn't use a frameset for anything.

  On Mon, Mar 17, 2008 at 10:26 AM, John Hancock [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  wrote:

   I'd use flash. http://www.gothamsounddesign.com/ is a fairly good example
   of an 'unobtrusive' flash player.
  
   On 18/03/2008, at 3:10 AM, kevin mcmonagle wrote:
  
   hi,
   Im doing a site for a nightclub.  So im doing a hybrid.
   The owner has demanded a music track playing continuously.
   What would you lot do if you had to put in a continually playing music
   track?
   I mean the only solution that  is a frameset right but i just want some
   feedback of the dangers of this.
  
   -thanks in advance
   kev
  
  
  
  
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