RE: [WSG] Who are the Away on leave Notices from?

2008-11-05 Thread Paul Bennett
Just auto replies from list members away on leave (who have set their 'out of 
office' setting to 'on')

It is annoying, but in saying that I'm probably guilty of it at times ;)


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RE: [WSG] Accessible and cross browser online slide system

2008-10-21 Thread Paul Bennett
Lisa,

On behalf of other list members, any chance of turning return receipts off?

:)
Paul


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RE: [WSG] Browser loading images issue

2008-10-15 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi there,

A bit left field, but I've had this issues *similar* to this before. It sounds 
like a network or ISP cache issue.

Once it was a company proxy not grabbing the latest files from the webserver 
and serving up old code, the other time, an ISP was caching website data in 
their proxy to limit load on their webservers.

In the 2nd instance, we had to call the ISP and have them manually remove the 
domain form their cache list.

You may want to contact the ISP / hosting company to make sure the site isn't 
on a cache list.

Worth a shot (the site looks fine for me here in New Zealand :) )

Paul


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RE: [WSG] Google chrome... Coming very soon...

2008-09-02 Thread Paul Bennett
Unless you're behind a firewall which requires proxy auth. In this case, you'll 
need to wait until tonight :(

http://thingsilearn.wordpress.com/2008/03/05/attention-software-developers-dont-make-assumptions-about-my-internet-connection/



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RE: [WSG] Google chrome... Coming very soon...

2008-09-02 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi Tee,

According to product info, it's been in private beta for a while.
This is the first public beta (well, to 100 or so countries anyway)

Rest assured a Mac ( *Nix ?) version will follow soon :)

Paul


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RE: [WSG] H1 and the img tag

2008-08-25 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi Schalk,

Glad you raised this.
We built a new section of our site a while ago which required different 
treatment from our normal text h1's. I looked at the image replacement route 
and found the approaches kludgy and overwrought.
I ended up doing exactly what you said:

h1a img src= alt=Page Heading ../h1

Looks fine, and the pages revert back to the standard h1 text style when images 
are off.
You can see the results here:
http://tinyurl.com/5b3bwg

The image inside the h1 is simple, accessible and effective. Go with your gut :)

Paul


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RE: [WSG] H1 and the img tag

2008-08-25 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi Michael,

While that is possible, unfortunately the h1 text doesn't display when images 
are off and css is still in use.
This is the issue many image replacement techniques sought to address.

Paul


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RE: [WSG] resetting input boxes

2008-08-06 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi Kevin,

It's not clear what you're trying to achieve. Can you give us some more 
information?

Paul


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RE: [WSG] Forcing a vertical scrollbar in Firefox 3

2008-07-10 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi Jen,

Your comment may have come across as a bit more negative than it was intended, 
however:
http://validator.w3.org/check?verbose=1uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fairfax.com.au%2Findex.ac
(46 errors)

He who lives in a glass house etc, etc...

My opinion (and it is just that) is the we need to stop being so critical about 
trifling matters like this. I applaud Opera for their involvement in web 
standards and for their commitment to put a resource like this together even 
when it doesn't seem to offer a direct business benefit for them.

Lets keep it positive folks. It won't be pretty if we start assigning value to 
people by how their sites look through the validator.

Happy Friday :)
Paul


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RE: [WSG] Firefox 3 candidate

2008-06-19 Thread Paul Bennett
select custom install and install it to another directory (something like 
/Mozilla/Firefox3) and the two will run side-by-side.

You can do this with Opera too.
:)
Paul


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RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems

2008-06-19 Thread Paul Bennett
 Not if it's your own poem you're putting on your own page.

Rubbish - I quote myself all the time! :)

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RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems

2008-06-19 Thread Paul Bennett
Must you Australian's *always* have the last say?  ;)


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RE: [WSG] firefox 3 beta5

2008-05-19 Thread Paul Bennett
Ack!
Anyone else had horrible problems installing FF3?

My install crashes every time I open it, so I had to reinstall FF2..



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[WSG] RE: 2008 NZ Government Web Standards Review

2008-05-15 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi Anthony,

I sent a request for a registration on the webstandards wiki 2 days ago - how 
long does it normally take SSC to grant access?
Am I supposed to do something else?

Regards,
Paul Bennett
Web Coder
Web Centre
Wellington City Council
http://www.wellington.govt.nz http://www.wellington.govt.nz/
DDI: 04 801 3284
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


The information contained in this email is privileged and confidential and 
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asked to respect that confidentiality and not disclose, copy or make use of its 
contents. If received in error you are asked to destroy this email and contact 
the sender immediately. Your assistance is appreciated.





From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 9:41 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] 2008 NZ Government Web Standards Review


Hi all



The annual review of the New Zealand Government Web Standards is now underway.



We are very keen to get your comments and advice, which we'll feed directly 
into the review process.



Let us know what's worked for you and what's caused problems. Are there 
standards you've struggled with, either in their wording or their practical 
implementation? Which would you ditch and why? Which would you keep? Are some 
overly prescriptive, or too vague?



If you're not in NZ, we're still very keen to get your thoughts and feedback.



The process is that we (the Web Standards Working Group) collate feedback on 
the standards via the wiki and give it high priority while considering each 
standard. So it's crucial we get a good amount of feedback from users.



You do this by using the link below to go to the standard(s) on which you want 
to leave feedback, and click the comment tab.



http://webstandards.govt.nz/index.php/All_Standards 
BLOCKED::http://webstandards.govt.nz/index.php/All_Standards



You'll need to be registered, so if you haven't already, please send a request 
to



[EMAIL PROTECTED] BLOCKED::mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



Cheers



Anthony




--
Anthony Hawkins
Business Analyst
State Services Commission
DDI: +64 4 495 6718
Fax: +64 4 495 6669
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.ssc.govt.nz http://www.ssc.govt.nz/  | www.e.govt.nz 
http://www.e.govt.nz/  | newzealand.govt.nz http://newzealand.govt.nz/


New Zealand's State Services Commission: Leading the state sector to world 
class performance
...
Caution: If you have received this message in error please notify the sender 
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From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Matijs
Sent: Friday, 16 May 2008 9:22 a.m.
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Background on body not aligning with tiled background on 
wrapper DIV


Does overflow: hidden on the containing div and making the green bar wider 
help?


On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 7:23 PM, Paul Collins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


Hi all,

I've managed to put a page together. If you look at the green area in
Firefox and IE you will notice a small gap at the right of the green
area in IE. If you try to resize the browser by dragging it, you will
notice the gap keeps closing then appearing.

It's to do with the odd and even number of pixels on the window size
when you have a centred background.

Anyway, here is the test URL, anyone got an idea of how to solve this
without an extra DIV?!
http://paulcollinslondon.com/test/

Cheers
Paul


2008/5/15 Paul Collins [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

 Thanks for your reply Adam.

 I can't really put what's I have now due to copyright restrictions, or
 I would have. I was hoping someone had encountered this before and
 would know the answer.

 I'll have to try and set up a dummy page later today when I have more 
time.

 Thanks
 Paul

 2008/5/15 Adam Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 can we see an example?

 Paul Collins wrote:

 Hi all,

 I've seen this problem before, but can't remember how I solved it.
 Basically, I have put a centred background that repeats vertically 
on
 the body of my page using CSS. The main wrapper div is also centred
 and has a background sits on top of the Body one, but is only a 
fixed
 height Basically, they need to match up where they meet, which is
 working fine in Firefox, Safari, Opera, etc. The only place it's
 having an issue is IE6  7.

 I know what

RE: [WSG] How to make diagonal lines change color?

2008-04-10 Thread Paul Bennett
warning: untested!

You could try this* (won't people almost _always_ be mousing over the page body 
though?)

body{background: #000 url(/path/to/image.gif) repeat;}
body:hover{background: #000 url(/path/to/somotherimage.gif) repeat;}

* won't work in IE 6 though

HTH?

Paul


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RE: [WSG] restricting width in the body tag

2008-03-26 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi William,

It sounds like you're looking for something like a 'jello layout' (term not 
mine)
You can find out more here:
http://www.positioniseverything.net/articles/jello.html

Basically a jello layout will expand and shrink with the browser window but 
only to a defined minimum / maximum.

HTH,
Paul


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RE: [WSG] long word not wrapping in firefox

2008-03-06 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi there,
 
you can use a css rule to stop long text breaking table widths:
 
table tr td {overflow: hidden}
 
:)
Paul


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RE: [WSG] IE8 news

2008-03-06 Thread Paul Bennett
 http://www.geocities.com/hollywood/makeup/4303/t2script.txt

404! It's happening already!


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RE: [WSG] IE8 news

2008-03-05 Thread Paul Bennett
The IE7 beta worked as a standalone until the first Release Candidate came out. 
I presume IE8 will do the same.

Am trying now, but you need to have a fully patched machine (I'm behind a 
firewall so our patches are usually pushed out a bit later ) to install it - so 
be warned that the installer may require security patch updates to complete.

Hope to report soon on... :)  

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Patrick H. Lauke
Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2008 8:26 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] IE8 news

Anybody installed the IE8beta1 yet?
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/winfamily/ie/ie8/readiness/Install.htm
Wondering if this nukes IE7 and embeds itself into Windows, or if it can 
run standalone...

P
-- 
Patrick H. Lauke
__
re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively
[latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.]
www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk
http://redux.deviantart.com
__
Co-lead, Web Standards Project (WaSP) Accessibility Task Force
http://webstandards.org/
__


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RE: [WSG] IE8 news

2008-03-05 Thread Paul Bennett
2 restarts later I have found the following:

* it overwrites IE7
* it doesn't render anything in the tabs!
* it has an 'emulate IE7' button (??)

Best to hold off for now. If I get it sorted I'll let you all know.

Paul 

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RE: [WSG] IE8 news

2008-03-05 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi all,

Sorry for the quick-fire posts. This just in:
* if it doesn’t render when you start up the browser, you can open a new tab 
and then switch back to the first tab - this seems to 'wake up' the rendering 
engine
* the 'emulate IE7' button allows you to switch between IE7 and IE8 rendering 
engines, but you do have to restart the browser to do this. It seems that 
rather than overwriting IE7, it uses the same base chrome but does allow the 
rendering engine switch.

:)
Paul 

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RE: [WSG] generated source

2008-02-26 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi Jody,
 
I recall having a similar problem. The issue came down (from memory) to the 
doctype I was using. I was closing elements in xhtml style, while the doctype I 
was using was html.

Firefox was happily removing the extraneous closing elements in the rendered 
source to fit the doctype.

:)
Paul 


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RE: [WSG] an accessible question: server-side vs client-side validation

2008-02-12 Thread Paul Bennett
+1 on this.

I am no l33t h4x0r (by any stretch of the imagination), but even I know I can 
easily circumvent  client-side validation for nefarious purposes in at least 
the following ways:
1. save the form onto my drive, remove all js and submit the form to your 
server url with pretty much any data I like in it
2. switch off javascript and mash that submit button

Web apps should be built to work first without JS, and then the js behaviour 
should be layered over the top:
http://domscripting.com/blog/display/41

:)
Paul


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RE: [WSG] w3c link checker

2008-01-08 Thread Paul Bennett
winrar will open .tar and .gz files on windows:  http://www.rarlab.com/

:)
Paul

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RE: [WSG] CMS and site design

2007-12-03 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi Lyn,
 
In order for them to work correctly, CMS systems usually restrict you to 
using/designing application specific templates (some even incorporate 
templating languages). You'll likely need to work with the CMS from the word go.
 
Bear in mind that if you haven't worked with CMS driven sites before, there can 
be quite a learning curve...
 
:)
Paul



From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lyn Patterson
Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2007 11:39 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] CMS and site design


I have never had to use a CMS and know very little about them.  I have a client 
who wants to update his site himself  and my hosting company supports Joomla.

My question is: do I design the site in the normal way and then append the CMS 
or is the site designed within Joomla? Am I restricted in design options?

Lyn Patterson
Western Web Design

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RE: [WSG] Invisible US Passport renewal page

2007-11-20 Thread Paul Bennett
 http://www.passports.gov.au

1. Flyout menu? Check
2. Really bad site search? Check.
3. Ugly design? Check.
4. Shocking usability? Check.

Must be a government site ;)

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RE: [WSG] Rounded Courners .... Your Take

2007-10-30 Thread Paul Bennett
 Now instead of opening up inkscape it's just a call to a PHP script like:
 background-image: url(corner.png.php?fgc=cccbs=1bgc=000bc=fffr=90);

So for everytime the css file is called, your script has to create an image? 
Has this impacted on your sites / servers performance any?

Have you considered a caching solution - where the new image is generated then 
stored static until it needs to change again?

Also, there's always things like this using the Dom  JavaScript:
http://www.456bereastreet.com/archive/200505/transparent_custom_corners_and_borders/
 


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RE: [WSG] PHI and YUI Grids

2007-10-30 Thread Paul Bennett
You mean the 'Golden Mean'? Not that I can see - grids offers a variety of 
column widths and nesting. You do a large variety of things with it and column 
widths don't appear to be golden mean base, but based on Yahoo's enormous 
experience .

 I am slowly learning to create aesthetically pleasing web designs, although i 
 would never use the Yahoo framework 

As someone who is getting ready to implement grids for a large government 
project, may I ask why not?


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RE: [WSG] Re: worst site I've seen lately

2007-10-29 Thread Paul Bennett
The blinking was really annoying (and it was everywhere!), as was the very 
small text.

What I liked was the live rendering of the fonts and the ability to select a 
font and actually be able to type with it, see it at different font sizes etc - 
very handy (I've seen this on another font site too, but I can't recall the url)
 
The orange scroll bar was a bit of a downer, especially seeing as it was right 
next to the old handy browser scrollbar

In terms of bad flash, weird UI and 'mystery meat navigation', take a look at 
this...
http://matterhorn.co.nz/

I have a feeling this thread is 'weaving' off-topic :)


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RE: [WSG] Minimum width help

2007-10-24 Thread Paul Bennett
 visibility: hidden does hide the content from screen readers the same as
 display:none does.

And it may get your site banned from search engines if overused:
http://www.google.com/support/webmasters/bin/answer.py?answer=66353

What I've done for accesskey code is use this:

position: absolute;
left: -px;
width: 1px; 

From what I've learnt this allows access to the text to screen readers but 
regular browsers don't see it.

I'm not aware of any SEO issues with this. Our site doesn't seem to have been 
affected...

Paul


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RE: [WSG] will Eric Meyers C SS SCULPTOR put me out of job?

2007-08-27 Thread Paul Bennett
You could also look at Yahoo's YUI grids  css project which is essentially 
doing the same thing but supported by Yahoo.
http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/

I've had good experiences with it...

Paul 


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RE: [WSG] will Eric Meyers C SS SCULPTOR put me out of job?

2007-08-27 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi,

Apart from a cursory look, no. This looks pretty straightforward.

Advantages with YUI however are that:
- it allows you to nest elements to create 'grids' (think easy cross browser 
css columns within columns)
- it uses one central css file instead of different css files for each layout
- you need only change an id / id's in certain elements to affect changes - not 
load in different stylesheets

Paul (yui fanboi)


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RE: [WSG] vCard File

2007-08-01 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi Joyce,
 
It looks like vCard is a standard, so I guess the user's email client would 
pick it up:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VCard

HTH,
Paul 


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RE: [WSG] Re: please avoid forcing people to open pdf in browser!

2007-07-19 Thread Paul Bennett
I, for one am enjoying this discussion :)

My 2c:

1) Let the user know it's a PDF *and* what size the PDF is, eg by putting 
something like (12Kb PDF) beside the link. I'm on dial up at home and it grates 
my backside when sites don't let me know how big the file is

2) If you can, use Acrobat Pro to autotag your PDF's. It's far from perfect but 
it's a start

3) Never ever assume a tagged PDF is 'screen reader friendly'. A partially 
sighted woman gave a (fantastic) presentation at a conference I attended 
recently where she 'showed' a screen reader opening a PDF and also showed how 
Acrobat rendered the doc in ZoomText. It was absolutely illegible and the 
screen reader couldn't make head or tail of it.

4) Push back on your departments to change the workflow so you get raw content 
and (in a perfect world) time to mark it up.

5) Get a search tool that indexes the raw text of PDF content and lets you 
point users to the text version if they want it. Again, not perfect but better 
than nothing.

Like most government employees, I've got a lot of work to do in this area, but 
it really does need to be done :)

Paul


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RE: [WSG] Re: video

2007-07-03 Thread Paul Bennett
Flash: (google video, youtube, yahoo video, revver, dailymotion, etc etc)
http://www.digital-web.com/articles/the_rise_of_flash_video_part_1/
http://www.digital-web.com/articles/the_rise_of_flash_video_part_2/
http://www.digital-web.com/articles/the_rise_of_flash_video_part_3/ 

Yes, you can get (pretty) good quality flash video at a low file size

Quicktime gives good quality (at a larger file size) but just isn't as 
ubiquitous as flash...

My 2c anyway


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RE: [WSG] Content not appearing in IE

2007-06-28 Thread Paul Bennett
Peekaboo bug?

http://www.positioniseverything.net/explorer/peekaboo.html

Paul


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RE: [WSG] Safari now on Windows

2007-06-12 Thread Paul Bennett
  Then how will you test for ... IE 5 Mac

Like the rest of us - he won't
:)


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RE: [WSG] Safari now on Windows

2007-06-11 Thread Paul Bennett
 a friend called me on the weekend and said he can't find anything newer than 
 IE5 for OS9 but won't upgrade to OSX because it would be way too slow on his 
 G3. (and he doesn't have the money to buy a new machine)
 now that is something to think about! 

Ah, nothing like a good bit of hardware AND software lock-in to make the user 
smile

*ducks*


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RE: [WSG] Suggestions Please for: CMS / E-commerce Solutions

2007-05-28 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi all,

I just have to pitch in here. My dealings with Drupal have been less than 
wonderful. I find it vague and confusing  (kind of like it's trying to be 
everything to everyone) and when I tried to create a new template I found all 
sorts of crappy table-based code needed, as well as the need to create bits of 
files all over the place to get one new template working.

In my experience, something like Expression Engine 
(http://www.expressionengine.com) or wordpress (http://www.wordpress.org) would 
be a far better bet for a simple CMS and a heck of a lot easier for a 
non-technical editor to use.

Just my 2c anyway
Paul


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RE: [WSG] RE: Error help

2007-05-23 Thread Paul Bennett
In my experience, browser crashes == bad JavaScript or bad video
 
In Firefox and Opera - the flash video shows the message 'a required component 
is missing from your system! Click here to add component'
(no js errors in either browser)
 
there are a lot of requests to dev.theweddingshow.com.au when the page loads - 
could this cause an error?
 
In IE7 - I get a warning : 'this website wants to run the following add-on: 
Windows Media Player Extension ...'
(the pink scroll bars are really cheesy looking  - I'm guessing that was a 
client 'must-have' ? :) )

IE6 : I just get a popup to confirm I want to load flash content
 
None of my browsers 'crash' - my advice would be to visit the client and get 
them to show you exactly what's happening.
 
HTH,
Paul


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RE: [WSG] New Yorker Redesign

2007-03-27 Thread Paul Bennett
 misc:exposeBean var=platform bean=platform/


Never a good look to expose your beans in public...

Apart from that it seems to be just url encoding issues - great to see more and 
more large sites moving to standards based code

Paul


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RE: [WSG] Global and page-specific style sheets

2007-03-13 Thread Paul Bennett
One of the best things we did was to follow Doug Bowmans (webstock '06) 
suggestion to break up stylesheets into logical components and include them in 
one main file.

Our 'styles.css' file now looks like this:
-
@import url(styles-contentTables.css);
@import url(styles-forms.css);
@import url(styles-mainnav.css);
@import url(styles-popups.css);
@import url(styles-secondarynav.css);
@import url(styles-textformatting.css);

/* generic rules go here */
---

It may take a while, but I promise you you'll thank yourself later on :)
It was great advice and we've never regretted it.
Paul


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RE: [WSG] Global and page-specific style sheets

2007-03-13 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi Chris,

Basically if I'm looking to change something in the main nav, I look in 
mainnav.css, if I'm altering a header for a table in our content area, I look 
in   contentTables.css etc, etc.

The main file was 30K (!) before we started trimming it down and breaking up. 
Yes it's more http connections, but it is *way* easier to find things and  
easier to maintain.

I understand where you're coming from for small css files, but for large sites 
and applications splitting up the files is (in my opinion) invaluable.

Paul


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RE: [WSG] PopUp windows

2007-03-07 Thread Paul Bennett
Anyone remember frames?
It's a plan so crazy it just might work! 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chris Williams
Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2007 8:23 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: RE: [WSG] PopUp windows

This sounds like a perfect application for Ajax.  Have the TOC on the
left, the actual document on the right... opens as you click through the
TOC?

Just a thought...

-Original Message-
From: Bob Schwartz
Subject: Re: [WSG] PopUp windows

Example would be a page with a sort of table of contents which lists  
minutes of the past five years board meeting, the user clicks on one,  
it pops up they read it, print it or whatever, then go to the next.

It gives them a chance to browse without leaving the TOC page,


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RE: [WSG] background image

2007-03-01 Thread Paul Bennett
Without more info...check the URL of the background image in your CSS? 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of kevin mcmonagle
Sent: Friday, March 02, 2007 7:49 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] background image

Hi,
Just one more question about this page:

http://www.arena7.ie/index2.html

When viewing the above page with ie6 pc can you see the diagonal striped 
bacground pattern?
I have ie6 running locally on an old machine thats offline and its not 
showing up.

thanks for all the help

-best
kvnmcwebn
www.mcmonagledesign.com




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RE: [WSG] Javascript to check for Handheld Devices

2007-03-01 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi David,

In my experience, you can't guarantee that a mobile device will be a full 
fledged 'browser' (like Opera mini or Safari for the iPhone), so you don't know 
if JS will be supported on a handheld device. This may be less likely now, but 
is still valid.

Example: About 3 - 4 years ago I had a Palm based Kyocera which did a pretty 
good job of rendering HTML (including allowing you to submit form data), but 
had no JS or CSS support.

Is there anything wrong with using something like:

 @media handheld { /* insert rules here */ }

http://developer.openwave.com/documentation/xhtml_mp_css_reference/css-ref5.html#669571

Also, this may be helpful:
http://developer.openwave.com/documentation/xhtml_mp_css_reference/

Let us know what you think,
Paul

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RE: [WSG] Website Directory Structure - Best Practice

2006-03-19 Thread Paul Bennett
I smell troll
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RE: [WSG] Website Directory Structure - Best Practice

2006-03-19 Thread Paul Bennett
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll

:)

Tip (to pay for this OT post): Web developer resource list:
http://www.listible.com/list/online-tools2C-generators2C-checkers 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Herrod, Lisa
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 11:26 AM
To: 'wsg@webstandardsgroup.org'
Subject: RE: [WSG] Website Directory Structure - Best Practice

here's me showing my greeny status again... ;) What do they mean when they
mean when they say that.. :(

-Original Message-
From: Paul Bennett [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, 20 March 2006 10:15 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: RE: [WSG] Website Directory Structure - Best Practice


I smell troll


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RE: [WSG] page break when printing

2006-03-09 Thread Paul Bennett

common mistake, often referred to as div-mania (or something along 

It's famous!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divitis
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RE: [WSG] Site Check/Launch: Edentiti.com

2006-03-02 Thread Paul Bennett


On 3/2/06, Lachlan Hunt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 

 ... due to Dead  Edwards' IE7 script not working  

Man, when did Dean Edwards die? I know his last post was in December, but I 
didn't know he was *dead*

Maybe MS will make IE7 standards compliant in his honour... ;)

Paul
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RE: [WSG] Introduction and first submission

2006-02-23 Thread Paul Bennett
trust the Texans to be loud!
 
;)
 
Tip - a great resource site: http://www.alvit.de/handbook/ [web developer's 
handbook] 

Paul



From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Herrod, Lisa
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2006 10:38 AM
To: 'wsg@webstandardsgroup.org'
Subject: RE: [WSG] Introduction and first submission


Oh I can see an Austin WSG forming already!

-Original Message-
From: Helmut Granda [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, 24 February 2006 7:35 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: RE: [WSG] Introduction and first submission



Welcome Sharron.. Im in Austin too! (just in case you were wondering J )

 

...helmut



From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of 
Paul Menard
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 2:13 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Introduction and first submission

 

Another Texan! Welcome Sharron. I'm here in Austin. 

- Original Message 
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2006 2:06:29 PM
Subject: [WSG] Introduction and first submission




Pardon a silly question, but is it standard procedure to introduce 
one's self? I stumbled upon this site several days ago and have been inundated 
with wonderfully interesting and helpful information ever since.

 

I did read that I need to only use plain text, so I must first figure 
out how that is done on a email by email basis using Outlook Express.

 

I am Sharron a resident of the state of Texas, USA. I am a fairly 
newcomer to css, validation etcetera. 

 

Regards

 

Sharron

 

 

 

 

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RE: [WSG] Plain text v HTML on this list

2006-02-22 Thread Paul Bennett
You mean none of you can see my animated gifs?

;)

To set default messages to plain text in Outlook: 
Tools  Options  Mail Format - Compose message in: Plain text (drop down box)

To set html messages as plain text when replying:
Format  Plain Text (or Alt+o t for all us keyboard junkies)

Paul 'I miss Mozilla mail' Bennett



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tom Worthington
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 12:23 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Plain text v HTML on this list

At 09:46 AM 2/22/2006, Nick Gleitzman wrote:
... could list members please use plain text for posting? ... kinder to 
those who only have dialup connections ...

And those of us on slow supposedly broadband wireless links.

... makes the posts more legible. I, for one, tend to skip over posts 
which are rendered in my mail client in teeny tiny text...

I have told my mail client to render the HTML as plain text with no images. 
This works fine most of the time. Any message I can't read this way is 
probably not worth reading anyway, particularly on a list about web design.



Tom Worthington FACS HLM [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ph: 0419 496150
Director, Tomw Communications Pty LtdABN: 17 088 714 309
PO Box 13, Belconnen ACT 2617http://www.tomw.net.au/
Director, ACS Communications Tech Board   http://www.acs.org.au/ctb/
Visiting Fellow, ANU  Blog: http://www.tomw.net.au/blog/atom.xml  

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RE: [WSG] Confusing the users... In Page Links

2006-02-21 Thread Paul Bennett
Actually Mike, according to a recent Jakob Neilsen study, Jakob Neilsen is 
right 100% of the time.
;) 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Brown
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 3:28 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Confusing the users... In Page Links

Herrod, Lisa wrote:
 This is really interesting article in that it contradicts findings of a
 recent study we completed just 2 weeks ago.
 
 We recently conducted user testing on a site with 22 participants, which is
 a significant sample (often we test with 8 to 12).
  
 The demographic was 18 skilled workers and 4 employers of skilled workers.
 Balance of gender, spread of age and technical ability (novice to expert).
 
 
 We received very positive feedback from the users about in-page links, so
 much so that it was reported as a positive attribute of the site. In fact,
 about 25% commented that they liked these links, without being asked.
 

You usability people, always with the testing!

You don't know there's a 99% chance Jakob is always right?

:)

Mike
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RE: [WSG] The dilemma: tabular data with sublevels

2006-01-26 Thread Paul Bennett
You're saying that Add is a definition of Item 1 

   dtItem 1/dt
   dda href=?add=123Add/a/dd
   dda href=?edit=123Edit/a/dd
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RE: [WSG] Form editor that doesn't use tables for layout

2006-01-08 Thread Paul Bennett



On this page:
http://www.formarchitect.com/content/index.php

It took me about 5 minutes to figure out I had to click 
'Create Form' after I'd just clicked 'Start New Form' - that part is not clear 
or user-friendly

Also the google ads under your main tabs are misleading - 
it looks like they are sub-pages of the correct tab and people like me are 
likely to hit them by accident thinking they're going to a page *on your 
site*

Paul


From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Eric 
SmithSent: Monday, January 09, 2006 4:36 PMTo: 
wsg@webstandardsgroup.orgSubject: [WSG] Form editor that doesn't use 
tables for layout
Hello all,I've recently put online a free visual form editor 
that allows the creation of html forms without using tables for layout and I'd 
appreciate any suggestions for the editor and the html/css code it 
generates. My aim is to show that css layout is more than capable 
of replicating any table based form layout, and my hope is that the editor 
(always free and publicly available) makes creating and editing the layout quick 
and easy. The site is http://www.formarchitect.comThanks,Eric


RE: [WSG] New to Standards.

2006-01-04 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi AlvAro,

The WSG Resources section is a good place to start:
http://webstandardsgroup.org/resources/ 

:)
Paul
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RE: [WSG] Server-side includes?

2005-12-18 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi,
 
this discussion has been had before - follow this thread:
http://www.mail-archive.com/wsg@webstandardsgroup.org/msg22706.html


:)
Paul


From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chris Lamberson
Sent: Monday, December 19, 2005 11:26 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] Server-side includes?


I suppose I have always very much disliked server-side includes, for no reason 
I can immediately think up, they just seem like bad form. But if I really think 
about it, it doesn't matter what goes on as long as it gets to the client in a 
standards-compliant, semantically correct form. A business partner of mine 
wants to use includes in our site, and I want to tell him no, but I also can't 
think of a good reason to give him. My question is: are server-side includes 
good, bad, or neither in the eyes of standards and semantics? 
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RE: [WSG] New logo scheme was talking points for standards

2005-12-07 Thread Paul Bennett
Trolling? 
:)

Tip:(unrelated to this dead thread)

I found this good reference: a list of commonly confused HTML special characters
http://www.cs.sfu.ca/~ggbaker/reference/characters/#single


Paul

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Alan Trick
Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 3:36 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: RE: [WSG] New logo scheme was talking points for standards

I was just thinking about that and I don't think google.com (or for that
matter - anything that company creates) would manage to get more than 1
star.

On Wed, 2005-12-07 at 12:00 +1100, Peter Williams wrote:
  From: Herrod, Lisa
  
  Who really pays attention to the badges?
  
  Are the badges useful? really? surely an accessibility page 
  on the site is more informative and helpful/useful/clear
  to those who are interested.
  
  We work this way because it's best practice and the right 
  thing to do; it's faster and more efficient...
 
 I should point out that I don't use the W3C buttons on any
 sites, I try always to make sites comply with standards and
 to be functionally efficient. I wouldn't use any new rating
 or badge system either unless it was mandated.
 
 I think it would be amusing to see all the pretty but broken
 sites with no stars or 1 star though.
 

__
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 

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RE: [WSG] Fluid problems

2005-11-16 Thread Paul Bennett
There's a message here:

*Before* asking - VALIDATE your code! :)

Paul 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of The Visual 
Process
Sent: Thursday, November 17, 2005 10:38 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Fluid problems

Why does your base.css file have html in it? 

Adam Morris wrote:

I'm having BIG problems trying to get the content of this site to be 
held within the image 'containers' I've used. Help me, please?! I'm 
beginning to lose it.

Adam

http://www.janelehrer.co.uk/live5
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RE: [WSG] Server Side Includes

2005-11-08 Thread Paul Bennett
SSI is irrelevant to standards, as the code is parsed  by the webserver (and 
the include file placed in the output code) before the browser/client receives 
it

Paul

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 1:10 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [WSG] Server Side Includes

Richard,

I use SSI's for my navigation, and I've never had any problems with validation, 
or structure.

Kind regards,
Mario

 Are there any standards issues around using server side includes? For 
 example a simple include of another file e.g.

 -- #include file=test.html --

 Does it matter that this is making use of code within comments 
 (without wishing to start the debate about IE conditional code in 
 comments again), or is it irrelevant because this will not be seen by the 
 browser?

 Thanks,  Richard Morton

 QM Consulting Ltd



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RE: [WSG] Server Side Includes

2005-11-08 Thread Paul Bennett
 I use XHTML Strict, and if my markup in the SSI file contains a deprecated 
 property then it won't validate.

This is an issue with the *code in the include*
NOT 
with server side includes.

This list is about standards-compliant code - SSI has no bearing on whether a 
site is or isn't standards compliant, hence the initial point still stands - 
SSI is irrelevant to standards compliance.

Paul
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RE: [WSG] firefox ignoring my stylesheet

2005-11-03 Thread Paul Bennett
Nothing that I can see at a cursory glance, but it may help to validate your 
stylesheet:
http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mcmonagle.biz%2Ftheme%2Fstandards2.csswarning=1profile=css2usermedium=all

Paul
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RE: [WSG] Firefox mystery space bug?

2005-10-17 Thread Paul Bennett
I get the big gap in FF 1.07.

Interestingly the page renders without the gap until the main content is filled 
in, at which time the footer of the page 'jumps' down - creating the gap in  
question.

I can't find anything out of the ordinary in your css, (although some shorthand 
would go down well) and no known bugs spring to mind. Oddly, the page looks 
fine in Ie, Opera 8 and even Netscape 6.2!!!

My troubleshooting advice would be to remove and replace elements in the main 
content one at a  time until you can see which is triggering the bug..

Let us know how you get on :)

Paul

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Christian Montoya
Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2005 10:05 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Firefox mystery space bug?

 Joseph R. B. Taylor wrote:

  Guys and gals,
 
  check this out.  http://hayteam.sitesbyjoe.com/default.asp
 
  I get this occasional bug to show in Firefox for Windows.  What 
  happens is occasionally Firefox puts a big space at the bottom of my 
  content before just before the footer as if I had a bunch of spaces 
  in there.  It doesn't always happen, but sometimes it shows up if I 
  refresh a few times, then after another refresh it disappears.
 
  I have also seen it creep on this site too:
  http://northstartraffic.com/default.asp
 

I can't recreate the problem on either website. I'm using FF 1.5 Beta 2, maybe 
they fixed the bug?

What I did see, was if I visited
http://hayteam.sitesbyjoe.com/default.asp#, the footer link styling was messed 
up, and wouldn't fix itself if I reloaded 
http://hayteam.sitesbyjoe.com/default.asp, I had to reload 
http://hayteam.sitesbyjoe.com. I then tried http://hayteam.sitesbyjoe.com/, and 
sure enough, http://hayteam.sitesbyjoe.com/# did the same problem again, and I 
couldn't fix it at all, not even going to http://hayteam.sitesbyjoe.com/ or 
http://hayteam.sitesbyjoe.com would work. Maybe this is all an ASP problem?

Any idea?
--
- C Montoya
rdpdesign.com ... liquid.rdpdesign.com ... montoya.rdpdesign.com
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RE: [WSG] Chinese food and web standards

2005-10-12 Thread Paul Bennett
and the market share of Linux in general in my own web site stats is next to 
nil.

Wouldn't a LOT of Linux users now be Firefox users too?

The OS is not the concern here (although Konqueror is Linux exclusive? ), it's 
getting things working in (somewhat imperfect) browsers. 

Ian is expressing a valid commercial concern: trying to give users a 
consistent, functional experience despite browser inconsistencies.

Paul
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RE: [WSG] Chinese food and web standards

2005-10-12 Thread Paul Bennett

but there should be something similar which uses the KDE desktop.

Knoppix uses KDE from (rather rusty) memory

http://www.Knoppix.org 

Paul
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RE: [WSG] site check: liquid.rdpdesign.com

2005-10-10 Thread Paul Bennett
FOUC?

an empty script tag will do it, ie:

script type=text/javascript/script

(after the styles are imported / included iirc...)

Paul
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RE: [WSG] How do I vertical-align bottom

2005-10-05 Thread Paul Bennett
2 options spring to mind:
 
(1) give the div margin-top to push it to the bottom. This way, even if the 
above content expands, the div *should* still appear at the bottom of the table 
cell
 
(2) Rowspan the other two cells and split the third (containing the div) into 
two rows eg:


 ---
| | |   |
|   |   | cell 3
|
|   |   |   
|
| cell 1| cell 2|   
|
| (rowspan = 2) | (rowspan = 2) |   |
|   |   |   
|
|   |   |---
|   |   | cell 4
|
|   |   |(vert-align: bottom)   |
|   |   |(contains div) |
 ---

Paul
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RE: [WSG] Big Websites that turned Accessible

2005-10-04 Thread Paul Bennett
(1) Trim your posts
(2) That reply would be better off-list

Tip to 'pay' for this post (ala evolt.org):

If, for any reason, you're using word-to-html conversion, here's a handy tool 
to help you clean up some of that gorgeous WORD 'markup':

http://textism.com/wordcleaner/

:)
Paul
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RE: [WSG] Homepage Review: webnetdesignstudios.com

2005-10-02 Thread Paul Bennett
 dl id=testimonial
 dtJoe Coyle, President, www.coylemedical.com/dt ddMr. Cisneros and his 
 team have 
 an extraordinary talent for customer communication, market vision, and web 
 page 
 design./dd dl

 feel free to bite my head off - I haven't been following this thread closely. 

There seems to be a tendency lately to use definition lists for way more than I 
think they're supposed to be used for.

In the above example, is this (semantically) equivalent to saying that the 
definition of 'Joe Coyle, President, www'
is
'Mr. Cisneros and his team have an extraordinary talent for customer 
communication, market vision, and web page design'?

Obviously untrue, but I'm open to 'enlightenment' ;)

Paul
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RE: [WSG] IE6 not shrinking space at pure dom explorer list trouble

2005-09-22 Thread Paul Bennett
Hi Isabel,

Firstly your request was a *whole lot* for us list members to take in, hence 
the lack of responses.

Secondly, the list is fine for me in IE6 (Windows XP, Service Pack 2).

The list is expanded as the page loads, the script then seems to load which 
collapses the list. The images below the list then move up into the space, just 
as they do in FFox.

What version of IE are you using? Operating system?

Paul
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RE: [WSG] controlling font size in form text box

2005-09-21 Thread Paul Bennett
1. personally that font size is already borderline readable (and I have good 
vision) any smaller than 9px (some would say 10px) is getting into the 
squinty-eyes arena.
2. According to my screen callipers, the font size the designer wants is 7px. 
There's a reason it looks too small at this size - because it is. Your designer 
might have to just be happy with 9px IMHO.

Paul

tip type=Screen Callipers
Need to measure things onscreen (to appease designers, for example) then check 
out this 'Screen Callipers' utility:

http://www.iconico.com/caliper/index.aspx

(I'm not afflated, just a happy user)
/tip
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RE: [WSG] Web font families

2005-09-12 Thread Paul Bennett
And Times New Roman is the default font by browsers, if I remember correctly? 
At least 
IE's default font.

I may be wrong (it happened once before ;) ) but I would think that the browser 
would use the default SYSTEM serif font. Seeing as this (for Windows) is Times 
New Roman, that's what you'll see on Windows machines...

Welcoming feedback from those more 'in the know'

Paul
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RE: [WSG] Browsers as copilers (was) Barclays standards redesign

2005-09-08 Thread Paul Bennett

Screenshots of a browser displaying (X)HTML errors in the same manner that a 
compiler 
does may get the message across that valid markup is important to those that 
make the 
decisions about such things. I'd certainly find it useful.

although I foresee browsing with that extension may be a version of hell for 
many of us - can you imagine seeing the html errors for *every* page you 
viewed?

one might want to take up gardening instead... :)
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RE: [WSG] Barclays standards redesign

2005-09-07 Thread Paul Bennett
It doesn't actually validate. (watch wrap)

http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.barclays.co.uk%2Fpremier%2Fcharset=%28detect+automatically%29doctype=Inlineverbose=1

http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.barclays.co.uk%2Fcharset=%28detect+automatically%29doctype=Inlineverbose=1


You've got to blame the web development company for this one. We had a similar 
issue (before I started here) where the organisation I work for demanded s 
'standards compliant site redesign'. Unfortunately no one in the team was code 
savvy enough to police it and in the end we got an old school broken tables in 
tables in tables layout with a 40Kb stylesheet to semi-control layout.

The developers answer to making it 'standards compliant' was to add a DOCTYPE, 
which none of the code actually fits.

Now it's part of my job to try and clean up some of their mess and make it 
validate.

Standards compliance needs to be built into RFP's from the get-go and then 
enforced by companies who pay the web-dev's.

You have been warned ;) 

Paul
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RE: [WSG] Tables and divs and soon

2005-09-07 Thread Paul Bennett
*unless the desired effect...*

Why fighting the medium?
If that *desire effect* is purely visual, then I think there is a problem...

Yep, they're called 'Clients' :)

Paul
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RE: [WSG] Tables and divs and soon

2005-09-07 Thread Paul Bennett
I'd say that people who rely heavily on tables are the ones who obviously do 
not care 
about standards.

Or they just DON'T KNOW.

I work in an organisation where our only other coder hasn't been formally 
trained, was thrown into intranet work out of necessity and has learnt 'web 
stuff' by trial and error. Her technical savvy is pretty good but limited and 
she is quite terrified by change.

Getting her to throw away her precious tables for divs is an ongoing challenge, 
but it's not a case of her 'not caring'.

We need to take great care when evangelising standards that it doesn't become a 
guilt-trip or pseudo-religious debate. Evangelise the benefits, and be patient 
- not everyone has been exposed to the paradigm-shift that is standards 
compliant design.


Paul

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RE: [WSG] Barclays standards redesign

2005-09-07 Thread Paul Bennett
be glad you're learning about web standards now - it'll make getting a good job 
a lot easier.

The capability of my tutors wasn't much better than yours. Even Zeldman has 
lamented lately (sorry - googled and couldn't find the entry) that Universities 
can teach molecular physics but apparently are unable to teach 
standards-compliant web design.
 
 
*sigh*
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RE: [WSG] accessibility - opening new windows philosophy

2005-08-15 Thread Paul Bennett
I'm not familiar with it being a 'web standard' not to open a new window for a 
link. Can someone enlighten me?

Paul
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[WSG] RE: Hot Topic: HTML design

2005-08-15 Thread Paul Bennett
Great topic! 

I had some experience using xml / xslt earlier this year. I was fiddling with 
w3schools xslt tutorial which uses client-side xslt transformation and I 
finally saw what all the xml fuss was about. The content could be marked up 
meaningfully (according to the actual data) then xslt could lay out the content 
and css could style it.

It was a real 'wow' moment as the xml penny finally dropped - a total 
separation of content and presentation, with no server-side shenanigans needed 
to convert the xml content. As soon as there is consistent browser support for 
client side xslt, we'll be able to deliver pure xml to the client and have it 
apply style and layout as the / browser chooses. True accessibility and 
universality. The web equivalent of 'Zen' ;)

In my experience it's not the content that's the problem - it's the outlying 
structure (header, footer, nav, branding) that gets in the way of true 
'semanticity' (look Ma - I done made me up a new word!). If we had a way (no, 
not frames) to semantically separate the nav / branding fluff from the actual 
core content we would be set.

Thoughts welcome,

Paul 
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RE: [WSG] New front page for http://abc.net.au/

2005-08-03 Thread Paul Bennett
not to me - want screenshots? IN IE the homepage actually defaults to 
http://abc.net.au/default_800.htm
and in FF to
http://abc.net.au/

I thought all those nasty browser-sniffing days were over 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Andreas Boehmer 
[Addictive Media]
Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 11:46 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: RE: [WSG] New front page for http://abc.net.au/

 




From: Gary Menzel [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, 4 August 2005 9:35 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] New front page for http://abc.net.au/


 For some reason - the layout is quite different between IE and Firefox.

Looks the same to me in both browsers.
 



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RE: [WSG] New front page for http://abc.net.au/

2005-08-03 Thread Paul Bennett
IE6, Win XP, SP2 

Strange - it doesn't redirect for me. Are you using PC or MAC? I have tried IE 
6 and IE 5.5 on the PC and in both cases I go to http://www.abc.net.au, not 
http://abc.net.au/default_800.htm


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RE: [WSG] New front page for http://abc.net.au/

2005-08-03 Thread Paul Bennett
Browser sniffing, resolution sniffing - same difference to me.

It leads to fractured site design and multiple pages / scripts doing one thing. 
I'm on 1280 x 1024 and so wondered whay I got the 800 x 600 page. Turns out my 
browser fired up at just under 1024 x 768 and I was lumped into the less than 
1024 x 768 bracket.

I can understand this as it would be a challenge to fit 4 columns across an 800 
x 600 screen and still have things readable. What would be a little nicer is if 
the browser was served a slightly amended stylesheet rather than needing a 
redirect to a 'special' page (thus giving developers another home page version 
to maintain.)

Ironically, with JavaScript disabled an 800x600 viewport is served the 1024x768 
homepage, thus destroying the whole 'lowest common denominator' thing.

Terrence, I would reconcile it with a PDA (mobile browser) by understanding 
that that browser will either strip out all semblance of style and layout from 
my page (as in the majority of version 1 mobile browsers), or that I MAY be 
able to serve it a mobile stylesheet (support is not great). What I WOULD NOT 
do is sniff for mobile devices and create YET ANOTHER home page for them.

Standards people, standards - leave the rendering to the device, PLEASE don't 
go back to the bad old days of creating special pages for this resolution, that 
resolution, this device, that device.

 This site has done a good job of that by using standards compliant code, and 
the seperate homepage is simply a nod to the fact that some users are still 
using that resolution. Yes, it could have been done better but so could a lot 
of things I do every day

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Terrence Wood
Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 12:22 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Cc: Terrence Wood
Subject: Re: [WSG] New front page for http://abc.net.au/

it's not browser sniffing it's resolution sniffing, and it it browser 
independent.

Browser sniffing is bad becuase it breaks stuff. Enhancing things based on 
browser capabilities (in this case how much content fits in the
viewport) is OK, most scripting relies on it. The important thing is that the 
site site works without scripting.

Does it matter if it looks the exactly the same in a particular browser 
compared with another? And if so, how do you reconcile that with say, a pda?


kind regards
Terrence Wood.


On 4 Aug 2005, at 11:53 AM, Paul Bennett wrote:

 not to me - want screenshots? IN IE the homepage actually defaults to 
 http://abc.net.au/default_800.htm and in FF to http://abc.net.au/

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RE: [WSG] Longhorn Avalon - seismic shift for web standards?

2005-07-14 Thread Paul Bennett
hmmmI smell Troll...

You don't work for Microsoft do you David?

:)


From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Pietersen
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 1:41 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Longhorn  Avalon - seismic shift for web standards?


 But, if you're in the business of building web apps that target a specific 
 platform.. :)
 
We all do, really.  I am at home, and don't have the research here, but current 
statistics show that 97.4% of all devices accessing web content are running on 
Windows.  Every one of these machines has IE on it.  Really, are we mad to 
develop for anything else?  Discuss. 
 
 
 


 
On 7/15/05, Philippe Wittenbergh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 


On 15 Jul 2005, at 9:54 am, Paul Ross wrote:

 The most important difference between Avalon and the current Windows 
 display architecture is that Avalon is vector based. The vector
 structure allows scalable graphics (windows, fonts  icons), meaning
 designers can specify shapes and objects onscreen instead of mapping 
 elements using pixels and x/y coordinates.

Apple (OS X, Core graphics), recent KDE (using SVG) and recent Gnome
already have this build.

 What does all this mean for the web standards community? Am I reading 
 too much into this by thinking this is a seismic shift in the way we
 could be building websites in the future? In particular - what are the
 implications in the XHTML/CSS path versus something like Flash? 

That will depend on what the browser supports. A webpage is not an
application.
SVG (and the canvas tag) is the obvious answer here.

Firefox nightly builds (and DeerPark dev. preview) already have full 
SVG support build in.
Opera 8: idem (only SVG tiny, atm).
Safari and Webkit supports the canvas tag, SVG support (the patches
made by the KDE team) has landed recently in the CVS tree, meaning you
can already build Webkit with SVG support yourself. 
Konqueror recent builds should support SVG as well.

Internet exploder: no support, except via the Adobe plugin. Maybe in
the elusive Longhorn.

As far as webstandards goes: no shift. You can use svg as a 
background-image, or for a series of buttons, or...


Philippe
---
Philippe Wittenbergh
http://emps.l-c-n.com/

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RE: [WSG] Visited Link Styling

2005-07-04 Thread Paul Bennett
r U k1dd1n??
L1n3-thru l1nx sh0w wikked CSS h4x0r skillz, 'speshly w1f bl4ck bg c0l0ur and 
gr33n 'MATRIX' c0l0ur linx

LOL

;) 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Terrence Wood
Sent: Tuesday, July 05, 2005 1:19 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] Visited Link Styling

or some people, like me, just find line-through links annoying =)

regards
Terrence Wood.

On 5 Jul 2005, at 12:23 PM, Patrick H. Lauke wrote:
 As others pointed out, it's more of a usability question

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RE: [WSG] Will HTML be nicer to PHP than XHTML?

2005-07-03 Thread Paul Bennett
 
Subject: Re: [WSG] Will HTML be nicer to PHP than XHTML?

Personally, I believe this is one of the strong argumens for XHTML. PHP is 
very sloppy, and when you combine that with another sloppy language, HTML, the 
mess is tremendos. For small projects and new people it's not much of an 
issue, but try to maintain a large codebase without it being incredibly buggy.

Using XHTML forces you towards good practices, something that is good to do 
from the begining before you develop those bad habits. I don't know who was 
objecting to using XHTML, but IMHO it will interfere with you learning of PHP 
less than HTML because it will force you to know what your doing, which is 
the point of learning.

In PHP's defence, stupid sloppy code can be written in ANY language. (Don't 
believe me? Head over to http://www.thedailywtf.com and see some real-world 
examples.)

PHP's lack of pickiness (compared to Java for example) is what has allowed it 
to be accessible to so many people, without requiring the very steep learning 
curve some other languages require. Good developers  write good code. Period.

let me repeat again. THERE IS NO LINK BETWEEN BAD HTML AND PHP.

This thread needs to die.




RE: [WSG] Will HTML be nicer to PHP than XHTML?

2005-06-27 Thread Paul Bennett
ARGH! The logo's - the logo's!!!
My EYES! 

-Original Message-
Hi

This could prove immensely helpful:
http://loadaveragezero.com/vnav/labs/PHP/
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RE: [WSG] why doesn't this validate with w3c.org and what to do about it

2005-05-26 Thread Paul Bennett
is this CSS inline or included in a file?

If it's included in a file, the w3c validator won't mind at all. If its inline 
then the validator might not like it.

No personal experience - just a hunch...

Paul 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bruce Gilbert
Sent: Friday, May 27, 2005 2:26 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] why doesn't this validate with w3c.org and what to do about it

I have some comments within my CSS to let me or anyone else know what is 
controlling what

eg: 
/*aligns list in middle of page*/
p.middle{test-align:center}

validation doesn't like this.is there a fix? or should I just ignore???

TIA

--
::Bruce::
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RE: [WSG] Mystical belief in the power of Web Standards, Usability, and tableless CSS

2005-04-20 Thread Paul Bennett
 
 Yep, he probably is right about that , but he's wrong about something else  
 . My home page uses  web standards and it's no monument to great design. 
 http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.webpagesthatsuck.com%2F...

Hah! But theres only *88* errors, so its not that bad ;)
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RE: [WSG] LOC new release - standards or looks?

2005-04-19 Thread Paul Bennett



Thanks 
for the heads up Doug,

This 
is great news and good to see that developers are really picking up on standards 
compliant design and working that into projects of this 
scale.
The 
site does not yetvalidate and the encoded ampersands are a big issue in 
this (in fact the only issue on the front page)

One 
issue I have noticed is that some major developer sites and 'famous' css layout 
based sites actually don't validate. Is there a trend growing 
that people are building css based sites for the 'look' and not 
actuallycaring aboutstandards? Is it becoming about a 
'style'?

For 
example, a large site I work onwas redesigned recently (before I arrived) and the company specified that 
the code must validate. From wading through the muck they produced it appears 
that all the development company did was add a doctype to each page and 
for them this was 'valid code'. Worse, the site was built in nested tables (you 
go through 3 nested tables before hitting the actual page content) and the 
doctype in no way reflects the code or structure of the site. We are a LONG way 
from validating and it will be me that cleans up the 
mess.

Has 
anyoneelse noticed this kind oflip-service being paidto 
standards by devlopers?




RE: [WSG] CSS Zen Garden piss take, anyone got link?

2005-04-17 Thread Paul Bennett
http://brucelawson.co.uk/garden
?
 
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RE: [WSG] Background image in the mast head...

2005-04-12 Thread Paul Bennett
from a cursory examination it seesm to position the top left corner of a span 
(500px width) 500px to the left of the edge of the visible page. (thus making 
the span invisible.)

In what context is it being used?

Paul  

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Devendra 
Shrikhande
Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2005 11:22 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: RE: [WSG] Background image in the mast head...

Russ:

As a newbie to CSS, I do not know what this does:

#masthead span { position: absolute; left: -500px; width: 500px; }

Would appreciate your explanation - thanks!

#DSS#
 


-Original Message-

There are so many ways to do this but I would not use a spacer gif. One way you 
could go is:

HTML
div id=masthead
a href=http://mysite.com;spanMy Site/span/a /div

CSS
#masthead { width: 750px; height: 100px; background: blah... } #masthead a { 
display: block; width: 750px; height: 100px; } #masthead span {
position: absolute; left: -500px; width: 500px; }

Be warned, this was written quickly without any checking, so be careful
:)

The advantage with this method is that for non-css users they will get your 
text. Also, when you go to print it you can use this text version if you need 
to, instead of a background image. There is also another advantage. You can set 
the a element to any size - it does not need to be the entire size of the 
banner - you could have it only the size of a logo within the banner image. So, 
in some ways this method gives you a good degree of flexibility.

However, like all methods there are good and bad. Worth looking at a range of 
them and deciding what is right for your needs.

Russ

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