Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
dwain wrote: i agree, put the poem in a div, place the poem inside a p, use br / (br for html4) at the end of each line and a double br / between stanzas (unless you are writing a very long poem, then i'd go for p at every stanza). cheers, dwain Hello Web Standards Group List Readers, This is my first post here, and i am looking forward to more conclusive discussions. Now back on topic. If you ask me, i would say that a double br is a p already. Look at word processing programs. When you wish for a double br you will simply type Enter. If you want a line-break you will mostly do a Shift+Enter. p is a paragraph and a poem can consist of multiple paragraphs, called verses. The discussion might be about small matters, but i feel p looks more like it fits breaking a poem into verses. Another idea might be using an ul list instead of div an wrapping the poems into li list elements, since your chained div elements would result in a list of poems. So far my first thoughts. regards, Jens *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Jens Nedal wrote: [...] If you ask me, i would say that a double br is a p already. Look at word processing programs. When you wish for a double br you will simply type Enter. If you want a line-break you will mostly do a Shift+Enter. Word processing isn't web design, and one has to look beyond the visual when selecting markup since markup convey both visual and non-visual meaning by its presence, or absence. A br doesn't tell anything about the context it's in - it is just a line-break no matter where it is found. How many breaks one add doesn't change that. Visually a br can have some height, line-height or zero height, depending on how one styles it, so one can not rely on it to create a space to add additional meaning either. p is a paragraph and a poem can consist of multiple paragraphs, called verses. The discussion might be about small matters, but i feel p looks more like it fits breaking a poem into verses. One can observe some discussion about how to markup poems and alike on the HTML 5 lists, and so far series of paragraphs with line-breaks (br) as appropriate and spans for additional styling seems to be the only somewhat suitable option. I think that'll stick ... unless they add new, dedicated, elements for poems, which seems unlikely. Since one can style paragraphs, spans and line-breaks as one wants, one can achieve quite acceptable visual presentations with control of white-space etc., without losing or messing up more than one has to for the non-styled and/or non-visual presentation. Wrapping the whole poem in a div (division/section) provides for additional styling. regards Georg -- http://www.gunlaug.no *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Matijs wrote: I have to agree with Elizabeth here. Semantically I'd say that this is one of the few occasions where a br/ would be appropriate. The verses would be paragraphs of course. I did this a while back on a site for an author. I decided it was the best compromise between practicallity, readability and standards. I gave each verse a CSS class called 'stanza'. See: http://www.webscribe.fsnet.co.uk/chapters/c3summer.html Bob www.gwelanmor-internet.co.uk *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 9:37 AM, Designer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Matijs wrote: I have to agree with Elizabeth here. Semantically I'd say that this is one of the few occasions where a br/ would be appropriate. The verses would be paragraphs of course I did this a while back on a site for an author. I decided it was the best compromise between practicallity, readability and standards. I gave each verse a CSS class called 'stanza'. See: http://www.webscribe.fsnet.co.uk/chapters/c3summer.html Bob www.gwelanmor-internet.co.uk From all the replies I have read through and from all the articles I have read up on, this is probably the best solution I came across. I would wrap the whole poem within a div, then each of the verses in a paragraph and the lines created using br /. Anyone against this method? and why? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
On 6/23/08, James Jeffery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 9:37 AM, Designer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From all the replies I have read through and from all the articles I have read up on, this is probably the best solution I came across. I would wrap the whole poem within a div, then each of the verses in a paragraph and the lines created using br /. Anyone against this method? and why? i agree, put the poem in a div, place the poem inside a p, use br / (br for html4) at the end of each line and a double br / between stanzas (unless you are writing a very long poem, then i'd go for p at every stanza). cheers, dwain -- dwain alford The artist may use any form which his expression demands; for his inner impulse must find suitable expression. Kandinsky *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
I have to say I'm at a loss to see how a poem can be interpreted as a list! One of the simplest tests (for me) of 'is this markup semantically appropriate?' is to consider what your reaction would be if you saw it without styles (or more correctly, with default styling). I would certainly be taken aback to see a verse marked up as a bulleted list! And consider the effect in a screen reader: would it help the vistor to hear at the beginning of each verse 'list of twelve items bullet Shall I compare the to a summer's day? Bullet Thou art more lovely and more temperate bullet etc' Elizabeth -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Aldona Sent: Sunday, 22 June 2008 12:46 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems I've been reading the marking up poems thread with interest but it seems no one has made what seems to be the most obvious suggestion. When I was still in class we had an exercise with a poem and used an unordered list. Would this be a viable option? You could even have a different list for each verse and then still do the fancy styling. What do people think of that as an option? IceKat Gunlaug Sørtun wrote: Must you Australian's *always* have the last say? ;) not always, but often. esp if it ends in beer and a party Is that why what you say most often makes no sense? :-) Georg *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
I have to agree with Elizabeth here. Semantically I'd say that this is one of the few occasions where a br/ would be appropriate. The verses would be paragraphs of course. On Sun, Jun 22, 2008 at 10:13 AM, Elizabeth Spiegel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have to say I'm at a loss to see how a poem can be interpreted as a list! One of the simplest tests (for me) of 'is this markup semantically appropriate?' is to consider what your reaction would be if you saw it without styles (or more correctly, with default styling). I would certainly be taken aback to see a verse marked up as a bulleted list! And consider the effect in a screen reader: would it help the vistor to hear at the beginning of each verse 'list of twelve items bullet Shall I compare the to a summer's day? Bullet Thou art more lovely and more temperate bullet etc' Elizabeth -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Aldona Sent: Sunday, 22 June 2008 12:46 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems I've been reading the marking up poems thread with interest but it seems no one has made what seems to be the most obvious suggestion. When I was still in class we had an exercise with a poem and used an unordered list. Would this be a viable option? You could even have a different list for each verse and then still do the fancy styling. What do people think of that as an option? IceKat Gunlaug Sørtun wrote: Must you Australian's *always* have the last say? ;) not always, but often. esp if it ends in beer and a party Is that why what you say most often makes no sense? :-) Georg *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
I've been reading the marking up poems thread with interest but it seems no one has made what seems to be the most obvious suggestion. When I was still in class we had an exercise with a poem and used an unordered list. Would this be a viable option? You could even have a different list for each verse and then still do the fancy styling. What do people think of that as an option? IceKat Gunlaug Sørtun wrote: Must you Australian's *always* have the last say? ;) not always, but often. esp if it ends in beer and a party Is that why what you say most often makes no sense? :-) Georg *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Poetry is art and its really ugly to even try to mark it correctly. There must be something that would work though and i have actually tried with a really bad result.. http://kevinmcgeary.com/essay.html With inherit and ems mixed with p there must be a way also where beginning letter would be replaced with a sIFR font to be pretty and make it really pretty... I didnt have the energy because it so rare and really destroying the words meaning i guess... Michael James Jeffery wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Well yes, you could mark it up as XML behind the scenes, but you shouldn't be sending XML to the browser. They might or might not be able to cope with it, but you'd be breaking validation (unless you used XHTML sent as actual XML and start namespacing things). In simple terms, I'd mark up each stanza as a paragraph and slap line breaks in for each line. P From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Jeffery Sent: 19 June 2008 10:08 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] Marking Up Poems A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
I would suggest that this is pre. Poetry is generally so display-specific that you couldn't hope to mark it up, I'd say. Michael On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 19:08, James Jeffery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
True. I still think there should be a stanard set of elements to mark up poems though. Not checked if WG are doing anything in HTML 5 - i think they are. On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 10:38 AM, Michael Cordover [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would suggest that this is pre. Poetry is generally so display-specific that you couldn't hope to mark it up, I'd say. Michael On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 19:08, James Jeffery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Just another resource for those interested: http://signified.com.au/a-poem-element-for-html5/ On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 10:53 AM, James Jeffery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: True. I still think there should be a stanard set of elements to mark up poems though. Not checked if WG are doing anything in HTML 5 - i think they are. On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 10:38 AM, Michael Cordover [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would suggest that this is pre. Poetry is generally so display-specific that you couldn't hope to mark it up, I'd say. Michael On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 19:08, James Jeffery [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
On 19 Jun 2008, at 10:08, James Jeffery wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. Whats your views on this, anyone actually did it before? Historically each stanza in a poem is a paragraph. Layout (new lines) began punctuating paragraphs in the later Middle Ages. Prior to that the lines ran into one another with punctuation used to indicate where breaths and breaks in the running text occurred [1]. Syntactic punctuation was not commonplace until after Ben Johnson's English Grammar in 1640. That means that layout /is/ punctuation for modern poetry, so markup needs to reflect that. My recommendation would be p for stanzas and br / line breaks for most verse. To do anything that returns stanzas to running text when CSS is disabled would break the syntax of the verse /unless/ lines are specifically punctuated with something other than a break at the end; a comma for example. pre is an alternative but does not punctuate line ends at all, except visually. It would be interesting to know how alternative browsers handle both br /s and single/double line breaks in pre blocks. Do they inject a pause or other aural boundary? Jon Tan - http://jontangerine.com/ [1] http://www.ualberta.ca/~sreimer/ms-course/course/punc.htm *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. It depends on the form, really. For most poetry, I think paragraphs with line breaks are appropriate. If the poem requires very specific positioning, pre would be the first option as that doesn't rely on CSS. Finally if all else fails, divs for verses and paragraphs for lines, with classes to position them. But that won't degrade gracefully, since CSS is required to convey core meaning. There's not much hope for something better in future either. XHTML2 had the l element, which was the line element. That would have been useful in this case. Sadly HTML5 doesn't seem to have anything so simple as a way to mark up a line of text within a paragraph. cheers, Ben -- --- http://weblog.200ok.com.au/ --- The future has arrived; it's just not --- evenly distributed. - William Gibson *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
On 19 Jun 2008, at 11:06, Jon Tan wrote: On 19 Jun 2008, at 10:08, James Jeffery wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. [snip] It would be interesting to know how alternative browsers handle both br /s and single/double line breaks in pre blocks. Do they inject a pause or other aural boundary? Jon Gibbins (http://dotjay.co.uk) of GAWDS and Accessify forum has kindly run some screen reader tests on both p with br / and pre. He's also published the actual results as .MP3s: http://lab.dotjay.co.uk/tests/screen-readers/poetry/ Jon - http://jontangerine.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Very good! But I have to say they all sound the same. Did anyone spot any differences? I think there may have been a difference in the second one but can't be sure. On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 4:09 PM, Jon Tan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 19 Jun 2008, at 11:06, Jon Tan wrote: On 19 Jun 2008, at 10:08, James Jeffery wrote: A question was raised at work today 'How do you mark up a poem'. I looked into it but found nothing worthy. My original thought was to use P's and class names, but one article I read said XML is perfect for this case. [snip] It would be interesting to know how alternative browsers handle both br /s and single/double line breaks in pre blocks. Do they inject a pause or other aural boundary? Jon Gibbins (http://dotjay.co.uk) of GAWDS and Accessify forum has kindly run some screen reader tests on both p with br / and pre. He's also published the actual results as .MP3s: http://lab.dotjay.co.uk/tests/screen-readers/poetry/ Jon - http://jontangerine.com/ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
A poem is, essentially, a block quotation, is it not? I'd probably be throwing in a cite attribute too :-) http://reference.sitepoint.com/html/blockquote/cite -- Andrew Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.woowoowoo.com ~~~ * ~~~ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
I look after a poetry ezine site ( http://www.foame.org/) and that¹s what I do. For a lot of poets, the look of their poem on the page is very important. Sometimes they want to make visual patterns with their stanzas ... always a bit hit and miss, depending on browsers/platforms etc. And then you get the poems with lines that are required to start under a specific word in the previous line have had to make use of a lot of non-breaking spaces to do that, and again it can¹t be precise. - susie On 20/6/08 2:42 AM, jody tate [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd stress what Jon Tan wrote: My recommendation would be p for stanzas and br / line breaks for most verse. Stanzas are usually taught as the paragraph of poetry and verses are referred to as line breaks. Side note you're free to ignore: I'd argue most of the historical bits below are incorrect in the details, but are correct in general. Jonson's _English Grammar_ is a great snapshot of the period's grammar eccentricities, but hardly a guide that was followed--he didn't care enough to publish it while alive despite how careful he was about publication (I did a Ph.D. one Shakespeare and taught medieval, early modern and modern poetry for eight years before the siren call of web work). -jody -- Jody Tate Web Developer - UW Network Systems http://staff.washington.edu/jtate/ On Jun 19, 2008, at 3:06 AM, Jon Tan wrote: Historically each stanza in a poem is a paragraph. Layout (new lines) began punctuating paragraphs in the later Middle Ages. Prior to that the lines ran into one another with punctuation used to indicate where breaths and breaks in the running text occurred [1]. Syntactic punctuation was not commonplace until after Ben Johnson's English Grammar in 1640. That means that layout /is/ punctuation for modern poetry, so markup needs to reflect that. My recommendation would be p for stanzas and br / line breaks for most verse. To do anything that returns stanzas to running text when CSS is disabled would break the syntax of the verse /unless/ lines are specifically punctuated with something other than a break at the end; a comma for example. pre is an alternative but does not punctuate line ends at all, except visually. It would be interesting to know how alternative browsers handle both br /s and single/double line breaks in pre blocks. Do they inject a pause or other aural boundary? *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Andrew Harris wrote: A poem is, essentially, a block quotation, is it not? Not if it's your own poem you're putting on your own page. P -- Patrick H. Lauke __ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com __ Co-lead, Web Standards Project (WaSP) Accessibility Task Force http://webstandards.org/ __ *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Not if it's your own poem you're putting on your own page. Rubbish - I quote myself all the time! :) *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Not if it's your own poem you're putting on your own page. Rubbish - I quote myself all the time! :) Don't you mean: blockquote cite=me Rubbish - I quote myself all the time! :) /blockquote :) *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Must you Australian's *always* have the last say? ;) *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
not always, but often. esp if it ends in beer and a party From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Paul Bennett [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, 20 June 2008 12:12 PM To: 'wsg@webstandardsgroup.org' Subject: RE: [WSG] Marking Up Poems Must you Australian's *always* have the last say? ;) *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** NOTICE - This communication is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking any action in reliance on, this communication by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication please delete and destroy all copies and telephone SMS Management Technology on 9696 0911 immediately. Any views expressed in this Communication are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifically states them to be the views of SMS Management Technology. Except as required by law, SMS Management Technology does not represent, warrant and/or guarantee that the integrity of this communication has been maintained nor that the communication is free from errors, virus, interception or interference. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Marking Up Poems
Must you Australian's *always* have the last say? ;) not always, but often. esp if it ends in beer and a party Is that why what you say most often makes no sense? :-) Georg -- http://www.gunlaug.no *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
