[WSG] Re: WSG Digest

2012-09-16 Thread Dominic Hey
my apologies - the 'context' i referred to is fully out of the hands of the
designer - it is the browsing environment, determined via a mixture of
user-agent information, feature detection and media queries...

On 16 September 2012 16:54, wsg@webstandardsgroup.org wrote:

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 WEB STANDARDS GROUP MAIL LIST DIGEST
 *


 From: Mathew Robertson mathew.blair.robert...@gmail.com
 Date: Sun, 16 Sep 2012 12:01:42 +1000
 Subject: Re: [WSG] Re: WSG Digest

 Part of the img vs picture discussion, has been to define what features
 are actually required of this element.  Primarily this has come down to:

 a) responsive handling of bandwidth vs image-quality (aka bandwidth vs
 file-size)
 b) pixel density of display devices
 c) art direction

 [ Did I miss any? ]

 Breaking them down:

 a) bandwidth is completely out of control of the website designer... (eg:
 3G bandwidth varies x10 with time) so there is next to no reason for markup
 (HTML or CSS) to be related to bandwidth.  If the designer chose to use
 JPEG2000, SVG, HDF or some other tileable/scalable format, then changes the
 scope somewhat, as the browser could implement range requests to the
 webserver to indicate which block of data would suit its currently
 available bandwidth.

 b) Pixel density depends completely on the target device... again outside
 of the designers control (unless you want to design for every version of
 every  device in existence). And again the best a designer can do is offer
 multiple images.  In which case, srcset seems like a nice way to go, as
 it leverage's an existing element thus allowing backwards compatibility.

 c) The art-direction aspect can be solved using variations of clip(...)
 combined with range-requests.

 An extra mention... the media: max-width variations are really not all
 that useful (unless you are targeting an exact screen size + density)... my
 eyes work well enough so that I can read small text, so would happily like
 to use tablet-width layouts on a small screen.


 The idea of context would seem appropriate... just need to remember that
 some of that context is not in the hands of the designer.

 Just  my $0.02...
 cheers,
 Mathew Robertson

 On 14 September 2012 17:03, Dominic Hey dominic@gmail.com wrote:

  To paraphrase your own words.. if an img src=... is descriptive of the
  target image then srcset would be descriptive of the *set* of target
  images, no styling information there. Where I would be more inclined to
  agree with you would be the media attribute, however if you abstract
 the
  essence of a media query it is not, in itself, concerned with styling. It
  is a conditional test.
 
  Perhaps we need a fourth element - context - to join the separate
 channels
  of content, behaviour and appearance?
 
 
  On 14 September 2012 16:43, wsg@webstandardsgroup.org wrote:
 
  *
  WEB STANDARDS GROUP MAIL LIST DIGEST
  *
 
 
  From: Mathew Robertson mathew.blair.robert...@gmail.com
  Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2012 10:53:34 +1000
  Subject: responsive images
 
  In this week's links for light reading, there is a reference to
 responsive
  images, eg:
 
  http://www.netmagazine.com/features/road-responsive-images
 
  I'd be interested to hear this lists' opinion on the proposed syntax.
 
 
  To me this screams of putting styling information, into the document.
  For
  comparison, we now use media queries to change font sizes and element
  locations, based on viewport size and/or direction.  I would have
 expected
  responsive images to be implemented in a similar manner, not with new
 html
  tags.
 
  In other words, an img src=... is descriptive of the target image, and
  we
  add alt-attributes to describe it as such.   Simply showing a higher
  quality image of the same thing, shouldn't change the document
 structure.
 
 
  Thoughts?
  Mathew Robertson
 
 
 
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Re: [WSG] Re: WSG Digest

2012-09-15 Thread Mathew Robertson
Part of the img vs picture discussion, has been to define what features
are actually required of this element.  Primarily this has come down to:

a) responsive handling of bandwidth vs image-quality (aka bandwidth vs
file-size)
b) pixel density of display devices
c) art direction

[ Did I miss any? ]

Breaking them down:

a) bandwidth is completely out of control of the website designer... (eg:
3G bandwidth varies x10 with time) so there is next to no reason for markup
(HTML or CSS) to be related to bandwidth.  If the designer chose to use
JPEG2000, SVG, HDF or some other tileable/scalable format, then changes the
scope somewhat, as the browser could implement range requests to the
webserver to indicate which block of data would suit its currently
available bandwidth.

b) Pixel density depends completely on the target device... again outside
of the designers control (unless you want to design for every version of
every  device in existence). And again the best a designer can do is offer
multiple images.  In which case, srcset seems like a nice way to go, as
it leverage's an existing element thus allowing backwards compatibility.

c) The art-direction aspect can be solved using variations of clip(...)
combined with range-requests.

An extra mention... the media: max-width variations are really not all
that useful (unless you are targeting an exact screen size + density)... my
eyes work well enough so that I can read small text, so would happily like
to use tablet-width layouts on a small screen.


The idea of context would seem appropriate... just need to remember that
some of that context is not in the hands of the designer.

Just  my $0.02...
cheers,
Mathew Robertson

On 14 September 2012 17:03, Dominic Hey dominic@gmail.com wrote:

 To paraphrase your own words.. if an img src=... is descriptive of the
 target image then srcset would be descriptive of the *set* of target
 images, no styling information there. Where I would be more inclined to
 agree with you would be the media attribute, however if you abstract the
 essence of a media query it is not, in itself, concerned with styling. It
 is a conditional test.

 Perhaps we need a fourth element - context - to join the separate channels
 of content, behaviour and appearance?


 On 14 September 2012 16:43, wsg@webstandardsgroup.org wrote:

 *
 WEB STANDARDS GROUP MAIL LIST DIGEST
 *


 From: Mathew Robertson mathew.blair.robert...@gmail.com
 Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2012 10:53:34 +1000
 Subject: responsive images

 In this week's links for light reading, there is a reference to responsive
 images, eg:

 http://www.netmagazine.com/features/road-responsive-images

 I'd be interested to hear this lists' opinion on the proposed syntax.


 To me this screams of putting styling information, into the document.  For
 comparison, we now use media queries to change font sizes and element
 locations, based on viewport size and/or direction.  I would have expected
 responsive images to be implemented in a similar manner, not with new html
 tags.

 In other words, an img src=... is descriptive of the target image, and
 we
 add alt-attributes to describe it as such.   Simply showing a higher
 quality image of the same thing, shouldn't change the document structure.


 Thoughts?
 Mathew Robertson



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[WSG] Re: WSG Digest

2012-09-14 Thread Dominic Hey
To paraphrase your own words.. if an img src=... is descriptive of the
target image then srcset would be descriptive of the *set* of target
images, no styling information there. Where I would be more inclined to
agree with you would be the media attribute, however if you abstract the
essence of a media query it is not, in itself, concerned with styling. It
is a conditional test.

Perhaps we need a fourth element - context - to join the separate channels
of content, behaviour and appearance?


On 14 September 2012 16:43, wsg@webstandardsgroup.org wrote:

 *
 WEB STANDARDS GROUP MAIL LIST DIGEST
 *


 From: Mathew Robertson mathew.blair.robert...@gmail.com
 Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2012 10:53:34 +1000
 Subject: responsive images

 In this week's links for light reading, there is a reference to responsive
 images, eg:

 http://www.netmagazine.com/features/road-responsive-images

 I'd be interested to hear this lists' opinion on the proposed syntax.


 To me this screams of putting styling information, into the document.  For
 comparison, we now use media queries to change font sizes and element
 locations, based on viewport size and/or direction.  I would have expected
 responsive images to be implemented in a similar manner, not with new html
 tags.

 In other words, an img src=... is descriptive of the target image, and we
 add alt-attributes to describe it as such.   Simply showing a higher
 quality image of the same thing, shouldn't change the document structure.


 Thoughts?
 Mathew Robertson


 **
 Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
 Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
 Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
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[WSG] responsive images

2012-09-13 Thread Mathew Robertson
In this week's links for light reading, there is a reference to responsive
images, eg:

http://www.netmagazine.com/features/road-responsive-images

I'd be interested to hear this lists' opinion on the proposed syntax.


To me this screams of putting styling information, into the document.  For
comparison, we now use media queries to change font sizes and element
locations, based on viewport size and/or direction.  I would have expected
responsive images to be implemented in a similar manner, not with new html
tags.

In other words, an img src=... is descriptive of the target image, and we
add alt-attributes to describe it as such.   Simply showing a higher
quality image of the same thing, shouldn't change the document structure.


Thoughts?
Mathew Robertson


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[WSG] Re: WSG Digest

2012-09-12 Thread Joanne Glasspoole
Please unsubscribe me.

Kind regards,

Joanne Glasspoole
Certified Social Media Manager

INDIGO CREATIVE SOLUTIONS
2142 200th Street
Centuria, Wisconsin 54824

*For urgent or time sensitive support requests, please call or text me at (715)
553-1514*
*
*
Toll-free Number: (877) 259-6989
Toll-free Fax: (877) 227-9854
Toll-free Conference Room: (800) 617-7801 Access Code: 8344401
*
*
*Find us on Facebook: *Joanne Glasspoolehttps://www.facebook.com/glasspoole
 | Indigo Creative
Solutionshttps://www.facebook.com/pages/Indigo-Creative-Solutions/260485463977454
 | Jim Morrison Project https://www.facebook.com/jimmorrisonproject | Grief
Loss  Recovery https://www.facebook.com/grieflossrecovery

~~~
P.S.* **Now is the time to migrate your site to Joomla 2.5. *Joomla 1.5
reached its end of life on April 30, 2012 and will no longer be supported
by Joomla at the end of September 2012. If you would like to schedule a
free consultation for an estimate to migrate your site to Joomla 2.5, call
or text me at (715) 553-1514. --Joanne



On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 10:32 AM, wsg@webstandardsgroup.org wrote:

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 From: Kiama Web Design m...@kiamawebdesign.com.au
 Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2012 00:30:14 -0500
 Subject: Out of office

 I will be out of the office from Friday 7th until Tuesday 11th September.

 Cheers,
 Mark New
 Kiama Web Design



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[WSG] Out of office

2012-09-10 Thread Kiama Web Design
I will be out of the office from Friday 7th until Tuesday 11th September. 
 
Cheers,
Mark New
Kiama Web Design




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[WSG] Digitising services for audio cassettes

2012-09-09 Thread Andrew Ivin
Hi all,

I hope that this request is not (too) off-topic.
I am trying to track down a service that will digitise the content of audio
cassettes, for eventual web publication.

Can anyone recommend a good service, preferably Australian based?


Thanks very much,


-- 
Andrew
andrew.i...@gmail.com
www.twitter.com/aivin


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[WSG] Out of office

2012-09-09 Thread Kiama Web Design
I will be out of the office from Friday 7th until Tuesday 11th September. 
 
Cheers,
Mark New
Kiama Web Design




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Thanks: [WSG] More on spam traps

2012-08-23 Thread coder
Thanks folks. I know nothing about server-side validation, so that's more 
learning for me . . .

(or some carpentry, maybe :-)

Bob

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[WSG] Out of Office AutoReply: WSG Digest

2012-08-23 Thread Gemma Maidment
Thank you very much for your email. 

I am out of the office until Thursday 30th August so I'll reply to your email 
as soon as possible when I return.

Kind Regards

Gemma


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[WSG] [Off-topic] AngularJS

2012-08-23 Thread James Ducker
Has anyone done much with AngularJS[1]? I'm currently evaluating it as a
potential successor to a huge bespoke framework I wrote. The syntax feels a
little convoluted at times, but my god does it absolutely blaze through DOM
updates!


[1]: http://www.angularjs.org/

-- 
*James Ducker*
james.duc...@gmail.com
 +61 404 838 470


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[WSG] More on spam traps

2012-08-22 Thread coder
Hi All,

I have recently attempted to 'trap' spammers who use autofilling tactics on the 
site at www.gwelanmor-internet.co.uk. This is written in html5 and uses a 
mixture of simple tests to validate the form.  However, yesterday I recvd a 
mail thus:





a.. name 
  a.. igmgrtasel 
a.. email 
  a.. 
a.. hidden 
  a.. -9 
a.. comments 
  a.. CaWePF a href=http://ipdszgwutyvp.com/;ipdszgwutyvp/a, 
[url=http://fkpbtvpaxitv.com/]fkpbtvpaxitv[/url], 
[link=http://rtcdalwdjrkb.com/]rtcdalwdjrkb[/link], http://xsejahukjzdr.com/ 
a.. send 
  a.. send message .




The script I used to validate the form is this:


script type=text/javascript
function validateForm()
  {
  var x=document.forms[contact][email].value;
  var atpos=x.indexOf(@);
  var dotpos=x.lastIndexOf(.);
  if (atpos1 || dotposatpos+2 || dotpos+2=x.length)
 {
 alert(This is Not a valid e-mail address);
 return false;
 }
//
  var y=document.forms[contact][hidden].value;
   if (y==null || y==)
   {
   return true;}
  else
   {
alert(I think you are a machine)
return false;
   }

}
!--// --
  function check(node) 
   {
var re = new RegExp('[\[\\]]', 'g');
document.getElementById('send').disabled = re.test(node.value);
   }
/script

and it works locally and online. However the mail I quote from above is 
completely unaffected.  Does this mean I give up trying, or what?  

Any thing?

Thanks,

Bob



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Re: [WSG] More on spam traps

2012-08-22 Thread Ken Robinson
 Client side validation fails when scammers screen scrape your site and then 
directly send to your receiving script.  You really need to consider using a 
server side validation.

Ken
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-Original Message-
From: coder co...@gwelanmor-internet.co.uk
Sender: li...@webstandardsgroup.org
Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2012 12:37:51 
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Reply-to: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] More on spam traps

Hi All,

I have recently attempted to 'trap' spammers who use autofilling tactics on the 
site at www.gwelanmor-internet.co.uk. This is written in html5 and uses a 
mixture of simple tests to validate the form.  However, yesterday I recvd a 
mail thus:





a.. name 
  a.. igmgrtasel 
a.. email 
  a.. 
a.. hidden 
  a.. -9 
a.. comments 
  a.. CaWePF a href=http://ipdszgwutyvp.com/;ipdszgwutyvp/a, 
[url=http://fkpbtvpaxitv.com/]fkpbtvpaxitv[/url], 
[link=http://rtcdalwdjrkb.com/]rtcdalwdjrkb[/link], http://xsejahukjzdr.com/ 
a.. send 
  a.. send message .




The script I used to validate the form is this:


script type=text/javascript
function validateForm()
  {
  var x=document.forms[contact][email].value;
  var atpos=x.indexOf(@);
  var dotpos=x.lastIndexOf(.);
  if (atpos1 || dotposatpos+2 || dotpos+2=x.length)
 {
 alert(This is Not a valid e-mail address);
 return false;
 }
//
  var y=document.forms[contact][hidden].value;
   if (y==null || y==)
   {
   return true;}
  else
   {
alert(I think you are a machine)
return false;
   }

}
!--// --
  function check(node) 
   {
var re = new RegExp('[\[\\]]', 'g');
document.getElementById('send').disabled = re.test(node.value);
   }
/script

and it works locally and online. However the mail I quote from above is 
completely unaffected.  Does this mean I give up trying, or what?  

Any thing?

Thanks,

Bob



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Re: [WSG] More on spam traps

2012-08-22 Thread Oliver Boermans
Hi Bob,

A few points:
- The form submission was likely posted without JavaScript
- There is no point confronting a robot with the reality of it’s existence

Look into writing a filter on your email inbox or server that can
eliminate such messages without your intervention.

Don’t give up :)
Ollie
--
@ollicle

On 22 August 2012 21:07, coder co...@gwelanmor-internet.co.uk wrote:
 I have recently attempted to 'trap' spammers who use autofilling tactics on
 the site at www.gwelanmor-internet.co.uk. This is written in html5 and uses
 a mixture of simple tests to validate the form.  However, yesterday I recvd
 a mail thus:

 

 name

 igmgrtasel

 email

 hidden

 -9

 comments

 CaWePF a href=http://ipdszgwutyvp.com/;ipdszgwutyvp/a,
 [url=http://fkpbtvpaxitv.com/]fkpbtvpaxitv[/url],
 [link=http://rtcdalwdjrkb.com/]rtcdalwdjrkb[/link], http://xsejahukjzdr.com/

 send

 send message .

 

 The script I used to validate the form is this:


 script type=text/javascript
 function validateForm()
   {
   var x=document.forms[contact][email].value;
   var atpos=x.indexOf(@);
   var dotpos=x.lastIndexOf(.);
   if (atpos1 || dotposatpos+2 || dotpos+2=x.length)
  {
  alert(This is Not a valid e-mail address);
  return false;
  }
 //
   var y=document.forms[contact][hidden].value;
if (y==null || y==)
{
return true;}
   else
{
 alert(I think you are a machine)
 return false;
}

 }
 !--// --
   function check(node)
{
 var re = new RegExp('[\[\\]]', 'g');
 document.getElementById('send').disabled = re.test(node.value);
}
 /script

 and it works locally and online. However the mail I quote from above is
 completely unaffected.  Does this mean I give up trying, or what?


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RE: [WSG] More on spam traps

2012-08-22 Thread Mike Kear
I think its important to give the spammer no indication that you are onto
them.   If you give them any kind of feedback, they can use that to work a
way through your maze.The filters i use (which are similar to yours on
the client side, but I also use some tests on the server side, but the
submitter sees the same result either way.   Even if the submission is just
discarded to the bitbucket in the sky. They have no way to know their
submission has been discarded.

 

Cheers

Mike Kear

AFP Webworks

Windsor, NSW, Australia 

http://afpwebworks.com

 

 

 

 

From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On
Behalf Of coder
Sent: Wednesday, 22 August 2012 9:38 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] More on spam traps

 

Hi All,

 

I have recently attempted to 'trap' spammers who use autofilling tactics on
the site at www.gwelanmor-internet.co.uk. This is written in html5 and uses
a mixture of simple tests to validate the form.  However, yesterday I recvd
a mail thus:

 

  _  

 

.  name 

*   igmgrtasel 

.  email 

*

.  hidden 

*   -9 

.  comments 

*   CaWePF a href=http://ipdszgwutyvp.com/;ipdszgwutyvp/a,
[url=http://fkpbtvpaxitv.com/]fkpbtvpaxitv[/url],
[link=http://rtcdalwdjrkb.com/]rtcdalwdjrkb[/link], http://xsejahukjzdr.com/


.  send 

*   send message .

  _  

 

The script I used to validate the form is this:

 

 

script type=text/javascript
function validateForm()
  {
  var x=document.forms[contact][email].value;
  var atpos=x.indexOf(@);
  var dotpos=x.lastIndexOf(.);
  if (atpos1 || dotposatpos+2 || dotpos+2=x.length)
 {
 alert(This is Not a valid e-mail address);
 return false;
 }
//
  var y=document.forms[contact][hidden].value;
   if (y==null || y==)
   {
   return true;}
  else
   {
alert(I think you are a machine)
return false;
   }

 

}
!--// --
  function check(node) 
   {
var re = new RegExp('[\[\\]]', 'g');
document.getElementById('send').disabled = re.test(node.value);
   }
/script

 

and it works locally and online. However the mail I quote from above is
completely unaffected.  Does this mean I give up trying, or what?  

 

Any thing?

 

Thanks,

 

Bob

 

 

No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database: 2437/5212 - Release Date: 08/20/12


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Re: [WSG] More on spam traps

2012-08-22 Thread MJ Ray
Mike Kear
 I think its important to give the spammer no indication that you are onto
 them.   If you give them any kind of feedback, they can use that to work a
 way through your maze.The filters i use (which are similar to yours on
 the client side, but I also use some tests on the server side, but the
 submitter sees the same result either way.   Even if the submission is just
 discarded to the bitbucket in the sky. They have no way to know their
 submission has been discarded.

That's awfully public-spirited of you, as it makes the spammer slower
to move on to attacking another website, but it can get expensive.  If
some spammers think they are being successful, they will absolutely
hammer your server and that could burn your data transfer allowance,
or even overload your server if the tests aren't written carefully.

Let them submit a few forms and then 302 redirect them to
something like http://spam-ip.com/honeypot.php perhaps.

Thanks,
-- 
MJ Ray (slef), member of www.software.coop, a for-more-than-profit co-op.
http://koha-community.org supporter, web and library systems developer.
In My Opinion Only: see http://mjr.towers.org.uk/email.html
Available for hire (including development) at http://www.software.coop/


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[WSG] Out of office

2012-08-04 Thread Kiama Web Design
I will be out of the office from Thursday 2nd until Monday 6th August. 
 
Cheers,
Mark New
Kiama Web Design



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Re: [WSG] how to force a cache bypass?

2012-08-03 Thread David Hucklesby

(See below)

On 8/2/12 9:50 PM, James Ducker wrote:

Second that. If you can version the filenames that's definitely the
most sure-fire way to make sure users don't cache old copies.

James


On 3 August 2012 14:39, Emmanuel Negri nna...@gmail.com
mailto:nna...@gmail.com wrote:

Sometimes a random query string does not work.

Changing the filename itself works 100% of the time.

Eg. style-scm-revision-number.css

Manu

On 03/08/2012, at 1:25 PM, James Ducker james.duc...@gmail.com
mailto:james.duc...@gmail.com wrote:


Append some junk querystring to the end of the URL, like
example.com/index.html?20120803132400
http://example.com/index.html?20120803132400. Every time it changes,
stuff will be refreshed. Wouldn't really recommend doing it for
regular pages because it makes the URLs look messy, but if you're
trying to refresh scripts or images, go nuts.

James


On 21 July 2012 03:22, Rob Crowther robe...@boogdesign.com
mailto:robe...@boogdesign.com wrote:

On 20/07/2012 17:47, coder wrote:

How can I make a web page appear as the latest version in all
browsers,
i.e., perform a cache bypass?  And I don't mean for me - I
mean for all
visitors to the page?  Is it possible?
??

Once it's cached in the browser there's not much you can do about
it, the browser will store the cache settings at the time when it
cached the page and if those settings say don't check again for a
month then, generally, it won't.

If you want the page to never be cached then you need to set the
expiry header.  With Apache servers this is quite straightforward
and can usually be done in the directory's .htaccess file:

ExpiresByType text/html access plus 0 seconds

This is example was take from HTML5 BoilerPlate:


https://github.com/h5bp/html5-__boilerplate/blob/__83f4f281866be1cf7f391738c53c44__8a5ac658e9/.htaccess#L233

https://github.com/h5bp/html5-boilerplate/blob/83f4f281866be1cf7f391738c53c448a5ac658e9/.htaccess#L233


Rob



You may be interested in this automated way of doing it:

 http://derek.io/blog/2009/auto-versioning-javascript-and-css-files/

--
Cordially,
David



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[WSG] Out of office

2012-08-03 Thread Kiama Web Design
I will be out of the office from Thursday 2nd until Monday 6th August. 
 
Cheers,
Mark New
Kiama Web Design



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[WSG] Re: WSG Digest

2012-08-02 Thread Dominic Hey
joining the party a little late here.. unless i have misunderstood things
here this is a perfect situation to employ XSLT (
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XSLT). you can assign whatever attributes you
require to the XML and then use XSLT to have the browser render the file as
XHTML.


On 2 August 2012 10:38, wsg@webstandardsgroup.org wrote:

 *
 WEB STANDARDS GROUP MAIL LIST DIGEST
 *


 From: Mathew Robertson mathew.blair.robert...@gmail.com
 Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2012 09:57:54 +1000
 Subject: Re: [WSG] XHTML5 polyglot markup and WAI-ARIA, is there a valid
 way?

 Hi Isabel,

 It sounds like you might be confusing/mixing your requirements... from the
 limited information you have provided, this sounds like perfect candidate
 to generate two separate files ie: HTML already has accessibility built
 in, and you get the XML file contain exactly what you require.

 regards,
 Mathew Robertson

 On 1 August 2012 09:29, Isabel Santos unboun...@gmail.com wrote:

  Hi Rob,
 
  thank you, and sorry for the delayed answer.
 
  The need for xml comes from the site being
  a web application for an academic work.
  The idea is to generate xml both to the site and for exchange purposes.
 
  I could generate both xml and html but that isn't very elegant,
  and would not optimise the resources.
  In fact, accessibility, validity, design and usability are my own
 concerns,
  they aren't part of the work, won't be evaluated,
  and are taking more time then they should.
 
  Anyway, as long as it is possible to do,
  the more difficult a work, the more one learns.
 
  I gess I've lost a good part of the WAI-ARIA development history,
  it's kind of hard to understand the excessive and aparently arbitrary
  strictness
  of xhtml in regards to ARIA.
 
  regards,
 
  isabel
 
 
 
  On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 10:56 AM, Rob Crowther robe...@boogdesign.com
 wrote:
 
 
  What XML content do you need to include?  If you just stick to regular
  HTML5 then all the ARIA stuff is valid (with some sanity restrictions)
 and
  you won't have to work around the strict parsing:
 
  http://www.whatwg.org/specs/**web-apps/current-work/**
  multipage/elements.html#wai-**aria
 http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/elements.html#wai-aria
 
 
  XML elements will be parsed into the HTML5 document tree, albeit
 slightly
  differently to how an XML document would be parsed, but maybe close
 enough
  for your purposes depending on what XML you'll be including.
 
  Rob
 
 
 
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 *
 From: Rob Crowther robe...@boogdesign.com
 Date: Wed, 01 Aug 2012 02:01:34 +0100
 Subject: Re: [WSG] XHTML5 polyglot markup and WAI-ARIA, is there a valid
 way?

 On 01/08/12 00:29, Isabel Santos wrote:
  I could generate both xml and html but that isn't very elegant,
  and would not optimise the resources.

 Unless you serve the XHTML files with a MIME type of application/xml or
 application/xhtml+xml, which will break things in IE9, the browser will
 treat all the content as HTML anyway.  This is precisely because of
 XHTML's arbitrary strictness.


 http://wiki.whatwg.org/wiki/HTML_vs._XHTML#Differences_Between_HTML_and_XHTML

 Rob


 **
 Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
 Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
 Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
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[WSG] AUTO: Out of office. (returning 09/08/2012)

2012-08-02 Thread Rohan Westbury


I am out of the office until 09/08/2012.

Urgent messages may be forwarded to Peter Mason, Senior Manager WoVG
Enterprise Architecture  Standards, Government Services Division, DTF (868
32899, peter.j.ma...@dtf.vic.gov.au).



Note: This is an automated response to your message WSG Digest sent on
03/08/2012 19:42:58.

This is the only notification you will receive while this person is away.



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[WSG] Out of office

2012-08-02 Thread Kiama Web Design
I will be out of the office from Thursday 2nd until Monday 6th August. 
 
Cheers,
Mark New
Kiama Web Design



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Re: [WSG] how to force a cache bypass?

2012-08-02 Thread James Ducker
Append some junk querystring to the end of the URL, like
example.com/index.html?20120803132400. Every time it changes, stuff will be
refreshed. Wouldn't really recommend doing it for regular pages because it
makes the URLs look messy, but if you're trying to refresh scripts or
images, go nuts.

James


On 21 July 2012 03:22, Rob Crowther robe...@boogdesign.com wrote:

 On 20/07/2012 17:47, coder wrote:

 How can I make a web page appear as the latest version in all browsers,
 i.e., perform a cache bypass?  And I don't mean for me - I mean for all
 visitors to the page?  Is it possible?
 ??

 Once it's cached in the browser there's not much you can do about it, the
 browser will store the cache settings at the time when it cached the page
 and if those settings say don't check again for a month then, generally,
 it won't.

 If you want the page to never be cached then you need to set the expiry
 header.  With Apache servers this is quite straightforward and can usually
 be done in the directory's .htaccess file:

 ExpiresByType text/html access plus 0 seconds

 This is example was take from HTML5 BoilerPlate:

 https://github.com/h5bp/html5-**boilerplate/blob/**
 83f4f281866be1cf7f391738c53c44**8a5ac658e9/.htaccess#L233https://github.com/h5bp/html5-boilerplate/blob/83f4f281866be1cf7f391738c53c448a5ac658e9/.htaccess#L233


 Rob


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*James Ducker*
james.duc...@gmail.com
 +61 404 838 470


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Re: [WSG] how to force a cache bypass?

2012-08-02 Thread Emmanuel Negri
Sometimes a random query string does not work.

Changing the filename itself works 100% of the time. 

Eg. style-scm-revision-number.css

Manu

On 03/08/2012, at 1:25 PM, James Ducker james.duc...@gmail.com wrote:

 Append some junk querystring to the end of the URL, like 
 example.com/index.html?20120803132400. Every time it changes, stuff will be 
 refreshed. Wouldn't really recommend doing it for regular pages because it 
 makes the URLs look messy, but if you're trying to refresh scripts or images, 
 go nuts.
 
 James
 
 
 On 21 July 2012 03:22, Rob Crowther robe...@boogdesign.com wrote:
 On 20/07/2012 17:47, coder wrote:
 How can I make a web page appear as the latest version in all browsers,
 i.e., perform a cache bypass?  And I don't mean for me - I mean for all
 visitors to the page?  Is it possible?
 ??
 Once it's cached in the browser there's not much you can do about it, the 
 browser will store the cache settings at the time when it cached the page and 
 if those settings say don't check again for a month then, generally, it 
 won't.
 
 If you want the page to never be cached then you need to set the expiry 
 header.  With Apache servers this is quite straightforward and can usually be 
 done in the directory's .htaccess file:
 
 ExpiresByType text/html access plus 0 seconds
 
 This is example was take from HTML5 BoilerPlate:
 
 https://github.com/h5bp/html5-boilerplate/blob/83f4f281866be1cf7f391738c53c448a5ac658e9/.htaccess#L233
 
 
 Rob
 
 
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 -- 
 James Ducker
 james.duc...@gmail.com
  +61 404 838 470
 
 
 
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Re: [WSG] how to force a cache bypass?

2012-08-02 Thread James Ducker
Second that. If you can version the filenames that's definitely the
most sure-fire way to make sure users don't cache old copies.

James


On 3 August 2012 14:39, Emmanuel Negri nna...@gmail.com wrote:

 Sometimes a random query string does not work.

 Changing the filename itself works 100% of the time.

 Eg. style-scm-revision-number.css

 Manu

 On 03/08/2012, at 1:25 PM, James Ducker james.duc...@gmail.com wrote:

 Append some junk querystring to the end of the URL, like
 example.com/index.html?20120803132400. Every time it changes, stuff will
 be refreshed. Wouldn't really recommend doing it for regular pages because
 it makes the URLs look messy, but if you're trying to refresh scripts or
 images, go nuts.

 James


 On 21 July 2012 03:22, Rob Crowther robe...@boogdesign.com wrote:

 On 20/07/2012 17:47, coder wrote:

 How can I make a web page appear as the latest version in all browsers,
 i.e., perform a cache bypass?  And I don't mean for me - I mean for all
 visitors to the page?  Is it possible?
 ??

 Once it's cached in the browser there's not much you can do about it, the
 browser will store the cache settings at the time when it cached the page
 and if those settings say don't check again for a month then, generally,
 it won't.

 If you want the page to never be cached then you need to set the expiry
 header.  With Apache servers this is quite straightforward and can usually
 be done in the directory's .htaccess file:

 ExpiresByType text/html access plus 0 seconds

 This is example was take from HTML5 BoilerPlate:

 https://github.com/h5bp/html5-**boilerplate/blob/**
 83f4f281866be1cf7f391738c53c44**8a5ac658e9/.htaccess#L233https://github.com/h5bp/html5-boilerplate/blob/83f4f281866be1cf7f391738c53c448a5ac658e9/.htaccess#L233


 Rob


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  +61 404 838 470



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-- 
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james.duc...@gmail.com
 +61 404 838 470


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[WSG] Out of office

2012-08-01 Thread Kiama Web Design
I will be out of the office from Thursday 2nd until Monday 6th August. 
 
Cheers,
Mark New
Kiama Web Design



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Re: [WSG] XHTML5 polyglot markup and WAI-ARIA, is there a valid way?

2012-07-31 Thread Isabel Santos
Hi Rob,

thank you, and sorry for the delayed answer.

The need for xml comes from the site being
a web application for an academic work.
The idea is to generate xml both to the site and for exchange purposes.

I could generate both xml and html but that isn't very elegant,
and would not optimise the resources.
In fact, accessibility, validity, design and usability are my own concerns,
they aren't part of the work, won't be evaluated,
and are taking more time then they should.

Anyway, as long as it is possible to do,
the more difficult a work, the more one learns.

I gess I've lost a good part of the WAI-ARIA development history,
it's kind of hard to understand the excessive and aparently arbitrary
strictness
of xhtml in regards to ARIA.

regards,

isabel



On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 10:56 AM, Rob Crowther robe...@boogdesign.comwrote:


 What XML content do you need to include?  If you just stick to regular
 HTML5 then all the ARIA stuff is valid (with some sanity restrictions) and
 you won't have to work around the strict parsing:

 http://www.whatwg.org/specs/**web-apps/current-work/**
 multipage/elements.html#wai-**ariahttp://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/elements.html#wai-aria

 XML elements will be parsed into the HTML5 document tree, albeit slightly
 differently to how an XML document would be parsed, but maybe close enough
 for your purposes depending on what XML you'll be including.

 Rob


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Re: [WSG] XHTML5 polyglot markup and WAI-ARIA, is there a valid way?

2012-07-31 Thread Mathew Robertson
Hi Isabel,

It sounds like you might be confusing/mixing your requirements... from the
limited information you have provided, this sounds like perfect candidate
to generate two separate files ie: HTML already has accessibility built
in, and you get the XML file contain exactly what you require.

regards,
Mathew Robertson

On 1 August 2012 09:29, Isabel Santos unboun...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi Rob,

 thank you, and sorry for the delayed answer.

 The need for xml comes from the site being
 a web application for an academic work.
 The idea is to generate xml both to the site and for exchange purposes.

 I could generate both xml and html but that isn't very elegant,
 and would not optimise the resources.
 In fact, accessibility, validity, design and usability are my own concerns,
 they aren't part of the work, won't be evaluated,
 and are taking more time then they should.

 Anyway, as long as it is possible to do,
 the more difficult a work, the more one learns.

 I gess I've lost a good part of the WAI-ARIA development history,
 it's kind of hard to understand the excessive and aparently arbitrary
 strictness
 of xhtml in regards to ARIA.

 regards,

 isabel



 On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 10:56 AM, Rob Crowther robe...@boogdesign.comwrote:


 What XML content do you need to include?  If you just stick to regular
 HTML5 then all the ARIA stuff is valid (with some sanity restrictions) and
 you won't have to work around the strict parsing:

 http://www.whatwg.org/specs/**web-apps/current-work/**
 multipage/elements.html#wai-**ariahttp://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/elements.html#wai-aria

 XML elements will be parsed into the HTML5 document tree, albeit slightly
 differently to how an XML document would be parsed, but maybe close enough
 for your purposes depending on what XML you'll be including.

 Rob



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Re: [WSG] XHTML5 polyglot markup and WAI-ARIA, is there a valid way?

2012-07-31 Thread Rob Crowther

On 01/08/12 00:29, Isabel Santos wrote:

I could generate both xml and html but that isn't very elegant,
and would not optimise the resources.


Unless you serve the XHTML files with a MIME type of application/xml or 
application/xhtml+xml, which will break things in IE9, the browser will 
treat all the content as HTML anyway.  This is precisely because of 
XHTML's arbitrary strictness.


http://wiki.whatwg.org/wiki/HTML_vs._XHTML#Differences_Between_HTML_and_XHTML

Rob



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Re: [WSG] XHTML5 polyglot markup and WAI-ARIA, is there a valid way?

2012-07-30 Thread Rob Crowther

On 26/07/2012 23:41, Isabel Santos wrote:

I decided to use polyglot markup, allthough it involved serving it as
text-html for old trident browsers, to be able to include xml content on
the site (wich I'm still learning).


What XML content do you need to include?  If you just stick to regular 
HTML5 then all the ARIA stuff is valid (with some sanity restrictions) 
and you won't have to work around the strict parsing:


http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/elements.html#wai-aria

XML elements will be parsed into the HTML5 document tree, albeit 
slightly differently to how an XML document would be parsed, but maybe 
close enough for your purposes depending on what XML you'll be including.


Rob



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Re: [WSG] XHTML5 polyglot markup and WAI-ARIA, is there a valid way?

2012-07-28 Thread Isabel Santos
Hi Kevin,

thank you for your feedback, I do recall times when this list was quite
more active :)

I found out I can use WAI-ARIA with html5 polyglot, without any aditional
schema or doctype, I was tired the other day, and not thinking straight.

The reason it wasn't validating, is because polyglot markup is considerably
stricter, relying on older specifications, so it does not allow most new
wai-aria roles and states from the latest realese candidate specification.

I'm still testing against validation, what structures can I use, and what
elements can take them (I imagine the rc specs are way ahead the validator,
one cannot really follow their examples without testing) but its better
then nothing.

Anyway, I was hoping wai-aria could fill in the gap if javascript was
unavalilable, but state change reliy heavily on javascript, so no miracles
yet. It still is nice to have some control over the NVDAs announcements. It
promisses to be a steep learning curve, and a longer headset time hearing
strange html announcements, no doubt a challenge.

thank you so much
isabel



On Sat, Jul 28, 2012 at 1:18 AM, Kevin L. Erickson kevinlerick...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 I am also looking into some similar areas. Looking for replies???

 Kevin Erickson
 804-873-0388

 On Jul 26, 2012, at 6:41 PM, Isabel Santos unboun...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi all,

 I've been researching for a way to use aria roles and states, to enhance
 accessibility on a web application, but it seems to be turning my brain
 into a soup of glia cells and floating neurons flashing like crazy
 fireflies!

 I decided to use polyglot markup, allthough it involved serving it as
 text-html for old trident browsers, to be able to include xml content on
 the site (wich I'm still learning).

 Since I'm using dropdown menus, that do not open on tab focus without
 javascript, I decided to try on wai-aria to improve the overall
 accessibility of the site, complementing the semantics, with or without
 javascript. And all was well, I was loving the idea and the new
 possibilities WAI-ARIA brings to the game, untill I tested it in
 http://validator.nu/.

 According to the Polyglot Markup: HTML-Compatible XHTML Documents (
 http://www.w3.org/TR/html-polyglot/)
 I shouldn't use any docktype on the head of the document besides the
 !DOCTYPE HTML declaration,
 and am only allowed to use the default namespaces
 html xmlns=http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml;
 math xmlns=http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML;
 svg xmlns=http://www.w3.org/2000/svg;
 wich by the way, I can and should omit, because they are included in
 the html5 by default.

 Yet XHTML is, according to http://www.alistapart.com/articles/waiaria/ the 
 extendible
 markup language, so it makes sense to extended it.
 Also, xml is supposed to allow for publication and standardization of
 doctypes and schemas, to avoid the need to be always reinventing the weel,
 and to allow easier document sharing.
 Since WAI-ARIA is gaining so mutch ground in terms of implementation (I'm
 gessing probably more driven by the mobile market then by the screen reader
 user needs) their should be already a doctype or a schema learking around.
 I'm not sure the one on ALAs exemple is what I need, but then again, it
 seems to have been designed to xhtml 1.1, not to polyglot XHTML5.

 I can´t avoid stranging that I'm finding so few documents on the web
 mentioning both polyglot markup and WAI-ARIA, most of them refering to
 older xhtml versions, stating the incompatibility, whille telling us to
 break the standards in favor of the accessibility (no doubt accessibility
 is more important, but why should one have to choose?).

 I'm probably missing something here, this doesn't make much sense, I'm
 really, really confused, too many documents, from several different groups,
 and I'm far from an expert.
 Can any of you offer some guidance on the matter?

 already gratefull for your time,
 regards
 isabel santos

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Re: [WSG] XHTML5 polyglot markup and WAI-ARIA, is there a valid way?

2012-07-27 Thread Kevin L. Erickson
I am also looking into some similar areas. Looking for replies???

Kevin Erickson
804-873-0388

On Jul 26, 2012, at 6:41 PM, Isabel Santos unboun...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi all,
  
 I've been researching for a way to use aria roles and states, to enhance 
 accessibility on a web application, but it seems to be turning my brain into 
 a soup of glia cells and floating neurons flashing like crazy fireflies!
  
 I decided to use polyglot markup, allthough it involved serving it as 
 text-html for old trident browsers, to be able to include xml content on the 
 site (wich I'm still learning). 
  
 Since I'm using dropdown menus, that do not open on tab focus without 
 javascript, I decided to try on wai-aria to improve the overall accessibility 
 of the site, complementing the semantics, with or without javascript. And all 
 was well, I was loving the idea and the new possibilities WAI-ARIA brings to 
 the game, untill I tested it in http://validator.nu/.
  
 According to the Polyglot Markup: HTML-Compatible XHTML Documents 
 (http://www.w3.org/TR/html-polyglot/)
 I shouldn't use any docktype on the head of the document besides the 
 !DOCTYPE HTML declaration,
 and am only allowed to use the default namespaces
 html xmlns=http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml;
 math xmlns=http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML;
 svg xmlns=http://www.w3.org/2000/svg;
 wich by the way, I can and should omit, because they are included in the 
 html5 by default.
  
 Yet XHTML is, according to http://www.alistapart.com/articles/waiaria/ the 
 extendible markup language, so it makes sense to extended it.
 Also, xml is supposed to allow for publication and standardization of 
 doctypes and schemas, to avoid the need to be always reinventing the weel, 
 and to allow easier document sharing.
 Since WAI-ARIA is gaining so mutch ground in terms of implementation (I'm 
 gessing probably more driven by the mobile market then by the screen reader 
 user needs) their should be already a doctype or a schema learking around.
 I'm not sure the one on ALAs exemple is what I need, but then again, it seems 
 to have been designed to xhtml 1.1, not to polyglot XHTML5.
  
 I can´t avoid stranging that I'm finding so few documents on the web 
 mentioning both polyglot markup and WAI-ARIA, most of them refering to older 
 xhtml versions, stating the incompatibility, whille telling us to break the 
 standards in favor of the accessibility (no doubt accessibility is more 
 important, but why should one have to choose?).
  
 I'm probably missing something here, this doesn't make much sense, I'm 
 really, really confused, too many documents, from several different groups, 
 and I'm far from an expert.
 Can any of you offer some guidance on the matter?
  
 already gratefull for your time,
 regards
 isabel santos
 
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[WSG] Out of Office AutoReply: WSG Digest

2012-07-27 Thread Gerst, Kim
I am out of the office today.  I will respond to your email when I return on 
Monday .


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[WSG] XHTML5 polyglot markup and WAI-ARIA, is there a valid way?

2012-07-26 Thread Isabel Santos
Hi all,

I've been researching for a way to use aria roles and states, to enhance
accessibility on a web application, but it seems to be turning my brain
into a soup of glia cells and floating neurons flashing like crazy
fireflies!

I decided to use polyglot markup, allthough it involved serving it as
text-html for old trident browsers, to be able to include xml content on
the site (wich I'm still learning).

Since I'm using dropdown menus, that do not open on tab focus without
javascript, I decided to try on wai-aria to improve the overall
accessibility of the site, complementing the semantics, with or without
javascript. And all was well, I was loving the idea and the new
possibilities WAI-ARIA brings to the game, untill I tested it in
http://validator.nu/.

According to the Polyglot Markup: HTML-Compatible XHTML Documents (
http://www.w3.org/TR/html-polyglot/)
I shouldn't use any docktype on the head of the document besides the
!DOCTYPE HTML declaration,
and am only allowed to use the default namespaces
html xmlns=http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml;
math xmlns=http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML;
svg xmlns=http://www.w3.org/2000/svg;
wich by the way, I can and should omit, because they are included in
the html5 by default.

Yet XHTML is, according to http://www.alistapart.com/articles/waiaria/
the extendible
markup language, so it makes sense to extended it.
Also, xml is supposed to allow for publication and standardization of
doctypes and schemas, to avoid the need to be always reinventing the weel,
and to allow easier document sharing.
Since WAI-ARIA is gaining so mutch ground in terms of implementation (I'm
gessing probably more driven by the mobile market then by the screen reader
user needs) their should be already a doctype or a schema learking around.
I'm not sure the one on ALAs exemple is what I need, but then again, it
seems to have been designed to xhtml 1.1, not to polyglot XHTML5.

I can´t avoid stranging that I'm finding so few documents on the web
mentioning both polyglot markup and WAI-ARIA, most of them refering to
older xhtml versions, stating the incompatibility, whille telling us to
break the standards in favor of the accessibility (no doubt accessibility
is more important, but why should one have to choose?).

I'm probably missing something here, this doesn't make much sense, I'm
really, really confused, too many documents, from several different groups,
and I'm far from an expert.
Can any of you offer some guidance on the matter?

already gratefull for your time,
regards
isabel santos


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[WSG] Re: WSG Digest::Abwesendheitsnotiz Michael Schröder

2012-07-21 Thread mailservice
Vielen Dank für Ihre Nachricht. Ich befinde mich vom 16. Juli bis 
einschließlich 8. August 2012 im Urlaub und kann Ihre Nachricht deshalb zur 
Zeit nicht bearbeiten. Nach meiner Rückkehr werde ich mich umgehend um Ihr 
Anliegen kümmern.

In dringenden Fällen wenden Sie sich bitte an meinen Geschäftspartner:
Mail Boxes ETC.
Herr Peter Baumann
Ochsenzoller Straße 129
22848 Norderstedt
Tel: (0 40) 51 31 51 61
Fax: (0 40) 51 31 51 62
E-mail: p...@mbe-norderstedt.de

Öffnungszeiten:
Montag - Freitag: 09.00 - 19.00 Uhr 

Mit freundlichem Gruß
Michael Schröder




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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-21 Thread Claire Helme
I am currently on maternity leave. Please contact Anna Moretti in my absence.


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[WSG] Issues with IE

2012-07-20 Thread Naim Latifi
 
Hello friends, 

I really hope you are having fun in this warm summer. Through this email I want 
to ask for a help if you can figure one issue with Toggle and IE. I will 
describe as follow. I have a checkout button and I implemented a toggle with 
Jquery. Everything works find in other browser expect IE is moving down one div 
once I hover in the go to checkout button. Here is the link where you can see 
the issue http://again.naimweb.com. 

I really appreciate any tips to solve the issue ! 

Thanks a lot !

Kind regards,
**








Naim Latifi 











Master student in 
Social Media and Web technologies  








Linne University

















Idet 1:201








SE-35252 Vaxjo 








 Sweden 

















Emails: naimlatif...@hotmail.com








  naim.lat...@gmail.com








  nlae...@student.vxu.se
 







n...@betterlife.se
Web development portfolio:
http://www.naimweb.com
Linkedin:


 


 http://www.linkedin.com/in/naimlatifi

Phone: +46765662003  








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Re: [WSG] Issues with IE

2012-07-20 Thread Naim Latifi
Hi again,

Just to let you know that the issue is fixed after I did some research ;)

Regards,

Naim Latifi

On 20 jul 2012, at 11:12, Naim Latifi naimlatif...@hotmail.com wrote:

 Hello friends, 
 
 I really hope you are having fun in this warm summer. Through this email I 
 want to ask for a help if you can figure one issue with Toggle and IE. I will 
 describe as follow. I have a checkout button and I implemented a toggle with 
 Jquery. Everything works find in other browser expect IE is moving down one 
 div once I hover in the go to checkout button. Here is the link where you can 
 see the issue http://again.naimweb.com. 
 
 I really appreciate any tips to solve the issue ! 
 
 Thanks a lot !
 
 
 Kind regards,
 **
 Naim Latifi 
 
 Master student in 
 Social Media and Web technologies  
 Linne University
 
 Idet 1:201
 SE-35252 Vaxjo 
  Sweden 
 
 Emails: naimlatif...@hotmail.com
   naim.lat...@gmail.com
   nlae...@student.vxu.se
   n...@betterlife.se
 
 Web development portfolio:
 http://www.naimweb.com
 
 Linkedin:
  
  http://www.linkedin.com/in/naimlatifi
 
 Phone: +46765662003  
 ***
 
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[WSG] how to force a cache bypass?

2012-07-20 Thread coder
OK, this isn't about standards, but it's more interesting than knowing that 
folk are not in the office . . .

How can I make a web page appear as the latest version in all browsers, i.e., 
perform a cache bypass?  And I don't mean for me - I mean for all visitors to 
the page?  Is it possible?

??


Bob

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Re: [WSG] how to force a cache bypass?

2012-07-20 Thread Danny Vose
Are! you again Bob,  we will have people complaining about off topic again lol

You can do this Bob

Place the following meta tag within the head of your HTML document. When used 
to refresh the current page, the syntax looks like this: It should work in 
all browsers but dont hold me to that and do a check mate. This tells the 
server to call up a new version of the page each time its requested. (or 
refreshed automatically in 600 seconds if they stay on the page)

  meta http-equiv=refresh content=600 
Dan

  - Original Message - 
  From: coder 
  To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org 
  Sent: Friday, July 20, 2012 5:47 PM
  Subject: [WSG] how to force a cache bypass?


  OK, this isn't about standards, but it's more interesting than knowing that 
folk are not in the office . . .

  How can I make a web page appear as the latest version in all browsers, i.e., 
perform a cache bypass?  And I don't mean for me - I mean for all visitors to 
the page?  Is it possible?

  ??


  Bob

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Re: [WSG] how to force a cache bypass?

2012-07-20 Thread Rob Crowther

On 20/07/2012 17:47, coder wrote:

How can I make a web page appear as the latest version in all browsers,
i.e., perform a cache bypass?  And I don't mean for me - I mean for all
visitors to the page?  Is it possible?
??
Once it's cached in the browser there's not much you can do about it, 
the browser will store the cache settings at the time when it cached the 
page and if those settings say don't check again for a month then, 
generally, it won't.


If you want the page to never be cached then you need to set the expiry 
header.  With Apache servers this is quite straightforward and can 
usually be done in the directory's .htaccess file:


ExpiresByType text/html access plus 0 seconds

This is example was take from HTML5 BoilerPlate:

https://github.com/h5bp/html5-boilerplate/blob/83f4f281866be1cf7f391738c53c448a5ac658e9/.htaccess#L233

Rob


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[WSG] Out of Office

2012-07-20 Thread Tim Hatton
I am currently out of the office until 31st July.  I will be checking email 
sporadically but I may not be able to reply until my return.


Regards


Tim Hatton

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[WSG] Out of the Office Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-20 Thread Janet Jaffke
I am currently out of the office until July 23, If you need immediate
assistance please contact Darla Ware at extension 7-5777

Best Regards,

Janet Jaffke

-- 
•
Janet Jaffke
Director Content Strategy and UI
Illinois Institute of Technology
3300 S. Federal
Chicago, IL 60616
312.567.3155
•


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[WSG] Re: WSG Digest::Abwesendheitsnotiz Michael Schröder

2012-07-20 Thread mailservice
Vielen Dank für Ihre Nachricht. Ich befinde mich vom 16. Juli bis 
einschließlich 8. August 2012 im Urlaub und kann Ihre Nachricht deshalb zur 
Zeit nicht bearbeiten. Nach meiner Rückkehr werde ich mich umgehend um Ihr 
Anliegen kümmern.

In dringenden Fällen wenden Sie sich bitte an meinen Geschäftspartner:
Mail Boxes ETC.
Herr Peter Baumann
Ochsenzoller Straße 129
22848 Norderstedt
Tel: (0 40) 51 31 51 61
Fax: (0 40) 51 31 51 62
E-mail: p...@mbe-norderstedt.de

Öffnungszeiten:
Montag - Freitag: 09.00 - 19.00 Uhr 

Mit freundlichem Gruß
Michael Schröder




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[WSG] Out of Office

2012-07-19 Thread Tim Hatton
I am currently out of the office until 31st July.  I will be checking email 
sporadically but I may not be able to reply until my return.


Regards


Tim Hatton

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[WSG] Bobby is away Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-19 Thread Slobodanka Graham
Hi there. Thanks for getting in touch. I am on holiday. I'll speak to
you when I get back.
Bobby

-- 
http://about.me/slobodanka.bobby.graham


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[WSG] Re: WSG Digest::Abwesendheitsnotiz Michael Schröder

2012-07-19 Thread mailservice
Vielen Dank für Ihre Nachricht. Ich befinde mich vom 16. Juli bis 
einschließlich 8. August 2012 im Urlaub und kann Ihre Nachricht deshalb zur 
Zeit nicht bearbeiten. Nach meiner Rückkehr werde ich mich umgehend um Ihr 
Anliegen kümmern.

In dringenden Fällen wenden Sie sich bitte an meinen Geschäftspartner:
Mail Boxes ETC.
Herr Peter Baumann
Ochsenzoller Straße 129
22848 Norderstedt
Tel: (0 40) 51 31 51 61
Fax: (0 40) 51 31 51 62
E-mail: p...@mbe-norderstedt.de

Öffnungszeiten:
Montag - Freitag: 09.00 - 19.00 Uhr 

Mit freundlichem Gruß
Michael Schröder




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Re: [WSG] Complex navigation - semantics tab order

2012-07-18 Thread Chad Kelly

On 7/18/2012 3:23 PM, Ben Zeller wrote:

Hi all,
On a current project we are debating the best way to construct our 
main navigation in an accessible  keyboard friendly format.

The navigation consists of three levels - primary, secondary, tertiary.

Navigation will be arranged in a horizontal tabbed format where only 
the first level will be visible on the home page.
Upon visiting a primary content page, the secondary navigation will be 
visible below the primary nav, with the tertiary navigation available 
via dropdowns.


Our initial thought was to use a structure that works semantically, by 
nesting all three levels in the same menu. (eg. 
http://www.stgeorge.com.au/ )

*Pro*: Semantic markup, all levels have relationship.
*Con*: User must tab through all secondary/tertiary links (we have 
many!) before navigating to the remaining primary links:



If you are going to have page specific menus you are probably better off 
not using drop down menus, as that might get a bit complex and those are 
meant for groups of information such as about us menus where you might 
have a company profile etc.
You are probably better off having the page specific menus in a separate 
column.





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[WSG] Re: WSG Digest::Abwesendheitsnotiz Michael Schröder

2012-07-18 Thread mailservice
Vielen Dank für Ihre Nachricht. Ich befinde mich vom 16. Juli bis 
einschließlich 8. August 2012 im Urlaub und kann Ihre Nachricht deshalb zur 
Zeit nicht bearbeiten. Nach meiner Rückkehr werde ich mich umgehend um Ihr 
Anliegen kümmern.

In dringenden Fällen wenden Sie sich bitte an meinen Geschäftspartner:
Mail Boxes ETC.
Herr Peter Baumann
Ochsenzoller Straße 129
22848 Norderstedt
Tel: (0 40) 51 31 51 61
Fax: (0 40) 51 31 51 62
E-mail: p...@mbe-norderstedt.de

Öffnungszeiten:
Montag - Freitag: 09.00 - 19.00 Uhr 

Mit freundlichem Gruß
Michael Schröder




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[WSG] Out of Office AutoReply: [Spam] WSG Digest

2012-07-18 Thread Pahwa, Neha
I will be out of the office for the rest of the day today and will return 
tomorrow (July 19).

If you have any urgent IxD needs, please contact James Maliszewski at 
james.maliszew...@tmp.com 


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[WSG] Re: WSG Digest::Abwesendheitsnotiz Michael Schröder

2012-07-17 Thread mailservice
Vielen Dank für Ihre Nachricht. Ich befinde mich vom 16. Juli bis 
einschließlich 8. August 2012 im Urlaub und kann Ihre Nachricht deshalb zur 
Zeit nicht bearbeiten. Nach meiner Rückkehr werde ich mich umgehend um Ihr 
Anliegen kümmern.

In dringenden Fällen wenden Sie sich bitte an meinen Geschäftspartner:
Mail Boxes ETC.
Herr Peter Baumann
Ochsenzoller Straße 129
22848 Norderstedt
Tel: (0 40) 51 31 51 61
Fax: (0 40) 51 31 51 62
E-mail: p...@mbe-norderstedt.de

Öffnungszeiten:
Montag - Freitag: 09.00 - 19.00 Uhr 

Mit freundlichem Gruß
Michael Schröder




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[WSG] Complex navigation - semantics tab order

2012-07-17 Thread Ben Zeller
Hi all, 
On a current project we are debating the best way to construct our main 
navigation in an accessible  keyboard friendly format. 
The navigation consists of three levels - primary, secondary, tertiary. 

Navigation will be arranged in a horizontal tabbed format where only the first 
level will be visible on the home page.
Upon visiting a primary content page, the secondary navigation will be visible 
below the primary nav, with the tertiary navigation available via dropdowns.

Our initial thought was to use a structure that works semantically, by nesting 
all three levels in the same menu. (eg. http://www.stgeorge.com.au/ )
Pro: Semantic markup, all levels have relationship.
Con: User must tab through all secondary/tertiary links (we have many!) before 
navigating to the remaining primary links:

ul
  liaPrimary 1/a
ul
  liaSecondary/a
ul
  liaTertiary/a/li
  liaTertiary/a/li
  liaTertiary/a/li
  liaTertiary/a/li
/ul
  /li
/ul
  /li
  liaPrimary 2/a/li
  liaPrimary 3/a/li
/ul

Looking at a couple of other sites (http://www.commbank.com.au/personal/
http://www.westpac.com.au/personal-banking/ - the banking model is a good 
comparison for us) 
it is clear that there are advantages to separating the levels of navigation, 
in our case the markup is much more manageable from a css point of view.
Pro: tab order allows users to quickly access all primary links.
Con: loss of semantic relationship between primary  secondary links:

ul
  liaPrimary 1/a/li
  liaPrimary 2/a/li
  liaPrimary 3/a/li
/ul

ul
  liaSecondary/a
ul
  liaTertiary/a/li
  liaTertiary/a/li
  liaTertiary/a/li
  liaTertiary/a/li
/ul
  /li
/ul

Would love to hear peoples opinions as to whether either method is preferable 
from a usability perspective, or poses any accessibility/wcag issues.

Thanks
- Ben

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[WSG] James Meszes has left DHS [SEC=No Protective Marking Present]

2012-07-17 Thread James.Meszes
 
I will be out of the office starting  18/07/2012 and will not return until
19/06/2020.

Please contact Veronica Boller in my absence.


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other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information is 
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in error please notify the sender immediately and delete all electronic and 
hard copies of this transmission together with any attachments. Please consider 
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[WSG] Re: WSG Digest::Abwesendheitsnotiz Michael Schröder

2012-07-16 Thread mailservice
Vielen Dank für Ihre Nachricht. Ich befinde mich vom 16. Juli bis 
einschließlich 8. August 2012 im Urlaub und kann Ihre Nachricht deshalb zur 
Zeit nicht bearbeiten. Nach meiner Rückkehr werde ich mich umgehend um Ihr 
Anliegen kümmern.

In dringenden Fällen wenden Sie sich bitte an meinen Geschäftspartner:
Mail Boxes ETC.
Herr Peter Baumann
Ochsenzoller Straße 129
22848 Norderstedt
Tel: (0 40) 51 31 51 61
Fax: (0 40) 51 31 51 62
E-mail: p...@mbe-norderstedt.de

Öffnungszeiten:
Montag - Freitag: 09.00 - 19.00 Uhr 

Mit freundlichem Gruß
Michael Schröder




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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-16 Thread Claire Helme
I am currently on maternity leave. Please contact Anna Moretti in my absence.


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[WSG] Bobby is away Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-15 Thread Slobodanka Graham
Hi there. Thanks for getting in touch. I am on holiday. I'll speak to
you when I get back.
Bobby

-- 
http://about.me/slobodanka.bobby.graham


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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-15 Thread Kirill Kiryshin
I'm going to be out of the office until Tuesday 17th July.

For all urgent matters, please email:
Jeremy (j...@geemultimedia.com.au)


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[WSG] Re: WSG Digest::Abwesendheitsnotiz Michael Schröder

2012-07-15 Thread mailservice
Vielen Dank für Ihre Nachricht. Ich befinde mich vom 16. Juli bis 
einschließlich 8. August 2012 im Urlaub und kann Ihre Nachricht deshalb zur 
Zeit nicht bearbeiten. Nach meiner Rückkehr werde ich mich umgehend um Ihr 
Anliegen kümmern.

In dringenden Fällen wenden Sie sich bitte an meinen Geschäftspartner:
Mail Boxes ETC.
Herr Peter Baumann
Ochsenzoller Straße 129
22848 Norderstedt
Tel: (0 40) 51 31 51 61
Fax: (0 40) 51 31 51 62
E-mail: p...@mbe-norderstedt.de

Öffnungszeiten:
Montag - Freitag: 09.00 - 19.00 Uhr 

Mit freundlichem Gruß
Michael Schröder




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[WSG] Re: WSG Digest::Abwesendheitsnotiz Michael Schröder

2012-07-14 Thread mailservice
Vielen Dank für Ihre Nachricht. Ich befinde mich vom 16. Juli bis 
einschließlich 8. August 2012 im Urlaub und kann Ihre Nachricht deshalb zur 
Zeit nicht bearbeiten. Nach meiner Rückkehr werde ich mich umgehend um Ihr 
Anliegen kümmern.

In dringenden Fällen wenden Sie sich bitte an meinen Geschäftspartner:
Mail Boxes ETC.
Herr Peter Baumann
Ochsenzoller Straße 129
22848 Norderstedt
Tel: (0 40) 51 31 51 61
Fax: (0 40) 51 31 51 62
E-mail: p...@mbe-norderstedt.de

Öffnungszeiten:
Montag - Freitag: 09.00 - 19.00 Uhr 

Mit freundlichem Gruß
Michael Schröder




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[WSG] Re: WSG Digest::Abwesendheitsnotiz Michael Schröder

2012-07-13 Thread mailservice
Vielen Dank für Ihre Nachricht. Ich befinde mich vom 16. Juli bis 
einschließlich 8. August 2012 im Urlaub und kann Ihre Nachricht deshalb zur 
Zeit nicht bearbeiten. Nach meiner Rückkehr werde ich mich umgehend um Ihr 
Anliegen kümmern.

In dringenden Fällen wenden Sie sich bitte an meinen Geschäftspartner:
Mail Boxes ETC.
Herr Peter Baumann
Ochsenzoller Straße 129
22848 Norderstedt
Tel: (0 40) 51 31 51 61
Fax: (0 40) 51 31 51 62
E-mail: p...@mbe-norderstedt.de

Öffnungszeiten:
Montag - Freitag: 09.00 - 19.00 Uhr 

Mit freundlichem Gruß
Michael Schröder




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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-12 Thread Claire Helme
I am currently on maternity leave. Please contact Anna Moretti in my absence.


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[WSG] Video not showing using iframe in Firefox

2012-07-11 Thread nand
Hello,

I am having a problem with video not showing using iframe in Firefox. The
table cell also has an image background. Am getting different results in
browsers.

Chrome 20.0: works fine
IE 9.0: video shows but dotted line around video when clicked to play/pause
Firefox 13.0.1: embedded video does not show

Have not tested on Safari and Opera.

Sample HTML5 page is here: http://healthphone.org/frametest.htm

style type=text/css
!--
td.hpvideo {
 width : 500px;
height : 365px;
 border-width : 0;
padding-top : 0px;
 padding-bottom : 0px;
padding-right : 0px;
 padding-left : 0px;
text-align : center;
 background-image:url('../images/mphone.png');
background-repeat:no-repeat;
 background-position:center;
}
iframe {
border : none;
 }
--
/style

td class=hpvideoiframe src=
http://dotsub.com/media/ac29a1ea-8fb8-4bb1-9087-cc0bb56f842c/embed/;
width=420 height=315/iframe/td


What is wrong here? Thank you.

nand


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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-11 Thread Kirill Kiryshin
I'm going to be out of the office until Tuesday 17th July.

For all urgent matters, please email:
Jeremy (j...@geemultimedia.com.au)


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[WSG] Bobby is away Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-11 Thread Slobodanka Graham
Hi there. Thanks for getting in touch. I am on holiday. I'll speak to
you when I get back.
Bobby

-- 
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Re: [WSG] Video not showing using iframe in Firefox

2012-07-11 Thread Frank M. Palinkas
Tested: Page loads 100% with no errors, and video renders perfect in FF
13.0.1 and in Opera 12.50,

Kind regards,

Frank M. Palinkas
Senior Technical Writer
Google Motorola Mobility Inc. Sunnyvale, CA
Mobile: +1 650 248 5315
Web standards and accessibility tutorials:
http://dev.opera.com/author/947856



On Wed, Jul 11, 2012 at 8:45 PM, nand wadhw...@gmail.com wrote:


 Hello,

 I am having a problem with video not showing using iframe in Firefox. The
 table cell also has an image background. Am getting different results in
 browsers.

 Chrome 20.0: works fine
 IE 9.0: video shows but dotted line around video when clicked to play/pause
 Firefox 13.0.1: embedded video does not show

 Have not tested on Safari and Opera.

 Sample HTML5 page is here: http://healthphone.org/frametest.htm

 style type=text/css
 !--
 td.hpvideo {
  width : 500px;
 height : 365px;
  border-width : 0;
 padding-top : 0px;
  padding-bottom : 0px;
 padding-right : 0px;
  padding-left : 0px;
 text-align : center;
  background-image:url('../images/mphone.png');
 background-repeat:no-repeat;
  background-position:center;
 }
 iframe {
 border : none;
  }
 --
 /style

 td class=hpvideoiframe src=
 http://dotsub.com/media/ac29a1ea-8fb8-4bb1-9087-cc0bb56f842c/embed/;
 width=420 height=315/iframe/td


 What is wrong here? Thank you.

 nand



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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-05 Thread Claire Helme
I am currently on maternity leave. Please contact Anna Moretti in my absence.


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[WSG] Bobby is away Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-04 Thread Slobodanka Graham
Hi there. Thanks for getting in touch. I am on holiday. I'll speak to
you when I get back.
Bobby

-- 
http://about.me/slobodanka.bobby.graham


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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-03 Thread Kirill Kiryshin
I'm going to be out of the office until Tuesday 17th July.

For all urgent matters, please email:
Jeremy (j...@geemultimedia.com.au)


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[WSG] Out of the Office Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-03 Thread Janet Jaffke
I am currently out of the office until July 9, If you need immediate
assistance please contact Darla Ware at extension 7-5777

Best Regards,

Janet Jaffke

-- 
•
Janet Jaffke
Director Content Strategy and UI
Illinois Institute of Technology
3300 S. Federal
Chicago, IL 60616
312.567.3155
•


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[WSG] Out of Office AutoReply: [Spam] WSG Digest

2012-07-03 Thread Green, Dan
Thank you for your email. TMP will be closed on July 4th in observance of 
Independence Day. I will return your email when I am back in the office on 
Thursday, July 5th.


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Re: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-07-02 Thread Patrick H. Lauke

On 02/07/2012 04:35, Teddy Knoy wrote:

These e-mails aren't intended for me, but I keep on receiving them.
Ted Knoy


Dear Ted, welcome to the wonderful world of email mailing lists. You 
must have signed yourself up at some point?



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P
--
Patrick H. Lauke
__
re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively
[latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.]

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Re: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-07-02 Thread Kevin Rapley
I would go with David Dorwood’s suggestion, this seems the most logical. I
would try and avoid the sup tags, as these are for superscript, which is
really presentational and should be handled by CSS if this is the style
that is required.

On 2 July 2012 11:41, Patrick H. Lauke re...@splintered.co.uk wrote:

 On 02/07/2012 04:35, Teddy Knoy wrote:

 These e-mails aren't intended for me, but I keep on receiving them.
 Ted Knoy


 Dear Ted, welcome to the wonderful world of email mailing lists. You must
 have signed yourself up at some point?


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 P
 --
 Patrick H. Lauke
 __**__**__
 re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively
 [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.]

 www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk
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 http://flickr.com/photos/**redux/http://flickr.com/photos/redux/
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Warm regards,

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Re: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-07-02 Thread coder
In what way is sup more presentational than p? 

Bob


  - Original Message - 
  From: Kevin Rapley 
  To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org 
  Cc: Teddy Knoy 
  Sent: Monday, July 02, 2012 12:27 PM
  Subject: Re: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?


  I would go with David Dorwood’s suggestion, this seems the most logical. I 
would try and avoid the sup tags, as these are for superscript, which is 
really presentational and should be handled by CSS if this is the style that is 
required.



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RE: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-07-02 Thread Dan Freeman
The sup tag is definitely not presentational.  It's good for the browser
to know what is superscripted.  Think about math and powers.

 

The browser will interpret these two things totally differently:

 

104

10sup4/sup (correct)

10span4/span (browser will think it's 104 instead of 104)

 

Dan

 

From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On
Behalf Of Kevin Rapley
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2012 7:28 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Cc: Teddy Knoy
Subject: Re: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

 

I would go with David Dorwood's suggestion, this seems the most logical. I
would try and avoid the sup tags, as these are for superscript, which is
really presentational and should be handled by CSS if this is the style
that is required.

On 2 July 2012 11:41, Patrick H. Lauke re...@splintered.co.uk wrote:

On 02/07/2012 04:35, Teddy Knoy wrote:

These e-mails aren't intended for me, but I keep on receiving them.
Ted Knoy

 

Dear Ted, welcome to the wonderful world of email mailing lists. You must
have signed yourself up at some point?

 

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to this list.

Cheers,

P
-- 
Patrick H. Lauke
__
re.dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively
[latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.]

www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk
http://redux.deviantart.com | http://flickr.com/photos/redux/
__
twitter: @patrick_h_lauke | skype: patrick_h_lauke
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-- 
Warm regards,

Kevin Rapley / User Experience Designer
0772 345 7862


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Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you 
are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply E-mail, and 
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Re: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-07-02 Thread Patrick H. Lauke

On 02/07/2012 13:39, Dan Freeman wrote:

The sup tag is definitely not presentational.  It’s good for the
browser to know what is superscripted.  Think about math and powers.

The browser will interpret these two things totally differently:

10^4

10sup4/sup (correct)

10span4/span (browser will think it’s 104 instead of 10^4 )



Arguably the semantics of mathematics are best conveyed with something 
like MathML, not HTML. sup really just means it's superscript - make 
it look tinier, and up a bit. Compare the semantics of


10sup4/sup vs 1supst/sup vs Msuplle/sup

clearly, not related at all, apart from the fact that they visually look 
the same in print. The meaning (it's a mathematical exponent vs an 
ordinal indicator vs an abbreviation for Mademoiselle) changes depending 
on context, so the semantics are certainly far from cut and dry.


IMHO of course,

P
--
Patrick H. Lauke
__
re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively
[latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.]

www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk
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Re: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-07-02 Thread Rob Crowther

On 30/06/2012 07:10, tee wrote:

In scholarly paper and report, we often use number (e.g.. 1, 2. 3,  displays in 
sup) in between paragraphs when referencing others' work. What is the name of 
the tag used in such manner in HTML or ebook format?

The microformats community lists a rel=footnote under 'POSH usage' 
on their rel values reference:


http://microformats.org/wiki/existing-rel-values#POSH_usage

Rob



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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2012-07-02 Thread Claire Helme
I am currently out of the office and will respond to your email on my return


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[WSG] HTML5 input type=date / and you

2012-07-01 Thread James Ducker
Hi all,

I just got a little burned by Chrome's new date popup for HTML date-type
inputs!

*Why?*

   - Because when I wrote the original code, I hadn't read up on the new
   properties being added to HTML5 input types
   - Because I was using a js-based datepicker plugin to implement the same
   functionality and wasn't feature-detecting native date handling (except for
   mobile devices)
   - Because my JS expects a particular date format, and could only handle
   Australian dd/mm/ or ISO8601-compliant date strings. This wasn't an
   issue before, because my JS datepicker controlled the format.


*How do I avoid making the same mistake?*
HTML5 implements a new property for input types that deal with date or time
values:

element.valueAsDate

This property is designed to solve your locale woes, and it is also an easy
way to feature-detect a browser's native support for the date input type. I
haven't gone through all current browsers yet, so if you do use this
method, make sure to check that none of your browsers support the property
without implementing a date picker.

.valueAsDate, as you might have guessed, returns the input's value as
a Dateobject. Here's a super-simple feature detect:

if ( !myElement.valueAsDate ) {
   // Implement my JavaScript datepicker
}

*The result*
Better usability! (and more robust date handling).

*For your convenience*
I have created a jsFiddle you can run on any browser to test the feature
detection: http://jsfiddle.net/h9jYB/5/

   - Opera 12: *Pass *(valueAsDate handling, datepicker present)
   - Chrome 20: *Pass *(valueAsDate handling, datepicker present)
   - Firefox 12: *Pass *(no valueAsDate handling, no datepicker)
   - IE8, IE9: *Pass *(no valueAsDate handling, no datepicker)

- James


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Re: [WSG] HTML5 input type=date / and you

2012-07-01 Thread Patrick H. Lauke

On 02/07/2012 01:55, James Ducker wrote:


element.valueAsDate

This property is designed to solve your locale woes, and it is also an
easy way to feature-detect a browser's native support for the date input
type. I haven't gone through all current browsers yet, so if you do use
this method, make sure to check that none of your browsers support the
property without implementing a date picker.

.valueAsDate, as you might have guessed, returns the input's value as a
Date object. Here's a super-simple feature detect:

if ( !myElement.valueAsDate ) {
// Implement my JavaScript datepicker
}


You can also simply test if the type of your input is reported as 
date. Older browsers that don't implement the new HTML5 types simply 
fall back to changing them - in the DOM itself - to type=text


if (!myElement.type === text) {
// fallback
}

--
Patrick H. Lauke
__
re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively
[latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.]

www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk
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Re: [WSG] HTML5 input type=date / and you

2012-07-01 Thread James Ducker
The only issue I've found so far is that Safari's implementation of the
date type sucks. It gives you little up/down chevrons which add or subtract
one day at a time. So my working code also treats Safari as
datepicker-not-implemented.

For me, as I make use of the valueAsDate property when it's available, it
made more sense to check its existence directly.

Also, Chrome's date picker is pretty annoying when you're trying to enter
DOBs. As far as I can see there's no quick way to jump forward/backward by
decades at a time.

On 2 July 2012 11:11, Patrick H. Lauke re...@splintered.co.uk wrote:

 On 02/07/2012 01:55, James Ducker wrote:

  element.valueAsDate

 This property is designed to solve your locale woes, and it is also an
 easy way to feature-detect a browser's native support for the date input
 type. I haven't gone through all current browsers yet, so if you do use
 this method, make sure to check that none of your browsers support the
 property without implementing a date picker.

 .valueAsDate, as you might have guessed, returns the input's value as a
 Date object. Here's a super-simple feature detect:

 if ( !myElement.valueAsDate ) {
 // Implement my JavaScript datepicker
 }


 You can also simply test if the type of your input is reported as
 date. Older browsers that don't implement the new HTML5 types simply fall
 back to changing them - in the DOM itself - to type=text

 if (!myElement.type === text) {
 // fallback
 }

 --
 Patrick H. Lauke
 __**__**__
 re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively
 [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.]

 www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk
 http://redux.deviantart.com | 
 http://flickr.com/photos/**redux/http://flickr.com/photos/redux/
 __**__**__
 twitter: @patrick_h_lauke | skype: patrick_h_lauke
 __**__**__





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james.duc...@gmail.com
 +61 404 838 470


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Re: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-07-01 Thread tee
Thanks David.

I think ePub3 and HTML5 support is still not here. When converting the HTML5 
doctype files to ePub, Sigil (an ePub editor) forces ePub2 version and stripped 
all HTML5 tags. 

Converting to mobil format for Amazon Kindle is even worse, I feel as if 
dealing with the IE6  7. 

Tee

On Jun 30, 2012, at 3:16 AM, David Dorward wrote:

 
 On 30 Jun 2012, at 11:04, tee wrote:
 I thought maybe I can use hyperlink for monolithic instead of adding 3 
 (which will be directed to Appendix), but this often is not desirable 
 because in other sections of paragraphs where citations are used, there 
 aren't alway clear sentences to hyperlink.
 
 A hyperlink (to an aside) is the closest thing HTML has AFAIK.
 
 This is for an ebook project, it's different from the webpage, and the 
 readers are more accustom to the footnotes, but footnote doesn't work for 
 ebook format, because devices' sizes vary, and portrait vs landscape view 
 affects text flow too so strictly speaking there isn't pagination.
 
 
 
 The example syntax given in the EPUB specification[1] is:
 
 html … xmlns:epub=http://www.idpf.org/2007/ops;
…
p … a epub:type=noteref href=#n11/a … /p
…
aside epub:type=footnote id=n1
…
/aside
…
 /html
 
 [1] http://idpf.org/epub
 
 -- 
 David Dorward
 http://dorward.me.uk
 
 
 
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Re: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-07-01 Thread Teddy Knoy
These e-mails aren't intended for me, but I keep on receiving them.
Ted Knoy

On Mon, Jul 2, 2012 at 10:52 AM, tee weblis...@gmail.com wrote:

 Thanks David.

 I think ePub3 and HTML5 support is still not here. When converting the
 HTML5 doctype files to ePub, Sigil (an ePub editor) forces ePub2 version
 and stripped all HTML5 tags.

 Converting to mobil format for Amazon Kindle is even worse, I feel as if
 dealing with the IE6  7.

 Tee

 On Jun 30, 2012, at 3:16 AM, David Dorward wrote:

 
  On 30 Jun 2012, at 11:04, tee wrote:
  I thought maybe I can use hyperlink for monolithic instead of adding
 3 (which will be directed to Appendix), but this often is not desirable
 because in other sections of paragraphs where citations are used, there
 aren't alway clear sentences to hyperlink.
 
  A hyperlink (to an aside) is the closest thing HTML has AFAIK.
 
  This is for an ebook project, it's different from the webpage, and the
 readers are more accustom to the footnotes, but footnote doesn't work for
 ebook format, because devices' sizes vary, and portrait vs landscape view
 affects text flow too so strictly speaking there isn't pagination.
 
 
 
  The example syntax given in the EPUB specification[1] is:
 
  html … xmlns:epub=http://www.idpf.org/2007/ops;
 …
 p … a epub:type=noteref href=#n11/a … /p
 …
 aside epub:type=footnote id=n1
 …
 /aside
 …
  /html
 
  [1] http://idpf.org/epub
 
  --
  David Dorward
  http://dorward.me.uk
 
 
 
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Re: [WSG] HTML5 input type=date / and you

2012-07-01 Thread Teddy Knoy
These e-mails aren't intended for me, but I keep receiving them.
Ted Knoy

On Mon, Jul 2, 2012 at 9:57 AM, James Ducker james.duc...@gmail.com wrote:

 The only issue I've found so far is that Safari's implementation of the
 date type sucks. It gives you little up/down chevrons which add or subtract
 one day at a time. So my working code also treats Safari as
 datepicker-not-implemented.

 For me, as I make use of the valueAsDate property when it's available, it
 made more sense to check its existence directly.

 Also, Chrome's date picker is pretty annoying when you're trying to enter
 DOBs. As far as I can see there's no quick way to jump forward/backward by
 decades at a time.

 On 2 July 2012 11:11, Patrick H. Lauke re...@splintered.co.uk wrote:

 On 02/07/2012 01:55, James Ducker wrote:

 element.valueAsDate

 This property is designed to solve your locale woes, and it is also an
 easy way to feature-detect a browser's native support for the date input
 type. I haven't gone through all current browsers yet, so if you do use
 this method, make sure to check that none of your browsers support the
 property without implementing a date picker.

 .valueAsDate, as you might have guessed, returns the input's value as a
 Date object. Here's a super-simple feature detect:

 if ( !myElement.valueAsDate ) {
 // Implement my JavaScript datepicker
 }


 You can also simply test if the type of your input is reported as
 date. Older browsers that don't implement the new HTML5 types simply fall
 back to changing them - in the DOM itself - to type=text

 if (!myElement.type === text) {
 // fallback
 }

 --
 Patrick H. Lauke
 __**__**__
 re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively
 [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.]

 www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk
 http://redux.deviantart.com | 
 http://flickr.com/photos/**redux/http://flickr.com/photos/redux/
 __**__**__
 twitter: @patrick_h_lauke | skype: patrick_h_lauke
 __**__**__





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 --
 *James Ducker*
 james.duc...@gmail.com
  +61 404 838 470



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[WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-06-30 Thread tee
In scholarly paper and report, we often use number (e.g.. 1, 2. 3,  displays in 
sup) in between paragraphs when referencing others' work. What is the name of 
the tag used in such manner in HTML or ebook format?


Thanks!

Tee



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RE: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-06-30 Thread Greg Gamble
Are you referring to a citation tag cite?  

Greg


-Original Message-
From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On
Behalf Of tee
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2012 11:11 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

In scholarly paper and report, we often use number (e.g.. 1, 2. 3,  displays
in sup) in between paragraphs when referencing others' work. What is the
name of the tag used in such manner in HTML or ebook format?


Thanks!

Tee



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RE: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-06-30 Thread Birendra Patel
Hi

It's called sup/sup

Regards
Birendra

-Original Message-
From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On
Behalf Of Greg Gamble
Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2012 12:36 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: RE: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

Are you referring to a citation tag cite?  

Greg


-Original Message-
From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On
Behalf Of tee
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2012 11:11 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

In scholarly paper and report, we often use number (e.g.. 1, 2. 3,  displays
in sup) in between paragraphs when referencing others' work. What is the
name of the tag used in such manner in HTML or ebook format?


Thanks!

Tee



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Re: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-06-30 Thread tee
Sort of. 

But I looked up from HTML5 tag, cite doesn't' seem to be the correct ones to 
use.

Example of my text when we do it in a Word document.

One model to explain political power, ...is referred to as the monolithic 
theory . 3

Where 3 is superscribed, and at the footnote of the given page where the quoted 
texts located, or references (such as a book title, page # etc)

In a case like this, wrapping 3 in cite doesn't seem correct to me.

I thought maybe I can use hyperlink for monolithic instead of adding 3 (which 
will be directed to Appendix), but this often is not desirable because in other 
sections of paragraphs where citations are used, there aren't alway clear 
sentences to hyperlink.


This is for an ebook project, it's different from the webpage, and the readers 
are more accustom to the footnotes, but footnote doesn't work for ebook format, 
because devices' sizes vary, and portrait vs landscape view affects text flow 
too so strictly speaking there isn't pagination.


Tee


 

On Jun 30, 2012, at 12:05 AM, Greg Gamble wrote:

 Are you referring to a citation tag cite?  
 
 Greg
 
 
 -Original Message-
 From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On
 Behalf Of tee
 Sent: Friday, June 29, 2012 11:11 PM
 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
 Subject: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?
 
 In scholarly paper and report, we often use number (e.g.. 1, 2. 3,  displays
 in sup) in between paragraphs when referencing others' work. What is the
 name of the tag used in such manner in HTML or ebook format?
 
 
 Thanks!
 
 Tee
 
 
 
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 Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm
 Help: memberh...@webstandardsgroup.org
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Re: [WSG] which tag to use for link to reference?

2012-06-30 Thread David Dorward
 
On 30 Jun 2012, at 11:04, tee wrote:
 I thought maybe I can use hyperlink for monolithic instead of adding 3 
 (which will be directed to Appendix), but this often is not desirable because 
 in other sections of paragraphs where citations are used, there aren't alway 
 clear sentences to hyperlink.

A hyperlink (to an aside) is the closest thing HTML has AFAIK.

 This is for an ebook project, it's different from the webpage, and the 
 readers are more accustom to the footnotes, but footnote doesn't work for 
 ebook format, because devices' sizes vary, and portrait vs landscape view 
 affects text flow too so strictly speaking there isn't pagination.



The example syntax given in the EPUB specification[1] is:

html … xmlns:epub=http://www.idpf.org/2007/ops;
…
p … a epub:type=noteref href=#n11/a … /p
…
aside epub:type=footnote id=n1
…
/aside
…
/html

[1] http://idpf.org/epub

-- 
David Dorward
http://dorward.me.uk



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Re: [WSG] cross-browser or vendor-specific CSS

2012-06-30 Thread Tom Livingston
Learn something new everyday. Never heard of this before!

Sent from iOS 5

On Jun 30, 2012, at 12:03 AM, David Hucklesby huckle...@gmail.com wrote:

 On 6/29/12 11:08 AM, coder wrote:
 
 - Original Message - From: David Hucklesby
 
 Start with a simple design for mobile and old browsers. Add advanced
 CSS inside @media queries or qualified by :root.
 
 qualified by :root?  can you give us an example here?
 
 
 In HTML, :root is functionally equivalent to html. Not supported by IE
 prior to version 9, so a rule like this:
 
 :root .thumbs .figure { display: inline-block; }
 
 ...would be ignored by old IE.
 
 HTH
 -- 
 Cordially,
 David
 
 
 
 
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[WSG] Bobby is away Re: WSG Digest

2012-06-30 Thread Slobodanka Graham
Hi there. Thanks for getting in touch. I am on holiday. I'll speak to
you when I get back.
Bobby

-- 
http://about.me/slobodanka.bobby.graham


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Re: [WSG] cross-browser or vendor-specific CSS

2012-06-30 Thread Kevin Rapley
Firstly “Do websites need to look exactly the same in every browser?”
http://dowebsitesneedtolookexactlythesameineverybrowser.com/

This wasn't on my radar, but even still, there are better solutions out
there to handle CSS. I looked through the little documentation that this
tool gave, and I doubt it has the level of support that Compass and SASS
have. I would stick with Compass and SASS; they have a good following and
community around them and there are loads of extensions (mixins, functions
etc.) in Github and the like.

http://compass-style.org
http://sass-lang.com

On 30 June 2012 13:55, Tom Livingston tom...@gmail.com wrote:

 Learn something new everyday. Never heard of this before!

 Sent from iOS 5

 On Jun 30, 2012, at 12:03 AM, David Hucklesby huckle...@gmail.com wrote:

  On 6/29/12 11:08 AM, coder wrote:
 
  - Original Message - From: David Hucklesby
 
  Start with a simple design for mobile and old browsers. Add advanced
  CSS inside @media queries or qualified by :root.
 
  qualified by :root?  can you give us an example here?
 
 
  In HTML, :root is functionally equivalent to html. Not supported by IE
  prior to version 9, so a rule like this:
 
  :root .thumbs .figure { display: inline-block; }
 
  ...would be ignored by old IE.
 
  HTH
  --
  Cordially,
  David
 
 
 
 
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-- 
Warm regards,

Kevin Rapley / User Experience Designer
0772 345 7862


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Re: [WSG] cross-browser or vendor-specific CSS

2012-06-30 Thread Tom Livingston
For the record, I was referring to :root, not the site mentioned by the OP.

Sent from iOS 5

On Jun 30, 2012, at 6:43 PM, Kevin Rapley ke...@digikev.co.uk wrote:

 Firstly “Do websites need to look exactly the same in every browser?”
 http://dowebsitesneedtolookexactlythesameineverybrowser.com/
 
 This wasn't on my radar, but even still, there are better solutions out there 
 to handle CSS. I looked through the little documentation that this tool gave, 
 and I doubt it has the level of support that Compass and SASS have. I would 
 stick with Compass and SASS; they have a good following and community around 
 them and there are loads of extensions (mixins, functions etc.) in Github and 
 the like.
 
 http://compass-style.org
 http://sass-lang.com
 
 On 30 June 2012 13:55, Tom Livingston tom...@gmail.com wrote:
 Learn something new everyday. Never heard of this before!
 
 Sent from iOS 5
 
 On Jun 30, 2012, at 12:03 AM, David Hucklesby huckle...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  On 6/29/12 11:08 AM, coder wrote:
 
  - Original Message - From: David Hucklesby
 
  Start with a simple design for mobile and old browsers. Add advanced
  CSS inside @media queries or qualified by :root.
 
  qualified by :root?  can you give us an example here?
 
 
  In HTML, :root is functionally equivalent to html. Not supported by IE
  prior to version 9, so a rule like this:
 
  :root .thumbs .figure { display: inline-block; }
 
  ...would be ignored by old IE.
 
  HTH
  --
  Cordially,
  David
 
 
 
 
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 -- 
 Warm regards,
 
 Kevin Rapley / User Experience Designer
 0772 345 7862
 
 
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?????? [WSG] cross-browser or vendor-specific CSS

2012-06-30 Thread linxz
http://selectors.linxz.de/#32
 
--



 




--  --
??: David Hucklesby; 
: 2012??6??30??(??) 12:03
??: wsg; 
: Re: [WSG] cross-browser or vendor-specific CSS



On 6/29/12 11:08 AM, coder wrote:

 - Original Message - From: David Hucklesby

 Start with a simple design for mobile and old browsers. Add advanced
 CSS inside @media queries or qualified by :root.

 qualified by :root?  can you give us an example here?


In HTML, :root is functionally equivalent to html. Not supported by IE
prior to version 9, so a rule like this:

:root .thumbs .figure { display: inline-block; }

...would be ignored by old IE.

HTH
-- 
Cordially,
David




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[WSG] cross-browser or vendor-specific CSS

2012-06-29 Thread Kevin Erickson
Hi, I am asking if anyone uses  http://ecsstender.org/ to write CSS
cross-browser code or, if not, what are you using to write CSS
cross-browser or vendor-specific code?
Many thanks!

Kevin


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Re: [WSG] cross-browser or vendor-specific CSS

2012-06-29 Thread Tom Livingston
On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 10:20 AM, Kevin Erickson
kevinlerick...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hi, I am asking if anyone uses  http://ecsstender.org/ to write CSS
 cross-browser code or, if not, what are you using to write CSS cross-browser
 or vendor-specific code?
 Many thanks!

 Kevin


I do not use this. I rely on progressive enhancement. If IE has square
corners instead of round, for example, so be it. It's ok. It doesn't
render the content inaccessible.

I do, however, use http://selectivizr.com/ to make my life easier as
it allows the use of advanced selectors which saves some extra fussing
and extra markup for old browsers.

HTH

-- 

Tom Livingston | Senior Interactive Developer | Media Logic |
ph: 518.456.3015x231 | fx: 518.456.4279 | mlinc.com


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Re: [WSG] cross-browser or vendor-specific CSS

2012-06-29 Thread David Hucklesby

On 6/29/12 7:20 AM, Kevin Erickson wrote:

Hi, I am asking if anyone uses  http://ecsstender.org/ to write CSS
cross-browser code or, if not, what are you using to write CSS
cross-browser or vendor-specific code?



Short answer - I don't even try to make all browsers act alike. :)

Start with a simple design for mobile and old browsers. Add advanced CSS
inside @media queries or qualified by :root. Enhance IE 7 and 8 if you need
to with rules governed by conditional comments.

This is my version of progressive enhancement. YMMV.

Looking at the documentation for eCSStender suggests to me there's going to
be a severe performance hit on page load. I hope I'm wrong.
--
Cordially,
David


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Re: [WSG] cross-browser or vendor-specific CSS

2012-06-29 Thread coder


- Original Message - 
From: David Hucklesby huckle...@gmail.com

To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Cc: Kevin Erickson kevinlerick...@gmail.com
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2012 5:06 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] cross-browser or vendor-specific CSS



Start with a simple design for mobile and old browsers. Add advanced CSS
inside @media queries or qualified by :root. 


qualified by :root?  can you give us an example here?

Thanks,

Bob


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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2012-06-29 Thread Kirill Kiryshin
I'm going to be out of the office until Tuesday 17th July.

For all urgent matters, please email:
Jeremy (j...@geemultimedia.com.au)


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Re: [WSG] cross-browser or vendor-specific CSS

2012-06-29 Thread David Hucklesby

On 6/29/12 11:08 AM, coder wrote:


- Original Message - From: David Hucklesby


Start with a simple design for mobile and old browsers. Add advanced
CSS inside @media queries or qualified by :root.


qualified by :root?  can you give us an example here?



In HTML, :root is functionally equivalent to html. Not supported by IE
prior to version 9, so a rule like this:

:root .thumbs .figure { display: inline-block; }

...would be ignored by old IE.

HTH
--
Cordially,
David




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[WSG] Out of office Re: WSG Digest

2012-06-28 Thread Claire Helme
I am currently out of the office and will respond to your email on my return


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