Re: [WSG] Acronym element
Ross Bruniges skrev:
the abbr and acronym elements have extra value
in the fact that a screen reader will say
out each letter opposed to trying to pronounce the word.
Here is how I understand the difference between an acronym and other
abbreviations:
Acronyms should *not* be spelled as, but spoken like a word, as in
NATO, AIDS or Benelux.
Initialisms are very similar, except that the individual letters should
be pronounced separately, as in FBI or HTML.
Some abbreviations should be replaced with other words completely when
spoken. Like e.g. = for example or i.e. = that is, or perhaps
ROTFL.
Ergo: Screen readers should not spell out the contents of an *acronym*
element, but should spell out the content of *some* abbreviations.
In an ideal world, screen readers should be programmed to recognize
common abbreviations and speak naturally when they encounter one.
In an ideal world screen readers should know when to apply media types
(screen, tv, projection, speech, braille, etc) and media groups
(contunuos/paged, visual/audio/speech/tactile, interactive/static)
In the real world they do not and we have to compromise. This is a
beautiful(?) vision only:
@media audio {
abbr, acronym {
speak: normal;
}
abbr.replace {
content: attr(title);
}
abbr.initialism {
speak: spell-out;
}
}
Aural, abbr class=replace title=by the wayBTW/abbr, is
abbrCSS/abbr 2.0, not 2.1.
Lars Gunther
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Re: [WSG] Acronym element
On 9/1/08 (20:18) dwain said: i was mistaken earlier saying cynthia says remarked on having to have the title attribute on the abbr element. after i added titles to the abbr element i didn't get the error. Dwain, I didn't quite follow that. You initially reported that Cynthia gave an error telling you to add titles to the abbr tags. You added them and the error went away. In what way was your initial report mistaken? Surely this is what one would expect to happen? Or am I missing/misreading something? -- Rick Lecoat *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Acronym element
it was taw that gave me the error not cynthia says. that was my error. dwain On 1/10/08, Rick Lecoat [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 9/1/08 (20:18) dwain said: i was mistaken earlier saying cynthia says remarked on having to have the title attribute on the abbr element. after i added titles to the abbr element i didn't get the error. Dwain, I didn't quite follow that. You initially reported that Cynthia gave an error telling you to add titles to the abbr tags. You added them and the error went away. In what way was your initial report mistaken? Surely this is what one would expect to happen? Or am I missing/misreading something? -- Rick Lecoat *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- dwain alford The artist may use any form which his expression demands; for his inner impulse must find suitable expression. Kandinsky *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Acronym element
the abbr and acronym elements have extra value in the fact that a screen reader will say out each letter opposed to trying to pronounce the word. so I would recommend if you have control over the content that use use them every time you need (the title doesn't have to be used each time though) - Original Message From: John Faulds [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Wednesday, 9 January, 2008 4:54:22 AM Subject: Re: [WSG] Acronym element e.g. Web Standards Group (WSG) the WSG wouldn't benefit from the acronym element. No, I believe you only then need to use the acronym or abbr tag for the first instance of it following where it appears in brackets on any one page (ie at the start of a new page, you'd expand the acronym/abbreviation again). -- Regards John --- Tyssen Design www.tyssendesign.com.au Ph: (07) 3300 3303 Mb: 0405 678 590 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** __ Sent from Yahoo! Mail - a smarter inbox http://uk.mail.yahoo.com *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Acronym element
On 1/9/08, Ross Bruniges [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: so I would recommend if you have control over the content that use use them every time you need (the title doesn't have to be used each time though) cynthia says that each use needs a title for priority 3 validation. i have just dealt with this on my site. dwain btw, how do you get rid of the dotted underline on each abreviation? i tried styling the abbr with text-decoration:none and the underline is still there. any ideas? - -- dwain alford The artist may use any form which his expression demands; for his inner impulse must find suitable expression. Kandinsky *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Acronym element
border:none 2008/1/9, dwain [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On 1/9/08, Ross Bruniges [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: so I would recommend if you have control over the content that use use them every time you need (the title doesn't have to be used each time though) cynthia says that each use needs a title for priority 3 validation. i have just dealt with this on my site. dwain btw, how do you get rid of the dotted underline on each abreviation? i tried styling the abbr with text-decoration:none and the underline is still there. any ideas? - -- dwain alford The artist may use any form which his expression demands; for his inner impulse must find suitable expression. Kandinsky *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Acronym element
thank you. On 1/9/08, Rochester oliveira [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: border:none btw, how do you get rid of the dotted underline on each abreviation? i tried styling the abbr with text-decoration:none and the underline is still there. any ideas? - -- dwain alford The artist may use any form which his expression demands; for his inner impulse must find suitable expression. Kandinsky *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** -- dwain alford The artist may use any form which his expression demands; for his inner impulse must find suitable expression. Kandinsky *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Acronym element
About the abbr, i think u may use it only once per page but if u want to
speel-out the other times use the css aural.
Example:
Bla bla bla acronym title=World wide web consortiumW3C/acronym
bla bla bla... bla bla span class=spellW3C/span
and the css (media aural) span.spell { *speak: *spell-out }
--
[]'s
-
Rochester Oliveira
http://webbemfeita.com/
Viva a Web-Bem-Feita
Web Designer
Curitiba - PR - Brasil**
2008/1/9, dwain [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
thank you.
On 1/9/08, Rochester oliveira [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
border:none
btw, how do you get rid of the dotted underline on each abreviation?
i tried styling the abbr with text-decoration:none and the underline is
still there. any ideas?
-
--
dwain alford
The artist may use any form which his expression demands;
for his inner impulse must find suitable expression. Kandinsky
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--
dwain alford
The artist may use any form which his expression demands;
for his inner impulse must find suitable expression. Kandinsky
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Re: [WSG] Acronym element
have you run this through taw online? i was mistaken earlier saying cynthia
says remarked on having to have the title attribute on the abbr element.
after i added titles to the abbr element i didn't get the error.
i am also finding differences between the online accessibility checkers. i
also found it amusing that taw has some accessibility errors on the test
page.
dwain
On 1/9/08, Rochester oliveira [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
About the abbr, i think u may use it only once per page but if u want to
speel-out the other times use the css aural.
Example:
Bla bla bla acronym title=World wide web consortiumW3C/acronym
bla bla bla... bla bla span class=spellW3C/span
and the css (media aural) span.spell { *speak: * spell-out }
--
dwain alford
The artist may use any form which his expression demands;
for his inner impulse must find suitable expression. Kandinsky
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[WSG] Acronym element
Hi all. I have a quick question re: practical use of the acronym element. If I have a piece of text that defines the word, then includes the acronym immediately after in brackets, I assume there's no need/point in using acronym for the text in brackets? e.g. Web Standards Group (WSG) the WSG wouldn't benefit from the acronym element. TIA. Grant *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Acronym element
e.g. Web Standards Group (WSG) the WSG wouldn't benefit from the acronym element. No, I believe you only then need to use the acronym or abbr tag for the first instance of it following where it appears in brackets on any one page (ie at the start of a new page, you'd expand the acronym/abbreviation again). -- Regards John --- Tyssen Design www.tyssendesign.com.au Ph: (07) 3300 3303 Mb: 0405 678 590 *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
